Duke Johnson RB Dolphins (3 Viewers)

[Xue]

Yeah it is sort of the same doubt or observation than Gabriel makes. They doubt the RB because of the outstanding blocking.

I don't think Indiana's offensive line was as good at run blocking as Wisconsin's either. But I haven't spent any time really looking at that. This is just based off of historical trends.

I find myself skeptical of Alabama, Nebraska, LSU running backs as well because they often have had very good offensive lines.

I don't agree with Coleman being the best RB but I do have him as the fourth best. I believe his pro day is on the 25th. So we should get some new information regarding his injury. If that does turn into a bigger concern I could see myself moving him down. I don't see much causing me to value Coleman over Ayaji, Gordon or Gurley. But I don't have a huge issue with people who like Coleman the best.

You can take us off the list. We haven't had consistently good offensive line play in probably a decade. Surely since Bo came on campus and rotated through a cadre of promoted graduate assistants at the position 7 years ago.

Wisconsin, though, has consistently had an excellent line for years now. Big reason why I'm a Gordon doubter. He got 400+ of those yards against the Huskers, and that was largely because they gave all the carries to one guy this year instead of splitting them between White, Ball, and Gordon last time (they gashed us for just as many yards without Gordon carrying the load).

Flawed reasoning.

YPC > Total Yards

If the line was so good, why didn't Corey Clement have the same YPC while getting less carries, especially in garbage time?

 

[gianmarco]

Yeah it is sort of the same doubt or observation than Gabriel makes. They doubt the RB because of the outstanding blocking.

I don't think Indiana's offensive line was as good at run blocking as Wisconsin's either. But I haven't spent any time really looking at that. This is just based off of historical trends.

I find myself skeptical of Alabama, Nebraska, LSU running backs as well because they often have had very good offensive lines.

I don't agree with Coleman being the best RB but I do have him as the fourth best. I believe his pro day is on the 25th. So we should get some new information regarding his injury. If that does turn into a bigger concern I could see myself moving him down. I don't see much causing me to value Coleman over Ayaji, Gordon or Gurley. But I don't have a huge issue with people who like Coleman the best.

You can take us off the list. We haven't had consistently good offensive line play in probably a decade. Surely since Bo came on campus and rotated through a cadre of promoted graduate assistants at the position 7 years ago.

Wisconsin, though, has consistently had an excellent line for years now. Big reason why I'm a Gordon doubter. He got 400+ of those yards against the Huskers, and that was largely because they gave all the carries to one guy this year instead of splitting them between White, Ball, and Gordon last time (they gashed us for just as many yards without Gordon carrying the load).

According to these stats, you seem to be mistaken

Using adjusted line yards (i.e. O-line ability after removing RB ability), Nebraska ranked 11th in the nation. Wisconsin ranked 12th.

And when you look at the stuff rate (percentage of carries by running backs that are stopped at or before the line of scrimmage.), which is really where the O-lines shine at the NCAA level, Nebraska ranked 28th in the nation while Wisconsin was 72nd.

Despite that pretty bad stuff rate by Wisconsin's O-Line, Gordon still managed have an obscene YPC and lead the nation in rushing yards.

There are obviously other stats listed there where Wisconsin was better, but that 1st ALY is the most important (with teams like Bama, Georgia, Ohio St., Auburn, and Oregon at the top) and where Nebraska surely did quite well and actually better than Wisconsin (albeit only 1 spot ahead).

 

[mcintyre1]

Yeah it is sort of the same doubt or observation than Gabriel makes. They doubt the RB because of the outstanding blocking.

I don't think Indiana's offensive line was as good at run blocking as Wisconsin's either. But I haven't spent any time really looking at that. This is just based off of historical trends.

I find myself skeptical of Alabama, Nebraska, LSU running backs as well because they often have had very good offensive lines.

I don't agree with Coleman being the best RB but I do have him as the fourth best. I believe his pro day is on the 25th. So we should get some new information regarding his injury. If that does turn into a bigger concern I could see myself moving him down. I don't see much causing me to value Coleman over Ayaji, Gordon or Gurley. But I don't have a huge issue with people who like Coleman the best.

