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Jamaal Charles Thread: Hall of Famer? (1 Viewer)

Man you hate to see that. I'm not sure his body type can really handle another ACL tear and come back to be productive. His game is predicated on his speed, elusiveness and vision hard to see him take one more hit to his speed and be able to compensate for it.

 
Jamaal appeared to be the type of back that could be productive past age 30, but man that injury is really going to challenge that thinking.

 
papacapps said:
With Charles out, what are the values of West and Davis respectively?
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I'm a Chiefs fan and a Charles owner. I dropped Davis for Snead last week. I have the no. 1 waiver and will be dropping Snead for West this week.ETA: Well, the way Snead has been playing, I may drop Golden Tate instead.

 
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Have Davis in one where I have Charles...hope I can get West.

Another, will be able to get either of them....TD heavy...will it be more Knile?

 
Do not own Charles this year but had him during his breakout season and have always loved watching him play.

Sad day for football fans.

 
TheFanatic said:
Man I hate to see this. He is one exciting guy to watch. That kind of talent is the reason we watch football...
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I agree. Its not because I own him in a league or because I'm a Chiefs fans or anything but when a guy like him gets hurt, it's just bad all around for football. You lose a guy that you just can't replicate. It's like Big Ben being out. He's a unique guy that's good for the game. If JJ Watt was out or a guy like that, its the same deal.

 
Shutout said:
TheFanatic said:
Man I hate to see this. He is one exciting guy to watch. That kind of talent is the reason we watch football...
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I agree. Its not because I own him in a league or because I'm a Chiefs fans or anything but when a guy like him gets hurt, it's just bad all around for football. You lose a guy that you just can't replicate. It's like Big Ben being out. He's a unique guy that's good for the game. If JJ Watt was out or a guy like that, its the same deal.
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Exactly. I don't own him in any league, but I admire his skills and will stop on that game if I hear, "And the handoff to Charles," just to see what he's going to do.

 
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
think he is toast in Dyno formats now?

Getting old and his skinny little legs cant keep up it seems
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No. I think he is one of these guys that can keep on going and he really has low miles, overall. There are probably some people thinking an ACL is particularly bad for a player like him but, for lack of other things to point to, he's already had that injury and he came back and looked just as great as he always had. Certain players just have that look that they can age gracefully and, to me, Charles is one of them,

 
Lascelle said:
Todem said:
BigSteelThrill said:
Sorry Kniles Davis handcuff owners, its Chacandrick West.
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Wrong.....it will be a committee.

We are all screwed.
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Pretty much this. At least in years past when Charles went down, you could have the peace of mind that Knile would slot right in and put up RB2 numbers.

Charcandrick West ruined that dream.
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Yea yesterday I was thinking I would dump all my BB money on west. Now I am thinking screw it I'll go low and if I don't get him so be it. Plus I really don't know if its west or davis anyways.

 
I haven't been following the Chiefs since I moved away and haven't seen West play. That said, I find it really hard to believe that Knile has been supplanted by a relative newcomer. Davis is the trustworthy back who has performed when called upon. In what reality is West *that* much better?

 
ATB said:
I haven't been following the Chiefs since I moved away and haven't seen West play. That said, I find it really hard to believe that Knile has been supplanted by a relative newcomer. Davis is the trustworthy back who has performed when called upon. In what reality is West *that* much better?
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In the offseason, as noted on espn, they were not happy with Kniles lack of production (3.5yr1, 3.5yr2), problems with pass blocking, receiving and ball control issues.

Nothing about this was quick. This is Kniles 3rd year and Wests 2nd year.

 
I was trying to figure out Charles dynasty value tonight. He'll be a few months shy of 30 years old when next season starts.

He's had some monster seasons, both rushing and receiving. I figured he's had quite a few touches. What I found out really surprised me.

Charles - 1605 touches

Gore - 2870

Forte - 2370

ADP - 2348

Lynch - 2319

McCoy - 1815

Foster - 1656

When I checked everyone's touches per game, Charles was once again the lowest of the bunch.

Foster - 22.38

ADP - 21.74

Forte 21.16

McCoy - 19.51

Lynch - 18.85

Gore - 18.76

Charles - 16.05

Next I figured out career yards per touch. This time Charles came out on top.

Charles - 6.02

Gore - 5.69

ADP - 5.27

Foster - 5.26

McCoy - 5.13

Forte - 5.08

Lynch - 4.65

Lastly, fantasy points per touch (PPR) once again Jamaal came out on top.

Charles - 1.01

Foster - 0.92

ADP - 0.86

McCoy - 0.86

Forte - 0.85

Gore - 0.78

Lynch - 0.78

Just surprising (to me anyway), so I thought I'd share.

I guess the real takeaway from all of this is not to expect too much out of C.West or K.Davis. Even if one of them ends up with a Charles like workload, they are replacing a special RB.

Jamaal has averaged just over 16 touches per game in his career, I'd be really surprised if West or Davis ends up over 12 per game the rest of 2015, with a 10-11/7-9 split more likely.

With a reasonable expectation (in my mind) of 0.5 to 0.7 points per touch (PPR) we're looking at 5 to 7.5 ppg for the lead guy and 3.5 to 6 ppg for the other guy.

