Electric Cars (Tesla and Others) (1 Viewer)

[ghostguy123]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Without additional exploration already planned the 94MMbd Crude capacity cuts to the 40MMbd range by then which is maybe overestimating the strength of the reserves. There is a finite crude capacity out there, and using it to get to shake shack is probably not sustainable. The Saudis may at some point as shocking as it sounds, run out. When that happens the world will enter a crisis. I suppose the crisis could be either we use the crude and the world burns up, or we use the crude and run out and the world starves.

Of course gas will run out at some point.
However, going all electric is also going to be chaos.

 

[ghostguy123]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

 

[Chaos34]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

ooh, semis as mobile charging stations. my route to tahoe needs that. I'll dm elon.

 

[ghostguy123]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

ooh, semis as mobile charging stations. my route to tahoe needs that. I'll dm elon.

Drones delivering batteries?

Roads that are electrified?

 

[beer 30]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

ooh, semis as mobile charging stations. my route to tahoe needs that. I'll dm elon.

So since you brought up semi's and are knowledgeable on the subject, how does CA plan to address freight transport by 2035? The current versions of OTR's are ridiculously expense ($500k+) and provide about a 200 mile range before they have to be fully recharged which takes about 8-10 hours. Getting anything from one of the busiest ports in the US (Los Angeles) even to the border now becomes a 2-3 day trip.

 

[Ron Swanson]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

ooh, semis as mobile charging stations. my route to tahoe needs that. I'll dm elon.

So since you brought up semi's and are knowledgeable on the subject, how does CA plan to address freight transport by 2035? The current versions of OTR's are ridiculously expense ($500k+) and provide about a 200 mile range before they have to be fully recharged which takes about 8-10 hours. Getting anything from one of the busiest ports in the US (Los Angeles) even to the border now becomes a 2-3 day trip.

They've got an even bigger problem right now unless they've modified the ACT act. No new "non zero emissions" drayage trucks may enter service after 12.31.23 in CA. All drayage trucks period by 2035 must be zero emission. Other fleets have different phase out requirements on non-ZEV through 2035 but have exemptions that drayage doesn't. I don't think there's anyway this doesn't restrict the output capability of Long Beach over the short term at least until refueling (hydrogen) or recharging (ev) infrastructure can be significantly expanded.

Advanced Clean Fleets Regulation Summary | California Air Resources Board

Accelerating Zero-Emission Truck Markets The Advanced Clean Fleets (ACF) regulation is part of California Air Resources Board’s (CARB or Board) overall approach to accelerate a large-scale reduction in tailpipe emissions focusing on zero-emissions medium- and heavy-duty vehicles. This regulation...

ww2.arb.ca.gov

 

[the moops]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

ooh, semis as mobile charging stations. my route to tahoe needs that. I'll dm elon.

Drones delivering batteries?

Roads that are electrified?

Some Chinese company developed a battery pack that could be swapped out by robots. Wish that could become a standard thing. Pull into a garage, depleted battery pack is removed, freshly charged one installed. Carry on your way

 

[beer 30]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

ooh, semis as mobile charging stations. my route to tahoe needs that. I'll dm elon.

So since you brought up semi's and are knowledgeable on the subject, how does CA plan to address freight transport by 2035? The current versions of OTR's are ridiculously expense ($500k+) and provide about a 200 mile range before they have to be fully recharged which takes about 8-10 hours. Getting anything from one of the busiest ports in the US (Los Angeles) even to the border now becomes a 2-3 day trip.

They've got an even bigger problem right now unless they've modified the ACT act. No new "non zero emissions" drayage trucks may enter service after 12.31.23 in CA. All drayage trucks period by 2035 must be zero emission. Other fleets have different phase out requirements on non-ZEV through 2035 but have exemptions that drayage doesn't. I don't think there's anyway this doesn't restrict the output capability of Long Beach over the short term at least until refueling (hydrogen) or recharging (ev) infrastructure can be significantly expanded.

