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How good is Denver? (1 Viewer)

Well, I'll tell you what, if the 2004 New England Patriots show up to play the Denver Broncos, they'll probably be favored.
You want to know what ELSE the Patriots haven't done in the past 4 years? For one, they haven't sent a team to the playoffs that was worse than 6th in the NFL in points allowed. This season, they're 18th. They were also a combined 5-0 against Indy and Denver in 2003-2004, and a combined 0-2 against Indy and Denver in 2005.
the fact ALSO remains that no team has a better record in weeks following the bye, since the bye was introduced, than the Denver Broncos.
Inconsistent.
Not at all inconsistant. I said if the 2004 Patriots showed up, they'd be favored. Unfortunately, the 2004 Patriots don't exist anymore. Now there's just the 2005 Patriots, which aren't anywhere NEAR as good as the 2004 version. As a result, the 2005 Patriots will be underdogs to Denver- as they should be, since Denver is a much better team than the 2005 Patriots, even if they're potentially worse than the 2004 Patriots.
I understand what you said. The inconsistency is in refusing to acknowledge the past accomplishments of this 2005 Patriots team, then bringing up the Broncos' record in games after the bye.

The Broncos haven't had a bye week since the Elway/Terrell Davis Superbowl teams. How can you possibly cite their record in games after the bye week from 1998, when you won't acknowledge the Patriots' playoff record from 2001-2004?

Inconsistent.

 
WHAT? Denver should ABSOLUTELY be favored. Denver is the 2nd best team in the entire NFL, Denver has the biggest HFA in the NFL, Denver is healthy (and NE is not), and home teams win 80% of the time in the second round. Lots of people would put money on Denver- at least the people who gamble because they like making money. Denver's got the third best odds of winning the SB, behind Indy and Seattle, so obviously Vegas likes them. And I think Vegas has demonstrated that they are far more knowledgeable than the average fan.

I've made the offer SEVERAL times, but no one has taken me up on it yet... but I will make a sig-bet that New England loses next week, regardless of who they play.

I read that a Vegas insider predicted that if Denver faces NE, they'll be favored by 3, and if they face Cincy, they'll be favored by 5.
Look, IMO the Broncos are the 2nd-best team in the league and all that. I don't need the canned lecture you've given out 245 times already.I'm saying from a betting standpoint, do you really think 1/2 of bettors would bet against the Patriots if they were getting 3 points, even against a Broncos team that they've historically had problems with under Brady?

 
Look, IMO the Broncos are the 2nd-best team in the league and all that. I don't need the canned lecture you've given out 245 times already.

I'm saying from a betting standpoint, do you really think 1/2 of bettors would bet against the Patriots if they were getting 3 points, even against a Broncos team that they've historically had problems with under Brady?
I don't know how many times I have had to say this, but the perception is reality when it comes time to setting the line. I'm glad at least 1 Den homer/fan can see that w/o getting his panties in a bunch. Den should and will be favored in the game. I just don't think it will be by much... 2/3 points IMO. As SSOG has said himself, look at the predictions thread at how many people are picking NE to WIN. That is not just the perception that a lot of NFL fans have. It will be the reality when it comes time for Vegas to balance the line for a profit. You can keep telling us over and over again how great you thnk your team is though...
 
I understand what you said.

The inconsistency is in refusing to acknowledge the past accomplishments of this 2005 Patriots team, then bringing up the Broncos' record in games after the bye.

The Broncos haven't had a bye week since the Elway/Terrell Davis Superbowl teams. How can you possibly cite their record in games after the bye week from 1998, when you won't acknowledge the Patriots' playoff record from 2001-2004?

Inconsistent.
I'm not talking about a playoff bye. I'm talking about a bye week, period. And that's not just past history, because Denver won after the bye this season, too.The majority of coaches fare no better after the bye than they do on every other week. Shanahan's record on opening day and after a bye suggest that, if you give him an extra week to prepare, he's going to be hard to beat.

Look, IMO the Broncos are the 2nd-best team in the league and all that. I don't need the canned lecture you've given out 245 times already.

