Dynasty Rankings (6 Viewers)

[SSOG]

I see you have Bradford and Sanchez ranked the same, what have you seen from Sanchez that makes you think he should be ranked the same as Bradford? Although i would like to see it in the regular season, Bradford already looks more poised, and clealry has the superior physical skills.Dwayne Bowe seems awfully low, how come?I had a hard time ranking Steven Jackson that high, and i also have him ranked ahead of Best. I cant lie though, if i had to pick one of the two in a dynasty startup, i would take Best. For some reasom though, i cant put Jackson any lower on my list. Do you feel the same, or would you really take SJax ahead of Best in a dynasty startup?Plus a comment....get ready to move Bradshaw up, it wont be long before he is in everyones top 20.OK, one more comment, Mcnabb will be outside of your top 15 QB's by midseason.Again, nice job!!

Bradford vs. Sanchez: If Bradford got drafted by one of 28 other teams, I'd probably have him around 14th. I firmly believe that bad franchises can ruin good quarterbacks, though.Bowe: Steroids, his coach hates him, Cassel is terrible, and his best season (86/1022/7) really wasn't all that and a bag of chips (reminds me a lot of 2004 Ashley Lelie, to be honest). Not a fan.Jackson vs. Best: It kind of depends. I'd rather not use a pick in the first two/three rounds on a 27-year old RB, so if we're in the early 3rd and I'm drafting an RB, I'd probably go with Best. If we're in the 4th and I've already got myself a pretty solid top-3 core, I'd probably go with Jackson because I'd still have a core left even after he falls off.Bradshaw: there's room for him to ascend. Everyone in the 15-30 range is kind of squishy and pretty easily shoved aside. If you want to crown him, then go ahead and crown him- I'm waiting to see if the coaches can treat him like a workhorse instead of just another Pierre/Felix before I let him off the hook.McNabb: Mike Shanahan- greatest offensive mind in the league today, or greatest NFL mind of the last 20 years? Personally, I'm leaning towards greatest offensive mind of the past 20 years, but I suppose I can understand how someone might think that he's only the greatest offensive mind in the league today. P.S. McNabb is the same age as Brady.Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Patoons]

Plus a comment....get ready to move Bradshaw up, it wont be long before he is in everyones top 20 10.

This kid is seriously underrated and continues to be despite production on bum legs/feet last year. He's finally healthy and appears to have the lead back role in the RBBC locked down. Jacobs is around, but he lost it last year.

 

[The Real Hipster Doofus]

SSOG,

You talked earlier about Stafford vs. Sanchez and the fact that you have Stafford rated slightly higher due to the urgency of his situation. I will admit as a Lions fan when the drafted Stafford I was pissed. I thought they should have built at another position and taken a QB later. Since that point almost every thing he has done has been pushing me to the idea that he will be a top level NFL QB. I am aware it is only the preseason, but have you seen anything to break up the Stafford/Sanchez/Henne/Freeman tier further?

Nice work on the site. I don't always agree with your rankings but I will say you stick to your position and explain it extremely well.

 

[SSOG]

SSOG,You talked earlier about Stafford vs. Sanchez and the fact that you have Stafford rated slightly higher due to the urgency of his situation. I will admit as a Lions fan when the drafted Stafford I was pissed. I thought they should have built at another position and taken a QB later. Since that point almost every thing he has done has been pushing me to the idea that he will be a top level NFL QB. I am aware it is only the preseason, but have you seen anything to break up the Stafford/Sanchez/Henne/Freeman tier further? Nice work on the site. I don't always agree with your rankings but I will say you stick to your position and explain it extremely well.

First off, thanks. Second off, no, nothing to break up the Stafford/Sanchez/Henne/Kolb/Bradford tier (Freeman is a bit behind, partly because I don't think he's as good of a prospect and partly because of what I said about bad franchises ruining good QBs sometimes). I am very convinced that at least 2 of them and possibly 3 or more of them will wind up producing big this season and providing plenty of clarity, though.

 

[The Real Hipster Doofus]

In one of my dynasty leagues, the rookie draft is held before the NFL draft. I thought it would be interesting to revisit how much things have changed in just a few short months.

Round 1

1. Dez Bryant

2. Ryan Mathews

3. CJ Spiller

4. Jonathan Dwyer

5. Jahvid Best

6. Toby Gerhart

7. Sam Bradford

8. Demaryius Thomas

9. Arrelious Benn

10. Montario Hardesty

11. Golden Tate

12. Andre Roberts

Other Notables

2.03 Ben Tate

2.10 Dexter McCluster

3.10 Mike Williams

3.11 Jimmy Graham

A couple big time misses, and a few really nice value picks.

I think I will be trading away all draft picks in the future....

 

[humpback]

I love Fitz as well, but I think you might be selling AJ a bit short. I think they are very comparable talent-wise, I can't consider him head and shoulders above him. I guess that explains the difference in opinion- I think they are close in talent, but AJ's situation is superior (and I think AJ has more upside from his current numbers if his TD production increases, while Fitz seems to have peaked).

I'm not disputing his track record, it's great, but value right now is based on future production, not past. I know you were just making a point, but Marshall would probably be valued higher than Fitz if he outperforms him this year by a decent amount, regardless if Fitz crushed him in the past. I was in awe of Fitz's post season run in '08 as well, but his fantasy production actually fell off quite a bit last year instead of exploding like a lot of people (myself included) expected. I know it's not his fault, but still.

I can understand this deal being a no-brainer for you, but I have Fitz a bit lower and Marshall a bit higher than you, so it's closer for me.

 

[valhallan]

Read some of the stuff on this page, as well as some of the pages immediately before and immediately after. There was a ton of Meachem discussion around these parts late last season. One guy on that page said that he's a Colston fan, but Meachem was the best receiver on the entire team. Several posters were saying they'd trade Santonio Holmes for Robert Meachem in a heartbeat. Several others suggested they'd trade Hakeem Nicks for Robert Meachem. Another poster suggested Meachem was more likely to turn into the next Reggie Wayne than the next Ashley Lelie. Lots of people were taking exception to his ranking (which was #32 at the time that page was posted), which means lots of people did think he should be ranked in the top 25 going forward.