Advanced Clean Fleets Regulation Summary | California Air Resources Board

Accelerating Zero-Emission Truck Markets The Advanced Clean Fleets (ACF) regulation is part of California Air Resources Board’s (CARB or Board) overall approach to accelerate a large-scale reduction in tailpipe emissions focusing on zero-emissions medium- and heavy-duty vehicles. This regulation...

ww2.arb.ca.gov

There's short term money to be made if you have the capitol to infuse. Set up a tandem truck system. Build some depo's about 175 miles out, have another fleet of trucks ready to transfer the load and keep moving until you hit the border and transfer to a truck that can go farther than around the block. The cost of goods will be astronomical but it gets widgets from Point A to Point B. This is where the removable battery concept mentioned above would really come in handy. Unfortunately the Chines have the ability to tell their manufacturers you will build your vehicle to this standard. The US doesn't and every truck company does it different.

This brings up the concept of rail but then you're probably going to build some (a lot?) of infrastructure to handle it? Maybe? I don't know but straight EV is gonna make it difficult.

 

[ghostguy123]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

ooh, semis as mobile charging stations. my route to tahoe needs that. I'll dm elon.

Drones delivering batteries?

Roads that are electrified?

Some Chinese company developed a battery pack that could be swapped out by robots. Wish that could become a standard thing. Pull into a garage, depleted battery pack is removed, freshly charged one installed. Carry on your way

I'm this political landscape where nobody can agree on the simplest of things, no chance

 

[ghostguy123]

Build a car out of solar panels already

 

[Psychopav]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

I am pretty sure AAA already does this.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Definitely get a level 1 EVSE to keep in your vehicle just in case. It’s like having a small gas can. You’ll never know when you need it.

Definitely do your best to NOT add an extension cord into the mix. You’re adding resistance to the line and run the risk of overheating. Especially as cord, EVSE, etc age.

Agree that it's optimal to plug your Level 1 charger directly into a plug, but when you're traveling and staying at hotels/AirBnBs without charging stations, it's very unlikely they have parking within a few feet of a 120 outlet.

 

[fruity pebbles]

Definitely get a level 1 EVSE to keep in your vehicle just in case. It’s like having a small gas can. You’ll never know when you need it.

Definitely do your best to NOT add an extension cord into the mix. You’re adding resistance to the line and run the risk of overheating. Especially as cord, EVSE, etc age.

Agree that it's optimal to plug your Level 1 charger directly into a plug, but when you're traveling and staying at hotels/AirBnBs without charging stations, it's very unlikely they have parking within a few feet of a 120 outlet.

The cord that comes with the Bolt is 25 feet long

 

[culdeus]

Definitely get a level 1 EVSE to keep in your vehicle just in case. It’s like having a small gas can. You’ll never know when you need it.

Definitely do your best to NOT add an extension cord into the mix. You’re adding resistance to the line and run the risk of overheating. Especially as cord, EVSE, etc age.

Agree that it's optimal to plug your Level 1 charger directly into a plug, but when you're traveling and staying at hotels/AirBnBs without charging stations, it's very unlikely they have parking within a few feet of a 120 outlet.

10A doesn't need a substation to provide. Maybe don't take your wish.com extension cord but 25' is not a big risk.

 

[Ron Swanson]

So who's gonna start the multi trillion dollar business of road side assistance for electric vehicles? I wish I knew about business.

ooh, semis as mobile charging stations. my route to tahoe needs that. I'll dm elon.

So since you brought up semi's and are knowledgeable on the subject, how does CA plan to address freight transport by 2035? The current versions of OTR's are ridiculously expense ($500k+) and provide about a 200 mile range before they have to be fully recharged which takes about 8-10 hours. Getting anything from one of the busiest ports in the US (Los Angeles) even to the border now becomes a 2-3 day trip.

They've got an even bigger problem right now unless they've modified the ACT act. No new "non zero emissions" drayage trucks may enter service after 12.31.23 in CA. All drayage trucks period by 2035 must be zero emission. Other fleets have different phase out requirements on non-ZEV through 2035 but have exemptions that drayage doesn't. I don't think there's anyway this doesn't restrict the output capability of Long Beach over the short term at least until refueling (hydrogen) or recharging (ev) infrastructure can be significantly expanded.

