SproutDaddy
Footballguy
I know it's only one half of football in week one, but oof.......never understood the hype on this guy. We'll see.
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Lamar Miller, 2016, Infinity and beyond (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Evil G
- Start date
cstu
Footballguy
Todem
Footballguy
Spot on post.
But you know how it is around here.....and what the Shark Pool has sunk too. It's all about I told you so.
Miller will be fine. It's week one. He has had zero room to run anywhere as other good backs today are also seeing too.
The Kerminator
Footballguy
Please put Thomas in. I don't need negative points from my flex.
MCguidance
Footballguy
Rookie_Whisperer
Footballguy
Let's be clear, he is NOT Reggie Bush. Just because he was a preseason darling to a bunch of wannabe analysts, that is no reason to go running him up to the top of your draft boards. I hope you didn't buy into the preseason echo chamber hype machine.....
McGarnicle
Footballguy
####### ####bird
Donnybrook
Footballguy
Rotoworld commentators were reporting this off season like they went to Vegas and pushed all in on Lamar Miller.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
OLine was awful today, I posted about it in the "What did we learn" thread, check that out.
The Kerminator
Footballguy
Rotoworld still on the Miller bandwagon
msudaisy26
Footballguy
Lol, I love the fact you looked at the upsideUnless Gio Bernard takes over soon, I'm now screwed at RB. 14' #1 Pick here we come!
Rookie_Whisperer
Footballguy
LOL....those sure are some rose colored glasses they watched that game with, if anyone at that ridiculous site actually watched the game. He looked terrible!
MCguidance
Footballguy
This is one time in looking forward to the fbg recaps, to discern wtf happened.
KellysHeroes
Footballguy
Roto writers are for the most part very stuborn, they beaten his drum ALL summer long and not going to quit over the 1st game. See Ryan Mathews last yr, even when RM got hurt they still ranked him high and encourage FF players to draft him.
Why would you quit after week 1? He faced a far improved defense and D Thomas is pure garbage. You must be new at fantasy football.
Rose colored outlook will say the Browns run D is underrated. It's not like any Dolphin RB did anything. On the flip side it looks like the Dolphins OL could be a poor group in run blocking. Still too early to tell, but not a good start for Miller owners. I benched him in one league, started in another. Probably gonna bench him week 2 to see what shakes out.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
Miller was awful but lets not act like it was all him D. Thomas had 8 carries for 14 yards as well. This line is horrible
werdnoynek
Footballguy
The fools buying Thomas and those selling Miller over this week's performance will each be sorry IMO.
Lott's Fingertip
Footballguy
I went to the bar to watch the early games, so I taped this game to get a good look at several players, Miller included.
Miller did nothing wrong. Most plays he took what was there... and several times he was hit in the backfield with no chance to do anything. There was no room for him to cut or juke anybody, he was always gang tackled (so power was not really relevant)... Cleveland played good run D, and Miami created no room at all. Miami had two runs designed for Miller to come across the QB like some run option/sweep hybrid, and it looked terrible with multiple defenders all over Miller within a half step of receiving the handoff. The problem with this play is that Miller had no chance to do anything except follow the play design; half the field was cut off from the play, if that makes sense. If Miami could power block, maybe there might be the option to cut through a hole or go wide, but that wasn't happening. If Miller took the handoff from behind the QB as is normal, he could go left or right, wide or inside, follow the play or cut back. Those two runs looked bad and he lost 3 yards each time. I will say that there were two other runs where he seemed a bit hesitant, but even on those plays more decisiveness would not have helped gain any yards. Miller had one play where he got outside the tackle, juked a tackler and got 6 yards, but it was (rightfully) called back by holding.
Dan Thomas looked very ordinary. I don't think he is as bad as most on this board think, but he is very much Just A Guy. He had a couple of okay jump cuts, but does not have the explosion or speed to make anything out of them. His TD dive was pretty solid.
After watching every offensive play of the game, I am not worried about Miller's talent. The game did not show him to suck, he just did not get a chance to show anything. I am worried about Miami's Oline. Cleveland has some defensive talent, but NOTHING was there on the ground all day for Miami, and they practically abandoned the run. We'll see if they can make any adjustments against the Colts next week. If it is more of the same against a weakish Colts D, then it may be time to panic.
Miller did nothing wrong. Most plays he took what was there... and several times he was hit in the backfield with no chance to do anything. There was no room for him to cut or juke anybody, he was always gang tackled (so power was not really relevant)... Cleveland played good run D, and Miami created no room at all. Miami had two runs designed for Miller to come across the QB like some run option/sweep hybrid, and it looked terrible with multiple defenders all over Miller within a half step of receiving the handoff. The problem with this play is that Miller had no chance to do anything except follow the play design; half the field was cut off from the play, if that makes sense. If Miami could power block, maybe there might be the option to cut through a hole or go wide, but that wasn't happening. If Miller took the handoff from behind the QB as is normal, he could go left or right, wide or inside, follow the play or cut back. Those two runs looked bad and he lost 3 yards each time. I will say that there were two other runs where he seemed a bit hesitant, but even on those plays more decisiveness would not have helped gain any yards. Miller had one play where he got outside the tackle, juked a tackler and got 6 yards, but it was (rightfully) called back by holding.
Dan Thomas looked very ordinary. I don't think he is as bad as most on this board think, but he is very much Just A Guy. He had a couple of okay jump cuts, but does not have the explosion or speed to make anything out of them. His TD dive was pretty solid.
