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Green Bay Packers Thread (2 Viewers)

Ditkaless Wonders said:
I have enjoyed most of the ride this year though the mental errors make me a bit crazy.  I think the Packers are a good team, but not a great one.  I can see them handling Minnesota and the Cowboys.  I can see them beating Houston or K.C. or Buffalo or the Patriots.  What I cannot see is them prevailing over the Saints, 49ers, Seahawks or Ravens.  Sure, they will have a punchers chance, but so too the teams they will have to face early in the playoffs, and they ones if they advance, I just don't see it.  Still, runs happen, things come together, sometimes the best team does not win but sometimes it is the hottest one.  Here's to getting hot.  Here's to staying healthy.  Here's to more snow.
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Agreed...I think they can beat those teams...but need to play a near perfect game to do so.  They aren't up with them defensively and the OL is too inconsistent to rely on to keep Rodgers upright and protected and he is too inconsistent with the ball right now.

They just can't stop anyone up the middle right now, on the ground or in the air.  Martinez can tackle...but isn't a playmaker...Savage is coming on, but the lack of communication on the back end has been really bad.  Amos has been an ok signing, but with Savage still learning, its not enough to just be ok.  King back there looks great one play, the next he is 5 yards behind chasing a WR or TE streaking up the seam or down the field.

Love the Smith Bros...but it seems we are either get a sack, or have no real pressure at all on the QB.

Just too many inconsistencies that the great teams don't have.

Offensively...Jones and Williams are a very good compliment to each other.

Receiver wise...things seem to be coming along with Lazard being a bigger piece to the puzzle.  Geronimo may have peaked and MVS seems to have taken a step backwards.  Adams, of course, is still damn good.  Kumerow...fan favorite and nice guy and all, but think he is a JAG.  If he had shorter hair and didn't go to Whitewater, would the fans even care?  Is he another Janis?

TE is the black hole.  Jimmy was a mistake...Lewis actually has been a decent signing though from the blocking standpoint and when used, he can catch some too.  Obviously the jury is still out on Sternberger.

Coaching...Lafleur has been a mix but Id say mostly good.

Pettine...promising start and improved last year and promising start this year...but it has fallen off. Im going to guess without a huge run by the D, Lafleur is going to want his own guy next year.

 
The Packers are an average team, with a good record. We will not beat the 9er’s, Saints or Seattle for sure and will probably lose to the Bears this weekend and like 92% chance the Vikings destroy us. We could not put away a beat up Redskin team with a rookie QB at HOME!!! How pathetic is that. 

I was really watching a lot of offenses this weekend and the routes that seem to win often, and we don’t run them. Crossing routes still seem to be the best and most consistent routes. Besides Adams and I do like Lazard no one ever seems open, doesn’t matter who we are playing. Graham still sucks and we keep forcing him on the field instead of giving Jace a chance, who I am sure isn’t afraid to be tackled. Lewis is a very good blocker and seems to catch the passes thrown to him but he’s also slow as molasses. We need a small fast guy that can scare defenses and we still don’t have that guy.   

The defense has been good at times, but we struggle too much against quality opponents. Unless there’s a huge change I just don’t see us going very far in the playoffs if we do make them. 

 
The Claymaker said:
The Packers are an average team, with a good record. We will not beat the 9er’s, Saints or Seattle for sure and will probably lose to the Bears this weekend and like 92% chance the Vikings destroy us. We could not put away a beat up Redskin team with a rookie QB at HOME!!! How pathetic is that. 

I was really watching a lot of offenses this weekend and the routes that seem to win often, and we don’t run them. Crossing routes still seem to be the best and most consistent routes. Besides Adams and I do like Lazard no one ever seems open, doesn’t matter who we are playing. Graham still sucks and we keep forcing him on the field instead of giving Jace a chance, who I am sure isn’t afraid to be tackled. Lewis is a very good blocker and seems to catch the passes thrown to him but he’s also slow as molasses. We need a small fast guy that can scare defenses and we still don’t have that guy.   

