Let's settle the debate. (1 Viewer)

[laughinboy_2000]

This is actually a debate within another thread that I thought would make for some nice discussion.

The younger Eli to me has some issues.

1. True Eli has thrown for 24 TDs in each of the last two years, but the guy also LOVES to throw INT's throwing an alarming 35! That's approacting Brett Favre territory if you ask me.

2. His numbers dropped last year, as he threw more INTS and for less yardage than 2005. True he threw less passes in 2006, but who's to say if he would have thrown more, he would have added more INTS to his total.

3. I don't care what Giant fans say, they will miss Tiki Barber. Barber was the catalyst who moved the offense down the field, not Manning. This to me says Manning may have to throw more, and that could spell trouble. Don't get me wrong, I like Jacobs, but he is a little raw for my liking.

4. The O-Line to me is bad which to me means Eli will have to rush things which is never a good thing. Their own OC Gilbride admitted he was worried about the offense this year.

I know I'm going to get ripped for posting this thread, so let me have it!

 

[laughinboy_2000]

This is actually a debate within another thread that I thought would make for some nice discussion.The younger Eli to me has some issues.1. True Eli has thrown for 24 TDs in each of the last two years, but the guy also LOVES to throw INT's throwing an alarming 35! That's approacting Brett Favre territory if you ask me.2. His numbers dropped last year, as he threw more INTS and for less yardage than 2005. True he threw less passes in 2006, but who's to say if he would have thrown more, he would have added more INTS to his total.3. I don't care what Giant fans say, they will miss Tiki Barber. Barber was the catalyst who moved the offense down the field, not Manning. This to me says Manning may have to throw more, and that could spell trouble. Don't get me wrong, I like Jacobs, but he is a little raw for my liking.4. The O-Line to me is bad which to me means Eli will have to rush things which is never a good thing. Their own OC Gilbride admitted he was worried about the offense this year.I know I'm going to get ripped for posting this thread, so let me have it!

Almost forgot one somebody else mentioned.5. No Pro Bowl Appearances.

 

[Sea Bass]

NO

 

[Routilla]

NO

 

[laughinboy_2000]

My top 10 in no particular order:

Peyton

Bulgar

Brees

Palmer

McNabb

Brady

Hassleback

Vince Young

Tony Romo

Brett Favre

 

[Da Guru]

I would not be suprised to see Eli crack the top 10.

 

[Gr00vus]

In fantasy football: maybe.

In real life: not close.

 

[nygiants56]

This is actually a debate within another thread that I thought would make for some nice discussion.

The younger Eli to me has some issues.

1. True Eli has thrown for 24 TDs in each of the last two years, but the guy also LOVES to throw INT's throwing an alarming 35! That's approacting Brett Favre territory if you ask me.

2. His numbers dropped last year, as he threw more INTS and for less yardage than 2005. True he threw less passes in 2006, but who's to say if he would have thrown more, he would have added more INTS to his total.

3. I don't care what Giant fans say, they will miss Tiki Barber. Barber was the catalyst who moved the offense down the field, not Manning. This to me says Manning may have to throw more, and that could spell trouble. Don't get me wrong, I like Jacobs, but he is a little raw for my liking.

4. The O-Line to me is bad which to me means Eli will have to rush things which is never a good thing. Their own OC Gilbride admitted he was worried about the offense this year.

I know I'm going to get ripped for posting this thread, so let me have it!

that says it all, really. Kevin Gilbride, a guy who's coached for more teams anyone I can remember, says he's now worried about the offense.I'm worried about the offense BECAUSE of Kevin Gilbride.to answer the question, No, I don't consider Eli a top 10 QB, I probably wouldn't rank him as a top 20 guy either..

the Giants defense is shot, the O-line is in shambles, there is instability at the RB position, Shockey is once again hurt, and Eli won't be able to handle the jeers and boos from the NY-area crowd once he starts tacking on INT's; they'll turn on him in a NY-minute..

its probably a make or break year for him, ya know..Couch got a few years before they drove him out of Cleveland, same with Leaf in SD, Carr in Houston, Akili Smith in Cincy, Heath Shuler in DC, Harrington in Detroit, etc..

That bothers me as a Giants fan. We're married to this clown longer than we would be, had they not traded away Rivers and those draft picks for him. And, we wouldn't hold onto him for so long, if his last name wasn't `Manning`...

He needs to produce this season, it's put up or shut up time..

