ChainsawU
Footballguy
Agreed. Make it stop. For the love of God make it stop. This is the preseason. This is what they mean when they tell you guys to sell high. This is what sell high looks like.
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kenbrell thompkins (2 Viewers)
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ChainsawU
Footballguy
I can't believe they got you drinking this too, bro. First Mo anoints him ROY and now this.
Banger
Footballguy
We had our 20th anniversary draft today in AC and he was the only player that didn't have a sticker in the draft kit. Most of the guys in my league didn't even know who he was. I think he's pretty under the radar.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
I can only go by what I'm seeing, GB. And he looks fantastic. It's one thing to buy the hype, but it's not wise to ignore it either. But I'm well aware they have been facing vanilla defenses and nobody is game-planning to stop him right now. He's still intriguing though.I can't believe they got you drinking this too, bro. First Mo anoints him ROY and now this.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
pantherclub
Footballguy
JustinHawkins
Footballguy
Any Patriots WR has upside, but I do think you have to keep his nice production that last game in check. I doubt Brady will go to him before Gronk or Amendola when both are on the field. That's not to say I think Thompkins won't deliver when given targets, but he's got no where to go but down on Brady's pecking order when he has a full healthy deck so to speak.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Boston
Footballguy
Right now a lot of Thompkins value will depend on the other WRs and TEs (and Vereen)...IMO there is zero doubt that Amendola and Gronk will be the top two targets for the Pats...if healthy (and it's a big if for both of them) they will both put up very big numbers...after those two it gets murky because everyone else (including Thompkins) is pretty much an unknown...guys like Dobson, Boyce, Edelman and Sudfeld could be key contributors or they could have quiet seasons...Vereen should be heavily involved in the passing game but does he catch 40 balls or 65 balls...tough to say right now...it appears Thompkins has a leg-up to be the #3 target (or #4 depending on what you think of Vereen) for the Pats but what that means will depend a lot on how good those other guys are...in the past few years the Pats WR depth has been pretty thin but this year it has the potential to be a unit where everyone can contribute...so when you are deciding how much you like Thompkins it probably makes sense to tie his value with what you think of those other guys...
bostonfred
Footballguy
Let's take a step back here.
Would you feel comfortable drafting a team where kt was in your starting lineup week one? I wouldn't, unless maybe I had gordon on the bench during his suspension. And even then I would feel like I was fairly weak at wr3/wr4. So he's a low end wr4 or wr5.
Is he a top two target on his own team? Maybe, but probably not The jury is still out on whether he can be a top three target, with gronk amendola vereen and the other rookies. If he is, it will be because he was productive, but he's fighting for fantasy relevance right now.
And if he isn't, the worst case scenario is that he has a two td week one, 4 catches for 80 in week 2, then does nothing for a couple weeks as you've finally built up the courage to start him. Given his situation, consistent production seems unlikely. You won't start him until he has a good week or two, which means you'll never get his full production in your roster. And as the season goes on, gronk may return, and the other rookies will be catching up.
That doesn't mean he has no upside. His upside is comparable to guys like welker and decker. That's pretty good for a late round flier. You might put him in as a wr3 or even a weak wr2. He definitely has potential as a bye week starter. But think about what would have to happen over the next 14 weeks for you to confidently put him in your lineup in weeks 15 and 16. That's a long shot no matter how excited you are about him right now.
Definitely worth a flier, but in the double digit rounds. 12th or 13th round as a wr5 sounds about right.
Would you feel comfortable drafting a team where kt was in your starting lineup week one? I wouldn't, unless maybe I had gordon on the bench during his suspension. And even then I would feel like I was fairly weak at wr3/wr4. So he's a low end wr4 or wr5.
Is he a top two target on his own team? Maybe, but probably not The jury is still out on whether he can be a top three target, with gronk amendola vereen and the other rookies. If he is, it will be because he was productive, but he's fighting for fantasy relevance right now.
