cstu
Footballguy
It boggles my mind that a team with a defense like the 49ers who have an inexperienced player returning punts wouldn't simply instruct him to avoid any chance of a turnover.
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Kyle Williams WR SF (This kid is gaining steam) (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter jacobo_moses
- Start date
wiscstlatlmia
Footballguy
oof...I hope he can come back from this...really, really though game. I hope he can keep his head up and keep working hard
Dr. Awesome
Footballguy
Are we catching the bobble on the reverse?How many catches did he have today?As far as snaps go. This is kind of his rookie year. And the only reason he was the returner was cause Ginn was out. I think its kind of shortsighted to say because of a huge game and playoff one at that. Most rookie's returning punts or kicks would feel some heavy pressure to perform. Sorry guys. I think he is still a heck of a player that will only get better. To fault him for those 2 bad fumbles and say he is worthless and won't ever see the field because of it is a little premature in my opinion.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
Just because you started the thread, you dont have to stand by him until he retires/gets kicked off the 9ersAs far as snaps go. This is kind of his rookie year. And the only reason he was the returner was cause Ginn was out. I think its kind of shortsighted to say because of a huge game and playoff one at that. Most rookie's returning punts or kicks would feel some heavy pressure to perform. Sorry guys. I think he is still a heck of a player that will only get better. To fault him for those 2 bad fumbles and say he is worthless and won't ever see the field because of it is a little premature in my opinion.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Especially if they bring in a real QB. Alex Smith just seemed completely overmatched. Hopefully they bring in Flynn or somebody else to compete with him. He's a bottom third NFL starter right now at best.
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shadyridr
Footballguy
I completely forgot about that. So the guy started and played an entire game at WR, had 0 catches, fumbled a reverse which shouldve been a turnover, fumbled to punt returns, and fair caught other punts when defenders werent within 30 yards of him. Heck of a player.Are we catching the bobble on the reverse?How many catches did he have today?As far as snaps go. This is kind of his rookie year. And the only reason he was the returner was cause Ginn was out. I think its kind of shortsighted to say because of a huge game and playoff one at that. Most rookie's returning punts or kicks would feel some heavy pressure to perform. Sorry guys. I think he is still a heck of a player that will only get better. To fault him for those 2 bad fumbles and say he is worthless and won't ever see the field because of it is a little premature in my opinion.
And Crabtree had 1 catch for 3 yards. The WRs in general did nothing yesterday. Smith completed 12 of 26 (46%) and we're putting all the fault Williams and now calling him worthless?Granted Williams was awful on special teams, but I doubt he'll be back there ever again to field punts. We're talking about two separate units and on offense he's still coming along and maturing. He showed a bit of promise this season.Nice buy low from people who think he's done. He was dropped in one of my deep leagues yesterday after the game - very shortsighted.ETA: Just have to hope the psychological impacts of those two fumble don't mess with him going forward.I completely forgot about that. So the guy started and played an entire game at WR, had 0 catches, fumbled a reverse which shouldve been a turnover, fumbled to punt returns, and fair caught other punts when defenders werent within 30 yards of him. Heck of a player.Are we catching the bobble on the reverse?How many catches did he have today?As far as snaps go. This is kind of his rookie year. And the only reason he was the returner was cause Ginn was out. I think its kind of shortsighted to say because of a huge game and playoff one at that. Most rookie's returning punts or kicks would feel some heavy pressure to perform. Sorry guys. I think he is still a heck of a player that will only get better. To fault him for those 2 bad fumbles and say he is worthless and won't ever see the field because of it is a little premature in my opinion.
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SmoovySmoov
The Way of the Samurai
"If "if's" and "but's" were candy and nuts, we'd all have a Merry Christmas." - My Dad'shadyridr said:
Ghost of Bill Walsh
Footballguy
I seriously doubt that Williams will return kicks next year. His shot to having a good career will have to come on offense. Yes he's just a 2yr. player but the mistakes he made were huge in the outcome of yesterday's game. Not so sure his dynasty value is that great. Probably can get him cheap but I speculate he won't develop into a stud receiver. Maybe a low end #2 at best.
Not from what I've seen in my leagues where roughly 288 to 310 players are rostered depending on the league (14-team / 22 man rosters and 12-team / 24 man rosters). That spans across ~10 leagues.I've (and I know some others for sure) tried in all and people weren't trading him up very easily.
jacobo_moses
Footballguy
49ers stick by Kyle Williams as it should be.
