[Dynasty] 2014 Draft Prospects (3 Viewers)

[ShaHBucks]

I'm not sure what the cap ramifications are if STL cut Bradford but he sucks so they could be looking at a QB since they have two picks in the 1st this year.

fisher said he went to STL because of bradford and the 1.2 pick (likely given more operational and personnel control than he would have gotten in MIA, as well). i think he is realistic and realized he had one of the worst OL and WR situations in the first few years. in other threads, you had people insisting STL WRs were just as good as GB, than we had a poll, and that left this position in ruins and in full reteat (about 4 out of 44 voted for STL, but oddly, each of the four was too embarrassed to defend their position in public ).

matt ryan has been held up as a bullet proof QB that "elevates his weapons and makes them better", yet even with julio jones for five games, roddy white for about 10 and tony gonzalez for 14, they were 3-10 before narrowly beating a reeling WAS that had *SEVEN* turnovers, and that may have been because shanahan oddly went for a two point conversion instead of sending the game into OT.

in staffords first four seasons, his record against winning teams (look it up)... 1-23. does that "suck"?

back to fisher, he was already high on bradford, and in many ways, he was having a career season (14/4 TD/INT ratio through part of seven games - rodgers was like 15/4 through eight or part of eight, for perspective)... not sure exactly what people were looking for as evidence of improvement, through six full games... 20/0, 30/0? when i would ask people in the threads, nobody would committ to a number? people would point to the 1-3 start, but didn't want to hear that stacy had one carry in the first month. everything is always about bradford being 100% responsible for the rams challenges. people say, its only seven games, but that is a copout. obviously when people have made up their minds, even if he was 30/10 over 16 games, what would the predictable refrain be according to the law of floating boundaries and shifting demarcations. it was only one SEASON.

when the defense holds IND to 8 points, that is evidence that bradford is terrible. when they get 250+ rushing yards against CHI, of course this is conclusive proof that bradford is terrible. when austin had a 65 yard TD against the bears, of course the same goofy poster lunged at his keyboard to fire off a clemens is better for austin than bradford. the only problem? laughably, it was a run. what possible better evidence could there be of a troll agenda? but this same person a few weeks before had posted that austin was one of the worst NFL players in history, based on comparitive PUNT RETURN STATS, that he would NEVER be able to elude NFL defenders. so seizing on the opportunity of the QB change to cover this singularly, stupefyingly bad projection, he framed bradford as the bad guy and scape goat. oh, but he forgot one thing. his hatchet job on austin, was on the basis of his PUNT RETURN EXPLOITS. what does that have to do with bradford? some people get really creative with this stuff, and are extremely determined. it could be in a bob waterfield historical post. a favorite snacks in the st. louis stadium thread. an FFA thread about St. Louis tourist spots... must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks wherever possible. or it will crop up in even stranger places. threads on macedonian battle tactics? post-structuralism of jacques derrida and michel foucault? must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks!

instead of taking a QB, they could maybe use the two picks on some kind of combo like sammy watkins and auburn LT greg robinson... or jake matthews and mike evans. than he would be throwing to maybe watkins, austin, bailey (one of their best WRs, will start next year, bradford didn't have the benefit of throwing to him) and cook.

so no, i don't see fisher, in year three of a carefully orchestrated, methodically organized, meticulous planned multi-year rebuild, making a panic move and doing the equivalent of yanking on the emergency brake and locking the car up during rush hour. what if they get a rookie and they bust. OOPS. 2-3 year setback. try another rookie? another bust? OOPS? another 2-3 year setback?

most STL observers (jim thomas, bernie miklasz, brian burwell, nick wagoner, et al) don't expect the rams to take a first round QB, for what its worth.

I agree that Bradford was having a breakout season. He would have had better numbers than a ton of big name QBs. But it's a possibility that he is done. He just tore his ACL, had foot problems and a shoulder injury his final year of college. The time in between that was all that great. He got hurt in a critical time in his development. I'd write off any Wr/Rb with that kind of injury history. I'm sure he'll be a crafty vet like, Carson Palmer, but I have no hope for him in FF. He's the last of the overpaid high-pick QBs. I don't see it happening. If I seen a QB I'd take the insurance. I don't get the Bradford hate either. It's all media driven. They love say Josh Freeman, but hate Sam Bradford. They love Mike Vick, but hate Nick Foles. Love Jake Locker, but hate Andy Dalton ect...

 

[Milkman]

I'm not sure what the cap ramifications are if STL cut Bradford but he sucks so they could be looking at a QB since they have two picks in the 1st this year.

fisher said he went to STL because of bradford and the 1.2 pick (likely given more operational and personnel control than he would have gotten in MIA, as well). i think he is realistic and realized he had one of the worst OL and WR situations in the first few years. in other threads, you had people insisting STL WRs were just as good as GB, than we had a poll, and that left this position in ruins and in full reteat (about 4 out of 44 voted for STL, but oddly, each of the four was too embarrassed to defend their position in public ).

matt ryan has been held up as a bullet proof QB that "elevates his weapons and makes them better", yet even with julio jones for five games, roddy white for about 10 and tony gonzalez for 14, they were 3-10 before narrowly beating a reeling WAS that had *SEVEN* turnovers, and that may have been because shanahan oddly went for a two point conversion instead of sending the game into OT.

in staffords first four seasons, his record against winning teams (look it up)... 1-23. does that "suck"?

back to fisher, he was already high on bradford, and in many ways, he was having a career season (14/4 TD/INT ratio through part of seven games - rodgers was like 15/4 through eight or part of eight, for perspective)... not sure exactly what people were looking for as evidence of improvement, through six full games... 20/0, 30/0? when i would ask people in the threads, nobody would committ to a number? people would point to the 1-3 start, but didn't want to hear that stacy had one carry in the first month. everything is always about bradford being 100% responsible for the rams challenges. people say, its only seven games, but that is a copout. obviously when people have made up their minds, even if he was 30/10 over 16 games, what would the predictable refrain be according to the law of floating boundaries and shifting demarcations. it was only one SEASON.

when the defense holds IND to 8 points, that is evidence that bradford is terrible. when they get 250+ rushing yards against CHI, of course this is conclusive proof that bradford is terrible. when austin had a 65 yard TD against the bears, of course the same goofy poster lunged at his keyboard to fire off a clemens is better for austin than bradford. the only problem? laughably, it was a run. what possible better evidence could there be of a troll agenda? but this same person a few weeks before had posted that austin was one of the worst NFL players in history, based on comparitive PUNT RETURN STATS, that he would NEVER be able to elude NFL defenders. so seizing on the opportunity of the QB change to cover this singularly, stupefyingly bad projection, he framed bradford as the bad guy and scape goat. oh, but he forgot one thing. his hatchet job on austin, was on the basis of his PUNT RETURN EXPLOITS. what does that have to do with bradford? some people get really creative with this stuff, and are extremely determined. it could be in a bob waterfield historical post. a favorite snacks in the st. louis stadium thread. an FFA thread about St. Louis tourist spots... must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks wherever possible. or it will crop up in even stranger places. threads on macedonian battle tactics? post-structuralism of jacques derrida and michel foucault? must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks!

instead of taking a QB, they could maybe use the two picks on some kind of combo like sammy watkins and auburn LT greg robinson... or jake matthews and mike evans. than he would be throwing to maybe watkins, austin, bailey (one of their best WRs, will start next year, bradford didn't have the benefit of throwing to him) and cook.

so no, i don't see fisher, in year three of a carefully orchestrated, methodically organized, meticulous planned multi-year rebuild, making a panic move and doing the equivalent of yanking on the emergency brake and locking the car up during rush hour. what if they get a rookie and they bust. OOPS. 2-3 year setback. try another rookie? another bust? OOPS? another 2-3 year setback?

most STL observers (jim thomas, bernie miklasz, brian burwell, nick wagoner, et al) don't expect the rams to take a first round QB, for what its worth.

Look I'm not trying to troll anybody but Bradford hasn't looked very good early in his career. What's crazy is he is going to be coming off of major knee surgery next year and I would not be surprised if he struggles again because of it. See RG3 and Brady for other QB's that have struggled the year after an ACL injury. You're probably right they aren't going to give up on him yet but what happens if he struggles again next year? Seems likely he will..........

 

[jurb26]

Nice early effort. I like Murray more than you; Fales should be on that list. This WR group looks very strong.

