Florida boy killed by Neighborhood Watch (1 Viewer)

[SacramentoBob]

White people are more racist, this is indisputable.

 

[The Commish]

Why are people trying so hard to deny that this whole story centers on race?

So it's not about a person getting shot and killed. That's not the story. It's because he was black? Probably one of the more racist things I've seen on these boards.

 

[Charlie Frown]

Excellent article by Waymon Hudson, LGBT rights activist:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/waymon-hudson/trayvon-martin-white-privilege_b_1401107.html

I've really struggled as a writer to talk about the tragic shooting of unarmed Florida teen Trayvon Martin by George Zimmerman, who has still not been arrested or even charged. While media discussions swirl about so many other issues, for me it boils down to a central point that, according to 911 calls, Trayvon Martin was viewed as "suspicious" by Zimmerman simply for being black. And that basic issue, the scary look at how race can dangerously shape perceptions with deadly results, is what has struck me to the core.

I had to stop reading here.More speculation without any facts.

I don't think this is speculation at all. Zimmerman thought Martin was suspicious, one of the reasons being that he looked like the perpetrators of prior break-ins in the neighborhood. Namely, he was a young, black male. About 60 pages ago, people were trying to show how finding Martin suspicious was justified for this reason. Zimmerman gave himself away with the 'these #######s always get away' comment. who are 'these #######s'? they are the young, black males who he almost caught previously during a break-in. If Martin was white, he's not suspicious and he's probably not dead right now. so while Z may not be a raging racist, this case does have an aspect of race to it.

I dunno. Judging by the 911 call I listened to Zimmerman wasn't even certain Martin was black.

 

[TexanFan02]

Excellent article by Waymon Hudson, LGBT rights activist:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/waymon-hudson/trayvon-martin-white-privilege_b_1401107.html

I've really struggled as a writer to talk about the tragic shooting of unarmed Florida teen Trayvon Martin by George Zimmerman, who has still not been arrested or even charged. While media discussions swirl about so many other issues, for me it boils down to a central point that, according to 911 calls, Trayvon Martin was viewed as "suspicious" by Zimmerman simply for being black. And that basic issue, the scary look at how race can dangerously shape perceptions with deadly results, is what has struck me to the core.

I had to stop reading here.More speculation without any facts.

I don't think this is speculation at all. Zimmerman thought Martin was suspicious, one of the reasons being that he looked like the perpetrators of prior break-ins in the neighborhood. Namely, he was a young, black male. About 60 pages ago, people were trying to show how finding Martin suspicious was justified for this reason. Zimmerman gave himself away with the 'these #######s always get away' comment. who are 'these #######s'? they are the young, black males who he almost caught previously during a break-in. If Martin was white, he's not suspicious and he's probably not dead right now. so while Z may not be a raging racist, this case does have an aspect of race to it.

I dunno. Judging by the 911 call I listened to Zimmerman wasn't even certain Martin was black.

Really? Did you miss the part where he said "he's black"?

 

[Clinton]

Shelby Steele: The Exploitation of Trayvon Martin

And this points to the second tragedy that Trayvon's sad demise highlights. Before the 1960s the black American identity (though no one ever used the word) was based on our common humanity, on the idea that race was always an artificial and exploitive division between people. After the '60s—in a society guilty for its long abuse of us—we took our historical victimization as the central theme of our group identity. We could not have made a worse mistake.

It has given us a generation of ambulance-chasing leaders, and the illusion that our greatest power lies in the manipulation of white guilt. The tragedy surrounding Trayvon's death is not in the possibility that it might have something to do with white racism; the tragedy is in the lustfulness with which so many black leaders, in conjunction with the media, have leapt to exploit his demise for their own power.

We need more black leadrs like this, and fewer Jackson's and Sharpton's. Outstanding piece.

I think the tragedy is that a 17 year old is dead. Both sides are wrong in focusing on the race issue.

Your moral equivalence is wrong, and that's the point of the article. One side is trying to make it a race issue, the other side is defending themselves from the accusation. But for the original accusation, the other side would not have to defend on racial grounds.I also think it's unfair to describe Steele as a black leader. He's biracial (half black-half white), and it's that combination that gives him a unique perspective on both sides of the issue.

Classic, coming from you.

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

It's classic Clinton because you bring race into every discussion you participate in. You are every bit as bad as the media in this case. Besides, there's already a separate thread on race for this incident. Please go there and talk about what a problem you think black people are in today's society.

It's obvious, TexasFan, that you're either not intelligent enough or too immature to understand the "But for..." standard.But for the likes of Sharpton and Jackson making the Trayvon Martin matter a racial issue, Shelby Steele and others would not have to interject race in defense.

But for TexasFan and others like him constable suggesting whites are most racist, I wouldn't have to constantly cite statisticts showing otherwise.

I understand that cause-and-effect is a difficult concept for those just starting out, but it's the basis of these arguments that you'll later come to understand.

I've never said this case was about race. You haven't ever talked about anything else. In fact, that's been your only input in the thread. I don't think I'm the one with a problem.

Perhaps not on the highlighted, but you've certainly done you're best to try to discredit those who defend against others racial accusations.Despite me saying numerous times in this thread that Zimmerman likely found Martin suspicious specifically because he's black (and I was one of the few who was emphatic that Santorum dropped anN-bomb) you've attacked me on other racial issues. Your inconsistency reflects your discomfort with this issue. You, to me, are nothing more than a petulant child who won't let truth interfere with their narrative. Sorry if that truth offends you.