 

[V1LL]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

 

[PatytonsGhost]

This is actually a debate within another thread that I thought would make for some nice discussion.

The younger Eli to me has some issues.

1. True Eli has thrown for 24 TDs in each of the last two years, but the guy also LOVES to throw INT's throwing an alarming 35! That's approacting Brett Favre territory if you ask me.

2. His numbers dropped last year, as he threw more INTS and for less yardage than 2005. True he threw less passes in 2006, but who's to say if he would have thrown more, he would have added more INTS to his total.

3. I don't care what Giant fans say, they will miss Tiki Barber. Barber was the catalyst who moved the offense down the field, not Manning. This to me says Manning may have to throw more, and that could spell trouble. Don't get me wrong, I like Jacobs, but he is a little raw for my liking.

4. The O-Line to me is bad which to me means Eli will have to rush things which is never a good thing. Their own OC Gilbride admitted he was worried about the offense this year.

I know I'm going to get ripped for posting this thread, so let me have it!

that says it all, really. Kevin Gilbride, a guy who's coached for more teams anyone I can remember, says he's now worried about the offense.I'm worried about the offense BECAUSE of Kevin Gilbride.to answer the question, No, I don't consider Eli a top 10 QB, I probably wouldn't rank him as a top 20 guy either..

the Giants defense is shot, the O-line is in shambles, there is instability at the RB position, Shockey is once again hurt, and Eli won't be able to handle the jeers and boos from the NY-area crowd once he starts tacking on INT's; they'll turn on him in a NY-minute..

its probably a make or break year for him, ya know..Couch got a few years before they drove him out of Cleveland, same with Leaf in SD, Carr in Houston, Akili Smith in Cincy, Heath Shuler in DC, Harrington in Detroit, etc..

That bothers me as a Giants fan. We're married to this clown longer than we would be, had they not traded away Rivers and those draft picks for him. And, we wouldn't hold onto him for so long, if his last name wasn't `Manning`...

He needs to produce this season, it's put up or shut up time..

The comparisons you draw to Couch,Leaf,Carr Smith ....etch are unfair. I am in no way an Eli fan but give the guy a break he is miles better than any of those QB's. Eli is going to be a top QB one day. I cannot say he will be top #10 this year for sure but he will be in the near future. Eli actually has better numbers than Peyton his first two years. I think its fair to compare their numbers because they play the same position, they are Brothers, and they pretty much got the starting QB role from the beginning. As Starters

Peyton first 2 years 52TD 43Int

Eli first 2 years 48TD 35Int

Whats the difference?

Yes I am saying Eli could be as good as Peyton

 

[Gr00vus]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.Off the top of my head he is better than these players:Jason CampbellT. JacksonJoey BallgameBrodie Croylethat puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

 

[patriarchz]

We're not gonna settle this debate, only Eli can. And I bet he'll settle it by finishing about 13th or so.

Let's face it, NYG is a bad team this year, and Eli can't seem to keep his head on straight.

 

[Gr00vus]

I was just thinking Eli could probably benefit from a change of scenery. He doesn't strike me as a guy who is going to thrive in NY.

Too bad his daddy gave him such bad advice - he could have been on a contender in a low pressure environment right now otherwise.

 

[PatytonsGhost]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.Off the top of my head he is better than these players:Jason CampbellT. JacksonJoey BallgameBrodie Croylethat puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

 

[Blackjacks]

I have absolutely no doubt that Eli will be in the top 10 this year for fantasy purposes as long as he doesn't get injuried. I do think the G-Men are going to be awful this year but I see Eli with about 3700 yards and 28 td's this year. I do however think he'll probably end up with atleast 16 int's if not more but my leagues don't count that against you so i don't care. People in NY are hilarious, almost every other team in the league would love to have this guy under center. He has alot of weapons on his side this year and I think they're gonna be playing from behind alot. I wouldn't be surprised to see him jump into the top 5 actually.

 

[Blackjacks]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

Who would you put on that list above Eli?

 

[tomarken]

Eli actually has better numbers than Peyton his first two years. I think its fair to compare their numbers because they play the same position, they are Brothers, and they pretty much got the starting QB role from the beginning. As StartersPeyton first 2 years 52TD 43IntEli first 2 years 48TD 35IntWhats the difference?Yes I am saying Eli could be as good as Peyton

You've conveniently left out Eli's first 8 games. If you leave out Peyton's first 8 games also, he has 59 TD's and 36 INT's. And Peyton's #'s otherwise were better.

