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[Dynasty] 2014 Draft Prospects (1 Viewer)

Ohio State senior RB Carlos Hyde ranks as the No. 19 overall player on Mel Kiper's big board.

This is easily the highest we have seen Hyde ranked, so props to Kiper for going out on a limb. "Hyde has a great combination of elite size for the position plus quick feet and an ability to accelerate quickly through the hole," Kiper writes. "He's devastating on the second level because he has a downhill style that makes him a punishing runner who can run through and bounce off contact." Hyde has received compliments on his pass protection, but we believe it could still use some improvement. Our own Josh Norris has compared Hyde to Zac Stacy and Frank Gore.


Source: ESPN
Same time of the year that Lacy started showing up in the first round of mock drafts. Wouldn't be surprised to see the rest of the draft community follow Kiper.
Lacy didn't go in the first and I don't think Hyde will either. Hyde is not a bad player. Good feet and hips for a big back. Efficient runner. I think he can be a serviceable starter. Therein lies the problem though. NFL teams don't usually spend first round picks on backs unless they offer something special. And there are several guys in this class who offer a decent approximation of what Hyde brings (Hill and Freeman can both run with power inside and Freeman is also a good receiver). If I were an NFL GM I wouldn't spend a top 35 pick on any of those guys. I would sit back in the 2nd-3rd round and grab one for a more reasonable price.

Unless he surprises me at the combine, I would say Hyde is basically Doug Martin without the open field ability or explosiveness. Just a grinder. There's nothing wrong with that and I think he can be productive if fed 20 carries per game, but guys like Shonn Greene, Stevan Ridley, Eddie Lacy, and LeVeon Bell don't go in the first round of the NFL draft. Teams will be looking for someone with a little more sizzle that high. In this class I think Seastrunk and Gordon are probably the only two who might be able to sneak in. I'd say Andre Williams looks like sort of a boom-or-bust prospect, but I also think he offers something a little more unique than what you'd get in Hill/Freeman/Hyde, so maybe some team will fall in love and overdraft him.

 
Don't and can't are two different things. Neither player is used much that way in college, but it doesn't mean they can't do it in the NFL. It may be a scheme/usage thing. Without going back and looking at a bunch of stats, I suspect you'd find that a lot of the NFL's better receiving RBs didn't have a huge number of receptions in college.

 
The problem with Seastrunk and Gordon is they don't catch the ball so their ceiling is Alfred Morris.
WOW!!!!! I don't know if you are just fishing are serious but either way................. :doh:
Maybe I'm being dumb idk. I would love to hear what you have to say. I own two top 5 picks and both of these guys could end up on my team. I think maybe what you're saying is "what's wrong with that?" Not sure.

 
The problem with having an elite rb that doesn't catch the ball is it tends to make them less consistent. When their team gets down double digits they get pulled for the third down back.

 
Baylor never throws to its RBs, which makes Seastrunk's lack of receptions understandable. I'll have to get the scoop on him as a receiver from scouts, tape-watchers, and reports on his receiving drills at the combine/pro-day. Or, if someone makes a YouTube video of all of his targets in the passing game I would watch that - it would be pretty quick.

Gordon doesn't have that excuse - James White caught 37 passes this year.

Ohio State is in between, and Hyde has just enough receptions to make his low YPR concerning.

 
The problem with Seastrunk and Gordon is they don't catch the ball so their ceiling is Alfred Morris.
WOW!!!!! I don't know if you are just fishing are serious but either way................. :doh:
Maybe I'm being dumb idk. I would love to hear what you have to say. I own two top 5 picks and both of these guys could end up on my team. I think maybe what you're saying is "what's wrong with that?" Not sure.
There's no question in my mind that Sea is and will be the best in this class. I know for several reasons but they are irrelevant as for as trying to explain too much on this board. I may have taken your "don't" as a "can't" catch because you compared them to Morris. You ARE sadly mistaking. Baylor just doesn't throw the ball to their backs, they have some of the best talent in key positions that I've seen in many years. You may not see it now but in the next few years they will get more respect. Even as good as Sea is there are a few freshman there that are going to be sure fire studs when their chance arrive but let me get back on topic lol. Sea is much, much better than his stats show. He got injured in that OK game and didn't play in the OK St or TT game.

Watch this game on 1/1/12 and if he is showcased like I'm believing in this game then you'll see the real Sea but understand too that as good as his numbers were this past season he did it with very few carries. He's going to blow the combine out of the water. If he had gotten the same amount of carries as Carey, Sankey, or even Hyde he would be spoken as by far the best back in this draft.

So why would Baylor throw to their backs when they have so much talent (and trust me they do) at the WR position and this team is deep. They just don't, so don't discount a player because their team is so talented that they use their WR to catch the ball and their running backs to run the ball.

I don't know about Gordon. I've watch maybe 6 or 7 games and he doe's look good, just don't know if calling either of them Morris because I was never impressed with Morris.

Tex

 
Baylor never throws to its RBs, which makes Seastrunk's lack of receptions understandable. I'll have to get the scoop on him as a receiver from scouts, tape-watchers, and reports on his receiving drills at the combine/pro-day. Or, if someone makes a YouTube video of all of his targets in the passing game I would watch that - it would be pretty quick.

Gordon doesn't have that excuse - James White caught 37 passes this year.