 

[TexanFan02]

Shelby Steele: The Exploitation of Trayvon Martin

And this points to the second tragedy that Trayvon's sad demise highlights. Before the 1960s the black American identity (though no one ever used the word) was based on our common humanity, on the idea that race was always an artificial and exploitive division between people. After the '60s—in a society guilty for its long abuse of us—we took our historical victimization as the central theme of our group identity. We could not have made a worse mistake.

It has given us a generation of ambulance-chasing leaders, and the illusion that our greatest power lies in the manipulation of white guilt. The tragedy surrounding Trayvon's death is not in the possibility that it might have something to do with white racism; the tragedy is in the lustfulness with which so many black leaders, in conjunction with the media, have leapt to exploit his demise for their own power.

We need more black leadrs like this, and fewer Jackson's and Sharpton's. Outstanding piece.

I think the tragedy is that a 17 year old is dead. Both sides are wrong in focusing on the race issue.

Your moral equivalence is wrong, and that's the point of the article. One side is trying to make it a race issue, the other side is defending themselves from the accusation. But for the original accusation, the other side would not have to defend on racial grounds.I also think it's unfair to describe Steele as a black leader. He's biracial (half black-half white), and it's that combination that gives him a unique perspective on both sides of the issue.

Classic, coming from you.

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

It's classic Clinton because you bring race into every discussion you participate in. You are every bit as bad as the media in this case. Besides, there's already a separate thread on race for this incident. Please go there and talk about what a problem you think black people are in today's society.

It's obvious, TexasFan, that you're either not intelligent enough or too immature to understand the "But for..." standard.But for the likes of Sharpton and Jackson making the Trayvon Martin matter a racial issue, Shelby Steele and others would not have to interject race in defense.

But for TexasFan and others like him constable suggesting whites are most racist, I wouldn't have to constantly cite statisticts showing otherwise.

I understand that cause-and-effect is a difficult concept for those just starting out, but it's the basis of these arguments that you'll later come to understand.

I've never said this case was about race. You haven't ever talked about anything else. In fact, that's been your only input in the thread. I don't think I'm the one with a problem.

Perhaps not on the highlighted, but you've certainly done you're best to try to discredit those who defend against others racial accusations.Despite me saying numerous times in this thread that Zimmerman likely found Martin suspicious specifically because he's black (and I was one of the few who was emphatic that Santorum dropped anN-bomb) you've attacked me on other racial issues. Your inconsistency reflects your discomfort with this issue. You, to me, are nothing more than a petulant child who won't let truth interfere with their narrative. Sorry if that truth offends you.

I don't really care what you think about me. And I don't feel the need to resort to insults. I feel kind of sorry for you.

 

[Schlzm]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

Pure speculation Tim. If a black man had shot a hispanic man with the exact same details how would any of us know what the result would be?

I think that the number of blacks who are arrested every year back up this speculation. I think that it's a quite reasonable speculation, given how ill-treated black people are by police in our society.

And you are wrong in thinking that.http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=datool&surl=/arrests/index.cfm#

Schlzm

Why is he wrong in thinking that?

He has insinuated (if not stated) that black people are disproportionately singled out for arrest when compared to white people. The numbers prove otherwise.Schlzm

Really? The numbers I just looked up say that black people make up 13% of the population but about 30% of arrests. Is that what yours say?

The numbers I am looking at tell me that white people were arrested more than twice as many times than black people in 2009, 9.5mm vs. 3.8mm for total offenses. I wasn't looking for specific percentage points, however these are going to be wildly skewed by which population center you wish to look at and could be used to support any argument about who is more likely to be arrested.Schlzm

 

[TexanFan02]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

Pure speculation Tim. If a black man had shot a hispanic man with the exact same details how would any of us know what the result would be?

I think that the number of blacks who are arrested every year back up this speculation. I think that it's a quite reasonable speculation, given how ill-treated black people are by police in our society.

And you are wrong in thinking that.http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=datool&surl=/arrests/index.cfm#

Schlzm

Why is he wrong in thinking that?

He has insinuated (if not stated) that black people are disproportionately singled out for arrest when compared to white people. The numbers prove otherwise.Schlzm

Really? The numbers I just looked up say that black people make up 13% of the population but about 30% of arrests. Is that what yours say?

The numbers I am looking at tell me that white people were arrested more than twice as many times than black people in 2009, 9.5mm vs. 3.8mm for total offenses. I wasn't looking for specific percentage points, however these are going to be wildly skewed by which population center you wish to look at and could be used to support any argument about who is more likely to be arrested.Schlzm

You need to do the rate chart, not the count. There are more white people than black, so more whites are arrested. But blacks are arrested at a higher rate.

 

[fatness]

Joe Oliver, George Zimmerman's 'friend', no longer his media advisor

Looks like he didn't get the gig he was after.

NBC News confirmed that Oliver has removed himself from Zimmerman's team now that Sonner has hired co-counsel Hal Uhrig, who was a television legal analyst with an Orlando Fox affiliate during the Casey Anthony murder trial.

"My whole intention from the beginning was to help George with the media," Oliver told theGrio, claiming his many television appearances began with a mere coincidence. "It just so happened that when I finally got in touch with Craig" to offer his services, on the day of their initial meeting just over a week ago, "ABC News was already there to interview Craig."

