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Far-right militias regrouping around anti-vaccine conspiracy theories (1 Viewer)

dawgtrails said:
Yes, the far right militias failed in their attempt to stop certification. Let's hope they also fail as miserably at convincing others to not get the vaccine.
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I don't think this is the point.  I think these militia groups recognized a group of gullible, easily influenced people (COVID anti-vaxxers) and are targeting them not to "not get the vaccine" but rather to indoctrinate them into the militia.

 
tonydead said:
Yahoo is going to be thrilled to learn there are still a handful that fall for their clickbait articles.  
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I suppose. Just as breitbart and gatewaypundit are thrilled with their clickbait successes.

Just a reminder, the Yahoo clickbait you are refering to was actually a Business Insider article they posted on their website.

 
Ruffrodys05 said:
I suppose. Just as breitbart and gatewaypundit are thrilled with their clickbait successes.

Just a reminder, the Yahoo clickbait you are refering to was actually a Business Insider article they posted on their website.
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Insider <> Business Insider   :lmao:

OMG they have a lot of breaking news!

You guys eat this stuff up. 

 
Unfortunately I know some Republicans that I wouldn't consider "far right militia" that believe that Covid was a hoax and won't get vaccinated. 

I would say this belief is very prevalent in the GOP.

 
Godsbrother said:
Unfortunately I know some Republicans that I wouldn't consider "far right militia" that believe that Covid was a hoax and won't get vaccinated. 

I would say this belief is very prevalent in the GOP.
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Where do you guys live…seriously

 
Godsbrother said:
Unfortunately I know some Republicans that I wouldn't consider "far right militia" that believe that Covid was a hoax and won't get vaccinated. 

I would say this belief is very prevalent in the GOP.
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I know dems in my family that are "anti-vaccers"  Many blacks are refusing vaccines.  I guess it is a personal choice.

 
The General said:
Like a third of the adult US population isn't vaccinated. Of those people, say 10% have let's just say extreme and very uninformed views on the vaccine. That's a #### load of people.
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Your jumping from unvaccinated to thinking covid was a hoax?

eta…you’re just making numbers up with the 10%, and would be great to see actual demographics

 
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The General said:
Like a third of the adult US population isn't vaccinated. Of those people, say 10% have let's just say extreme and very uninformed views on the vaccine. That's a #### load of people.
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Having grown up in a rural part of a ruby red state, it's not necessarily extremism.  I'll grant you that I feel there are some uninformed views.  But in their opinion I'm too trusting of the government etc and I'm the one who is wrong.  After all, we are still talking about an emergency use vaccine with no long term trials.  I understand the scientific arguments and I chose to get the vaccine but that was my decision.

While I disagree with their choice, they aren't really extreme people.  Most just want to live their life, go to work, raise their kids, etc.  I think when it's framed on television as extreme views or extremist positions, it hardens the resolve of the already reluctant. It might make some extreme and hard line who really weren't at all because they feel attacked for their opinions on either a political or intellectual level.  As we know from the PSF whenever that happens, discussions generally go downhill.  It all goes back to what is the best way to try and convince those who have previously refused the vaccine.  You're never going to get 100%.  But you'd get a lot more if it came from doctors and clergy rather than the door to door plan that has been proposed.  At the very least in the more conservative rural areas.  These are the counties in our state that lag most on the vaccination percentages.  

 
Shula-holic said:
Having grown up in a rural part of a ruby red state, it's not necessarily extremism.  I'll grant you that I feel there are some uninformed views.  But in their opinion I'm too trusting of the government etc and I'm the one who is wrong.  After all, we are still talking about an emergency use vaccine with no long term trials.  I understand the scientific arguments and I chose to get the vaccine but that was my decision.

While I disagree with their choice, they aren't really extreme people.  Most just want to live their life, go to work, raise their kids, etc.  I think when it's framed on television as extreme views or extremist positions, it hardens the resolve of the already reluctant. It might make some extreme and hard line who really weren't at all because they feel attacked for their opinions on either a political or intellectual level.  As we know from the PSF whenever that happens, discussions generally go downhill.  It all goes back to what is the best way to try and convince those who have previously refused the vaccine.  You're never going to get 100%.  But you'd get a lot more if it came from doctors and clergy rather than the door to door plan that has been proposed.  At the very least in the more conservative rural areas.  These are the counties in our state that lag most on the vaccination percentages.  
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I’m not saying people who don’t get a vax are militia members. I’m not saying they are bad people.