And if he isn't, the worst case scenario is that he has a two td week one, 4 catches for 80 in week 2, then does nothing for a couple weeks as you've finally built up the courage to start him. Given his situation, consistent production seems unlikely. You won't start him until he has a good week or two, which means you'll never get his full production in your roster. And as the season goes on, gronk may return, and the other rookies will be catching up.
That doesn't mean he has no upside. His upside is comparable to guys like welker and decker. That's pretty good for a late round flier. You might put him in as a wr3 or even a weak wr2. He definitely has potential as a bye week starter. But think about what would have to happen over the next 14 weeks for you to confidently put him in your lineup in weeks 15 and 16. That's a long shot no matter how excited you are about him right now.
Definitely worth a flier, but in the double digit rounds. 12th or 13th round as a wr5 sounds about right.
MoveToSkypager
Footballguy
I saw him go in the 9th round of a redraft. I also saw him go 11th and 7th in rookie drafts.
Just reporting the news here.
Just reporting the news here.
I know that people are going to thin I am nuts but I am tying to trade up from the 19th pick to the 10th pick in my rookie draft as we speak so I can grab him.
I am offering up my first round pick in 2014. Which sound steep but its actually easy to trade for a first rd pick during the season. Rt before the trade deadline I usually trade a guy with value that I know I won't keep for a 1 st rd pick from a team that is rt on the cusp if making the playoffs but needs that one guy to get over the hump. Works every time.
So I'm confident ill get a 1st rd pick back.
pantherclub
Footballguy
opensourcebeer
Footballguy
I'd have no issue taking him 11th in rookie drafts. I'd probably consider him at 7.
Lacy, Gio, Wheaton, Eifert, Hopkins, Patterson, Lattimore, Micheals are guys I'd want before him.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
Who is to say they will ever be on the field at the same time. I'm an Amendola owner, but I don't have a ton of confidence he'll last until Gronk gets back. (Assuming he's out at least the first 6 games.)
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
I don't get this kind of talk. He should be on everyone's radar, he's no longer a sleeper kind of guy.
HurryUpSundays
Footballguy
Chuh-Ching. God bless Matt Berry. The hype-train is full of momentum.
Gotta be honest though, I picked up KT before the last game in hopes this would happen. I love selling high. But, the more and more I read, the more and more this guys seems to have the gig in hand. So many factors obviously, The hoody'd one being numero uno. But if this kid does maintain the starting gig and DCs game plan for Gronk and Amendola, which how can you not, KT 'could' put up solid WR2/3 numbers on a weekly basis.
If you got him before the game he is of little risk. I'm sure those who got him early plucked him off the ww. But, in upcoming drafts I highly doubt he'll be on any other of my teams.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Do you think he realistically can put up bigger numbers than Lloyd did last year (900 yards, 4 TDs)? I like KT and think he is an outstanding value, but I have a hard time seeing him be anything more than a bye week guy when Amendola and Gronk are healthy.
A lot of people thought that about Victor Cruz after his great preseason a couple of years ago. A lot of these guys end up being a flash in the pan. But to discount what you're looking at just because it's preseason leaves the door open for the next guy to get a potential WR 2 or 3 at a great price.Agreed. Make it stop. For the love of God make it stop. This is the preseason. This is what they mean when they tell you guys to sell high. This is what sell high looks like.
Not everybody invests as much time into ff as the people on this site. I'm in a work league with people who buy a magazine and watch espn, thats the extent of their preparation. Not every league is full of experts.
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ponchsox
Footballguy
Obviously, the sharks and astute FFL drafters will have Thompkins on their radar. The guppies who use outdated draft sheets probably don't even have them on their list. Depending on your league, you might be able to scoop him up late. I for one would not depend on him as a starter but a high upside 5th WR that could bring WR2 value. Before the 10th is definitely a reach.
