espn breaking news - McNair (1 Viewer)

[AB in DC]

McNair is not technically "due" $24 million. His salary for this year is slated to be $10 million IIRC. The balance is cap accounting hits that the team incurred by playing shennigans with his contract. Everyone and their brother knows that NFL contracts rarely get paid out in full, so players and agents have to look at things with a grain of salt.

Yup.

Somehow, there was a whacky contract clause that would have paid McNair some ungodly amount of money ($50 million) if they picked up a 3-year bonus earlier this offseason. Instead, the team bought out the remainder of the contract for $1 million (which was a term of the contract). That leaves McNair with his $10 million deal for this upcoming season only and leaves Tennessee with a huge salary cap number because the contract as written was based on having 4 more years to fulfill the terms, bonuses, and conditions but now has to be recalculated for cap accounting purposes and dumped into 2006 all at once.

Yup.

I believe that the best option for McNair is to renegotiate something to help the team avoid an almost $24 million cap hit. The best thing for the team (if he doesn't) is wait until June 1 and THEN cut him, and if my capology is correct that should allow the Titans to space out the cap hit equally in 2006 and 2007. I have no inclination as to how much that cap hit would be if they release him. I'm guessing $7 million each year ($24M - $10M salary = $14M hit split into two seasons).

Nope. The June 1 rule only applies to contracts that have at least two years left. In that case, if a player is cut after June 1 this year, only the 2006 portion of unaccounted for bonuses would apply in the 2006 season, and the remainer would apply in the next season.

But since McNair's contract ends in 2006, there's no effect on 2007, and it all has to hit in 2006.

 

[David Yudkin]

Nope. The June 1 rule only applies to contracts that have at least two years left. In that case, if a player is cut after June 1 this year, only the 2006 portion of unaccounted for bonuses would apply in the 2006 season, and the remained would apply in the next season covered by the contract. But since McNair's contract ends in 2006, there's no effect on 2007, and it all has to hit in 2006.

I forgot about the 2 year requirement. But the base salary would come off the books (which is actually $9M not $10M as I listed). So I'm guessing that the Titans would take about a $14.5 million cap hit by cutting him.

 

[Big Score]

What we do not know is what McNair is demanding in new money up front and for the future years over which to spread the SB. Suppose he is asking for a 30 million SB with base salaries every year of 9-10 million for a four year contract.

I didn't know that McNair was asking for his contract to be renegotiated. Where are you getting this from?

This goes to Andy as wellMcNairs contract is - since the 50M option was not paid - in it's final year. You cannot lower the cap number in the final year of a contract - unless you extend it.

That is what they are discussing - the extension of McNairs contract. And the basis for saying that McNair is asking for something.

In fact double It is the Titans organization that is approaching McNair & his agent and asking them to renegotiate McNair's contract.

But this somehow equates to McNair & his agent asking for something from the Titans Organization?

Is it just me, am I missing something obvious? I don't understand this logic at all.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

What we do not know is what McNair is demanding in new money up front and for the future years over which to spread the SB. Suppose he is asking for a 30 million SB with base salaries every year of 9-10 million for a four year contract.

I didn't know that McNair was asking for his contract to be renegotiated. Where are you getting this from?

This goes to Andy as wellMcNairs contract is - since the 50M option was not paid - in it's final year. You cannot lower the cap number in the final year of a contract - unless you extend it.

That is what they are discussing - the extension of McNairs contract. And the basis for saying that McNair is asking for something.

In fact double It is the Titans organization that is approaching McNair & his agent and asking them to renegotiate McNair's contract.

But this somehow equates to McNair & his agent asking for something from the Titans Organization?

Is it just me, am I missing something obvious? I don't understand this logic at all.

 

[Big Score]

That's completely different than a player that signs a contract and then one year later doesn't like it so he asks for more.

You mean like Anquan Boldin?

I don't remember what he did.

Anquan Boldin signed a contract and one year later asked for it to renegotiated.

I would say like Javon Walker.

Javon Walker signed a contract and 3 years later asked for it to be renegotiated.Boldin fits your criteria, of a player signing a contract and then one year later deciding he doesn't like it and asking for more.

Walker does not fit your criteria.

Boldin was also playing on a second round rookie contract, which is going to be slotted based on what other picks around him are getting. He then goes out and posts 1500 yards...then AZ drafts Fitz and pays him top 5 pick money. So now it's Boldin's fault that AZ took him in the second round rather than the top 5???

Didn't say that Hobbes. Only said that Boldin fits Andy Dufresne criteria of a player signing a contract and then one year later asking for it to be renegotiated. My opinion on that being a players right is pretty well documented. You preaching to the converted.

 

[David Yudkin]

What we do not know is what McNair is demanding in new money up front and for the future years over which to spread the SB. Suppose he is asking for a 30 million SB with base salaries every year of 9-10 million for a four year contract.

I didn't know that McNair was asking for his contract to be renegotiated. Where are you getting this from?

This goes to Andy as wellMcNairs contract is - since the 50M option was not paid - in it's final year. You cannot lower the cap number in the final year of a contract - unless you extend it.

That is what they are discussing - the extension of McNairs contract. And the basis for saying that McNair is asking for something.

In fact double It is the Titans organization that is approaching McNair & his agent and asking them to renegotiate McNair's contract.

But this somehow equates to McNair & his agent asking for something from the Titans Organization?

Is it just me, am I missing something obvious? I don't understand this logic at all.

