Great Michael Vick Column (1 Viewer)

[NY/NJMFDIVER]

If Vick can't play in the NFL he may as well not even live anymore.

Lupica's absolutely right. This isn't what happened to the last guy who was caught red-handed and found to be operating and funding an interstate dogfighting operation where he confessed to the actual killing of animals essentially with his bare hands and lied to the face of the commissioner about it.

lol

Yeah, but I mean, guys beat their wives and girlfriends? Which is crueler in the scheme of things?

so there are worse things a person can do, therefore don't make such a big deal out of this one? lost me on that logic.speaking of which, what did I miss ie "Vick has served his 23 month sentence" didn't it start in Dec 07? what he got a break, or this is some new math?he's a POS who deserves to have some electrodes attached to him and.....any team low enough to sign him I immediately hope loses every game even if it's my beloved jets jets jets.

My quibble would be with something of a universal standard on misconduct. Goodell can only be lucky that domestic violence organizations aren't as organized as animal rights groups, because in a league they are at least taking cursory steps to market to women, and certainly advertise as being "fun for the family", where guys can get in domestic scuffles routinely, which terrorizes their partner AND their family in ways I suppose you can't imagine if you haven't been witness to it. And there are any manner of indescretions that slide and some are major violations with no real sense other than Goodell's mood or approval ratings apparently. They can and will paint this as a gambling issue, but I think we know it boils back to animal rights. And this is the league that will market itself around endless tailgating shots of people grilling steaks, burgers, ribs and wings getting ready for gameday. Now I don't think what this guy did is right, but I don't think what hunters do is right either and how many guys in this league hunt? When you factor in the cultural aspects of this stuff(its not like Vick thought up Dog fighting) I think he's well served his time. But Goodell seems intent on making him serve more. Killing animals is always unnecessary and totally needless in the modern developed world yet we do it, largely because we like the way they taste or the way their furs work. Its so needlessly silly that I frankly don't see much distinction with what Vick did beyond people wanting to claim a moral highground that their abuse of animals is ok while Vick's isn't.

 

[Dr. Evil]

The hypocrisy here is astounding. How many of you guys that decry the dogfighting and killing enjoy hunting Bambi's furry friends for sport? What about the systemic torture and degradation of our fellow man at Guantanamo Bay?

He paid the price that society set. Unless you guys want to require tatooing a big red "C" on his forehead to signify he is a convict, he should be given a chance to learn from his mistakes.

 

[Avery]

The hypocrisy here is astounding. How many of you guys that decry the dogfighting and killing enjoy hunting Bambi's furry friends for sport? What about the systemic torture and degradation of our fellow man at Guantanamo Bay?He paid the price that society set. Unless you guys want to require tatooing a big red "C" on his forehead to signify he is a convict, he should be given a chance to learn from his mistakes.

I really don't see the hypocrisy you're talking about.As for me, I don't enjoy or condone torturing or senseless killing of animals or people nor did I see anyone on this thread who criticized Vick say that they did.Painting the world in black and white would make everything easy, but the reality is there are shades of gray and I think that there is something between letting Vick play in the NFL the moment he is free and tattooing a big red "C" on his forehead.

 

[Tanner9919]

The hypocrisy here is astounding. How many of you guys that decry the dogfighting and killing enjoy hunting Bambi's furry friends for sport? What about the systemic torture and degradation of our fellow man at Guantanamo Bay?

He paid the price that society set. Unless you guys want to require tatooing a big red "C" on his forehead to signify he is a convict, he should be given a chance to learn from his mistakes.

dude, stop..I agree with the fact that he paid his debt and all that jazz. he shouldn't be blacklisted, but probably will be , at least from a PR perspective, its hard to imagine anyone taking a chance on him. you might as well invite P.E.T.A to come live at your house..but, yes, he's paid his debt we get it..

now, as for killing and torturing animals, that is most definitely NOT the same thing as hunting an animal. First of all, hunting is legal...( I should stop here because that's really all that needs to be said - it's legal.)