Check out this article.
http://arizona.sbnation.com/arizona-cardinals/2012/1/23/2727208/kyle-williams-san-francisco-49ers
Check out this article.
http://arizona.sbnation.com/arizona-cardinals/2012/1/23/2727208/kyle-williams-san-francisco-49ers
Young 8
Footballguy
A nice story for the press
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Homers and fans are understandably emotional right now. But he does have some value I think as a buy low.
I have him in a 12 team 24 roster league... I floated him out to people and was ignored or mocked. I offered him up for the 3.12 pick (last pick in the draft) and was told this is a deep class and whatever player is available at the 3.12 would be a better gamble than Kyle Williams. I couldn't get him off my roster. What were people asking for in your leagues?
Avery
Footballguy
He was the Niners' 5th WR on opening day. Assuming Morgan and Ginn are extended, I don't see how you can consider Williams as having the inside track on the WR2 spot, especially after what happened yesterday - it's a rare goat that gives away the game twice. If you're looking for a low upside Niners' WR, you should consider Morgan IMO. Judging by this thread, he's an afterthought.
Offered an early 3rd in 2 leagues and turned down (3.01 and 3.05 in two separate leagues). Ed Dickson for Williams was rejected in another.
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identikit
Footballguy
Recent offers?Might try them again.
Young 8
Footballguy
OWNEDBeat writer Matt Maiocco says Kyle Williams' roster spot "certainly is not guaranteed for next season."
How is that "owned?"
Will he then be unable to sign with another team if the 49ers let him go? I don't understand.If anything, it can be argued that it may in fact HELP him if he isn't with the 9ers. He'll put this mess from last night behind him (out of sight-out of mind), as well as potentially sign with a team that's more active in the passing game than SF.
goldenchild
Footballguy
Let's not forget that he didn't exactly have a decent game vs. NO (dropped a key 3rd down pass that would have gotten us the 1st). Call it 2nd year jitters or whatever... he let the big stage get the best of him.
Young 8
Footballguy
You don't understand because you think he's goodUnfortunately he's just a scrub who will be tagged as a "fumbler" from now on
goldenchild
Footballguy
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Wow. Now that's scouting.
jwb
Footballguy
I think we saw yesterday that, in terms of FF, he's really not going to be anything much. He may eventually become a servicable player / ff depth / etc, but a guy to stash in hopes of becoming something big? Probably not - guys that become something big don't have playoffs like this.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Shutout
Footballguy
I feel bad for the kid.
For FF value, its hard to imagine much value. If he stays with the Niners, he becomes a risk as one of the lower WRs on the roster because you know he will never work on the return team again. So if it comes down to a new kid that plays well on specials, you might think Williams would be a late cut before the season if there is a choice to made. That really sets him back.
If he goes somewhere else, he has to flat out beat someone out of a spot, similar to if he stays in San Fran.
I just think overall that someone really is going to have to like him to let him stick long enough to rebound from this because as spots get tight, a team may be willing to give someone else a try. making the mistakes he made yesterday WILL have some effects on his confidence and thats a big hurdle to get back over. In the NFL, you see really good players go into the virtual tank at times when things like this happen (and they get cut a ot of slack). Much harder for a guy that was fortunate enough to make a final cut this year.
For FF value, its hard to imagine much value. If he stays with the Niners, he becomes a risk as one of the lower WRs on the roster because you know he will never work on the return team again. So if it comes down to a new kid that plays well on specials, you might think Williams would be a late cut before the season if there is a choice to made. That really sets him back.
If he goes somewhere else, he has to flat out beat someone out of a spot, similar to if he stays in San Fran.
I just think overall that someone really is going to have to like him to let him stick long enough to rebound from this because as spots get tight, a team may be willing to give someone else a try. making the mistakes he made yesterday WILL have some effects on his confidence and thats a big hurdle to get back over. In the NFL, you see really good players go into the virtual tank at times when things like this happen (and they get cut a ot of slack). Much harder for a guy that was fortunate enough to make a final cut this year.