After watching every offensive play of the game, I am not worried about Miller's talent. The game did not show him to suck, he just did not get a chance to show anything. I am worried about Miami's Oline. Cleveland has some defensive talent, but NOTHING was there on the ground all day for Miami, and they practically abandoned the run. We'll see if they can make any adjustments against the Colts next week. If it is more of the same against a weakish Colts D, then it may be time to panic.
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^^^ agreed
I just re-watched every Miller carry (NFL rewind is glorious thing) and saw the same thing. There was nothing in terms of blocking for him. The one play where he had some space, he made the first guy miss and got 6 yards. Of course there was a holding penalty on the play. It was a hard game to tell if he "sucks" as he really had no chance in pretty much all his carries. Still gonna wait and see before pressing that panic button.
I just re-watched every Miller carry (NFL rewind is glorious thing) and saw the same thing. There was nothing in terms of blocking for him. The one play where he had some space, he made the first guy miss and got 6 yards. Of course there was a holding penalty on the play. It was a hard game to tell if he "sucks" as he really had no chance in pretty much all his carries. Still gonna wait and see before pressing that panic button.
Max Power
Footballguy
Shanahanigans
Footballguy
Even I didn't think the first game would go this poorly!
Even if Miller didn't look bad, it should be concerning that Thomas is getting the same amount of carries, and getting the goalline carries.
Even if Miller didn't look bad, it should be concerning that Thomas is getting the same amount of carries, and getting the goalline carries.
chad in Indy
Footballguy
i think the bigger concern is how terrible the O-line looked. I agree that this can't be put all on Miller's shoulders. Can't blame the RB when your'e getting hit before reaching the line of scrimmage. Hey, Miller may not have gotten pts. this week, but at least he ended up with positive points unlike the other derailed hype train going in NY.....Ouch!!
Thanks, Lott. After a game like that its really important to make the distinction BW the player just flat out sucking or if there were other factors at play.
I'm hiding pay on miller (what choice do I have?). But in seriously dialing down expectations based on miami's woeful o line (which we all should have seen coming and there were posters who warned of that so kudos to them) and that miller is not AP....he can't overcome a bad surrounding cast.
I'd say its safe for now to downgrade miller to an RB3/flex play and we should play the matchups with him. Until he proves that he can and should be tarted vs the stronger run defenses he should be in your bench when he faces them imo
I always suspected this would happen, but confirming it must suck for Miller owners. Goal line carries sure are nice.
jurb26
Footballguy
I've never thought a miller would be a goalie guy. I did expect more receiving ops though. That was the most disappointing part for me.
Chicago Hooligan
Footballguy
Black holes go to infinity too, right?
miami's o-line being awful was something you knew since 2012.... Reggie bush was rb2 worthy last year despite miami's line, we all hoped miller would be this year....
i know no one cares, but in my 0.5ppr league wilson and miller netted me -0.6.... so cheers to the high upside backs!
jacobo_moses
Footballguy
For this reason it still baffles me as to why MIA didn't sign Vonta Leach when they were strongly thinking about it.
Touchdown There
Footballguy
The o-line is going to get their butts chewed this week. Miami came out with a win, so morale is still high. This situation will shake out over the next few weeks.
jurb26
Footballguy
I'm pretty sure they tried to bit he picked a different team.
TheGreatSpinks
Footballguy
I was flipping channels for the early games but I know at least 5-6 of Millers carries, he was hit in the backfield or right at the line of scrimmage. He didn't have a single seam to work with all game. Cleveland's front 7 is no joke, luckily, sledding gets easier next week... That should be a better barometer. I will say I'm not sure what was worse... Miami's O line or Mike Sherman's inept play calling.
Until that stooge is out, the Dolphins won't reach their potential.
Until that stooge is out, the Dolphins won't reach their potential.
SproutDaddy
Footballguy
What do you guys think about Ingram then? Every carry he had except for one he was hit in the backfield.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
That's a tough one for me. Because Pierre Thomas looked pretty good and his YPC was much higher. So I'd say Ingram getting hit behind the line is partially his fault and partially the coaches--hear me out. When he's in the backfield, 90% of the time it's a run. Being such a narrowly used player is partially Ingram's fault, and it allows the D to just assume it's a run and swallow him up. He's not versatile.
So I wouldn't compare the two (Ingram and Miller) even if yesterday they were both getting hit behind the line. Because Miller hasn't shown that's it's a product of his (earned) predictable role in the offense, like Ingram has. I think we can realistically blame the Miami OL more than we can blame the Saints OL.
Ingram is in a bigger time share and the Saints, for being such a creative offensive team, are very obvious with their use of him. It's a good bet when Ingram is in, the Saints are going to run. He's set up for failure more than half the time and he's not exceptional talent like AD to overcome.SproutDaddy said:
timschochet
Footballguy
Unless Lamar Miller gets hurt, he's going to get 10-15 carries a game, minimum. Depending on the game situation, he's going to get more. That makes him a viable RB2/RB3 in most leagues. Of course many of us who drafted him were hoping to strike gold, and that doesn't look likely, at least for the moment. But Miller is the starting running back on an NFL football team, and therefore he's a valuable commodity in fantasy football.
The Kerminator
Footballguy
He got 10 carries last week. Wasn't anywhere close to a viable RB2/RB3 in any leagues. What is going to change? Same offensive line. Thomas is still around.
