Jared from Subway got what he deserved (1 Viewer)

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

 

[Hang 10]

I'm waiting for Tim to weigh in on the maturity levels of these kids before I make any judgments.

 

[kentric]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

I'm not sure. I have children 16 and under and know that I would take action against a man who sexually assaulted one of my daughters. But I also know that some girls who are younger than my 16 y.o. daughter can also be sexually aggressive. I differentiate between a sexual predator who forces a girl versus one who pays for a girl for consensual sex. Depending on the age of the girl and location, the consensual sex is a crime (statutory rape) and the person paying for the sex should be punished to the full extent of the law. I was just trying to indicate my views on murder versus child molestation. And by child molestation, from what I see it is this guy Jared looking at naked pics of kids and having consensual sex with kids (16 y.o. and potentially younger). For me, someone murdering another person should be put away longer than a child molester (non-forceful rape). Of course, the circumstances surrounding the situation has an impact on one's views of this.

 

[kentric]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

Just looked it up. The age of consent in NY is 17 y.o. Not sure if he made internet arrangements with the 17 y.o.s for sex in another state and therefore some interstate age of consent kicks in. If that's not the case, it wouldn't be illegal but for prostitution charges. So there would have to be sex with someone 16 y.o. or younger.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

Yeah, I don't quite know where the "menu of his choices" stuff is coming from. There are four general allegations against Jared.

1. That Jared received child pornography from Russell Taylor procured by Taylor installing hidden cameras in his home and hosting children and that Jared approved of this scheme.

2. That Jared received child pornography through other means (over the internet, in message boards, etc.).

3. That Jared traveled across state lines to have sex with minors (the 17 year olds in New York); and that he communicated with those girls in an attempt to procure younger sex partners ("the younger, the better").

4. That Jared used other internet sites to try to procure other underage sex partners.

 

[Pipes]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

Serious question have all of the charges made public or are we just hearing snipets? Just yesterday all he was being accused of was having some images on his computer and now today we're hearing about the solicitation and sexual contact with minors. It seems like there could be a lot more to this and this is the first shoe that's dropping...I could be wrong though.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

Serious question have all of the charges made public or are we just hearing snipets? Just yesterday all he was being accused of was having some images on his computer and now today we're hearing about the solicitation and sexual contact with minors. It seems like there could be a lot more to this and this is the first shoe that's dropping...I could be wrong though.

Here is a direct link to the Criminal Information.

EDIT: sorry, link is now included

 

[Rubi]

I guess he lied when he said he "ate nothing but subway turkey subs" to lose all that weight.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

Just looked it up. The age of consent in NY is 17 y.o. Not sure if he made internet arrangements with the 17 y.o.s for sex in another state and therefore some interstate age of consent kicks in. If that's not the case, it wouldn't be illegal but for prostitution charges. So there would have to be sex with someone 16 y.o. or younger.

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

 

[Cjw_55106]

Oviously I dont 'get' a lot of things. Two things to add to the list:

1. People that try to defend or justify this type of behavior

2. People that make pedophile jokes.

 

[Hilts]

Iirc it looks like OJ's son was the murderer and not OJ himself.

Either way, Jared is a disgusting human being.

 

[Donkey Derp]

I appreciate the legal explanations. That is one thing that is cool about the FBG is the diversity of professions - can really learn a lot if you don't drown from the schtick.

 

[kentric]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

Just looked it up. The age of consent in NY is 17 y.o. Not sure if he made internet arrangements with the 17 y.o.s for sex in another state and therefore some interstate age of consent kicks in. If that's not the case, it wouldn't be illegal but for prostitution charges. So there would have to be sex with someone 16 y.o. or younger.

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

Thanks for clarifying. Figured there may be some Trump to the state age of consent.

 

[CGRdrJoe]

Oviously I dont 'get' a lot of things. Two things to add to the list:

1. People that try to defend or justify this type of behavior

2. People that make pedophile jokes.

michael jackson was the brunt of them for decades

 

[Cjw_55106]

Oviously I dont 'get' a lot of things. Two things to add to the list:

1. People that try to defend or justify this type of behavior

2. People that make pedophile jokes.

michael jackson was the brunt of them for decades

And?