To review (as I see it)- Titans have asked McNair several times over the year to renegotiate (which he did)

- Both sides agreed to a contract that included an either/or clause that would have given McNair a $50 million bonus and extended his contract 3 more years) OR the Titans would have to give McNair $1 million and he would have a single year remaining at $9 million per year (but a $23.5 million salasry cap hit).

- The Titans want McNair to groom a rookie QB to take over for (presumably) 2007.

- McNair has indicated he wants to be the clear starter and does not want to groom a QB, as he thinks he has several good years left and wants his contract back up to 3-4 years (like it would have been if the Titans paid out the huge bonus) and wants to remain as the starter for all that time and get paid starter's money.

- Titans probably don't want to pay him anywhere near what he wants and are staring a major salary cap charge against the cap in rostering McNair (or a huge cap hit in cutting him).

- Titans want McNair to renegotiate (read as extend) his contract to reduce the cap charge when in all likelihood they will cut him long before the contract is over and thus McNair would only see a small portion of the money.

I am sure the team and McNair's agent at some point have talked about money and terms, and apparently they are not seeing eye to eye.

 

[AB in DC]

Nope. The June 1 rule only applies to contracts that have at least two years left. In that case, if a player is cut after June 1 this year, only the 2006 portion of unaccounted for bonuses would apply in the 2006 season, and the remained would apply in the next season covered by the contract. But since McNair's contract ends in 2006, there's no effect on 2007, and it all has to hit in 2006.

I forgot about the 2 year requirement. But the base salary would come off the books (which is actually $9M not $10M as I listed). So I'm guessing that the Titans would take about a $14.5 million cap hit by cutting him.

Yup. It's really a sunk cost, though. The only question right now is whether McNair is worth $9 million this year.

 

[Spike]

I understand he left the facility like a warrior too.

ESPN also reported that Kevin Dyson tried to get into the facility in order to give McNair a ride home, but he was stopped by security 1 yard shy of the entrance.

We have a winnah!One of the funniest comments I have EVAH read.

You should read more.

 

[flapgreen]

This makes me :X . Being from the Nashville area, the Titans have been my 2nd favorite team since they arrived. I'm not sure if this will continue after this nonsense. Sure, I understand it's a business and the team has to do what it takes to try and win but this is a very cowardly thing to do. If you don't want to pay him what he wants, that's fine. Don't tell the guy who's carried your team for years and given everything he had that he's not allowed in the facility. And by a trainer no less. Big to the Titans management. I'm disgusted. :(

 

[FUBAR]

This makes me :X . Being from the Nashville area, the Titans have been my 2nd favorite team since they arrived. I'm not sure if this will continue after this nonsense. Sure, I understand it's a business and the team has to do what it takes to try and win but this is a very cowardly thing to do. If you don't want to pay him what he wants, that's fine. Don't tell the guy who's carried your team for years and given everything he had that he's not allowed in the facility. And by a trainer no less. Big to the Titans management. I'm disgusted. :(

:X McNair deserves better. Teams might try treating people who have given their all with a little more respect.

 

[David Yudkin]

McNair deserves better. Teams might try treating people who have given their all with a little more respect.

I guess you haven't read the Patriots' manifesto on player relations and contract management.

 

[FUBAR]

McNair deserves better. Teams might try treating people who have given their all with a little more respect.

I guess you haven't read the Patriots' manifesto on player relations and contract management.

No, I understand the concept of letting players go when it's time.I haven't read where the Patriots or Steelers use a trainer to communicate to their star player.

 

[David Yudkin]

McNair deserves better. Teams might try treating people who have given their all with a little more respect.

I guess you haven't read the Patriots' manifesto on player relations and contract management.

No, I understand the concept of letting players go when it's time.I haven't read where the Patriots or Steelers use a trainer to communicate to their star player.

The Pats have been accused of not even communicating with their players and having them see on Sports Center that they were cut. Whether that is true or not is unclear.

 

[FUBAR]

McNair deserves better. Teams might try treating people who have given their all with a little more respect.

I guess you haven't read the Patriots' manifesto on player relations and contract management.

No, I understand the concept of letting players go when it's time.I haven't read where the Patriots or Steelers use a trainer to communicate to their star player.

The Pats have been accused of not even communicating with their players and having them see on Sports Center that they were cut. Whether that is true or not is unclear.

I missed that. Lucky, I'm not a Patriots fan. Nor do I think their way is the best way.

 

[redman]

McNair has done some good thing for Tennessee but with all of the injuries he has had, how could any organization think he will ever be able to start and be effective again?

By comparing him to Kyle Boller.

Good point.

This schtick never gets old. Oh, and to Steve McNair:

 

[MKB4®]

Ravens monitoring McNair's situation with Titans

Len Pasquarelli

4/4/2006

When the Tennessee Titans released wide receiver Derrick Mason and cornerback Samari Rolle for salary cap reasons in the spring of 2005, the Baltimore Ravens quickly snapped up the two Pro Bowl performers, signing each to lucrative long-term contracts.

And now, league sources said on Tuesday evening, Ravens officials are hoping lightning strikes thrice.

Determined to add a veteran quarterback to their training camp mix, to either bump incumbent starter Kyle Boller from the top spot on the depth chart or force the Ravens' 2003 first-round draft choice to produce at a higher standard, Baltimore officials for weeks have been monitoring the status of Tennessee starter Steve McNair. In the wake of Tuesday's news, that the Titans have told McNair that he cannot work out at the club's facility until his sticky contract situation is resolved, the Ravens' interest has been further piqued.

There remains a chance that, without a contract readjustment, the Titans will release McNair and make him a free agent. And if that occurs, Baltimore is the most likely landing spot for him to resume his career.