Sigh. I've been a lurker on the forums this off-season, but I guess it's time to jump back in the fray to defend myself here. First, let's consider the timestamp of that post: 3:10am. I'll give you one guess as to what my liver was doing at that hour. Aside from that, the Saints were 13-0 and as a life-long fan, to say I was in a state of unrelenting euphoria is putting it very, very mildly. On to Meachem. While it was hyperbolic to suggest he's better than Colston, I do still believe the former is a top 30-ish NFL talent. Granted that doesn't make anyone jump out of their seat, but when you put that talent on the NFL's top offense he becomes a top 20 fantasy option. But of course there's a big rub here - he can't stay healthy. I think the anomaly last year was not his unsustainable PPG streak, but rather his surprising health down the stretch. He eventually suffered an ankle injury before the playoffs and disappeared. So in short I believe it will be health, not talent that will hold him back from reaching fantasy stud-dom. He'll post big games until the next ankle, foot, or knee tweak - little dings that have plagued him throughout his 3 NFL seasons.

When the euphoria of the Super Bowl victory died down, I'll admit that I sold Meachem. Not because I don't believe he can help my team but because I was able to get a more reliable pieces in the deal. I think you're just trying to be cute with the Marc Boerigter stuff, but of course if Meachem can't stay healthy then you'll be able to say "I told you so". If that makes you feel good, then fine. But let's not act like Sean Payton and the Saints brass, who plucked Pierre Thomas, Marques Colston, Jahri Evans, et al from obscurity suddenly became poor judges of talent and wasted a first round pick on Marc Boerigter part deux.

 

[spon23]

I know he's been discussed quite a bit already, but I'm wondering if I can get some thoughts on Arian Foster's value relative to a 2011 rookie draft pick. Where would you value him? I'm thinking maybe late 1st? Tate was a mid 1st this year in most drafts and from what I've seen/read Foster looks as good as Tate did pre-injury. Would you give a late 2011 1st for him?

thanks guys!

 

[Unwrittenlaw]

I know he's been discussed quite a bit already, but I'm wondering if I can get some thoughts on Arian Foster's value relative to a 2011 rookie draft pick. Where would you value him? I'm thinking maybe late 1st? Tate was a mid 1st this year in most drafts and from what I've seen/read Foster looks as good as Tate did pre-injury. Would you give a late 2011 1st for him?thanks guys!

He's more of a mid 1st like in the pick #5-8 range.

 

[Clifton]

I'll take AJ over Fitz 100 out of 100 times...in any format.

 

[hostile]

Where are we at with Antonio Bryant?

Right now I have him on one of my teams which is pretty loaded at WR (Calvin, Miles, Roddy, Smiff, Evans, Aromash, Britt, Sanders) and was thinking of ditching him for an up-and-comer like Naanee.

The fact that he has damage to the joint capsule and being the age he is scares me about his long-term prospects.

Is he a jettison or a hold?

 

[D'OHtis]

Still owners sleeping on Stephen Williams as a dirt cheap flyer with very realistic possibility of starting in AZ as soon as next year.

Breaston is a FA after this year. Early's a RFA after this year. If Stephen shines like he did in training camp & preseason, Breaston won't be brought back. Early will remain the WR3.

Stephen showed great chemistry with DA & should get plenty of work with Max Hall (assuming the latter is the backup this year).

He's the rookie Arizona WR to target (Not Andre Roberts -- who only holds a roster spot right now due to draft position). Startling Williams when undrafted with his size/speed package coupled with college production.

Hard not to be giddy about his potential, but the Cards may have stumbled upon a potential star.

 

[Go deep]

I'll take AJ over Fitz 100 out of 100 times...in any format.

I agree, its a rare thing to be the easy #1, and have lots of room to improve. One of these years, maybe this one, his TD numbers are going to match his reception/yardage numbers.In 2007, before he got hurt, he was on pace for 100+ receptions, 1500+ yards and 15 TD's.

 

[LessThanZero]

In one of my dynasty leagues, the rookie draft is held before the NFL draft. I thought it would be interesting to revisit how much things have changed in just a few short months. Round 11. Dez Bryant2. Ryan Mathews3. CJ Spiller4. Jonathan Dwyer5. Jahvid Best6. Toby Gerhart7. Sam Bradford8. Demaryius Thomas9. Arrelious Benn10. Montario Hardesty11. Golden Tate12. Andre RobertsOther Notables2.03 Ben Tate2.10 Dexter McCluster3.10 Mike Williams3.11 Jimmy GrahamA couple big time misses, and a few really nice value picks. I think I will be trading away all draft picks in the future....

This is why I heavily prefer late rookie drafts. I've seen a lot of griping around here about how that helps weaker teams (particular re: Mike Williams rocketing up the boards this year), but honestly, I don't think it does. I'm far more confident in my ability to keep up and analyze rookie camps, OTAs, and preseason compared to weaker players. I'd rather have as much information as my fingertips as possible in order to avoid mistakes due to lack of information, even if it means other guys will also draft "better" than they would in April.Of course, I drafted Hardesty in a startup in June, and in my main league's rookie draft last weekend. In both the early and the late draft, the result is the same.

Where are we at with Antonio Bryant?Right now I have him on one of my teams which is pretty loaded at WR (Calvin, Miles, Roddy, Smiff, Evans, Aromash, Britt, Sanders) and was thinking of ditching him for an up-and-comer like Naanee.The fact that he has damage to the joint capsule and being the age he is scares me about his long-term prospects.Is he a jettison or a hold?

Sever. He's done.

 

[thriftyrocker]

Still owners sleeping on Stephen Williams as a dirt cheap flyer with very realistic possibility of starting in AZ as soon as next year.

Where are we at with Antonio Bryant?

In a league where Naanee is unowned, I would definitely drop Bryant. Pretty much from the day TO signed it would have been ok. He's only 29 but he's already had his one miracle resurgence.

 

[SSOG]

When the euphoria of the Super Bowl victory died down, I'll admit that I sold Meachem. Not because I don't believe he can help my team but because I was able to get a more reliable pieces in the deal. I think you're just trying to be cute with the Marc Boerigter stuff, but of course if Meachem can't stay healthy then you'll be able to say "I told you so". If that makes you feel good, then fine. But let's not act like Sean Payton and the Saints brass, who plucked Pierre Thomas, Marques Colston, Jahri Evans, et al from obscurity suddenly became poor judges of talent and wasted a first round pick on Marc Boerigter part deux.

Again, it's not about whether Robert Meachem is the next Reggie Wayne or whether he's the next Marc Boerigter. It's not about Robert Meachem at all. The point is how the "hot prospects" ebb and flow so much. When someone starts reading the clippings of the flavor-of-the-month prospect and elevating him over all of the other similar "young prospects with upside", they're losing sight of context. All they're seeing is the upside of that particular WR, and not the comparable upside of all the other WRs surrounding him in the rankings.

I think I will be trading away all draft picks in the future....

Don't trade away high rookie picks. High rookie picks are worth their weight in gold.