 

[Coeur de Lion]

There are a lot of people to feel bad for, but man his wife. That has to be awful.

She's filed for divorce. She loses a creep and will probably be entitled to a significant amount of his net worth. She'll move on.

He ####### cheated on her with KIDS. No way she just easily gets over this by taking half of his money.

Pretty sure that she's also probably in a total panic about what might have gone on with HER kids. I'd be climbing the effing walls of I found out that my kids had been around a pedophile.

 

[McGarnicle]

This whole thing is so bizarre and sad.

 

[BowieMercs]

$1.4M & 5 years seems like he's getting a light sentence

 

[George Jefferson Airplane]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

Just looked it up. The age of consent in NY is 17 y.o. Not sure if he made internet arrangements with the 17 y.o.s for sex in another state and therefore some interstate age of consent kicks in. If that's not the case, it wouldn't be illegal but for prostitution charges. So there would have to be sex with someone 16 y.o. or younger.

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

Also the 17 yo was 16 when they first had sexual contact.

Jared could have just asked for "barely legal" and been just fine, but he had to have "minors" according to his own words.

 

[George Jefferson Airplane]

$1.4M & 5 years seems like he's getting a light sentence

It's not 5, it's 5-13. He might get 6 or 12 but the likelihood for early release from whatever the sentence is, would be small.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

Just looked it up. The age of consent in NY is 17 y.o. Not sure if he made internet arrangements with the 17 y.o.s for sex in another state and therefore some interstate age of consent kicks in. If that's not the case, it wouldn't be illegal but for prostitution charges. So there would have to be sex with someone 16 y.o. or younger.

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

Also the 17 yo was 16 when they first had sexual contact.

.

I don't see that in the Information. Again, that section appears to have some typos. It refers to Minor Victim 12 at one point when it clearly means to refer to Minor Victim 13 and I think it then continues to refer to Minor Victim 13 when it means to refer to Minor Victim 14. But both specific incidents identify the victim to be 17 at the time of the sexual encounter. He does text Minor Victim 13 and other escorts and asks them to procure him younger prostitutes.

 

[George Jefferson Airplane]

I'm just casually browsing this thread...are people seriously comparing this p o s to O.J?

O.J. lost his mind and killed a couple people in the heat of the moment. I do not excuse that behavior, but molesting children is way, way worse than that. These guys are calculating how to ruin the lives of young children, and by extension, their families for nothing more than their own personal amusement.

I would love to create a television program like 'The Running Man' where dudes like this are hunted for sport by ex-victims of this type of perversion. It would be great, you would probably only have to run it for a few years before people would just decide its not worth the risk.

Win/Win for everyone involved.

Oh, is that all? He KILLED two people. Until we know all the details, up to now, this guy Jared got off on looking at naked pics and having sex with 16-17 y.o.s for cash. Its possible that the 16/17 y.o.s were consenting. I'm not saying what he did wasn't disgusting and warranting some serious time, but to me, killing someone is worse than what he appears to have done.

Are we sure none were younger than 16? There were 14 victims and a 16 year old was only mentioned the one time when no one younger was available...allegedily.

12 of the confidential victims listed in the Information were the children surreptitiously photographed by the guy with Jared's foundation. There is no allegation that Jared molested these children. Jared received the photographs and allegedly knew who these victims were and approved of the scheme to photograph them.

As near as I can tell, two of the listed confidential victims were 17 year olds he had sex with while in New York on business. I may need to re-read the information because the section on New York might have a typo which made it difficult for me to determine it they were talking about one or two victims.

There is other evidence suggesting the Jared at least attempted to have sex with younger teenagers, but no concrete allegations of specific incidents where that happened.