Ohio State is in between, and Hyde has just enough receptions to make his low YPR concerning.
LOL, was typing my response (and watching Kill Bill Vol. 2 which is still epic) so I didn't see your response but I have every Baylor game the last three years.....trust me (not really sure why I still have some) but anyway. Your response to Sea is dead on........Baylor has no reason what so ever to throw to their backs because their WR core is so damn fast that the QB has no need to check down or even think about throwing it to the backs because their WR get open so freaking fast it's just unreal.

I thought really, really hard about putting out more Youtube videos but over the last few years I've just been waaaay too busy otherwise I would.

Tex

 
Don't and can't are two different things. Neither player is used much that way in college, but it doesn't mean they can't do it in the NFL. It may be a scheme/usage thing. Without going back and looking at a bunch of stats, I suspect you'd find that a lot of the NFL's better receiving RBs didn't have a huge number of receptions in college.
It was probably in the other Dynasty Prospect thread, but I posted the fact that of the top 20 RBs in receiving yards right now, only 2 of them didn't have a 25+ reception season in college, one was Jamaal Charles and the other was Andre Ellington. Could just be a coincidence that both are skinny speed/jukey guys, and for whatever it's worth, Charles had 3 straight 14+ reception seasons at 10+ yards per reception.

I pretty well agree with ZWK's analysis of these guys' pass catching likelihood in the NFL. Despite Baylor not passing to RBs generally, there's some highlights from last season where Seastrunk looks pretty comfortable catching the ball, plus he fits the speed/jukey mold of the other NFL RBs who have had success receiving in the NFL but not in college in Charles and Ellington.

Melvin Gordon's 3 career receptions on a team that's willing to throw to their RBs suggests to me that the chance of Gordon ever developing into a good receiving back in the NFL are pretty slim.

As for Hyde, I'd say he has what it takes to be a mediocre pass catching back, his ability to block and it's impact on keeping him on the field on 3rd downs will likely allow him to get in the ~40 reception range in the NFL if he's on a team that's willing to give him a full load, though I wouldn't count on him being a very special receiver.

 
The problem with having an elite rb that doesn't catch the ball is it tends to make them less consistent. When their team gets down double digits they get pulled for the third down back.
Yep. It can be a FF killer. However even guys that can catch the ball can end up on teams that don't throw to the RB. SF is the #1 example. They no longer use Gore to his abilities.

 
The problem with Seastrunk and Gordon is they don't catch the ball so their ceiling is Alfred Morris.
WOW!!!!! I don't know if you are just fishing are serious but either way................. :doh:
Maybe I'm being dumb idk. I would love to hear what you have to say. I own two top 5 picks and both of these guys could end up on my team. I think maybe what you're saying is "what's wrong with that?" Not sure.
That's what the combine is for. Picked, prodded, observed, and put in situations where they can showcase their receiving skills.....or, expose their lack there of.....

 
Lacy didn't go in the first and I don't think Hyde will either.

There's nothing wrong with that and I think he can be productive if fed 20 carries per game, but guys like Shonn Greene, Stevan Ridley, Eddie Lacy, and LeVeon Bell don't go in the first round of the NFL draft.
Most predicted that Lacy was going in the first round, prior to the injury/conditioning questions. Doug Martin went in the first, and Bell/Lacy are as much like him as they aer Shonn Greene and Stevan Ridley.

 
Excerpt from Peter King's MMQB:

I think I’m hearing some crazy things about the quarterback race at the top of the draft. Namely: I know one team that, as of now, thinks it’s no sure thing Teddy Bridgewater will be the top quarterback on its board (and this is a team that could take a quarterback in the first round). Moreover, this team believes Central Florida’s Blake Bortles or Johnny Manziel could be the top quarterback on the board. That’s right. Blake Bortles. We don’t even know if Bortles, a redshirt junior, will return for his fifth season at UCF. He will reportedly make his decision after Central Florida’s Fiesta Bowl game against Baylor.
 
Lacy didn't go in the first and I don't think Hyde will either.

There's nothing wrong with that and I think he can be productive if fed 20 carries per game, but guys like Shonn Greene, Stevan Ridley, Eddie Lacy, and LeVeon Bell don't go in the first round of the NFL draft.
Most predicted that Lacy was going in the first round, prior to the injury/conditioning questions. Doug Martin went in the first, and Bell/Lacy are as much like him as they aer Shonn Greene and Stevan Ridley.
Doug Martin had the highest weight/height ratio of any of those guys. He was also the fastest, running anywhere from 4.46-4.55 depending on the source. He had a solid 36" vertical and 10' broad jump. None of his numbers really pop off the page, but they're all pretty good. Especially for a player with his dimensions.

Lacy, Greene, and Ridley were all 4.6 guys. Bell was a 4.56-4.60 runner depending on the source. He also had a weak broad jump for a 6'1" athlete and a pathetic vertical.

It's no coincidence that all four of those guys fell to the 2nd-3rd while Martin went in the 1st. Martin is the only guy who showed the right kind of height/weight/speed/explosiveness combo that you usually see in a 1st round back. Barring some surprise, Hyde seems unlikely to run fast enough and/or show enough explosiveness in the jumps to fit the profile of a 1st rounder, meaning he's likely to slip to the 2nd-3rd and end up looking more like those other guys.