The Ravens have been seeking an alternative to Boller for much of the offseason and, until Tuesday, much of the focus had been on Kerry Collins, released by the Oakland Raiders last month. Collins flourished in New York under Jim Fassel, when the Baltimore offensive coordinator was head coach of the Giants, and conventional wisdom suggested a possible reunion.

But while there have been discussions with Collins and his agent, the Ravens have yet to strike a deal, and Baltimore general manager Ozzie Newsome told ESPN.com last week he was in no hurry yet to acquire a challenger for Boller. Also, last week, Ravens coach Brian Billick noted that there were still some scenarios around the league in which veteran quarterbacks might yet become available.

Neither Newsome nor Billick specifically cited McNair, but it is no secret that the Ravens will seriously consider signing him if he is eventually released.

"Right now, the way I see it, I've got the job in the league," Newsome said last week. "There aren't any other teams left out there where you can say to an agent or [a quarterback], 'Look, you can come in here and win the job.' There's one opening, and I've got it, and there are a lot of guys out there."

Obviously embarrassed by the events of Tuesday, which are believed to have been orchestrated by owner Bud Adams, the Titans issued a release terming the situation "entirely a risk management problem and not a reflection on the enormous respect we have [for McNair]."

Essentially, the Titans fear that McNair could be injured in their offseason program, and that they would liable for the $10 million in total compensation he is due for the 2006 campaign.

Tennessee, which owns the third overall choice in the draft, likely will select a quarterback. Team officials on Monday conducted a private workout with Southern California star Matt Leinart, who was coached for two seasons by current Tennessee offensive coordinator Norm Chow.

The Ravens on Monday continued to consider alternatives, too, meeting with University of Texas standout Vince Young at team headquarters.

Baltimore currently has only two quarterbacks, Boller and Brian St. Pierre, on its roster. St. Pierre has played in just one game, and registered one pass attempt, in his career. Last year's top backup, Anthony Wright, who started seven games when Boller was injured, is an unrestricted free agent and the Ravens have made no attempt to re-sign him.

Billick said last week that the inconsistent and oft-criticized Boller, who has logged 34 starts in his three seasons, "is going to be pretty good." But he also noted: "How good? Do you not look at other options? Of course not."

One of the options on which the Ravens will cast a keen eye is McNair, who has played his entire career with the Titans franchise, who has 131 starts, and who was named co-most valuable player in the league in 2003. McNair, 33, has said he feels he can play several more productive seasons. His agent, James "Bus" Cook, on Tuesday night reiterated that it could be difficult for McNair to play again in Tennessee after essentially being banned from the team's practice facility.

http://sports.espn.go.com

 

[Weapon of Mass Instruction]

Adios amigos.

 

[MKB4®]

Titans Not Willing To Carry Cap Hit on McNair Into '06

Staff Report

4/4/2006

The Titans will not be willing to carry Steve McNair's $23 million salary cap hit into the 2006 regular season, the team said Tuesday in a statement.

''We have communicated with Steve and Bus since the fall that we could handle Steve's salary cap figure into the new league year, but we are not willing to carry that number into the season,'' the team said Tuesday in a statement. ''We have spent time working in good faith to renegotiate Steve's contract, but have not yet arrived at a mutually satisfactory resolution.''

The statement comes less than 24 hours after the team asked McNair to leave the team complex because of injury concerns. The team delivered the news to McNair, via trainer Brad Brown Monday morning, and to McNair's agent Bus Cook, via general counsel Steve Underwood.

''It was unfortunate the way this played out yesterday, but we think both Steve and Bus understand the team's position,'' the statement said. ''Other clubs facing the same dilemma have arrived at the same conclusion we did.''

''With the offseason conditioning program underway, we have no choice but to protect the club and its future from the possibility of having a significant amount of our salary cap at risk in a single player should he sustain a major injury. This is entirely a risk management problem and not a reflection of the enormous respect we have for Steve, for what he means to our franchise, and the huge contributions he has made as a player and as a person.''

McNair counts more than $23 million against the salary cap, with $9 million of that his actual salary. The team said talks will continue with Cook, though McNair's agent told the Tennessean he had a hard time seeing McNair return to the team after Monday's incident.

''We will continue our efforts to resolve the contract difficulties and look forward to Steve returning when this is completed,'' the statement said.

http://titansradio.com

 

[JAA]

I appologize up front for the large font here but ...

''We have communicated with Steve and Bus since the fall that we could handle Steve's salary cap figure into the new league year, but we are not willing to carry that number into the season,''

THIS IS SUCH BULL####!!!

You knew ### #### well this would happen when you wrote up the contract and asked SM to sign it.

Just as players are expected to honor contracts, YOU SHOULD ALSO BE EXPECTED TO HONOR CONTRACTS!!!

Fact of the matter is you (the Titans) were not negotiating in good faith when you got Steve to sign the deal. You knew it would never be honored, nothing has changed from that day!!

 

[Koya]

The team is certainly within its right, and in fact they may have made the right choice in having McNair not participate - but the WAY they handled this is a disgrace. Why not have the COACH at least, or the GM, or even the team president, give McNair a call and explain this to him? Then the ball is in McNair's court.

To have McNair find out via the team trainer? Pretty pathetic.

 

[David Yudkin]

I appologize up front for the large font here but ...

''We have communicated with Steve and Bus since the fall that we could handle Steve's salary cap figure into the new league year, but we are not willing to carry that number into the season

THIS IS SUCH BULL####!!!

You knew ### #### well this would happen when you wrote up the contract and asked SM to sign it.