Just looked it up. The age of consent in NY is 17 y.o. Not sure if he made internet arrangements with the 17 y.o.s for sex in another state and therefore some interstate age of consent kicks in. If that's not the case, it wouldn't be illegal but for prostitution charges. So there would have to be sex with someone 16 y.o. or younger.

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

Also the 17 yo was 16 when they first had sexual contact.

.

I don't see that in the Information. Again, that section appears to have some typos. It refers to Minor Victim 12 at one point when it clearly means to refer to Minor Victim 13 and I think it then continues to refer to Minor Victim 13 when it means to refer to Minor Victim 14. But both specific incidents identify the victim to be 17 at the time of the sexual encounter. He does text Minor Victim 13 and other escorts and asks them to procure him younger prostitutes.

• Between 2010 and February 2013, Fogle traveled from Indiana to New York to pay to have sex with minors.

• One victim told investigators she had sex with Fogle twice when she was 17 in exchange for money, once at the Plaza Hotel and once at the Ritz Carlton, both in New York City.

• The same minor also said that Fogle had sex with her three other times before 2012, when she was 16.

• Prosecutors say that text messages, travel records, hotel records and a search of Fogle's home provided evidence of these arrangements.

• The same minor said Fogle had sex with another 16-year-old girl on another occasion.

 

[cstu]

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

If you have a home in the state you are traveling to would this be a loophole in the law?

 

[Michael Brown]

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

If you have a home in the state you are traveling to would this be a loophole in the law?

So wait, assuming the age of consent in Indiana is 16 and in NY it's 17...

If he found a 16-year-old in Indiana and had sex with her, that's fine and legal.

But if he goes to NY and has sex with a 16-year-old there, it's illegal.

Is that right?

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

If you have a home in the state you are traveling to would this be a loophole in the law?

So wait, assuming the age of consent in Indiana is 16 and in NY it's 17...

If he found a 16-year-old in Indiana and had sex with her, that's fine and legal.

But if he goes to NY and has sex with a 16-year-old there, it's illegal.

Is that right?

Here is the offense straight from the statute:

A person who travels in interstate commerce or travels into the United States, or a United States citizen or an alien admitted for permanent residence in the United States who travels in foreign commerce, for the purpose of engaging in any illicit sexual conduct with another person shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 30 years, or both.

18 USC § 2423(b).

"Illicit sexual conduct" is defined as including:

any commercial sex act (as defined in section 1591) with a person under 18 years of age

18 USC § 2423(f)(2).

Remember there has to be a hook to establish federal jurisdiction. Here, its the travel in interstate commerce.

 

[tommyboy]

i'd be shocked if he didn't kill himself in the next several months

Why? In five years he'll move to Thailand and live like a Saudi prince for the rest of his life.

he seems like the kind of person that won't be able to handle the public shame, the loss of wife, loss of kids and prison rape(s). I set the over under at 8 months and I'm taking the under

 

[Chadstroma]

They must have found the prostitute through the text messages, right? Once they talked to her then it is just collecting collaborating evidence I would think.

 

[Michael Brown]

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

If you have a home in the state you are traveling to would this be a loophole in the law?

So wait, assuming the age of consent in Indiana is 16 and in NY it's 17...

If he found a 16-year-old in Indiana and had sex with her, that's fine and legal.

But if he goes to NY and has sex with a 16-year-old there, it's illegal.

Is that right?

Here is the offense straight from the statute:

A person who travels in interstate commerce or travels into the United States, or a United States citizen or an alien admitted for permanent residence in the United States who travels in foreign commerce, for the purpose of engaging in any illicit sexual conduct with another person shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 30 years, or both.

18 USC § 2423(b).

"Illicit sexual conduct" is defined as including:

any commercial sex act (as defined in section 1591) with a person under 18 years of age

18 USC § 2423(f)(2).

Remember there has to be a hook to establish federal jurisdiction. Here, its the travel in interstate commerce.

Interesting. The US should probably just change the law so that 18 is the age of consent, and anything under that requires like a +2 designation. So a 14 year old can only have sex with a 16 year old, a 17 year old can only have sex with a 19 year old, and so on. Otherwise these laws look very confusing.