You can take us off the list. We haven't had consistently good offensive line play in probably a decade. Surely since Bo came on campus and rotated through a cadre of promoted graduate assistants at the position 7 years ago.

Wisconsin, though, has consistently had an excellent line for years now. Big reason why I'm a Gordon doubter. He got 400+ of those yards against the Huskers, and that was largely because they gave all the carries to one guy this year instead of splitting them between White, Ball, and Gordon last time (they gashed us for just as many yards without Gordon carrying the load).

Flawed reasoning.

YPC > Total Yards

If the line was so good, why didn't Corey Clement have the same YPC while getting less carries, especially in garbage time?

I was referencing how Wisconsin put up about the same number of total rushing yards against Nebraska the previous outing, but they split those carries among 3 talented backs. Overall I just want people to understand that it was not much of a feat to put up that many yards against Nebraska's defense. Regardless, this is a thread about Duke Johnson, so I'm going to shut up now.

Yeah it is sort of the same doubt or observation than Gabriel makes. They doubt the RB because of the outstanding blocking.

I don't think Indiana's offensive line was as good at run blocking as Wisconsin's either. But I haven't spent any time really looking at that. This is just based off of historical trends.

I find myself skeptical of Alabama, Nebraska, LSU running backs as well because they often have had very good offensive lines.

I don't agree with Coleman being the best RB but I do have him as the fourth best. I believe his pro day is on the 25th. So we should get some new information regarding his injury. If that does turn into a bigger concern I could see myself moving him down. I don't see much causing me to value Coleman over Ayaji, Gordon or Gurley. But I don't have a huge issue with people who like Coleman the best.

You can take us off the list. We haven't had consistently good offensive line play in probably a decade. Surely since Bo came on campus and rotated through a cadre of promoted graduate assistants at the position 7 years ago.

Wisconsin, though, has consistently had an excellent line for years now. Big reason why I'm a Gordon doubter. He got 400+ of those yards against the Huskers, and that was largely because they gave all the carries to one guy this year instead of splitting them between White, Ball, and Gordon last time (they gashed us for just as many yards without Gordon carrying the load).

According to these stats, you seem to be mistaken

Using adjusted line yards (i.e. O-line ability after removing RB ability), Nebraska ranked 11th in the nation. Wisconsin ranked 12th.

And when you look at the stuff rate (percentage of carries by running backs that are stopped at or before the line of scrimmage.), which is really where the O-lines shine at the NCAA level, Nebraska ranked 28th in the nation while Wisconsin was 72nd.

Despite that pretty bad stuff rate by Wisconsin's O-Line, Gordon still managed have an obscene YPC and lead the nation in rushing yards.

There are obviously other stats listed there where Wisconsin was better, but that 1st ALY is the most important (with teams like Bama, Georgia, Ohio St., Auburn, and Oregon at the top) and where Nebraska surely did quite well and actually better than Wisconsin (albeit only 1 spot ahead).

Yeah... I trust my eyes more than those stats. "Adjusted Line Yardage"? "Statistic that attempts to, even to a small extent, separate the ability of a running back from the ability of the offensive line." Yeah, sure. I read through the explanation of what they're trying to represent with the NFL version of that stat (which they say the NCAA stat is nebulously based on), and I'll just summarize my opinion as

I'm highly skeptical of any advanced stat that claims to be able to isolate and determine the exact "value" of a given blocker based on the aggregate crunching of a bunch of run plays and comparing it to the YPC averages of a bunch of RBs. In my experience, the vast majority of "advanced stats" have been constructed in a way to produce "expected" results (ie. Adrian Peterson/Demarco Murray/whoever is the among the best RBs right now, and our stat also has him highly rated). They seem to operate under the assumption that if they just tweak enough parameters and check it against what they expect to see until they reach some "perfect" equation they'll develop a model that predicts future success, and I'm sorry but I just don't buy that. Maybe some day when we have extensive analytics of virtually everything on the field, but certainly not from a bunch of textual play by play recaps.