It was asked where would you find someone who is saying covid is a hoax - these people are everywhere.

As far as choosing to not get vaxed if someone tells me they won’t get it and their reasoning is “they don’t trust the government” to me that is an extreme position and is uninformed. 

 
Shula-holic said:
Having grown up in a rural part of a ruby red state, it's not necessarily extremism.  I'll grant you that I feel there are some uninformed views.  But in their opinion I'm too trusting of the government etc and I'm the one who is wrong.  After all, we are still talking about an emergency use vaccine with no long term trials.  I understand the scientific arguments and I chose to get the vaccine but that was my decision.

While I disagree with their choice, they aren't really extreme people.  Most just want to live their life, go to work, raise their kids, etc.  I think when it's framed on television as extreme views or extremist positions, it hardens the resolve of the already reluctant. It might make some extreme and hard line who really weren't at all because they feel attacked for their opinions on either a political or intellectual level
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You just described my brother and some of my cousins. Like spooky spot on. They're great people. I worry about them of course.  I disagree with them but still respect their choice. I'm certainly not going to change their minds.

 
The General said:
I’m not saying people who don’t get a vax are militia members. I’m not saying they are bad people.

It was asked where would you find someone who is saying covid is a hoax - these people are everywhere.

As far as choosing to not get vaxed if someone tells me they won’t get it and their reasoning is “they don’t trust the government” to me that is an extreme position and is uninformed. 
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I understand.  But I'd ask you to keep in mind that VP Harris said herself that she wouldn't take the vaccine if it was recommended by the Trump administration.  The Trump administration at the time was the government, so she wasn't trusting of the government either.  She mentioned it would have to come from health professionals.  So when I make the case that pushing from the governmental side hurts the cause in red areas, this is in play because they view this as being pushed by the Biden administration.  We can parse the words carefully or split hairs, but it's pretty equivalent thinking.  I happen to think it's wrong in both cases as it pertains to this vaccine, but when I think extremes I don't think these are small slices of either political type who do/did feel that way.  It's more mainstream to have distrust of that other side in our present environment.

 
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Shula-holic said:
I understand.  But I'd ask you to keep in mind that VP Harris said herself that she wouldn't take the vaccine if it was recommended by the Trump administration.  The Trump administration at the time was the government, so she wasn't trusting of the government either.  She mentioned it would have to come from health professionals.  So when I make the case that pushing from the governmental side hurts the cause in red areas, this is in play because they view this as being pushed by the Biden administration.  We can parse the words carefully or split hairs, but it's pretty equivalent thinking.  I happen to think it's wrong in both cases as it pertains to this vaccine, but when I think extremes I don't think there were small slices of either political type who do/did feel that way.
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This was before a vaccine was out and much less known than where we are at today wouldn’t you say? I do agree that was not a good moment for her (Trump does seem to have a bit of trouble with facts and truth but not to get sidetracked).

Today the vaccine is being promoted by Republican officials, Democrats, Independents. But, more importantly the entire scientific and medical community.

If people don’t want to get it, have at it. I just don’t want to hear about. I certainly don’t want to hear that it’s a conspiracy or the government can’t be trusted I think these people are doing a disservice to their neighbors, to medical people who have to deal with their choice, to people they encounter who have no choice, etc.  

 
The General said:
This was before a vaccine was out and much less known than where we are at today wouldn’t you say? I do agree that was not a good moment for her (Trump does seem to have a bit of trouble with facts and truth but not to get sidetracked).

Today the vaccine is being promoted by Republican officials, Democrats, Independents. But, more importantly the entire scientific and medical community.

If people don’t want to get it, have at it. I just don’t want to hear about. I certainly don’t want to hear that it’s a conspiracy or the government can’t be trusted I think these people are doing a disservice to their neighbors, to medical people who have to deal with their choice, to people they encounter who have no choice, etc.  
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I would say so, but I'm also vaccinated.  My more overall point is I think it's worth trying to understand why a lot of what's in the media today drives the reluctant further toward being unmovable on the issue.  But when it comes to hearing about it, I'm ready to get on with living my life.  At this point if you get sick because you don't want to be vaccinated, well that's a risk you chose to take.  