Advanced Clean Fleets Regulation Summary | California Air Resources Board

Accelerating Zero-Emission Truck Markets The Advanced Clean Fleets (ACF) regulation is part of California Air Resources Board’s (CARB or Board) overall approach to accelerate a large-scale reduction in tailpipe emissions focusing on zero-emissions medium- and heavy-duty vehicles. This regulation...

ww2.arb.ca.gov

There's short term money to be made if you have the capitol to infuse. Set up a tandem truck system. Build some depo's about 175 miles out, have another fleet of trucks ready to transfer the load and keep moving until you hit the border and transfer to a truck that can go farther than around the block. The cost of goods will be astronomical but it gets widgets from Point A to Point B. This is where the removable battery concept mentioned above would really come in handy. Unfortunately the Chines have the ability to tell their manufacturers you will build your vehicle to this standard. The US doesn't and every truck company does it different.

This brings up the concept of rail but then you're probably going to build some (a lot?) of infrastructure to handle it? Maybe? I don't know but straight EV is gonna make it difficult.

Yes, I know there is a new rail terminal/inland port being built around Phoenix with the idea being to shift some of this over to inter modal. Doesn't solve the local drayage issue from port to truck but alleviates some strain.

 

[beer 30]

Here you go EV owners in colder environs, the Scandinavians have it figured out.

https://www.fastcompany.com/91011373/evs-work-fine-in-the-cold-in-norway-heres-how-they-do-it?utm_campaign=mb&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_source=morning_brew

 

[Hot Diggity Dog]

Fusion reactors for electricity production is the answer to this and many other problems.

 

[Nugget]

IRS Link - Used Clean Vehicle Credit - If you are looking for a used EV, prices are dropping pretty quickly and the 2022 models now qualify for the $4000 tax credit.

I've seen 2021 Mach E's under 25K now, 2020 Nissan Leaf around $13K, and as documented above Tesla's being sold under 25K from Hertz.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

Hertz is selling off a their EV fleet.

That is not terribly surprising.

It's not just unsurprising, it's standard operations for all large rental car companies. My first job after college was with Hertz' parent company in the auditing dept. Selling the fleet before 30k miles was a huge part of the operation. 20k Teslas hitting the market? Less than 600 currently available? I would expect bigger numbers tbh. That bit is a non-story and calling it selling off their fleet is sensationalizing a common practice.

The pertinent part of the story is EVs are typically a poor choice for a rental. The hassle of charging while traveling and learning the touch screen are inconvenient for most rental applications. They also get the Camaro/Mustang treatment for idgits who want to rent something fast to abuse, so no kidding repairs are an issue. I would advise someone considering an EV to rent one for a few days though. They are the future.

I wouldn’t call the reverse that Hertz has done ”common procedure”. Yes—rental car companies generally sell cars at certain mileage because of value depreciation as miles go higher, the vehicle needing more and more maintenance as the miles rise—etc——but this is effectively Hertz selling off a large portion of a class of vehicle that they had placed a bit bet on. They have already said that they are going to use a lot of the money from their electric vehicle sales in order to buy more gas vehicles—and this is after they placed a big bet on electric.

They are selling them because the strategy was a losing strategy all around. The electric vehicles costed them more on average to purchase. The vehicles are not holding value like the gas counterparts. The demand for them as rentals was not as strong as expected—so they either were sitting on the lots, or they were being rented out at lower than expected rates. Hertz found that their electric vehicles would be involved in accidents/collisions at a greater rate than their gas vehicles—and the costs and timelines to repair the Ev”s was much longer and much more costly. It’s so bad that apparently Hertz has been in direct communication with Tesla about possibly changing or messing with the performance of their vehicles to make it less likely that they get into crashes.

I want to make clear that I’m not anti- EV. I think that they are great and I have zero issue with them. I just wanted to point out that Hertz selling their EV’s is not just regular standard operating procedure. When Hertz sells gas vehicles—they’ve generally replaced them with other gas vehicles as replacements. This is not what is going on here. They bet big on electric—and now they are pulling back.

 

[culdeus]

Hertz is selling off a their EV fleet.