ELI MANNINGCareer Games	Pass Yd		TD	INT	Cmp %	YPA1-8		1043		6	9	48.2	5.39-16		1809		14	5	51.4	7.017-24		1949		10	12	53.8	6.525-32		1851		15	9	61.3	7.133-40		1393		9	9	54.2	5.3PEYTON MANNINGCareer Games	Pass Yd		TD	INT	Cmp %	YPA1-8		1873		11	16	55.1	6.49-16		1866		15	12	64.0	6.617-24		2557		15	9	60.2	9.325-32		1584		11	6	64.3	6.133-40		2438		18	9	65.4	8.7

 

[TheAristocrat]

I would not be suprised to see Eli crack the top 10.

I'm certainly not putting him in the Top-10 until he proves it though. Having him on my team last year was painful. I watched a number of his games (Thanks NFL ticket) and never saw the leadership or competitiveness that I wanted to see.But I drafted him too early last year, and am probably just bitter. Also questioning the work ethic of those around him.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Eli Manning ranked 31st out of the 42 QBs in adjusted FPs per adjusted Game last season, among the 42 QBs to play in 3 full games or more.

 

[Chase Stuart]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

Who would you put on that list above Eli?

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

 

[laughinboy_2000]

I have absolutely no doubt that Eli will be in the top 10 this year for fantasy purposes as long as he doesn't get injuried. I do think the G-Men are going to be awful this year but I see Eli with about 3700 yards and 28 td's this year. I do however think he'll probably end up with atleast 16 td's if not more but my leagues don't count that against you so i don't care. People in NY are hilarious, almost every other team in the league would love to have this guy under center. He has alot of weapons on his side this year and I think they're gonna be playing from behind alot. I wouldn't be surprised to see him jump into the top 5 actually.

Since when has 16 TDs in a season EVER gotten anybody a Top 10 finish?

 

[Jon_Moore]

It may depend on your scoring system. I had a few leagues where he finished as #10 last year, and one where he finished #8 so to say he can't be top 10 is almost asinine.

He'll be forced to pass more this season, could lead to more turnovers, or he could put it together and figure out the nfl. pre-season wise it's a matter of whether or not you think he becomes a very good-great quarterback or stays where he's at now.

At the moment, I'd draft:

Peyton

Palmer

Brady

Brees

Bulger

Mcnabb

Romo

Kitna

Rivers

ahead of him, and Rivers might not prove to be better than Eli. But, around 10, I don't think he's a bad pick.

 

[Blackjacks]

I have absolutely no doubt that Eli will be in the top 10 this year for fantasy purposes as long as he doesn't get injuried. I do think the G-Men are going to be awful this year but I see Eli with about 3700 yards and 28 td's this year. I do however think he'll probably end up with atleast 16 td's if not more but my leagues don't count that against you so i don't care. People in NY are hilarious, almost every other team in the league would love to have this guy under center. He has alot of weapons on his side this year and I think they're gonna be playing from behind alot. I wouldn't be surprised to see him jump into the top 5 actually.

Since when has 16 TDs in a season EVER gotten anybody a Top 10 finish?

that was suppose to be int's.....sorry

 

[PatytonsGhost]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

Who would you put on that list above Eli?

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

FWIW i see Eli focus on cutting his INT problems this year resulting in a top 10 or round there ranking, just my OpinionIn order these are my tentative #10 QB rankings as of now

1Manning

2Palmer

3Brees

4Brady

5Bulger

6McNabb

7Rivers

8Romo

9Cutler

10Manning.E

11Losman

 

[Blackjacks]

I would not be suprised to see Eli crack the top 10.

I'm certainly not putting him in the Top-10 until he proves it though. Having him on my team last year was painful. I watched a number of his games (Thanks NFL ticket) and never saw the leadership or competitiveness that I wanted to see.But I drafted him too early last year, and am probably just bitter. Also questioning the work ethic of those around him.

He was #11 last year while being horrible down the stretch without his #2 wideout and he was #4 the year before that in his first season as a starter. What are talking about when you say until he proves it?

 

[Blackjacks]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

Who would you put on that list above Eli?