The defense has been good at times, but we struggle too much against quality opponents. Unless there’s a huge change I just don’t see us going very far in the playoffs if we do make them. 
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The defense is again too reliant on turnovers.  And as I said earlier...its either, get a sack and do some stupid celebration...or get zero pressure at all (at least that is how it feels).

Offensively...I think a quick slot guy is about the only thing Id spend any draft or free agent capital on.  Otherwise...the entire offseason focus should be Oline.

Defensively...yeah, a lot of needs...mainly Dline and ILB.  And can never have too many secondary guys it seems.

 
Felt a bit like a loss yesterday.

This week will be interesting.  The Bears believe they have figured things out.  I am not so sure.  Yes, the beat a reeling Dallas team and Trubisky's numbers were good but I watched, and what I saw were lollipop throws, arriving late into double and triple coverage which inexplicably worked.  I am not so certain that the Bears do have it figured out.  As for the Packers, well yesterday the run D looked improved and the run offense reappeared.  Of course other things disappeared.  If they are going to bring this thing together it needs ot happen soon.  Still, a 2 seed as things currently sit so O.K.

 
My opinion of the Packers hasn't changed since early on. The record is good but much better than what this team really is. This team is a fringe playoff team and they deserve to make the playoffs but they have a lot of work to do or need to get lucky to get by teams like the Saints, 49ers and Seahawks. They are probably around the same level as the Vikings and Rams. The East is terrible and I think the Eagles win that division by default. The Cowboys are going through the motions and Jason Garrett is a coach that has lost his job just not officially yet.

 
I disagree about the offense Sho.  They need multiple WR's and another TE too to go along with offensive line help.  For WR draft a young stud in the early rounds and pick up a cheap veteran guy as well.  Damn I really, really wanted AJ Brown and I cringe when I see how well he's doing along with Deebo, Hollywood Brown, McLaurin etc.  A lot of great young WR's from this past draft class and GB is relying on 3 UDFA and a late round draft pick who's fast but is completely clueless on the field.  It's time to get Rodgers some weapons. 

Defense I don't think they are as terrible as some do.  If the offense could hold up their end I think the defense would be fine.  Definitely need to address Inside LB this offseason along with along big body on the DL.  Secondary is always a concern with Tramon being old and Josh Jackson apparently sucking. But I feel much better about this unit than I have in a number of years.

And overall while I wouldn't say they are average...you are what your record is. I will say they are the worst 10 win team in the league and yeah I see an early playoff exit.  

 
We can all pontificate about the defense, running/receiving game, coaching, etc. - but the fact remains this team is almost 100% dependant on #12.  Aaron Jones had his best game of the season, but it was still basically one score separating us from a team that is an absolute dumpster fire.  I think it may have been the worst game I've ever seen from Rogers.   If he returns to form, the Packers can probably win out.  If not, I think they could get swept in these last three games.

 
Pipes said:
I disagree about the offense Sho.  They need multiple WR's and another TE too to go along with offensive line help.  For WR draft a young stud in the early rounds and pick up a cheap veteran guy as well.  Damn I really, really wanted AJ Brown and I cringe when I see how well he's doing along with Deebo, Hollywood Brown, McLaurin etc.  A lot of great young WR's from this past draft class and GB is relying on 3 UDFA and a late round draft pick who's fast but is completely clueless on the field.  It's time to get Rodgers some weapons. 

Defense I don't think they are as terrible as some do.  If the offense could hold up their end I think the defense would be fine.  Definitely need to address Inside LB this offseason along with along big body on the DL.  Secondary is always a concern with Tramon being old and Josh Jackson apparently sucking. But I feel much better about this unit than I have in a number of years.

And overall while I wouldn't say they are average...you are what your record is. I will say they are the worst 10 win team in the league and yeah I see an early playoff exit.  
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I can understand that...and I know people will disagree.  I just think the talent, for the most part, is there at WR (and obviously RB).  TE...i was hoping to see more of what Sternberger could do, but because of the injury he was so far behind.  Maybe he shows more down the stretch, but not holding my breath.

