Game of Thrones, tv only, books don't exist, no backstory...NERDS already ruining a series that hasn't started (1 Viewer)

[Ilov80s]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

 

[Bonzai]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

I've already braced myself for this.

 

[Ilov80s]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

I've already braced myself for this.

This being an all-Wall episode is very likely based on the previews. I am hopeful that they resolve Tyrion's fate though, they haven't really made a habit of leaving anything too major hanging and have mostly used the endings to set-up new developments for the future (Dany's dragons, White Walker Army, etc)

 

[Otis]

The best thing about these threads is watching a bunch of nerds slap fight over who read a book and who didn't.

Can't wait for tonight. POPCORN

 

[Wyld Stallyns]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

 

[Christo]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

Did she do the hitching or her father?

 

[Chaka]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

Actually it was Tywin who hitched Cersei's wagon to Robert Baratheon.

 

[hxperson]

The best thing about these threads is watching a bunch of nerds slap fight over who read a book and who didn't.

Can't wait for tonight. POPCORN

I'm not sure which is sillier...the nerdy book reading posters who insist on posting in a thread that they are clearly told not to be in, or the nerdy non-book reading posters who react to any kind of spoiler as if someone just chopped off their right arm.

 

[shadyridr]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

Actually it was Tywin who hitched Cersei's wagon to Robert Baratheon.

well so much for that theory lol

 

[Wyld Stallyns]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

Actually it was Tywin who hitched Cersei's wagon to Robert Baratheon.

Did they say that on the show at some point? I wasn't sure...

 

[Mario Kart]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

Will you be happy when the episode takes a turn you are not suspecting? Like, when the Red Witch lady does some crazy magic and the whole wall comes tumbling down. The whole wall is going to fall making the North a part of the South or the South a part of the North. Weather is going to get screwed up. Dogs and cats are going to live together. Just madness.

 

[Chaka]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

Actually it was Tywin who hitched Cersei's wagon to Robert Baratheon.

Did they say that on the show at some point? I wasn't sure...

Buncha times.

 

[KarmaPolice]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show?

I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show?

I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

Blackwater episode was 100% Blackwater as I recall.

 

[KarmaPolice]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

nah- even in season 2 tyrion points out how bad she is at the game, which is a reason daddy sends brother to watch over her. I cat think of anything off that she has done to help her family or situation.

I would say the power players are tywin, littlefinger, and the Tyrells.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

nah- even in season 2 tyrion points out how bad she is at the game, which is a reason daddy sends brother to watch over her. I cat think of anything off that she has done to help her family or situation.

I would say the power players are tywin, littlefinger, and the Tyrells.

I agree in general, but I wouldn't say she hasn't done anything.

She orchestrated the death of Robert before he could be told about Joffrey's true origins. Also, didn't she then beat Ned at the GoT to make Joffrey king after Robert died? I know Littlefinger ultimately betrayed Ned for personal reasons but I can't recall if she was sending something his way for it as well.

 

[KarmaPolice]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

nah- even in season 2 tyrion points out how bad she is at the game, which is a reason daddy sends brother to watch over her. I cat think of anything off that she has done to help her family or situation.I would say the power players are tywin, littlefinger, and the Tyrells.

I agree in general, but I wouldn't say she hasn't done anything.

She orchestrated the death of Robert before he could be told about Joffrey's true origins. Also, didn't she then beat Ned at the GoT to make Joffrey king after Robert died? I know Littlefinger ultimately betrayed Ned for personal reasons but I can't recall if she was sending something his way for it as well.

I forgot about offing robert. I wouldn't say she beat ned to anything. everybody assumed joff was the heir. she was trying to prevent info leaking out to prevent stannis from being found out to be the rightful heir after the fact.

imo she is not nearly as good at the game as she thinks. there are probably 3 other female characters we have met that are better at it, and you could argue sansa might be better now.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I forgot about offing robert.

I wouldn't say she beat ned to anything. everybody assumed joff was the heir. she was trying to prevent info leaking out to prevent stannis from being found out to be the rightful heir after the fact.

imo she is not nearly as good at the game as she thinks. there are probably 3 other female characters we have met that are better at it, and you could argue sansa might be better now.