I'm also dubious of "stuff rate", considering those stats are for 2014, during which Ameer Abdullah was our workhorse RB. Ameer should have been tackled behind the line countless times, but made positive yardage despite the terrible blocking due to his (as evidenced by his combine) exceptional agility. I'm not at all surprised that Nebraska would rate well on that statistic, but I attribute that almost entirely to Ameer.

Our offensive line play has been atrocious, by historical standards. We haven't sent many lineman to the pros in the last decade, and, frankly, I've been watching them play this whole time. They're worse. They're visibly less strong than our lineman from the late 90's and early 2000's when Milt Tenopir was around and their technique is routinely shoddy. We started a 5'11" T-rex armed chub monster at center in 2014 because 1) we couldn't get anyone better and 2) he was the nephew of Bo Pelini. I can't think of a better expression of my frustrations with our offensive line group in the last 7 years than that.

Statistics should help us validate what we see, not tell us what we are going to see.

 

[Biabreakable]

Here are the offensive linemen drafted from Nebraska from 2000-2014

2014 3 78 Spencer Long OL
2012 7 234 Marcel Jones OL
2011 6 196 Keith Williams OL
2009 6 193 Matt Slauson G
2009 7 228 Lydon Murtha T
2008 5 164 Carl Nicks T
2004 6 190 Josh Sewell C
2002 2 39 Toniu Fonoti G
2001 2 50 Dominic Raiola C
2001 5 151 Russ Hochstein C

So they didn't have a very high draft pick coming from the offensive line position since 2002 although Spencer Long was a 3rd round pick in 2014

Here is the offensive linemen drafted 1st to 3rd round from 2010-2014 (covers most of the time frame of recent RB picks)

Wisconsin

2011 3 75 John Moffitt
2012 2 55 Peter Konz
2013 1 31 Travis Frederick
2011 1 29 Gabe Carimi
2012 1 27 Kevin Zeitler

Alabama

2010 3 98 Mike Johnson
2014 2 44 Cyrus Kouandjio
2011 1 25 James Carpenter
2013 1 11 D.J. Fluker
2013 1 10 Chance Warmack


USC

2014 3 70 Marcus Martin
2010 2 64 Charles Brown
2011 1 9 Tyron Smith
2012 1 4 Matt Kalil



Oaklahoma

2012 3 74 Donald Stephenson
2013 1 4 Lane Johnson
2010 1 4 Trent Williams



Florida

2011 2 63 Marcus Gilbert
2010 1 18 Maurkice Pouncey
2011 1 15 Mike Pouncey


Illinois

2013 3 86 Hugh Thornton
2010 3 68 Jon Asamoah
2012 2 44 Jeff Allen

LSU

2011 3 92 Joe Barksdale
2014 3 92 Trai Turner


Miami

2014 3 93 Brandon Linder
2011 2 46 Orlando Franklin

Ohio State

2014 2 59 Jack Mewhort
2012 2 56 Mike Adams

Nebraska

2014 3 78 Spencer Long


I am still thinking about how to best try to use offensive linemen picks as a form of evaluation of RB support? Perhaps looking at the number of all linemen by school would be better than just the top 3

I do think there are some linemen who are good run blockers but incomplete players who will not get drafted because of lack of pass protection skills.

In any case my perception of Nebraska being a offensive lineman factory may not be as accurate as perhaps it once was a decade or so ago.

No denying that Wisconsin and Alabama have been having the most linemen drafted in the first three rounds recently.

 

[Faust]

Duke Johnson: Slasher or sluggish?

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Miami RB Duke Johnson "is an entertaining back who can explode in any direction at any time, sometimes a bit out of control and in haste," wrote NFLDraftScout.com's Frank Cooney.

"He can be a game-breaker with his talent or a back-breaker with his fumbles," Cooney wrote. "He is certainly worth a shot, but is not the guy to carry an NFL team on his back." Johnson has been compared to Chris Johnson in the past, but he's not quite the elite sprinter on the stop watch. Asked about his skills, Johnson replied: "Being able to receive out of the backfield is the No. 1 thing. I'm a mismatch with linebackers. I can catch the ball really well."