But my reasoning is watching all of these other teams and even offenses...its not a who's who of great talent sometimes and they move the ball just fine.  Look at MN without Thielen right now.  They don't seem to have the same troubles because their OL is playing well.  Now...some of my complaint may even be with Rodgers still holding the ball.  But I think an Oline being solidified helps make WRs look a little better.  A little more time to gain separation.

And if they had taken Brown...we would have another hole possibly on the OLine...same with McLaurin...then we would have ignored TE.  There is always a bit of hindsight...well, we got the two FAs...so why take Gary.  Why didn't we take this guy...he blew up.  

GB was relying not just on this past draft at WR...but what they had coming back to build on their careers.  MVS, Allison....

I think there is a mix on D of some of it being offensive (though, its not always some 3 and out putting them back on the field).  They have given up too many big plays...still can't cover the middle, whether through the run game or TEs in the pass game...  I just can't say I have much confidence in that unit in a close game if they need a stop.

Agree about secondary...I don't think its a huge priority..just the mindset of it doesn't seem you can ever have too many guys back there.  I also am not as high on King as some.  The INTs are there, but so is inconsistency...the guy is usually the one trailing when we are getting burned for a big play.

 
Win ugly seems to be the theme this year.

They can't seem to play consistent and put teams away.  Always seems when they get the momentum, they go completely flat or have a mistake or two that kills a drive.  Yesterday, up 21-3 or even 6 (can't recall the exact situation in the game)...3rd and 5 and we have the communication issue where the line leaves Mack unblocked.  Seriously...I know he did not do a ton yesterday, but you may still want to block him.  It always seems like something like that, or the drops start coming out, or a holding penalty...just at the time things are going well and then we punt and teams start getting back into the game.

But...even with all of that...11-3 with decent standing in all of the tiebreakers it looks like.  If I am reading it right, they can lose to MN next week, and still win the division by beating the Lions.  And with Seattle and SF playing each other...and NO having some not so easy games left...GB still has a decent chance at the 1 seed.  While that sounds funny as this isn't a great team at all.  Which other team has not had some stumbles?  SF just lost to the Falcons, the Saints were blown out by the Falcons several weeks ago (and still have the Colts, Titans and Panthers...none of them are really pushovers).  Seattle got beat up by the Rams last week.  

Frankly...no team looks unbeatable...but several (SF, and MN) definitely look better than GB and NO and Seattle probably too...but have had moments of just blah as well.

At this point...its good to be relatively healthy...and just not make a lot of mistakes.

Looking way ahead, which I don't like much during the season...but heard this as people were talking about Tua coming out of Alabama with the injury and how he may fall.  With Rodgers getting up in age, and knowing it gives the guy time to recover from the injury and learn the game...do you take a talent like Tua this coming year in the late 1st round?  I get the...lets build now to win...but that talent being available and the idea of having Favre, to Rodgers, to Tua (if he has that talent and skill)...man, that may be hard to pass up.

 
Steal a Super bowl this year.  Draft Tua, trade Rodgers to Denver where Elway is so desperate to repeat his Peyton Manning success that he would give us three first, two seconds, and a third and Drew Lock.  Rebuild complete between the Super Bowl Parade and the opening of OTA's.  Oh, cut Jimmy Graham.   

 
They could lose to or beat anyone in the playoffs, NFC field will be crazy. Nice to have a shot at a bye this late but I really don’t know what to expect. I don’t think anyone has considered them a “good” team since the San Diego game, or certainly not since SF.

This is the healthiest I can ever remember them being. Gotta take advantage. SF and NO are racking up injuries on defense.

Sweeping the Bears and ending their season is just *chef’s kiss*

 
I complained about this each of the last three years and it still happens all game every game, we snap the ball with 3 or less seconds, every play. It gives the D line such an advantage because they know the snap is coming. We are the only team with a good record that does it and it’s an issue. I really don’t get why it’s such a problem to snap the ball at 8-10 seconds and stop letting the D get set and audible and reset. 