Just as players are expected to honor contracts, YOU SHOULD ALSO BE EXPECTED TO HONOR CONTRACTS!!!

Fact of the matter is you (the Titans) were not negotiating in good faith when you got Steve to sign the deal. You knew it would never be honored, nothing has changed from that day!!

Don't blame the Titans, blame the player's union. They agreed to the salary cap and all its faults. Teams regularly cut players before their contracts are completed because they are deemed too costly. I have never figured out how the team can cut a player at any time yet a player can't void his contract whenever he wants. Doesn't seem fair to me.Titans have the upper hand to cut McNair if they so choose, so McNair could have been a Boy Scout his entire career and it wouldn't make a bit of difference.

 

[psychobillies]

I appologize up front for the large font here but ...

''We have communicated with Steve and Bus since the fall that we could handle Steve's salary cap figure into the new league year, but we are not willing to carry that number into the season,''

THIS IS SUCH BULL####!!!

You knew ### #### well this would happen when you wrote up the contract and asked SM to sign it.

Just as players are expected to honor contracts, YOU SHOULD ALSO BE EXPECTED TO HONOR CONTRACTS!!!

Fact of the matter is you (the Titans) were not negotiating in good faith when you got Steve to sign the deal. You knew it would never be honored, nothing has changed from that day!!

When they gave him his signing bonus, (a check he has no doubt cashed) it gave the team the right to keep him under certain terms or release him. Don't you think that Mcnair knew all of this when he signed the deal? Don't you think Mcnair realized that a 10 million salary was going to be possible but a bit unrealistic at this point in his career? Of course he did, that's probably why the bonus was very large. I didn't hear him complaining when he signed the contract. The team is absolutely without a doubt honoring every word in the contract that was signed by Mcnair. If they weren't they would probably be getting sued. It's why you always hear about how NFL contract are all about the bonus money. The salaries are not gauranteed.That being said, it does seem like the Titans are handling this poorly.

 

[JAA]

I appologize up front for the large font here but ...

''We have communicated with Steve and Bus since the fall that we could handle Steve's salary cap figure into the new league year, but we are not willing to carry that number into the season

THIS IS SUCH BULL####!!!

You knew ### #### well this would happen when you wrote up the contract and asked SM to sign it.

Just as players are expected to honor contracts, YOU SHOULD ALSO BE EXPECTED TO HONOR CONTRACTS!!!

Fact of the matter is you (the Titans) were not negotiating in good faith when you got Steve to sign the deal.  You knew it would never be honored, nothing has changed from that day!!

 

Don't blame the Titans, blame the player's union. They agreed to the salary cap and all its faults. Teams regularly cut players before their contracts are completed because they are deemed too costly. I have never figured out how the team can cut a player at any time yet a player can't void his contract whenever he wants. Doesn't seem fair to me.Titans have the upper hand to cut McNair if they so choose, so McNair could have been a Boy Scout his entire career and it wouldn't make a bit of difference.

I blame the Titans and all the Owners/GMs/Teams. What I am specifically blaming them for is their perpetuation of the MYTH that players should honor their contracts because "they signed them", the team negotiated in good faith, blah blah blah blah, more .

 

[JAA]

I appologize up front for the large font here but ...

''We have communicated with Steve and Bus since the fall that we could handle Steve's salary cap figure into the new league year, but we are not willing to carry that number into the season,''

THIS IS SUCH BULL####!!!

You knew ### #### well this would happen when you wrote up the contract and asked SM to sign it.

Just as players are expected to honor contracts, YOU SHOULD ALSO BE EXPECTED TO HONOR CONTRACTS!!!

Fact of the matter is you (the Titans) were not negotiating in good faith when you got Steve to sign the deal.  You knew it would never be honored, nothing has changed from that day!!

 

When they gave him his signing bonus, (a check he has no doubt cashed) it gave the team the right to keep him under certain terms or release him. Don't you think that Mcnair knew all of this when he signed the deal? Don't you think Mcnair realized that a 10 million salary was going to be possible but a bit unrealistic at this point in his career? Of course he did, that's probably why the bonus was very large. I didn't hear him complaining when he signed the contract. The team is absolutely without a doubt honoring every word in the contract that was signed by Mcnair. If they weren't they would probably be getting sued. It's why you always hear about how NFL contract are all about the bonus money. The salaries are not gauranteed.That being said, it does seem like the Titans are handling this poorly.

see my post above

 

[psychobillies]

I :

When they gave him his signing bonus, (a check he has no doubt cashed) it gave the team the right to keep him under certain terms or release him. Don't you think that Mcnair knew all of this when he signed the deal? Don't you think Mcnair realized that a 10 million salary was going to be possible but a bit unrealistic at this point in his career? Of course he did, that's probably why the bonus was very large. I didn't hear him complaining when he signed the contract. The team is absolutely without a doubt honoring every word in the contract that was signed by Mcnair. If they weren't they would probably be getting sued. It's why you always hear about how NFL contract are all about the bonus money. The salaries are not gauranteed.That being said, it does seem like the Titans are handling this poorly.

see my post above

OK. I still think you're missing the point behind the signing bonuses and how NFL contracts are structured. If they cut him, he gets to keep all of that bonus money AND go to another team to get MORE bonus money plus whatever salary he would earn for playing this year. I fail to realize how Mcnair is getting screwed by the contract here or how NFL GMs screw players over by giving them large bonuses to obtain their rights.

 

[redman]

I appologize up front for the large font here but ...