 
Gordon doesn't get used in the pass game much because James White is so good (receiving and blocking). I can guarantee that he'd see more passing work next year if he decides to stay with White leaving.

 
Lacy didn't go in the first and I don't think Hyde will either.

There's nothing wrong with that and I think he can be productive if fed 20 carries per game, but guys like Shonn Greene, Stevan Ridley, Eddie Lacy, and LeVeon Bell don't go in the first round of the NFL draft.
Most predicted that Lacy was going in the first round, prior to the injury/conditioning questions. Doug Martin went in the first, and Bell/Lacy are as much like him as they aer Shonn Greene and Stevan Ridley.
Doug Martin had the highest weight/height ratio of any of those guys. He was also the fastest, running anywhere from 4.46-4.55 depending on the source. He had a solid 36" vertical and 10' broad jump. None of his numbers really pop off the page, but they're all pretty good. Especially for a player with his dimensions.

Lacy, Greene, and Ridley were all 4.6 guys. Bell was a 4.56-4.60 runner depending on the source. He also had a weak broad jump for a 6'1" athlete and a pathetic vertical.

It's no coincidence that all four of those guys fell to the 2nd-3rd while Martin went in the 1st. Martin is the only guy who showed the right kind of height/weight/speed/explosiveness combo that you usually see in a 1st round back. Barring some surprise, Hyde seems unlikely to run fast enough and/or show enough explosiveness in the jumps to fit the profile of a 1st rounder, meaning he's likely to slip to the 2nd-3rd and end up looking more like those other guys.
We have no idea what a healthy Eddie Lacy does at the combine. I know that I personally don't see any value in using the numbers that we do have, knowing that Lacy wasn't in shape, was "jogging" through the drills.

You might not think Lacy was 1st round bound, but, looking at the mocks at the time - you are in the minority.

Let's see what Hyde does. I don't think Martin's numbers are out of reach at all.

 
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We have no idea what a healthy Eddie Lacy does at the combine. I know that I personally don't see any value in using the numbers that we do have, knowing that Lacy wasn't in shape, was "jogging" through the drills.

You might not think Lacy was 1st round bound, but, looking at the mocks at the time - you are in the minority.

Let's see what Hyde does. I don't think Martin's numbers are out of reach at all.
If Lacy wasn't healthy enough to work out, why did his reps let him work out? You are operating under the assumption that he would've done much better some other time, but that's hardly a given. And while mocks may have had Lacy as a first round pick, it's irrelevant. He wasn't picked in the first round. Or even close.

There is a certain type of back that gets picked in the first round. Generally, it's somebody who offers something special in terms of explosiveness or a rare size/speed package. I don't see Hyde fitting the mold. From what I can see he's unlikely to run very fast times. He doesn't appear to be an explosive big play threat or a great weapon in the passing game. He's more of a typical ho-hum grinder type, which will probably be reflected in his draft slot when the time comes. Teams don't often pay first round prices for a replacement level starter. They want someone who can be a difference-maker. Otherwise they can just wait until day three and get a BJGE, Ballard, or Mike James to do the two-down cloud of dust stuff. That's going to work against Hyde.

 
It was pretty well documented that Lacy wasn't healthy when he worked out. I'm not sure how that all of a sudden became debatable. He delayed working out as long as he could but eventually he had too show the teams something.

 
If Lacy wasn't healthy enough to work out, why did his reps let him work out? You are operating under the assumption that he would've done much better some other time, but that's hardly a given.
I think you should find and read a few articles about his workout. To answer your question, yes: I think Eddie Lacy is physically capable of finishing a standard set of combine drills when healthy/in-shape. And yes: That's a given.

And Doug Martin doesn't fit your mold, unless your arbitrary cut off just happens to be Martin.

 
It was pretty well documented that Lacy wasn't healthy when he worked out. I'm not sure how that all of a sudden became debatable. He delayed working out as long as he could but eventually he had too show the teams something.
You never really have to work out. Crabtree never worked out for scouts. Neither did Demaryius Thomas. Both were still picked high.

If Lacy's people knew he was far from 100% and still let him work out, they made a big error. That's certainly possible. It's also possible that he's simply not a great workout numbers guy and that they let him work out because his numbers were basically as good as they were ever going to get. We'll never really know. Ultimately, all we have to go by are the numbers on the paper. If you're going to play the "what if" game with one prospect then you'd have to do the same with every prospect, which would be chaotic and extremely prone to subjective bias confirmation. I mean, I think Chad Johnson is faster than 4.57 (his combine time) and I think he's a first round talent, but 4.57 is the time he ran and he wasn't a first round pick. So that's the beginning and end of the debate.

Eddie Lacy was not a first round pick. Ultimately, RBs who "were supposed to be" or "should have been" first round picks don't count as first round picks. Only first round picks count as first round picks. So there's little value in speculating where one guy might have gone in an alternate reality.

 
And Doug Martin doesn't fit your mold, unless your arbitrary cut off just happens to be Martin.
He is right on the fringe. I would compare him to a guy like Marshawn Lynch. Neither really has "wow" workout numbers in any single category, but the overall picture is very solid. In general, first round backs tend to run low 4.5 or better, jump at least 35" in the vertical, and at least 10' in the broad jump. Doug Martin is right on the border in every category. Juuust barely athletic enough to fit the mold, and incidentally was chosen in the late 1st rather than the top half of the round.

