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Ladarius Green's value (1 Viewer)

But guys, I just had someone in a dynasty league say he ranks at Maxx Williams' level and NOBODY would trade a rookie 1st round pick (even as part of a package) for him. So tap the brakes, I'd say.

 
zamboni said:
Julius was very TD heavy that year (with not a ton of catches), which boosted his fantasy points in a big way. If you think Green is going to  catch as many TDs, then draft accordingly. But TDs are very variable, so I would rather go for a target-heavy guy.
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Thomas had two consecutive seasons with 12 TDs prior to leaving Denver.  The system fed him the ball at the goalline.

 
A lot of news recently affecting Green's value. What is the highest rookie pick you'd pay for him? What would it take for you to move him? 

I'd say early 2nd / late 1st.

 
mikel2014 said:
A lot of news recently affecting Green's value. What is the highest rookie pick you'd pay for him? What would it take for you to move him? 

I'd say early 2nd / late 1st.
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In this draft I wouldn't trade him for anything less than the 1.03 which I don't expect anybody to offer. There's a lot of players I'd trade him for though. 

 
mikel2014 said:
A lot of news recently affecting Green's value. What is the highest rookie pick you'd pay for him? What would it take for you to move him? 

I'd say early 2nd / late 1st.
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1.01 or bust for me, and I own Ladarius in all my dyno leagues.  Him and Fleener are the big winners in value right now.  I wouldn't pay that, but then again I don't have to :)

 
Zyphros said:
1.01 or bust for me, and I own Ladarius in all my dyno leagues.  Him and Fleener are the big winners in value right now.  I wouldn't pay that, but then again I don't have to :)
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agree on Fleener and Green and the reality is, in dynasty FF, with that age and that location for each of these guys,the seller has the leverage because you're just not going to be able to find a guy in a rookie draft at that position that could land in a better situation or make that type of impact for a few years.  Two years is very realistic waiting time on a proposition like that and that is a long time (especially if you are in a win now mode).

I know nobody would probably give 1.01-1.06 or so this year.  Just can't see it. But if they need to, they should.

 
Shutout said:
agree on Fleener and Green and the reality is, in dynasty FF, with that age and that location for each of these guys,the seller has the leverage because you're just not going to be able to find a guy in a rookie draft at that position that could land in a better situation or make that type of impact for a few years.  Two years is very realistic waiting time on a proposition like that and that is a long time (especially if you are in a win now mode).

I know nobody would probably give 1.01-1.06 or so this year.  Just can't see it. But if they need to, they should.
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1.01? For Fleener or Green? How many points per recept are we talking here?

 
jeaton6 said:
1.01? For Fleener or Green? How many points per recept are we talking here?
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I said I didn't expect anyone to do it for the first 6 picks or so.  But, if you are a team in a win now mode and you really think you are a TE away from winning then, yes, you should, because (IMO) one of the things that people gets so sideways and wrong about in dynasty league football is this "Logan's run" syndrome where everyone thinks they have to have super young players and  they hang onto them and get so biased that they forget as these dynasty years go by, they forget how to compete in the year they are playing in.

I've seen guys so many times that might be something like a TE and a little flex depth away from being a true top, obvious team.  So some guy comes along and says (let's say its right now) "I'll give you Golden Tate and Coby Fleener for Treadwell".  That's a move that absolutely punches the contending team's ticket but it gets declined in a flash and the Treadwell guy will say something about "blah blah blha, you're guys are older..Treadwell is only 20....".  Well that's fine.  You go ahead with that contending team with Brady and Peterson and all that and you draft your Austin Hooper and all that and at the end of the year, those two holes will still be there because neither of those players will give as much impact as you were offered and in about a year or two, your window is closed...just when your Treadwell and Hooper are now able to help.

More than anything, that's how I see so many dynasty league seem to maintain this constant level of plateaued, good but not great talent on good but not great teams.  IMO, in dynasty, you have to know when seize the moment and there are a lot of guys that simply aren't good at it.

 
That's lovely and all,  but doesn't mean those two TEs that haven't proven #### are worth a 1st rounder.  

If someone is a tight ends away,  they go and get a good tight end, not an athlete that barely got playing time for years,  or a stiff that went from one good offense he couldn't do anything in,  to another good offense.  

Why is Fleener going to be good?  Because he escaped the evil clutches of Andrew Luck?  :lmao:

 
massraider said:
That's lovely and all,  but doesn't mean those two TEs that haven't proven #### are worth a 1st rounder.  

If someone is a tight ends away,  they go and get a good tight end, not an athlete that barely got playing time for years,  or a stiff that went from one good offense he couldn't do anything in,  to another good offense.  

Why is Fleener going to be good?  Because he escaped the evil clutches of Andrew Luck?  :lmao:
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Isn't the same true about those first rounders you are putting on a pedestal in that they haven't done #### yet either?