''We have communicated with Steve and Bus since the fall that we could handle Steve's salary cap figure into the new league year, but we are not willing to carry that number into the season,''

THIS IS SUCH BULL####!!!

You knew ### #### well this would happen when you wrote up the contract and asked SM to sign it.

Just as players are expected to honor contracts, YOU SHOULD ALSO BE EXPECTED TO HONOR CONTRACTS!!!

Fact of the matter is you (the Titans) were not negotiating in good faith when you got Steve to sign the deal. You knew it would never be honored, nothing has changed from that day!!

The fact that this is a team sport and the existence of the salary cap and free agency mean that contracts are always negotiable by both sides. Players commonly restructure their deals to turn salary into bonus to shorten cap hits, or do the opposite, in order to help their teams. My team, the Redskins, make that a yearly ritual, and the players virtually to a man work with them. It has to be that way. Did this sound like a wise deal to put together in the first place (I don't know what the deal was honestly)? No, not from the way this has played out. But I can't believe a quarterback and team icon is refusing to renegotiate in some way to reduce what is clearly a crushing cap hit.

 

[redman]

I have never figured out how the team can cut a player at any time yet a player can't void his contract whenever he wants.

Signing bonuses are guaranteed and cap hits from bonuses are accellerated (and no longer prorated) if the player is cut early. Could you imagine the collective mess vis-a-vis the salary cap if players kept voiding contracts? There would be fights every time that happened over how much of the bonus should be returned, and the players would be in effective control of their teams' salary caps.

 

[JAA]

I :

When they gave him his signing bonus, (a check he has no doubt cashed) it gave the team the right to keep him under certain terms or release him. Don't you think that Mcnair knew all of this when he signed the deal? Don't you think Mcnair realized that a 10 million salary was going to be possible but a bit unrealistic at this point in his career? Of course he did, that's probably why the bonus was very large. I didn't hear him complaining when he signed the contract. The team is absolutely without a doubt honoring every word in the contract that was signed by Mcnair. If they weren't they would probably be getting sued. It's why you always hear about how NFL contract are all about the bonus money. The salaries are not gauranteed.That being said, it does seem like the Titans are handling this poorly.

see my post above

OK. I still think you're missing the point behind the signing bonuses and how NFL contracts are structured. If they cut him, he gets to keep all of that bonus money AND go to another team to get MORE bonus money plus whatever salary he would earn for playing this year. I fail to realize how Mcnair is getting screwed by the contract here or how NFL GMs screw players over by giving them large bonuses to obtain their rights.

Let me repeat:The Owners/GMs/Coaches out of one side of their mouth say "we signed a player to ABC contract, and we expect him to honor that". Then out of the other side of their mouth say "We cant handle this cap figure and will need to release you."

 

[Big Score]

The fact that this is a team sport and the existence of the salary cap and free agency mean that contracts are always negotiable by both sides.

Considering the Javon Walker mess, apparently the Packers didn't get that memo.

 

[redman]

The fact that this is a team sport and the existence of the salary cap and free agency mean that contracts are always negotiable by both sides. 

Considering the Javon Walker mess, apparently the Packers didn't get that memo.

Walker was a FA, but yeah, there are certainly teams (and players) that "get it" more than others.

 

[David Yudkin]

Let me repeat:The Owners/GMs/Coaches out of one side of their mouth say "we signed a player to ABC contract, and we expect him to honor that". Then out of the other side of their mouth say "We cant handle this cap figure and will need to release you."

Contracts for players = bindingContracts for owners = non-bindingIt's in the rules. Both the players and owners agreed to it. If the players didn't like it, they just had the chance to get rid of the system or at the least alter it. But they figured the current system with an $18 million increase in the salary cap per team outweighed sniping over the fine print.I think what some people are not really grasping is that the players still get their fair share of money (in total) and that sometimes the seemingly overpaid veterans have to get cut and it looks bad and unfair for the players. Remember, if teams all spend close to the cap, the players collectively will still get over $3.2 billion this year.Whether it goes to McNair or someone else (or even McNair someplace else), the players (collectively) are still going to make the same amount of money.

 

[psychobillies]

I :

When they gave him his signing bonus, (a check he has no doubt cashed) it gave the team the right to keep him under certain terms or release him. Don't you think that Mcnair knew all of this when he signed the deal? Don't you think Mcnair realized that a 10 million salary was going to be possible but a bit unrealistic at this point in his career? Of course he did, that's probably why the bonus was very large. I didn't hear him complaining when he signed the contract. The team is absolutely without a doubt honoring every word in the contract that was signed by Mcnair. If they weren't they would probably be getting sued. It's why you always hear about how NFL contract are all about the bonus money. The salaries are not gauranteed.That being said, it does seem like the Titans are handling this poorly.

see my post above

OK. I still think you're missing the point behind the signing bonuses and how NFL contracts are structured. If they cut him, he gets to keep all of that bonus money AND go to another team to get MORE bonus money plus whatever salary he would earn for playing this year. I fail to realize how Mcnair is getting screwed by the contract here or how NFL GMs screw players over by giving them large bonuses to obtain their rights.

Let me repeat:The Owners/GMs/Coaches out of one side of their mouth say "we signed a player to ABC contract, and we expect him to honor that". Then out of the other side of their mouth say "We cant handle this cap figure and will need to release you."

I think it's more an issue of "here's 15 million dollars cash. Now we expect you to play for us as long as we want to pay you the salaries". They buy the right to do this with the bonus.What they really are saying is "We can't handle this cap figure so we need to release you but go ahead and keep the entire bonus".

I'm not sure how you see that as dishonorable or talking out of both sides of their mouth. It's real cut and dry to me.

