Karen - The Movie (1 Viewer)

[Max Power]

Not going to attempt to put words in Max's mouth, so my attempt at actual discussion is: 

Isn't this a natural extension and chessy/low budget, 0 subtlety, made for cable version of what movies like Us and Get Out were going for and were insanely popular? 

I heard about the title and thought it was stupid, but maybe if done right could be satire level funny stuff.  Then I heard it's a racists Karen who is more racist than a Karen.  THEN... I saw the Star and Director thought this movie could bring about social change, so I posted it here.

I'm happy to see everyone thinks it's stupid.  With some of the responses to other issues around here, I wasn't sure what direction this thread would go. 

I don't see a connection to Get Out that others keep bringing up.  Get Out was a smart and well made movie.  This doesn't look like either. 

 

[Max Power]

and to your point DJ, if I'd have to guess I don't think Max stumbled on this trailer while browsing the fall movie releases.  I'd guess SM or a website came into play along with some "omg look at this racist movie" type of messages.  

Youtube recommended a Ben Shapiro segment laughing at it.  I had heard they were making a movie called Karen prior, but paid no attention to it. 

 

[djmich]

You are trying too hard to reframe my position.   you yourself said this was targeted for a certain people.  I agree, and some of those people might be people that already think think is prevalent.  this dumb movie isn't changing that.   people that don't like the obvious message probably aren't watching this anyway.  

it's a big nothing burger in the scheme things for those reasons.  plus, it's fiction and it's not trying to hide that fact.   

of all the things you listed- parents, environment, experiences, SM, news, etc.   some crappy BET movie isn't even a blip on the radar.  it's a movie.  

Good conversation, I think we hold similar beliefs but how we see things unfold and the significance of those things is different.

When you say it is a big nothing burger in the scheme of things, I agree.  But you can say that for virtually everything and we are the sum total of all these things.  I don't think racism is right, I think it happens a lot and at the same time any individual instance is statistically a nothing burger.  So when I observe it, my first reaction is not "well it happens and its a nothing burger in the scheme of things".  

I'm not going to go protest Karen and I really don't GAF, I wouldn't even be aware of it if not for this forum.  Similarly I'm not up in arms about any individual act of racism where I think its the end of the world or a game changer.  It the scheme of things these are nothing burgers.  99.9999999% of individual events are statistically meaningless in the scope of our planet and our social development.  One song is meaningless.  One movie is meaningless.  An individual can be aware of that and simultaneously say "that's unhealthy".  Where do you start if not individual observations?

 

[Godsbrother]

Wait, Hollywood has started making films involving stereotypes?   No way!!!

 

[Summer Wheat]

Wait, Hollywood has started making films involving stereotypes?   No way!!!

The sequel called "LaShondra" is in the works right now.  Opening scene is a cat fight at Popeyes. 

 

[E Street Brat]

I think it is just a parody clip.

Looks like a documentary to me, 

 

[BladeRunner]

Wait, Hollywood has started making films involving stereotypes?   No way!!!

There is absolutely ZERO chance you would have thought this was cute if this was the Country channel that made a movie about Lashonda and all the black stereotypes you could imagine.

ZERO chance.  I'm not so much against the film as I am against the absolute hypocrisy.

 

[Doug B]

I heard about the title and thought it was stupid, but maybe if done right could be satire level funny stuff.  Then I heard it's a racists Karen who is more racist than a Karen.  THEN... I saw the Star and Director thought this movie could bring about social change ...

I still don't think the film is being played straight. Not that it's intended as a comedy -- rather, that the expression of the film's dramatic narrative is secondary to the buzz and debate the film engenders before even being shown.

...

That said, if this film came out 30 years ago ... and it was shown at my college dorm's Movie Night in the lobby ... there would be a bunch of us of all different races watching Karen. And we'd spend half the movie goofing on the stereotypes: "Y'all know that's what y'all do!" "I guess Karen didn't want any watermelon!" "Hi, my name is Graham Wellington and I'm you're new neighbor" "Go ahead, take the newspaper -- it's free", etc. It would be like 30 people of varying backgrounds doing their best Mystery Science Theater meets Eddie Murphy Raw impressions, SNL callbacks, and original zingers. We'd have been rolling on the floor.

 

[Doug B]

Wait, Hollywood has started making films involving stereotypes?   No way!!!

"We're looking for an Eddie Murphy type ... "

"Whoah! Put down my activator, man!"

 

[KarmaPolice]

Good conversation, I think we hold similar beliefs but how we see things unfold and the significance of those things is different.