Lol, I wondered if someone was going to call me out on that. You have no idea how close I was to listing him. Eventually I refrained and probably shouldn't have. I'm not sure where I fit him in just yet. Somewhere after McCarron and between Murray is most likely.

 

[ShaHBucks]

Most people don't account for this. They just look at the raw numbers. So David Wilson's 4.3 is "elite athleticism" while Doug Martin's 4.4-4.5 is "average."

Lacy ran a 4.45 the year before. If you're going to stick to his official pro-day time, can we at least compare it to Martin's official combine time of 4.55? Martin's clearly not the legit 4.4 guy that his unofficial, word-of-mouth times might suggest.

Hand times from spring practice don't matter. Lots of guys claim to run a 4.4, but can't hit the mark when they're actually put to the test.

If you really need to keep comparing these two, have at it:

Doug Martin

5'9.2" 223 (32.7 BMI)

40 - 4.46-4.55

Vertical - 36"

Broad Jump - 10'

Three Cone - 6.79 seconds

Eddie Lacy

5'11" 231 (32.2)

40 - 4.58-4.64

Vertical - 33.5"

Broad Jump - 9'7"

Three Cone - 7.33 seconds

That is a disastrous workout for Lacy. Almost certainly a big factor in why he wasn't a first round pick.

Martin was thicker, faster, and more explosive across the board.

It's hard for any RB to get picked in the first round. It's that much harder when you don't have standout physical tools. Teams can get a serviceable grinder in the middle-late rounds. To go higher than that, you usually have to offer something exceptional. We even saw shades of that in the most recent draft with the first two RBs off the board offering more than just two-down power running. Bernard is explosive and versatile as a pass catcher. I'm no Bell fan, but he has good feet and rare receiving ability for a heavier back. That's almost certainly part of what got him the nod over comparable options when Pitt was on the clock.

It's not that a guy like Hyde is a bad player, but what incentive is there to pick him in the top 32 when you can get a pounder like Jeremy Hill or Devonta Freeman a round or three later? There is a place for guys like Shonn Greene, Rudi Johnson, and BJGE in the NFL, but that place isn't in the first round of the draft. When teams have made the mistake of taking one-dimensional power backs with poor explosiveness that high in recent years, it hasn't worked out very well (Benson, Moreno, Ingram - all huge busts, though to his credit Moreno also has some receiving ability).

RB is probably more devalued now than ever before. So I think teams are really going to want to see something special from a back to take him that high. Which is what I've been repeating for the last several posts. I think Gordon and Seastrunk might be the only backs who tempt anyone that high this year. Andre Williams has the look of a first round back at time, but may be too one-dimensional to go that high. I don't see Hyde offering enough value over your street level replacement to justify that pick. So barring a strong combine, I'm gonna say he won't sniff the first round.

I said in the offseason what did you expect from a 230 pound man coming off of injury? And that he's not going to be running sweeps. He has the profile to make money between the tackles. Lacy's 40x and agility number are in the right range for someone his size(maybe a touch slow). Did he measure out as a elite RB? Nah, but he was not a bust that everyone made him out to be. There is not too many 230 pound men, or top RB prospect for the matter, that can run the 40x that Lacy did. I agree with your last take. Any team could have had identical big RBs like Mendenhall or Tolbert for cheap. They could have waited rounds for a prospect like Zac Stacy(or my boy L. Murray but I digress...).

 

[ShaHBucks]

Nice early effort. I like Murray more than you; Fales should be on that list. This WR group looks very strong.

Lol, I wondered if someone was going to call me out on that. You have no idea how close I was to listing him. Eventually I refrained and probably shouldn't have. I'm not sure where I fit him in just yet. Somewhere after McCarron and between Murray is most likely.

Fales is nice.

 

[Xue]

Updated my rankings today.

QB

Teddy Bridgewater, Louis.

Derek Carr, Fresno St.

Blake Borles, UCF

Tajh Boyd, Clem.

Johnny Manziel, TAM

McCarron, Bama

Stephen Morris, Mia.

Zach Mettenberger, LSU

Aaron Murray, UGA

RB

Launche Seastrunk, Baylor

Bishop Sankey, Wash.

Melvin Gordon, Wisconsin

Ka'Deem Carey, Arz.

Carlos Hyde, OSU

Devonta Freeman, FSU

Tre Mason, Auburn

Andre Williams, BC

Jeremy Hill, LSU

Raijun Neal, Tenn

Charles Sims, WVU

Marion Grace, Arz St.

Henry Josey, Mizz

LaDarius Perkins, Miss St.

Ben Malena, TAM

Damien Williams, Oklahoma

Wilder, FSU

Alfred Blue, LSU

Silas redd, SC

Kenny Hilliard, LSU

James White, Wisc

John Hubert, Kstate

WR

Sammy Watkins, Clem.

Marquise Lee, USC

Jaelen Strong, Arz St.

Mike Evans, TAM

Devonte Adams, Fresno

Jarvis Landry, LSU

Kelvin Benjamin, FSU

Allen Robinson, PSU

Jordan Mathews, Vandy

Paul Richardson, Colorado

Brandon Coleman, Rutgers

Odell Beckham, LSU

Brandin Cooks, Oregon St.

Dontre Moncrief, Ole Miss

DeVante Parker, Louisville

Cody Hoffman, BYU

Malcom Mitchell, UGA

Devin Street, Pitt

Jaed Abbrederis, Wisconsin

Rashad Greene, FSU

Josh Huff, Oregon

TE

Eric Ebron, UNC

Jace Amaro, Texas Tech

Austin Seferian-Jenkins, Wash

Xavier Grimble, USC

Arthur Lynch, UGA

CJ Fiedorowicz, Iowa

Carey is overrated. Wilder and White are too low. Ameer Abdullah missing.

Coleman overrated. Cooks, Beckham, Greene too low. Mitchell probably not declaring since he tore his ACL early in the season.

Grimble, Lynch, Fiedorowicz are nothing special, I wouldn't bother ranking them.

 

[jurb26]

Grimble, Lynch, Fiedorowicz are nothing special, I wouldn't bother ranking them.

When you play in 32 team IDP leagues with a possibility to start 2 TEs you dig deep into the pool. I've got more TEs ranked than that but stopped there for the reason you stated. I acknowledge some guys aren't yet ranked because I've not figured out where I'd place them. This will change about a dozen more times.

 

[Bob Magaw]

I'm not sure what the cap ramifications are if STL cut Bradford but he sucks so they could be looking at a QB since they have two picks in the 1st this year.

fisher said he went to STL because of bradford and the 1.2 pick (likely given more operational and personnel control than he would have gotten in MIA, as well). i think he is realistic and realized he had one of the worst OL and WR situations in the first few years. in other threads, you had people insisting STL WRs were just as good as GB, than we had a poll, and that left this position in ruins and in full reteat (about 4 out of 44 voted for STL, but oddly, each of the four was too embarrassed to defend their position in public ).

matt ryan has been held up as a bullet proof QB that "elevates his weapons and makes them better", yet even with julio jones for five games, roddy white for about 10 and tony gonzalez for 14, they were 3-10 before narrowly beating a reeling WAS that had *SEVEN* turnovers, and that may have been because shanahan oddly went for a two point conversion instead of sending the game into OT.

in staffords first four seasons, his record against winning teams (look it up)... 1-23. does that "suck"?

back to fisher, he was already high on bradford, and in many ways, he was having a career season (14/4 TD/INT ratio through part of seven games - rodgers was like 15/4 through eight or part of eight, for perspective)... not sure exactly what people were looking for as evidence of improvement, through six full games... 20/0, 30/0? when i would ask people in the threads, nobody would committ to a number? people would point to the 1-3 start, but didn't want to hear that stacy had one carry in the first month. everything is always about bradford being 100% responsible for the rams challenges. people say, its only seven games, but that is a copout. obviously when people have made up their minds, even if he was 30/10 over 16 games, what would the predictable refrain be according to the law of floating boundaries and shifting demarcations. it was only one SEASON.