Oliver said he stepped forward to join the team because in his words, Sonner was inexperienced in dealing with the media, and Oliver, a former news anchor with NBC affiliate WESH in Orlando, who also worked for CNN, "was aware of what the media storm that was brewing was going to be like, having had 20 plus years experience both local and network. As a friend, acquaintance -- however you or anybody else wants to define it -- it was my obligation to offer my expertise to his counsel in dealing with the media."

Probably just as well.

Last week, Zimmerman’s lawyer trotted out Joe Oliver, the “black friend” and former co-worker of George Zimmerman, who did the rounds on television talk shows and news programs and defended Zimmerman. Unfortunately for Zimmerman, Oliver did him no favors, as this video clip shows. Oliver didn’t seem to know Zimmerman very well and didn’t know that Zimmerman’s ex-fiancee had filed assault charges against him. He stumbled on questions about the anger management counseling Zimmerman allegedly underwent.

link

 

[Carolina Hustler]

People carry guns all over the united states..

Who said they didn't?

They come into, and go out of your life all of the time..

I've never had a stranger do this. I must be lucky. Either that or you have an incredibly disingenuous definition of "come into, and go out of"

You run into people at the gas station, grocery store, on the road, anywhere in public really, that carry guns all the time. Some you don't know are carrying, some you do. You may speak to them, or just stand in line with them. You may be tail gated by one.. Or you might cut one off.. For that brief moment, they are part of your life.. If you decided to take issue with something one of these people did or said, and that develops into a confrontation, then you'd be in a similar situation..

If you jump on one of those guys and start beating the #### out of him, you better believe he's going to use it..

I'd hope so.Now....what does ANY of this have to do with what I posted?

Zimmerman came into Trayvons life, No proof as of yet that he did anything against the law, or outside of "neighborhood watch guidelines".. There is a possibility that while Zimmerman may have been well within his rights to do what he was doing, that Trayvon took exception to it and decided to make it a physical altercation.

 

[GDogg]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

Pure speculation Tim. If a black man had shot a hispanic man with the exact same details how would any of us know what the result would be?

I think that the number of blacks who are arrested every year back up this speculation. I think that it's a quite reasonable speculation, given how ill-treated black people are by police in our society.

And you are wrong in thinking that.http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=datool&surl=/arrests/index.cfm#

Schlzm

Why is he wrong in thinking that?

He has insinuated (if not stated) that black people are disproportionately singled out for arrest when compared to white people. The numbers prove otherwise.Schlzm

Really? The numbers I just looked up say that black people make up 13% of the population but about 30% of arrests. Is that what yours say?

The numbers I am looking at tell me that white people were arrested more than twice as many times than black people in 2009, 9.5mm vs. 3.8mm for total offenses. I wasn't looking for specific percentage points, however these are going to be wildly skewed by which population center you wish to look at and could be used to support any argument about who is more likely to be arrested.Schlzm

I could be wrong but isn't knowing the percentage of the total population the only way to know whether the arrests are proportional? What proportions are you taking about if not the population? There are more than five times as many white people in the united states as black people.

 

[Clinton]

We need more black leadrs like this, and fewer Jackson's and Sharpton's. Outstanding piece.

I think the tragedy is that a 17 year old is dead. Both sides are wrong in focusing on the race issue.

Your moral equivalence is wrong, and that's the point of the article. One side is trying to make it a race issue, the other side is defending themselves from the accusation. But for the original accusation, the other side would not have to defend on racial grounds.I also think it's unfair to describe Steele as a black leader. He's biracial (half black-half white), and it's that combination that gives him a unique perspective on both sides of the issue.

Classic, coming from you.

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

It's classic Clinton because you bring race into every discussion you participate in. You are every bit as bad as the media in this case. Besides, there's already a separate thread on race for this incident. Please go there and talk about what a problem you think black people are in today's society.

It's obvious, TexasFan, that you're either not intelligent enough or too immature to understand the "But for..." standard.But for the likes of Sharpton and Jackson making the Trayvon Martin matter a racial issue, Shelby Steele and others would not have to interject race in defense.

But for TexasFan and others like him constable suggesting whites are most racist, I wouldn't have to constantly cite statisticts showing otherwise.

I understand that cause-and-effect is a difficult concept for those just starting out, but it's the basis of these arguments that you'll later come to understand.

I've never said this case was about race. You haven't ever talked about anything else. In fact, that's been your only input in the thread. I don't think I'm the one with a problem.

Perhaps not on the highlighted, but you've certainly done you're best to try to discredit those who defend against others racial accusations.Despite me saying numerous times in this thread that Zimmerman likely found Martin suspicious specifically because he's black (and I was one of the few who was emphatic that Santorum dropped anN-bomb) you've attacked me on other racial issues. Your inconsistency reflects your discomfort with this issue. You, to me, are nothing more than a petulant child who won't let truth interfere with their narrative. Sorry if that truth offends you.

I don't really care what you think about me. And I don't feel the need to resort to insults. I feel kind of sorry for you.

Really? You don't feel the need to start personal attacks even though you are the one who started them.You really are too dumb to understand the Supreme Court's "But for" test. I never attacked you, ever, until you posted a comment suggesting I wanted a return to slavery. But I can't defend myself from your unsubstantiated attack without it being equal?

Of course, since you are so biased and immature you won't admit that I'm responding to your personal attack, but I am.

 

[fatness]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

 

[fatness]

Zimmerman came into Trayvons life

 

[Schlzm]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

Pure speculation Tim. If a black man had shot a hispanic man with the exact same details how would any of us know what the result would be?

I think that the number of blacks who are arrested every year back up this speculation. I think that it's a quite reasonable speculation, given how ill-treated black people are by police in our society.