Martin's case is a little different though because he has a hulking frame. This is something that is poorly understood when people talk about him as if he were an average athlete. You look at his numbers on paper and they aren't that great. Modest 40 time. 36" vertical. 10' broad jump. Those are solid marks, but there's nothing special there. Then you look at a guy like David Wilson. 4.38 40. 41" vertical. 11' broad jump. That's nasty stuff. Much more exceptional. Here's the catch though. Martin is actually a little shorter than Wilson, yet he outweighs him by 17 pounds. Basically, he's a very heavy back. Within shouting distance of guys like Jamal Lewis, Ricky Williams, Michael Turner, and Maurice Jones-Drew from a weight-per-height standpoint.

The average BMI for an NFL starting RB is probably about 30. Almost all of the guys with really freaky explosiveness numbers (Chris Johnson, CJ Spiller, Adrian Peterson, Darren McFadden) are below that figure. Jamaal Charles and DeMarco Murray are two other 4.3 speed guys who check in below the 30 barrier. Ryan Mathews (4.37) and David Wilson are right on the 30.0 line. That's 8 guys with 4.3 speed who also have a 30 or lower BMI. On the flipside, there's only ONE starting RB in the entire NFL with 4.3 speed and a 30+ BMI. And that's Maurice Jones-Drew. With almost all of the other big backs, you're going to see somewhat weaker numbers in the sprints and jumps. That's probably because they're carrying more weight.

Most people don't account for this. They just look at the raw numbers. So David Wilson's 4.3 is "elite athleticism" while Doug Martin's 4.4-4.5 is "average." The reality is that Doug Martin's numbers would be average if they had been achieved by an average sized RB, but Doug Martin is not an average sized RB. He's a big back. For a big back to run and jump as well as he did is more rare. He is thicker than Shonn Greene/Eddie Lacy/Stevan Ridley (all 31.2-32.2 BMI guys), yet he also ran faster than all of those guys and nearly bested all of them in all of the major drills (Greene had a better vertical and broad jump by 1" and Ridley had a better three cone time by .01 seconds). The fact that he has rare explosiveness for a big back is probably a large part of the reason why he went in the first round while those guys fell.

Like I said, there is a certain "type" that the NFL looks for in a first round RB and it's usually someone with special overall athleticism. It seems like teams only violate these rules when it comes to highly-productive 215+ pound backs on MAJOR BCS schools. Knowshon Moreno, Cedric Benson, and Mark Ingram are three of the only non-ideal physical tools RBs to be selected in the first round within the past decade and every one of those guys had the benefit of playing on the big stage at an established football factory. Carlos Hyde kind of fits the mold from that extent, so I guess it's possible that someone will reach on him, but barring a surprise showing at the combine my guess is that he's a 2nd round pick. He'll likely end up being close to guys like Lacy/Leshoure/Gerhart/Greene/Forte in terms of draft slot. If he runs 4.55 or better and jumps 35"+ and 10'+ at the combine, I'll be singing a different tune. I'm not sure he's gonna do that though. We'll see. He doesn't look that explosive to me when I watch his clips.

 
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Most people don't account for this. They just look at the raw numbers. So David Wilson's 4.3 is "elite athleticism" while Doug Martin's 4.4-4.5 is "average."
Lacy ran a 4.45 the year before. If you're going to stick to his official pro-day time, can we at least compare it to Martin's official combine time of 4.55? Martin's clearly not the legit 4.4 guy that his unofficial, word-of-mouth times might suggest.

 
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Most people don't account for this. They just look at the raw numbers. So David Wilson's 4.3 is "elite athleticism" while Doug Martin's 4.4-4.5 is "average."
Lacy ran a 4.45 the year before. If you're going to stick to his official pro-day time, can we at least compare it to Martin's official combine time of 4.55? Martin's clearly not the legit 4.4 guy that his unofficial, word-of-mouth times might suggest.
Hand times from spring practice don't matter. Lots of guys claim to run a 4.4, but can't hit the mark when they're actually put to the test.

If you really need to keep comparing these two, have at it:

Doug Martin

5'9.2" 223 (32.7 BMI)

40 - 4.46-4.55

Vertical - 36"

Broad Jump - 10'

Three Cone - 6.79 seconds

Eddie Lacy

5'11" 231 (32.2)

40 - 4.58-4.64

Vertical - 33.5"

Broad Jump - 9'7"

Three Cone - 7.33 seconds

That is a disastrous workout for Lacy. Almost certainly a big factor in why he wasn't a first round pick.

Martin was thicker, faster, and more explosive across the board.

It's hard for any RB to get picked in the first round. It's that much harder when you don't have standout physical tools. Teams can get a serviceable grinder in the middle-late rounds. To go higher than that, you usually have to offer something exceptional. We even saw shades of that in the most recent draft with the first two RBs off the board offering more than just two-down power running. Bernard is explosive and versatile as a pass catcher. I'm no Bell fan, but he has good feet and rare receiving ability for a heavier back. That's almost certainly part of what got him the nod over comparable options when Pitt was on the clock.