when the defense holds IND to 8 points, that is evidence that bradford is terrible. when they get 250+ rushing yards against CHI, of course this is conclusive proof that bradford is terrible. when austin had a 65 yard TD against the bears, of course the same goofy poster lunged at his keyboard to fire off a clemens is better for austin than bradford. the only problem? laughably, it was a run. what possible better evidence could there be of a troll agenda? but this same person a few weeks before had posted that austin was one of the worst NFL players in history, based on comparitive PUNT RETURN STATS, that he would NEVER be able to elude NFL defenders. so seizing on the opportunity of the QB change to cover this singularly, stupefyingly bad projection, he framed bradford as the bad guy and scape goat. oh, but he forgot one thing. his hatchet job on austin, was on the basis of his PUNT RETURN EXPLOITS. what does that have to do with bradford? some people get really creative with this stuff, and are extremely determined. it could be in a bob waterfield historical post. a favorite snacks in the st. louis stadium thread. an FFA thread about St. Louis tourist spots... must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks wherever possible. or it will crop up in even stranger places. threads on macedonian battle tactics? post-structuralism of jacques derrida and michel foucault? must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks!

instead of taking a QB, they could maybe use the two picks on some kind of combo like sammy watkins and auburn LT greg robinson... or jake matthews and mike evans. than he would be throwing to maybe watkins, austin, bailey (one of their best WRs, will start next year, bradford didn't have the benefit of throwing to him) and cook.

so no, i don't see fisher, in year three of a carefully orchestrated, methodically organized, meticulous planned multi-year rebuild, making a panic move and doing the equivalent of yanking on the emergency brake and locking the car up during rush hour. what if they get a rookie and they bust. OOPS. 2-3 year setback. try another rookie? another bust? OOPS? another 2-3 year setback?

most STL observers (jim thomas, bernie miklasz, brian burwell, nick wagoner, et al) don't expect the rams to take a first round QB, for what its worth.

I agree that Bradford was having a breakout season. He would have had better numbers than a ton of big name QBs. But it's a possibility that he is done. He just tore his ACL, had foot problems and a shoulder injury his final year of college. The time in between that was all that great. He got hurt in a critical time in his development. I'd write off any Wr/Rb with that kind of injury history. I'm sure he'll be a crafty vet like, Carson Palmer, but I have no hope for him in FF. He's the last of the overpaid high-pick QBs. I don't see it happening. If I seen a QB I'd take the insurance.I don't get the Bradford hate either. It's all media driven. They love say Josh Freeman, but hate Sam Bradford. They love Mike Vick, but hate Nick Foles. Love Jake Locker, but hate Andy Dalton ect...

the thing about bradford's injuries are they haven't been the same (not like a danario alexander case), and he hasn't been as injury prone as mcfadden. no repeat of the shoulder joint in college. the ankle injury that he played on and reinjured and got shut down in 2011 (i could furnish the quote, but when football outsiders looked at their team that year, they called it the most injured offense in the past decade - three QBs went down), i chalked up to the OL... he has never had a pro bowl caliber LT like jake long before, and as a run blocking unit, they have been dominant at times since saffold moved to RG (see CHI - but saffold may be looking for davin joseph money, i hope they pay it, or close, as he is more valuable to the team's future than aging vets wells AND dahl, and they can trim them off the books in 2014... the complication in assigning a fair value to saffold is he tends to get dinged a lot, but he might get hurt less at guard?)... as to the knee, it was just the ACL, not like RGIII, who also tore the PCL and MCL, so his prognosis could be much better. also, his injury happened three months ahead of RGIII on the timeline. if people don't think the knee injury will be a death blow to RGIIIs career, they shouldn't in bradford's case, IMO.

i'll like him more if he is throwing to watkins, austin, bailey and cook next year, and has stacy all season. bailey is a hidden gem, but just began to get an opportunity to start in past week or two. he is flat out better than givens, quick and pettis. reminds me of hines ward and derrick mason.

 

[lyon812]

I'm not sure what the cap ramifications are if STL cut Bradford but he sucks so they could be looking at a QB since they have two picks in the 1st this year.

I don't think many Rams homers/writers/etc believe they're going to take a QB, especially after publicly stating they were looking into extending Bradford before his injury. While it's definitely arguable that they SHOULD draft a QB, Fisher and co. seem very loyal to him.

For what it's worth, here's a recent article discussing what could happen if they did cut Bradford loose: http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/86384/setting-the-rams-on-a-path-to-redemption

Back to the topic at hand, though, I think it's more likely that the Rams trade out of the #2-3 and try for a repeat of the RG3 deal with a QB-hungry team.

 

[Bob Magaw]

I'm not sure what the cap ramifications are if STL cut Bradford but he sucks so they could be looking at a QB since they have two picks in the 1st this year.

fisher said he went to STL because of bradford and the 1.2 pick (likely given more operational and personnel control than he would have gotten in MIA, as well). i think he is realistic and realized he had one of the worst OL and WR situations in the first few years. in other threads, you had people insisting STL WRs were just as good as GB, than we had a poll, and that left this position in ruins and in full reteat (about 4 out of 44 voted for STL, but oddly, each of the four was too embarrassed to defend their position in public ).

matt ryan has been held up as a bullet proof QB that "elevates his weapons and makes them better", yet even with julio jones for five games, roddy white for about 10 and tony gonzalez for 14, they were 3-10 before narrowly beating a reeling WAS that had *SEVEN* turnovers, and that may have been because shanahan oddly went for a two point conversion instead of sending the game into OT.

in staffords first four seasons, his record against winning teams (look it up)... 1-23. does that "suck"?

back to fisher, he was already high on bradford, and in many ways, he was having a career season (14/4 TD/INT ratio through part of seven games - rodgers was like 15/4 through eight or part of eight, for perspective)... not sure exactly what people were looking for as evidence of improvement, through six full games... 20/0, 30/0? when i would ask people in the threads, nobody would committ to a number? people would point to the 1-3 start, but didn't want to hear that stacy had one carry in the first month. everything is always about bradford being 100% responsible for the rams challenges. people say, its only seven games, but that is a copout. obviously when people have made up their minds, even if he was 30/10 over 16 games, what would the predictable refrain be according to the law of floating boundaries and shifting demarcations. it was only one SEASON.

when the defense holds IND to 8 points, that is evidence that bradford is terrible. when they get 250+ rushing yards against CHI, of course this is conclusive proof that bradford is terrible. when austin had a 65 yard TD against the bears, of course the same goofy poster lunged at his keyboard to fire off a clemens is better for austin than bradford. the only problem? laughably, it was a run. what possible better evidence could there be of a troll agenda? but this same person a few weeks before had posted that austin was one of the worst NFL players in history, based on comparitive PUNT RETURN STATS, that he would NEVER be able to elude NFL defenders. so seizing on the opportunity of the QB change to cover this singularly, stupefyingly bad projection, he framed bradford as the bad guy and scape goat. oh, but he forgot one thing. his hatchet job on austin, was on the basis of his PUNT RETURN EXPLOITS. what does that have to do with bradford? some people get really creative with this stuff, and are extremely determined. it could be in a bob waterfield historical post. a favorite snacks in the st. louis stadium thread. an FFA thread about St. Louis tourist spots... must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks wherever possible. or it will crop up in even stranger places. threads on macedonian battle tactics? post-structuralism of jacques derrida and michel foucault? must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks!

instead of taking a QB, they could maybe use the two picks on some kind of combo like sammy watkins and auburn LT greg robinson... or jake matthews and mike evans. than he would be throwing to maybe watkins, austin, bailey (one of their best WRs, will start next year, bradford didn't have the benefit of throwing to him) and cook.

so no, i don't see fisher, in year three of a carefully orchestrated, methodically organized, meticulous planned multi-year rebuild, making a panic move and doing the equivalent of yanking on the emergency brake and locking the car up during rush hour. what if they get a rookie and they bust. OOPS. 2-3 year setback. try another rookie? another bust? OOPS? another 2-3 year setback?

most STL observers (jim thomas, bernie miklasz, brian burwell, nick wagoner, et al) don't expect the rams to take a first round QB, for what its worth.