you must buy permits, licenses, guns, background checks, etc..and not only does it require licensing and permits, but hunting season is also only open a few times per year per type of animal ( buck, doe, bear, etc)..as for NJ, we'd have

we have an abundant, overly productive deer population that needs legalized hunting to keep their numbers in check.

putting a noose around a dogs neck, spraying him down with water ( the sole intention being to make the dog more conducive to electricity) and them raising him and flipping a switch to fry him, is deplorable. the fact that you'd compare legalized, regulated hunting to torturing of animals ( dogs in this case) is comical..yes illegal hunting goes on, but these guys who hunt illegally, don't skin the animal alive , they don't mame it and let a pack of hunting dogs finish it off.they kill the animal with one shot, either with a bow/arrow combo, or with a rifle.there is no torture going on.

as for Gitmo, you use the term 'fellow man'? these aren't men, they're animals..

sorry , but the 9/11 mastermind Sheikh Mohammed and his bros, deserve what they get at Gitmo. this is a mass murderer who has had his hand in 9/11, Bali bombings, WTC 1993, Bojinka, Mill. plot, execution of Daniel Pearl, Richard Reid shoe bombing attempt, on and on..and you want to clothe him, and feed him , and play checkers with him..

:

 

[Jason Wood]

The hypocrisy here is astounding. How many of you guys that decry the dogfighting and killing enjoy hunting Bambi's furry friends for sport? What about the systemic torture and degradation of our fellow man at Guantanamo Bay?

He paid the price that society set. Unless you guys want to require tatooing a big red "C" on his forehead to signify he is a convict, he should be given a chance to learn from his mistakes.

I just read through the entire thread and I have to ask if you did the same? Because I don't see many people arguing Vick shouldn't get a chance to play in the NFL. I'm seeing lots of people defend the severity of the crime, and lots of people pointing out that Lupica is barking up a tree where there isn't one right now, and that Goodell has a lot of leeway in how he handles this but we have to SEE how he handles this before people condemn or praise him.I'll leave the relative comparisons between torturing animals, torturing political prisoners and hunting to others as it's not at all germane to the discussion at hand.

 

[NY/NJMFDIVER]

The hypocrisy here is astounding. How many of you guys that decry the dogfighting and killing enjoy hunting Bambi's furry friends for sport? What about the systemic torture and degradation of our fellow man at Guantanamo Bay?

He paid the price that society set. Unless you guys want to require tatooing a big red "C" on his forehead to signify he is a convict, he should be given a chance to learn from his mistakes.

I just read through the entire thread and I have to ask if you did the same? Because I don't see many people arguing Vick shouldn't get a chance to play in the NFL. I'm seeing lots of people defend the severity of the crime, and lots of people pointing out that Lupica is barking up a tree where there isn't one right now, and that Goodell has a lot of leeway in how he handles this but we have to SEE how he handles this before people condemn or praise him.I'll leave the relative comparisons between torturing animals, torturing political prisoners and hunting to others as it's not at all germane to the discussion at hand.

The speculative relevance of Goodell comes from this recent statement:http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nf...dell-vick_N.htm

The gist of it being, Vick being released from jail won't be sufficent reason for reinstatement, he'll need to show additional contrition of some sort.

Now, there are facts to Vick that are obvious, like that he's been convicted of a felony in connection with a gambling, which I'll concede could be a moral ground for Goodell, but I think most of us are choosing to read between the lines of infraction. Were he betting on the NFL, goodbye and don't look back, but this is not a threat to intrinsic integrity of the game. Its sick and depraved, but thats sort of part and parcell for the NFL. I can't blame Goodell for the ultimate example of NFL laxness in Leonard Little, but this is a league that also celebrates Ray Lewis and will likely put him in their hall of fame. Goodell has issued no such proclimations for Plaxico(and I'm refraining from the "follows closely" cult but there would be a NY there if i did list one). This is a guy who brought a gun into a crowded nightclub.

If this is Sheriff Goodell's new era, I'm actually all for it, and what Vick did is sickening, but I think there should be a perspective and consistency to enforcement of penalties.