I think the players benefit from this system as much as the owners do. I'm sure that if we looked at the entire sum of money that Mcnair has earned from his distinguished career in the NFL, we would not feel sorry for him. or think that he has been underpaid.

 

[Silver & Black]

I think people are losing sight of the tree through the forest here.

McNair has been a great player and a great team mate for Tenn. He plays hurt and is a warrior.

Forgetting all the details of the contract and who is within their rights to do this and who knew what when the contract was signed. I find that to all be ancillary.

IMO, the bottom line here is that the Titans are handling a bad situation very poorly. Right or wrong, treating a seasoned veteran who has given it is absolute all IMO like a piece of dirt at this stage in his career is just wrong.

To Titans on this one.

 

[massraider]

From McNair's perspective, the only thing that sucks is that the Titans have no reason to release him between now and the eve of the season opener. They paid him that $1 mill bonus, declining that 3 year, 50 mill deal, but they now have the entire summer to try and negotiate with him.

If they are nervous about paying him the 9 mill, they should cut him now, but there's no real financial rush to cut him now. I mean, in order to do the right thing by him, they should release him, but that would also be helping out another team, maybe even a team in their own conference.

Bus should maaybe take some blame here as well, because he should have forseen this possibility. That's why you write it in the contract that if they decline the extension, he is released from his deal, instead, he's left dangling.

 

[cstu]

I appologize up front for the large font here but ...

''We have communicated with Steve and Bus since the fall that we could handle Steve's salary cap figure into the new league year, but we are not willing to carry that number into the season

THIS IS SUCH BULL####!!!

You knew ### #### well this would happen when you wrote up the contract and asked SM to sign it.

Just as players are expected to honor contracts, YOU SHOULD ALSO BE EXPECTED TO HONOR CONTRACTS!!!

Fact of the matter is you (the Titans) were not negotiating in good faith when you got Steve to sign the deal. You knew it would never be honored, nothing has changed from that day!!

Don't blame the Titans, blame the player's union. They agreed to the salary cap and all its faults. Teams regularly cut players before their contracts are completed because they are deemed too costly. I have never figured out how the team can cut a player at any time yet a player can't void his contract whenever he wants. Doesn't seem fair to me.Titans have the upper hand to cut McNair if they so choose, so McNair could have been a Boy Scout his entire career and it wouldn't make a bit of difference.

It seems fair enough well a team has to the give a player bonus money upfront regardless of whether the player plays or not. That's what the players want over a system with no bonuses and contracts that they have to play out to get paid. I think it generally works out in the players' favor since if they can still play they end up getting a bonus with another team.

 

[cstu]

I think people are losing sight of the tree through the forest here.

McNair has been a great player and a great team mate for Tenn. He plays hurt and is a warrior.

Forgetting all the details of the contract and who is within their rights to do this and who knew what when the contract was signed. I find that to all be ancillary.

IMO, the bottom line here is that the Titans are handling a bad situation very poorly. Right or wrong, treating a seasoned veteran who has given it is absolute all IMO like a piece of dirt at this stage in his career is just wrong.

To Titans on this one.

Bledsoe? Not only in NE but also Buffalo. That's the business and McNair needs to suck it up and move on.

 

[redman]

The people who are hurt under this system are the veterans who are not stars. They don't get large bonuses and are paid the veteran minimum or just above that, which is of course not guaranteed. They're quickly discarded in favor of prospects who are cheaper but not necessarily better.

Don't cry over guys like McNair.

 

[JAA]

Let me repeat:

The Owners/GMs/Coaches out of one side of their mouth say "we signed a player to ABC contract, and we expect him to honor that". Then out of the other side of their mouth say "We cant handle this cap figure and will need to release you."

Contracts for players = bindingContracts for owners = non-binding

It's in the rules. Both the players and owners agreed to it. If the players didn't like it, they just had the chance to get rid of the system or at the least alter it. But they figured the current system with an $18 million increase in the salary cap per team outweighed sniping over the fine print.

I think what some people are not really grasping is that the players still get their fair share of money (in total) and that sometimes the seemingly overpaid veterans have to get cut and it looks bad and unfair for the players. Remember, if teams all spend close to the cap, the players collectively will still get over $3.2 billion this year.

Whether it goes to McNair or someone else (or even McNair someplace else), the players (collectively) are still going to make the same amount of money.

I am not disagreeing with the system. Again, let me make my point.I am disagreeing the the perpetuated MYTH by the NFL Owners/GMs that a player should honor a contract because they signed it.

There have been numerous times where Coaches/GMs have said they expect a player to honor the contract. I do not think it is morally or even ethically right for someone to say that when they know damn well they would not honor the contract if they did not want to.

I am not speaking about the rules or the CBA. Strictly about the audacity to which a lot of owenrs/GM's/coaches preach about regarding how contracts are worked.

 

[psychobillies]

Let me repeat:

The Owners/GMs/Coaches out of one side of their mouth say "we signed a player to ABC contract, and we expect him to honor that". Then out of the other side of their mouth say "We cant handle this cap figure and will need to release you."

Contracts for players = bindingContracts for owners = non-binding

It's in the rules. Both the players and owners agreed to it. If the players didn't like it, they just had the chance to get rid of the system or at the least alter it. But they figured the current system with an $18 million increase in the salary cap per team outweighed sniping over the fine print.

I think what some people are not really grasping is that the players still get their fair share of money (in total) and that sometimes the seemingly overpaid veterans have to get cut and it looks bad and unfair for the players. Remember, if teams all spend close to the cap, the players collectively will still get over $3.2 billion this year.

