High Stakes Leagues: Pros vs Joes (1 Viewer)

[Hot Sauce Guy]

While I enjoy the NFFC drafts, and will be doing them again this year, I always seem to end up in a league with FF writers / YouTube personalities.

Last year it was Ron Stewart (YouTube guy). This year it’s Eric Lundquist (Stokstic)

I don’t always mind testing my mettle against industry experts, but I also recognize that they play in dozens of leagues, (and can likely write off the expenses, or be sponsored/staked) while I pay out of pocket with limited resources to do maybe 1-3 leagues. Just the sheer number of drafts these guys do gives them more experience for that format, and of course it’s their job to be hyper-focused on FF, while for me it’s merely a hobby.

That said, I also recognize that industry professionals can also be wrong, plant their flags for players who don’t work out, and try strategies that may or may not pay dividends (Lundquist has the Kelce/Mahomes stack 1-2, and the rest of his team is a bit rough as a result). But the point is that they have enough rosters to be able to take risks like that whereas most folks do not.

I was thinking NFFC (and others) would be better if they did it like Golf, where professionals & amateurs can compete in pro-ams as an option, but
I’d love to have the option of competing against non-professionals, if that’s my preference.

Sort of like playing poker. Sure, I’d love to play in the WSOP, but I know I’d probably get my butt handed to me by Johnny Chan or Phil Ivy. I’m a halfway decent poker player, but I walked into a poker room and saw those two at my table, I would be unlikely to sit down.

I don’t know if it’s the same for the $750 or $1K leagues as those are too rich for my blood (er, wallet).

Is this an unreasonable take, or do others feel this way about the high stakes leagues? To continue the poker analogy, I don’t look around the league & feel like I’m the sucker, but I definitely recognize that I’m swimming with sharks.

Discuss…

@Joe Bryant - I’d love to hear your thoughts on this.


ETA: last year I was the front runner in the league with Ron, 1st in points and tied for 1st record until about week 13 when the injury bug combined with BYEs to knock me out the last 3-4 weeks.

 

[nightmare]

You will only get better playing against better opponents.
Take the info and play in 10 $50 leagues and see what happens.

How limited is your money? It's rare if you play in 1 or 2 higher stakes leagues and cash.

 

[fruity pebbles]

I used to like playing in dynasty leagues with fantasy writers. My own experience, other than Bloom, I found most of them lacking. I did find most of them pretty easy to trade with as their rankings are front and center.

 

[TripItUp]

I would tear these self proclaimed "pros" apart

Back in the day, FBG used to do a staff vs. messageboard draft....would love to see that brought back.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I used to like playing in dynasty leagues with fantasy writers. My own experience, other than Bloom, I found most of them lacking. I did find most of them pretty easy to trade with as their rankings are front and center.

Unfortunately these are no-trade formats, for fairly obvious reasons.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

You will only get better playing against better opponents.

While true, the point was more about the advantages professionals have as compared to amateurs in terms of sheer number of leagues & less limited resources.

 

[candian fantasy guy]

If you’re going to play in these big tourneys, then you will play with the sharks. I personally have only gotten better over the years playing in those leagues. One year, I the same guy in 4 of 9 leagues. Kinda bizarre, but just the luck of the draw.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

If you’re going to play in these big tourneys, then you will play with the sharks. I personally have only gotten better over the years playing in those leagues

I agree - I’m definitely a better player for that level of competition.

But that’s not really the point.

One year, I the same guy in 4 of 9 leagues. Kinda bizarre, but just the luck of the draw.

This is the point. It’s not totally luck of the draw if that person is in 100 leagues and you’re in 9.

 

[acarey50]

FFPC has "Beginner's Only" leagues that you can join if you want, open only if you have played in less than 10 contests and won less than $1000

For the other questions, I'm not sure I agree. The big payout tournies like NFFC, FFPC, FPC and especially the large Underdog tournies require high volume players to hit their guarantees. They do cap entries for those, and on some do have single entry, but those are much smaller in size given the obvious limitation of not allowing multiple entry.

Also, by law the sites have to identify the "experienced" users. On FFPC, it's a green badge for playing more than X number of leagues or winning more than X dollars - Underdog has badges to identify Experienced and Highly Experienced players

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Also, by law the sites have to identify the "experienced" users. On FFPC, it's a green badge for playing more than X number of leagues or winning more than X dollars - Underdog has badges to identify Experienced and Highly Experienced players

Interesting. I don’t think NFFC has any such identifier. I just looked and Lindquist doesn’t. I didn’t see any for Ron last year.

That’s cool that FFPC has the beginners tournies.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

For the other questions, I'm not sure I agree. The big payout tournies like NFFC, FFPC, FPC and especially the large Underdog tournies require high volume players to hit their guarantees

This is a good point that I hadn’t considered.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Interestingly I looked up the players in my draft tonight, and I have 2 of the top 80 all-time earners (100K+ & 80K+ respectively) - neither are professional writers or FF personas, so I guess the initial idea of "professional" I used above isn't really relevant either.

I'd probably rather be in a league with a FF writer than with a top 80 all-time earner, now that I think about it. I'm not sure those are 1 and the same.

hmm....maybe it is just luck of the draw.

 

[TripItUp]

I'd probably rather be in a league with a FF writer than with a top 80 all-time earner, now that I think about it. I'm not sure those are 1 and the same.