It's not that a guy like Hyde is a bad player, but what incentive is there to pick him in the top 32 when you can get a pounder like Jeremy Hill or Devonta Freeman a round or three later? There is a place for guys like Shonn Greene, Rudi Johnson, and BJGE in the NFL, but that place isn't in the first round of the draft. When teams have made the mistake of taking one-dimensional power backs with poor explosiveness that high in recent years, it hasn't worked out very well (Benson, Moreno, Ingram - all huge busts, though to his credit Moreno also has some receiving ability).

RB is probably more devalued now than ever before. So I think teams are really going to want to see something special from a back to take him that high. Which is what I've been repeating for the last several posts. I think Gordon and Seastrunk might be the only backs who tempt anyone that high this year. Andre Williams has the look of a first round back at time, but may be too one-dimensional to go that high. I don't see Hyde offering enough value over your street level replacement to justify that pick. So barring a strong combine, I'm gonna say he won't sniff the first round.

 
Rotoworld:

Senior Bowl Executive Director Phil Savage believes the majority of scouts have Alabama QB A.J. McCarron in the second- or third-round.

"I think if you asked all 32 teams right now on a bell curve, there'd be two or three teams who would have him potentially as a high second-round, maybe even late first-round pick," Savage told the CFB 24/7 podcast. "Then there would be two or three teams that would have him in the fourth or fifth round, that are not that impressed with his arm strength, what have you." Savage, a former executive in the NFL, added that it is unfair to solely call McCarron a "game manager."


Source: CFB 24/7 Podcast
The fastest rising QB prospect in the draft class is UCF redshirt junior Blake Bortles, according to Peter King.

"I’ve spoken to a team that’s likely to have a top 10 pick, and they like him better than any quarterback in this draft," King added. The fact that the aforementioned team could be in need of a quarterback is an important point. Borltes movement skills and strength in the pocket are reminiscent of Andrew Luck and Ben Roethlisberger. He will wait to make his announcement until after the school's bowl game against Baylor.


Source: Orlandon Sentinel
 
Updated my rankings today.

QB

Teddy Bridgewater, Louis.

Derek Carr, Fresno St.

Blake Borles, UCF

Tajh Boyd, Clem.

Johnny Manziel, TAM

McCarron, Bama

Stephen Morris, Mia.

Zach Mettenberger, LSU

Aaron Murray, UGA

RB

Launche Seastrunk, Baylor

Bishop Sankey, Wash.

Melvin Gordon, Wisconsin

Ka'Deem Carey, Arz.

Carlos Hyde, OSU

Devonta Freeman, FSU

Tre Mason, Auburn

Andre Williams, BC

Jeremy Hill, LSU

Raijun Neal, Tenn

Charles Sims, WVU

Marion Grace, Arz St.

Henry Josey, Mizz

LaDarius Perkins, Miss St.

Ben Malena, TAM

Damien Williams, Oklahoma

Wilder, FSU

Alfred Blue, LSU

Silas redd, SC

Kenny Hilliard, LSU

James White, Wisc

John Hubert, Kstate

WR

Sammy Watkins, Clem.

Marquise Lee, USC

Jaelen Strong, Arz St.

Mike Evans, TAM

Devonte Adams, Fresno

Jarvis Landry, LSU

Kelvin Benjamin, FSU

Allen Robinson, PSU

Jordan Mathews, Vandy

Paul Richardson, Colorado

Brandon Coleman, Rutgers

Odell Beckham, LSU

Brandin Cooks, Oregon St.

Dontre Moncrief, Ole Miss

DeVante Parker, Louisville

Cody Hoffman, BYU

Malcom Mitchell, UGA

Devin Street, Pitt

Jaed Abbrederis, Wisconsin

Rashad Greene, FSU

Josh Huff, Oregon

TE

Eric Ebron, UNC

Jace Amaro, Texas Tech

Austin Seferian-Jenkins, Wash

Xavier Grimble, USC

Arthur Lynch, UGA

CJ Fiedorowicz, Iowa

 
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Boyd ahead of Manziel and McCarron, I can't get on board with that one.
Agreed... and I'd add Mettenberger too.

Boyd just doesn't look like an NFL QB to me. He's got a great skillset... but the whole package just doesn't seem to come together for him. I wouldn't really want my team to take a shot on the switch finally clicking on with any reasonable draft pick.

 
Boyd ahead of Manziel and McCarron, I can't get on board with that one.
Agreed... and I'd add Mettenberger too.

Boyd just doesn't look like an NFL QB to me. He's got a great skillset... but the whole package just doesn't seem to come together for him. I wouldn't really want my team to take a shot on the switch finally clicking on with any reasonable draft pick.
A lot of people are throwing dirt on Boyd's grave and I understand it. I think he will rise again this offseason because he had pretty nice physical tools.
 
Boyd ahead of Manziel and McCarron, I can't get on board with that one.
Agreed... and I'd add Mettenberger too.

Boyd just doesn't look like an NFL QB to me. He's got a great skillset... but the whole package just doesn't seem to come together for him. I wouldn't really want my team to take a shot on the switch finally clicking on with any reasonable draft pick.
A lot of people are throwing dirt on Boyd's grave and I understand it. I think he will rise again this offseason because he had pretty nice physical tools.
That's cool, but no one should ever put McCarron ahead of Boyd (or anyone). McCarron lucked out by going to Bama. A quadriplegic could look like a 2nd round pick in that offense.

 
Right now I'd probably say Raijun Neal, Tenn is the biggest sleeper for me in this class. I won't say more than that though.