When you say it is a big nothing burger in the scheme of things, I agree.  But you can say that for virtually everything and we are the sum total of all these things.  I don't think racism is right, I think it happens a lot and at the same time any individual instance is statistically a nothing burger.  So when I observe it, my first reaction is not "well it happens and its a nothing burger in the scheme of things".  

I'm not going to go protest Karen and I really don't GAF, I wouldn't even be aware of it if not for this forum.  Similarly I'm not up in arms about any individual act of racism where I think its the end of the world or a game changer.  It the scheme of things these are nothing burgers.  99.9999999% of individual events are statistically meaningless in the scope of our planet and our social development.  One song is meaningless.  One movie is meaningless.  An individual can be aware of that and simultaneously say "that's unhealthy".  Where do you start if not individual observations?

Man, I feel like we agree way more than we disagree, but we seem to argue a lot for two people who do agree that much.   

I will fully admit my bias towards art and basically having an anything goes mentality.   I am guessing a bit of that comes from me defending my metal music and horror movies growing up.  Just my opinion, but like I said of the things we listed a movie or song is so far down the list of things that would cause somebody to do something, I think it's pretty insignificant.   Not saying it never will, as I am sure we can find examples of people mimicing a movie, acting on a song, whatever.   Just think at that point it was the person and their state of mind (probably from their environment/parents/genetics), not the art anyway.  

I will meet you 1/2 way a little bit - I would say that only watching something extreme would be unhealthy, but I wouldn't say watching or making something like this is - and that might be our line in the sand, and that's OK.  Appreciate the back and forth as always.. 

 

[KarmaPolice]

There is absolutely ZERO chance you would have thought this was cute if this was the Country channel that made a movie about Lashonda and all the black stereotypes you could imagine.

ZERO chance.  I'm not so much against the film as I am against the absolute hypocrisy.

Here's the problem with you guys repeating this.    A "Karen" is not a racist that terrorizes her black neighbors.   A Karen is basically the #####y soccer mom that always complains and wants to speak to the manager.   That's one of the things that makes this movie look so dumb (unless Karen was just random on their part).   So you claiming that people would react the same as whatever the hell the Country channel is making a Lashonda movie is already not starting at the same place.   

This movie just seems to be an exaggeration of the "white folks not liking the new black neighbors" trope.   Which to be fair, we have read examples of.  

IMO this movie is not much different than another we had an argument about in the FFA - Black Christmas.  

 

[KarmaPolice]

I still don't think the film is being played straight. Not that it's intended as a comedy -- rather, that the expression of the film's dramatic narrative is secondary to the buzz and debate the film engenders before even being shown.

...

That said, if this film came out 30 years ago ... and it was shown at my college dorm's Movie Night in the lobby ... there would be a bunch of us of all different races watching Karen. And we'd spend half the movie goofing on the stereotypes: "Y'all know that's what y'all do!" "I guess Karen didn't want any watermelon!" "Hi, my name is Graham Wellington and I'm you're new neighbor" "Go ahead, take the newspaper -- it's free", etc. It would be like 30 people of varying backgrounds doing their best Mystery Science Theater meets Eddie Murphy Raw impressions, SNL callbacks, and original zingers. We'd have been rolling on the floor.

Exactly.  If I had BET, I could see myself firing up the vape and watching this thing.  

Just like countless other bad thrillers/horror movies, this is an exaggeration of real life.  (like I said, even Binky posted stories about some odd interactions with his neighbors when he moved into the neighborhood).   

 

[Godsbrother]

There is absolutely ZERO chance you would have thought this was cute if this was the Country channel that made a movie about Lashonda and all the black stereotypes you could imagine.

ZERO chance.  I'm not so much against the film as I am against the absolute hypocrisy.

Hollywood has been stereotyping blacks, asians, gays and native Americans since they began making films.   Now all of a sudden I should give a crap about one stupid movie involving a racist white lady on a channel that I'll never watch?

I don't condone it but this is America and you're allowed to make offensive films.   There may be consequences in producing such a film or there may not be and if there are they will have to deal with it.  My guess is that it will be pretty much unnoticed unless offended people start squawking about it. 

 

[KarmaPolice]

Hollywood has been stereotyping blacks, asians, gays and native Americans since they began making films.   Now all of a sudden I should give a crap about one stupid movie involving a racist white lady on a channel that I'll never watch?

I don't condone it but this is America and you're allowed to make offensive films.   There may be consequences in producing such a film or there may not be and if there are they will have to deal with it.  My guess is that it will be pretty much unnoticed unless offended people start squawking about it. 

