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Matt Flynn about to be traded (1 Viewer)

Palmer did put up QB2ish numbers even if most of it was garbage time; Flynn should have a floor of 4000 / 25TDs
That floor is crazy high....... You could be as well
Palmer had over 4000 and 22 last yr / in 2011 he had over 2300 and 11 in half a season; so Palmer's previous stats should be the floor for the better QB, not that crazy. Seriously, lossing DHB and Myers is going to prevent that?
1- It's not a given that Flynn is the better QB.

2- I don't think you understand the concept of what a "floor" means.
:goodposting:

 
Palmer did put up QB2ish numbers even if most of it was garbage time; Flynn should have a floor of 4000 / 25TDs
That floor is crazy high....... You could be as well
Palmer had over 4000 and 22 last yr / in 2011 he had over 2300 and 11 in half a season; so Palmer's previous stats should be the floor for the better QB, not that crazy. Seriously, lossing DHB and Myers is going to prevent that?
If that is the floor, what is the ceiling?

 
I think Flynn's floor could be very low. His ceiling is probably decently high as well. There is a lot of risk with Flynn because he just has not played enough to make a good projection. As a Packer fan I remember watching him in preseason his first couple of years and I thought he looked like a weak armed project that I had very little confidence in. He then got a couple of spot duty regular season action games and played very well. It was my understanding that he played OK during preseason last year but Wilson just looked to be better. If I had to tag a value on him right now it would probably be a QB18-QB24 due to the uncertainty.

 
In 23 starters (excluding the Panthers game where he was injured) with the Raiders, Palmer threw 869 passes. If Flynn averages 37.8 pass attempts per game and doesn't miss a snap, that's 605 passes. If Flynn has 605 passes, 4000 yards won't be a tough barrier to crack. Of course, those are two big assumptions, which is why they shouldn't be a floor.

 
Even though its April Fools, this story is legit.

Jay Glazer‏@JayGlazer2hOAK has traded 2 picks to Seattle for Matt Flynn, will sign papers on it this AM & now trying to finalize Carson Palmer to AZ for late pick

Jay Glazer‏@JayGlazer2h"@BMu_1963: @JayGlazer April fools?" > no, it's not an April fools joke

Jay Glazer‏@JayGlazer2hAgain, w Flynn trade getting signed today Oak now working to finalize a trade to send Carson Palmer to Cardinals

Adam Schefter‏@AdamSchefter2hPicks in Flynn-to-OAK deal are a pick in 2014 and a conditional pick in 2015.

Adam Schefter‏@AdamSchefter1hOnce Matt Flynn trade completed, Seattle will consider signing Matt Leinart as its No. 2 QB. @mortreport also says Tyler Thigpen in play.

 
Trade terms in. Believed to be a 2014 5th round pick and conditional pick in 2015.
That's cheap considering Seattle has already paid the $6M signing bonus and his salaries are $5.25M and $6.25M. For comparison, Seattle paid him $8M for one year. No guaranteed money after this year either.

 
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Trade terms in. Believed to be a 2014 5th round pick and conditional pick in 2015.
Wow, the Raiders actually made a good trade. Another 10 moves like this and they might be able to take the tarps off the stadium.

Flynn may or may not be a huge upgrade over Palmer, but he's definitely an upgrade, and at a good cost.

 
So if Raiders get anything for Palmer essentially they swap out Palmer for Flynn at half the price and just about no draft picks given up? Good deal imo
Yeah, it's not a bad move at all for the Raiders. Not so sure about Seattle, however, the PC/JS combo has been right a lot more than wrong and I've learned to take a "wait and see" attitude with moves I am questioning. I think they gave him away for too little, but then again it opens up some cap money. What they do with it is something that will need to be weighed against the cheap price the Raiders got. If Flynn works out then it'll be about the best move the Raiders made in a long time. Seattle has done some good work with late round picks and need to start re-signing their own drafted studs in the next few years. Flynn was a nice luxury to have as backup, gotta see who they pick up because as of now, Wilson is the only QB on the roster.