 
Boyd ahead of Manziel and McCarron, I can't get on board with that one.
Agreed... and I'd add Mettenberger too.

Boyd just doesn't look like an NFL QB to me. He's got a great skillset... but the whole package just doesn't seem to come together for him. I wouldn't really want my team to take a shot on the switch finally clicking on with any reasonable draft pick.
A lot of people are throwing dirt on Boyd's grave and I understand it. I think he will rise again this offseason because he had pretty nice physical tools.
That's cool, but no one should ever put McCarron ahead of Boyd (or anyone). McCarron lucked out by going to Bama. A quadriplegic could look like a 2nd round pick in that offense.
Alabama is obviously a good situation, but this is highly misguided IMO. Don't judge the kid's skills and abilities solely based on the supporting cast. McCarron can make all the throws, doesn't turn the ball over, progresses through his reads. And there's now been plenty of buzz about the NFL taking notice. This isn't Greg McElroy... don't condemn him because he played the same position at the same school.

 
I hope Jaelen Strong comes out this year. For him it's better if he stays another year in school but if he comes out he will slip and people will be getting an elite prospect late in the 1st round.

 
Updated my rankings today.

QB

Teddy Bridgewater, Louis.

Derek Carr, Fresno St.

Blake Borles, UCF

Tajh Boyd, Clem.

Johnny Manziel, TAM

McCarron, Bama

Stephen Morris, Mia.

Zach Mettenberger, LSU

Aaron Murray, UGA

RB

Launche Seastrunk, Baylor

Bishop Sankey, Wash.

Melvin Gordon, Wisconsin

Ka'Deem Carey, Arz.

Carlos Hyde, OSU

Devonta Freeman, FSU

Tre Mason, Auburn

Andre Williams, BC

Jeremy Hill, LSU

Raijun Neal, Tenn

Charles Sims, WVU

Marion Grace, Arz St.

Henry Josey, Mizz

LaDarius Perkins, Miss St.

Ben Malena, TAM

Damien Williams, Oklahoma

Wilder, FSU

Alfred Blue, LSU

Silas redd, SC

Kenny Hilliard, LSU

James White, Wisc

John Hubert, Kstate

WR

Sammy Watkins, Clem.

Marquise Lee, USC

Jaelen Strong, Arz St.

Mike Evans, TAM

Devonte Adams, Fresno

Jarvis Landry, LSU

Kelvin Benjamin, FSU

Allen Robinson, PSU

Jordan Mathews, Vandy

Paul Richardson, Colorado

Brandon Coleman, Rutgers

Odell Beckham, LSU

Brandin Cooks, Oregon St.

Dontre Moncrief, Ole Miss

DeVante Parker, Louisville

Cody Hoffman, BYU

Malcom Mitchell, UGA

Devin Street, Pitt

Jaed Abbrederis, Wisconsin

Rashad Greene, FSU

Josh Huff, Oregon

TE

Eric Ebron, UNC

Jace Amaro, Texas Tech

Austin Seferian-Jenkins, Wash

Xavier Grimble, USC

Arthur Lynch, UGA

CJ Fiedorowicz, Iowa
This is a really good list.

Sankey could move up to #1 RB in FF with a good combine just because he is a known quantity in the passing game. Devonta Freeman is kind of a wildcard for me. With his running style I really want to see what he weighs. He has potential.

I really like Devonte Adams too but the offense he plays in and the competition he plays against scare me. I really want to see him do well at the combine before I'm fully on board.

 
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I hope J************ comes out this year. For him it's better if he stays another year in school but if he comes out he will slip and people will be getting an elite prospect late in the 1st round.
Let's not mention his name again until May. Thank you all for your cooperation.

 
Rotoworld:

Scouts Inc.'s Todd McShay included four QBs in the top six picks in his first mock draft of the season.
Louisville's Teddy Bridgewater was mocked No. 1 to the Texans, UCF's Blake Bortles to the Raiders at No. 3, Johnny Manziel to the Jaguars at No. 4, and Derek Carr to the Browns at No. 6. "I think the key for Manziel is going to be how he interviews," McShay said. "Some teams are going to fall in love with his confidence, whereas others will be turned off by him." No other quarterbacks were slotted in the first-round.

Source: ESPN
Ohio State junior QB Braxton Miller told reporters he thinks he is ready for the NFL.
We should note that Miller has not declared for the draft, but every one of his comments seem to point to that direction. At least initially. Miller added that staying and working under Urban Meyer for another season would improve his game. It appears as if Miller wants to enter, but is receiving advice suggesting otherwise.

Source: Kyle Rowland on Twitter
San Diego State junior RB Adam Muema tweeted he was leaving for the NFL, but later deleted the post.
"I'm declaring to the NFL, there's no secret," Muema posted on Monday. The school noted they are aware of the statement, but have no further comment at this time. "I know Keith Smith (linebacker from San Diego State) is coming out. The two of them may come out together," Lou Farrar, Muema's high school coach, said. The two were childhood friends. The junior rushed for 1,015 yards and 12 touchdowns this year.

Source: UT San Diego
New Mexico State junior WR Austin Franklin has declared for the NFL Draft.
The junior caught 52 passes for 670 yards and seven touchdowns this season. Franklin apparently did not consult his head coach, Doug Martin, on the decision. "The Dallas, Texas native has shown ability to be a possible professional prospect: strong and physical, Franklin was moved around throughout the formation in 2013 and displayed his penchant as a play maker," beat writer Teddy Feinberg writes.

