Game of Thrones, tv only, books don't exist, no backstory...NERDS already ruining a series that hasn't started (1 Viewer)

[toshiba]

Arya finds Jamie's body. Does her faceless men trick. Slays Dany on the throne. Jon walks in and sees it. Distraught he kills what he thinks is Jamie but after striking him down is horrified to realize it was Arya.

Jaime is buried under 7 million tons of rubble. And even if that was not the case, Jaime is an escaped prisoner and would get nowhere near Dany

He was buried under 4 rocks  

 

[-arcK-]

I find it curious that people are interpreting the dragon melting the throne as some kind of greater symbolic gesture. I view the dragons as being not much different than teenage boys. They're full of all this new strength and rage that they can't control very well.

The way I see it... the dragon sensed something was wrong, checked on her and found her dead, was so pissed and distraught it just wanted to destroy something, and the throne was there as a tempting nearby target. I'm not proud to say that in my youth I've done similar in emotional situations. Still feel bad about that nice mailbox I destroyed when I was 13.

And I don't think it should be necessary to explain why the dragon didn't take it out on Jon. Yet I still see people bringing it up.

 

[Chaka]

It's not rocket science but there appear to be two groups here

One that's content with the ending and likely would have been content with any ending

And one that wants the ending to cash in on the prior 7 seasons.

I think it is fair to at least suggest that a substantial subset of these people, perhaps a majority, would not have been satisfied by any ending.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Stayed away from this thread for the entire series, but I can't tell you how thrilled I was that we got to watch Arya just walk around for the last three hours of the series. 

Well....she killed the nk...i think they just used her as a stalker of cersei....a stalker of danny....but funny point...she ended up not doing #### at kl

 

[Daywalker]

I dont buy that DandD had more say on the episode count then hbo.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

I think it is fair to at least suggest that a substantial subset of these people, perhaps a majority, would not have been satisfied by any ending.

Exactly....

 

[toshiba]

It's not rocket science but there appear to be two groups here

One that's content with the ending and likely would have been content with any ending

And one that wants the ending to cash in on the prior 7 seasons.

I think it is fair to at least suggest that a substantial subset of these people, perhaps a majority, would not have been satisfied by any ending.

So we have at least 3 groups...

One that's content with the ending and likely would have been content with any ending.

One that wants the ending to cash in on the prior 7 seasons.

And one that would not have been satisfied by any ending.

 

[Snotbubbles]

While it might not be the right ending, what did him being a secret Targaryen really add to the story other then he rode a dragon.  He could have always been just Jon Snow and done everything else he did in the show.

She always believed she was the rightful heir to the throne, the last Targaryen.  When she found out that not only was she not the last Targaryen, but she also wasn't the rightful heir and that the true heir had the backing of the people she meant to rule, the Daenerys as we knew her was finished.  She now had a threat to what she spent her entire life believing was hers.  Not only was Jon a threat, but the people of Westeros loved Jon, not her.  Without love, the only thing she had left was fear.  Once people knew who Jon really was, she had to either relinquish her claim to Jon or go totally ballistic so that no one would ever challenge her.  If Jon Snow was just a ******* Stark, he wouldn't have been a threat, the most he could have been was a usurper like Robert Baratheon.

 

[Chaka]

Which wasn't really needed since she was so willing to take him back. He could have waited until later that night to stab her in the privacy of their bedroom. 

Drogon's reaction may have been a tad different if Jon were merely a Snow and not a Targaryen. Like, smoking Jon and all of Winterfell different.

 

[Mile High]

To me there are two branches of consideration in how things ended. One is how we feel about the broad strokes of the plot - how Martin sees the story going overall. The other is how the show executed the realization of those broad strokes. I don't have a problem with the broad plot strokes (in fact, taken on their own I think they're pretty interesting in a good way), but I think the execution of conveying them was markedly poorer than it was when there was more source material to work from. I think the show runners realized they couldn't write as well as Martin, so they shortened the remaining seasons to avoid them being even more poorly executed than they ended up being.

Yeah. I guess they finished it with what they know best. I mentioned in another post, the visually and the music used parts were 10s. The story line was like they didn't give a #### and were done. They probably did care about the story but just sucked at telling it. Probably better just to hype the #### out of 13 episodes and then get the hell out of Dodge.

 

[Chaka]

Agree with those who think Jon being a Targaryen, pushed Dany over the edge.