And you are wrong in thinking that.http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=datool&surl=/arrests/index.cfm#

Schlzm

Why is he wrong in thinking that?

He has insinuated (if not stated) that black people are disproportionately singled out for arrest when compared to white people. The numbers prove otherwise.Schlzm

Really? The numbers I just looked up say that black people make up 13% of the population but about 30% of arrests. Is that what yours say?

The numbers I am looking at tell me that white people were arrested more than twice as many times than black people in 2009, 9.5mm vs. 3.8mm for total offenses. I wasn't looking for specific percentage points, however these are going to be wildly skewed by which population center you wish to look at and could be used to support any argument about who is more likely to be arrested.Schlzm

I could be wrong but isn't knowing the percentage of the total population the only way to know whether the arrests are proportional? What proportions are you taking about if not the population? There are more than five times as many white people in the united states as black people.

I did a little more digging beyond the raw numbers and looked at Sanford specifically and you and Tim are correct that arrest vs. population is disproportionate. I'll retract my earlier statement.Schlzm

 

[Clinton]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how the PC piers that be want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than whites

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Shelby Steele: The Exploitation of Trayvon Martin

The absurdity of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton is that they want to make a movement out of an anomaly. Black teenagers today are afraid of other black teenagers, not whites.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303302504577323691134926300.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_LEADTop

Two tragedies are apparent in the Trayvon Martin case. The first is obvious: A teenager—unarmed and committing no crime—was shot dead. Dressed in a "hoodie," a costume of menace, he crossed paths with a man on the hunt for precisely such clichés of menace. Added to this—and here is the rub—was the fact of his dark skin.

Maybe it was more the hood than the dark skin, but who could argue that the skin did not enhance the menace of the hood at night and in the eyes of someone watching for crime. (Fifty-five percent of all federal prisoners are black though we are only 12% of the population.) Would Trayvon be alive today had he been walking home—Skittles and ice tea in hand—wearing a polo shirt with an alligator logo? Possibly. And does this make the ugly point that dark skin late at night needs to have its menace softened by some show of Waspy Americana? Possibly.

What is fundamentally tragic here is that these two young males first encountered each other as provocations. Males are males, and threat often evokes a narcissistic anger that skips right past reason and into a will to annihilate: "I will take you out!" There was a terrible fight. Trayvon apparently got the drop on George Zimmerman, but ultimately the man with the gun prevailed. Annihilation was achieved.

If this was all there was to it, the Trayvon/Zimmerman story would be no more than a cautionary tale, yet another admonition against the hair-trigger male ego. But this story brought reaction from the White House: "If I had a son he would look like Trayvon," said the president. The Revs. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, ubiquitous icons of black protest, virtually battled each other to stand at the bereaved family's side—Mr. Jackson, in a moment of inadvertent honesty, saying, "There is power in blood . . . we must turn a moment into a movement." And then there was the spectacle of black Democrats in Congress holding hearings on racial profiling with Trayvon's parents featured as celebrities.

In fact Trayvon's sad fate clearly sent a quiver of perverse happiness all across America's civil rights establishment, and throughout the mainstream media as well. His death was vindication of the "poetic truth" that these establishments live by. Poetic truth is like poetic license where one breaks grammatical rules for effect. Better to break the rule than lose the effect. Poetic truth lies just a little; it bends the actual truth in order to highlight what it believes is a larger and more important truth.

The civil rights community and the liberal media live by the poetic truth that America is still a reflexively racist society, and that this remains the great barrier to black equality. But this "truth" has a lot of lie in it. America has greatly evolved since the 1960s. There are no longer any respectable advocates of racial segregation. And blacks today are nine times more likely to be killed by other blacks than by whites.

If Trayvon Martin was a victim of white racism (hard to conceive since the shooter is apparently Hispanic), his murder would be an anomaly, not a commonplace. It would be a bizarre exception to the way so many young black males are murdered today. If there must be a generalization in all this—a call "to turn the moment into a movement"— it would have to be a movement against blacks who kill other blacks. The absurdity of Messrs. Jackson and Sharpton is that they want to make a movement out of an anomaly. Black teenagers today are afraid of other black teenagers, not whites.

So the idea that Trayvon Martin is today's Emmett Till, as the Rev. Jackson has said, suggests nothing less than a stubborn nostalgia for America's racist past. In that bygone era civil rights leaders and white liberals stood on the highest moral ground. They literally knew themselves—given their genuine longing to see racism overcome—as historically transformative people. If the world resisted them, as it surely did, it only made them larger than life.

It was a time when standing on the side of the good required true selflessness and so it ennobled people. And this chance to ennoble oneself through a courageous moral stand is what so many blacks and white liberals miss today—now that white racism is such a defeated idea. There is a nostalgia for that time when posture alone ennobled. So today even the hint of old-fashioned raw racism excites with its potential for ennoblement.

For the Revs. Jackson and Sharpton, for the increasingly redundant civil rights establishment, for liberal blacks and the broader American left, the poetic truth that white racism is somehow the real culprit in this tragedy is redemption itself. The reason Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson have become such disreputable figures on our cultural landscape is that they are such quick purveyors of poetic truth rather than literal truth.

The great trick of poetic truth is to pass itself off as the deep and essential truth so that hard facts that refute it must be dismissed in the name of truth. O.J. Simpson was innocent by the poetic truth that the justice system is stacked against blacks. Trayvon was a victim of racist stereotyping—though the shooter never mentioned his race until asked to do so.