Definitely

The pro football handicappers that actually bet big money are much better sports bettors than the guys that talk about it on podcasts and articles they've written.

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

If you are playing in big national contests, this should be expected.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

If you are playing in big national contests, this should be expected.

Yes, obviously, but I did pose a question.

It’s not really about *me* or my ability to swim with sharks. As I said, I’ve been playing in that format for years.

It’s more just a general observation that this is something that happens, and wondering what, if any, are possible solutions for the general public.

If I was worried about it, I wouldn’t play in that format.

Not sure why everything gets personalized around here - sometimes I like to play devil’s advocate when something seems flawed. Often it breaks out into interesting discussion.

Perhaps this isn’t one of those times.

 

[nittanylion]

FWIW, a very high number of the 'Joe's' in the FFCP Pro's vs Joe's Leagues are actually some of the 'sharkiest' of sharks, and none of them are 'industry' guys, just tremendously successful high stakes players who have won a boatload of money over the years. In order to be considered for the drawing of the Joe's slots, you have to purchase your FFPC Teams very early in the year, which most of the large-portfolio high stakes players do, whether their own money, or they're being staked by someone.

If you check the FFPC youtube channel, you can see videos of these drafts, hosted by Eric Balkman, often with guest hosts and live in-draft interviews with some of the Players. Balkman runs down the names of the Players, and the Joe's are mostly a who's who of top all time money winners in High Stakes FF. Additionally, there's a live chat going on, largely populated by fellow high profile large portfolio High Stakes Players. Many of them know each other very well.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

FWIW, a very high number of the 'Joe's' in the FFCP Pro's vs Joe's Leagues are actually some of the 'sharkiest' of sharks, and none of them are 'industry' guys, just tremendously successful high stakes players who have won a boatload of money over the years. In order to be considered for the drawing of the Joe's slots, you have to purchase your FFPC Teams very early in the year, which most of the large-portfolio high stakes players do, whether their own money, or they're being staked by someone.

If you check the FFPC youtube channel, you can see videos of these drafts, hosted by Eric Balkman, often with guest hosts and live in-draft interviews with some of the Players. Balkman runs down the names of the Players, and the Joe's are mostly a who's who of top all time money winners in High Stakes FF. Additionally, there's a live chat going on, largely populated by fellow high profile large portfolio High Stakes Players. Many of them know each other very well.

Yeah, this morning’s draft had a dude in the low 30s all time earnings ($180k) and 2 dudes in the 40s.

There’s a public list from NFFC of the all time earnings leaders.

I give myself a 3-pack of $350 leagues for my birthday every year - this year only 1 league didn’t have a bona fide shark in it. And even then I believe we had 1 writer for an online FF site.

I also drafted at 3 different times of day. The 8 PM PT draft didn’t have any on the list. The 5 PM PT had 2. This morning (11:00 AM PT) had 3.

Not sure if that’s a trend, but I could see late night drafts maybe keeping out the east coast folks. Who knows who among them are sharks geographically speaking.

Personally I just focus on my own draft & let it flow. I might scope the ‘sperts & all-time winners after the fact just to see what they did. I noticed a trend today where the buzziest hyped guys all went a few rounds early to those teams. The AT Perry, Puka Nakua types. They also seem to regularly take the discount on JTaylor/Josh Jacobs/Alvin Kamara types.

Like I said, I’m not scared of the sharks or i wouldn’t enter. It’s more about the number of entries that I feel gives people an advantage, similar to the Draft Kings massive contests.

I guess I’ll just have to win that grand prize so I can afford to enter 20 teams next year.

 

[massraider]

I might scope the ‘sperts & all-time winners after the fact just to see what they did. I noticed a trend today where the buzziest hyped guys all went a few rounds early to those teams. The AT Perry, Puka Nakua types. They also seem to regularly take the discount on JTaylor/Josh Jacobs/Alvin Kamara types.

Those buzzy rookie guys are the ones most likely to have a quiet start (when owners do NOT need their late rounders to start) and have a top 12 finish down the stretch.

People try and get a safe guy in the late rounds, some vet slot guy with no upside. This is how you have enviable depth, finish top 5 or 6 in scoring, and lose in the playoffs.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I might scope the ‘sperts & all-time winners after the fact just to see what they did. I noticed a trend today where the buzziest hyped guys all went a few rounds early to those teams. The AT Perry, Puka Nakua types. They also seem to regularly take the discount on JTaylor/Josh Jacobs/Alvin Kamara types.

Those buzzy rookie guys are the ones most likely to have a quiet start (when owners do NOT need their late rounders to start) and have a top 12 finish down the stretch.

People try and get a safe guy in the late rounds, some vet slot guy with no upside. This is how you have enviable depth, finish top 5 or 6 in scoring, and lose in the playoffs.

I’m going BPA the whole way.

I managed to get a really deep bench in one of my 3 leagues this way. The other two drafts I felt behind the 8-ball the whole way.

I think I’ll at least compete in all 3 leagues. One team feels like it has some potential to go deep, where Eke fell to 1.06 & Henry to 2.07. That’s the one with the depth at RB, TE & receiver and I managed LJax/Pitts, too.

Health will be a big factor as always but I really like that team.

FBG gave it a B-. lol

 

[Cowboysfan8]

Back in the day, FBG used to do a staff vs. messageboard draft....would love to see that brought back.

In

 

[Soulfly3]

Wow, there's lottery pros!?!?!?