Being close to the edge seems to be a Targaryen trait.

 

[Captain Cranks]

I think it is fair to at least suggest that a substantial subset of these people, perhaps a majority, would not have been satisfied by any ending.

Exactly....

Exactly wrong.

If a landing is well executed, it will get the credit it deserves.  OTOH, it's fair to say that there will be a subset of people who would have been satisfied by any ending.  

 

[nirad3]

I really thought that when Grey Worm said, "That's not enough" about Tyrion's punishment that he was going to demand that he be made a eunuch.   

Maybe they did that off-screen.... I mean, he was re-arranging chairs for Pete's sake.

 

[Dickies]

Exactly wrong.

If a landing is well executed, it will get the credit it deserves.  OTOH, it's fair to say that there will be a subset of people who would have been satisfied by any ending.  

I thought there were probably 100+ satisfying ways they could have ended the series because there are so many great characters that each needed their own endings.  I was a bit underwhelmed while watching, but the more I sit on it the more I like it.  Having read many speculated endings written by fans, there were a bunch that I really liked, but there were some that were cringe-worthy, so I don't think it's exactly fair to say that people would be satisfied with any ending.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I dont buy that DandD had more say on the episode count then hbo.

Lots of reports out that HBO offered them 10 seasons and that they wanted more episodes.  But this is from the showrunners directly if 100 secondhand reports don't convince you.  

You told me back when filming season 3 that you were thinking of doing the final season as three movies because you couldn’t imagine pulling off what you and George had in mind on a television budget. Do you feel like you’ve been able to do what you envisioned years ago?

WEISS: Yes. To their credit, they put their money where their mouths are — literally stuffed their mouth full of million-dollar bills which don’t exist anymore. They said, “We’ll give you the resources to make this what it needs to be, and if what it needs to be is a summer tentpole-size spectacle in places, then that’s what it will be.”

BENIOFF: HBO would have been happy for the show to keep going, to have more episodes in the final season. We always believed it was about 73 hours, and it will be roughly that. As much as they wanted more, they understood that this is where the story ends.

https://ew.com/tv/2019/04/09/game-of-thrones-season-8-showrunners-interview/

 

[Mile High]

I dont buy that DandD had more say on the episode count then hbo.

Let's see if HBO still feels that way after their subscription fees stop rolling in.

 

[TheFanatic]

How do you feel about the way they glossed over the dragon? 

How did they do that exactly. He's a Targ. Dragon couldn't do anything to him. What was Drogon going to do, go back to taking a nap?

 

[pantherclub]

Let's see if HBO still feels that way after their subscription fees stop rolling in.

On the Ringer Watch podcast they stated there were multiple endings filmed and HBO may have wanted some stories open ended to potentially have like an Arya spin off years down the road etc.  If that that is just cheap.

 

[pantherclub]

How did they do that exactly. He's a Targ. Dragon couldn't do anything to him. What was Drogon going to do, go back to taking a nap?

They still didnt do any sort of wrap up and just had a throwaway line about bran looking for him.   I mean the dragons were the focal point of the ENTIRE series and they treat it like no big deal at the end.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Let's see if HBO still feels that way after their subscription fees stop rolling in.

Great ending or not....people were dropping hbo at the end of got

 

[Good Posting Judge]

I'm a little concerned that this is a show that takes place all over a damn continent, where there's about a dozen main characters, with dozens more that have supporting roles, and there's some people that think everyone has to have a "purpose", or everything has to "mean" something.

 

[otb_lifer]

They still didnt do any sort of wrap up and just had a throwaway line about bran looking for him.   I mean the dragons were the focal point of the ENTIRE series and they treat it like no big deal at the end.

... not to mention how 2 were taken down with incredible ease, while Drogon suffered nary a nick during the siege of Blackwater Bay/KL  

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Great ending or not....people were dropping hbo at the end of got Barry.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Touche! 

 

[Thunderlips]

They didn't have to get away from that. D&D chose to do it that way.

I think you have to kind of do when you get to the end of the show.  

 

[jamny]

It's not like the finale is getting universal acclaim outside of this board. I think comments here reflect what a majority of viewers are saying about it. At least from what I've read. Most of the comments I saw on Facebook immediately following it where saying wtf was that?

 

[eoMMan]

IDK. My wife is pretty hyped for Big Little Lies.  HBO will always some hit going on.