It's legal to sleep with a 16 year old in NJ, but not if you're a cop or something then it's 18...16 is always illegal in NYC, but 17 is legal across the Hudson River...but only if you're already there, not if you take a NY Waterway ferry to get there, then it becomes 18. It's all mumbo-jumbo. What's the point of having it be so convoluted?

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Free foot longs for him

With extra sauce.

 

[otello]

how many years is he looking at?

 

[cstu]

It's legal to sleep with a 16 year old in NJ, but not if you're a cop or something then it's 18...16 is always illegal in NYC, but 17 is legal across the Hudson River...but only if you're already there, not if you take a NY Waterway ferry to get there, then it becomes 18. It's all mumbo-jumbo. What's the point of having it be so convoluted?

Sounds like the rules in Amsterdam.

 

[Buckfast 1]

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

If you have a home in the state you are traveling to would this be a loophole in the law?

So wait, assuming the age of consent in Indiana is 16 and in NY it's 17...If he found a 16-year-old in Indiana and had sex with her, that's fine and legal.

But if he goes to NY and has sex with a 16-year-old there, it's illegal.

Is that right?

Here is the offense straight from the statute:

A person who travels in interstate commerce or travels into the United States, or a United States citizen or an alien admitted for permanent residence in the United States who travels in foreign commerce, for the purpose of engaging in any illicit sexual conduct with another person shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 30 years, or both.

18 USC § 2423(b).

"Illicit sexual conduct" is defined as including:

any commercial sex act (as defined in section 1591) with a person under 18 years of age

18 USC § 2423(f)(2).

Remember there has to be a hook to establish federal jurisdiction. Here, its the travel in interstate commerce.

Interesting. The US should probably just change the law so that 18 is the age of consent, and anything under that requires like a +2 designation. So a 14 year old can only have sex with a 16 year old, a 17 year old can only have sex with a 19 year old, and so on. Otherwise these laws look very confusing.

It's legal to sleep with a 16 year old in NJ, but not if you're a cop or something then it's 18...16 is always illegal in NYC, but 17 is legal across the Hudson River...but only if you're already there, not if you take a NY Waterway ferry to get there, then it becomes 18. It's all mumbo-jumbo. What's the point of having it be so convoluted?

State sovereignty for each state to decide the age at which girls become old enough to bang. This topic could be a great basis for a lecture in federalism.

 

[Brony]

how many years is he looking at?

low numbers based on his internet history.

 

[EYLive]

how many years is he looking at?

I believe the quote was "the younger, the better". wakka wakka

 

[EYLive]

If someone has these type of urges but never acts on them or seeks out images in any form, is that individual still sick, twisted and/or have a disorder?

 

[Zow]

They had child porn. They contribute to the industry which is just as bad as doing it live.

By this analogy a meth user is just as bad a the head of the cartel.

 

[Zow]

The federal criminal statute defines a minor as someone under 18. It appears that if you travel across state lines, you can be charged even if the victim would be above the age of consent in your home forum and in the foreign forum.

If you have a home in the state you are traveling to would this be a loophole in the law?

So wait, assuming the age of consent in Indiana is 16 and in NY it's 17...

If he found a 16-year-old in Indiana and had sex with her, that's fine and legal.

But if he goes to NY and has sex with a 16-year-old there, it's illegal.

Is that right?

Here is the offense straight from the statute:

A person who travels in interstate commerce or travels into the United States, or a United States citizen or an alien admitted for permanent residence in the United States who travels in foreign commerce, for the purpose of engaging in any illicit sexual conduct with another person shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 30 years, or both.

18 USC § 2423(b).

"Illicit sexual conduct" is defined as including:

any commercial sex act (as defined in section 1591) with a person under 18 years of age

18 USC § 2423(f)(2).

Remember there has to be a hook to establish federal jurisdiction. Here, its the travel in interstate commerce.