Look I'm not trying to troll anybody but Bradford hasn't looked very good early in his career. What's crazy is he is going to be coming off of major knee surgery next year and I would not be surprised if he struggles again because of it. See RG3 and Brady for other QB's that have struggled the year after an ACL injury. You're probably right they aren't going to give up on him yet but what happens if he struggles again next year? Seems likely he will..........

i don't think you are a troll, water1, everybody is entitled to their opinion (in the anecdote, there was somebody else specific i had in mind), your post just prompted me to recollect he does seem to have been bashed in a lot of cases for weird, highly suspect reasons(STL WRS are better than GB, etc). you make some reasonable points. if he blows out his ACL again, thats all she wrote, they have to move on.

fisher and snead were probably negligent in not getting getting a better backup QB (but where would they drafted one, they picked barret jones in round four, and traded two sixths for a fifth to get stacy - maybe instead of the CB in round five)?

most do expect them to upgrade the backup and draft a developmental type in round 3-4 (murray or mettenberg could fall due to ACL tears, maybe a guy like alabama QB?). if he struggles, i think they will have to do their best to see if he makes improvement during the season, and if it is due to the knee, if there is cause for optimism in his rate of improvement as he recovers. point taken the timing was bad, but i guess it is never good. it is true, that he has nowhere close to brady's resume, so he can't assume they will patiently wait for him to return to form. given his injury, stabilizing the OL and continuing to surround him with weapons could be an emphasis in the draft (but with a lot of picks, they can work on defense, too... maybe a trade down if they end up with 1.2 could manufacture another second and/or third)?

as to not looking good early, the point i make is switch him with ryan, let him throw to julio jones and roddy white and tony gonzalez, and have ryan throw to brandon gibson and austin pettis, and magically bradford looks better and ryan worse. which is a big reason i'd like to see what he could do with a legit WR1-type like sammy watkins or mike evans.

 

[bonesman]

What are people's take on how deep this draft is with talent? I ended up with a 5th and 15th pick in a 16 team TE heavy league and I think I may package them together to move up (contracts are slotted so moving up is kind of pricey)... or else move down. I know there are some good TEs in this draft but we can only put a 5 year max contract so rookie TEs aren't really the most appealing

 

[BigTex]

What are people's take on how deep this draft is with talent? I ended up with a 5th and 15th pick in a 16 team TE heavy league and I think I may package them together to move up (contracts are slotted so moving up is kind of pricey)... or else move down. I know there are some good TEs in this draft but we can only put a 5 year max contract so rookie TEs aren't really the most appealing

It's deep with the possibility of being deeper. I believe that Jace is the best TE in this class and I've always felt that way. If he falls to me at the 7th I'd be happy as hell.

Tex

 

[BigTex]

Updated my rankings today.

QB

Teddy Bridgewater, Louis.

Derek Carr, Fresno St.

Blake Borles, UCF

Tajh Boyd, Clem.

Johnny Manziel, TAM

McCarron, Bama

Stephen Morris, Mia.

Zach Mettenberger, LSU

Aaron Murray, UGA

RB

Launche Seastrunk, Baylor

Bishop Sankey, Wash.

Melvin Gordon, Wisconsin

Ka'Deem Carey, Arz.

Carlos Hyde, OSU

Devonta Freeman, FSU

Tre Mason, Auburn

Andre Williams, BC

Jeremy Hill, LSU

Raijun Neal, Tenn

Charles Sims, WVU

Marion Grace, Arz St.

Henry Josey, Mizz

LaDarius Perkins, Miss St.

Ben Malena, TAM

Damien Williams, Oklahoma

Wilder, FSU

Alfred Blue, LSU

Silas redd, SC

Kenny Hilliard, LSU

James White, Wisc

John Hubert, Kstate

WR

Sammy Watkins, Clem.

Marquise Lee, USC

Jaelen Strong, Arz St.

Mike Evans, TAM

Devonte Adams, Fresno

Jarvis Landry, LSU

Kelvin Benjamin, FSU

Allen Robinson, PSU

Jordan Mathews, Vandy

Paul Richardson, Colorado

Brandon Coleman, Rutgers

Odell Beckham, LSU

Brandin Cooks, Oregon St.

Dontre Moncrief, Ole Miss

DeVante Parker, Louisville

Cody Hoffman, BYU

Malcom Mitchell, UGA

Devin Street, Pitt

Jaed Abbrederis, Wisconsin

Rashad Greene, FSU

Josh Huff, Oregon

TE

Eric Ebron, UNC

Jace Amaro, Texas Tech

Austin Seferian-Jenkins, Wash

Xavier Grimble, USC

Arthur Lynch, UGA

CJ Fiedorowicz, Iowa

I always like your rankings.........just like Jace as the #1 TE but to each his own.

Giddy Up,

Tex

 

[jurb26]

Ebron and Amaro are kind of 1a and 1b to me. I think both are going to be great fantasy contributors.

 

[Vincesanity]

Who are the best PPR backs that we know of? Sankey? Grice?

 

[Concept Coop]

Who are the best PPR backs that we know of? Sankey? Grice?

I like Grice for his PPR potential. I recall a writer comparing Carey to Vereern, and thought to myself that Grice is a much better comp to Vereern.

 

[Concept Coop]

That is a disastrous workout for Lacy. Almost certainly a big factor in why he wasn't a first round pick.

This is likely my last comment on the matter: Yes. We know it was disastrous - it raised major red flags. I have said as much. I just don't put as much stock in those numbers, given the circumstances. I don't think a healthy, in shape Lacy puts up those numbers.

And you're going out of your way to cherry pick 40 times. Lacy's time was reported in the 4.50-4.60 range, and Martin ran a 4.55, not a 4.46-4.55.

 

[EastonBlues22]

Mocking 4 QBs to be drafted in the top 6 picks is pretty bold. I'm not even convinced that 4 will go in the entire 1st round.

but if you look at how the 32 teams are distributed in the current draft order, it is uncanny that of the teams expected to be looking for a QB, nearly all of them are in the top 10...

1 - HOU

3 - OAK

4 - JAX

6 - CLE

7 - TB (might be OK with glennon?)

8 - MIN

10 - TEN (some think they are prepared to move on from locker)

NYJ at #13? i don't think they give up on geno after one season (especially if it means taking the fifth or sixth best prospect in the class).

ARI at #20? palmer has played well enough to put them in playoff contention despite being in the rugged NFC West.

That is (not counting the jets and cards, who may not be as viable for a high pick anyways) seven of the top 10 teams.

So if there are four that go in the first round, they may go in the top ten, just because that is where they are needed... contingent on their grades being in line (otherwise we could see a trade down scenario like BUF with manuel this year, but that could be risky with so many teams needing one?), but it is sounding increasingly like the grades might be there for bridgewater, bortles, manziel and carr (don't know about the rest).

I tend to think some of these QBs will have their stock fall a bit now that the nit-picking process is about to begin, but you're certainly right that there might be a perfect storm of sorts brewing.

If it plays out that way, I think the Rams could do very well by trading back from their #2 pick.

 

[JFS171]

I tend to think some of these QBs will have their stock fall a bit now that the nit-picking process is about to begin, but you're certainly right that there might be a perfect storm of sorts brewing.


If it plays out that way, I think the Rams could do very well by trading back from their #2 pick.

Surely teams learned not to reach for a QB after watching the Gabbert/Locker/Ponder mess play out... right? Just because you need a QB and there's one available doesn't mean that guy is worth the pick.

Plus McShay is a complete hack... ESPN has him to put on TV and regurgitate what he's been told. Period.

 

[cstu]

Nice early effort. I like Murray more than you; Fales should be on that list. This WR group looks very strong.

Lol, I wondered if someone was going to call me out on that. You have no idea how close I was to listing him. Eventually I refrained and probably shouldn't have. I'm not sure where I fit him in just yet. Somewhere after McCarron and between Murray is most likely.

Fales is nice.

Amazing how he's still being under-rated.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

That is a disastrous workout for Lacy. Almost certainly a big factor in why he wasn't a first round pick.

This is likely my last comment on the matter: Yes. We know it was disastrous - it raised major red flags. I have said as much. I just don't put as much stock in those numbers, given the circumstances. I don't think a healthy, in shape Lacy puts up those numbers.

And you're going out of your way to cherry pick 40 times. Lacy's time was reported in the 4.50-4.60 range, and Martin ran a 4.55, not a 4.46-4.55.

Actually it was revised to 4.46 nearly a year after the combine.

 

[EastonBlues22]

I tend to think some of these QBs will have their stock fall a bit now that the nit-picking process is about to begin, but you're certainly right that there might be a perfect storm of sorts brewing.


If it plays out that way, I think the Rams could do very well by trading back from their #2 pick.

Surely teams learned not to reach for a QB after watching the Gabbert/Locker/Ponder mess play out... right? Just because you need a QB and there's one available doesn't mean that guy is worth the pick.

Plus McShay is a complete hack... ESPN has him to put on TV and regurgitate what he's been told. Period.