That is not terribly surprising.

It's not just unsurprising, it's standard operations for all large rental car companies. My first job after college was with Hertz' parent company in the auditing dept. Selling the fleet before 30k miles was a huge part of the operation. 20k Teslas hitting the market? Less than 600 currently available? I would expect bigger numbers tbh. That bit is a non-story and calling it selling off their fleet is sensationalizing a common practice.

The pertinent part of the story is EVs are typically a poor choice for a rental. The hassle of charging while traveling and learning the touch screen are inconvenient for most rental applications. They also get the Camaro/Mustang treatment for idgits who want to rent something fast to abuse, so no kidding repairs are an issue. I would advise someone considering an EV to rent one for a few days though. They are the future.

I wouldn’t call the reverse that Hertz has done ”common procedure”. Yes—rental car companies generally sell cars at certain mileage because of value depreciation as miles go higher, the vehicle needing more and more maintenance as the miles rise—etc——but this is effectively Hertz selling off a large portion of a class of vehicle that they had placed a bit bet on. They have already said that they are going to use a lot of the money from their electric vehicle sales in order to buy more gas vehicles—and this is after they placed a big bet on electric.

They are selling them because the strategy was a losing strategy all around. The electric vehicles costed them more on average to purchase. The vehicles are not holding value like the gas counterparts. The demand for them as rentals was not as strong as expected—so they either were sitting on the lots, or they were being rented out at lower than expected rates. Hertz found that their electric vehicles would be involved in accidents/collisions at a greater rate than their gas vehicles—and the costs and timelines to repair the Ev”s was much longer and much more costly. It’s so bad that apparently Hertz has been in direct communication with Tesla about possibly changing or messing with the performance of their vehicles to make it less likely that they get into crashes.

I want to make clear that I’m not anti- EV. I think that they are great and I have zero issue with them. I just wanted to point out that Hertz selling their EV’s is not just regular standard operating procedure. When Hertz sells gas vehicles—they’ve generally replaced them with other gas vehicles as replacements. This is not what is going on here. They bet big on electric—and now they are pulling back.

EV for rentals with the state of charging and the state of hotel charging was silly. If people were using rent cars for <200 miles on a weekend, maybe.

It is also a bit of a learning curve to deal with the high torque and one pedal driving. That curve can lead to more accidents so much more that there is a learning mode now on Teslas.

I have heard some horror stories from hertz tesla model3 rentals going out without functioning mobile chargers, with % too low to get to a SC and then having to force someone to a SC and not being able to make their meetings, etc.

That being said the ones hertz are selling have 80-90kmiles on them, so they worked to some extent.

 

[HellToupee]

Solar panels on a car are mainly for looks. I guess if you park in the sun a lot it’s worth it, enough to run the system that cools the battery so you don’t lose range, but that’s about it. Fisker Ocean Extreme has one. Love that car but not sure the company will survive.

Saw a Fisker ocean on 95 today . Only said Ocean & didn’t recognize the logo , had to look it up when I got home.

 

[jrt103]

Roads that are electrified?

The future is now

 

[Nugget]

Recurrent EV Report

Used EV pricing dropped 32%

 

[Ron Swanson]

Just got my CyberTruck order invite. Delivery between February and April for the "Limited Edition Foundation Series".$99,990. Dual Motor, 318-340 mile range, 4.1 sec 0-60, all the goodies. OR for $119,900 I can order Cyberbeast for Mid-Late 2024 delivery. 301-320 mile range, 2.6 0-60.

I was so excited about this when it was announced...but no way I move forward at this point. Only those who don't mind an immediate 30-50k hit can chance ordering this and not care if Elon drops the bottom out of the pricing if it doesn't move.

Doesn't look like it's worth the hassle of selling the reservation on ebay either. Which is also indicative of demand on this I think.

Some of the engineering is incredible and ground breaking but...

 

[the moops]

Some of the engineering is incredible and ground breaking but...

That's a lot of money...