 

[SSOG]

Also, there's an update over at DR.net that is, in my opinion, a really, really big deal. We've finally got our player archive up and running. More than that, though, we've got this unbelievably awesome dynamic graphing utility. Enter a player's name, enter a date range, and DR.net will automatically generate a graph of how that player's ranking changed over time, or how his value score changed over time, or how his tier changed over time. These aren't static graphs that you're seeing- they're dynamically generated by the website every single time you make a query. If you want to see it in action, try entering Arian Foster into the name field and you can watch his meteoric rise over the last 2 weeks in its full graphic splendor. Or, if you're more of a sadist, enter in Ben Tate and watch his long and painful slide.

The feature is brand new and there are still a few kinks in the system (for some reason, it isn't properly rendering Matt Leinart's nose dive right now...), but we hope to have those ironed out over the next few days. In the meantime, I really cannot overstate just how big of a deal I think this tool is going to wind up being. After we have a year's worth of data, or two years worth of data, or three years worth of data, we can do something like chart the path that the average WR takes into the dynasty top 10. Do they tend to debut high and stay there? Do they debut in the 50s and work their way up? Do they debut in the 20s and slowly rise? Is their rise meteoric or slow? How consistent do rankings stay from week to week? How much rankings inertia is too much, and how much is too little? I really feel like I'm just scratching the surface of the potential of a tool like this. As our rankings archives continue to grow week by week, I think we're really going to learn a lot about how to more effectively and efficiently rank dynasty players going forward.

Anyway, please spend some time playing with it, and if you encounter any issues, please let me know in this thread so we can go about resolving them as quickly as possible.

In the meantime... enjoy! I know I will.

 

[XFLcommish]

Love the new tool. Noticed something strange though. Dez Bryant is #10 in your rankings and shows up as #12 on your graphing tool.

 

[Kree]

Very nice feature

 

[Patoons]

Also, there's an update over at DR.net that is, in my opinion, a really, really big deal. We've finally got our player archive up and running. More than that, though, we've got this unbelievably awesome dynamic graphing utility. Enter a player's name, enter a date range, and DR.net will automatically generate a graph of how that player's ranking changed over time, or how his value score changed over time, or how his tier changed over time. These aren't static graphs that you're seeing- they're dynamically generated by the website every single time you make a query. If you want to see it in action, try entering Arian Foster into the name field and you can watch his meteoric rise over the last 2 weeks in its full graphic splendor. Or, if you're more of a sadist, enter in Ben Tate and watch his long and painful slide.

The feature is brand new and there are still a few kinks in the system (for some reason, it isn't properly rendering Matt Leinart's nose dive right now...), but we hope to have those ironed out over the next few days. In the meantime, I really cannot overstate just how big of a deal I think this tool is going to wind up being. After we have a year's worth of data, or two years worth of data, or three years worth of data, we can do something like chart the path that the average WR takes into the dynasty top 10. Do they tend to debut high and stay there? Do they debut in the 50s and work their way up? Do they debut in the 20s and slowly rise? Is their rise meteoric or slow? How consistent do rankings stay from week to week? How much rankings inertia is too much, and how much is too little? I really feel like I'm just scratching the surface of the potential of a tool like this. As our rankings archives continue to grow week by week, I think we're really going to learn a lot about how to more effectively and efficiently rank dynasty players going forward.

Anyway, please spend some time playing with it, and if you encounter any issues, please let me know in this thread so we can go about resolving them as quickly as possible.

In the meantime... enjoy! I know I will.

I'd actually just been browsing your site and saw this. Came in here to post that this feature is pretty sweet. Don't know how you guys did this, but it's fantastic. Wish I were that crafty with graphs and HTML, but I can't figure out how to get something like this on my site. Nice work.

 

[SSOG]

Love the new tool. Noticed something strange though. Dez Bryant is #10 in your rankings and shows up as #12 on your graphing tool.

There's an issue where the two most recent points on the graph both call up one of the earlier points on the graph (in Dez's case, it's calling up his initial ranking, because he debuted at #12). I don't know what's causing it, but we hope to have it fixed soon.

 

[Sebowski]

In one of my dynasty leagues, the rookie draft is held before the NFL draft. .

This is why I heavily prefer late rookie drafts. I've seen a lot of griping around here about how that helps weaker teams (particular re: Mike Williams rocketing up the boards this year), but honestly, I don't think it does. I'm far more confident in my ability to keep up and analyze rookie camps, OTAs, and preseason compared to weaker players. I'd rather have as much information as my fingertips as possible in order to avoid mistakes due to lack of information, even if it means other guys will also draft "better" than they would in April.

I don't want to draft before the NFL does, but I love drafting right before training camp. Big difference.

 

[Homer]

I just picked up Louis Murphy. I guess I don't see what is not to like about this guy. Here you have a young kid at just 23 years old that came in and made some impact on a woeful team. He's stayed healthy throughout preseason. He's the WR1 on a team with a much better QB. Schilens isn't anything to worry about, he can't stay on the field. DHB has had his dings as well and he's simply not as good as Murphy is. He's the guy I've been kicking the tires on all offseason. I just had to find a way to pull him off the wire. I honestly like everything about Murphy. He's exactly the kind of player that comes out of nowhere.

I'm surprised he was on your wire. Even if he managed to make it through last season without getting picked up, the instant the story broke that Chaz Schilens' was going to be missing more time to injury, there should have been a scramble to add him. I like the pickup a lot.

Probably the biggest difficulty that I have with my dynasty team is learning when to cut bait with a player. There's a couple of examples over the last two years that have come back to haunt me. Our dynasty league has a rule that cuts the rosters from 24 to 18 after each season. Following the 2008 season, I released MSW and Steve Smith (NYG). Walker had spent most of his career on the injury report, and Smith looked like he was going to be a possession receiver at best. Fast forward to 2009, and MSW finishes as the #25 WR and Smith #11. I'm good and relatively deep at WR regardless of releasing those two, but I would have a better team had I held onto them. Now I'm faced with a similar decision going into this season. I've just drafted a whole new crop of rookies that all have decent upside as I pay attention, and can get decent prospects in the late rounds of rookie drafts. However, if I need to make any roster moves, I'll either need to cut one of those rookies, or a player like Chaz Schilens or Laurent Robinson, or even Eddie Royal if he comes out of the gate struggling. I'm not looking for roster advice here, just maybe more of a theory that I can hold onto. Its so tough cutting bait with a player that you've bought into. Its then worse to see them overcome obstacles and perform on somebody else's roster. Curious how other people decide when to cut bait.