What I don't get is all the Trojans talk that gets thrown around whenever Carroll is involved with needing players at a position. This time it was Palmer and Leinart having their names thrown around to replace Flynn. He's shown zero loyalty to SC guys. He passed on Mays in the draft, traded away Lawrence Jackson, gave Lofa a paycut-or-else ultimatum, cut Mike Williams before preseason even though BMW earned his way onto the team, cut Lendale White very quickly as well. It amazes me when people still bring up the USC connection, if anything he's averse to having Trojans on the roster.

eta: also, getting a nearly washed up, immobile Palmer to AZ should also be viewed as a gain for Seattle in the trade. He's gonna die by week 4 if their OL is anything like it was last year.

 
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I think Flynn's floor could be very low. His ceiling is probably decently high as well. There is a lot of risk with Flynn because he just has not played enough to make a good projection. As a Packer fan I remember watching him in preseason his first couple of years and I thought he looked like a weak armed project that I had very little confidence in. He then got a couple of spot duty regular season action games and played very well. It was my understanding that he played OK during preseason last year but Wilson just looked to be better. If I had to tag a value on him right now it would probably be a QB18-QB24 due to the uncertainty.
FWIW, Rich Gannon said pretty much the exact same thing but then went on to say that as time went by, he definitely saw the improvement and, last year, when Flynn signed with Seattle, that he was pretty excited about that signing. So, it sounds like that Gannon likes the potential there.

I know people are kind of split on the idea of Flynn and a lot of people site that he didn't "even beat out a rookie" but a couple of things about that are A)people tend to forget that flynn (at least reportedly) had an elbow issue that ultimately kept him from completely competing for the job. Up until the Elbow issue was reported, the pre-season games and the reporting weren't highly skewed to one guy or the other and B) the chapters aren't written for Wilson. We may look back in ten years and Wilson might be a Brees, Rodgers, or Eli and at that time we might all say "Yeah, both were good..just happened that a pretty good QB got stuck behind a great QB."

Flynn hasn't played a lot for people to be able to pour over a lot of footage and make informed opinions but what I personally give the benefit of the doubt to is, regardless of all the "yeah buts" on Flynn, he is a guy that was taught how to play the position in one of the best places for a QB to learn in the NFL, executives in Seattle that had familiarity with him in GB thought enough of him to bring him there last year, and in seeing him play in two games in the NFL, he hasnt' made himself look bad. I know that's not a world of data but it is just as good or better than a ton of these rookies we all laud before they ever take a snap and some of them are great and some of them flop. I will at least give beneft of the doubt here until proven otherwise.

 
I think Flynn's floor could be very low. His ceiling is probably decently high as well. There is a lot of risk with Flynn because he just has not played enough to make a good projection. As a Packer fan I remember watching him in preseason his first couple of years and I thought he looked like a weak armed project that I had very little confidence in. He then got a couple of spot duty regular season action games and played very well. It was my understanding that he played OK during preseason last year but Wilson just looked to be better. If I had to tag a value on him right now it would probably be a QB18-QB24 due to the uncertainty.
FWIW, Rich Gannon said pretty much the exact same thing but then went on to say that as time went by, he definitely saw the improvement and, last year, when Flynn signed with Seattle, that he was pretty excited about that signing. So, it sounds like that Gannon likes the potential there.

I know people are kind of split on the idea of Flynn and a lot of people site that he didn't "even beat out a rookie" but a couple of things about that are A)people tend to forget that flynn (at least reportedly) had an elbow issue that ultimately kept him from completely competing for the job. Up until the Elbow issue was reported, the pre-season games and the reporting weren't highly skewed to one guy or the other and B) the chapters aren't written for Wilson. We may look back in ten years and Wilson might be a Brees, Rodgers, or Eli and at that time we might all say "Yeah, both were good..just happened that a pretty good QB got stuck behind a great QB."