Whether it goes to McNair or someone else (or even McNair someplace else), the players (collectively) are still going to make the same amount of money.

I am not disagreeing with the system. Again, let me make my point.I am disagreeing the the perpetuated MYTH by the NFL Owners/GMs that a player should honor a contract because they signed it.

There have been numerous times where Coaches/GMs have said they expect a player to honor the contract. I do not think it is morally or even ethically right for someone to say that when they know damn well they would not honor the contract if they did not want to.

I am not speaking about the rules or the CBA. Strictly about the audacity to which a lot of owenrs/GM's/coaches preach about regarding how contracts are worked.

I don't mean to keep jumping on your posts, but I think you have made your point very very clear. It's just that your point is off the mark and basically incorrect. GM's have the right and IMO the obligation to tell players they need to honor a contract because they took the bonus money. It's that simple. If they truly do not want to honor a contract they should step up and return at least a portion of the bonus to be released. Exactly what Lavar Arrington did this year.

 

[redman]

Let me repeat:

The Owners/GMs/Coaches out of one side of their mouth say "we signed a player to ABC contract, and we expect him to honor that". Then out of the other side of their mouth say "We cant handle this cap figure and will need to release you."

Contracts for players = bindingContracts for owners = non-binding

It's in the rules. Both the players and owners agreed to it. If the players didn't like it, they just had the chance to get rid of the system or at the least alter it. But they figured the current system with an $18 million increase in the salary cap per team outweighed sniping over the fine print.

I think what some people are not really grasping is that the players still get their fair share of money (in total) and that sometimes the seemingly overpaid veterans have to get cut and it looks bad and unfair for the players. Remember, if teams all spend close to the cap, the players collectively will still get over $3.2 billion this year.

Whether it goes to McNair or someone else (or even McNair someplace else), the players (collectively) are still going to make the same amount of money.

I am not disagreeing with the system. Again, let me make my point.I am disagreeing the the perpetuated MYTH by the NFL Owners/GMs that a player should honor a contract because they signed it.

There have been numerous times where Coaches/GMs have said they expect a player to honor the contract. I do not think it is morally or even ethically right for someone to say that when they know damn well they would not honor the contract if they did not want to.

I am not speaking about the rules or the CBA. Strictly about the audacity to which a lot of owenrs/GM's/coaches preach about regarding how contracts are worked.

I don't mean to keep jumping on your posts, but I think you have made your point very very clear. It's just that your point is off the mark and basically incorrect. GM's have the right and IMO the obligation to tell players they need to honor a contract because they took the bonus money. It's that simple. If they truly do not want to honor a contract they should step up and return at least a portion of the bonus to be released. Exactly what Lavar Arrington did this year.

Moreover, even to the extent that you disagree with this, it's all BS posturing anyway, and nobody does more of that than the agents do.

 

[JAA]

Let me repeat:

The Owners/GMs/Coaches out of one side of their mouth say "we signed a player to ABC contract, and we expect him to honor that". Then out of the other side of their mouth say "We cant handle this cap figure and will need to release you."

Contracts for players = bindingContracts for owners = non-binding

It's in the rules. Both the players and owners agreed to it. If the players didn't like it, they just had the chance to get rid of the system or at the least alter it. But they figured the current system with an $18 million increase in the salary cap per team outweighed sniping over the fine print.

I think what some people are not really grasping is that the players still get their fair share of money (in total) and that sometimes the seemingly overpaid veterans have to get cut and it looks bad and unfair for the players. Remember, if teams all spend close to the cap, the players collectively will still get over $3.2 billion this year.

Whether it goes to McNair or someone else (or even McNair someplace else), the players (collectively) are still going to make the same amount of money.

I am not disagreeing with the system. Again, let me make my point.I am disagreeing the the perpetuated MYTH by the NFL Owners/GMs that a player should honor a contract because they signed it.

There have been numerous times where Coaches/GMs have said they expect a player to honor the contract. I do not think it is morally or even ethically right for someone to say that when they know damn well they would not honor the contract if they did not want to.

I am not speaking about the rules or the CBA. Strictly about the audacity to which a lot of owenrs/GM's/coaches preach about regarding how contracts are worked.

I don't mean to keep jumping on your posts, but I think you have made your point very very clear. It's just that your point is off the mark and basically incorrect. GM's have the right and IMO the obligation to tell players they need to honor a contract because they took the bonus money. It's that simple. If they truly do not want to honor a contract they should step up and return at least a portion of the bonus to be released. Exactly what Lavar Arrington did this year.

I see what you are saying. I guess I am still unhappy with how the owners/coahces/gm's say it. They shouldnt say "honor contract", they should say we paid for the right for the contract".

 

[JAA]

Let me repeat:

The Owners/GMs/Coaches out of one side of their mouth say "we signed a player to ABC contract, and we expect him to honor that". Then out of the other side of their mouth say "We cant handle this cap figure and will need to release you."

Contracts for players = bindingContracts for owners = non-binding

It's in the rules. Both the players and owners agreed to it. If the players didn't like it, they just had the chance to get rid of the system or at the least alter it. But they figured the current system with an $18 million increase in the salary cap per team outweighed sniping over the fine print.

I think what some people are not really grasping is that the players still get their fair share of money (in total) and that sometimes the seemingly overpaid veterans have to get cut and it looks bad and unfair for the players. Remember, if teams all spend close to the cap, the players collectively will still get over $3.2 billion this year.

Whether it goes to McNair or someone else (or even McNair someplace else), the players (collectively) are still going to make the same amount of money.