Source: Las Cruces Sun-News
 
Mocking 4 QBs to be drafted in the top 6 picks is pretty bold. I'm not even convinced that 4 will go in the entire 1st round.
but if you look at how the 32 teams are distributed in the current draft order, it is uncanny that of the teams expected to be looking for a QB, nearly all of them are in the top 10...

1 - HOU

3 - OAK

4 - JAX

6 - CLE

7 - TB (might be OK with glennon?)

8 - MIN

10 - TEN (some think they are prepared to move on from locker)

NYJ at #13? i don't think they give up on geno after one season (especially if it means taking the fifth or sixth best prospect in the class).

ARI at #20? palmer has played well enough to put them in playoff contention despite being in the rugged NFC West.

That is (not counting the jets and cards, who may not be as viable for a high pick anyways) seven of the top 10 teams.

So if there are four that go in the first round, they may go in the top ten, just because that is where they are needed... contingent on their grades being in line (otherwise we could see a trade down scenario like BUF with manuel this year, but that could be risky with so many teams needing one?), but it is sounding increasingly like the grades might be there for bridgewater, bortles, manziel and carr (don't know about the rest).

 
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I'm not sure what the cap ramifications are if STL cut Bradford but he sucks so they could be looking at a QB since they have two picks in the 1st this year.

 
Rotoworld:

Scouts Inc.'s Todd McShay included four QBs in the top six picks in his first mock draft of the season.

Louisville's Teddy Bridgewater was mocked No. 1 to the Texans, UCF's Blake Bortles to the Raiders at No. 3, Johnny Manziel to the Jaguars at No. 4, and Derek Carr to the Browns at No. 6. "I think the key for Manziel is going to be how he interviews," McShay said. "Some teams are going to fall in love with his confidence, whereas others will be turned off by him." No other quarterbacks were slotted in the first-round.

Source: ESPN
Does he think NFL GMs are stupid? Maybe one team in the top 10 will reach but not 4. It is not going to happen.

His mock is reminiscent on December last year when so called scouts were mocking Barkley, Geno, Nassib and Wilson in the first round. All flaws will be revealed in the next few months. His mock in a couple of months will have the title "QBs falling" when in reality none should have been rated that high in the first place.

 
I'm not sure what the cap ramifications are if STL cut Bradford but he sucks so they could be looking at a QB since they have two picks in the 1st this year.
fisher said he went to STL because of bradford and the 1.2 pick (likely given more operational and personnel control than he would have gotten in MIA, as well). i think he is realistic and realized he had one of the worst OL and WR situations in the first few years. in other threads, you had people insisting STL WRs were just as good as GB, than we had a poll, and that left this position in ruins and in full reteat (about 4 out of 44 voted for STL, but oddly, each of the four was too embarrassed to defend their position in public :) ).

matt ryan has been held up as a bullet proof QB that "elevates his weapons and makes them better", yet even with julio jones for five games, roddy white for about 10 and tony gonzalez for 14, they were 3-10 before narrowly beating a reeling WAS that had *SEVEN* turnovers, and that may have been because shanahan oddly went for a two point conversion instead of sending the game into OT.

in staffords first four seasons, his record against winning teams (look it up)... 1-23. does that "suck"?

back to fisher, he was already high on bradford, and in many ways, he was having a career season (14/4 TD/INT ratio through part of seven games - rodgers was like 15/4 through eight or part of eight, for perspective)... not sure exactly what people were looking for as evidence of improvement, through six full games... 20/0, 30/0? when i would ask people in the threads, nobody would committ to a number? people would point to the 1-3 start, but didn't want to hear that stacy had one carry in the first month. everything is always about bradford being 100% responsible for the rams challenges. people say, its only seven games, but that is a copout. obviously when people have made up their minds, even if he was 30/10 over 16 games, what would the predictable refrain be according to the law of floating boundaries and shifting demarcations. it was only one SEASON. another favorite point trotted out is that he hasn't had a .500 season. but that is similar, if he had a few times, the critique would shift to, he has never had a winning season before. if he did that a few times, the critique would shift to, he has never made the playoffs before. and so on.

when the defense holds IND to 8 points, that is evidence that bradford is terrible. when they get 250+ rushing yards against CHI, of course this is conclusive proof that bradford is terrible. when austin had a 65 yard TD against the bears, of course the same goofy poster lunged at his keyboard to fire off a clemens is better for austin than bradford. the only problem? laughably, it was a run. what possible better evidence could there be of a troll agenda? but this same person a few weeks before had posted that austin was one of the worst NFL players in history, based on comparitive PUNT RETURN STATS, that he would NEVER be able to elude NFL defenders. so seizing on the opportunity of the QB change to cover this singularly, stupefyingly bad projection, he framed bradford as the bad guy and scape goat. oh, but he forgot one thing. his hatchet job on austin, was on the basis of his PUNT RETURN EXPLOITS. what does that have to do with bradford? :) some people get really creative with this stuff, and are extremely determined. it could be in a bob waterfield historical post. a favorite snacks in the st. louis stadium thread. an FFA thread about St. Louis tourist spots... must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks wherever possible. or it will crop up in even stranger places. threads on macedonian battle tactics? post-structuralism of jacques derrida and michel foucault? must post... bradford sucks, bradford sucks, bradford sucks!