I'm saying from a betting standpoint, do you really think 1/2 of bettors would bet against the Patriots if they were getting 3 points, even against a Broncos team that they've historically had problems with under Brady?
Yup. I think they might be nervous about it, but they'd be even MORE nervous about betting against a home Denver team that's, like you said, possibly the second best in the league. Especially since Denver's beaten New England 3 of the last 4 times they met, and the one that NE won, Denver was starting Danny Kanell (and they still almost pulled it out).
I don't know how many times I have had to say this, but the perception is reality when it comes time to setting the line. I'm glad at least 1 Den homer/fan can see that w/o getting his panties in a bunch. Den should and will be favored in the game. I just don't think it will be by much... 2/3 points IMO. As SSOG has said himself, look at the predictions thread at how many people are picking NE to WIN. That is not just the perception that a lot of NFL fans have. It will be the reality when it comes time for Vegas to balance the line for a profit. You can keep telling us over and over again how great you thnk your team is though...
I understand that perception is reality when it comes to setting the line, but I also understand that the perception of people who actually PUT MONEY ON THE GAMES tends to be pretty informed. For instance, the perception around the boards is that Denver has less than a 50% chance to get out of next weekend. The perception among gamblers, though, is that Denver's got a better chance of winning the SB (9:2) than anyone except Indy (even odds) and Seattle (7:2).Perception maybe reality among gamblers, but perception among casual fans is NOT perception among gamblers. In fact, there is a huge disconnect between casual fans and gamblers when it comes to Denver. Casual fans are always down on Denver, but gamblers LOVE Denver. How much do gamblers love Denver? Denver's been favored in 29 out of 32 regular season games going back the last 2 seasons- all except last season at SD, this season at Jax, and this season at SD (when Denver was expected to rest everyone).

 
Yup. I think they might be nervous about it, but they'd be even MORE nervous about betting against a home Denver team that's, like you said, possibly the second best in the league. Especially since Denver's beaten New England 3 of the last 4 times they met, and the one that NE won, Denver was starting Danny Kanell (and they still almost pulled it out).

Denver's been favored in 29 out of 32 regular season games going back the last 2 seasons- all except last season at SD, this season at Jax, and this season at SD (when Denver was expected to rest everyone).
Fair enough. I know Denver generally gets a lot of money, but I figure the Patriots probably do, too. It'll be interesting to see what the "expert" picks are from ESPN and all those other types. You'd figure those probably have a slight effect on these things.Also, very interesting stat in the 2nd part I quoted. Does this trend go back to the previous 2 years as well?

 
I understand what you said. 

The inconsistency is in refusing to acknowledge the past accomplishments of this 2005 Patriots team, then bringing up the Broncos' record in games after the bye. 

The Broncos haven't had a bye week since the Elway/Terrell Davis Superbowl teams.  How can you possibly cite their record in games after the bye week from 1998, when you won't acknowledge the Patriots' playoff record from 2001-2004? 

Inconsistent.
I'm not talking about a playoff bye. I'm talking about a bye week, period. And that's not just past history, because Denver won after the bye this season, too.The majority of coaches fare no better after the bye than they do on every other week. Shanahan's record on opening day and after a bye suggest that, if you give him an extra week to prepare, he's going to be hard to beat.
Then why do ignore Brady's, and the Patriots', playoff numbers? I'm not just talking about past history - they're undefeated this year, and Brady has only thrown three picks in ten playoff games (0 picks in 1 playoff game this year).
 
Yup. I think they might be nervous about it, but they'd be even MORE nervous about betting against a home Denver team that's, like you said, possibly the second best in the league. Especially since Denver's beaten New England 3 of the last 4 times they met, and the one that NE won, Denver was starting Danny Kanell (and they still almost pulled it out).

Denver's been favored in 29 out of 32 regular season games going back the last 2 seasons- all except last season at SD, this season at Jax, and this season at SD (when Denver was expected to rest everyone).
Fair enough. I know Denver generally gets a lot of money, but I figure the Patriots probably do, too. It'll be interesting to see what the "expert" picks are from ESPN and all those other types. You'd figure those probably have a slight effect on these things.Also, very interesting stat in the 2nd part I quoted. Does this trend go back to the previous 2 years as well?
I have no idea. I read before the Jacksonville game that it was only the second regular season game that Denver was an underdog in since the beginning of 2004. I thought it was interesting, so I started tracking it. Denver wasn't an underdog again until the final week against SD.I once knew of a site that listed all of the historical lines, but I forget what it was now. If anyone knows where I could get a list of what all the lines were for all the games for the past few seasons, I would be very appreciative.