Coaching staffs and front offices have a lot of pressure to win. If there's a known problem, they'll can usually count on one chance to fix it. If they mess that up, well, the NFL isn't really known for job security.

Drafting a highly rated QB typically buys a few years, because nobody really expects a rookie QB to step in and perform at a finished product level. If they bypass that option for a journey-man vet and development QB project, then all bets are usually off.

 

[Faust]

Does UCF’s Blake Bortles have the look of a first-round quarterback?

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

As of Thursday, 201 underclassmen have requested evaluations from the NFL Draft Advisory Board.

Chargers beat writer Bob McGinn notes around 180 non-seniors requested evaluations last year. Expect the record of declared underclassmen to be broken again this year.


Source: Bob McGinn on Twitter

Scouts Inc.'s Todd McShay called UCF redshirt junior QB Blake Bortles a cross between Ben Reothlisberger and Joe Flacco.

"Bortles has good size, arm strength and accuracy, and has proved he can win from inside the pocket," McShay writes. "He also possesses good character and a strong football IQ." We like Bortles, but a large number of his throws come on first reads and UCF's offense seems to be heavily reliant on yards after the catch. He does flash pocket movement, however.


Source: ESPN

NFL.com's Daniel Jeremiah spoke with two GMs who believe Fresno State senior QB Derek Carr has the most to prove from now until May's draft.

"With all of these other quarterbacks staying in school, Carr could sky rocket with an impressive Senior Bowl. He'll interview very well at the combine," One general manager said. "He has a chance to go really high with a good postseason. If he has a good Senior Bowl, where he looks good in a pro offense, and then interviews well, that will really up his stock," another added. We would be shocked if Carr does not shine in Mobile, especially in passing drills that do not feature a pass rush. We still want to see how he handles interior pressure, but that could be said with every quarterback prospect.


Source: NFL.com

 

[JFS171]

I tend to think some of these QBs will have their stock fall a bit now that the nit-picking process is about to begin, but you're certainly right that there might be a perfect storm of sorts brewing.


If it plays out that way, I think the Rams could do very well by trading back from their #2 pick.

Surely teams learned not to reach for a QB after watching the Gabbert/Locker/Ponder mess play out... right? Just because you need a QB and there's one available doesn't mean that guy is worth the pick.

Plus McShay is a complete hack... ESPN has him to put on TV and regurgitate what he's been told. Period.

Coaching staffs and front offices have a lot of pressure to win. If there's a known problem, they'll can usually count on one chance to fix it. If they mess that up, well, the NFL isn't really known for job security.

Drafting a highly rated QB typically buys a few years, because nobody really expects a rookie QB to step in and perform at a finished product level. If they bypass that option for a journey-man vet and development QB project, then all bets are usually off.

How's that worked out for the Jets and Geno Smith? Looks like Rex is on his way out, and that's a rookie QB that was highly rated in the pre-draft process... then he slid.

 

[EastonBlues22]

I tend to think some of these QBs will have their stock fall a bit now that the nit-picking process is about to begin, but you're certainly right that there might be a perfect storm of sorts brewing.


If it plays out that way, I think the Rams could do very well by trading back from their #2 pick.

Surely teams learned not to reach for a QB after watching the Gabbert/Locker/Ponder mess play out... right? Just because you need a QB and there's one available doesn't mean that guy is worth the pick.

Plus McShay is a complete hack... ESPN has him to put on TV and regurgitate what he's been told. Period.

Coaching staffs and front offices have a lot of pressure to win. If there's a known problem, they'll can usually count on one chance to fix it. If they mess that up, well, the NFL isn't really known for job security.

Drafting a highly rated QB typically buys a few years, because nobody really expects a rookie QB to step in and perform at a finished product level. If they bypass that option for a journey-man vet and development QB project, then all bets are usually off.

How's that worked out for the Jets and Geno Smith? Looks like Rex is on his way out, and that's a rookie QB that was highly rated in the pre-draft process... then he slid.

I'm not quite sure what your point is.

Smith will get another year or two to prove himself. Ryan might be there to see if he can do it, and if he isn't then he's certainly earned his ticket out of town.

 

[Bob Magaw]

I tend to think some of these QBs will have their stock fall a bit now that the nit-picking process is about to begin, but you're certainly right that there might be a perfect storm of sorts brewing.

If it plays out that way, I think the Rams could do very well by trading back from their #2 pick.

Surely teams learned not to reach for a QB after watching the Gabbert/Locker/Ponder mess play out... right? Just because you need a QB and there's one available doesn't mean that guy is worth the pick.

Plus McShay is a complete hack... ESPN has him to put on TV and regurgitate what he's been told. Period.

each class is different. just because gabbert failed, doesn't necessarily mean bortles or carr will. we will know more about how their grades are shaping up as we get through the combine and approach the draft. in the case of ponder, he was generally thought, AT THE TIME, to be a second round talent, this was noted then. hypothetically, if manziel emerges with a top 10-15 grade, and he is picked by MIN, that won't be an instance of a comparable reach or analogous situation. i was just listening to daniel jeremiah today talk about how bridgewater was superior to any prospect in the 2013 class. hundley is another prospect we didn't discuss earlier, that would enhance the stature of the class. you can look at a few minutes of tape of ponder and a few of hundley and see the latter is a vastly more athletically gifted and talented prospect. adding to the suspense, mariota, despite saying he won't be declaring, has asked for a grade from the advisory committee. maybe he really is returning to school as is generally expected, but if so, why ask for a grade? so perhaps if they come back with a top 3 grade, he could still change his mind?

 

[FUBAR]

Grimble, Lynch, Fiedorowicz are nothing special, I wouldn't bother ranking them.

When you play in 32 team IDP leagues with a possibility to start 2 TEs you dig deep into the pool. I've got more TEs ranked than that but stopped there for the reason you stated. I acknowledge some guys aren't yet ranked because I've not figured out where I'd place them. This will change about a dozen more times.

Personally, I like it when knowledgeable posters post deep players. I'd probably prefer seeing a more defined tier system with deep fliers, but just listing the names helps a lot right now. Keep up the good work.

 

[Faust]

Big Board: Underclassmen could make it another banner year for OTs


by Rob Rang | NFLDraftScout.com Senior Analyst

Dec. 19, 2013 6:23 PM ET

Three of the first four picks in the 2013 NFL Draft were spent on offensive linemen, but this year's crop could be even better should a number of highly regarded underclassmen elect to leave school early.

Texas A&M senior left tackle Jake Matthews is the safest of the bunch and checks in at No. 5 overall on the Big Board. Matthews' teammate, junior right tackle Cedric Ogbuehi, is one of several underclassmen with an even more exciting skill-set.

The Big Board isn't a mock draft. There is no attention given to team needs or the projected selection order. It is simply a ranking of the 32 best prospects potentially eligible for the 2014 NFL Draft.

1. Jadeveon Clowney*, DE, South Carolina (6-6, 268): There is no denying that by registering just three sacks (and zero forced fumbles) in 2013, Clowney has failed to live up to expectations. He also inflamed concerns about his maturity with a Dec. 7 speeding ticket when he was clocked at 110 mph. Clowney's red flags are real, but so is his talent. In my 13 years of grading prospects for the NFL Draft, Clowney competes only with former No. 2 overall pick Julius Peppers (2002) as the most gifted defensive end I've ever seen.

2. Teddy Bridgewater*, QB, Louisville (6-3, 220): In an era in which college quarterbacks' numbers are often inflated by short passes and relatively simplistic schemes, Bridgewater's sparkling production is due to Pro Bowl-caliber accuracy. His success (70.2 completion percentage with 28 touchdowns against just four interceptions) comes out of a pro-style offense that forces him to make tough throws. Bridgewater's slight frame and level of competition are concerns. Bridgewater's poise will be tested in the Florida Citrus Bowl on Dec. 28 against his hometown Miami Hurricanes in the game most believe will be his last at the collegiate level.

3. Anthony Barr, OLB, UCLA (6-4, 238): A running back until last season, Barr has emerged as one of the elite prospects in the country and is my top-rated senior at any position. A powerful and fluid athlete at his best rushing off the edge, Barr was named the 2013 recipient of the LOTT Impact Award with 62 tackles, 20 tackles for loss, 10 sacks and five forced fumbles over the regular season.