The big difference is obvious to me.  WIth Fleener, you're getting a guy that has shown ability and has played ion a team with a combo of bad QBs at times and a team that inexplicably spent a year thinking they were a run first team...and you shared duties with a guy that is pretty darned good himself in Dwayne Allen. And now you're going to a team where the Qb made a 35 year old TE last year the #7 TE for the year and the guy before him was the consensus #1-#2 dynasty TE (due largely to his own talent but the fact that the Saints seemingly threw in a JAG last year and pushed him to top 10 should make us notice).

With Green, very similar situation in some ways.  Really, the only thing that clearly holds him back is the injuries.  I'm not as familiar with him as Fleener but from the outside looking in I think we can say we see Pitt as a fairly TE friendly team that scores a ton and, again if you are a TE away, you are probably going to be in good hands.

 
massraider said:
That's lovely and all,  but doesn't mean those two TEs that haven't proven #### are worth a 1st rounder.  

If someone is a tight ends away,  they go and get a good tight end, not an athlete that barely got playing time for years,  or a stiff that went from one good offense he couldn't do anything in,  to another good offense.  

Why is Fleener going to be good?  Because he escaped the evil clutches of Andrew Luck?  :lmao:
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Targets.

Fleener got 92 a couple years ago from a healthy Luck and finished TE6 (then he got 84 during last year's debacle and finished TE21... quite the range). He will probably get around 120 this year, but even if he only gets Ben Watson's 110, that's still enough volume to finish in the top 6.

Green's situation isn't as fertile, but he'll probably get 90 with an upside of ~105.

 
Ben Roethlisberger "did not mention" Ladarius Green (ankle surgery) when asked Tuesday about the Steelers' tight end situation.
Asked about Green's progress from January ankle surgery, Big Ben "answered with a two-shoulder shrug." Ostensibly still in his rehab phase a whopping seven months removed from the procedure, Green has reportedly been running alone on a side field while the Steelers do 11-on-11s. Fantasy owners should begin moving Green down their cheatsheets while continuing to monitor his situation.

 
 
Source: Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
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Milkman said:
Yeah this is not good. If he can't cut on his ankle after 7 months..........something is going on here........
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Where there is smoke, there is fire

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000683334/article/headaches-not-ankle-injury-sidelining-ladarius-green

Headaches, not ankle injury, sidelining Ladarius Green

By Aditi Kinkhabwala
NFL Media reporter
Published: Aug. 11, 2016 at 01:34 p.m. Updated: Aug. 11, 2016 at 01:57 p.m.
LATROBE, Pennsylvania -- The Steelers made just one splashy -- and much-needed -- free agent signing this past offseason, tight end Ladarius Green. They have yet to see him in their offense, though, and a member of the organization, informed of the player's health, said it has nothing to do with the tight end's surgically-repaired ankle -- but is instead an issue with recurring headaches.

Green signed a four-year, $20-million contract in March, which included a $4.75 million signing bonus, but he has yet to practice one play.

His ankle surgery in January ostensibly kept him out of spring practices and minicamp and he's spent the entirety of training camp on the PUP (physically unable to perform) list. Steelers coach Mike Tomlin has maintained that Green's sustained absence from the field is not entirely unexpected, and he reiterated that Wednesday, as he readied his team for its preseason opener Friday against the Lions.

"He's progressing, but we really thought it would be touch-and-go up to this point," Tomlin said. "The (ankle) surgery was not a routine cleanup, so we knew it would be a significant amount of time."

Green's agent, Adisa Bakara, however, immediately said, "His ankle is fine," when reached Wednesday night. Bakara would not comment on what is ultimately keeping Green sidelined, and his client has reportedly been seen running sprints at St. Vincent's College, while his teammates practice.

Green, then a member of the Chargers, complained of headaches after suffering two concussions in two weeks last September, according to a report in the San Diego Union-Tribune. Those were his second and third concussions in less than one calendar year. Green sat out one game last season due to a concussion, while ankle issues sidelined him for two others. A concussion also caused Green to miss one game during the 2014 season.

Green was expected to help alleviate the hole left at tight end after the retirement of Heath Miller. It was Miller who was Ben Roethlisberger's security blanket, one of his most dependable targets -- and blockers -- for 11 seasons. Miller missed only eight games in those 11 years, and retired as the Steelers' tight end with the most all-time receiving yards, receptions and touchdowns.
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Posted this in the Steelers thread, and thought it deserved to be over here too:

Here's another take from Pro Football Talk, so take it with a grain of salt - but there are some really damning quotes from the "unnamed source" 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/08/11/ladarius-greens-recurring-headaches-raise-questions-about-his-future-contract/

Ladarius Green’s recurring headaches raise questions about his future, contract

Posted by Mike Florio on August 11, 2016, 2:33 PM EDT
Pittsburgh Steelers tight end Ladarius Green (80) pulls on a  hat during a practice at the NFL football team's training camp in Latrobe, Pa., on Saturday, July 30, 2016. (AP Photo/Gene J. Puskar)
AP
The NFL Media report, attributed to an unnamed member of the Steelers, regarding the recurring headaches suffered by tight end Ladarius Green raises questions about the player’s future, and regarding his contract.

First, rumors of Green dealing with lingering headaches have been circulating since training camp opened. The person who first mentioned the ongoing headaches to PFT suggested that Green is considering retirement. If the headaches don’t resolve, retirement remains an option.