 
Denver is only a 3 point favorite against New England next week despite being the better team, being a dominant home team and coming off a bye. In a current ESPN poll, over 70% of those voting are picking the Patriots to win. See, Vegas is smart. They know everyone is going to load up on the Patriots and then laugh when the Broncos win and cover. :)

 
I am well aware that Denver has had New England's number in the past. I'm not writing off this game by any means. The Broncos are a very good team, and their fans have every right to expect that their team will do better than one and done in the playoffs. I will say that I take comfort in the following things: - Their last meeting was fairly close- New England seems to have played better since their last meeting- Denver seems to have played worse since their last meeting- New England has beaten Denver in the past- New England typically fares much better the second time they face a team in a season- Denver has looked horrible in their last two playoff gamesHaving said all of that, I understand why people would think the Broncos deserve to be favored. I generally disagree, and mostly because of this fact:- New England is 10-0 in the playoffs under Belichick and BradyOne of the biggest rules of sports gambling is that you don't bet against a streak. New England hasn't lost a playoff game since 1998. Brady is 10-0 in the playoffs. When someone finally beats the Brady-led Patriots in the playoffs - something I'm sure most of us believe will eventually happen - it will have to be considered an upset.

 
Denver is only a 3 point favorite against New England next week despite being the better team, being a dominant home team and coming off a bye. In a current ESPN poll, over 70% of those voting are picking the Patriots to win. See, Vegas is smart. They know everyone is going to load up on the Patriots and then laugh when the Broncos win and cover. :)
I wouldn't trust the ESPN poll. 7) Which running game would you rather have in this game?

74.5% Denver: Mike Anderson and Tatum Bell

25.5% New England: Corey Dillon

<_<

8) Who is the best receiving option in this game?

52.1% Deion Branch, Patriots

31.6% Rod Smith, Broncos

8.8% Ben Watson, Patriots

4.0% Ashley Lelie, Broncos

2.9% David Patten, Patriots <-- <_<

0.6% Jeb Putzier, Broncos

 
I wouldn't trust the ESPN poll.

7) Which running game would you rather have in this game?

74.5% Denver: Mike Anderson and Tatum Bell

25.5% New England: Corey Dillon

<_<
I don't understand the complaint here. Dillon's looked old all year - NE's running game has looked better with Faulk or Pass running the ball.
 
I am well aware that Denver has had New England's number in the past. I'm not writing off this game by any means. The Broncos are a very good team, and their fans have every right to expect that their team will do better than one and done in the playoffs.

I will say that I take comfort in the following things:

- Their last meeting was fairly close

- New England seems to have played better since their last meeting

- Denver seems to have played worse since their last meeting

- New England has beaten Denver in the past

- New England typically fares much better the second time they face a team in a season

- Denver has looked horrible in their last two playoff games

Having said all of that, I understand why people would think the Broncos deserve to be favored. I generally disagree, and mostly because of this fact:

- New England is 10-0 in the playoffs under Belichick and Brady

One of the biggest rules of sports gambling is that you don't bet against a streak. New England hasn't lost a playoff game since 1998. Brady is 10-0 in the playoffs. When someone finally beats the Brady-led Patriots in the playoffs - something I'm sure most of us believe will eventually happen - it will have to be considered an upset.
Denver has won their last 10 home games, 8 of which were this season, which is more of a reflection of the actual team that will take the field next Saturday, which is more than can be said for New England and their 10 consecutive playoff wins (9 of which were in previous seasons). Also, while NE has not lost in the playoffs since 1998, the Broncos have not lost at home in the playoffs since 1996.

The first game this season between the two was only close because New England scored some late TD's while the Broncos defense was struggling with closing games out in the 4th quarter, which has not been a problem since mid-season.