Good post, and it's another reason why the "they wouldn't allow X stereotype" argument doesn't hold a ton of water.   That's been going on since movies were a thing.  Like you said, usually the market takes care of that - it gets panned, nobody watches it, whatever.  

 

[Ghost Rider]

Hollywood has been stereotyping blacks, asians, gays and native Americans since they began making films.   Now all of a sudden I should give a crap about one stupid movie involving a racist white lady on a channel that I'll never watch?

I don't condone it but this is America and you're allowed to make offensive films.   There may be consequences in producing such a film or there may not be and if there are they will have to deal with it.  My guess is that it will be pretty much unnoticed unless offended people start squawking about it. 

I think this is a good way to look at it.  I think naming it Karen is poor form, since that word has become kind of a slur about a stereotypical white woman, but I won't quibble about it.  Odds are the film, which looks awful based on the trailer, will go largely unnoticed except for those looking for a reason to hate on white people and those looking to get angry about a film that makes white people look bad.  Yawn. 

 

[Alex P Keaton]

My boss is named Karen.   She's a terrible boss but not a racist.  Anyway, carry on.

 

[djmich]

Hollywood has been stereotyping blacks, asians, gays and native Americans since they began making films.   Now all of a sudden I should give a crap about one stupid movie involving a racist white lady on a channel that I'll never watch?

You’re right, I’m glad they finally decided to make a movie where white people don’t look good, those are really hard to find.

 

[BladeRunner]

You’re right, I’m glad they finally decided to make a movie where white people don’t look good, those are really hard to find.

And back in the 1920s and 30s Hollywood was racist so this is just Payback. The best way to fight racism is with even more racism. Racism 2.0

 

[Godsbrother]

And back in the 1920s and 30s Hollywood was racist so this is just Payback. The best way to fight racism is with even more racism. Racism 2.0

Hollywood stereotypes did not end in the 30s and are still prevalent in today's films.   Hispanics are often portrayed as drug dealers, Muslims as terrorists, black men as being angry/violent, black women as being loud and sassy, gays as being effeminate and promiscuous, and yes whites are sometimes portrayed as racists.  Heck the majority of comedies use stereotypes.   It isn't going away.

As I said earlier, I don't condone the making of this film and I won't watch it but there are a lot of offensive characters in movies and on TV.  I don't think this one made-for-TV movie made by a cable channel I never watch is indicative of a rise in "Racism 2.0" in Hollywood.   

If you want to be offended and attribute more weight to it than I then go for it.

 

[Godsbrother]

You’re right, I’m glad they finally decided to make a movie where white people don’t look good, those are really hard to find.

There are TONS of movies that make all kinds of people look bad.   

Again this is America, you're allowed to make offensive movies.  You are free to react to it anyway you want.  For me, I'm just not going to watch it which will be easy because the next show I watch on BET will be the first.

 

[Summer Wheat]

My boss is named Karen.   She's a terrible boss but not a racist.  Anyway, carry on.

I work with a Karen, and she is black! 

 

[djmich]

There are TONS of movies that make all kinds of people look bad.   

Again this is America, you're allowed to make offensive movies.  You are free to react to it anyway you want.  For me, I'm just not going to watch it which will be easy because the next show I watch on BET will be the first.

I'm struggling to think of movies that the clear intent is to take a race/gender/religion/etc stereo type to demean one of those populations...I'm sure their have to be some?

Making such a movie actually seems really contrary to the current social environment...but we know why this one is ok.

You are 100% correct though, free country, you're allowed to be racist.

 

[KarmaPolice]

I'm struggling to think of movies that the clear intent is to take a race/gender/religion/etc stereo type to demean one of those populations...I'm sure their have to be some?

Making such a movie actually seems really contrary to the current social environment...but we know why this one is ok.

You are 100% correct though, free country, you're allowed to be racist.

Still trying to wrap my head around what you guys think the stereotype is here.  Again, I don't think stereotype of a Karen is a racist, and I don't think a stereotype of white people is racists.  

 

[bigbottom]

I'm struggling to think of movies that the clear intent is to take a race/gender/religion/etc stereo type to demean one of those populations...I'm sure their have to be some?

Making such a movie actually seems really contrary to the current social environment...but we know why this one is ok.

You are 100% correct though, free country, you're allowed to be racist.

From the trailer it appears that the villains are racist Karen and her racist brother who is a cop. It is unclear to me whether the movie’s clear intent is to demean the entire white population. It’s certainly possible.