Interesting. The US should probably just change the law so that 18 is the age of consent, and anything under that requires like a +2 designation. So a 14 year old can only have sex with a 16 year old, a 17 year old can only have sex with a 19 year old, and so on. Otherwise these laws look very confusing.

It's legal to sleep with a 16 year old in NJ, but not if you're a cop or something then it's 18...16 is always illegal in NYC, but 17 is legal across the Hudson River...but only if you're already there, not if you take a NY Waterway ferry to get there, then it becomes 18. It's all mumbo-jumbo. What's the point of having it be so convoluted?

Lawyers need to get paid, homie.

 

[Gary Coal Man]

how many years is he looking at?

Seventeen tops. Once they reached that age he stopped looking.

 

[ShamrockPride]

how many years is he looking at?

Seventeen tops. Once they reached that age he stopped looking.

Ha ha, GOT 'IM!!

 

[Hilts]

If someone has these type of urges but never acts on them or seeks out images in any form, is that individual still sick, twisted and/or have a disorder?

Yes, absolutely. If you're sexually attracted to minors you've got some bad wiring.

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

If someone has these type of urges but never acts on them or seeks out images in any form, is that individual still sick, twisted and/or have a disorder?

Yes, absolutely. If you're sexually attracted to minors you've got some bad wiring.

Minors or children?

 

[Zow]

Okay so let me clear some things up:

1. Fogle has been charged and has taken a plea in the Federal Court. This isn't state courts so your understanding of the laws/sentencing ranges in your local jurisdiction don't apply.

2. He has taken a plea. I can tell you from experience that plea negotiations with federal prosecutors are not easy. It's very likely that the assigned prosecutor followed his or her office's plea policy. I'm guessing Jared's plea fell within that policy and probably only slightly modified his potential sentencing ranges. He's almost certainly been set for a sentencing date like a month or two out and has been ordered to meet with probation. However, he's NOT getting probation - probation has designated pre-sentence report writers.

3. What will apply is the Federal Sentencing guidelines. The guidelines are laid out in a manual that is over 500 pages in length. I cannot stress enough how convoluted these guidelines are but basically what will happen is that a federal probation officer (unlike your local probation officer, these probation officers are usually rockstars and may even be former lawyers or law enforcement) will examine particular factors about the defendant and draft a "pre-sentence report" that will apply these sentencing factors to Jared's ranges and proffer a sentence within that range. What is being reported in the media is that Jared will get at least five years. The State won't argue for more than 12.5, which makes me conclude that Jared's top end range is probably around this (I haven't looked at the guidelines for a few years and don't have time to look up the exact range). This pre-sentence report will have a lot of influence and will be considered by the judge to be the most neutral/objective argument for the length of his incarceration. Jared's attorney will argue for a "downward departure" and argue for factors that may convince the judge to drop below the five years. In my experience, it's incredibly rare for a judge to deviate below the bottom end. In my opinion, Jared will receive more than five years.

4. There is a Supreme Court case (U.S. v. Booker) which actually says that the guidelines are not mandatory so really Jared could get about anything. Nonetheless, it's likely the judge will find Jared should get somewhere between the 5-12.5 (my bet is around ten years).

5. I practice predominantly in Arizona. I defend people charged with similar offenses. Many of these people are cases I take on appointment (meaning at no cost to the defendant). Arizona is a very "tough" state when it comes to sentencing and is probably one of the few states on par with the federal sentencing scheme. In general, the "going rate" for someone charged with similar crimes in my jurisdiction is 5-10 years, usually accompanied by a period of probation and always accompanied with lifetime registration. Accordingly, I don't see this as a case where Jared got a significantly reduced sentenced or was cut any breaks because he's a celebrity.

6. I'd note that Jared has not been charged with sleeping with a six year old and, from what I can gather, has not even been charged with attempting or soliciting sex with a 6 year old. He had sex with 16 and 17 year olds - suggest that he's a hebephile or ephebophile. He's also been charged with possessing child pornography. Nothing indicates that that he produced any porn or tried to sleep with a small child. He's committed bad and disgusting crimes, but those suggesting he should get the death penalty or that what he did is worse than murdering two people in cold blood are irrational.

