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This may all be true, but in the end it doesn't make much sense. Vick is a far superior qb to kolb. If they have decided to go with vick, then the best move is to trade kolb for draft picks now. He will walk away after next year for nothing, if you can get a 1st round pick or q 2nd pick, then you always take that trade. What value does kolb provide the eagles? A backup qb for one year. How many other teams in the league would trade a 1st or 2nd, for the honor of having a good backup qb for one year? The answer of course is zero.
I think you're missing part of the point - they CAN'T trade Kolb for draft picks now. He simply can't be moved in any deal including picks until a new CBA is reached. There is a very real chance that Kolb won't be able to be traded until right before the season starts if the CBA negotiations hit snags as expected. If that's the case, it's going to be very difficult to move him because QBs can't just learn the system in a couple of weeks. It usually takes months for them to pick up the system and perform adequately. Then it becomes an issue of a team going into the season knowing that half the season is lost because Kolb will be just getting up to speed -- are you giving up a 1st knowing the guy probably won't be helping you for several months? Maybe, maybe not. It all hinges on the CBA, the longer it takes to get a deal, the less chance Kolb has of being moved, or at least the less chance he has of making a difference next season.
Still looks at draft picks for this year, which to me is unrealistic. I don't see a new CBA by the draft in April, so Kolb couldn't get traded. After that, most teams would have most of their draft picks for the following seasons.As for the potential draft picks listed as compensation, ones that had picks in the teens this year AND another pick seemed to be a but too much.
I had mentioned in another thread that I could see a trade of Kolb+#23 for a top 15 pick and a 2nd or 3rd. I also think the CBA will prevent any trade.
IMO this would absolutely be the best move.
It would be the best for 2011, but should they do that then KK would leave for sure at season's end, with Philly's only compensation being a compensatory pick. You don't pass up valuable draft picks for a one year rental at a backup position. The only way they keep Kolb long term that way is if Vick folds. IN that scenario...Philly still has missed terrific trade value, just with Vick instead.There is no easy solution here, especially with the CBA problems.
Reggie Brown had a few nice seasons and had more value for the Eagles than Feeley had for the Dolphins. Even if he wasn't great, the Eagles traded their back-up QB for a decent #2 starting WR. Good move for the Eagles, especially when you consider Feeley was originally drafted with a 5th round pick.Nice article, overall.However, shouldn't this guy do a little homework before making comments like this:Amused to Death said:
WR Reggie Brown was taken with that pick.
Seems much more like a wash to me. They picked Feeley with a 5, traded him for a marginal WR who never amounted to anything, traded him for a 6 and were done with that.You can't go thumping your chest and taunting the Dolphins for giving up their #2 when the Eagles got nothing of substance out of that pick. They dropped $10 million on the guy and he washed out. I wouldn't be trumpeting this...at...all.Reggie Brown had a few nice seasons and had more value for the Eagles than Feeley had for the Dolphins. Even if he wasn't great, the Eagles traded their back-up QB for a decent #2 starting WR. Good move for the Eagles, especially when you consider Feeley was originally drafted with a 5th round pick.Nice article, overall.
However, shouldn't this guy do a little homework before making comments like this:
WR Reggie Brown was taken with that pick.
Exactly. We can't keep them both beyond this year unless we were to somehow give Vick a long-term deal now (which I don't think is prudent) and then consider tagging our backup next year (again, assuming CBA allows for tags at that point). HIGHLY unlikely to say the least. So the team has to optimize its options. Since it appears they truly think Vick is a better option, then trading Kolb, particularly in a year when it appears there are no easy answers in the draft, makes a lot of sense.
We'll just agree to disagree. You have your Cowboy glasses on and there is no arguing with that. Was Reggie Brown all-pro? no. Was he a servicable #2 WR for a couple of years? Yes. The main problem was the Eagles didn't have a #1 receiver due to TO flaming out. Brown had 2,100 yards receiving and 16 TD's in his first 3 years. That averages to 700 yards and 5 TD's per year. Again, not all pro, but decent for a #2 receiver.Keep in mind, Brown led the Eagles in receiving yards and TD's in 2006, when the Eagles ranked 3rd in the league in passing yards and ranked first in passing TD's. Guess who was the Eagles 3rd string QB on that 2006 team behind McNabb and Garcia? you guessed it, AJ Feeley, who had already flamed out with the Dolphins. The Dolphins basically got nothing for that 2nd round pick. The Eagles got a servicable receiver for a couple of years, and got their Back-up QB back. Advantage, Eagles.On a separate note, Brown was the last of a bunch of average to bad WR picks for the Eagles (Na Brown, Fred Mitchell, Todd Pinkston, Billy McMullen). Since then, they have drafted Avant, Jackson, and Maclin. They have gotten much better at picking WR's.
The entire Article is based upon the presumption that a new CBA WILL be in effect before the draft. He even states that in point #1, at the beginning:David Yudkin said:
While I do not believe that this will occur either, at least the Author is aware of the fact, and points it out at the beginning.
All I've seen is that if there is no new CBA before the draft, there can be no trades.I also have seen nothing to indicate that the owners would implement their right to invoke the last best offer clause as cited in that PFT report. As far as I know, the owners were planning on collecting their tv revenue with no football being played and making the NFLPA cave (if there still is one). A lot will depend on whether the players' lawsuit to block the owners from getting paid by the networks gains any traction.