90% unrelated, but I cut Carlos Gonzalez in a dynasty league last year because I needed his roster spot to speculate on a "closer roulette" candidate. CarGo's career OPS was <.500 at the time, and he was in the minors buried on the Rockies OF depth chart after a crappy opening to 2009...All you can say when you do something like that is OOPS!

 

[Homer]

http://www.dynastyrankings.net/forums/view...hp?f=3&t=77

As always, very nice rankings, SSOG, and THANKS for your effort and enthusiasm and, usually, solid, solid WISDOM.

But your flip-flopping of Rivers/Roethlisberger dynasty rankings seems to me as pretty NUTTY?

Last year was the first year R'berger has even sniffed Rivers' jock as far as fantasy QB upside. R'berger is a big, immobile moose who, despite an awesome innate pocket presence, gets hit a LOT more than Rivers. R'berger lost a more important WR in Holmes, IMO, than Rivers is losing in V Jax (yet nobody seems to reflect that in the WR's fantasy rankings. Brainfarts? Lagging info?).

But then, the crowning denouement, assuming R'berger's knucklehead status hs a ZERO factor? Dude, next time he gets busted for jaywalking, it's surely a season spent in Ricky Williams-esque exile? Even if you had EVERY other factor as a coin flip, wouldn't that mean Rivers is the call in dynasty?

Another thing, how much does Big Ben missing a month of THIS year impact dynasty rankings? In a competitive dynasty league of decent size, your replacement options SHOULD look like something between Josh Freeman and Sam Bradford? That's a helluva handicap to take for 30% of the HERE AND NOW fantasy season?

 

[renesauz]

http://www.dynastyrankings.net/forums/view...hp?f=3&t=77

As always, very nice rankings, SSOG, and THANKS for your effort and enthusiasm and, usually, solid, solid WISDOM.

But your flip-flopping of Rivers/Roethlisberger dynasty rankings seems to me as pretty NUTTY?

Last year was the first year R'berger has even sniffed Rivers' jock as far as fantasy QB upside. R'berger is a big, immobile moose who, despite an awesome innate pocket presence, gets hit a LOT more than Rivers. R'berger lost a more important WR in Holmes, IMO, than Rivers is losing in V Jax (yet nobody seems to reflect that in the WR's fantasy rankings. Brainfarts? Lagging info?).

But then, the crowning denouement, assuming R'berger's knucklehead status hs a ZERO factor? Dude, next time he gets busted for jaywalking, it's surely a season spent in Ricky Williams-esque exile? Even if you had EVERY other factor as a coin flip, wouldn't that mean Rivers is the call in dynasty?

Another thing, how much does Big Ben missing a month of THIS year impact dynasty rankings? In a competitive dynasty league of decent size, your replacement options SHOULD look like something between Josh Freeman and Sam Bradford? That's a helluva handicap to take for 30% of the HERE AND NOW fantasy season?

 

[SSOG]

http://www.dynastyrankings.net/forums/view...hp?f=3&t=77

As always, very nice rankings, SSOG, and THANKS for your effort and enthusiasm and, usually, solid, solid WISDOM.

But your flip-flopping of Rivers/Roethlisberger dynasty rankings seems to me as pretty NUTTY?

Last year was the first year R'berger has even sniffed Rivers' jock as far as fantasy QB upside. R'berger is a big, immobile moose who, despite an awesome innate pocket presence, gets hit a LOT more than Rivers. R'berger lost a more important WR in Holmes, IMO, than Rivers is losing in V Jax (yet nobody seems to reflect that in the WR's fantasy rankings. Brainfarts? Lagging info?).

But then, the crowning denouement, assuming R'berger's knucklehead status hs a ZERO factor? Dude, next time he gets busted for jaywalking, it's surely a season spent in Ricky Williams-esque exile? Even if you had EVERY other factor as a coin flip, wouldn't that mean Rivers is the call in dynasty?

Another thing, how much does Big Ben missing a month of THIS year impact dynasty rankings? In a competitive dynasty league of decent size, your replacement options SHOULD look like something between Josh Freeman and Sam Bradford? That's a helluva handicap to take for 30% of the HERE AND NOW fantasy season?

What do you mean last year was the first year Roofles sniffed Rivers' jock? Bruce Arians became the Pittsburgh OC in 2007. Since then, Philip Rivers has scored 913 points in 48 games (19.02 ppg), while Roofles has scored 879 points in 46 games (19.11 ppg). I don't know whether Ben Roethlisberger has ever actually sniffed Rivers' jock, but I do know that Ben Roethlisberger has actually outproduced Philip Rivers on a per-game basis over the last 3 years. That sound you hear is the window of perception being shattered to pieces by the cold hard brick of reality.Rivers is losing a better WR than Roofles. Rivers has a worse remaining receiver corps than Roofles. Rivers plays for a head coach/offensive coordinator that are busy devoting their every resource to take the ball out of Rivers' hands as much as humanly possible, while Roofles is playing for a head coach/offensive coordinator that have spent the past 3 years making sure he's the centerpiece of the entire offense. Rivers has 2 career rushing TDs, while Roofles has rushed for 2 or more TDs every year for 5 straight years. And, oh yeah, did I mention that all the reports out of Pittsburgh make it sound like Roofles has been a man possessed and is about to unleash a show of aggression on the rest of the league the likes of which we haven't seen since the Patriots were accused of cheating?

Maybe Rivers/Roofles will be my Versus article next week.

 

[Sabertooth]

Max Hall looks superb in ARI tonight.I have a theory that Leinart is gone, Anderson will choke and Max Hall takes over with Fitz, Breaston, Hightower, Doucet, Williams, Onrea Jones to throw to and becomes a very capapble QB2 this year.It's late and I'm tired but sometimes that's when my best theories come to the forefront.

I like this theory. I was just able to scoop Hall.

 

[Tau837]

http://www.dynastyrankings.net/forums/view...hp?f=3&t=77

As always, very nice rankings, SSOG, and THANKS for your effort and enthusiasm and, usually, solid, solid WISDOM.

But your flip-flopping of Rivers/Roethlisberger dynasty rankings seems to me as pretty NUTTY?

Last year was the first year R'berger has even sniffed Rivers' jock as far as fantasy QB upside. R'berger is a big, immobile moose who, despite an awesome innate pocket presence, gets hit a LOT more than Rivers. R'berger lost a more important WR in Holmes, IMO, than Rivers is losing in V Jax (yet nobody seems to reflect that in the WR's fantasy rankings. Brainfarts? Lagging info?).