 

[djmich]

Still trying to wrap my head around what you guys think the stereotype is here.  Again, I don't think stereotype of a Karen is a racist, and I don't think a stereotype of white people is racists.  

From the trailer it appears that the villains are racist Karen and her racist brother who is a cop. It is unclear to me whether the movie’s clear intent is to demean the entire white population. It’s certainly possible.

Will let you guys get the last word, but imo:

KP:  I'm not even saying its explicitly racist, I'm just saying its a stereotype about white women and its not good.  Do with that what you will.  Here are some Karen's...will let you draw you own conclusion if Karens are a white stereotype or not and if people of one race using that stereo-type to stereotype another race is racist or not.  I kinda don't care about the argument over any technical classification, I just don't believe its helpful particularly in the environment we are in.

BB:   When the title of the movie is using the name that is meme'd to represent an entire segment of people with specific demographic traits...its hard to not think its related.  Maybe the producers are not familiar with the meme.

 

[bigbottom]

Will let you guys get the last word, but imo:

KP:  I'm not even saying its explicitly racist, I'm just saying its a stereotype about white women and its not good.  Do with that what you will.  Here are some Karen's...will let you draw you own conclusion if Karens are a white stereotype or not and if people of one race using that stereo-type to stereotype another race is racist or not.  I kinda don't care about the argument over any technical classification, I just don't believe its helpful particularly in the environment we are in.

BB:   When the title of the movie is using the name that is meme'd to represent an entire segment of people with specific demographic traits...its hard to not think its related.  Maybe the producers are not familiar with the meme.

I really shouldn’t be spending time analyzing a trailer for what appears to be an objectively terrible movie, but I’ll say that it appears that the Karen in the movie starts off by exhibiting stereotypical Karen behaviors - threatening to call the restaurant manager because other diners were too loud, telling neighbors that they needed to take their trash cans up per association rules. That is prototypical Karen stuff. But then Karen is revealed to be a racist psychopath. I’m not sure that the movie’s theme is that all white people are racist psychopaths, or even that all Karens are racist psychopaths. It’s possible I guess. Also, I think it’s unfortunate that the Karen moniker got tied up with a racial demographic. Because I think the characteristics are exhibited by a broad range of people. I’ve run into some myself. 

 

[glvsav37]

To me, it looks like this film is a story made out of separate, cherry picked events and white vs black ideas. 

• When she is on the phone claiming she is being harassed by black youths. Thats the Central Park Dog leash story
• Every time she mentions "Comply" (a bunch of times) its a poke at people who rebut police shootings with "well if they complied?" 
• "I dont have my ID" while getting arrested. Possible tie to the idea that AA's dont have ID's
• Bunch of seemingly random house searches and traffic stops
• Corrupt white cops. 
 

and thats just in the trailer.....

 

[Godsbrother]

To me, it looks like this film is a story made out of separate, cherry picked events and white vs black ideas. 

• When she is on the phone claiming she is being harassed by black youths. Thats the Central Park Dog leash story
• Every time she mentions "Comply" (a bunch of times) its a poke at people who rebut police shootings with "well if they complied?" 
• "I dont have my ID" while getting arrested. Possible tie to the idea that AA's dont have ID's
• Bunch of seemingly random house searches and traffic stops
• Corrupt white cops. 
 

and thats just in the trailer.....

Agreed,  looks like pretty lazy writing and I'm guessing it will be terrible.

 

[glvsav37]

Agreed,  looks like pretty lazy writing and I'm guessing it will be terrible.

I guess your enjoyment will depend on which side of the narrative you fall on. 

If you believe that AA's are systematically oppressed, this flick is for you. 

If you believe that white people are unfairly stereotyped as the cause of racism, then this one might be a pass. 

 

[KarmaPolice]

I guess your enjoyment will depend on which side of the narrative you fall on. 

If you believe that AA's are systematically oppressed, this flick is for you. 

If you believe that white people are unfairly stereotyped as the cause of racism, then this one might be a pass. 

It's not a requirement to believe in the premise of a movie to enjoy it or watch it.    Odd black and white take here (pun not intended).  

 

[glvsav37]

It's not a requirement to believe in the premise of a movie to enjoy it or watch it.    Odd black and white take here (pun not intended).  

 I think if you just look at the replies in this thread, which I assume are mostly Caucasian men, reaction to this particular movie seem pretty decisive. It seems this movie is pushing racial buttons in reverse, where the white person is the villain. Good or bad, I think that might cloud some people's desire to even go see it. 