No.I don't understand your "owned" comment because not being guaranteed a spot with the 49ers isn't ending his entire career. He's got the WR build and has shown can make catches and is only 2 years out of the gate. Is he a Colston, Dez, Mike Wallace, etc.? Clearly not. No one's claiming that. Sure, he crumbled on the big stage yesterday, but does that mean he can't be a #3/#4 WR for fantasy purposes? No. He can certainly be a #3/#4 fantasy WR. I don't see how last night's 2 fumbles on special teams seals his NFL career. That's the definition of a knee jerk reaction.Shutout's point on the psychological impact of this is the only thing that concerns me, but in no way should this guy be dropped in leagues because of last night or be termed "worthless". No one knows the psychological impact, but if he gets past that... he can be fantasy relevant.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
Completely forgot about Morgan. He showed some flashes early in the year before the injury (broken ankle?), and that was really before Smith got in a groove (Only 1 game over 205yds in the first 5).That said, I dont see anyone worth owning on that team besides Crabtree and Davis. Not enough passes to go around, and not a good enough QB to have 3 viable options in FF.
BaBastage
Footballguy
Name one WR that the 49ers have today who has a 100% guaranteed roster spot for next season.Crabtree has 4 years left on his contract (iirc) and i wouldn't even call his spot completely safe. (albeit likely that he'll be on the team next year.)
houndirish
Footballguy
I'm with Moses ...
I had made a note about him heading into my dynasty offseason as a player to monitor before this weekend's games. I don't have high expectations but he's young and has gamebreaker speed and is playing on a team where there appears to be opportunity.
I'm not here to defend his special teams play. He either won't be used at that position any longer or he'll get a heavy dose of fundamentals coaching if SF wants to keep him there. Either way, as a fantasy receiver prospect, he's still on my radar and if anything, this past game just made him dirt cheap.
I had made a note about him heading into my dynasty offseason as a player to monitor before this weekend's games. I don't have high expectations but he's young and has gamebreaker speed and is playing on a team where there appears to be opportunity.
I'm not here to defend his special teams play. He either won't be used at that position any longer or he'll get a heavy dose of fundamentals coaching if SF wants to keep him there. Either way, as a fantasy receiver prospect, he's still on my radar and if anything, this past game just made him dirt cheap.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
OP all over this, Williams is gaining a lot of steam....and death threats.
jacobo_moses
Footballguy
This was posted on Twitter by
EyeonNFL
No matter what you think of Kyle Williams, he reportedly stood in front of his locker today and answered all questions. A true pro.
I wish Alex Smith would have hit
him on that play action play when Williams had beaten everyone and was overthrown by Smith just like 2 yards or so.
Just saying is all.
EyeonNFL
No matter what you think of Kyle Williams, he reportedly stood in front of his locker today and answered all questions. A true pro.
I wish Alex Smith would have hit
him on that play action play when Williams had beaten everyone and was overthrown by Smith just like 2 yards or so.
Just saying is all.
identikit
Footballguy
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jacobo_moses
Footballguy
I thought this was an interesting take on the whole thing.
http://nflfilms.nfl.com/2012/01/24/cosell-talks-for-alex-smith-what-a-difference-a-week-made/
While I fully believe Kyle Williams single handedly cost them the game at the end. If the 49ers had made good on some of the open spots earlier (Like they did vs the Saints) the 49ers would've never had to put the whole game on Williams shoulders to not mess up at all in his first full game has the PR and KR. Sad but true.
http://nflfilms.nfl.com/2012/01/24/cosell-talks-for-alex-smith-what-a-difference-a-week-made/
While I fully believe Kyle Williams single handedly cost them the game at the end. If the 49ers had made good on some of the open spots earlier (Like they did vs the Saints) the 49ers would've never had to put the whole game on Williams shoulders to not mess up at all in his first full game has the PR and KR. Sad but true.
identikit
Footballguy
Ray Ratto's (SF beat writer) take:
Now you understand why the concussion problem in sports is never going away, ever. Or if you haven’t seen the Newark Star-Ledger piece on the Giants and 49ers, you’re about to do so.
To summarize, the Giants apparently targeted Kyle Williams because of his history of concussions. To fill out that story, we turn to columnist Steve Politi:
“The thing is, we knew he had four concussions, so that was our biggest thing . . . to take him outta the game,” said Jacquian Williams, who forced the overtime fumble.
In addition, Devin Thomas, the reserve wide receiver who recovered both that fumble and the fourth quarter one that set up New York’s second touchdown, said Kyle Williams was a person of particular interest.