I'm really stretching my memory here as it's been a long time since S1 and I wasn't as into the show then, but I recall there being more to it then Joff just taking over. Ned was all set to make his move and thought he had the King's guard at his back through the promise of Littlefinger. When he put himself out there and called on them though, they ignored him. I know this was ultimately Littlefinger's decision but what I can't recall is if Cersei had also talked to Littlefinger about it or if he did it 100% on his own.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

She thinks she was pulling the strings over the death of Robert Baretheon, really though, it was revealed that it was Littlefinger all along.

Refresh my memory here. As I recall Cersei sexed up the teen boygirl Lannister and convinced him to get Robert crunk while he was out hunting boar so he would have an accident. What role did Littlefinger play in that?

 

[Christo]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

Actually it was Tywin who hitched Cersei's wagon to Robert Baratheon.

Did they say that on the show at some point? I wasn't sure...

If you weren't sure of who did what why did you claim Cersei was the one responsible?

 

[Wingnut]

8 pics of things you don't normally see the GOT cast doing

http://www.fascinatingpics.com/8-pics-of-things-you-dont-normally-see-the-game-of-thrones-stars-doing/

 

[KarmaPolice]

I forgot about offing robert.

I wouldn't say she beat ned to anything. everybody assumed joff was the heir. she was trying to prevent info leaking out to prevent stannis from being found out to be the rightful heir after the fact.

imo she is not nearly as good at the game as she thinks. there are probably 3 other female characters we have met that are better at it, and you could argue sansa might be better now.

I'm really stretching my memory here as it's been a long time since S1 and I wasn't as into the show then, but I recall there being more to it then Joff just taking over. Ned was all set to make his move and thought he had the King's guard at his back through the promise of Littlefinger. When he put himself out there and called on them though, they ignored him. I know this was ultimately Littlefinger's decision but what I can't recall is if Cersei had also talked to Littlefinger about it or if he did it 100% on his own.

joff was already in power I think.

i believe what you are thinking about happened after ned confronted cersei about knowing the truth and giving her a day to get out of dodge.

I assume she and ned went to littlefinger right after that about the gold cloaks. she has done other things- I assume she is the one who got bronn and shae away from tyrion.

maybe it is just the family she is in. everybody bends to tywin, and a non-incarcerated tyrion seemed to be able to side step her most of the time. now she has more power, but is still #2 to tywin.

 

[jamny]

I love this thread.

 

[jamny]

She thinks she was pulling the strings over the death of Robert Baretheon, really though, it was revealed that it was Littlefinger all along.

Refresh my memory here. As I recall Cersei sexed up the teen boygirl Lannister and convinced him to get Robert crunk while he was out hunting boar so he would have an accident. What role did Littlefinger play in that?

Maybe he's confused with Jon Arryn?

 

[KarmaPolice]

She thinks she was pulling the strings over the death of Robert Baretheon, really though, it was revealed that it was Littlefinger all along.

Refresh my memory here. As I recall Cersei sexed up the teen boygirl Lannister and convinced him to get Robert crunk while he was out hunting boar so he would have an accident. What role did Littlefinger play in that?

Maybe he's confused with Jon Arryn?

must be

cersei = robert

littlefinger/lysa = jon

 

[Wyld Stallyns]

I think Cersei gets a bad rap, but she's probably THE major player in the game so far. The only reason the Lannister's are even in King's Landing is because she hitched her bus to Baratheon.

Actually it was Tywin who hitched Cersei's wagon to Robert Baratheon.

Did they say that on the show at some point? I wasn't sure...

If you weren't sure of who did what why did you claim Cersei was the one responsible?

I thought she married Baratheon on her own, but as I was typing it I thought, "Wait a sec, I vaguely remember a scene where a somebody acted like everything she did was at Tywin's orders". ... But then my next thought was, "Meh, whatever".

 

[Norman Paperman]

Episode 9 = Good time for a Stark to die

 

[KarmaPolice]

Episode 9 = Good time for a Stark to die

I guess lucky for them no starks are at the wall.