 
The Claymaker said:
I complained about this each of the last three years and it still happens all game every game, we snap the ball with 3 or less seconds, every play. It gives the D line such an advantage because they know the snap is coming. We are the only team with a good record that does it and it’s an issue. I really don’t get why it’s such a problem to snap the ball at 8-10 seconds and stop letting the D get set and audible and reset. 
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I assume this is on Rodgers.  He wants to get as good a read on the defense as possible, and obviously loves drawing presnap flags.  I completely agree with you how frustrating it is as a fan.  Apart from the issue you raise, there are also all the wasted timeouts and delay of game penalties we’ve seen over the years. 

 
The frustrating part for me is we have seen each element of the team perform from time to time, so we know the potential is there, passing, running, defense, yet we have also seen each fail or disappear.  We need to put it all together.  Maybe they can.  Maybe that comes with a new coach, a new system, some time to get consistent.  The thing is, time's up.  Do it now!

 
Ditkaless Wonders said:
The frustrating part for me is we have seen each element of the team perform from time to time, so we know the potential is there, passing, running, defense, yet we have also seen each fail or disappear.  We need to put it all together.  Maybe they can.  Maybe that comes with a new coach, a new system, some time to get consistent.  The thing is, time's up.  Do it now!
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Yup...we know the Oline can play well...we know Rodgers has the talent to play well...we know they have the RBs to be effective running the football.

The D has stepped up and played well at times.

Yet, they have yet to play a complete game really...will they?  I hope so.

Was reminded...even in that SB year in 2010...it was about going on a run.   They lost 7-3 against a Lions team that went 6-10.  That was the game Rodgers was knocked out, but the O had done nothing while he was in there.

 
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The Claymaker said:
I complained about this each of the last three years and it still happens all game every game, we snap the ball with 3 or less seconds, every play. It gives the D line such an advantage because they know the snap is coming. We are the only team with a good record that does it and it’s an issue. I really don’t get why it’s such a problem to snap the ball at 8-10 seconds and stop letting the D get set and audible and reset. 
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This is so frustrating to watch, especially for a veteran QB.  How can you do this game after game, burning crucial TOs often??  Almost as frustrating as how long #12 hangs onto the ball...I know we will miss him when gone, but really wish he would make some improvements on these items that seem basic to me.

 
yak651 said:
This is so frustrating to watch, especially for a veteran QB.  How can you do this game after game, burning crucial TOs often??  Almost as frustrating as how long #12 hangs onto the ball...I know we will miss him when gone, but really wish he would make some improvements on these items that seem basic to me.
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Remember 2011 when they had that quick strike slant offense.  That was beautiful.  Rodgers should, in my mind, get back an appreciation that a new set of downs is a beautiful thing.  Yes we want T.D.'s but we can get one on the drive without getting one that very play. 

I keep thinking back to the first half of the Viking game in week 2.  That was great.  lets recapture that and extend it into the second half and right on through to a Super Bowl win.

 
Ditkaless Wonders said:
Remember 2011 when they had that quick strike slant offense.  That was beautiful.  Rodgers should, in my mind, get back an appreciation that a new set of downs is a beautiful thing.  Yes we want T.D.'s but we can get one on the drive without getting one that very play. 
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2011 was beautiful.  We also had WRs back then who could win 1-on-1 battles and get open consistently.  We don’t have that today.

 
Alex P Keaton said:
2011 was beautiful.  We also had WRs back then who could win 1-on-1 battles and get open consistently.  We don’t have that today.
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The dip from Adams to the #2 wr right now is the largest difference in the NFL in that position. 
 

That’s the difference in our offense today. Back then, Jordy, Jennings, Jones, Driver, and Cobb and a TE that could actually move and threaten a defense. To be honest if you look at the skill positions around Rodgers right now, it’s amazing we have won 11 games. 