Source: CBS Sports
Apr 14 - 10:05 AM

 

[Faust]

Duke Johnson holds fantasy deep sleeper appeal

 

[Faust]

Video Link:

Pro Comparison: Duke Johnson

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Duke Johnson - RB - Hurricanes

Miami RB Duke Johnson's "draft stock has been somewhat capped due to durability issues and his relatively small frame, but his breakaway ability could be second to none in this draft," wrote ESPN's K.C. Joyner.

Amongst draft-eligible backs from Power 5 conferences, Johnson led the pack in percentage of rush attempts that gained 10 or more yards (18.7 percent) last year. "This breakaway ability isn't limited to rushing attempts, as Johnson also led the nation in long scrimmage plays," Joyner wrote. "He's also a great receiver out of the backfield. He could make a team that takes him on Day 2 very happy."

Source: ESPN Insider

Apr 19 - 8:17 PM

 

[Faust]

Miami RB Duke Johnson: I fit Dallas' offensive scheme

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Miami RB Duke Johnson "isn't going to be a bell-cow runner in the NFL, but like [Ameer] Abdullah, he could be a big-time contributor as a change-of-pace runner who plays in tandem with a power back," notes ESPN's Todd McShay.

"He's one of the best pass-catchers of all the running backs in this class, which makes him a big-time threat on third down," McShay wrote. "There is some concern about his durability and whether he can consistently stay on the field at the NFL level." Johnson led draft-eligible backs from Power 5 conferences in percentage of rush attempts that gained 10 or more yards (18.7 percent) last year. Johnson has been compared to Chris Johnson in the past, but he's not quite the elite sprinter on the stop watch.

Source: ESPN Insider
Apr 24 - 6:53 PM

 

[Sabertooth]

How does he compare to Jamal Charles in terms of breakaway ability?

 

[cstu]

How does he compare to Jamal Charles in terms of breakaway ability?

Think Shane Vereen.

 

[jurb26]

How does he compare to Jamal Charles in terms of breakaway ability?

What do you consider breakaway ability?Duke is great at breaking long runs but he's not great at finishing them like Charles because he doesn't have near the long speed.

 

[Sabertooth]

Gotcha

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Duke Johnson - RB - Hurricanes

Miami RB Duke Johnson "is one of the fastest players in this class, with elite burst to and through the hole," notes ESPN's Todd McShay.

"One of the most important qualities in a running back is the ability to create yards on your own, and Johnson can do that with his ability to make defenders miss in the hole and with his electrifying lateral agility," McShay wrote. "He can stop and start on a dime and can quickly change directions while working through multiple creases. Running plays don't always go the way you draw them up on the chalk board, so a lot of times you need to find the second crease, which is why Johnson's ability to change direction without losing momentum is so important." Johnson led draft-eligible backs from Power 5 conferences in percentage of rush attempts that gained 10 or more yards (18.7 percent) last year. "He is also an excellent pass-catcher, with his ability to quickly transition upfield after the catch and then make defenders miss in the open field," McShay wrote. Johnson is also a good kickoff returner.

Source: ESPN Insider

Apr 26 - 11:59 PM

 

[Alex P Keaton]

RIP in peace Duke...We hardly knew ye

Because he has to beat out an underperforming 3rd round pick from last year and another 2nd year guy who was u drafted last year?

 

[lod01]

Miami RB Duke Johnson: I fit Dallas' offensive scheme

Yeah, well welcome to Cleveland, bottom of the NFL barrel and owner of the 2016 #1 pick.

 

[spider321]

RIP in peace Duke...We hardly knew ye

Because he has to beat out an underperforming 3rd round pick from last year and another 2nd year guy who was u drafted last year?

No. Because all three will play.

 

[lod01]

RIP in peace Duke...We hardly knew ye

Because he has to beat out an underperforming 3rd round pick from last year and another 2nd year guy who was u drafted last year?

That 2nd year guy's only problem is fumbles. Johnson is undersized. No way he carries the load on a team with absolutely nothing at the QB and WR position. He's be lucky to gain 2 yards a carry.

 

[jurb26]

RIP in peace Duke...We hardly knew ye

Because he has to beat out an underperforming 3rd round pick from last year and another 2nd year guy who was u drafted last year?

No no no, of course not. Actually, it's because he's on the Cleveland Browns.