 

[Norman Paperman]

Episode 9 = Good time for a Stark to die

I guess lucky for them no starks are at the wall.

I think for the purpose of this show, a Snow's as good as a Stark. Plus, we don't know where Rickon is, and Bran is north of the wall, so he could still eat it tonight. Arya could die on the way to the wall - if thats where the Mountain turns next...

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Episode 9 = Good time for a Stark to die

I guess lucky for them no starks are at the wall.

Jon snow

 

[Ilov80s]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show? I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

It was all the battle, which was awesome. I think it is a good idea to sometimes have episodes solely fixed on one location, I'm just not as into the story at the Wall as I am others. That said, the show nails 90% of what it does and there has been a lot of build up to this, so it could be epic.

 

[Rohn Jambo]

Why does Cersei need to be neutralized for Tyrion to survive? Or maybe I am unclear of your definition of "neutralize". There seem to be plenty of options to keep Tyrion alive without any change in Cersei's status.

Cersei either needs to die or needs to face a conflict so overwhelming, that she no longer has time or reason to keep trying to kill Tyrion.

She wants him dead. Clearly she blames him for the death of their mother. Now she blames him for the death of her son. She blames him for showing up everyone as Hand Of The King. She blames him for marrying off her daughter the way she was married off. She blames him for his raw honesty, where he pulls no punches in telling her she's basically a useless whore lucky to be in a powerful family where she doesn't have to do any of the heavy lifting and still she's completely inept politically.

At some point the conflict has to play out. You just can't keep having Cersei trying to kill Tyrion and failing at it til the end of the series. The only established points of weakness developed for Cersei is Jamie and her children. One kid dead, one kid in Dorne, clearly the weak point for her is Tommen. A dramatic change and threat to Tommen will reshift her focus.

The foreshadowing on Tywin has been clear since he and Arya were in Harrenhall ( ie. "No matter what happens, I know this will be my last war" and Arya "Anyone can be killed, my lord" ) Also Tywin living means Jamie must keep his word and go rule in Location X, where his story arc is clearly not headed. Tywin dead means that promise is also dead.

One person sure to live is the Viper's woman. Clearly there was a point to the Mountain confessing that he killed the Viper's sister. Now she can return to Dorne, talk to the Vipers older brother and now Dorne will have real justification to go to war with the Lannisters.

The writing was no the wall for the Viper since the start of the season ( he was the younger brother) He came with a 2nd person who could report back to Dorne. While he didn't have the power to declare war, his older brother could. Certain Martin wasn't going to bring Dorne into the story just to give Myrcella a place to go.

Usually writing convention ditches a minor character when it has served it's purpose and has no where left to go ( the jester knight with the necklace that Baelish killed) or a major character that breeds the most conflict with his departure ( i.e Tywin, which would serve just about as much as Sonny dying in The Godfather to throw all the Lannisters into turmoil)

Cersei and Tywin's storylines are getting a little stale at this point. I hope we get a fresh, kickass villain next season.

 

[Rohn Jambo]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show? I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

It was all the battle, which was awesome. I think it is a good idea to sometimes have episodes solely fixed on one location, I'm just not as into the story at the Wall as I am others. That said, the show nails 90% of what it does and there has been a lot of build up to this, so it could be epic.

Tyrion getting wrongly accused lasted 7 episodes already...Fans will revolt if they are left hanging over the cliff.

 

[Ilov80s]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show? I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

It was all the battle, which was awesome. I think it is a good idea to sometimes have episodes solely fixed on one location, I'm just not as into the story at the Wall as I am others. That said, the show nails 90% of what it does and there has been a lot of build up to this, so it could be epic.

Tyrion getting wrongly accused lasted 7 episodes already...Fans will revolt if they are left hanging over the cliff.

The show has never had a problem making people wait on storylines, winter is coming, white walkers, khaleesi coming to Westeros, and so on.

 

[Thunderlips]

Episode 9 = Good time for a Stark to die

I guess lucky for them no starks are at the wall.

Benjen Starks unaccounted for. Maybe's he's been hiding in the Wall tunnel the whole time?