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

FWIW i see Eli focus on cutting his INT problems this year resulting in a top 10 or round there ranking, just my OpinionIn order these are my tentative #10 QB rankings as of now

1Manning

2Palmer

3Brees

4Brady

5Bulger

6McNabb

7Rivers

8Romo

9Cutler

10Manning.E

11Grossman

I think that is a very good list

 

[PatytonsGhost]

I have absolutely no doubt that Eli will be in the top 10 this year for fantasy purposes as long as he doesn't get injuried. I do think the G-Men are going to be awful this year but I see Eli with about 3700 yards and 28 td's this year. I do however think he'll probably end up with atleast 16 td's if not more but my leagues don't count that against you so i don't care. People in NY are hilarious, almost every other team in the league would love to have this guy under center. He has alot of weapons on his side this year and I think they're gonna be playing from behind alot. I wouldn't be surprised to see him jump into the top 5 actually.

Since when has 16 TDs in a season EVER gotten anybody a Top 10 finish?

that was suppose to be int's.....sorry

Kitna ? 22ints oops got it

 

[-OZ-]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

Who would you put on that list above Eli?

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

FWIW i see Eli focus on cutting his INT problems this year resulting in a top 10 or round there ranking, just my OpinionIn order these are my tentative #10 QB rankings as of now

1Manning

2Palmer

3Brees

4Brady

5Bulger

6McNabb

7Rivers

8Romo

9Cutler

10Manning.E

11Grossman

I think that is a very good list

I think it's a horrible list after the top 6. Kitna below Grossman?

I'd put Campbell above Eli. I can agree with the rest on the original list.

 

[PatytonsGhost]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

Who would you put on that list above Eli?

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

FWIW i see Eli focus on cutting his INT problems this year resulting in a top 10 or round there ranking, just my OpinionIn order these are my tentative #10 QB rankings as of now

1Manning

2Palmer

3Brees

4Brady

5Bulger

6McNabb

7Rivers

8Romo

9Cutler

10Manning.E

11Grossman

I think that is a very good list

I think it's a horrible list after the top 6. Kitna below Grossman?

I'd put Campbell above Eli. I can agree with the rest on the original list.

Tell me what u really think It is tentative but i have Kitna at 12.

 

[kensat30]

If Steve Smith plays well, Eli can most definitely be a top10 QB. The guy had Amani freaking Toomer at WR#2 last year, and that was only for 8 games until Toomer got hurt. Eli is one good player away from being a QB1 tier player IMO.

 

[Construction Man Jim]

that says it all, really. Kevin Gilbride, a guy who's coached for more teams anyone I can remember, says he's now worried about the offense.I'm worried about the offense BECAUSE of Kevin Gilbride.

to answer the question, No, I don't consider Eli a top 10 QB, I probably wouldn't rank him as a top 20 guy either..

the Giants defense is shot, the O-line is in shambles, there is instability at the RB position, Shockey is once again hurt, and Eli won't be able to handle the jeers and boos from the NY-area crowd once he starts tacking on INT's; they'll turn on him in a NY-minute..

its probably a make or break year for him, ya know..Couch got a few years before they drove him out of Cleveland, same with Leaf in SD, Carr in Houston, Akili Smith in Cincy, Heath Shuler in DC, Harrington in Detroit, etc..

That bothers me as a Giants fan. We're married to this clown longer than we would be, had they not traded away Rivers and those draft picks for him. And, we wouldn't hold onto him for so long, if his last name wasn't `Manning`...

He needs to produce this season, it's put up or shut up time..

You're a Giants fan? You don't know much about the team. How is the o-line in "shambles"? There's no instability at RB. Jacobs is the guy. Sit back and enjoy the ride. Sure Shockey is always hurt, but he still plays and produces (at a rate that ranks him among the best TEs in history, I might add).

And to mention Eli in the context of those other QBs further exposes your ignorance:

Ryan Leaf - Career stats through 3 seasons - 26 games, 317 comp, 655 att, 48.3%, 3666 yds, 5.6 Y/A, 14 TD, 36 INT

David Carr - Stats through 3 seasons - 44 games, 685 comp, 1,205 att, 56.8%, 8,136 yds, 6.73 Y/A, 34 TD, 42 INT

Akili Smith - Stats through 3 seasons - 20 games, 203 comp, 428 att, 47.4%, 2,095 yds, 4.89 Y/A, 5 TD, 12 INT

Heath Shuler - Career stats through 4 seasons - 29 games, 292 comp, 593 att, 49.2%, 3,691 yds, 6.2 Y/A, 15 TD, 33 INT

Joey Harrington - Stats through 3 seasons - 46 games, 798 com, 1,472 att, 54.2%, 8,221 yds 5.58 Y/A, 48 TD, 50 INT



Eli Manning - Stats through 3 seasons - 39 games, 690 comp, 1276 att, 54.1%, 8,049 yds, 6.3 Y/A, 54 TD, 44 INT

That said, I don't love Eli as a fantasy QB this year. I actually think the Giants may ask him to throw less. I see him as a QB2 with upside (the 30 TD potential is still there).