The Browns are killing it in this draft. They also have a great oline. Duke will probably be the best RB on the team. I don't know if that will mean a lead role, though.

 

[Xue]

RIP in peace Duke...We hardly knew ye

Because he has to beat out an underperforming 3rd round pick from last year and another 2nd year guy who was u drafted last year?

No no no, of course not. Actually, it's because he's on the Cleveland Browns.

The Browns are killing it in this draft. They also have a great oline. Duke will probably be the best RB on the team. I don't know if that will mean a lead role, though.

Duke is the best pass-catching RB on the team now. He's not the best "running" back on the team. He wasn't even the best "running" back on Miami.

 

[Xue]

How does he compare to Jamal Charles in terms of breakaway ability?

Think Shane Vereen.

And Gio Bernard.

 

[jurb26]

RIP in peace Duke...We hardly knew ye

Because he has to beat out an underperforming 3rd round pick from last year and another 2nd year guy who was u drafted last year?

No no no, of course not. Actually, it's because he's on the Cleveland Browns.

The Browns are killing it in this draft. They also have a great oline. Duke will probably be the best RB on the team. I don't know if that will mean a lead role, though.

Duke is the best pass-catching RB on the team now. He's not the best "running" back on the team. He wasn't even the best "running" back on Miami.

He easily could be better than West and Crowell. Clev must feel there is some disconnect in their running game to invest as well. The other RBs in Mia are irrelevant. They aren't being drafted, yet.

 

[Faust]

Duke Johnson: 'I can make things happen' for Browns

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000490303/article/duke-johnson-i-can-make-things-happen-for-browns

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

The Browns could use third-round RB Duke Johnson on kick returns.

Johnson was a standout kick returner at Miami, averaging 30.7 yards and scoring two touchdowns. He could be an upgrade over Travis Benjamin, who averaged a career-worst 20.5 on kick returns last year. Johnson's offensive role will likely be limited to passing downs behind Terrance West and Isaiah Crowell.

Source: Cleveland Plain Dealer
May 23 - 3:39 PM

 

[Faust]

Will Duke Johnson win the Browns starting running back job?: Hey Mary Kay!

 

[Shutout]

I can't see Duke wbeing the long-term lead back on this team. Coaches just simply DO NOT think this way in terms of having a guy or two with prototypical size to be a lead back and you sit those guys in favor of the small guy.

You have to extra-ordinarily special to break out of that mold and even when you do, as soon as you get one little ding or slow a half step, the coaches start talk about "keeping the guy fresh" or "saving him from a pounding".

Darren Sproles, to me, has looked ELECTRIC on the field at times. A no-brainer "best guy on the field" at times. But you can't give him the lead gig. You just can't.

You can get away with it when the guy is extremely durable (Charles) or powerful (MJD), etc, but otherwise, one way or the other, something happens and you don't just roll into year after year saying "yeah, Duke...special guy...clear bellcow".

 

[Eminence]

I think he can be the guy in a 60 - 40 split. Reminds me so much of McCoy.

 

[Shutout]

I think he can be the guy in a 60 - 40 split. Reminds me so much of McCoy.

Don't think he has nearly the natural feet Shady has.

 

[Zyphros]

I think he can be the guy in a 60 - 40 split. Reminds me so much of McCoy.

Don't think he has nearly the natural feet Shady has.

More Seastrunk than McCoy

 

[skol asylum]

Feed the Crow.

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Speaking at Browns Fan Fest on Saturday, GM Ray Farmer praised third-round pick Duke Johnson's "playmaking ability and supreme confidence."

"I think he's going to be tremendous for us," added Farmer. The 77th overall pick, Johnson was a dynamic all-purpose back at Miami, and offers a more versatile repertoire than projected starter Isaiah Crowell. Johnson will be an intriguing late-round target for owners planning to use the "Zero RB" strategy in 2015.

Source: Akron Beacon-Journal
Jun 7 - 1:34 PM

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Nice breakdown of DJ.