 

[fruity pebbles]

Just got my CyberTruck order invite. Delivery between February and April for the "Limited Edition Foundation Series".$99,990. Dual Motor, 318-340 mile range, 4.1 sec 0-60, all the goodies. OR for $119,900 I can order Cyberbeast for Mid-Late 2024 delivery. 301-320 mile range, 2.6 0-60.

I was so excited about this when it was announced...but no way I move forward at this point. Only those who don't mind an immediate 30-50k hit can chance ordering this and not care if Elon drops the bottom out of the pricing if it doesn't move.

Doesn't look like it's worth the hassle of selling the reservation on ebay either. Which is also indicative of demand on this I think.

Some of the engineering is incredible and ground breaking but...

Yeah I’m not paying 100k right now. That will be 80k this time next year.

 

[fruity pebbles]

Severe cold really hits these cars in the nose. Temp here jumped from single digits to the 30s this week. My range jumped an easy 25%.

 

[BlackCrowes]

Severe cold really hits these cars in the nose. Temp here jumped from single digits to the 30s this week. My range jumped an easy 25%.

Yeah there’s cold, and then there’s COLD

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. But, we could have made it to Indy without this stop. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

That is crazy to me having to spend so much time “filling up” on any kind of trip. I can drive my SUV from Philly to Pittsburgh in 4 hours and not have to stop at all. Can drive while in Pittsburgh a few days without having to get gas until time to head home.

 

[massraider]

Just got my CyberTruck order invite. Delivery between February and April for the "Limited Edition Foundation Series".$99,990. Dual Motor, 318-340 mile range, 4.1 sec 0-60, all the goodies. OR for $119,900 I can order Cyberbeast for Mid-Late 2024 delivery. 301-320 mile range, 2.6 0-60.

I was so excited about this when it was announced...but no way I move forward at this point. Only those who don't mind an immediate 30-50k hit can chance ordering this and not care if Elon drops the bottom out of the pricing if it doesn't move.

Doesn't look like it's worth the hassle of selling the reservation on ebay either. Which is also indicative of demand on this I think.

Some of the engineering is incredible and ground breaking but...

I have seen some discussion surrounding the lack of a clear coat on this stainless steel.

I think it's a fine investment if someone wanted to garage it, and sell it down the road.

 

[Nugget]

Just got my CyberTruck order invite. Delivery between February and April for the "Limited Edition Foundation Series".$99,990. Dual Motor, 318-340 mile range, 4.1 sec 0-60, all the goodies. OR for $119,900 I can order Cyberbeast for Mid-Late 2024 delivery. 301-320 mile range, 2.6 0-60.

I was so excited about this when it was announced...but no way I move forward at this point. Only those who don't mind an immediate 30-50k hit can chance ordering this and not care if Elon drops the bottom out of the pricing if it doesn't move.

Doesn't look like it's worth the hassle of selling the reservation on ebay either. Which is also indicative of demand on this I think.

Some of the engineering is incredible and ground breaking but...

I have seen some discussion surrounding the lack of a clear coat on this stainless steel.

I think it's a fine investment if someone wanted to garage it, and sell it down the road.

How long do you think you would need to own it for it to appreciate? I am with Ron and would guess a 20% depreciation day 1, down 40% after 2 years. Maybe Tesla can really delay production to try and hold margin, but I haven't seen that in their pricing strategy.

I had the lowest model Lightning (Pro), and I was able to make a little bit after driving for 6 months. Price was dropping about $1500 month last spring - I got out in May. I don't see many opportunities to flip vehicles for a profit - especially in EV. I've got a Maverick hybrid XL getting built in early February. I may be able to sell for what I buy it for later this year- we will see.

 

[massraider]

How long do you think you would need to own it for it to appreciate?

I dunno. I could see it being like a novelty thing, first gen Cybertruck, no mileage. If you could garage it. Then sell it to a collector down the road, some billionaire who has a DeLorean and an amphibicar.

Buying it for regular use, then selling it in a few years, nah. But Cybertruck buyers aren't thinking about depreciation.

 

[belljr]

The cyber truck will become the Tesla with DeLorean

 

[the moops]

That is crazy to me having to spend so much time “filling up” on any kind of trip. I can drive my SUV from Philly to Pittsburgh in 4 hours and not have to stop at all. Can drive while in Pittsburgh a few days without having to get gas until time to head home.