There is now a long litany of racial dust-ups—from Tawana Brawley to the Duke University lacrosse players to the white Cambridge police officer who arrested Harvard professor Skip Gates a summer ago—in which the poetic truth of white racism and black victimization is invoked so that the actual truth becomes dismissible as yet more racism.

When the Cambridge cop or the Duke lacrosse players or the men accused of raping Tawana Brawley tried to defend themselves, they were already so stained by poetic truth as to never be entirely redeemed. No matter the facts—whether Trayvon Martin was his victim or his assailant—George Zimmerman will also never be entirely redeemed.

And this points to the second tragedy that Trayvon's sad demise highlights. Before the 1960s the black American identity (though no one ever used the word) was based on our common humanity, on the idea that race was always an artificial and exploitive division between people. After the '60s—in a society guilty for its long abuse of us—we took our historical victimization as the central theme of our group identity. We could not have made a worse mistake.

It has given us a generation of ambulance-chasing leaders, and the illusion that our greatest power lies in the manipulation of white guilt. The tragedy surrounding Trayvon's death is not in the possibility that it might have something to do with white racism; the tragedy is in the lustfulness with which so many black leaders, in conjunction with the media, have leapt to exploit his demise for their own power.

Great article

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Shelby Steele: The Exploitation of Trayvon Martin

And this points to the second tragedy that Trayvon's sad demise highlights. Before the 1960s the black American identity (though no one ever used the word) was based on our common humanity, on the idea that race was always an artificial and exploitive division between people. After the '60s—in a society guilty for its long abuse of us—we took our historical victimization as the central theme of our group identity. We could not have made a worse mistake.

It has given us a generation of ambulance-chasing leaders, and the illusion that our greatest power lies in the manipulation of white guilt. The tragedy surrounding Trayvon's death is not in the possibility that it might have something to do with white racism; the tragedy is in the lustfulness with which so many black leaders, in conjunction with the media, have leapt to exploit his demise for their own power.

We need more black leadrs like this, and fewer Jackson's and Sharpton's. Outstanding piece.

I think the tragedy is that a 17 year old is dead. Both sides are wrong in focusing on the race issue.

I can agree with you on this point..

 

[Carolina Hustler]

I saw a man with a tee shirt on yesterday. "If I had a son....He'd shoot like George Zimmerman." Some people just don't give a ####. It's sad.

Yikes...Insanity on display..

 

[Clinton]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how all PCers want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than white

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial. Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

I think if this were some young white thug, shot by a black neighborhood watch captian, with all the same evidence, story, and witnesses in place, the out come would have been the same.. I think you are wrong..

 

[Carolina Hustler]

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/cnn-enhances-zimmerman-911-call-again-and-reporter-now-doubts-racial-slur-used/

Wow... there goes one more piece of Tim's argument.. The racial argument is being shot full of holes this week..

 

[glock]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

I think if this were some young white thug 17 year old, shot by a black neighborhood watch captian, with all the same evidence, story, and witnesses in place, the out come would have been the same.. I think you are wrong..

Say what?

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Excellent article by Waymon Hudson, LGBT rights activist:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/waymon-hudson/trayvon-martin-white-privilege_b_1401107.html

I've really struggled as a writer to talk about the tragic shooting of unarmed Florida teen Trayvon Martin by George Zimmerman, who has still not been arrested or even charged. While media discussions swirl about so many other issues, for me it boils down to a central point that, according to 911 calls, Trayvon Martin was viewed as "suspicious" by Zimmerman simply for being black. And that basic issue, the scary look at how race can dangerously shape perceptions with deadly results, is what has struck me to the core.

I had to stop reading here.More speculation without any facts.

I don't think this is speculation at all. Zimmerman thought Martin was suspicious, one of the reasons being that he looked like the perpetrators of prior break-ins in the neighborhood. Namely, he was a young, black male. About 60 pages ago, people were trying to show how finding Martin suspicious was justified for this reason. Zimmerman gave himself away with the 'these #######s always get away' comment. who are 'these #######s'? they are the young, black males who he almost caught previously during a break-in. If Martin was white, he's not suspicious and he's probably not dead right now. so while Z may not be a raging racist, this case does have an aspect of race to it.

"These #######s" = criminals, thieves, etc.. How you can attribute that statement to meaning Blacks is beyond me.. It was shown in the "hey look Zimmerman calls 911 to much" series of posts, that he wasn't only calling in on Blacks, he also called in on Hispanics and whites..

You guys are trying way to hard to make this thing about race.. Why?

 

[The Commish]

People carry guns all over the united states..

Who said they didn't?

They come into, and go out of your life all of the time..

I've never had a stranger do this. I must be lucky. Either that or you have an incredibly disingenuous definition of "come into, and go out of"

You run into people at the gas station, grocery store, on the road, anywhere in public really, that carry guns all the time. Some you don't know are carrying, some you do. You may speak to them, or just stand in line with them. You may be tail gated by one.. Or you might cut one off.. For that brief moment, they are part of your life.. If you decided to take issue with something one of these people did or said, and that develops into a confrontation, then you'd be in a similar situation..

If you jump on one of those guys and start beating the #### out of him, you better believe he's going to use it..

I'd hope so.Now....what does ANY of this have to do with what I posted?

Zimmerman came into Trayvons life, No proof as of yet that he did anything against the law, or outside of "neighborhood watch guidelines".. There is a possibility that while Zimmerman may have been well within his rights to do what he was doing, that Trayvon took exception to it and decided to make it a physical altercation.