But then, the crowning denouement, assuming R'berger's knucklehead status hs a ZERO factor? Dude, next time he gets busted for jaywalking, it's surely a season spent in Ricky Williams-esque exile? Even if you had EVERY other factor as a coin flip, wouldn't that mean Rivers is the call in dynasty?

Another thing, how much does Big Ben missing a month of THIS year impact dynasty rankings? In a competitive dynasty league of decent size, your replacement options SHOULD look like something between Josh Freeman and Sam Bradford? That's a helluva handicap to take for 30% of the HERE AND NOW fantasy season?

What do you mean last year was the first year Roofles sniffed Rivers' jock? Bruce Arians became the Pittsburgh OC in 2007. Since then, Philip Rivers has scored 913 points in 48 games (19.02 ppg), while Roofles has scored 879 points in 46 games (19.11 ppg). I don't know whether Ben Roethlisberger has ever actually sniffed Rivers' jock, but I do know that Ben Roethlisberger has actually outproduced Philip Rivers on a per-game basis over the last 3 years. That sound you hear is the window of perception being shattered to pieces by the cold hard brick of reality.Rivers is losing a better WR than Roofles. Rivers has a worse remaining receiver corps than Roofles. Rivers plays for a head coach/offensive coordinator that are busy devoting their every resource to take the ball out of Rivers' hands as much as humanly possible, while Roofles is playing for a head coach/offensive coordinator that have spent the past 3 years making sure he's the centerpiece of the entire offense. Rivers has 2 career rushing TDs, while Roofles has rushed for 2 or more TDs every year for 5 straight years. And, oh yeah, did I mention that all the reports out of Pittsburgh make it sound like Roofles has been a man possessed and is about to unleash a show of aggression on the rest of the league the likes of which we haven't seen since the Patriots were accused of cheating?

Maybe Rivers/Roofles will be my Versus article next week.

Care to make a wager on which of Rivers or Roethlisberger scores more fantasy points over the next year, 2 years, 3 years, 4 years, or 5 years? I'll take Rivers in any of those bets. You?

 

[SSOG]

Care to make a wager on which of Rivers or Roethlisberger scores more fantasy points over the next year, 2 years, 3 years, 4 years, or 5 years? I'll take Rivers in any of those bets. You?

Give me PPG instead of total points and I'll take Roofles over any one of those timeframes.

 

[Tau837]

Care to make a wager on which of Rivers or Roethlisberger scores more fantasy points over the next year, 2 years, 3 years, 4 years, or 5 years? I'll take Rivers in any of those bets. You?

Give me PPG instead of total points and I'll take Roofles over any one of those timeframes.

Deal. Going PPG takes away one of Rivers' best assets in a comparison with Roethlisberger - he is durable and doesn't get suspended. But given Ben's 4 game suspension to start out the period of any bet, it seems PPG is necessary. However, IMO these are two reasons (durability, knucklehead factor) why Rivers should be ranked higher than Roethlisberger as a dynasty prospect.I suggest a sig bet to avoid money hassles, but I'll make a money bet if you prefer. Let's go with the 2010 regular season, FBG scoring, partial games count fully (i.e., no dicing up partial games). Missed games obviously do not count.Looking back on the 4 seasons since Rivers became a starter (FBG scoring):2006: Rivers 16.6, Roethlisberger 16.12007: Rivers 15.1, Roethlisberger 21.92008: Rivers 22.3, Roethlisberger 15.22009: Rivers 21.6, Roethlisberger 22.8Overall (2006-2009): Rivers 18.922, Roethlisberger 18.918Pretty close, but trending is better for Rivers.

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

The last sig bet I remember was HK and about Brandon Jacobs.

 

[EBF]

JWB still a Ben hater after all these years.

 

[az_prof]

Care to make a wager on which of Rivers or Roethlisberger scores more fantasy points over the next year, 2 years, 3 years, 4 years, or 5 years? I'll take Rivers in any of those bets. You?

Give me PPG instead of total points and I'll take Roofles over any one of those timeframes.

Deal. Going PPG takes away one of Rivers' best assets in a comparison with Roethlisberger - he is durable and doesn't get suspended. But given Ben's 4 game suspension to start out the period of any bet, it seems PPG is necessary. However, IMO these are two reasons (durability, knucklehead factor) why Rivers should be ranked higher than Roethlisberger as a dynasty prospect.I suggest a sig bet to avoid money hassles, but I'll make a money bet if you prefer. Let's go with the 2010 regular season, FBG scoring, partial games count fully (i.e., no dicing up partial games). Missed games obviously do not count.Looking back on the 4 seasons since Rivers became a starter (FBG scoring):2006: Rivers 16.6, Roethlisberger 16.12007: Rivers 15.1, Roethlisberger 21.92008: Rivers 22.3, Roethlisberger 15.22009: Rivers 21.6, Roethlisberger 22.8Overall (2006-2009): Rivers 18.922, Roethlisberger 18.918Pretty close, but trending is better for Rivers.

This one will be fun to watch.

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

JWB still a Ben hater after all these years.

I'm not a big fan of him either to be honest, FF wise.Only two seasons over 18 passing TD's in his career.

 

[Homer]

http://www.dynastyrankings.net/forums/view...hp?f=3&t=77

As always, very nice rankings, SSOG, and THANKS for your effort and enthusiasm and, usually, solid, solid WISDOM.

But your flip-flopping of Rivers/Roethlisberger dynasty rankings seems to me as pretty NUTTY?

Last year was the first year R'berger has even sniffed Rivers' jock as far as fantasy QB upside. R'berger is a big, immobile moose who, despite an awesome innate pocket presence, gets hit a LOT more than Rivers. R'berger lost a more important WR in Holmes, IMO, than Rivers is losing in V Jax (yet nobody seems to reflect that in the WR's fantasy rankings. Brainfarts? Lagging info?).

But then, the crowning denouement, assuming R'berger's knucklehead status hs a ZERO factor? Dude, next time he gets busted for jaywalking, it's surely a season spent in Ricky Williams-esque exile? Even if you had EVERY other factor as a coin flip, wouldn't that mean Rivers is the call in dynasty?

Another thing, how much does Big Ben missing a month of THIS year impact dynasty rankings? In a competitive dynasty league of decent size, your replacement options SHOULD look like something between Josh Freeman and Sam Bradford? That's a helluva handicap to take for 30% of the HERE AND NOW fantasy season?