 

[pantherclub]

IDK. My wife is pretty hyped for Big Little Lies.  HBO will always some hit going on.

My wife watched the first season so by proxy so did I and after the finale we just laughed at how bad that show was.  I doubt we will circle back for S2.  Way too many better shows to watch than that.

 

[thecatch]

I thought the biggest reason she went mad was because she didn't have the love of the people of Westeros so she chose fear.

They could have happened without Jon being a secret Targaryen.  Jon Snow was the king of the North and a hero in the battle against the night king, Dani was someone no one knew, no secret Targaryen needed 

Jon Snow could have broken off his relationship with Dani after listening to the concerns of his sisters that she wasn't all that after all, not that she was his Aunt.

Him being a Targaryen hasn't needed other then to ride a dragon, that no one even said, why can he ride a dragon?

I think you are underselling how crushing it was to her to have a relative with a better claim. She said some variation of “I’m the last Targaryen,” “I was born to rule,” or “the throne is my birthright” about 10,000 times throughout the show. She viewed it as central to her identify. That was taken from her, and the last couple of episodes showed how freaked out she was by that, and how obsessed she was with that information not getting out. 

This certainly isn’t what I think we were all expecting once we found out Jon is the rightful heir, but I think in retrospect using the revelation in this manner is much more in keeping with Martin’s subversion of genre tropes than crowning Jon would have been. 

 

[Bob Sacamano]

He's a Targ. Dragon couldn't do anything to him. 

I don't think you understand how dragons work.  Or Targaryens, for that matter.

 

[fruity pebbles]

Final episode of GOT is rated lower then the final episode of Dexter on IMDB. 

It sucked for the overall quality of the show. I do t know how anyone can say different. Was it terrible as a stand alone, perhaps not. But as the culmination of one of the best shows ever created, it bit hard.

 

[zoonation]

As @Mile High said, the problem isn't that Jon didn't take his rightful place on the throne, the problem is that Jon being a Targayen was basically irrelevant to the story in any meaningful way.  The same way that all that time Bran spent learning to Warg was basically irrelevant, and all those episodes we spent watching Arya learn to take other people's identities was basically irrelevant, all the time Arya spent pining over murdering Cersei was basically irrelevant. 

All of those could have been completely removed from the show and it would have had barely any impact.  And it's not just that time was spent developing those narratives that were ultimately abandoned, it's that it was a major opportunity wasted because they created some really unique opportunities that were ignored in favor of every character just playing everything straight up and everything going pretty predictably linear.

I still contend that the most GRRM thing ever would have been to have one of the "good guys" accidentally kill Arya while not knowing she was in disguise as one of the "bad guys".  Imagine Jon putting a sword through Qyburn only to have it revealed as he was crumbling to his death that it was actually Arya he had stabbed after she had taken on Qyburn's face in a plot to get close enough to Cersei to kill her, or something along those lines.  THAT would have been epically the GoT we all know.

Except for, you know, being one of the key reasons Dany burned down King's Landing.  Jon would have been a happily kept man but for the whole being related thing.

Edit:  I see many pointed this out already.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

My wife watched the first season so by proxy so did I and after the finale we just laughed at how bad that show was.  I doubt we will circle back for S2.  Way too many better shows to watch than that.

All of the houses in that show are pretty sick.

 

[eoMMan]

Got this from another board...interesting....

By the final season, it had four remaining writers: Dave Hill, Bryan Cogman, and showrunners David Benioff and D.B. Weiss. I’ve done casual research on all four (meaning, I wikipedia’d them, googled them, and read/watched a few interviews and such), which I’ll summarize here:

David Benioff: Benioff is most experienced writer of the four. He has an academic background in writing and literature, and holds an MFA in creative writing. He also has screenwriting experience, having written the screenplays for (among others) Troy, The Kite Runner, and X-Men Origins: Wolverine.

D.B. Weiss: Weiss has a published novel, called Lucky Wander Boy. He has also apparently worked on multiple screenplays (one was based on Ender’s Game, one was a proposal for an aborted HALO movie, and one was a prequel to I Am Legend), but none were ever produced.

Dave Hill: He worked as an assistant to Benioff and Weiss early on in the show, then was promoted to writer in the fifth season. I couldn’t find anything else he’s worked on.

Bryan Cogman: Studied acting at Julliard. Appears to have had no prior writing experience before his hiring.