You could have simply said "yes" to using an incredibly disingenuous definition of "come into, and go out of" especially given the discussion.ETA: There are lots of ways this could have gone down. Coming up with a way then presenting it as fact (as if you know what happened) is foolish IMO. None of what you posted had anything to do with what I posted.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

Pure speculation Tim. If a black man had shot a hispanic man with the exact same details how would any of us know what the result would be?

I think that the number of blacks who are arrested every year back up this speculation. I think that it's a quite reasonable speculation, given how ill-treated black people are by police in our society.

And you are wrong in thinking that.http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=datool&surl=/arrests/index.cfm#

Schlzm

Why is he wrong in thinking that?

He has insinuated (if not stated) that black people are disproportionately singled out for arrest when compared to white people. The numbers prove otherwise.Schlzm

Really? The numbers I just looked up say that black people make up 13% of the population but about 30% of arrests. Is that what yours say?

That's not because police single out Black people, it's because black people make up a larger percentage of this countries impoverished population..

 

[Carolina Hustler]

White people are more racist, this is indisputable.

Apparently not..

 

[glock]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

I think if this were some young white thug 17 year old, shot by a black neighborhood watch captian, with all the same evidence, story, and witnesses in place, the out come would have been the same.. I think you are wrong..

Say what?

Freudian slip there, Carolina?

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Excellent article by Waymon Hudson, LGBT rights activist:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/waymon-hudson/trayvon-martin-white-privilege_b_1401107.html

I've really struggled as a writer to talk about the tragic shooting of unarmed Florida teen Trayvon Martin by George Zimmerman, who has still not been arrested or even charged. While media discussions swirl about so many other issues, for me it boils down to a central point that, according to 911 calls, Trayvon Martin was viewed as "suspicious" by Zimmerman simply for being black. And that basic issue, the scary look at how race can dangerously shape perceptions with deadly results, is what has struck me to the core.

I had to stop reading here.More speculation without any facts.

I don't think this is speculation at all. Zimmerman thought Martin was suspicious, one of the reasons being that he looked like the perpetrators of prior break-ins in the neighborhood. Namely, he was a young, black male. About 60 pages ago, people were trying to show how finding Martin suspicious was justified for this reason. Zimmerman gave himself away with the 'these #######s always get away' comment. who are 'these #######s'? they are the young, black males who he almost caught previously during a break-in. If Martin was white, he's not suspicious and he's probably not dead right now. so while Z may not be a raging racist, this case does have an aspect of race to it.

I dunno. Judging by the 911 call I listened to Zimmerman wasn't even certain Martin was black.

Really? Did you miss the part where he said "he's black"?

He mentioned race twice, the first time it seemed he was unsure. Remember, it was dark, and raining.. Tray also had a hood on.. It is plausible that Zimmerman didn't know until getting a better look..

 

[parasaurolophus]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial. Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

There are two questions that you would have to answer conclusively before your point becomes valid.Can you prove that Trayvon was not wandering about in between houses and looking at things?Can you prove that white people in the gated community have done the same things and Zimmerman ignored them?Seems to me the guy called about potholes before and I don’t think it was because the asphalt was black.

 

[GDogg]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how the PC piers that be want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than whites

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

That does not say that blacks commit most hate crimes.

 

[GDogg]

Excellent article by Waymon Hudson, LGBT rights activist:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/waymon-hudson/trayvon-martin-white-privilege_b_1401107.html

I've really struggled as a writer to talk about the tragic shooting of unarmed Florida teen Trayvon Martin by George Zimmerman, who has still not been arrested or even charged. While media discussions swirl about so many other issues, for me it boils down to a central point that, according to 911 calls, Trayvon Martin was viewed as "suspicious" by Zimmerman simply for being black. And that basic issue, the scary look at how race can dangerously shape perceptions with deadly results, is what has struck me to the core.

I had to stop reading here.More speculation without any facts.

I don't think this is speculation at all. Zimmerman thought Martin was suspicious, one of the reasons being that he looked like the perpetrators of prior break-ins in the neighborhood. Namely, he was a young, black male. About 60 pages ago, people were trying to show how finding Martin suspicious was justified for this reason. Zimmerman gave himself away with the 'these #######s always get away' comment. who are 'these #######s'? they are the young, black males who he almost caught previously during a break-in. If Martin was white, he's not suspicious and he's probably not dead right now. so while Z may not be a raging racist, this case does have an aspect of race to it.

"These #######s" = criminals, thieves, etc.. How you can attribute that statement to meaning Blacks is beyond me.. It was shown in the "hey look Zimmerman calls 911 to much" series of posts, that he wasn't only calling in on Blacks, he also called in on Hispanics and whites..

You guys are trying way to hard to make this thing about race.. Why?

I can't speak for everyone else, but for me, it's because I hate white people.

 

[GDogg]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

Pure speculation Tim. If a black man had shot a hispanic man with the exact same details how would any of us know what the result would be?

I think that the number of blacks who are arrested every year back up this speculation. I think that it's a quite reasonable speculation, given how ill-treated black people are by police in our society.

And you are wrong in thinking that.http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=datool&surl=/arrests/index.cfm#

Schlzm

Why is he wrong in thinking that?

He has insinuated (if not stated) that black people are disproportionately singled out for arrest when compared to white people. The numbers prove otherwise.Schlzm

Really? The numbers I just looked up say that black people make up 13% of the population but about 30% of arrests. Is that what yours say?