4. Derek Carr, QB, Fresno State (6-3, 215): Carr's staggering production (70.1 completion percentage, 48 TDs, seven INTs) is certainly inflated by head coach Tim DeRuyter's QB-friendly spread attack and legitimately talented receiving corps, but there is no denying his talent. His release and velocity are as impressive as any college quarterback in the country. Back in 2002, older brother David sealed up the No. 1 overall pick with a dominant performance at the Senior Bowl. It isn't out of the question that Derek could match the feat 12 years later.

5. Jake Matthews, OT, Texas A&M (6-5, 305): The son of Hall of Fame lineman Bruce Matthews, Jake proves the cliché -- the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. He has played well at left tackle this season after starring at right tackle over his first three years. Matthews is a terrific football player, demonstrating impressive technique, strength and consistency. He is not, however, an elite athlete and some view his future back on the right side in the NFL.

6. Sammy Watkins*, WR, Clemson (6-1, 200): With 85 catches for 1,235 yards and 10 touchdowns in 2013, Watkins erased any memories of his disappointing sophomore campaign. He is an explosive athlete with impressive body control and natural hands to pluck the ball. Unlike some of his teammates, Watkins played well against Clemson's top opponents this season, including Florida State and South Carolina. Watkins' showdown against Ohio State's Bradley Roby in the Orange Bowl on Jan. 3 may be the most tantalizing one-on-one matchup of the bowl season.

7. Darqueze Dennard, CB, Michigan State (5-11, 197): Quick feet, loose hips and a fluid turning motion make Dennard a classic cover corner capable of shutting down half the field. Dennard has allowed only three completions in 31 passes of 15-plus yards against him this season. His ability in coverage played a huge role in the Spartans' run to the Big Ten championship and it was recognized with Dennard winning the Thorpe Award as the nation's top defensive back.

8. Cyrus Kouandjio*, OT, Alabama (6-5, 312): Nick Saban questioned draft analysts for pegging Kouandjio as a first-round talent before the season, but given the junior left tackle's skills the projection is an easy one. Long-armed, athletic and aggressive, Kouandjio boasts many of the traits scouts are looking for in a potential Pro Bowl left tackle.

9. Cameron Erving*, OT, Florida State (6-5, 310): Erving played 13 games as a redshirt freshman defensive tackle but looked like a natural when moved to left tackle a season ago, though he remains a bit inconsistent. Long, balanced and athletic, he's a hidden factor in the dynamic play of freshman QB Jameis Winston and could enjoy a "quiet" ride into the top 10 of the 2014 draft just as former Texas A&M left tackle Luke Joeckel did a year ago while blocking for Heisman winner Johnny Manziel.

10. C.J. Mosley, OLB, Alabama (6-2, 232): While a bit undersized, Mosley might be the best pound-for-pound player in the country. Athletic and instinctive, he is a true three-down linebacker capable of making plays against the run and pass. Mosley lacks the bulk scouts want in a pass rusher but his awareness in coverage is special. While the tape is phenomenal, Mosley has undergone multiple surgeries (knee, shoulder) over his career and could be the latest Alabama player to receive medical red flags from some evaluators.

11. Khalil Mack, OLB, Buffalo (6-3, 248): With a record-tying 75 career tackles for loss, Mack's statistics jump off the page. Against the most gifted opponents he faced this year (Ohio State, Connecticut), it was his game that jumped off the screen. His size, instincts and agility as an edge rusher make him equally intriguing to teams operating out of a 4-3 or 3-4 alignment.

12. Cedric Ogbuehi*, OT, Texas A&M (6-5, 300): Overshadowed by all of the talent on the Aggies' roster, Ogbuehi is an exciting prospect in his own right. A standout at right guard a year ago, Ogbuehi (pronounced ah-BOO-hee) took over for Jake Matthews at right tackle and has excelled. With long arms and light feet, Ogbuehi offers more upside than his more celebrated teammate, though he is not yet as polished.

13. Mike Evans*, WR, Texas A&M (6-5, 225): Like his famous quarterback, Evans is just a redshirt sophomore but he has a big decision to make after dominating the SEC most of this season. Deceptively fast with great body control as well as timing, Evans is an exciting split end prospect who reminds scouts of Tampa Bay Buccaneers star Vincent Jackson. Of concern, however, is the fact that Evans struggled in his final two regular-season games, catching just eight passes for a combined 59 yards in losses to LSU and Missouri.

14. Eric Ebron*, TE, North Carolina (6-4, 245): Ebron has a jaw-dropping combination of size and athleticism that has earned comparisons to 49ers star Vernon Davis. Like Davis, however, Ebron struggles with consistency, relying too much on his athleticism rather than dedicating himself to learning the finer techniques of the position. Ebron will forgo his senior season and enter the 2014 draft.

15. Ifo Ekpre-Olomu*, CB, Oregon (5-10, 190): Lost in the hype of Oregon's offense are a number of highly regarded defenders, including Ekpre-Olomu, who combines great instincts, agility and physicality to shut down his side of the field. Ekpre-Olomu's toughness on the perimeter played a significant role in Oregon's win over Oregon State in the Civil War, as he posted 12 tackles (all solos), deflected three passes and intercepted another while helping to limit Beavers star WR Brandin Cooks.

16. Taylor Lewan, OT, Michigan (6-7, 310): With an impressive combination of size, strength and toughness, Lewan has earned comparisons to former Michigan standout Jake Long throughout his career with the Wolverines. He certainly looked the part against Ohio State, dominating the action up front.

17. Stephon Tuitt*, DL, Notre Dame (6-5, 303): Offseason sports hernia surgery may have played a role in Tuitt weighing 20 pounds more this season than a year ago, and early on the extra weight seemed to be slowing him. He played much better over the second half of the season, however, and his athleticism and frame project well to either scheme in the NFL.

18. Trent Murphy, DE, Stanford (6-6, 261): Used as a standup outside linebacker as a well as a down lineman for the Cardinal, Murphy is equally impactful in the passing game, running game and on special teams due to his instincts, physicality and awareness. His play and production (58 tackles, 21½ tackles for loss, 14 sacks) should have earned him the Pac-12 Defensive Player of the Year award that went to Arizona defensive lineman Will Sutton. Though he has starred in Stanford's 3-4 scheme, Murphy projects best as a 4-3 defensive end in the NFL.

19. Jace Amaro*, TE, Texas Tech (6-5, 260): The NFL is looking for seam threats rather than extra blockers at tight end in today's game. There hasn't been a more impressive prospect in the country in 2013 in this role than Amaro, who finished the regular season with 98 catches for 1,240 yards and seven touchdowns. Scouts are beginning to mention the name Jimmy Graham when discussing the Red Raiders' junior. After dropping a few passes against Texas in his regular-season finale Nov. 30, Amaro will be tested against an aggressive Arizona State defense in the Holiday Bowl on Dec. 30.

20. Greg Robinson*, OT, Auburn (6-5, 320): Redshirt offensive linemen rarely earn more than a whisper in scouting circles, but the buzz around the Tigers' star left tackle is venturing into deafening. Physical and tenacious, Robinson is a grizzly bear in the running game, mauling opponents with an exciting blend of size, strength and athleticism. Auburn's reliance on the running game, however, has given Robinson few opportunities in pass protection, making him a bit of a boom-or-bust prospect at this early point.

21. Marqise Lee*, WR, Southern Cal (6-0, 195): A nagging left knee injury has hampered Lee for much of the season, robbing the reigning Biletnikoff Award winner of his trademark elusiveness and acceleration. Finally healthy, he starred against Stanford on Nov. 16, helping guide the Trojans to the upset win and seeming to solidify his stock -- only to register a relatively nondescript six grabs for 69 yards in the Nov. 30 loss to UCLA.

22. Cyril Richardson, G, Baylor (6-5, 335): A dominating drive blocker who projects best at guard but spent the entire 2011 season protecting Robert Griffin III at left tackle, Richardson is massive, powerful and shockingly athletic. Richardson was recognized with the Jim Parker Award as the nation's top blocker and headlines a strong class of interior linemen.

23. Travis Swanson, C, Arkansas (6-4, 318): If Richardson is the elite interior lineman of the 2014 senior class, Swanson ranks a close second. Athletic, powerful and versatile (some view him as a potential guard convert), Swanson will continue former Wisconsin head coach Bret Bielema's tradition of churning out quality NFL prospects along the offensive line.