Henry's top 200 rest of the way has C.West at 135 points or 12.3 ppg for the remaining 11 games. I just don't see it. Jamaal has averaged 16.2 ppg during his career. The numbers above show that he is by far the best in the league in yards & points per touch.

We can't expect a replacement level RB to see as many touches as Charles, nor can we expect them to approach his elite points per touch output. True, the numbers above show that KC doesn't feed Charles like some other teams feed their lead back. But I'm willing to bet that that is a product of their system and has nothing to do with Charles. I expect that same philosophy to carry over to West and Davis.

Kansas City was already in trouble this season. Losing Charles, the "Big Toe" of the offense can not help matters. In my opinion, it's much more likely that the combination of West & Davis end 2015 in the ballpark of Henry's predicted 135 points for West than it is for either to exceed 90 on their own. JMHO

 
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BearsFan4Life said:
zamboni said:
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
think he is toast in Dyno formats now?
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I don't know about toast, but he'll be pushing 30 by the time next season rolls around. Hard to expect the same comeback as the last time he tore his ACL just before he turned 25.
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I am not sure about toast, but pushing 30 with 2 ACL tears and rehabs made me deal Charles for a 2016 1st Round Rookie Pick (top 7) in dynasty.
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The good news for Charles is that he recovered fully from the first ACL which was in his left knee. This one is in his right and he knows how to rehab successfully. The biggest concern for him to me is not the knee, but him turning 29 this month. Still think he has a couple big seasons ahead of him.

 
"That's the goal," he said. I had 11 (games) left in the season when I did it, so it's a lot of time to come back from it. The way I'm moving, I'll be back before the season starts. I want to be back. I want to play. I want to be out there again."
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Rotoworld:

Chiefs GM John Dorsey fully expects Jamaal Charles to remain with the team for 2016.

"I love him to death, love how dirty tough he is," Dorsey said. "Yeah, he's a Chief." Going on 30, Charles is recovering from a torn ACL, but was averaging 5.1 yards per carry before going down in October. He's due an eminently reasonable $5.75 million between salary and bonuses in 2016. We'd expect the Chiefs to roll with more of a committee in an effort to keep Charles fresh and healthy, but there's little doubt he'll be the chairman.

Source: Adam Teicher on Twitter

Jan 21 - 2:39 PM
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Marshall Faulk: Why do Chiefs keep Jamaal Charles?

"The conversation is, 'Why does Kansas City keepJamaal Charles when you saw Spencer Ware andCharcandrick West? For what reason?'" Faulkrecently asked the Kansas City Star. "I can't even see what reason they would continue to pay (him) if they have a way of getting up from under that contract and dispersing money elsewhere to fill some of the gaps that they have. And that's just real talk -- that's the business of the game.
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Not sure why Faulk is trying to get Charles fired. 

 
Biabreakable said:
Marshall Faulk: Why do Chiefs keep Jamaal Charles?

Not sure why Faulk is trying to get Charles fired. 
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I enjoy candid opinions like that. I don`t agree with him but I am sure some people do. If they have setbacks on the defense and OL due to the fact they couldn`t spend more $ a lot of people will share his opinion next offseason.

West/Ware/Forte might be better than Charles for a real NFL team at much less $ than just Charles by himself. When one of these injuries, or just age, robs Charles of a step it will be a fast decline.

 
Dude if KC doesn't retain Charles they will have given the Patriots SB 2017 when he signs. Plus whoever nutsack in your league can package 2 of either Charles, Brady, Edelman or Gronk will win your league.

 
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Why would they dump him to save $5.3M? Not a huge number and I'd rather have a backfield of Charles, West, and Ware than only West and Ware.

 
I could see KC moving on from JC as well. Ware is that good imo. JC coming off another significant injury. Save that money and spend it on DB or WR help. 

 
The savings number I have heard is $5M. That is definitely enough to make a team think about it but with the cap being nearly $155M or so, likely, I think JC warrants 4% of your salary cap.  After all, as competent as Ware and West were, JC is a unique guy.  You can't ignore the ypc which is among the all-time best. You can't ignore his pass game worth. You can ask questions about his speed, given the injury, but he has torn an ACL before and bounced back well.  Factor that with he really is a main face of the team and I think it's a muddy decision because we've seen the past several years that attrition at positions is deciding teams' seasons quite a bit these days. 

And, if nothing else, like Jon007 said, letting a guy like Charles walk almost guarantees you put yourself behind some other team as a serious contender.  IF Charles happened to sign with New England, Pitt (if Bell has a set back), even the Ravens, cowboys, or a handful of other teams, that doesn't make the Chiefs job any easier. 

 
Coach Andy Reid said Jamaal Charles (ACL) might not be cleared for training camp.
"We’ll have to see with Jamaal," said Reid. "You don’t want to take any steps back." Charles did some individual work at OTAs, but isn’t going to be full-go at the start of camp. Kansas City could rest Charles the entire preseason. Charles has setback risks coming off two knee surgeries in the last four years, but remains on track for Week 1.

 
 
Source: ESPN 
 
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