And the greatest irony is, if and when Michael Vick gets his S together, is able to contribute again, and be part of a Super Bowl team lets say, as a starting QB or WR, the entire Super Sunday will be built and marketed around his redemption, his comeback, blah blah blah, "Tell me Michael, you served 23 months and now you're in the bowl, talk about that for a moment...."

That or throw him the hell out of the league. Don't make this guy do some silly dance, because what he did is either serious enough to keep him out or its not.

 

[Stealthycat]

legal and illegal changes every year, legal and illegal is different in every state and country, legal and illegal is NO BASIS for right and wrong

dog fighting, is, I believe, wrong - because its enjoying the cruelty of the animals fighting.

Cruelty is nature, animals killing and each other alive or starving to death or many of the other ways animals die.

I hunt - its is my life to the core of my being, I cannot imagine life without hunting. I never ever have enjoyed the process of the animal dying - anything more than the absolute quickest possible death is not what I wish - ever.

That is what seperates Vick- however, as bad as dog fighting is, he did his time.

Let it go

 

[Phurfur]

Which is more cruel attaching electrodes to an animal and hosing them down while shocking them or hitting a woman?

Hitting a human man or woman is worse. If I am going to allow sensitivity determine my decision I will opt for the human species over another any day.

This is not a multiple choice. What Vick did could only be done by someone who is sub-human.

Multiple choice? What Vick did could be done by anyone if...

No it couldn't but we sure know who you are.

 

[Jason Wood]

The hypocrisy here is astounding. How many of you guys that decry the dogfighting and killing enjoy hunting Bambi's furry friends for sport? What about the systemic torture and degradation of our fellow man at Guantanamo Bay?

He paid the price that society set. Unless you guys want to require tatooing a big red "C" on his forehead to signify he is a convict, he should be given a chance to learn from his mistakes.

I just read through the entire thread and I have to ask if you did the same? Because I don't see many people arguing Vick shouldn't get a chance to play in the NFL. I'm seeing lots of people defend the severity of the crime, and lots of people pointing out that Lupica is barking up a tree where there isn't one right now, and that Goodell has a lot of leeway in how he handles this but we have to SEE how he handles this before people condemn or praise him.I'll leave the relative comparisons between torturing animals, torturing political prisoners and hunting to others as it's not at all germane to the discussion at hand.

The speculative relevance of Goodell comes from this recent statement:http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nf...dell-vick_N.htm

The gist of it being, Vick being released from jail won't be sufficent reason for reinstatement, he'll need to show additional contrition of some sort.

Now, there are facts to Vick that are obvious, like that he's been convicted of a felony in connection with a gambling, which I'll concede could be a moral ground for Goodell, but I think most of us are choosing to read between the lines of infraction. Were he betting on the NFL, goodbye and don't look back, but this is not a threat to intrinsic integrity of the game. Its sick and depraved, but thats sort of part and parcell for the NFL. I can't blame Goodell for the ultimate example of NFL laxness in Leonard Little, but this is a league that also celebrates Ray Lewis and will likely put him in their hall of fame. Goodell has issued no such proclimations for Plaxico(and I'm refraining from the "follows closely" cult but there would be a NY there if i did list one). This is a guy who brought a gun into a crowded nightclub.

If this is Sheriff Goodell's new era, I'm actually all for it, and what Vick did is sickening, but I think there should be a perspective and consistency to enforcement of penalties.

And the greatest irony is, if and when Michael Vick gets his S together, is able to contribute again, and be part of a Super Bowl team lets say, as a starting QB or WR, the entire Super Sunday will be built and marketed around his redemption, his comeback, blah blah blah, "Tell me Michael, you served 23 months and now you're in the bowl, talk about that for a moment...."

That or throw him the hell out of the league. Don't make this guy do some silly dance, because what he did is either serious enough to keep him out or its not.

Where I'm coming from, and have for a long time, is that the NFL had absurd double standards. A guy knocks his pregnant wife so hard she tumbles over a couch and, because she wouldn't press charges, he gets to play in his team's playoff game...yet Peyton Manning wants to wear black high tops to honor Johnny Unitas and the league threatens him with a $25,000 fine and further discipline if he were to continue to wear them. As fans, we have to accept that decisions are made by the NFL for more than moral reasons. As someone else noted, this is as much if not MORE about whether having Vick on the field damages the NFL's reputation and ABILITY TO PROFIT. I wish that weren't the case, but I don't know how you can rationally look at the NFL's actions and say otherwise.