Second, earlier today the same source told PFT that there’s new speculation that the Steelers may eventually cut Green.

Third, the Steelers could end up recovering (or at least trying to recover) Green’s $4.75 million signing bonus. If he retires, Green definitely owes the money. Even if he’s cut, however, there’s a chance the Steelers could make the same argument the Patriots advanced three years ago regarding defensive end Jonathan Fanene.

in 2013, the Patriots signed Fanene, gave him a $3.85 million signing bonus, and later cut him due to a knee injury that, as the team argued, came from a condition he had failed to disclose. If Green didn’t tell the Steelers he was still experiencing headaches at the time he was signed (and if he was indeed experiencing headaches), the Steelers could try to recover the $4.75 million.

In Fanene’s case, the grievance was settled, allowing the player to keep the $2.5 million he had received while also allowing the team to keep the $1.35 million balance.
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Just Win Baby said:
3. Green showed impressive ability at times. Yet he could not earn a bigger role despite playing for 2 head coaches and 3 offensive coordinators. The Chargers organization is not one of the better organizations in football, and I have plenty of issues with their decisions. But you have to assign a portion of the blame to the player. It's not like the coaches didn't want to win games. If they felt using Green more/differently would have helped to do that, they would have used him more/differently. Apparently, he didn't do enough in practice or in games to force them to do that.

4. Green has a potential concussion problem. He had 2 concussions within 2 weeks last year and at one point had had three concussions in 9 months.
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:coffee:

 
Ladarious did his part. Plenty of tape of him running wide open and Rivers forcing to Allen or Gates in double coverage. I remember when I was first discussing that with you I grab the tape from the game before and literally the first 5-6 offensive plays Green was open for like 2 TD's and Rivers never even looked his way. He could have been dropping passes in practice or not doing well  when going over tape with the team but he was getting open.

 
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Milkman said:
Ladarious did his part. Plenty of tape of him running wide open and Rivers forcing to Allen or Gates in double coverage. I remember when I was first discussing that with you I grab the tape from the game before and literally the first 5-6 offensive plays Green was open for like 2 TD's and Rivers never even looked his way. He could have been dropping passes in practice or not doing well  when going over tape with the team but he was getting open.
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I disagree with you now as I did then. It is ridiculous to believe he was running wide open frequently and being ignored, and Rivers and the coaches never recognized it and adjusted to throw it to him more often. They do watch game film you know. And they do try to win games.

 
Just Win Baby said:
I disagree with you now as I did then. It is ridiculous to believe he was running wide open frequently and being ignored, and Rivers and the coaches never recognized it and adjusted to throw it to him more often. They do watch game film you know. And they do try to win games.
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Saw it with my own two eyes. It's not hard for you to look into. 

 
Milkman said:
Lol yeah I wouldn't want to look either considering your stance. That means you haven't looked at all. Surprising you would be that closed minded but ok. 
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Dude, you have truly become one of the biggest trolls in this forum. Kudos.

I watched every Chargers game in Green's career. I live in San Diego and listen to Chargers sports talk radio every day. I read Chargers blogs and media coverage every day. Yet the only source that Green was running wide open frequently and not getting the ball is Milkman in the Footballguys forum, who saw it with his own two eyes. Sorry, but you are wrong. :shrug:

I'm certain you will want the last word, so have at it.

 
Just Win Baby said:
Dude, you have truly become one of the biggest trolls in this forum. Kudos.

I watched every Chargers game in Green's career. I live in San Diego and listen to Chargers sports talk radio every day. I read Chargers blogs and media coverage every day. Yet the only source that Green was running wide open frequently and not getting the ball is Milkman in the Footballguys forum, who saw it with his own two eyes. Sorry, but you are wrong. :shrug:

I'm certain you will want the last word, so have at it.
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Yeah but you haven't apparently watched the tape. Just because someone disagrees with you they're a troll. Lol got it bro. Yeah I'm trolling and making it up that I see him open on the tape all the time. 

 
ESPN Steelers reporter Jeremy Fowler believes Ladarius Green (ankle, headaches, active/PUP) could be headed to injured reserve.
That would be an odd decision considering the Steelers could just stash him on the reserve/PUP to start the season, but the overall takeaway is Green remains highly questionable for Week 1. With Green's future in doubt, Jesse James has suddenly become an interesting late-round pick in deeper leagues.

Source: ESPN






Looks like the outlaw Jesse James will have good value.

 
georg013 said:
From Green's mouth, rumors. Hope no one made a knee jerk reaction. 
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But didn't the story originate from his agent? Very odd story, this could just be Green covering up the fact that he was experiencing concussion symptoms when he signed his contract with the Steelers.

 
BroncoFreak_2K3 said:
yup
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So this designation totally sucks for fantasy purposes.  If he was put on short term IR, which basically amounts to pretty much the same thing, he could be IR'ed in most fantasy leagues.  But this designation does not allow him to be IRe'd, and thus he eats up a roster spot.  I dont recall this being an issue in the past.  Is the PUP with the 6 week minimum a new thing, or has it just never affected me before?

 
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