Denver looking horrible in their last two playoff games means nothing. Pittsburgh looked bad in their last playoff game before today, but looked awfully good today against Cincinnati.

It will be an upset if the Patriots win next week. The Broncos are a dominant home team. They are the better team. If they lose, it will be an upset.

 
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It always seems like the Patriots play at Denver. And not too good either. But I'm still taking the Pats. :thumbup:

 
I wouldn't trust the ESPN poll.

7) Which running game would you rather have in this game?

74.5% Denver: Mike Anderson and Tatum Bell

25.5% New England: Corey Dillon
How is that incorrect? If anything, it should be even more lopsided considering Dillon has been hurt off and on all year and Denver had the 2nd best running game in the NFL this season. It is simple math, really.
 
Denver Sucks. THey can't win a playoff game without ELway. My advice to Denver. Sign ELway to a one year deal and start him becuase Tommy Frazier is better than Jake Plummer. GO GIANTS!!

 
I am well aware that Denver has had New England's number in the past.  I'm not writing off this game by any means.  The Broncos are a very good team, and their fans have every right to expect that their team will do better than one and done in the playoffs.

I will say that I take comfort in the following things:

- Their last meeting was fairly close

- New England seems to have played better since their last meeting

- Denver seems to have played worse since their last meeting

- New England has beaten Denver in the past

- New England typically fares much better the second time they face a team in a season

- Denver has looked horrible in their last two playoff games

Having said all of that, I understand why people would think the Broncos deserve to be favored.  I generally disagree, and mostly because of this fact:

- New England is 10-0 in the playoffs under Belichick and Brady

One of the biggest rules of sports gambling is that you don't bet against a streak.  New England hasn't lost a playoff game since 1998.  Brady is 10-0 in the playoffs.  When someone finally beats the Brady-led Patriots in the playoffs - something I'm sure most of us believe will eventually happen - it will have to be considered an upset.
Denver has won their last 10 games, 8 of which were this season, which is more of a reflection of the actual team that will take the field next Saturday, which is more than can be said for New England. Also, while NE has not lost in the playoffs since 1998, the Broncos have not lost at home in the playoffs since 1996.

The first game this season between the two was only close because New England scored some late TD's while the Broncos defense was struggling with closing games out in the 4th quarter, which has not been a problem since mid-season.

Denver looking horrible in their last two playoff games means nothing. Pittsburgh looked bad in their last playoff game before today, but looked awfully good today against Cincinnati.

It will be an upset if the Patriots win next week. The Broncos are a dominant home team. They are the better team. If they lose, it will be an upset.
Pittsburg was on a roll last year too. What happened to that "reflection of the actual team that will take the field ?"
 
I wouldn't trust the ESPN poll. 

7) Which running game would you rather have in this game?

74.5% Denver: Mike Anderson and Tatum Bell

25.5% New England: Corey Dillon
How is that incorrect? If anything, it should be even more lopsided considering Dillon has been hurt off and on all year and Denver had the 2nd best running game in the NFL this season. It is simple math, really.
Oh, I agree. I can't believe 1/4 of all football fans believe that Dillon gives the Patriots a better running game than Anderson/Bell.
 
I am well aware that Denver has had New England's number in the past.  I'm not writing off this game by any means.  The Broncos are a very good team, and their fans have every right to expect that their team will do better than one and done in the playoffs.

I will say that I take comfort in the following things:

- Their last meeting was fairly close

- New England seems to have played better since their last meeting

- Denver seems to have played worse since their last meeting

- New England has beaten Denver in the past

- New England typically fares much better the second time they face a team in a season

- Denver has looked horrible in their last two playoff games

Having said all of that, I understand why people would think the Broncos deserve to be favored.  I generally disagree, and mostly because of this fact:

- New England is 10-0 in the playoffs under Belichick and Brady

One of the biggest rules of sports gambling is that you don't bet against a streak.  New England hasn't lost a playoff game since 1998.  Brady is 10-0 in the playoffs.  When someone finally beats the Brady-led Patriots in the playoffs - something I'm sure most of us believe will eventually happen - it will have to be considered an upset.
Denver has won their last 10 home games, 8 of which were this season, which is more of a reflection of the actual team that will take the field next Saturday, which is more than can be said for New England and their 10 consecutive playoff wins (9 of which were in previous seasons). Also, while NE has not lost in the playoffs since 1998, the Broncos have not lost at home in the playoffs since 1996.