“He’s had a lot of concussions,” Thomas told Star-Ledger columnist Steve Politi. “We were just like, ‘We gotta put a hit on that guy.’ (Safety Tyler) Sash did a great job hitting him early and he looked kind of dazed when he got up. I feel like that made a difference and he coughed it up.”
While we can’t know if the Sash hit discombobulated Williams, or if this is a piece of information that comes from coaches to players (as opposed to player-on-player pregame prep) the fact that the Giants would take satisfaction in the strategy explains much about the way many players regard each other. And almost certainly football isn’t the only venue for such headhunting.
Now we can expect denials all around as this story picks up heat, as provided by Deadspin’s distillation of the New York Magazine distillation of the internet reports from Sunday’s game. But let’s play with the very real possibility that the truth is found in the unvarnished reports.
It means that heads remain fair game in sports, and that cranial issues are just grist for the Darwinian mill. And that all the attempts to clean up head shots in the games we watch are valueless as long as the players who deliver them are proud of having done so and enjoy the competitive advantages that comes from them.
It may also point to the victims’ reluctance to report head issues, or to coaches’ disinterest in knowing about them. It certainly puts the injured shoulder story Williams’ father Ken advanced on Monday in a different light, and makes the death threats Kyle received that much more craven.
Frankly, it changes the entire Kyle Williams story, and presents the NFL with a new and more frightening twist about the game it presents as entertainment, and those who view it as such.
This is, in short, a story that a lot of people will want to move past as quickly as possible as the Super Bowl hype begins to crest, and as Kyle Williams’ career advances. But it should be placed in memory as a reminder that the depth of the head injury problem is far greater and more frightening than anyone associated with the business should find comfortable.
http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/niners-talk/post/Did-Giants-target-Kyle-Williams-because-?blockID=637030&feedID=5884
Now you understand why the concussion problem in sports is never going away, ever. Or if you haven’t seen the Newark Star-Ledger piece on the Giants and 49ers, you’re about to do so.
To summarize, the Giants apparently targeted Kyle Williams because of his history of concussions. To fill out that story, we turn to columnist Steve Politi:
“The thing is, we knew he had four concussions, so that was our biggest thing . . . to take him outta the game,” said Jacquian Williams, who forced the overtime fumble.
In addition, Devin Thomas, the reserve wide receiver who recovered both that fumble and the fourth quarter one that set up New York’s second touchdown, said Kyle Williams was a person of particular interest.
“He’s had a lot of concussions,” Thomas told Star-Ledger columnist Steve Politi. “We were just like, ‘We gotta put a hit on that guy.’ (Safety Tyler) Sash did a great job hitting him early and he looked kind of dazed when he got up. I feel like that made a difference and he coughed it up.”
While we can’t know if the Sash hit discombobulated Williams, or if this is a piece of information that comes from coaches to players (as opposed to player-on-player pregame prep) the fact that the Giants would take satisfaction in the strategy explains much about the way many players regard each other. And almost certainly football isn’t the only venue for such headhunting.
Now we can expect denials all around as this story picks up heat, as provided by Deadspin’s distillation of the New York Magazine distillation of the internet reports from Sunday’s game. But let’s play with the very real possibility that the truth is found in the unvarnished reports.
It means that heads remain fair game in sports, and that cranial issues are just grist for the Darwinian mill. And that all the attempts to clean up head shots in the games we watch are valueless as long as the players who deliver them are proud of having done so and enjoy the competitive advantages that comes from them.
It may also point to the victims’ reluctance to report head issues, or to coaches’ disinterest in knowing about them. It certainly puts the injured shoulder story Williams’ father Ken advanced on Monday in a different light, and makes the death threats Kyle received that much more craven.
Frankly, it changes the entire Kyle Williams story, and presents the NFL with a new and more frightening twist about the game it presents as entertainment, and those who view it as such.
This is, in short, a story that a lot of people will want to move past as quickly as possible as the Super Bowl hype begins to crest, and as Kyle Williams’ career advances. But it should be placed in memory as a reminder that the depth of the head injury problem is far greater and more frightening than anyone associated with the business should find comfortable.
http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/niners-talk/post/Did-Giants-target-Kyle-Williams-because-?blockID=637030&feedID=5884
jacobo_moses
Footballguy
Very interesting piece for sure. 
True, but man that kid's writing and spelling is horrendous.