I mean, that trip of @gianmarco is not really indicative of how most people travel with EV's. Typically we have been able to charge at home, and at destination. With only occasionally having to charge while we ate lunch or went grocer shopping.

And while stopping for gas is only 10 minutes or so, all those 10 minute stops add up to a hell of lot more waiting time then I will ever have with my EV. So yes, sometime I will have a 30 minute stop, but I have none of those 10 minute stops.

 

[culdeus]

That is crazy to me having to spend so much time “filling up” on any kind of trip. I can drive my SUV from Philly to Pittsburgh in 4 hours and not have to stop at all. Can drive while in Pittsburgh a few days without having to get gas until time to head home.

I mean, that trip of @gianmarco is not really indicative of how most people travel with EV's. Typically we have been able to charge at home, and at destination. With only occasionally having to charge while we ate lunch or went grocer shopping.

And while stopping for gas is only 10 minutes or so, all those 10 minute stops add up to a hell of lot more waiting time then I will ever have with my EV. So yes, sometime I will have a 30 minute stop, but I have none of those 10 minute stops.

People forget that gas stations do take time just as a daily driver. That's a lot of time back.

 

[Nugget]

How long do you think you would need to own it for it to appreciate?

I dunno. I could see it being like a novelty thing, first gen Cybertruck, no mileage. If you could garage it. Then sell it to a collector down the road, some billionaire who has a DeLorean and an amphibicar.

Buying it for regular use, then selling it in a few years, nah. But Cybertruck buyers aren't thinking about depreciation.

I see where you are going, but they only built 9000 DeLoreans. Cybertruck was targeting 400K sales over the next three years.

 

[massraider]

Cybertruck was targeting 400K sales over the next three years.

Tesla was targeting. Without looking, I am going to assume there are some bright people out there taking the under.

And there will only ever be one 1st generation, and it'll be the one with the least number produced, right?

They could walk away from this thing in two years, Musk could take a hostage, and you'll be able to sell this thing for a Milly.

 

[Chaos34]

Just got my CyberTruck order invite. Delivery between February and April for the "Limited Edition Foundation Series".$99,990. Dual Motor, 318-340 mile range, 4.1 sec 0-60, all the goodies. OR for $119,900 I can order Cyberbeast for Mid-Late 2024 delivery. 301-320 mile range, 2.6 0-60.

I was so excited about this when it was announced...but no way I move forward at this point. Only those who don't mind an immediate 30-50k hit can chance ordering this and not care if Elon drops the bottom out of the pricing if it doesn't move.

Doesn't look like it's worth the hassle of selling the reservation on ebay either. Which is also indicative of demand on this I think.

Some of the engineering is incredible and ground breaking but...

Our #s are close together. My invite says the same. Guys in the know at Tesla forums told me April was probable back in November. They were dialed in. But I'm not interested in the top of line even at 80k. Again, I signed up for a $40k 2wd ev truck with a $7500 tax credit. Tesla taught me patience, so I will wait, but I still want one eventually. If the mid range awd comes in at 60k in the next 12 months, I'll likely be selling my two current vehicles to get the stupid thing. I'd still prefer the bottom of the line leaving me money to outfit it with the range extender and a versatile shell I've seen. This may never happen.

 

[beer 30]

https://greenbuildingelements.com/f...res-70-of-ev-workers-ramps-up-gas-production/

 

[BassNBrew]

Rivian sent me a survey regarding my transfer experience (I bought used). Sent that back. Received a call today thanking me for being part of the journey with them and completing the survey. I've never previously had an auto manufacturer thank me for a purchase.

 

[fruity pebbles]

Wish I could claim an EV on my taxes every year lol. Went from owing $2500 to getting $4400 back.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I rented a Tesla Model 3 while my Nissan with 61,000 miles was in the shop for an $8400 transmission repair job and I have to say, I am a total convert.