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bigmarc27
Footballguy
That has nothing to do with Thompkins - no one is giving a 2014 1st straight up for Greg Jennings.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Should have started smaller. I wouldn't move a 2014 1st and 2014 devy pick for Jennings alone.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
I don't consider merely paying half attention to the four weeks of preseason preceding the regular season to be something that only experts do. Because that's all you'd have to do to have Thompkins on your radar. The Patriots are a high profile team. Everybody wants Tom Brady's favorite weapons on their fantasy roster. Even casual fantasy football owners should be picking up on Thompkins' hype, which was my point. He's no longer a sleeper even in many casual leagues, because he's performed on the field already.
a reach? I thought that sentence was going to end with "reasonable pick" and...why is he a reach as a 5th FF WR?
bigmarc27
Footballguy
I'm not saying I would personally take him in the 9th, but at that point in the draft I don't really believe in reaches anymore. People should take who they want and not go by a list that everyone is using.
This thread obviously picked up some steam and all and some of the previous discussion is many pages back now.
Dobson has seemed like the darling since day one. I haven't seen anything that takes that away. If he remains with that status he's going to get plenty of time and with his size and reach(which is unique on the pats) he's also going to get plenty of red zone love.
I still think Boyce is exciting and just needs some normal "seasoning" that rookie WRs often need. I could certainly envision him coming on mid-season.
Sudfeld is a beast with baseball mitt hands. I don't know that there's many defenders that can cover him in the red zone.
This doesn't even mention Sims who is doing very well as a traditional rookie not forced to play with the ones but instead developing down the depth chart.
The Pats still seem to have had this phenomenal offseason where they added a slew of weapons and normally would have been fortunate to add one or two. This could change, it's probably more likely that some of these rooks don't pan out than it is that all of them do. Some get injured? I don't know what happens but this Pats offseason is almost too good to be true with the offense.
KT has gone through an incredible transition where he'd be lucky to get a tryout to somehow seeming like a starter.
Everyone hasn't paid attention to KT since May. Some have looked in on him from time to time and are now thinking aww cmon an UDFA starting? 1000 yards receiving? Cmon. Had my curiousity not been piqued where I didn't follow him, I'd surely be that guy. KT has been doing real well for months now-not for a week or two.
While many sites had Michael Jenkins and Donald Jones predictions I have curiously not seen those sites transfer those projections to KT who about beat them out and sent them packing.
The most significant thing about KT is that Brady loves him or seems to as does BB and McD.
Dobson is a lock to get some love IMO and we'll have to see how he does then.
First and foremost will be BB getting a matchup he loves and having McD and Brady exploit that. I think there will be a lot of "hot hand" type offense with the Pats this year and the player that does well one week might not be the best player the next week.
The thing about KT is he has found some way to make it seem like he's been there, like he's one of the veterans. One could almost think he's been there three years while Dobson, Boyce, and Sims are the rooks. This is when a rookie has arrived. Find any previous thread on any rookie and you'll find that happening. It's well player X will start and I'm hopeful rook A and rook B can contribute. This is another reason why I think KT is assured some significant stats. It's unexpected and surprising, but there he is seeming to have played with Brady for years. There's a stat posted previously where someone was timing Brady's release and last year it was 2.4 while that day it was 2.0. It's hard to quantify Brady's comfort, but that is something factual at least. There's another article where KT kept running a route and pulling a DB away from the play like a veteran WR would do and Brady and Co. were praising him for his understanding of how while not being the receiver of the pass, he realized his value. There's some quotes out there during this offseason that have interestingly unique praise. These make me think more along the lines of starter/veteran and not along the lines of one of the rooks BB will be sure to rotate and move around to find mismatches.
BB and Brady have been playing a long time so it's curious to me how everyone pencils KT in for Lloyd's stats as if Lloyd's somehow been the norm for either of these guys' careers. At times under BB, I've felt like the Pats had one WR worth drafting. This seems like an especially good year for them.
Gronk's absence will give someone some time to become Brady's boy, Brady's other go to target besides Amendola. I think that'll be KT. I''m of the opinion Brady will have three go to targets after that point and not that KT will just be forgotten with two guys getting the lion's share of the passes.
plastik
Footballguy
For reference. I just dealt Thompkins in a start 3WR, 12 team, .5 ppr.