What do you mean last year was the first year Roofles sniffed Rivers' jock? Bruce Arians became the Pittsburgh OC in 2007. Since then, Philip Rivers has scored 913 points in 48 games (19.02 ppg), while Roofles has scored 879 points in 46 games (19.11 ppg). I don't know whether Ben Roethlisberger has ever actually sniffed Rivers' jock, but I do know that Ben Roethlisberger has actually outproduced Philip Rivers on a per-game basis over the last 3 years. That sound you hear is the window of perception being shattered to pieces by the cold hard brick of reality.Rivers is losing a better WR than Roofles. Rivers has a worse remaining receiver corps than Roofles. Rivers plays for a head coach/offensive coordinator that are busy devoting their every resource to take the ball out of Rivers' hands as much as humanly possible, while Roofles is playing for a head coach/offensive coordinator that have spent the past 3 years making sure he's the centerpiece of the entire offense. Rivers has 2 career rushing TDs, while Roofles has rushed for 2 or more TDs every year for 5 straight years. And, oh yeah, did I mention that all the reports out of Pittsburgh make it sound like Roofles has been a man possessed and is about to unleash a show of aggression on the rest of the league the likes of which we haven't seen since the Patriots were accused of cheating.

Maybe Rivers/Roofles will be my Versus article next week.

The four games (at least) missed this year absolutely count, something you conveniently ignore. Missing 4/14 games in THIS (THE most important season in any dynasty league for MOST owners) is enough to dump the player despite sure future dividends. The possibility of "unleashing aggression" in R'berger's more typical fashion (off the field) means the next incident is a year in exile and may drum him out of the lague for good.Re: the team building their offense around him, did you miss the reports that the Steelers were looking to DUMP HIM after the latest rape allegation this past offseason? Doesn't sound like the makings of a stable situation to ME.

Chargers are "looking to take the ball out of Rivers' hands?" How so? In fact, the running of LT out of town this offseason surely puts more emphasis on Rivers?

Re: comparisons to Rivers as a fantasy QB, R'berger had a hot (flukish?) year with TD's 3 years back, but sucked in two of the four that Rivers has been a starter, and last year was his first EVER putting up studly yardage totals. He is also much less consistent week to week, and was terrible against some patsy opponents down the stretch last year as the Steelers screwed the pooch when they were supposed to be on a playoff run.

Also, in the short run, Rivers plays in a much softer defensive division, and in warm weather, which often matters come playoff time. Hard to throw in a blizzard! Even if it was a coin flip, Rivers wins!

 

[Tau837]

JWB still a Ben hater after all these years.

I've always felt Roethlisberger was overrated by many here, like you and SSOG. I still think that, at least for those who would rank him above better dynasty QBs like Rivers, which is what prompted my posts about him here. And I now dislike him in addition, thanks to his off field incidents. Does that make me a Ben hater? If so, I'm okay with that.I've also always been a Rivers fan, and for a long time was posting that he was underrated. IMO I've been proven right about him. IMO it's obvious that Rivers should be ranked higher than Roethlisberger for both dynasty and redraft purposes, and that's what I've posted about here.

 

[EBF]

JWB still a Ben hater after all these years.

I've always felt Roethlisberger was overrated by many here, like you and SSOG. I still think that, at least for those who would rank him above better dynasty QBs like Rivers, which is what prompted my posts about him here. And I now dislike him in addition, thanks to his off field incidents. Does that make me a Ben hater?

Yes. After his rookie season you said he wasn't underrated in dynasty leagues even though most people had him near the very bottom of their top 20 QBs. In the five years since then he has won two Super Bowl rings and compiled three top 10 FF seasons, yet you still seem reluctant to admit that he's a good QB.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

JWB still a Ben hater after all these years.

I've always felt Roethlisberger was overrated by many here, like you and SSOG. I still think that, at least for those who would rank him above better dynasty QBs like Rivers, which is what prompted my posts about him here. And I now dislike him in addition, thanks to his off field incidents. Does that make me a Ben hater?

Yes. After his rookie season you said he wasn't underrated in dynasty leagues even though most people had him near the very bottom of their top 20 QBs. In the five years since then he has won two Super Bowl rings and compiled three top 10 FF seasons, yet you still seem reluctant to admit that he's a good QB.

He's only had more than 18 TDs in 2 seasons. Which other season did he finish top-10? Are we talking PPG or total points? (he was probably top-10 in PPG during his 2nd season, but he only played 12 games)Anyway, Big Ben could be a more accomplished NFL player than Rivers but still: a) be a worse fantasy option than Rivers in general despite being a better QB, b) have less fantasy value than Rivers in 2010 due to his 4-game suspension + the loss of Santonio Holmes, c) have less dynasty value than Rivers going forward.

 

[bweiser]

So after reading the Max Hall thread I thought I'd seek out some opinions in here. I'm desperate for a young QB to pair with Matt Schaub in the future in my start 2 QB if you want league. I used A. Smith last year and dropped him this year. May wind up with him back on my roster as I was disappointed in Henne in the preseason.

Anyway, I won't get Bradford, but looking at some of the others - Claussen, Hall, Skelton, Tebow, McCoy, Pike, LeFevour, other - I'd like to draft one for the future. I won't be taking him early, but most teams in my league due to roster spots won't take anyone other than maybe Claussen and Tebow.

Thoughts?

 

[Rodeojones]

So after reading the Max Hall thread I thought I'd seek out some opinions in here. I'm desperate for a young QB to pair with Matt Schaub in the future in my start 2 QB if you want league. I used A. Smith last year and dropped him this year. May wind up with him back on my roster as I was disappointed in Henne in the preseason.

Anyway, I won't get Bradford, but looking at some of the others - Claussen, Hall, Skelton, Tebow, McCoy, Pike, LeFevour, other - I'd like to draft one for the future. I won't be taking him early, but most teams in my league due to roster spots won't take anyone other than maybe Claussen and Tebow.

Thoughts?

LeFevour was cut yesterday.

 

[bweiser]

So after reading the Max Hall thread I thought I'd seek out some opinions in here. I'm desperate for a young QB to pair with Matt Schaub in the future in my start 2 QB if you want league. I used A. Smith last year and dropped him this year. May wind up with him back on my roster as I was disappointed in Henne in the preseason.

Anyway, I won't get Bradford, but looking at some of the others - Claussen, Hall, Skelton, Tebow, McCoy, Pike, LeFevour, other - I'd like to draft one for the future. I won't be taking him early, but most teams in my league due to roster spots won't take anyone other than maybe Claussen and Tebow.

Thoughts?

LeFevour was cut yesterday.

LOL. Wow. I really liked him in college. I would have bet $ he'd be a good NFL QB.