This draft class is deep so the fantasy community has made some knee-jerk reactions on this draft class. RB Duke Johnson is being discounted and dismissed by many because they have already anointed Isaiah Crowell the starter and Terrence West as the primary back-up or second banana in a RBBC. Last year West was sat by the coaching staff as a healthy scratch more than once. Crow is the lead back but whereas T-West's has been criticized for dancing and avoiding contact Isaiah Crowell's running style is just the opposite, he is confrontational with probably too many excessive collisions which lead to him getting hurt last year. Similar scenarios could unfold this year opening the door for Johnson.

The Browns offensive line is one of best in the league getting Pro Bowl C Alex Mack back and added 1st round pick Cameron Irving and they added a FB and blocking TE depth and they get a healthy OT Bowie back. The Browns averaged over 148 yards rushing per game before Alex Mack went down with a broken leg and less than 80 yards per game afterwards. New OC John Defilippo will utilize a pass catching RB this year and that role seems destined to go to Duke but he could find a lot more opportunities than what some believe. He could even emerge as the featured back in a committee at some point this year. Duke has been getting rave reviews in mini-camp and OTAs so early observations are positive.

As noted here is a good breakdown of RB Duke Johnson. Good resource but too much to cut-and-paste so go to the link:

----------------------------

http://dynastyfootballwarehouse.com/rookie-profile-duke-johnson/

ROOKIE PROFILE: RB

Duke Johnson
Posted by Mike Cagna on June 5th, 2015 10:00 AM | Featured Articles, NFL Draft Profiles, Redraft Warehouse

THE DFW 2015 ROOKIE GUIDE: RB

Duke Johnson

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Browns RBs coach Wilbert Montgomery said Cleveland would like to use third-round RB Duke Johnson in a Giovani Bernard-type role.

Montgomery called it a "Where's Waldo?" approach, suggesting Johnson could line up in the slot and flank out wide in addition to being a ball carrier. The Browns should be one of the most run-heavy teams in the league, and they have three capable backs in projected starter Isaiah Crowell, Terrance West, and rookie Johnson. Johnson will be an intriguing late-round target in fantasy drafts after the Browns seemed to sour a bit on both Crowell and West at times in 2014.

Source: Nate Ulrich on Twitter
Jun 11 - 2:53 PM

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

According to ESPN's Adam Caplan, rookie Duke Johnson has been "the most impressive" Browns running back at OTAs.

Caplan acknowledges Johnson needs to keep it up when the pads go on, but says his "money" would be on Johnson emerging as a three-down back. Seeing as GM Ray Farmer and RBs coach Wilbert Montgomery have both publicly compared Johnson to scatback Gio Bernard, we're not entirely sure the Browns envision Johnson as a true lead runner. Johnson did show the ability to run inside and create on his own at Miami (FL), however. Behind one of the league's better offensive lines, Johnson will be an intriguing flyer pick in 2015 fantasy drafts, particularly of the PPR variety.

Source: Adam Caplan on Twitter
Jun 12 - 10:37 PM

 

[Faust]

Browns RB coach on how they'll use Duke Johnson: 'Where's Waldo?'

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Third-round RB Duke Johnson has been getting reps as a wide receiver at minicamp.

Per offensive coordinator John DeFilippo, this is part of the plan. Johnson doesn't look like a wideout at 5'9/200, but has soft hands and is electric in space. He's capable of playing in both the slot and even flanking all the way out wide, similar to Gio Bernard. Johnson has reportedly been the Browns' best back during the offseason program, outplaying Isaiah Crowell and Terrance West. He's a sneaky late-round running back pick, especially in PPR formats.

Source: Nate Ulrich on Twitter
Jun 18 - 10:14 AM

 

[georg013]

It's almost like everyone in here forgot about the headaches Pettine caused last season with his running back rotation. Duke Johnson will NOT receive significant carries year 1 UNLESS Crowell or West fall flat on their faces. Period. His value will come from returns and receptions. I don't even envision him as the passing down back. Not a knock on Duke. This backfield belongs to Crowell or West. At least for this year. The hype is just that, hype. Everyone in this backfield was being hyped last season at some point. Same song, same dance.