I am not disagreeing with the system. Again, let me make my point.I am disagreeing the the perpetuated MYTH by the NFL Owners/GMs that a player should honor a contract because they signed it.

There have been numerous times where Coaches/GMs have said they expect a player to honor the contract. I do not think it is morally or even ethically right for someone to say that when they know damn well they would not honor the contract if they did not want to.

I am not speaking about the rules or the CBA. Strictly about the audacity to which a lot of owenrs/GM's/coaches preach about regarding how contracts are worked.

I don't mean to keep jumping on your posts, but I think you have made your point very very clear. It's just that your point is off the mark and basically incorrect. GM's have the right and IMO the obligation to tell players they need to honor a contract because they took the bonus money. It's that simple. If they truly do not want to honor a contract they should step up and return at least a portion of the bonus to be released. Exactly what Lavar Arrington did this year.

Moreover, even to the extent that you disagree with this, it's all BS posturing anyway, and nobody does more of that than the agents do.

I dont disagree at all. However, whenever a player or agent asks to renegotiate they are always put in a bad light. I dont think that should be the case.

 

[Crippler]

From McNair's perspective, the only thing that sucks is that the Titans have no reason to release him between now and the eve of the season opener. They paid him that $1 mill bonus, declining that 3 year, 50 mill deal, but they now have the entire summer to try and negotiate with him.

If they are nervous about paying him the 9 mill, they should cut him now, but there's no real financial rush to cut him now. I mean, in order to do the right thing by him, they should release him, but that would also be helping out another team, maybe even a team in their own conference.

Bus should maaybe take some blame here as well, because he should have forseen this possibility. That's why you write it in the contract that if they decline the extension, he is released from his deal, instead, he's left dangling.

I dont know about this. the Titans are 400, 000 under cap and need the room for rookies. I know teams are allocated a certain amount based on draft picks but when does that come into effect. The Titans will have to make a decision by probably July to sign there rookies at the worst. If it is when allocated, they need to cut him in May. I just dont know why they just dont cut him now if that is the intentions. I know this is a business but you have to think of your fans. Does it not cost teams money when they make PR blunders. Maybe dont sell out games with the Mcnair fiasco. Fans are a finicky group.

 

[-OZ-]

FWIW, may not be much, there's speculation that McNair could be traded for Ray Lewis.

Doesn't make sense in that TN is in a rebuilding phase, and would be best served getting picks, but it does in that Ray wants out, McNair is getting a raw deal here, TN needs a MLB, Balt needs a QB.

 

[msommer]

FWIW, may not be much, there's speculation that McNair could be traded for Ray Lewis.

Doesn't make sense in that TN is in a rebuilding phase, and would be best served getting picks, but it does in that Ray wants out, McNair is getting a raw deal here, TN needs a MLB, Balt needs a QB.

I'd hate to see Ray Lewis in a Titans jersey. That might just make me suspend my support until he (and Floyd Reese if it happens) is off the team.

 

[Mungo Burrows]

FWIW, may not be much, there's speculation that McNair could be traded for Ray Lewis.

Doesn't make sense in that TN is in a rebuilding phase, and would be best served getting picks, but it does in that Ray wants out, McNair is getting a raw deal here, TN needs a MLB, Balt needs a QB.

This could be a stroke of financial genius by Ozzie. Considering the huge percentage of fans whose Ravens Gear includes a #52 jersey, just think of all the purple #9's he could sell if Lewis were gone and McNair (or any QB other than Boller) came here.

 

[CalBear]

What are the cap implications if he's traded? Does the hit go to the team he's traded to, or to the Titans?

 

[massraider]

What are the cap implications if he's traded? Does the hit go to the team he's traded to, or to the Titans?

The 'hit' never goes to the team he's traded to.The new team is only on the hook for his base salary.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

LOL @ JAA and Big Score going into every contract thread around and still never understanding contracts even when they are explained time and again by lawyers.

Owners always honor contracts, always. They do not, however, always pick up all the options available to them under the terms of the contract as these options are...well...optional. That players and their agents try to create an expectation that these options will be exercised by always refering to the final optioned value of the contract as a done deal does not change this fact. If there is any unfairness to the player it is caused by their own ignorance counting on that which is still uncertain. That fans find this unfair merely is proof of their lack of understanding of option contracts.

 

[ravnzfan]

What are the cap implications if he's traded?  Does the hit go to the team he's traded to, or to the Titans?

The 'hit' never goes to the team he's traded to.The new team is only on the hook for his base salary.

raider...the "hit"(ie accelerated signing bonus) stays with the team that paid it---the team getting the player in trade assumes the contracted salary only, and is free to restructure the dealin this case, TENN is getting wacked for $14.5M accelerated signing bonus either way (by trade or cut)...the advantage the Ravens would have in a Lewis for McNair deal is that Mcnair is now their property, with no other team fighting them for his services

the problem in this senario is that this is EXACTLY what Ozzie was playing for all along---McNair getting cut

now that all the other seats have been filled in this QB-musical-chair mess, McNair could come here and start for starters $$$, while no other team would have the $$$ to compete w/the ravens for his services...

...which is why Lewis ISN'T going to TENN in this senario

Ray Lewis has a problem with Kyle Boller as the starting QB of "his" football team---McNair comes here and I'm thinking Ray-Ray will have a change of heart and play for the $5.5M he's under contract for this year, as he has a ton of respect for McNair the player

as far as TENN mgm't goes---someone should have buzzed McNair's agent prior to his arrival at the training facility

that little gem was in pretty poor taste