Thompkins, future 2nd (likely mid round), future 3rd (likely early)
for
Future 1st (same owner as the 2nd I dealt, so likely mid round)
I'm stacked at WR with Megatron, Marshall, D. Thomas, Fitz, Miles Austin and Gordon and crunched for Roster space so I couldn't pass it up. Last year this guy's 1st was 1.07.
ETA: Dynasty league, 22 man rosters.
Thompkins, future 2nd (likely mid round), future 3rd (likely early)
for
Future 1st (same owner as the 2nd I dealt, so likely mid round)
I'm stacked at WR with Megatron, Marshall, D. Thomas, Fitz, Miles Austin and Gordon and crunched for Roster space so I couldn't pass it up. Last year this guy's 1st was 1.07.
ETA: Dynasty league, 22 man rosters.
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Bronco Billy
Footballguy
I'm not sure why you're so invested in seeing this kid fail, but you sure are selling it hard. Maybe you could share why?Agreed. Make it stop. For the love of God make it stop. This is the preseason. This is what they mean when they tell you guys to sell high. This is what sell high looks like.
death of the cool
Footballguy
Last night in my redraft Thompkins went 9.06 and Sudfeld went 10.07 to the same guy....someone is buying the hype.
JustinHawkins
Footballguy
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Looks like I may have under estimated what this guy could fetch based on this deal here.
devouredbychaos
Footballguy
Pats homer here. I've got my keeper league draft and a redraft tomorrow night. Both leagues are full of Pats fans. I'm already predicting he'll be gone by the 9th round in both. In my one dynasty rookie draft he went 12th overall..and there aren't any Pats homers in that league besides me, I thought for sure I would've been able to snag him late.
ChainsawU
Footballguy
Bronco, it sounds like you have never stumbled upon a “gem” before, and now that you think you have one, you are getting defensive and calling people names because they have a stronger arguement than you do. Did you really think Thompkins was that talented coming out of college? If you did, then BOL with Thompkins and congrats on your find. But realistically, he went undrafted, and this is the preseason. And it's usually not a good idea to anoint an UDFA based on what he did in the preseason. It's preseason. Sell high bro.
plastik
Footballguy
Victor Cruz? Miles Austin? I just sold high on Thompkins, but I didn't do it without hesitation.Bronco, it sounds like you have never stumbled upon a “gem” before, and now that you think you have one, you are getting defensive and calling people names because they have a stronger arguement than you do. Did you really think Thompkins was that talented coming out of college? If you did, then BOL with Thompkins and congrats on your find. But realistically, he went undrafted, and this is the preseason. And it's usually not a good idea to anoint an UDFA based on what he did in the preseason. It's preseason. Sell high bro.
Run It Up
Footballguy
Can't stop, won't stop, also 1.5 TEPPR.
On-Topic:
Thompkins went for 1% of budget in a 10 team mandatory start 2 TE ppr auction draft on friday.
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ChainsawU
Footballguy
Reads Listens Views 2/22/2013By Matt Waldman • February 21, 2013
Friday Sleeper Tip: Cincinnati WR Kenbrell Thompkins
I’m wrapping up my film study for the 2013 Rookie Scouting Portfolio this month. I watch multiple games of almost every player I study and I try to document at least 2-3 of those views for the publication so my readers can have play-by-play notes that shows the work behind the analysis. Yesterday morning, I watched another game of University of Cincinnati runner George Winn and tight end Travis Kelce. It was Thompkins who caught my eye the most – as did his story.
Brown was a sleeper two years ago. Kenbrell Thompkins is one now. How are they related? See below. Photo by bmward_2000.
Thompkins is the cousin of Steelers wide receiver Antonio Brown and the brother Kendall, a University of Miami wideout. When Kenbrell saw Kendall earning opportunities to go to college, he decided to ditch his life headed down a path of crime for football. Sports Illustrated’s Michael McKnight does a fine job of reporting Thompkins’ transition from drug dealer to JUCO star, leader, and in my opinion, late-round or UDFA sleeper.