You may get a compensatory pick for Kolb that may not be too far off from what you'd get for him on the open market. Does this change your mind?
The highest possible compensatory pick come AFTER the third round. Not even the biggest non-beleivers have suggested he wouldn't draw better than that. It's unreasonable to think he'd be even remotely close to that.
Cassel and Vrabel just went for a high 2nd round pick. If you consider yourself a Super Bowl contender (which I assume the Eagles do), is giving up a solid backup QB, when your starter is injury prone, worth trading up from the end of the 3rd to the top of the 2nd?
A lot can change between now and then. For example, suppose Kolb sticks around and Vick gets hurt and misses half the season. Kolb steps in, the Eagles go 2-6, and Kolb doesn't play well and the offense sputters when Vick had them hitting on all cylinders.Would that impact Kolb's value at the end of next year and what he might sign for? Maybe he loses his ability to be a starter and has to settle to being a backup again.
I think the Pats gave Cassel away for peanuts, so I would not gauge Kolb's value based solely on that.I also am not totally convinced Vick should be categorized as a major injury risk. He played in 15+ games 4 of 5 years in ATL and has been hurt in two other seasons. Greater injury risk, sure, but IMO any QB is at risk from getting a hard hit and a serious injury.
Brown had 1 season of 800 yards and 6 TDs, which is I think the serviceable #2 you are looking for. There have been 108 other receivers to do that in the last 6 years. He did it once.While I guess it's better than Feely, he sure was a bust for a high 2nd rounder.
An impasse make a ton of sense though, given the reality that the TV revenue is not without strings or subject to litigation on many fronts. Think about it - if the sides are able to make little to no progress in the next month, why would they NOT do this? In the mean time, they certainly have to posture that they are trying to negotiate (hence no real mention of the possibility from owners). When the deadline hits, and the sides haven't budged an inch, the owners would be in position to implement this strategy and get the financial concessions they want (probably not the 18 game season though). Then what? THE NFLPA either strikes or has to accept, and a strike would be asinine.
I think the Cassel comparison is a fair one, because I really don't see anyone giving up a 1st rounder straight up for Kolb. Do you? A high 2nd is of course the next-best thing (unless we want to get into some theoretical combination of picks, which is a conversation that I'm really not even interested in having).As far as Vick's injury risk is concerned, you look at it that way, and I look at it this way: he has only once played a full 16 game schedule. To me, that would be enough to warrant keeping a solid, reasonably priced backup QB on the roster.
How about you provide us with some evidence to the contrary instead of expecting us to just blindly fall in line with your demands?
This makes sense. I like Vick but I think given how he plays it is wise to have a viable backup who can step in and keep your team in the playoff hunt.
I don't think 2/3 of the leagues QBs will play 18 games. I do think he will get traded while he has value.
I really don't think they're getting a 1st for Kolb, let alone a 1st+.
Consider them mentioned...Here's old news from ESPN & Schefter:Cardinals soliciting opinion of WR Larry Fitzgerald as to which QB he wants them to acquire. First recommendation was Kevin Kolb. 7:43 AM Feb 6th via ÜberTwitter Retweeted by 100+ people
I should have mentioned that in my post that everything hinges on the CBA. However the story indicates just how much KK is thought of around the league. The fact that Kolb would be Fitzgerald's choice says something, imo.Kafka being ready or not, I think they'd have to take a top 5 pick regardless.
I think you're reading a bit too much into this.
Into what? That there's interest in him around the league? I'm certainly not expecting a top 5 pick, but some people think the Eagles would never get a 1 or a decent 2 for him.
I think I need to be sold on Kolb, at this point he looks like an over hyped career backup. I think he would look great in a 49ers uniform
He's better than anything the Cards have currently, but I would rather take my chances with a free Bulger than an overpriced, unproven, and over hyped backup that struggled to put up consistently good numbers with a more talented team.
I would guess if it were for THIS draft that he might fetch an early second or a late first. The problem being that teams in the late first likely don't need a QB that badly or they would not have been in the playoffs to begin with. If no one would bite on that, then maybe you start looking at a late second this year and a second next year. I personally don't see a team offering a Top 5 pick, but anything can happen.If there is no CBA and teams will only be able to deal 2012 picks, then maybe a first in 2012 straight up and both teams run the risk of where the pick will ultimately be downstream (like the Patriots did with OAK for Richard Seymour).
Should any thing happen with the CBA and trades did happen for this year, I've said a few times the best we'd get is to trade Kolb and #23 for a pick in the 10-15 range + a 2nd or 3rd.I posted the Arizona article just an indication there is interest in him possibly in AZ and what one (crazy?) writer put as a value for him and the happiness of their star receiver, who publicly named Kolb as his top choice of available QBs.
The article indicates what one writer thinks about KK, not how he's thought of around the league. It says that Fitz said Kolb and Bulger would be his top choices. It's obvious he's only talking about QBs likely to be available, so I don't think this "indicates just how much KK is thought of around the league", unless you think Bulger is up there as well. This is just one writer's opinion, nothing more.