Driving that thing around the city was just a so much better experience than a traditional vehicle, and crazy fun to drive (and this was just a standard, I can't even imagine what the performance etc are like). The only annoying thing was having to wait for all the old slow ICE vehicles in front of me to accelerate with their laggy torque when in traffic, and not being able to open this bad boy up more consistently. The light is green, let's get moving, people!

I'll ride out of the last month of winter with this Armada and new transmission (gotta get at least a winter's use out of these new snow tires) and then probably sell it and dive into the EV full-stop. For now on long trips I think we'll just rent a big family vehicle on Turo (with a dog and two kids and outdoors stuff like bikes/skis we often fill up the Armada) and avoid the EV headache of long travel until it's more refined (though Utah's supercharger network is surprisingly robust). Even with a few driving trips a year I think we'll still come out ahead cost wise with the rental versus filling the Armada and its 14mpg with gas all year long, unless gas prices fall by another half or more.

At this point, I can't envision myself ever buying another ICE vehicle again.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

At this point, I can't envision myself ever buying another ICE vehicle again.

One of us, one of us

 

[the moops]

At this point, I can't envision myself ever buying another ICE vehicle again.

One of us, one of us

Same here. Once our old minivan that has 185K on it dies, we will get our 2nd EV. no doubt

 

[Psychopav]

I rented a Tesla Model 3 while my Nissan with 61,000 miles was in the shop for an $8400 transmission repair job and I have to say, I am a total convert.

Driving that thing around the city was just a so much better experience than a traditional vehicle, and crazy fun to drive (and this was just a standard, I can't even imagine what the performance etc are like). The only annoying thing was having to wait for all the old slow ICE vehicles in front of me to accelerate with their laggy torque when in traffic, and not being able to open this bad boy up more consistently. The light is green, let's get moving, people!

I'll ride out of the last month of winter with this Armada and new transmission (gotta get at least a winter's use out of these new snow tires) and then probably sell it and dive into the EV full-stop. For now on long trips I think we'll just rent a big family vehicle on Turo (with a dog and two kids and outdoors stuff like bikes/skis we often fill up the Armada) and avoid the EV headache of long travel until it's more refined (though Utah's supercharger network is surprisingly robust). Even with a few driving trips a year I think we'll still come out ahead cost wise with the rental versus filling the Armada and its 14mpg with gas all year long, unless gas prices fall by another half or more.

At this point, I can't envision myself ever buying another ICE vehicle again.

If you liked the Model 3, you'll love a Kia EV6. Truss me.

 

[Balco]

Anyone own or drive a Tesla Model Y? Thoughts? I have heard good things and once my 2011 Prius finally goes I think the Y sounds like a good purchase.

 

[CGRdrJoe]

so for any used ev under $25,000 and at least 2 years old (xxx-2022) you can now elect the federal tax break of $4,000 up front at time of purchase (your personal tax situation factors in as well)

EV Tax Credit 2024: How It Works, What Qualifies - NerdWallet

The EV tax credit is a federal tax incentive for taxpayers looking to go green on the road. Here are the rules, qualifications and how to claim the credit.

www.nerdwallet.com

that said I'm thinking of selling my 2017 camry that I bought in 2020, it's value is basically sitting at aprox. 4k more than I bought it in 2020 so I would be looking at going from a 2017 camry with 68,000 miles to a used tesla 3 or Y with what I'm guessing will be similar to slightly less miles on the vehicle.

 

[CGRdrJoe]

I have a feeling I'm going to spend most of the weekend searching how many miles are too many miles to buy a used tesla for each trim.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

To the people considering them: Just be sure you're able to charge at home. While the Supercharger network is a great option to have, and a huge differentiator for Tesla, over 80% of charging is done from home. There is a much greater % of EV dissatisfaction from people who thought they could just use charging stations and didn't need a home charging option. It's also better for your battery. I'd do 98% of my charging from home if I didn't have free supercharging. I take advantage of that when I can, but only because I can for free.

 

[Jobber]

I have a feeling I'm going to spend most of the weekend searching how many miles are too many miles to buy a used tesla for each trim.

Please post your research results in here if you can. I’ve got an old Focus and middle aged Rogue that at some point need replacing. I was looking at used Model 3s $25k and under the other day just to be prepared.