That's not because police single out Black people, it's because black people make up a larger percentage of this countries impoverished population..

Is that right? Then why did the lapd just release the results of an investigation finding that blacks had been racial profiled in traffic stops?Since you've found THE reason why blacks are arrested at a disproportional rate, you should write a scholarly article on the subject. It would be a big hit.

 

[Clinton]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how the PC piers that be want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than whites

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

That does not say that blacks commit most hate crimes.

"Most"? No.But if you're honest and truthful about statistics rather than trying to fit them I to your narrative you see that percentage-wise, black people do commit more hate crimes.

Were you hoping that percentage-wise white people commit more hate crimes?

 

[GDogg]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how the PC piers that be want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than whites

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

That does not say that blacks commit most hate crimes.

"Most"? No.But if you're honest and truthful about statistics rather than trying to fit them I to your narrative you see that percentage-wise, black people do commit more hate crimes.

Were you hoping that percentage-wise white people commit more hate crimes?

Just did the math. Nope. White people still commit a higher percentage of hate crimes. I'm not hoping for anything. I'm just trying to help you with reading comp and clarify your false statements based off your incorrect reading of statistics and words.I think what you are trying to say us that, statistically, individual black people are disproportionately more likely to commit hate crimes than white purple, but that most hate crimes, by far, are committed by white people.

 

[squistion]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how the PC piers that be want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than whites

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

That does not say that blacks commit most hate crimes.

"Most"? No.But if you're honest and truthful about statistics rather than trying to fit them I to your narrative you see that percentage-wise, black people do commit more hate crimes.

Were you hoping that percentage-wise white people commit more hate crimes?

Just did the math. Nope. White people still commit a higher percentage of hate crimes. I'm not hoping for anything. I'm just trying to help you with reading comp and clarify your false statements based off your incorrect reading of statistics and words.I think what you are trying to say us that, statistically, individual black people are disproportionately more likely to commit hate crimes than white purple, but that most hate crimes, by far, are committed by white people.

Exactly. If 62% of all hate crimes are committed by white people, then percentage wise they do commit more hate crimes. If only 38% are committed by non-whites then one can't say that blacks commit most hate crimes. Saying a higher percentage of a certain race commits a hate crime is not the same as saying most hate crimes are committed by that race. Bottom line - statistically if one is the victim of a hate crime the percentages are that the perpetrator was white.

 

[Clinton]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how the PC piers that be want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than whites

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

That does not say that blacks commit most hate crimes.

"Most"? No.But if you're honest and truthful about statistics rather than trying to fit them I to your narrative you see that percentage-wise, black people do commit more hate crimes.

Were you hoping that percentage-wise white people commit more hate crimes?

Just did the math. Nope. White people still commit a higher percentage of hate crimes. I'm not hoping for anything. I'm just trying to help you with reading comp and clarify your false statements based off your incorrect reading of statistics and words.I think what you are trying to say us that, statistically, individual black people are disproportionately more likely to commit hate crimes than white purple, but that most hate crimes, by far, are committed by white people.

You did underatnd that your inability to admit facts is clouded by the facts that "white" in FBI statistics include Rabas and Hispanics, right?Of the nearly 770,000 violent interracial crimes committed every year involving

blacks and whites, blacks commit 85 percent and whites commit 15 percent.

• Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against blacks. Fortyfive

percent of their victims are white, 43 percent are black, and 10 percent are

Hispanic. When whites commit violent crime, only three percent of their victims are

black.

• Blacks are an estimated 39 times more likely to commit a violent crime against

a white than vice versa, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery.

• Blacks are 2.25 times more likely to commit officially-designated hate crimes

against whites than vice versa.

http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

 

[GDogg]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how the PC piers that be want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than whites

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

That does not say that blacks commit most hate crimes.

"Most"? No.But if you're honest and truthful about statistics rather than trying to fit them I to your narrative you see that percentage-wise, black people do commit more hate crimes.

Were you hoping that percentage-wise white people commit more hate crimes?

Just did the math. Nope. White people still commit a higher percentage of hate crimes. I'm not hoping for anything. I'm just trying to help you with reading comp and clarify your false statements based off your incorrect reading of statistics and words.I think what you are trying to say us that, statistically, individual black people are disproportionately more likely to commit hate crimes than white purple, but that most hate crimes, by far, are committed by white people.

You did underatnd that your inability to admit facts is clouded by the facts that "white" in FBI statistics include Rabas and Hispanics, right?Of the nearly 770,000 violent interracial crimes committed every year involving

blacks and whites, blacks commit 85 percent and whites commit 15 percent.

• Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against blacks. Fortyfive

percent of their victims are white, 43 percent are black, and 10 percent are

Hispanic. When whites commit violent crime, only three percent of their victims are

black.

• Blacks are an estimated 39 times more likely to commit a violent crime against

a white than vice versa, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery.

• Blacks are 2.25 times more likely to commit officially-designated hate crimes

against whites than vice versa.

http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

You realize that has nothing to do with what we were discussing, right?In other words, I was right and you were wrong.

Do you not understand the difference between the terms more likely and most? It honestly doesn't appear that you do. Please look this up and then rejoin the discussion.