The first game this season between the two was only close because New England scored some late TD's while the Broncos defense was struggling with closing games out in the 4th quarter, which has not been a problem since mid-season.

Denver looking horrible in their last two playoff games means nothing. Pittsburgh looked bad in their last playoff game before today, but looked awfully good today against Cincinnati.

It will be an upset if the Patriots win next week. The Broncos are a dominant home team. They are the better team. If they lose, it will be an upset.
OK, New England has a streak with Brady/Belichick, and Denver has a streak of games at home. So when it comes down to it, which do you believe is better:Denver's home field advantage or

Brady/Belichick

I think most unbiased people would say Brady/Belichick, but I'm sure you'll come up with a reason to disagree.

 
I am well aware that Denver has had New England's number in the past. I'm not writing off this game by any means. The Broncos are a very good team, and their fans have every right to expect that their team will do better than one and done in the playoffs.

I will say that I take comfort in the following things:

- Their last meeting was fairly close

Their last meeting was 28-6 before Denver slipped into prevent defense and let New England make the score look respectable.

- New England seems to have played better since their last meeting

New England was 3-6 against teams with winning records- 4-6 if you include Jax.

- Denver seems to have played worse since their last meeting

Denver was 3-1 over their first 4 games. They were 3-1 over their next 4 games. They were 3-1 over their next 4 games. They were 4-0 over their last 4 games. They were 7-3 against teams with winning records, 2-1 since the bye. Please, explain to me how Denver has "played worse".

- New England has beaten Denver in the past

Yes, in 2003, when Denver was starting Danny Kanell, and even then, only through heroic end-of-game efforts. Meaning the 2003 SB Champion NE Patriots were barely better than the Danny Kanell-led Broncos. Denver has won the other 3 of the last 4 meetings.

- New England typically fares much better the second time they face a team in a season

Sounds like you're reaching, here. New England has lost the second game to Miami two straight seasons now.

- Denver has looked horrible in their last two playoff games

And New England looked horrible its last playoff game before it embarked on this 10-0 run. The last two Denver playoff teams were 10-6 wildcards. This Denver team is a 13-3 #2 seed. Personally, I believe how they performed THIS SEASON says more about who they are than how they performed last season, and THIS SEASON, no team has more wins against teams with winning records, and only Indy has a better winning percentage against winning teams. I mean, New England looked horrible in their last game against Denver, but you don't seem to think that counts anymore. 10 weeks ago is meaningless, but two seasons ago still carries weight, I guess.

Having said all of that, I understand why people would think the Broncos deserve to be favored. I generally disagree, and mostly because of this fact:

- New England is 10-0 in the playoffs under Belichick and Brady

One of the biggest rules of sports gambling is that you don't bet against a streak. New England hasn't lost a playoff game since 1998. Brady is 10-0 in the playoffs. When someone finally beats the Brady-led Patriots in the playoffs - something I'm sure most of us believe will eventually happen - it will have to be considered an upset.
Comments included above. As has been mentioned, the Patriots have won 10 straight in the playoffs- and Denver has won 10 straight at home. And neither stat will mean a thing to the team that loses.
7) Which running game would you rather have in this game?

74.5% Denver: Mike Anderson and Tatum Bell

25.5% New England: Corey Dillon

<_<
Denver- #2 in the league in rushing (#1 if you discount QB rushing yards).New England- #24 in the league in rushing.

Mike Anderson: 239/1014, 4.2 per carry.

Tatum Bell: 173/921, 5.3 per carry.

Corey Dillon: 209/733, 3.5 per carry.

Oh yeah, clearly only a blind idiot would rather have Denver's running game than New England's.