 
The Claymaker said:
The dip from Adams to the #2 wr right now is the largest difference in the NFL in that position. 
 

That’s the difference in our offense today. Back then, Jordy, Jennings, Jones, Driver, and Cobb and a TE that could actually move and threaten a defense. To be honest if you look at the skill positions around Rodgers right now, it’s amazing we have won 11 games. 
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I thought it was the Saints.

 
Ditkaless Wonders said:
I thought it was the Saints.
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I would say it’s close. Ginn and Smith vs MVS and Lazard. Remember their wr’ers didn’t have their QB for like 5 weeks, even though they won, let’s not try to compare Brees vs Bridgewater. But Cook, not a wr but quite a bit better than our #2, that’s not a RB. 

 
What a great defensive effort. Thank you D. 

Is Jordy Nelson still interested in playing? We could still use another WR to go with Adams and Lazard. 

 
Very nice win last night...not quite what I expected.  If the offense could have held onto the ball, would have been complete domination.

Defense was outstanding...yeah, they didn't have Cook, but that offense had been putting up points for a while and GB dominated the line of scrimmage.  Zadarius was incredible...definitely earning the money they paid him.  They managed pretty consistent pressure without really blitzing a lot which was good to see heading into the playoffs.  Also...pretty nice nights for Lowry and Kenny Clark who both seem to be coming on at the right time of the year.

Offense...hold onto the damn ball!!!  Even with that said, the two that put it on the ground made up for it with huge games.  Nice to see the slants working and the short quick passes to neutralize the Dline of Minnesota.  Lazard is becoming a nice option on those 3rd downs and pretty steady.  MVS has been a disappointment this year, didn't seem to build at all on a decent 1st year.  Oline played really well...and Aaron Jones is shining right now.  With all that said...Rodgers needs to quit relying so much on his arm...meaning, he can still sling it, but the misses he has is relying on the arm flick off the back foot and not stepping in...some passes are just off.  The pass behind Davante at the goalline that led to settling for a FG...another to Jones on a 3rd down that was behind him and he could not haul it in.   A couple sacks, and a holding call (on Vitale) when he held on to the ball too long (and one sack was expecting a TE to block for several seconds on a blitzing Viking.  Is it the age catching up to him?

but always good to win...especially on the road, in the division to take the division title and ensure a home playoff game.  One more win and they get a bye.  Maybe its been ugly most of the year, but still been winning (and again...look at the rest of the teams in the NFC...they ahve all lost some ugly games, the latest being Seattle against Arizona and they now have to turn to Beast Mode at RB in desperation).

 
Perhaps the most impressive thing of all for me was zero false starts in that stadium.

Too early for an update on Jamaal Williams but other than him I don’t think there were any injuries so that lucky run continues.

Great opportunity to end the year with 3 weeks of strong defense by beating up on the Lions. Getting the offense clicking would be nice too but I won’t count on it.

Football Outsiders finally moved the Packers ahead of the Vikings in their Super Bowl odds this week!

 
Positive, the Packers had five scoring drives.  They also had three other semi-sustained drives stopped, after a time, by their mistakes as much as Minnesota's efforts.  Maybe it is rounding into shape.

 
Ditkaless Wonders said:
Positive, the Packers had five scoring drives.  They also had three other semi-sustained drives stopped, after a time, by their mistakes as much as Minnesota's efforts.  Maybe it is rounding into shape.
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Yes...the turnovers sucked...but they looked more in rhythm than before...as I said above...when was the last time we saw that many slants?

 
Still enjoying the Vikings victory. Nice to sweep them.  The Bears too, nice to sweep them.  Lets make it complete and take care of the Lions.  All three were a bit insufferable the last couple of years as the Packers were injured.  I'd like to compensate for that without being insufferable.  Just some good quiet enjoyment. Of course how they view my enjoyment, the quality of it, well that's up to them.