 

[Zyphros]

It's almost like everyone in here forgot about the headaches Pettine caused last season with his running back rotation. Duke Johnson will NOT receive significant carries year 1 UNLESS Crowell or West fall flat on their faces. Period. His value will come from returns and receptions. I don't even envision him as the passing down back. Not a knock on Duke. This backfield belongs to Crowell or West. At least for this year. The hype is just that, hype. Everyone in this backfield was being hyped last season at some point. Same song, same dance.

I completely agree. I'm of the belief that 1 of these 2 will end up separating themselves (Crowell or West) and Duke is the odd man out. If he starts playing the slot or quick flare out's for a few catches then fine but the RB title belongs to the "vet's".

 

[satch]

It's almost like everyone in here forgot about the headaches Pettine caused last season with his running back rotation. Duke Johnson will NOT receive significant carries year 1 UNLESS Crowell or West fall flat on their faces. Period. His value will come from returns and receptions. I don't even envision him as the passing down back. Not a knock on Duke. This backfield belongs to Crowell or West. At least for this year. The hype is just that, hype. Everyone in this backfield was being hyped last season at some point. Same song, same dance.

I completely agree. I'm of the belief that 1 of these 2 will end up separating themselves (Crowell or West) and Duke is the odd man out. If he starts playing the slot or quick flare out's for a few catches then fine but the RB title belongs to the "vet's".

I agree as well. I think Crowell could be a huge value pick this year. Run heavy team with a great offensive line. Crow had 8 TDs as a rookie in a heavy timeshare. If he emerges as the Browns lead back he could be steal.

 

[LBH]

I think Duke is more talented than either Crowell or West. He's going to be too hard to keep off the field. I'm expecting a time share between Duke and Crowell. I think West will get a few carries behind Crowell but will more or less be phased out of the rotation. Duke is going to be a very solid PPR RB imo

 

[georg013]

I don't want to turn this into a Crowell thread but I too believe he is in for a big year. I'm thinking 1,000 yards, easy. I think we see him running with more confidence and aggression. Duke Johnson won't come close to those numbers but should be able to carve out a nice role in PPR leagues. Would I start him? Only if my team was decimated by injury or I didn't have any other flex options. Year 2 is when I expect us to know how the backfield will shake out. Unless of coure they draft another running back...

 

[Faust]

Why Duke Johnson Could Be a Late-Round Steal in PPR Leagues This Season

 

[voiceofunreason]

It's almost like everyone in here forgot about the headaches Pettine caused last season with his running back rotation. Duke Johnson will NOT receive significant carries year 1 UNLESS Crowell or West fall flat on their faces. Period. His value will come from returns and receptions. I don't even envision him as the passing down back. Not a knock on Duke. This backfield belongs to Crowell or West. At least for this year. The hype is just that, hype. Everyone in this backfield was being hyped last season at some point. Same song, same dance.

That's because neither really played very well and they kept trying to motivate them and get one of them to separate. Neither Crowell or West is that great and Duke will get plenty of chances to show what he can do. One of the worst backfields in football without question.

 

[georg013]

It's almost like everyone in here forgot about the headaches Pettine caused last season with his running back rotation. Duke Johnson will NOT receive significant carries year 1 UNLESS Crowell or West fall flat on their faces. Period. His value will come from returns and receptions. I don't even envision him as the passing down back. Not a knock on Duke. This backfield belongs to Crowell or West. At least for this year. The hype is just that, hype. Everyone in this backfield was being hyped last season at some point. Same song, same dance.

That's because neither really played very well and they kept trying to motivate them and get one of them to separate. Neither Crowell or West is that great and Duke will get plenty of chances to show what he can do. One of the worst backfields in football without question.

The moment Duke fumbles or has a poor practice he will be benched. Sorry Unreason, there is nothing you can say to convince me Pettine will approach Duke's usage any differently. Worst possible situation for the young fella year 1 at least.

 

[Shutout]

It's almost like everyone in here forgot about the headaches Pettine caused last season with his running back rotation. Duke Johnson will NOT receive significant carries year 1 UNLESS Crowell or West fall flat on their faces. Period. His value will come from returns and receptions. I don't even envision him as the passing down back. Not a knock on Duke. This backfield belongs to Crowell or West. At least for this year. The hype is just that, hype. Everyone in this backfield was being hyped last season at some point. Same song, same dance.