 
Shula-holic said:
I would say so, but I'm also vaccinated.  My more overall point is I think it's worth trying to understand why a lot of what's in the media today drives the reluctant further toward being unmovable on the issue.  But when it comes to hearing about it, I'm ready to get on with living my life.  At this point if you get sick because you don't want to be vaccinated, well that's a risk you chose to take.  
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The government doing what they can to get people vaccinated is a good thing. This was the number one job for them after the vax became available, I’d think this isn’t controversial.

They have excelled at this. 

People choosing an irrational response to the government actually doing a decent job at this is certainly a problem.

I tend to agree that if you get sick without a vaccine, that’s a “you” problem. 

The issue I do have is that it is also an us problem as this keeps the virus around, variants develop, the vaxed can still get it, governments will be compelled to restrict if numbers were to go back up. 

 
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Shula-holic said:
I would say so, but I'm also vaccinated.  My more overall point is I think it's worth trying to understand why a lot of what's in the media today drives the reluctant further toward being unmovable on the issue.  But when it comes to hearing about it, I'm ready to get on with living my life.  At this point if you get sick because you don't want to be vaccinated, well that's a risk you chose to take.  
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Unfortunately, choosing not to get vaccinated has cascading ramifications for society as a whole.  See LA County.  

I agree people have the right to choose.  The concern is that they are arguably making an uninformed choice, based on dubious information.  

 
Shula-holic said:
I understand.  But I'd ask you to keep in mind that VP Harris said herself that she wouldn't take the vaccine if it was recommended by the Trump administration.  The Trump administration at the time was the government, so she wasn't trusting of the government either.  She mentioned it would have to come from health professionals.  So when I make the case that pushing from the governmental side hurts the cause in red areas, this is in play because they view this as being pushed by the Biden administration.  We can parse the words carefully or split hairs, but it's pretty equivalent thinking.  I happen to think it's wrong in both cases as it pertains to this vaccine, but when I think extremes I don't think these are small slices of either political type who do/did feel that way.  It's more mainstream to have distrust of that other side in our present environment.
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That's not what she said.  She did not reference the Trump administration or the government.  She referenced Donald Trump, specifically.

 
djmich said:
The General said:
Like a third of the adult US population isn't vaccinated. Of those people, say 10% have let's just say extreme and very uninformed views on the vaccine. That's a #### load of people.
Click to expand...
Your jumping from unvaccinated to thinking covid was a hoax?

eta…you’re just making numbers up with the 10%, and would be great to see actual demographics
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Hopefully KFF is a good enough source.  There are TONS of studies out there that say the same things as this one, but this is the most clean/concise one I've seen.

https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/poll-finding/kff-covid-19-vaccine-monitor-june-2021/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiosvitals&stream=top

 
djmich said:
Thx, I made the effort to skim and look…but is the % that think covid is a hoax in there?
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No.....sorry, I just saw your post and responded to what you asked.  I don't know how you'll get a number for that as "hoax" is subjective in this day and age so whatever poll/survey brought up will likely simply argue over what "hoax" means.  What I posted was a legit study that won't have that kind of stuff in it.  I did post a LONG while back (a month or two ago) in this thread a social survey done that had a large percentage in the "don't trust, it's not a big deal, is it even a thing" category.  Would that be "hoax" or are we simply talking about the amount of people who simply don't believe anything they see with regard to this virus and that everything is made up?  That later group is probably pretty small.  On par with the % of people that think the earth is flat or that GWB was the mastermind of 9/11.  That's my guess anyway.

 
Summer Wheat said:
The General said:
There are anti-vaxers in all groups but it certainly higher among people who identify themselves as Republican. 
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Is there data on that?  I know some are anti but not sure how people vote have anything to do with that.  
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After reading back to see what you guys were talking about @djmich it's probably more appropriate to attach the link I gave you to this line of questioning.  Sorry GB.

https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/poll-finding/kff-covid-19-vaccine-monitor-june-2021/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiosvitals&stream=top

 
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