 

[NateDawg]

So after reading the Max Hall thread I thought I'd seek out some opinions in here. I'm desperate for a young QB to pair with Matt Schaub in the future in my start 2 QB if you want league. I used A. Smith last year and dropped him this year. May wind up with him back on my roster as I was disappointed in Henne in the preseason.

Anyway, I won't get Bradford, but looking at some of the others - Claussen, Hall, Skelton, Tebow, McCoy, Pike, LeFevour, other - I'd like to draft one for the future. I won't be taking him early, but most teams in my league due to roster spots won't take anyone other than maybe Claussen and Tebow.

Thoughts?

LeFevour was cut yesterday.

And claimed by the Bengals, I believe.

 

[Rodeojones]

So after reading the Max Hall thread I thought I'd seek out some opinions in here. I'm desperate for a young QB to pair with Matt Schaub in the future in my start 2 QB if you want league. I used A. Smith last year and dropped him this year. May wind up with him back on my roster as I was disappointed in Henne in the preseason.

Anyway, I won't get Bradford, but looking at some of the others - Claussen, Hall, Skelton, Tebow, McCoy, Pike, LeFevour, other - I'd like to draft one for the future. I won't be taking him early, but most teams in my league due to roster spots won't take anyone other than maybe Claussen and Tebow.

Thoughts?

LeFevour was cut yesterday.

And claimed by the Bengals, I believe.

Your right, and the Bengals terminate J.T. O'Sullivan's contract.

 

[SSOG]

Deal. Going PPG takes away one of Rivers' best assets in a comparison with Roethlisberger - he is durable and doesn't get suspended. But given Ben's 4 game suspension to start out the period of any bet, it seems PPG is necessary. However, IMO these are two reasons (durability, knucklehead factor) why Rivers should be ranked higher than Roethlisberger as a dynasty prospect.

I suggest a sig bet to avoid money hassles, but I'll make a money bet if you prefer. Let's go with the 2010 regular season, FBG scoring, partial games count fully (i.e., no dicing up partial games). Missed games obviously do not count.

Looking back on the 4 seasons since Rivers became a starter (FBG scoring):

2006: Rivers 16.6, Roethlisberger 16.1

2007: Rivers 15.1, Roethlisberger 21.9

2008: Rivers 22.3, Roethlisberger 15.2

2009: Rivers 21.6, Roethlisberger 22.8

Overall (2006-2009): Rivers 18.922, Roethlisberger 18.918

Pretty close, but trending is better for Rivers.

I'd rather do a cash bet, since I'm now using my sig for advertising purposes. Hopefully Paypal works fine for you. To make it interesting, how about making it a dynamic bet- how about $5 for every difference in PPG, maximum $50? If Rivers outscores Roofles by 3.4 ppg, I owe you $17. If Roofles outscores Rivers by 6.5, you owe me $32.50. If one player outscores the other by 0.05 ppg, one of us is Paypalling the other $0.25. Are these terms acceptable?I realize trending may look like it's favoring Rivers, but I've said all along that I view 2008 as a total aberration for Roofles. I said before last season that I didn't think it held any predictive value going forward, since it was so uncharacteristic not just for him, but for the entire Pittsburgh offense. Looks like a pretty good call in retrospect. Looking at it in that light, I'd say Roofles is trending better.

The four games (at least) missed this year absolutely count, something you conveniently ignore. Missing 4/14 games in THIS (THE most important season in any dynasty league for MOST owners) is enough to dump the player despite sure future dividends. The possibility of "unleashing aggression" in R'berger's more typical fashion (off the field) means the next incident is a year in exile and may drum him out of the lague for good.

Re: the team building their offense around him, did you miss the reports that the Steelers were looking to DUMP HIM after the latest rape allegation this past offseason? Doesn't sound like the makings of a stable situation to ME.

Chargers are "looking to take the ball out of Rivers' hands?" How so? In fact, the running of LT out of town this offseason surely puts more emphasis on Rivers?

Re: comparisons to Rivers as a fantasy QB, R'berger had a hot (flukish?) year with TD's 3 years back, but sucked in two of the four that Rivers has been a starter, and last year was his first EVER putting up studly yardage totals. He is also much less consistent week to week, and was terrible against some patsy opponents down the stretch last year as the Steelers screwed the pooch when they were supposed to be on a playoff run.

Also, in the short run, Rivers plays in a much softer defensive division, and in warm weather, which often matters come playoff time. Hard to throw in a blizzard! Even if it was a coin flip, Rivers wins!

I'm not ignoring the fact that Ben misses 4 games this year, but there seems to be a fundamental difference between how you build a dynasty team and how I build a dynasty team. You place a ton of emphasis on playing one year at a time, it seems. I don't. I've still got Vincent Jackson in my top 10 despite a likely goose egg this season. Some players have had a lot of success with the "one year at a time" mentality (I know that Pasquino is one of the biggest priests of the church of immediate production). Personally, I think it's short sighted and always winds up catching up to you in the end. Roethlisberger is 28 years old. He probably has over a hundred more games ahead of him in his career. The fact that he's going to miss 4 of those games this year doesn't have a substantial long-term impact on his value, especially since replacement production is so unbelievably cheap in dynasty leagues. Get yourself Brett Favre for a nice shiny nickle. Get yourself Matt Hasselbeck for two pennies. Get yourself Matt Moore for a stick of already chewed gum.Letting LT go might have been a sign that they wanted to put the ball in Rivers hands if A) Tomlinson still had something left in the tank (hint: he doesn't), B) the Chargers weren't about to dramatically downgrade their receiving corps (hint: they are), and C) the Chargers didn't trade half their draft to go up and select Ryan Mathews way before anyone realistically expected him to go (hint: they did). Those, to me, scream "negative indicators". Those aren't the moves a team makes when it's planning on transitioning to a more passing-heavy attack.

Roofles' TD season 3 years back wasn't flukish- he's averaged 5+% TD rate in 4 of his 6 seasons in the league (exception: post-motorcycle accident, and the 2008 "lost year"). His high TD season was no higher above his career averages than Rivers' high TD season was above his career averages. Last year's yardage total wasn't flukish, either- he averaged 8.6 ypa vs. a career average of 8.0 ypa. The reason he got so many yards is because he set a career high in pass attempts- which is no fluke, since Ariens is obviously busy making him the offensive centerpiece. Ben Roethlisberger has always been a stud during his entire career, he's just never gotten enough attempts for it to translate to fantasy. Now he has an offensive coordinator determined to get him enough attempts for it to translate to fantasy, and guess what... it's translating to fantasy. Imagine that.

After you're done imagining that, imagine Big Ben with 550 pass attempts.