That's because neither really played very well and they kept trying to motivate them and get one of them to separate. Neither Crowell or West is that great and Duke will get plenty of chances to show what he can do. One of the worst backfields in football without question.

The moment Duke fumbles or has a poor practice he will be benched. Sorry Unreason, there is nothing you can say to convince me Pettine will approach Duke's usage any differently. Worst possible situation for the young fella year 1 at least.

I tend to agree. Everyone looks at these rookies with talent (and he is very talented) and they just carve out the scenario of how he will get in there and make his role but unless he steps in and becomes a superstud that is just undeniably impossible to take off the field, my concern is that from what we saw of Pettine last year, it will be situational and, like was just said, he'll fumble and that old school Coughlin-like logic will ruin his day and plant doubt for the next week, etc. Pettine seems to have no problem going with a hot hand when given a choice of guys that are basically interchangeable. This group doesn't appear to be truly interchangeable, but I can see the HC justifying Crowell over Johnson, even if Johnson is playing well, leaning on the defense of "they wanted to scheme this game a particular way" or "the rookie didn't protect the ball" or "didn't pass protect well". Just something.

It was only about 10 months ago that we thought the Browns backfield was Tate, West, and then Crowell (with some sneak appeal if Crowell got a chance). A lot changes quickly..but then changes again. Not a scenario I like investing in until I see the clear leader emerge.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

It was only about 10 months ago that we thought the Browns backfield was Tate, West, and then Crowell (with some sneak appeal if Crowell got a chance). A lot changes quickly..but then changes again. Not a scenario I like investing in until I see the clear leader emerge.

The depth chart changed wildly over the course of the year and that is a big reason why no one should feel confident that Crow is the undisputed starter. He struggled in pass protection and catching the football last year and he was poor in eluding tackles which lead to him absorbing more contact and getting injured.

Pettine had little if any say in last year's offense, that was run by Kyle Shanahan who was not picked by Pettine to run the offense. This year Pettine hand picked his OC John D. Flilippo and Pettine is sitting in on some offensive meetings. Flip has stated he will utilize the RBs in the passing game and that is something that Crow is simply not good at.

"The Browns did not trust Crowell as a pass protector, however, and he saw only 14 targets in the passing game, catching nine for 87 yards. Crowell also showed a distinct lack of elusiveness as a runner; PFF charted him with just nine missed tackles forced, a league low among backs with at least 140 attempts."

Browns GM Ray Farmer said in February he wanted to add a RB so he and Pettine targeted Duke Johnson. Crow struggled in the passing game, West was inconsistent, the club saw a need to add a RB and did so.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/2130148/isaiah-crowell

February 19, 2015 12:55 pm

GM Farmer: Browns will look to add more RBs this offseason
by Igor Mello | CBSSports.com
Browns general manager Ray Farmer spoke highly of rookie running backs Isaiah Crowell and Terrance West, but indicated that Cleveland will look to adding more backs this offseason, per NFL.com. Farmer would not reveal whether he would add through free agency or the draft.

The role of both backs fluctuated during the season, especially after the team released Ben Tate...

RB Duke Johnson has been getting rave reviews in mini camp and OTAs. I think he has strengthened his grip on the 3rd down pass catching RB role and that he could assume more of a role as a feature back as the season unfolds.

 

[lardonastick]

 

[georg013]

That looks all warm and fuzzy during the offseason where seemingly EVERYONE has star potential and is going to receive rave reviews (see Devante Freeman). But then reality sets in. Those offseason darlings are expected to pass protect, hold on to the ball, and gain yards. How many third round backs in the last 10 years have come in and carved out a SIGNIFICANT role year one for any reason other than injury? Serious question. I would really like to know. Compound that with what we already know about Pettine and I would say the offseason talk is just that. Talk. This time of year, the internet is full of feel good comments. Last season, I fell for it hard with Eric Ebron. I'm not sold at all. Not until I see it weeks 1-7. Not saying Crowell and West are light years better. But they have one thing Duke doesn't. NFL experience. I would love Pettine to prove me wrong on this one and stick with a guy.