So, of season eight’s four writers, only one of them had ever actually had a screenplay produced prior to Game of Thrones. Two of the four appear to have had no professional writing experience whatsoever at the time they were hired. Does that seem right to you? It doesn’t to me.

The conclusion I draw from the above is this: good TV writing requires that the show take writing seriously, as though it’s a craft honed through experience and care. This conclusion is treated as obvious in other areas of production. They didn’t, for example, pull some random guy off the street and ask him to play Tywin Lannister, or design the show’s costumes, or manage the lighting and sets. And yet three of season eight’s four writers had, as near as I can tell, exactly zero screenwriting credits between them prior to Game of Thrones.

https://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=47113

 

[Thunderlips]

i dont' think so.  He was a dead man walking.   Im surprised that wasn't mentioned in the conversation with Tyrion actually.   There is no way that Hitler is going to let Hitler  Sr keep walking the earth if Hitler wants to retain power that is owed to Hitler Sr.

It was inferred.  Tyrion says something to the extent of "You know I'm not the last man she'll burn *wink* *wink".....and Jon was like "Yup...Oh ####...You mean me?"

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I don't think you understand how dragons work.

Did I really just type that? I need to leave here for good.

 

[Mile High]

Also they could have had more Cersei, Dani drama.  Cersei tells Jamie making a truce with the dragon queen might be their best interest for now, and better to deal with her like father would.  What happened with that?

Then Qyburn tells Bronn after giving him the crossbow they the crossbow isn't for Dani. The queen has other plans for the mother of dragons. What plans?

Though for sure Cersei had set a betrayal plan into action.

 

[beer 30]

Final episode of GOT is rated lower then the final episode of Dexter on IMDB. 

The hate watch is realz

I'm a little concerned that this is a show that takes place all over a damn continent, where there's about a dozen main characters, with dozens more that have supporting roles, and there's some people that think everyone has to have a "purpose", or everything has to "mean" something.

Well it is the world we live in, right? Everyone thinks people care about their opinion. Heck look at this thread for people trying to post as much content as they can to get their opinions out there. We all want that little bit of gratification from somebody liking a post or even better, quoting it with a "good job" or a  emoticon. Seems only natural that those very same people would project that expectation onto characters they've watched for 8 years grow up in front of them, right?

 

[Dickies]

How did they do that exactly. He's a Targ. Dragon couldn't do anything to him. What was Drogon going to do, go back to taking a nap?

Could have eaten him

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Dragons have killed Targaryens. With fire. They're not made of asbestos. 

 

[otb_lifer]

Dragons have killed Targaryens. With fire. They're not made of asbestos. 

exactly ... remember, Viserys was none too fireproof when Khal Drogo beaned his ##### ### with the molten gold ... now, while not dragon fire, it was still ... ya know - HOT. 

and that kid melted. 

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Dragons have killed Targaryens. With fire. They're not made of asbestos. 

Which is probably fortunate for Jon, given Ygritte's description of how he likes to get down. 

 

[Bob Sacamano]

 Jon suing Dany for boatsex-acquired mesothelioma would have been a more satisfying ending imo

 

[TheFanatic]

I don't think you understand how dragons work.  Or Targaryens, for that matter.

Only one group of people could control the dragons. Targs. It's not that hard. 

 

[Mile High]

Dragons have killed Targaryens. With fire. They're not made of asbestos. 

Wasn't there even a war between Targaryens were they rode dragons and killed each other?

 

[pantherclub]

Only one group of people could control the dragons. Targs. It's not that hard. 

Which is why I wished they would have shown the dragon soaring over Jons head in the last shot for some sort of resolution

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Only one group of people could control the dragons. Targs. It's not that hard. 

Right. 

And every other family from valyria.

And ignoring that the ability some, but not all, targs had to ride/control dragons doesn't mean dragons can't harm them. 

 

[Mile High]

Wasn't there even a war between Targaryens were they rode dragons and killed each other?

Googling it there was.  Dragons killed Targaryens during it. So saying dragons wouldn't kill a Targaryen is false.  It seems the only Targaryen a dragon was loyal to was their rider. So Drogon should have had no problem killing Jon.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Wasn't there even a war between Targaryens were they rode dragons and killed each other?

The Dance of the Dragons. Among others, Rhaenyra Targaryen would be very surprised to learn dragons can't harm her.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

 It's not that hard. 

-Sansa RE: Bran at the Kingsmoot?