Pittsburg was on a roll last year too. What happened to that "reflection of the actual team that will take the field ?"
Pittsburgh wasn't on a roll. Big Ben had been struggling badly for 6 or 7 games before New England ever came to town. Pittsburgh needed a missed NYJ field goal to even MAKE the AFC championship game. Vegas was really smart, and figured New England had a better than 50% chance to win the game- as evidenced by the fact that NE was favored.Notice that, this season, New England will NOT be favored. That's Vegas's way of saying "hey genius, they've got a less than 50% chance of winning this game".

OK, New England has a streak with Brady/Belichick, and Denver has a streak of games at home. So when it comes down to it, which do you believe is better:

Denver's home field advantage or

Brady/Belichick

I think most unbiased people would say Brady/Belichick, but I'm sure you'll come up with a reason to disagree.
Why would most unbiased people say Brady/Belichick? Brady and Belichick have bad games. Denver never has thick air.Let's look at it this way- THIS SEASON'S DENVER SQUAD is 8-0 at home. THIS SEASON'S NEW ENGLAND SQUAD is 1-0 in the playoffs. Which is a stronger statement, 8-0, or 1-0?

 
OK, New England has a streak with Brady/Belichick, and Denver has a streak of games at home.  So when it comes down to it, which do you believe is better:

Denver's home field advantage or

Brady/Belichick

I think most unbiased people would say Brady/Belichick, but I'm sure you'll come up with a reason to disagree.
Why would most unbiased people say Brady/Belichick? Brady and Belichick have bad games. Denver never has thick air.Let's look at it this way- THIS SEASON'S DENVER SQUAD is 8-0 at home. THIS SEASON'S NEW ENGLAND SQUAD is 1-0 in the playoffs. Which is a stronger statement, 8-0, or 1-0?
I think it's great that you're a big fan of your team.
 
7) Which running game would you rather have in this game?

74.5% Denver: Mike Anderson and Tatum Bell

25.5% New England: Corey Dillon

<_<
Denver- #2 in the league in rushing (#1 if you discount QB rushing yards).New England- #24 in the league in rushing.

Mike Anderson: 239/1014, 4.2 per carry.

Tatum Bell: 173/921, 5.3 per carry.

Corey Dillon: 209/733, 3.5 per carry.

Oh yeah, clearly only a blind idiot would rather have Denver's running game than New England's.
I've already responded to this, but apparently you were busy I'll say it again. I'm amazed that Dillon got a quarter of the votes, and I question the poll results because of it.
 
Denver is only a 3 point favorite against New England next week despite being the better team, being a dominant home team and coming off a bye. In a current ESPN poll, over 70% of those voting are picking the Patriots to win. See, Vegas is smart. They know everyone is going to load up on the Patriots and then laugh when the Broncos win and cover. :)
:D
 
And your not of yours? -BOSTONfredDenver beat the Pats in the regular season at home, and the rematch is set for next weekend. This Denver team is not the same team that got blown out by the colts (not the pats) the last two playoffs, and neither is this the patriots team that won 10 playoff games in a row. This is this years teams, and we will see how they fair in a weeks time.

 
Well to me the Broncos are one of the "FEW" teams that have actually controled Brady and BelichickBrady vs DenverDATE Opp GS Att Comp Pct Yds TD Int Rate Sac Yds Att Yds Avg Lg TD Fum Rec 10/28/01 @Denver L 20-31 38 25 65.8 203 2 4 57.1 2 20 2 -1 -0.5 0 0 1 1 10/27/02 Denver L 16-24 Yes 29 15 51.7 130 1 0 75.4 5 20 2 5 2.5 4 0 0 0 11/03/03 @Denver W 30-26 Yes 35 20 57.1 350 3 1 108.0 0 0 2 -1 -0.5 0 0 1 010/16/05 @DEN L 20-28 Yes 46 24 52.2 299 1 0 79.9 0 0 1 12 12.0 12 0 0 0 Well looks like he is 1-3 vs Denver for his career.So with around a average Rating of 77. taking out his High 108 and low 57 to be fair. And I think this Defence of Denver's is better than it has been in the past.So I say bring it on NE. To be the Champ you have to knock out the Champ and I think Denver will be able to do that this week.