 

[Thunderlips]

Why does Cersei need to be neutralized for Tyrion to survive? Or maybe I am unclear of your definition of "neutralize". There seem to be plenty of options to keep Tyrion alive without any change in Cersei's status.

Cersei either needs to die or needs to face a conflict so overwhelming, that she no longer has time or reason to keep trying to kill Tyrion.

She wants him dead. Clearly she blames him for the death of their mother. Now she blames him for the death of her son. She blames him for showing up everyone as Hand Of The King. She blames him for marrying off her daughter the way she was married off. She blames him for his raw honesty, where he pulls no punches in telling her she's basically a useless whore lucky to be in a powerful family where she doesn't have to do any of the heavy lifting and still she's completely inept politically.

At some point the conflict has to play out. You just can't keep having Cersei trying to kill Tyrion and failing at it til the end of the series. The only established points of weakness developed for Cersei is Jamie and her children. One kid dead, one kid in Dorne, clearly the weak point for her is Tommen. A dramatic change and threat to Tommen will reshift her focus.

The foreshadowing on Tywin has been clear since he and Arya were in Harrenhall ( ie. "No matter what happens, I know this will be my last war" and Arya "Anyone can be killed, my lord" ) Also Tywin living means Jamie must keep his word and go rule in Location X, where his story arc is clearly not headed. Tywin dead means that promise is also dead.

One person sure to live is the Viper's woman. Clearly there was a point to the Mountain confessing that he killed the Viper's sister. Now she can return to Dorne, talk to the Vipers older brother and now Dorne will have real justification to go to war with the Lannisters.

The writing was no the wall for the Viper since the start of the season ( he was the younger brother) He came with a 2nd person who could report back to Dorne. While he didn't have the power to declare war, his older brother could. Certain Martin wasn't going to bring Dorne into the story just to give Myrcella a place to go.

Usually writing convention ditches a minor character when it has served it's purpose and has no where left to go ( the jester knight with the necklace that Baelish killed) or a major character that breeds the most conflict with his departure ( i.e Tywin, which would serve just about as much as Sonny dying in The Godfather to throw all the Lannisters into turmoil)

Cersei and Tywin's storylines are getting a little stale at this point. I hope we get a fresh, kickass villain next season.

Why do people think Tywin's a villian? Guys got it together and makes more sense than just about everyone out there.

 

[Thunderlips]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show?I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

It was all the battle, which was awesome. I think it is a good idea to sometimes have episodes solely fixed on one location, I'm just not as into the story at the Wall as I am others. That said, the show nails 90% of what it does and there has been a lot of build up to this, so it could be epic.

I don't think they did a good job with The Wall storyline this year. It really seems thin.

 

[KarmaPolice]

Episode 9 = Good time for a Stark to die

I guess lucky for them no starks are at the wall.

Jon snow

bastards don't count.

 

[Ilov80s]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show?I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

It was all the battle, which was awesome. I think it is a good idea to sometimes have episodes solely fixed on one location, I'm just not as into the story at the Wall as I am others. That said, the show nails 90% of what it does and there has been a lot of build up to this, so it could be epic.

I don't think they did a good job with The Wall storyline this year. It really seems thin.

It's been built up to for a couple seasons now.

 

[Thunderlips]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show?I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

It was all the battle, which was awesome. I think it is a good idea to sometimes have episodes solely fixed on one location, I'm just not as into the story at the Wall as I am others. That said, the show nails 90% of what it does and there has been a lot of build up to this, so it could be epic.

I don't think they did a good job with The Wall storyline this year. It really seems thin.

It's been built up to for a couple seasons now.

Yeah, but to even hire a decent actor like the guy playing Mance Rayder and then not even show him this year... I'd imagine that the Snow storyline has the least amount of screen time this year...or second least behind Reek/Theon.

 

[Ilov80s]

My concern now is that tonight won't touch on Tyrion at all and will just be the Wall (which is my least favorite setting) and that the season ends up with Tyrion's fate as it's cliffhanger.

can't remember- was the blackwater episode all that, or did they do a couple others spots and go to the battle for the 2nd half of the show?I am hoping we get at least a couple nuggets of arya, sansa, tyrion, someone else before heading to the wall.