As per my reply earlier, it seems the movie appears to be a series of current anti-AA news stories woven into a story about a single AA family. If so, I think the overall reaction to the movie would mirror the reaction to those individual news stories. 

 

 

[Godsbrother]

 I think if you just look at the replies in this thread, which I assume are mostly Caucasian men, reaction to this particular movie seem pretty decisive. It seems this movie is pushing racial buttons in reverse, where the white person is the villain. Good or bad, I think that might cloud some people's desire to even go see it. 

As per my reply earlier, it seems the movie appears to be a series of current anti-AA news stories woven into a story about a single AA family. If so, I think the overall reaction to the movie would mirror the reaction to those individual news stories. 

 

I'm a white guy and I won't be watching.  Not because it offends me or I feel it is making any kind of statement, it just isn't my kind of movie and if it hadn't been for this thread I likely would not even be aware of it.

 

[Caveman33]

 I think if you just look at the replies in this thread, which I assume are mostly Caucasian men, reaction to this particular movie seem pretty decisive. It seems this movie is pushing racial buttons in reverse, where the white person is the villain. Good or bad, I think that might cloud some people's desire to even go see it. 

As per my reply earlier, it seems the movie appears to be a series of current anti-AA news stories woven into a story about a single AA family. If so, I think the overall reaction to the movie would mirror the reaction to those individual news stories. 

 

The trailer looks like a realistic version of Get Out.  I was expecting a comedy.  (Even the director's name I thought was a play on Lee Daniels.)  Karen may do well but I doubt I will enjoy it.  A comedy would have been better in my opinion.

 

[KarmaPolice]

To me, it looks like this film is a story made out of separate, cherry picked events and white vs black ideas. 

• When she is on the phone claiming she is being harassed by black youths. Thats the Central Park Dog leash story
• Every time she mentions "Comply" (a bunch of times) its a poke at people who rebut police shootings with "well if they complied?" 
• "I dont have my ID" while getting arrested. Possible tie to the idea that AA's dont have ID's
• Bunch of seemingly random house searches and traffic stops
• Corrupt white cops. 
 

and thats just in the trailer.....

You aren't wrong, and combining that with the morphing a "Karen" into a racist points to this movie being poorly written and a bit dumb.  I'm not even denying that the writer/director have an agenda.  But again, that certainly isn't anything new.  

Also, any one of those things above we could find a news article about IRL too.  Like you said, this seems to be a morphing and exaggeration (by putting them all in one movie) of stories of the black experience in recent years.  IMO this will be panned, watched by very few people, and blow over.  I posted about a similar movie, Black Christmas, that also was panned/had a huge axe to grind/seemed to rub people the wrong way in the thread.   Seems few of you have heard of or seen that POS, which is I think what will happen with this.  

 

[Doug B]

To me, it looks like this film is a story made out of separate, cherry picked events and white vs black ideas. 

It's basically Scary Movie, Vampires Suck, or Robin Hood Men in Tights. Except instead of borrowing from cinema, they're borrowing from the news.

 

[Doug B]

A comedy would have been better in my opinion.

I think that's what they're going to end up with, anyway. 

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

Still trying to wrap my head around what you guys think the stereotype is here.  Again, I don't think stereotype of a Karen is a racist, and I don't think a stereotype of white people is racists.  

Do you think stereotypes of black people are racist?

 

[KarmaPolice]

It's basically Scary Movie, Vampires Suck, or Robin Hood Men in Tights. Except instead of borrowing from cinema, they're borrowing from the news.

interesting way to frame it, but you aren't wrong.  this thing looks so jammed with crap it borders on spoof. 

 

[dawgtrails]

How about Karen, The Musical?

https://twitter.com/TheoShantonas/status/1487549147695783939?s=20&t=hqIB4kbsX5D_Naf1zXflFw

 

[BladeRunner]

How about Karen, The Musical?

https://twitter.com/TheoShantonas/status/1487549147695783939?s=20&t=hqIB4kbsX5D_Naf1zXflFw

Just snagged 4 tickets for me and my family!!! 

 

[quick-hands]

Just snagged 4 tickets for me and my family!!! 

Why was she arrested?   For changing the weight on her legs?    

 

[BladeRunner]

Why was she arrested?   For changing the weight on her legs?    

I have no idea. 

 

[Max Power]

When I saw this was on Hulu the wife and I tried to watch it, but it was just so bad...  We probably made it 30 minutes before we both started playing on our phones and turned it off.