I'll let my previous comments speak for themselves on the other thread.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=330996

 

[Construction Man Jim]

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

He doesn't need to improve significantly. In fantasy terms, he just needs to cut down on the INTs and get the yards up to his 2005 level. Having more than one WR at his disposal should help. His schedule is also significantly easier compared to the killer schedule the Giants had last year.And since when is being "on the field a lot" a bad thing?

 

[Chase Stuart]

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.

There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

He doesn't need to improve significantly. In fantasy terms, he just needs to cut down on the INTs and get the yards up to his 2005 level. Having more than one WR at his disposal should help. His schedule is also significantly easier compared to the killer schedule the Giants had last year.And since when is being "on the field a lot" a bad thing?

He does need to improve a lot, since he ranked 31st.Cutting down on INTs is a start, but that's not the biggest problem. He's averaged 6.2 Y/A, which isn't very good. He also provides nothing on the ground.

Being on the field a lot isn't a bad thing. It's a good thing for your QB. But when analyzing Manning's past play, the fact that he took every snap for the Giants is noteworthy. Sure, he scored more FPs than McNabb, but that doesn't make him a better fantasy QB. The Giants Team QB last year ranked 19th, and they had an easier than average schedule. Not sure where you got the killer schedule part from, but the Giants fantasy QB had an easier than average schedule for scoring fantasy points.

 

[Construction Man Jim]

He does need to improve a lot, since he ranked 31st.

Cutting down on INTs is a start, but that's not the biggest problem. He's averaged 6.2 Y/A, which isn't very good. He also provides nothing on the ground.

Being on the field a lot isn't a bad thing. It's a good thing for your QB. But when analyzing Manning's past play, the fact that he took every snap for the Giants is noteworthy. Sure, he scored more FPs than McNabb, but that doesn't make him a better fantasy QB. The Giants Team QB last year ranked 19th, and they had an easier than average schedule. Not sure where you got the killer schedule part from, but the Giants fantasy QB had an easier than average schedule for scoring fantasy points.

He provides nothing on the ground LOL.

 

[laughinboy_2000]

You're a Giants fan? You don't know much about the team.

How is the o-line in "shambles"? There's no instability at RB. Jacobs is the guy. Sit back and enjoy the ride. Sure Shockey is always hurt, but he still plays and produces (at a rate that ranks him among the best TEs in history, I might add).

And to mention Eli in the context of those other QBs further exposes your ignorance:

Ryan Leaf - Career stats through 3 seasons - 26 games, 317 comp, 655 att, 48.3%, 3666 yds, 5.6 Y/A, 14 TD, 36 INT

David Carr - Stats through 3 seasons - 44 games, 685 comp, 1,205 att, 56.8%, 8,136 yds, 6.73 Y/A, 34 TD, 42 INT

Akili Smith - Stats through 3 seasons - 20 games, 203 comp, 428 att, 47.4%, 2,095 yds, 4.89 Y/A, 5 TD, 12 INT

Heath Shuler - Career stats through 4 seasons - 29 games, 292 comp, 593 att, 49.2%, 3,691 yds, 6.2 Y/A, 15 TD, 33 INT

Joey Harrington - Stats through 3 seasons - 46 games, 798 com, 1,472 att, 54.2%, 8,221 yds 5.58 Y/A, 48 TD, 50 INT



Eli Manning - Stats through 3 seasons - 39 games, 690 comp, 1276 att, 54.1%, 8,049 yds, 6.3 Y/A, 54 TD, 44 INT

That said, I don't love Eli as a fantasy QB this year. I actually think the Giants may ask him to throw less. I see him as a QB2 with upside (the 30 TD potential is still there).