 

[TexanFan02]

I always cite my positions with statistics supported by reputable sources like the FBI. You cite your positions with feelings.

blacks are the target of the highest number of hate crimes in the United States, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation — higher by a wide margin than any another group of Americans by race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or disability. While blacks make up 12.6 percent of the country’s population, they were 70 percent of the victims of racial hate crimes in 2010.

link

Yet all statististics, regardless of how the PC piers that be want to appropriate it, show that blacks commit most hate crimes.MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010

FBI: Blacks more likely to commit hate crimes than whites

CNN offered a quick summary of a new FBI hate crime report. Of course, CNN was quick to point out that 62.4 percent of the offenders were white, while 18.5 percent were black.

What they forgot to include was a population comparison. Whites make up 74.8 percent of the population, while blacks are only 12.4 percent. That means that an average black person is 78.9 percent more likely to commit a hate crime than a white person. That's not a shame all people of a race should be burdened with, but it should dispel some of the popular views in our culture.

That does not say that blacks commit most hate crimes.

"Most"? No.But if you're honest and truthful about statistics rather than trying to fit them I to your narrative you see that percentage-wise, black people do commit more hate crimes.

Were you hoping that percentage-wise white people commit more hate crimes?

Just did the math. Nope. White people still commit a higher percentage of hate crimes. I'm not hoping for anything. I'm just trying to help you with reading comp and clarify your false statements based off your incorrect reading of statistics and words.I think what you are trying to say us that, statistically, individual black people are disproportionately more likely to commit hate crimes than white purple, but that most hate crimes, by far, are committed by white people.

You did underatnd that your inability to admit facts is clouded by the facts that "white" in FBI statistics include Rabas and Hispanics, right?Of the nearly 770,000 violent interracial crimes committed every year involving

blacks and whites, blacks commit 85 percent and whites commit 15 percent.

• Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against blacks. Fortyfive

percent of their victims are white, 43 percent are black, and 10 percent are

Hispanic. When whites commit violent crime, only three percent of their victims are

black.

• Blacks are an estimated 39 times more likely to commit a violent crime against

a white than vice versa, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery.

• Blacks are 2.25 times more likely to commit officially-designated hate crimes

against whites than vice versa.

http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

You realize that has nothing to do with what we were discussing, right?In other words, I was right and you were wrong.

Do you not understand the difference between the terms more likely and most? It honestly doesn't appear that you do. Please look this up and then rejoin the discussion.

Watch out, he'll call you names. He's like that.

 

[Chaos Commish]

http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

Your Source

 

[SacramentoBob]

http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

Your Source

For someone who doesn't fully support the movement he sure knows exactly where to go to pimp their literature.

 

[timschochet]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial. Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

There are two questions that you would have to answer conclusively before your point becomes valid.Can you prove that Trayvon was not wandering about in between houses and looking at things?Can you prove that white people in the gated community have done the same things and Zimmerman ignored them?Seems to me the guy called about potholes before and I don't think it was because the asphalt was black.

I don't think either of your questions would make my point any more or less valid.

 

[jon_mx]

There is not one shred of evidence which suggest that the police or DA acted unfairly against Treyvon by not arresting Zimmerman. You can be outraged by the law, but there is nothing here that shows any bias against blacks by the authorities. The outrage is misguided making issues that just ain't so.

 

[TexanFan02]

http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

Your Source

Taylor promotes his views by attacking racial, ethnic, and religious diversity, which he calls “one of the most divisive forces on the planet” and therefore “dangerous.”

Shocker.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

I think if this were some young white thug 17 year old, shot by a black neighborhood watch captian, with all the same evidence, story, and witnesses in place, the out come would have been the same.. I think you are wrong..

Say what?

Freudian slip there, Carolina?

If the 17 year old white kid was a thug, and the black guy was aknown neighborhood watch captian, I think the outcome would have been the same.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Zimmerman came into Trayvons life

yup.... They just bumped into each other by accident on a dark rainy night behind some apt`s and a fight broke out.

 

[glock]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

I think if this were some young white thug 17 year old, shot by a black neighborhood watch captian, with all the same evidence, story, and witnesses in place, the out come would have been the same.. I think you are wrong..

Say what?

Freudian slip there, Carolina?

If the 17 year old white kid was a thug, and the black guy was aknown neighborhood watch captian, I think the outcome would have been the same.

And if he like, wasn't a thug? You know- like Trayvon wasn't a thug?

 

[Clinton]

http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

Your Source

Taylor promotes his views by attacking racial, ethnic, and religious diversity, which he calls “one of the most divisive forces on the planet” and therefore “dangerous.”

Shocker.

Petulant Child, statistics are true regardless of who reports them. The fact is that few are brave enough to report them, and those who do, you label "racist" and dismiss their legitimate, stat based claims. Very convenient.Here's a supporing source

 

[SacramentoBob]

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial.

Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

I think if this were some young white thug 17 year old, shot by a black neighborhood watch captian, with all the same evidence, story, and witnesses in place, the out come would have been the same.. I think you are wrong..

Say what?

Freudian slip there, Carolina?

If the 17 year old white kid was a thug, and the black guy was aknown neighborhood watch captian, I think the outcome would have been the same.

And if he like, wasn't a thug? You know- like Trayvon wasn't a thug?

He had tattoos. Obvious sign of thug life.

 

[TexanFan02]

http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

Your Source

Taylor promotes his views by attacking racial, ethnic, and religious diversity, which he calls “one of the most divisive forces on the planet” and therefore “dangerous.”

Shocker.

Petulant Child, statistics are true regardless of who reports them. The fact is that few are brave enough to report them, and those who do, you label "racist" and dismiss their legitimate, stat based claims. Very convenient.

Tell the truth, you're really a Klansman, aren't you?