instead of taking a QB, they could maybe use the two picks on some kind of combo like sammy watkins and auburn LT greg robinson... or jake matthews and mike evans. than he would be throwing to maybe watkins, austin, bailey (one of their best WRs, will start next year, bradford didn't have the benefit of throwing to him) and cook.

so no, i don't see fisher, in year three of a carefully orchestrated, methodically organized, meticulous planned multi-year rebuild, making a panic move and doing the equivalent of yanking on the emergency brake and locking the car up during rush hour. what if they get a rookie and they bust. OOPS. 2-3 year setback. try another rookie? another bust? OOPS? another 2-3 year setback?

most STL observers (jim thomas, bernie miklasz, brian burwell, nick wagoner, et al) don't expect the rams to take a first round QB, for what its worth.

 
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Rotoworld:

Scouts Inc.'s Todd McShay included four QBs in the top six picks in his first mock draft of the season.

Louisville's Teddy Bridgewater was mocked No. 1 to the Texans, UCF's Blake Bortles to the Raiders at No. 3, Johnny Manziel to the Jaguars at No. 4, and Derek Carr to the Browns at No. 6. "I think the key for Manziel is going to be how he interviews," McShay said. "Some teams are going to fall in love with his confidence, whereas others will be turned off by him." No other quarterbacks were slotted in the first-round.

Source: ESPN
Does he think NFL GMs are stupid? Maybe one team in the top 10 will reach but not 4. It is not going to happen.His mock is reminiscent on December last year when so called scouts were mocking Barkley, Geno, Nassib and Wilson in the first round. All flaws will be revealed in the next few months. His mock in a couple of months will have the title "QBs falling" when in reality none should have been rated that high in the first place.
one difference between 2013 and 2014, though.

did as many as seven teams in the top 10 need QBs last year?

bridgewater has been viewed as potential #1 for a while, he didn't just sneak into the picture. carr has some physical traits that could have him go in the top half of round one... like kiper alluded to recently, if you like a guy at 15, why not like him in the top 10 (especially with potentially a quarter or more of the league angling for the four or five top prospects)? respected draft observer, dallas based rick gosselin, after conferring with NFL types for a few weeks (and he obviously has some well placed sources, he consistently used to have among the best, most accurate mocks, until he stopped a few years ago), came away convinced manziel would be a top 12 pick. bortles seems to be the late riser, but he has some impressive comps, accoring to some scouts.

 
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Boyd ahead of Manziel and McCarron, I can't get on board with that one.
Agreed... and I'd add Mettenberger too.

Boyd just doesn't look like an NFL QB to me. He's got a great skillset... but the whole package just doesn't seem to come together for him. I wouldn't really want my team to take a shot on the switch finally clicking on with any reasonable draft pick.
A lot of people are throwing dirt on Boyd's grave and I understand it. I think he will rise again this offseason because he had pretty nice physical tools.
That's cool, but no one should ever put McCarron ahead of Boyd (or anyone). McCarron lucked out by going to Bama. A quadriplegic could look like a 2nd round pick in that offense.
please make your point in a less thoughtless and inconsiderate way.

 
Updated my rankings today.

QB

Teddy Bridgewater, Louis.

Derek Carr, Fresno St.

Blake Borles, UCF

Tajh Boyd, Clem.

Johnny Manziel, TAM

McCarron, Bama

Stephen Morris, Mia.

Zach Mettenberger, LSU

Aaron Murray, UGA

RB

Launche Seastrunk, Baylor

Bishop Sankey, Wash.

Melvin Gordon, Wisconsin

Ka'Deem Carey, Arz.

Carlos Hyde, OSU

Devonta Freeman, FSU

Tre Mason, Auburn

Andre Williams, BC

Jeremy Hill, LSU

Raijun Neal, Tenn

Charles Sims, WVU

Marion Grace, Arz St.

Henry Josey, Mizz

LaDarius Perkins, Miss St.

Ben Malena, TAM

Damien Williams, Oklahoma

Wilder, FSU

Alfred Blue, LSU

Silas redd, SC

Kenny Hilliard, LSU

James White, Wisc

John Hubert, Kstate

WR

Sammy Watkins, Clem.

Marquise Lee, USC

Jaelen Strong, Arz St.

Mike Evans, TAM

Devonte Adams, Fresno

Jarvis Landry, LSU

Kelvin Benjamin, FSU

Allen Robinson, PSU

Jordan Mathews, Vandy

Paul Richardson, Colorado

Brandon Coleman, Rutgers

Odell Beckham, LSU

Brandin Cooks, Oregon St.

Dontre Moncrief, Ole Miss

DeVante Parker, Louisville

Cody Hoffman, BYU

Malcom Mitchell, UGA

Devin Street, Pitt

Jaed Abbrederis, Wisconsin

Rashad Greene, FSU

Josh Huff, Oregon

TE

Eric Ebron, UNC

Jace Amaro, Texas Tech

Austin Seferian-Jenkins, Wash

Xavier Grimble, USC

Arthur Lynch, UGA

CJ Fiedorowicz, Iowa
Nice early effort. I like Murray more than you; Fales should be on that list. This WR group looks very strong.

 

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