I’m a fan of Thompkins because he’s not just a fine athlete with quickness, leaping ability, and fluid skill around the ball. The Bearcats receiver clearly works at his craft. I can see it with the way he runs routes. Just like Marvin Jones, he can hold a defender in suspense with his route running and plays bigger than his 190-pound frame indicates.
The practice tape has a pre-Goodell-smackdown quality to it, but it demonstrates a lot of refinement with routes:
Plus, whenever I watch a wide receiver focus on details most prospects don’t address – such as engaging defenders 10-15 yards away from the ball as a blocker with good technique until the whistle blows – it’s a good indication the prospect is serious about getting better and not just leaning on his athleticism. The 2013 class is a deep one, but talent-wise Thompkins is a guy I’d remember if you’re a fantasy owner in a deep league monitoring the summer waiver wire for buzz-worthy candidates. Opportunity is a different story.
Friday Sleeper Tip: Cincinnati WR Kenbrell Thompkins
I’m wrapping up my film study for the 2013 Rookie Scouting Portfolio this month. I watch multiple games of almost every player I study and I try to document at least 2-3 of those views for the publication so my readers can have play-by-play notes that shows the work behind the analysis. Yesterday morning, I watched another game of University of Cincinnati runner George Winn and tight end Travis Kelce. It was Thompkins who caught my eye the most – as did his story.
Brown was a sleeper two years ago. Kenbrell Thompkins is one now. How are they related? See below. Photo by bmward_2000.Thompkins is the cousin of Steelers wide receiver Antonio Brown and the brother Kendall, a University of Miami wideout. When Kenbrell saw Kendall earning opportunities to go to college, he decided to ditch his life headed down a path of crime for football. Sports Illustrated’s Michael McKnight does a fine job of reporting Thompkins’ transition from drug dealer to JUCO star, leader, and in my opinion, late-round or UDFA sleeper.
I’m a fan of Thompkins because he’s not just a fine athlete with quickness, leaping ability, and fluid skill around the ball. The Bearcats receiver clearly works at his craft. I can see it with the way he runs routes. Just like Marvin Jones, he can hold a defender in suspense with his route running and plays bigger than his 190-pound frame indicates.
The practice tape has a pre-Goodell-smackdown quality to it, but it demonstrates a lot of refinement with routes:
- Sinking hips to generate hard, sudden breaks.
- Setting up breaks and releases with the chattering of feet and drumming of arms.
- The ability to dip the shoulder under contact at the line of scrimmage.
- Integration of feet and hands to gain a release.
- Suddenness to double moves.
- Flat breaks to prevent trailing coverage from undercutting the target.
Plus, whenever I watch a wide receiver focus on details most prospects don’t address – such as engaging defenders 10-15 yards away from the ball as a blocker with good technique until the whistle blows – it’s a good indication the prospect is serious about getting better and not just leaning on his athleticism. The 2013 class is a deep one, but talent-wise Thompkins is a guy I’d remember if you’re a fantasy owner in a deep league monitoring the summer waiver wire for buzz-worthy candidates. Opportunity is a different story.
Bronco Billy
Footballguy
Yeah, I saw before that you can be a #### and let it go. I'm going to do it again this time too. It still doesn't explain your need to see this kid fail. So you can get in a few "I told you so"s. Does that get your rocks off? There's got to be some reason why you come in blasting on anyone who sees something in this kid.Bronco, it sounds like you have never stumbled upon a gem before, and now that you think you have one, you are getting defensive and calling people names because they have a stronger arguement than you do. Did you really think Thompkins was that talented coming out of college? If you did, then BOL with Thompkins and congrats on your find. But realistically, he went undrafted, and this is the preseason. And it's usually not a good idea to anoint an UDFA based on what he did in the preseason. It's preseason. Sell high bro.
Run It Up
Footballguy
Good point I suppose have mentioned, Sudfeld went ahead of Thompkins in both of my recent drafts, scoring favors both WRs and TEs.
JustinHawkins
Footballguy
Is Sudfeld more desirable/valuable than Thompkins if you could only target one player?
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