24. Ryan Shazier*, OLB, Ohio State (6-2, 226): Shazier might be 10-15 pounds lighter than scouts would prefer but his instincts, speed and bone-jarring hits make him a fearful defender offenses must account for on every snap. No one played better for the Buckeyes against Michigan State in the Big Ten Championship Game than Shazier, who recorded 12 tackles, two pass breakups and a blocked punt against the Spartans.

25. Johnny Manziel*, QB, Texas A&M (5-11, 210): Manziel's vision, elusiveness and accuracy on the move make him a mesmerizing prospect, but red flags were raised with mediocre performances at LSU and Missouri to end the regular season. Bottled in the pocket by both, Manziel was unable to throw his receivers open and he struggled. NFL rules have never been more accommodating to dual-threat passers, but consistent accuracy from the pocket remains the most critical element to quarterback play at the next level.

26. Justin Gilbert, CB, Oklahoma State (6-0, 200): In terms of size, agility and speed, no cornerback offers a more intriguing skill set than the Cowboys' star. Gilbert, a Thorpe Award finalist, led the Big 12 with six interceptions this season and has returned just as many kickoffs for touchdowns during his time in Stillwater.

27. Blake Bortles*, QB, Central Florida (6-3, 230): A prototypically built pocket passer with good awareness and anticipation, Bortles looks the part of an NFL starting quarterback. Should he star in UCF's Fiesta Bowl showdown with explosive Baylor, the junior might have a tough time ignoring the NFL buzz his play is building.

28. Brandin Cooks*, WR, Oregon State (5-10, 186): Beavers coach Mike Riley has made a career out of finding undersized pass-catchers to star in his offense, but Cooks is a different level of athlete than Sammie Stroughter, Markus Wheaton and the Rodgers brothers (James and Jacquizz). Boasting a combination of elusiveness, acceleration and toughness that is earning comparisons to Percy Harvin, the Biletnikoff Award finalist is rewriting school and conference record books with 120 catches for 1,670 yards and 15 touchdowns in the regular season.

29. Ra'Shede Hageman, DT, Minnesota (6-6, 311): Blessed with an extraordinary combination of size and athleticism, Hageman could join Michael Brockers and Dontari Poe as recent big defensive tackles whose real rise up draft boards doesn't begin until the scouting combine. Hageman has looked unblockable at times, but he struggles with consistency.

30. Jason Verrett, CB, TCU (5-10, 182): Verrett lacks the size so en vogue in today's NFL, but agility and ball skills never go out of style for cornerbacks. Verrett led the Big 12 with 22 passes defended and six interceptions in 2012. Through the end of the 2013 regular season he led again in pass deflections (16) while recording two pass thefts. While light, Verrett is scrappy and tenacious, making him an ideal nickel corner with the tackling ability to threaten on an occasional blitz.

31. Kony Ealy*, DE, Missouri (6-5, 275): While teammate Michael Sam garnered more hype, scouts are increasingly intrigued by Ealy due to his impressive combination of size and athleticism. A highly versatile defender with experience inside and out for the Tigers, Ealy projects nicely to both the 4-3 and 3-4 alignments. The first-team All-SEC pick is just scratching the surface of his potential.

32. David Yankey*, G, Stanford (6-5, 314): Another impressive performance against two-time Pac-12 Defensive Player of the Year Will Sutton has Yankey's stock rising. Athletic and powerful, Yankey is earning similar grades from some clubs as former teammate David DeCastro, the No. 24 overall selection of the 2012 draft by the Pittsburgh Steelers.

Just missed the cutAustin Seferian-Jenkins, TE, Washington*
Will Sutton, DT, Arizona State
Vic Beasley, OLB, Clemson*
Bradley Roby, CB, Ohio State*
Ka'Deem Carey, RB, Arizona*
Shayne Skov, ILB, Stanford
Jordan Matthews, WR, Vanderbilt
Yawin Smallwood, ILB, Connecticut*
Allen Robinson, WR, Penn State*
La'el Collins, OT, LSU*
Xavier Su'a-Filo, G, UCLA*
Trevor Reilly, DE/OLB, Utah
Aaron Donald, DT, Pittsburgh
Ego Ferguson, DT, LSU*
Kyle Van Noy, OLB, BYU

 

[Faust]

TSV's Big Board

 

[Faust]

WalterFootball.com: 2014 NFL Draft Prospect Rankings

 

[Faust]

Ranking all 70 bowl teams based on their NFL draft prospects

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

ESPN NFL Draft analyst Todd McShay said Thursday that he has higher grades on Teddy Bridgewater, Blake Bortles, Johnny Manziel and Derek Carr than he did on Geno Smith one year ago.
"It's kind of been an interesting ride with these quarterbacks," McShay said on a conference call. "I thought it was going to be a little bit stronger at the top. I thought Marcus Mariota was headed towards becoming an elite quarterback and thought he was going to wind up coming out." McShay is pleased Mariota decided to return to school and hopes Ohio State's Braxton Miller and UCLA's Brett Hundley will follow suit. Lastly, McShay tabbed Eastern Illinois' Jimmy Garoppolo the sleeper of the class. "I think he has a chance to, one day down the road, develop into a starter," McShay said.

Source: SB Nation

 

[Faust]

Scouting the Las Vegas Bowl: Fresno State vs. USC Scouting the New Mexico Bowl: Washington St vs. Colorado St

 

[lyon812]

Melvin Gordon announces he's returning to school for his junior year.

http://host.madison.com/sports/college/football/badgers-football-tailback-melvin-gordon-announces-he-will-return-for/article_cdf3a954-89eb-54bc-b880-7fccddfd9206.html

 

[Andrew74]

So can anyone challenge Lache for the top RB spot?

 

[jurb26]

So can anyone challenge Lache for the top RB spot?

I think Sankey can and is being somewhat undervalued right now. I could see some NFL teams having him ahead of Seastruck. I'm curious to see his workout numbers. I know I'm in the minority with that view though.

 

[ZWK]

Matt Hinton as Football Outsiders just published a data set with advanced rushing and receiving stats for this past college season (similar to the data that Bill Connelly shared last year). One interesting nugget - here are the top 10 receivers in yards per target (min. 50 targets):

15.8 Tevin Reese Baylor
14.2 Mike Evans Texas A&M
13.2 Breshad Perriman Central Florida
13.1 Odell Beckham Jr. LSU
13.1 Martavis Bryant Clemson
13.1 Kenny Shaw Florida State
12.9 Antwan Goodley Baylor
12.6 Jonathan Krause Vanderbilt
12.5 Josh Huff Oregon
12.2 Levi Norwood Baylor

I'll be updating my WR & RB prospect ratings soon to take stats like this one into account.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

"High" 2nd round = early 2nd, or late 2nd?

DTFGate?

 

[Paulymaggs]

What I'm hearing around the league of late,

- David Fales is skyrocketing up several draft boards. At least three teams have him at a high 2nd round grade. There's some evidence working both ways, for and against him, looking at film of him myself, I'd label him as a prospect that needs to be coached up.

- Mettenberger, Hundley and Boyd are all falling around the league. Hundley IMHO is a Grady Fuson Special ( "What are we doing here? Selling jeans?") Mettenberger might go off the board to a team that decides to pick up Cam Cameron onto their coaching staff. My impression of Boyd is not his height issue, as many will cite, but looking at the tape, I think he has some mechanical issues while throwing on the move that trouble me.

- Don't be surprised to see a decent market for Mark Sanchez as a backup, this will impact the draft in terms of who might go off the board as a rookie backup. For whatever his failings with the Jets, he has a lot of starting experience, playoff experience and pressure cooker experience. He's also highly marketable across a lot of demographics.

- Rumors are there's a split in the Giants front office. One faction is very high on Sammy Watkins. The other faction wants to consider reinvestment in the O line and possibly QBOTF.

- Scuttlebutt is Big Ben is very quietly on the block. If one of two QB1 prospects fall to the projected Steelers pick, word I'm hearing they will grab him and there's a possible trade in place ( with a team with a ready now defense and a lot of other assets in place for an immediate run, think of the 49ers situation pre Kapernick) for late first rounder this year/other assets for Big Ben. Word I'm hearing is there are some issues with DTFGate that might be irreconcilable.

- Lots of big boards around the league have Manziel pushing out as high as 2nd overall, with a good chance he becomes a swing pick at 3rd, if the Falcons slot there, they will try to trade the pick. I'm hearing at least 5 teams have Manziel rated above Bridgewater and are happy he struggled late this college season to possibly drop to them.