I'll let my previous comments speak for themselves on the other thread.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=330996

This post makes no sense. "How is the OLine in shambles?" You lost the best lineman you had in Luke Petitgout via free agency, which downgrades the line immediately. There is no way he throws for 30 TDs this year? He does not have enough talent around him to do that. And there is no such thing as a "QB2" throwing for 30 TDs?

 

[Construction Man Jim]

This post makes no sense. "How is the OLine in shambles?" You lost the best lineman you had in Luke Petitgout via free agency, which downgrades the line immediately. There is no way he throws for 30 TDs this year? He does not have enough talent around him to do that. And there is no such thing as a "QB2" throwing for 30 TDs?

The Giants best o-lineman is Chris Snee. Luke wasn't lost "via free agency". He was cut. He's already missing practices with the Bucs due to injury.Diehl - Seubert - O'Hara - Snee - McKenzie. That's the same starting 5 that closed out last season. The right side has been intact the past two seasons. Diehl has started every game since entering the league 4 years ago. Seubert was a starter back in 2003 before breaking his leg and is now back to 100%. The Giants front office and coaching staff were confident enough that this group could protect their franchise QB that they chose to get rid of the injury prone Petigout.

I'm not saying Eli will throw 30 TDs. I'm saying he has the potential to do so. He has plenty of talent around him:

RB - Jacobs (he will be a weapon in the passing game and his presence will create play action opportunities for Eli), Droughns, Bradshaw

TE - Shockey, Boss (who is another great red zone target and has been catching everything in sight at training camp)

WR - Plax, Toomer, Moss, Smith (that's three more quality options right there than Eli had for the second half of last season)

Where was Drew Brees rated heading into last season? Or Tony Romo? Is there such thing as a 7th round draft pick rookie WR becoming a fantasy WR1/2 (Colston)? Guys outperform expectations all the time.

 

[BGP]

Is Eli Manning a top 10 QB?

There are 32 NFL teams.
Roughly 10 of these don't have a clear starter.So what we are really asking is if Eli is a top 10 out of about 22 starting QBs. If things break the right way, I think almost any of those 22 could crack the top 10. So I don't really know what meaning the question has.

 

[kevjones22]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

Who would you put on that list above Eli?

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

FWIW i see Eli focus on cutting his INT problems this year resulting in a top 10 or round there ranking, just my OpinionIn order these are my tentative #10 QB rankings as of now

1Manning

2Palmer

3Brees

4Brady

5Bulger

6McNabb

7Rivers

8Romo

9Cutler

10Manning.E

11Losman

Don't forget Hasselbeck, hes easily in the top 10!

 

[PatytonsGhost]

he might not be top 20. There is NO WAY he is top 10.

Off the top of my head he is better than these players:

Jason Campbell

T. Jackson

Joey Ballgame

Brodie Croyle

that puts him about 25th as far as I can tell.

I'd add Trent Green, Brad Pennington, Chuck Frye, Jeff Garcia, Rex Grossman, Steve McNair and Matt Schaub to that list at least. Probably Alex Smith and Lefty too.

Can I be in your fantasy leagues?

Who would you put on that list above Eli?

Grossman, Frye, Pennington and McNair all averaged more FP/G last season then Manning, when adjusted for SOS and adjusting for partial games. Garcia was obviously way higher too, but he's on a different team now. Manning isn't a very good fantasy player when he's on the field: he's just on the field a lot, so that makes him look like a decent enough player.There have been many better QBs the past two seasons. Unless Manning improves his play significantly, I doubt he'll be helping anyone win a championship this year.

FWIW i see Eli focus on cutting his INT problems this year resulting in a top 10 or round there ranking, just my OpinionIn order these are my tentative #10 QB rankings as of now

1Manning

2Palmer

3Brees

4Brady

5Bulger

6McNabb

7Rivers

8Romo

9Cutler

10Manning.E

11Losman

Don't forget Hasselbeck, hes easily in the top 10!

Your rite, but I have never been a Hasselback fan and now especially coming off his worst year statistically coinciding with injuries and age have me thinking he finishes out of top 10

 

[Jon_Moore]

I definitely don't see Hasselback as a lock for the top 10. Bad year last year, lost his top receiver, Alexander has question marks as well, the whole offense may take a step back.

 

[Truman]

My top 10 in no particular order:Vince YoungTony RomoBrett Favre

WTF? Favre? He's not even close to top 20. He puts up a few yards and TDs because he throws more than everyone else. Where he really crushes the competition though, is in INTs, with 47 the last two years. I'd rather have JP Losman.