Also, Pittsburgh was never looking to dump Roethlisberger. They said they were, but I'm not anywhere naive enough to believe them. When they dumped Santonio, they traded him for way below market value. That was an example of dumping. When they discussed "dumping" Roofles, they were talking about asking for exorbitant value back in trade. That's not an attempt to dump him, that's a bunch of organizational hot air, and it shows just how secure Ben is that Santonio gets kicked to the curb for a much lesser offense while Big Ben causes the Steelers massive embarrassment and they never do anything more than pretending they're willing to listen to offers for him when they know their asking price is so high that no offers will be forthcoming. It was a dog and pony show, a farce put on by the Steelers FO to save face with their fans.

 

[Tau837]

JWB still a Ben hater after all these years.

I've always felt Roethlisberger was overrated by many here, like you and SSOG. I still think that, at least for those who would rank him above better dynasty QBs like Rivers, which is what prompted my posts about him here. And I now dislike him in addition, thanks to his off field incidents. Does that make me a Ben hater?

Yes. After his rookie season you said he wasn't underrated in dynasty leagues even though most people had him near the very bottom of their top 20 QBs. In the five years since then he has won two Super Bowl rings and compiled three top 10 FF seasons, yet you still seem reluctant to admit that he's a good QB.

I don't recall saying he wasn't underrated in dynasty leagues in rankings in which he was near the bottom of the top 20. And his Super Bowl rings don't have much to do with it, since we were arguing fantasy, in which Super Bowls don't count (in my leagues, anyway). I do recall arguing back then that he was not a top 5-10 dynasty QB. I think that was true back then, and it is arguably true today... I'd probably rank him around #10 or so.And, by the way, he has two top 10 finishes, not three. See below.I just reread your original Ben Roethlisberger is underrated thread from summer 2005, and here are a couple of relevant posts:

If last year is any indication of the future then Roethlisberger could very easily be a top 5 fantasy QB in the near future. Will it happen next year? I wouldn't bet on it, but it wouldn't completely surprise me.

I don't disagree that Ben can and likely will outperform Carr & Harrington. I don't believe that has been the argument all along. The argument has more to do with his potential to be a top 5-10 fantasy QB, which has nothing to do with those two.

Here are his fantasy finishes using FBG scoring:2004: 20 (14 games played)2005: 18 (13)2006: 12 (15)2007: 5 (15)2008: 17 (16)2009: 9 (15)You were right that he could become a top 5 fantasy QB since he was able to finish as high as 5th one time... although it was the third season after your prediction. But I think you were really arguing that he was an elite dynasty QB, and I don't think that was the case then or now. While his performance has improved since then, that is offset by his off field knucklehead factor, which has come to light since then. So I think I was right in what I was arguing all along. Like I said, if that makes me a hater, I'm okay with that.

 

[Tau837]

Deal. Going PPG takes away one of Rivers' best assets in a comparison with Roethlisberger - he is durable and doesn't get suspended. But given Ben's 4 game suspension to start out the period of any bet, it seems PPG is necessary. However, IMO these are two reasons (durability, knucklehead factor) why Rivers should be ranked higher than Roethlisberger as a dynasty prospect.I suggest a sig bet to avoid money hassles, but I'll make a money bet if you prefer. Let's go with the 2010 regular season, FBG scoring, partial games count fully (i.e., no dicing up partial games). Missed games obviously do not count.Looking back on the 4 seasons since Rivers became a starter (FBG scoring):2006: Rivers 16.6, Roethlisberger 16.12007: Rivers 15.1, Roethlisberger 21.92008: Rivers 22.3, Roethlisberger 15.22009: Rivers 21.6, Roethlisberger 22.8Overall (2006-2009): Rivers 18.922, Roethlisberger 18.918Pretty close, but trending is better for Rivers.

I'd rather do a cash bet, since I'm now using my sig for advertising purposes. Hopefully Paypal works fine for you. To make it interesting, how about making it a dynamic bet- how about $5 for every difference in PPG, maximum $50? If Rivers outscores Roofles by 3.4 ppg, I owe you $17. If Roofles outscores Rivers by 6.5, you owe me $32.50. If one player outscores the other by 0.05 ppg, one of us is Paypalling the other $0.25. Are these terms acceptable?

Done.

I realize trending may look like it's favoring Rivers, but I've said all along that I view 2008 as a total aberration for Roofles. I said before last season that I didn't think it held any predictive value going forward, since it was so uncharacteristic not just for him, but for the entire Pittsburgh offense. Looks like a pretty good call in retrospect. Looking at it in that light, I'd say Roofles is trending better.

Well, if 2008 counts as an aberration for Roethlisberger, then 2007 should count as the same for Rivers.

 

[JbizzleMan]

 

[EBF]

So I think I was right in what I was arguing all along.

Riiiight.

 

[kremenull]

5 players who I believe will rise a great deal in value over the course of this season, some could become SELL HIGH candidates, others could become core dynasty keepers....

1. Johnny Knox.....I expect the Martz system to make at least 2 WRs look very good this season, Knox being one of them.

2. C.J. Spiller.....This time next season, could be a Top 5 pick........that's overall.

3. Robert Meachem......The best perimeter talent on the team could really shine this year

4. Matt Stafford......Looks to step his game up big-time in 2010, vaulting ahead of several FBG favorites like the other Matt in Stafford's old stomping grounds

5. Ahmad Bradshaw.....Will get plenty of opportunities this season, and he has always taken advantage of them to-date

Just a brief list for consideration/debate, and I'm assuming that these guys are pretty undervalued in most leagues, whether PPR or non-PPR.

 

[Patoons]

5 players who I believe will rise a great deal in value over the course of this season, some could become SELL HIGH candidates, others could become core dynasty keepers....1. Johnny Knox.....I expect the Martz system to make at least 2 WRs look very good this season, Knox being one of them.2. C.J. Spiller.....This time next season, could be a Top 5 pick........that's overall.3. Robert Meachem......The best perimeter talent on the team could really shine this year4. Matt Stafford......Looks to step his game up big-time in 2010, vaulting ahead of several FBG favorites like the other Matt in Stafford's old stomping grounds5. Ahmad Bradshaw.....Will get plenty of opportunities this season, and he has always taken advantage of them to-dateJust a brief list for consideration/debate, and I'm assuming that these guys are pretty undervalued in most leagues, whether PPR or non-PPR.

I agree with all of your 5 above as potential big season guys, buy it costs quite a bit to get Knox, Spiller, Stafford and Bradshaw in leagues that I've seen. A lot of people are all over these guys and think they're on the cusp of something big. You'll have to pay more than they're current perceived value to get them.