 
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I've already responded to this, but apparently you were busy I'll say it again. I'm amazed that Dillon got a quarter of the votes, and I question the poll results because of it.
Okay then, carry on. I'm glad to hear it, since that seemed uncharacteristically homeristic of you to suggest that NE's running game was better than Denver's.I like arguing with educated fans, not with blind homers. :)

 
I've already responded to this, but apparently you were busy I'll say it again. I'm amazed that Dillon got a quarter of the votes, and I question the poll results because of it.
Okay then, carry on. I'm glad to hear it, since that seemed uncharacteristically homeristic of you to suggest that NE's running game was better than Denver's.I like arguing with educated fans, not with blind homers. :)
What, like the blind homers who thought this game would open by giving NE 6 points? :P
 
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I've already responded to this, but apparently you were busy I'll say it again. I'm amazed that Dillon got a quarter of the votes, and I question the poll results because of it.
Okay then, carry on. I'm glad to hear it, since that seemed uncharacteristically homeristic of you to suggest that NE's running game was better than Denver's.I like arguing with educated fans, not with blind homers. :)
What, like the blind homers who thought this game would open by giving NE 6 points? :P
How does speculation on the line make me a blind homer? Early reads say Denver by 3. If New England had struggled against Jax, it could easily have been Denver by 4 or 5.Edit: :hophead:

 
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What does everyone think the point spread would be if NE played at Denver in the 2nd round?
Broncos by 2.
Home field advantage is worth 3 points to Vegas. The first round playoff bye is worth even more. Home teams win something crazy like 80% of the time in the divisional round, including 6 times in the past 12 years when no road team has won a divisional playoff game. Denver has only been an underdog TWICE in the past 2 seasons. Trust me, Denver will be favored by a lot more than 2, no matter WHO they open against. Of course, New England will be a chic pick, so the bettors will probably push the line a bit after it opens. I'd wager the line opens at Denver (-5 to 6).Edit: I don't know why everyone was so surprised by Denver this season. Their only losses were Kenoy Kennedy, Dan Neil, and Reggie Hayward. They already had a quality replacement for Kennedy in-house (Nick Ferguson was a starter in 2003 before losing his job to Lynch in 2004). They also IMPROVED their D-line despite losing Hayward (I know this because every single starter from last season's D-line, except of course Hayward, is behind Trevor Pryce, Gerard Warren, Michael Myers, Courtney Brown, Ebenezer Ekuban, John Engleberger, and Demetrin Veil on the depth chart). So the only question was depth on the O-line, which I think people should have been willing to overlook given Denver's EXTENSIVE history of replacing key cogs on their line without missing a beat.

To me, all objective analysis indicated a strong chance of Denver IMPROVING this season, and yet everyone was betting on them to regress. It wasn't like they overachieved last season, either, losing 3 games in the final seconds.
I've already responded to this, but apparently you were busy I'll say it again. I'm amazed that Dillon got a quarter of the votes, and I question the poll results because of it.
Okay then, carry on. I'm glad to hear it, since that seemed uncharacteristically homeristic of you to suggest that NE's running game was better than Denver's.I like arguing with educated fans, not with blind homers. :)
What, like the blind homers who thought this game would open by giving NE 6 points? :P
How does speculation on the line make me a blind homer? Early reads say Denver by 3. If New England had struggled against Jax, it could easily have been Denver by 4 or 5.
Your the one who got his panties in a bunch to my post over a week ago saying the line would open at 2....
 
How good is Denver? Well, you don't get to the title game in the difficult AFC by being merely good or even very good like some have suggested Denver only is, so I would have to say they are a great team. :D

 
Here's a hypothetical - what would have happened if the game were in Mile High? I have to believe that Denver would win handily - can any Cowboy fans argue that point?

You can argue that Denver got lucky, I can argue that Dallas got lucky. You can argue about the TOP and the drive stats, I can counter that Champ's int which was returned for a TD cost Denver a possession - Dallas went directly from one long drive to a second long drive, I call it about even.

To answer my original question, if Denver beat a 7-3 team on the road w/ minimal preparations and an injured critical part of the offense (Bell), I'd have to say that the Broncos are a darn good team.

I'm starting to believe...
OK, I officially believe now. :excited: :excited: :excited:
 

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