 
Still boggles my mind that the Packers didn’t address tight end or slot receiver in the offseason. Can only imagine what this team would look like with Cole Beasley it Jameson Crowder manning the slot position. Or if there was an ounce of athleticism at tight end. Watching Jimmy Graham is painful.

 
Take care of Detroit.  Take care in Detroit.  Get sharp.  Get that bye.  Work the fundamentals.  Ball security and communication on offense and defense. Don't overlook Detroit maybe feeling they owe us one after the first game of the season where they feel they got jobbed by the refs.  Detroit has guys playing for their jobs, their football life.  They are not coming out for a Packer coronation, they are looking to be a spoiler.  Quiet their crowd early and quash their teams hopes early.  Go Pack go!

 
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@FieldYates

· 12m

The Packers converted $14.26M of Aaron Rodgers’ 2020 $19.5M roster bonus into a signing bonus, which allows that money to prorate over five seasons, including 2019. The Lions did the same with Matthew Stafford’s 2020 $6M roster bonus. GB creates 11.4M in 2020 cap, DET $4.8M.
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This will allow them to lock up someone like Kenny Clark.

 
They need to help Aaron out - I sound like a broken record - but where are the threats in the mistake of the field? Coach loves two tight end sets and you think Jimmy Graham (could be worst tight end who plays significant snaps in the NFL) and Marcedea Lewis are the answer? You don’t spend a dime on a quick slot receiver?

back up the truck for Austin Hopper or Hunter Henry and draft a receiver who can get separation in a short area in the first round.

 
Balco said:
They need to help Aaron out - I sound like a broken record - but where are the threats in the mistake of the field? Coach loves two tight end sets and you think Jimmy Graham (could be worst tight end who plays significant snaps in the NFL) and Marcedea Lewis are the answer? You don’t spend a dime on a quick slot receiver?

back up the truck for Austin Hopper or Hunter Henry and draft a receiver who can get separation in a short area in the first round.
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They need to draft a wr early.

Lazard is pretty good and I think ends up as the wr2 on the team with a rookie in the slot. 

I like going after Hooper. Henry no thanks, dont need another injury prone TE

 
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WR need is the quick slot guy.  Thought about this the last few weeks watching a guy and he was mentioned earlier this week...Cole Beasley. That style would take so much off of Adams and the other wrs (and make things easier for Rodgers)

But Rodgers also needs to get better.  He was awful for at least the first half today.  
 

I said in the game thread...and they have two weeks to get smarter...but once they weren’t hitting the long balls...the insistence on continuing to go for them was crazy.  Then they shortened things up, Rodgers got in a rhythm and they put points in the board.  And then late we saw three straight deep balls where the D had to bail them out and give the offense the chance for that FG.

Biggest need bow...get back to healthy.  Need the 1-2 punch of Jones and Williams.  Get the OL healthy and hopefully Lazard as he is the only only consistent  WR other than Adams.
 

Defense...eliminate the mental errors...and hope they font have another bad tackling day like today.  Also...better scheme up if a team goes quick dink and dunk to throw off this pass rush.  Part of that is having the offense put up points so teams cant just go tempo for fear they will give the Packers the ball back too quick.

Cannot sleepwalk through a half against a good team.

 
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Hooper isnt a guy id break the bank for.  The mistake was letting Cook go to play games with Lance Kendricks and then Graham (who blows)

 
Not sure how much the staff in Jacksonville values him but I would love for Packers to see if they can get DeDe Westbrook. He would be the absolute perfect slot guy and Aaron would know how to use him.

I should be doing cartwheels after the regular season they just had but I can’t see them going anywhere postseason because the lack of short passing game options. It’s painful to watch.

 
sho nuff said:
Hooper isnt a guy id break the bank for.  The mistake was letting Cook go to play games with Lance Kendricks and then Graham (who blows)
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I would absolutely pay market value for him or Henry or both. The packers need immediate help. Lewis and Graham will be gone next year (mercifully) and now Lafleur needs to get two very good tight ends to really run his offense.

 
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