So from that perspective, I just cringe when we make this a moral debate in the first place. Morality comes into play by how we fans react. If enough of us make it painfully aware to the league that what Vick did is so deplorable we want him out of the league, well, chances are he won't be in the league. If, on the other hand, people begin to embrace the idea of his getting another chance in life, you can be sure he and Goodell will find a way for Vick to publicly show 'contrition.'

 

[goonsquad]

Vick will never play in the NFL again. No team will take the PR/marketing risk on him. The story was way too publicized and the emotions surrounding it are way too strong.

 

[Moe Green]

Michael Vick: What I'm Worth

Link

Michael Vick thinks Michael Vick is still worth a huge contract

By MJD

I don't know what kind of access Michael Vick has had to newspapers, magazines and the Internet in prison, but it seems like the news that he is no longer a hot commodity has not yet filtered down to Michael Vick.

In papers he submitted to a bankruptcy court, Vick indicated that he plans on making $10 million per season, which I'm pretty sure would be a record for an ex-con who had a career quarterback rating of 75.7 when he went away. From the Atlanta Journal Constitution:

The embattled Atlanta Falcons quarterback is hoping to earn as much as $10 million a year or more, according to court filings in his bankruptcy case. Under the plan he submitted to the court, Vick would keep the first $750,000 of his annual income over the next five years. After that, a percentage would go to his creditors based on a sliding scale. [...]

In a March 4 court filing, Vick’s attorneys say he “has every reason to believe upon his release, he will be reinstated into the NFL, resume his career and be able to earn a substantial living.”

“He is hopeful to play quarterback,” Daniel Meachum, an attorney and business manager for Vick, said in an interview. “There is no person with his talent in that position in all the league.”

That may have been true at one time, but there are also no quarterbacks in the league who have spent the last nine months sitting in a jail cell and eating prison food. I'm not a nutritionist or anything, but I'm pretty sure that's not what NFL team doctors would recommend for keeping a guy in optimum game shape.

The fact of the matter is that no one knows how Vick will perform when he gets out of the joint, though it seems extraordinarily unlikely that he'll look exactly the same as he did when he went in. Factor in the amount of teams scared off by the P.R. nightmare, and I think we're looking at a salary closer to $605,000, which was last year's veteran minimum for a seventh-year player.

Gracias, FanHouse.

Related: Michael Vick, Atlanta Falcons, NFL Criminal Behavior

 

[The Man with the Plan]

I didn't know Maurice Jones-Drew was a writer. He sure is talented.

 

[Holland Freeze]

Which is more cruel attaching electrodes to an animal and hosing them down while shocking them or hitting a woman?

Hitting a human man or woman is worse. If I am going to allow sensitivity determine my decision I will opt for the human species over another any day.

This is not a multiple choice. What Vick did could only be done by someone who is sub-human.

Multiple choice? What Vick did could be done by anyone if...

No it couldn't but we sure know who you are.

Could... and it tells just as much about you.

 

[Holland Freeze]

now, as for killing and torturing animals, that is most definitely NOT the same thing as hunting an animal. But it is close enough to make a point.

First of all, hunting is legal. ( I should stop here because that's really all that needs to be said - it's legal.) So was owning slaves at one time - legality means nothing in this conversation.

putting a noose around a dogs neck, spraying him down with water ( the sole intention being to make the dog more conducive to electricity) and them raising him and flipping a switch to fry him, is deplorable. Agreed.

the fact that you'd compare legalized, regulated hunting to torturing of animals ( dogs in this case) is comical. Because any other reaction would strike to close to an open nerve?

yes illegal hunting goes on, but these guys who hunt illegally, don't skin the animal alive , they don't mame it and let a pack of hunting dogs finish it off.they kill the animal with one shot, either with a bow/arrow combo, or with a rifle.there is no torture going on. Not always the case but along the same lines would you say the same about trapping?