 

[Bucky86]

I heard on the radio while they were interviewing a former convict. He said that for sure Jared is going to get raped and or killed.

 

[comfortably numb]

Is this the same prostitution service Lawrence Taylor was using?

 

[Christo]

So are people going to stop going to Subway over this? My wife thinks so - I think she is crazy. There are lots of reasons not to go to Subway - but I can't imagine this is really one of them...

I suppose the other shoe to drop would be some type of evidence that Subway management knew of Jared's proclivities.

Considering how quickly they dropped him, they had to have known something.

Oh, come on.

 

[EYLive]

If someone has these type of urges but never acts on them or seeks out images in any form, is that individual still sick, twisted and/or have a disorder?

Yes, absolutely. If you're sexually attracted to minors you've got some bad wiring.

I see.

But it's not really that person's fault if nature/God/the universe wired them that way, is it? If it was up to them, they would never chose to have that type of attraction.

If they understand that society does not approve of their attraction, and they successfully deny their own urges, don't they get a little credit for not acting on them?

 

[Chadstroma]

If someone has these type of urges but never acts on them or seeks out images in any form, is that individual still sick, twisted and/or have a disorder?

Yes, absolutely. If you're sexually attracted to minors you've got some bad wiring.

I see.

But it's not really that person's fault if nature/God/the universe wired them that way, is it? If it was up to them, they would never chose to have that type of attraction.

If they understand that society does not approve of their attraction, and they successfully deny their own urges, don't they get a little credit for not acting on them?

I think someone with these urges needs to seek professional help. As for not acting on the urges.... credit for what? Not violating child or contributing to those acts through consumtion of child porn? Do you give credit to the average guy who sees a woman and has all sorts of thoughts about her but does not rape her? No. There is no extra credit. It is what is expected.

 

[Coeur de Lion]

If someone has these type of urges but never acts on them or seeks out images in any form, is that individual still sick, twisted and/or have a disorder?

Yes, absolutely. If you're sexually attracted to minors you've got some bad wiring.

I see.But it's not really that person's fault if nature/God/the universe wired them that way, is it? If it was up to them, they would never chose to have that type of attraction.

If they understand that society does not approve of their attraction, and they successfully deny their own urges, don't they get a little credit for not acting on them?

Sexual attraction to prepubescent children doesn't typically come from nowhere. I used to be a social worker for family court, and had the sex offender caseload for about 5 months until I asked out (was going to quit, couldn't handle it) -- and the vast majority of the offenders I worked with were prior victims as children. They had to take sexual history polygraphs -- most of them suffered some pretty awful stuff as kids. It's a group that's really hard to feel at all sorry for, but reading / hearing that stuff made it at least somewhat possible.

 

[Chadstroma]

6. I'd note that Jared has not been charged with sleeping with a six year old and, from what I can gather, has not even been charged with attempting or soliciting sex with a 6 year old. He had sex with 16 and 17 year olds - suggest that he's a hebephile or ephebophile. He's also been charged with possessing child pornography. Nothing indicates that that he produced any porn or tried to sleep with a small child. He's committed bad and disgusting crimes, but those suggesting he should get the death penalty or that what he did is worse than murdering two people in cold blood are irrational.

I would agree except that the complaint states his request was 'the younger the better'. Murder is a higher crime than any sexual assualt even on a minor. Should he get the death penalty? No, though that would feel right but for the legal system that would be out of place. I certainly would not shed a tear if he got shanked in prison and bled out on the shower floor after being abused- I have no sympathy for someone like him. NONE. And the 'younger the better' makes the actual age of the victims a matter of opportunity in my mind so I am not too worried about them being 16 or 17. He is still a sick pig.

 

[Eephus]

I heard on the radio while they were interviewing a former convict. He said that for sure Jared is going to get raped and or killed.

Well, I guess that settles it.