It was all the battle, which was awesome. I think it is a good idea to sometimes have episodes solely fixed on one location, I'm just not as into the story at the Wall as I am others. That said, the show nails 90% of what it does and there has been a lot of build up to this, so it could be epic.

I don't think they did a good job with The Wall storyline this year. It really seems thin.

It's been built up to for a couple seasons now.

Yeah, but to even hire a decent actor like the guy playing Mance Rayder and then not even show him this year... I'd imagine that the Snow storyline has the least amount of screen time this year...or second least behind Reek/Theon.

Yeah. We need more Mance!

 

[krsone21]

In my opinion I think Tyrion will live. I think somehow his brother Jamie will be involved. I have no idea how, but they seem to have a genuine bond. Jamie has changed a lot since season 1 and I don't think in the end he will allow his brother to die.Of course I could be all wrong about this and one or both could be dead by the end of this season, never know with this show.

 

[NIU Kicker]

Whoa - no more Peter dinkladge in the opening credits.

 

[Rohn Jambo]

Why does Cersei need to be neutralized for Tyrion to survive? Or maybe I am unclear of your definition of "neutralize". There seem to be plenty of options to keep Tyrion alive without any change in Cersei's status.

Cersei either needs to die or needs to face a conflict so overwhelming, that she no longer has time or reason to keep trying to kill Tyrion.

She wants him dead. Clearly she blames him for the death of their mother. Now she blames him for the death of her son. She blames him for showing up everyone as Hand Of The King. She blames him for marrying off her daughter the way she was married off. She blames him for his raw honesty, where he pulls no punches in telling her she's basically a useless whore lucky to be in a powerful family where she doesn't have to do any of the heavy lifting and still she's completely inept politically.

At some point the conflict has to play out. You just can't keep having Cersei trying to kill Tyrion and failing at it til the end of the series. The only established points of weakness developed for Cersei is Jamie and her children. One kid dead, one kid in Dorne, clearly the weak point for her is Tommen. A dramatic change and threat to Tommen will reshift her focus.

The foreshadowing on Tywin has been clear since he and Arya were in Harrenhall ( ie. "No matter what happens, I know this will be my last war" and Arya "Anyone can be killed, my lord" ) Also Tywin living means Jamie must keep his word and go rule in Location X, where his story arc is clearly not headed. Tywin dead means that promise is also dead.

One person sure to live is the Viper's woman. Clearly there was a point to the Mountain confessing that he killed the Viper's sister. Now she can return to Dorne, talk to the Vipers older brother and now Dorne will have real justification to go to war with the Lannisters.

The writing was no the wall for the Viper since the start of the season ( he was the younger brother) He came with a 2nd person who could report back to Dorne. While he didn't have the power to declare war, his older brother could. Certain Martin wasn't going to bring Dorne into the story just to give Myrcella a place to go.

Usually writing convention ditches a minor character when it has served it's purpose and has no where left to go ( the jester knight with the necklace that Baelish killed) or a major character that breeds the most conflict with his departure ( i.e Tywin, which would serve just about as much as Sonny dying in The Godfather to throw all the Lannisters into turmoil)

Cersei and Tywin's storylines are getting a little stale at this point. I hope we get a fresh, kickass villain next season.

Why do people think Tywin's a villian? Guys got it together and makes more sense than just about everyone out there.

You like him? All the more reason to kill him off.

 

[Rohn Jambo]

Whoa - no more Peter dinkladge in the opening credits.

No!

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Whoa - no more Peter dinkladge in the opening credits.

No!

If he isnt in tonight's episode...

 

[Premier]

Gotta be honest, none of these people really resonate with me.

 

[Rohn Jambo]

Whoa - no more Peter dinkladge in the opening credits.

No!

If he isnt in tonight's episode...

I see they cut it short to spend zero time on the Tyrion storyline.

 

[Ilov80s]

That made all the BS at the Wall worth it. That was great stuff. Same director that did Blackwater Neil Marshall.

 

[Christo]

Gotta be honest, none of these people really resonate with me.

Not even Ginger Minge?