- Jace Amaro is all over the place all across boards around the league. Again, good chance he ends up a swing pick shifting the draft in one direction or another after he gets selected.

- The Browns are rumored to not go QB1 with their first pick. Word out is that the front office thinks the QB1 class is deep enough to get a good QBOTF prospect in a later round.

- I'm hearing internal security reviews by franchises to hard vet Clowney is not going well. Really not going well. More than a few franchises seemed spooked this kid might end up being Karl Malone physically but Greg Ostertag mentally.

- Word out is a QB1 needy team with a high pick is looking heavily at someone in Seattle's front office for their GM position, if so, expect to see Darren Bevell's coaching star rise a little ( just a little) as well as Ken Norton Jr on the defensive side, but that might trigger a surprise reach for QB1 in the draft.

- Things don't look good for Jason Garrett. But he's quietly a very hot commodity as an O coordinator this offseason when he's clipped. IMHO, a lot of things not made public were out of his control, but generallly around the league, he's well liked, well regarded and would not stay unemployed very long.

Gonna take all of this with a big grain of salt, but hey, at least it's interesting to read.

 

[Milkman]

Melvin Gordon announces he's returning to school for his junior year.

http://host.madison.com/sports/college/football/badgers-football-tailback-melvin-gordon-announces-he-will-return-for/article_cdf3a954-89eb-54bc-b880-7fccddfd9206.html

That's a pretty lol decision. It's in his best interest to come out this year.

 

[Milkman]

So can anyone challenge Lache for the top RB spot?

I think Sankey can and is being somewhat undervalued right now. I could see some NFL teams having him ahead of Seastruck. I'm curious to see his workout numbers. I know I'm in the minority with that view though.

It's seems NFL scouts don't like something about Seastrunk. Not sure what that is. He looks like an excellent prospect to me. Vision maybe?I like Sankey as well though. Probably more then most here. If he is the #1 RB taken I would have no issue taking him #1 overall. I like his compact running style and some of the runs he makes in between the tackles look kind of sexy. He doesn't need a lot of room to make a big play. Combine going to be huge for him.

 

[EBF]

Melvin Gordon announces he's returning to school for his junior year.

http://host.madison.com/sports/college/football/badgers-football-tailback-melvin-gordon-announces-he-will-return-for/article_cdf3a954-89eb-54bc-b880-7fccddfd9206.html

I don't know how big of a loss it is really. There are things I like about him, but part of me thinks that he might have been pretty overrated anyway. He's kind of a lean, long-legged runner and a lot of his big plays came on sweeps and straight sprints where he didn't have to do much besides run fast. I don't know if he can run with power or consistently make people miss.

 

[EBF]

So can anyone challenge Lache for the top RB spot?

I think Sankey can and is being somewhat undervalued right now. I could see some NFL teams having him ahead of Seastruck. I'm curious to see his workout numbers. I know I'm in the minority with that view though.

It's seems NFL scouts don't like something about Seastrunk. Not sure what that is. He looks like an excellent prospect to me. Vision maybe?I like Sankey as well though. Probably more then most here. If he is the #1 RB taken I would have no issue taking him #1 overall. I like his compact running style and some of the runs he makes in between the tackles look kind of sexy. He doesn't need a lot of room to make a big play. Combine going to be huge for him.

Yea, it is a little surprising that Seastrunk doesn't get more love in mocks. Could be due to a variety of factors. Even though he's pretty built, he doesn't run with a lot of power or break a lot of tackles. Sometimes he seems to dance too much and lose his momentum/balance. On his good days though, such as his monster game against West Virginia, he looks every bit the part of a first round back. Very solid athlete. Compact, but also explosive, fast, and pretty efficient. If he catches the ball okay in workouts and tests well, I would not be surprised to see him go late 1st regardless of whatever the mocks say today. There are always some surprises.

He sort of limped to the finish line this CFB season after a torrid start and he's had some issues with minor injuries, so maybe that's a factor in why he's not getting much buzz right now.

 

[MAC_32]

Looking forward to Carr and Adams vs USC today

 

[menobrown]

So can anyone challenge Lache for the top RB spot?

I think Sankey can and is being somewhat undervalued right now. I could see some NFL teams having him ahead of Seastruck. I'm curious to see his workout numbers. I know I'm in the minority with that view though.

I think I feel the same about Carey as you do about Sankey. I feel like he's underrated but I'm also curious to see his workout numbers.

Right now my top two rated RB's are Carey and Charles Sims and I think both are in the mix for top RB selected.

 

[lod01]

RB Brandon Oliver at 5:30 ESPN - Potato Bowl.

 

[lod01]

What I'm hearing around the league of late,

- David Fales is skyrocketing up several draft boards. At least three teams have him at a high 2nd round grade. There's some evidence working both ways, for and against him, looking at film of him myself, I'd label him as a prospect that needs to be coached up.

- Mettenberger, Hundley and Boyd are all falling around the league. Hundley IMHO is a Grady Fuson Special ( "What are we doing here? Selling jeans?") Mettenberger might go off the board to a team that decides to pick up Cam Cameron onto their coaching staff. My impression of Boyd is not his height issue, as many will cite, but looking at the tape, I think he has some mechanical issues while throwing on the move that trouble me.

- Don't be surprised to see a decent market for Mark Sanchez as a backup, this will impact the draft in terms of who might go off the board as a rookie backup. For whatever his failings with the Jets, he has a lot of starting experience, playoff experience and pressure cooker experience. He's also highly marketable across a lot of demographics.

- Rumors are there's a split in the Giants front office. One faction is very high on Sammy Watkins. The other faction wants to consider reinvestment in the O line and possibly QBOTF.

- Scuttlebutt is Big Ben is very quietly on the block. If one of two QB1 prospects fall to the projected Steelers pick, word I'm hearing they will grab him and there's a possible trade in place ( with a team with a ready now defense and a lot of other assets in place for an immediate run, think of the 49ers situation pre Kapernick) for late first rounder this year/other assets for Big Ben. Word I'm hearing is there are some issues with DTFGate that might be irreconcilable.

- Lots of big boards around the league have Manziel pushing out as high as 2nd overall, with a good chance he becomes a swing pick at 3rd, if the Falcons slot there, they will try to trade the pick. I'm hearing at least 5 teams have Manziel rated above Bridgewater and are happy he struggled late this college season to possibly drop to them.

- Jace Amaro is all over the place all across boards around the league. Again, good chance he ends up a swing pick shifting the draft in one direction or another after he gets selected.

- The Browns are rumored to not go QB1 with their first pick. Word out is that the front office thinks the QB1 class is deep enough to get a good QBOTF prospect in a later round.

- I'm hearing internal security reviews by franchises to hard vet Clowney is not going well. Really not going well. More than a few franchises seemed spooked this kid might end up being Karl Malone physically but Greg Ostertag mentally.

- Word out is a QB1 needy team with a high pick is looking heavily at someone in Seattle's front office for their GM position, if so, expect to see Darren Bevell's coaching star rise a little ( just a little) as well as Ken Norton Jr on the defensive side, but that might trigger a surprise reach for QB1 in the draft.

- Things don't look good for Jason Garrett. But he's quietly a very hot commodity as an O coordinator this offseason when he's clipped. IMHO, a lot of things not made public were out of his control, but generallly around the league, he's well liked, well regarded and would not stay unemployed very long.

Gonna take all of this with a big grain of salt, but hey, at least it's interesting to read.

Fales - Not a strong arm but highly accurate and good footwork. If he had an elite arm, he would challenge for the #1 pick.

Hundley needs to stay in school or he will bust big time.

Boyd is nothing.

Mettenburger seems to get hurt a lot lately.

 

[krsone21]

So can anyone challenge Lache for the top RB spot?

I think Sankey can and is being somewhat undervalued right now. I could see some NFL teams having him ahead of Seastruck. I'm curious to see his workout numbers. I know I'm in the minority with that view though.

I think I feel the same about Carey as you do about Sankey. I feel like he's underrated but I'm also curious to see his workout numbers.

Right now my top two rated RB's are Carey and Charles Sims and I think both are in the mix for top RB selected.

I'm high on Charles Sims as well. I'm interested to see what team he lands on.

 

[BigTex]

Ebron and Amaro are kind of 1a and 1b to me. I think both are going to be great fantasy contributors.

I agree. I'd take Amaro over Ebron if I had the option but I'd also take into account what team drafts them.