Flynn hasn't played a lot for people to be able to pour over a lot of footage and make informed opinions but what I personally give the benefit of the doubt to is, regardless of all the "yeah buts" on Flynn, he is a guy that was taught how to play the position in one of the best places for a QB to learn in the NFL, executives in Seattle that had familiarity with him in GB thought enough of him to bring him there last year, and in seeing him play in two games in the NFL, he hasnt' made himself look bad. I know that's not a world of data but it is just as good or better than a ton of these rookies we all laud before they ever take a snap and some of them are great and some of them flop. I will at least give beneft of the doubt here until proven otherwise.
I think there is something to this. Seattle's GM is John Schneider. He came from the Packers and knew Flynn well when they signed him to that deal. Now, Reggie Mckenzie, also formerly of the Packers trades for Flynn. While there isn't much game tape to review on Flynn out there, Schneider and McKenzie both were in the GB front office while Flynn was there. They knew Flynn better than just about anyone.

 
Flynn is average to below average.
What did you think about him before the Seahawks got rid of him?
There is an entire Russell Wilson Thread I created after the draft where I tell you what I think.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=640432
And a bunch of other threads where you claimed he was top-10. You're just a lonely internet hero and pretty much garbage imo.

 
Flynn is average to below average.
What did you think about him before the Seahawks got rid of him?
There is an entire Russell Wilson Thread I created after the draft where I tell you what I think.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=640432
Does it explain how he went from QB7 to average/below average? Cuz Wilson has nothing to do with that. Unless you think QBs8-32 were all below average.

 
ImTheScientist said:
Flynn is average to below average.
Yeah, he'd have to be because Russell Wilson is barely average on a good day and Flynn couldn't beat him out forthe starting spot in Seattle.

 
Does anyone think ITS will answer for the crap he talks?
What does that mean? Answer for what? To whom? Why would you ever expect an anonymous message board poster to ever expect to be held accountable for anything?
Thats my point...is he going to ever own up to claiming a guy was Dynasty 7 (prior to Wilson coming on...and only because he is a Seattle Homer with no objectivity)...and now claiming he is average or below average.

And I think plenty here own up to when they are wrong. ITS won't...and I think its funny that people are going to keep thinking he may some day.

 
Does anyone think ITS will answer for the crap he talks?
What does that mean? Answer for what? To whom? Why would you ever expect an anonymous message board poster to ever expect to be held accountable for anything?
Things I've learned...

1) Im The Scientist is always wrong.

2) Im the Scientist = Hooper31
For ####s sake. Seriously? I take the guy to task all the time for being a doosh.

 
Does anyone think ITS will answer for the crap he talks?
What does that mean? Answer for what? To whom? Why would you ever expect an anonymous message board poster to ever expect to be held accountable for anything?
Things I've learned...

1) Im The Scientist is always wrong.

2) Im the Scientist = Hooper31
For ####s sake. Seriously? I take the guy to task all the time for being a doosh.
But you side with him now. Less then a year ago he thought Flynn was worthy of a 7th overall QB selection in fantasy circles. Now he says he is not worth much now? After not even losing a spot because he sucks, just because someone was way better. 3rd round selection better.

sounds like he put himself in a box, yet you defend it?

 
But you side with him now. Less then a year ago he thought Flynn was worthy of a 7th overall QB selection in fantasy circles. Now he says he is not worth much now? After not even losing a spot because he sucks, just because someone was way better. 3rd round selection better. sounds like he put himself in a box, yet you defend it?
Side with him? WTF? I think you guys are all high. The only thing that is more dooshy than ITS is you guys thinking that if you rag on him about anything he will somehow see the light and change his tune. I call him out all the time because he's a Seattle fan, and I don't like him making other Seatte fans look bad. I think the board would be a lot better if fans would take the time to police their own.
 
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But you side with him now. Less then a year ago he thought Flynn was worthy of a 7th overall QB selection in fantasy circles. Now he says he is not worth much now? After not even losing a spot because he sucks, just because someone was way better. 3rd round selection better. sounds like he put himself in a box, yet you defend it?
Side with him? WTF? I think you guys are all high. The only thing that is more dooshy than ITS is you guys thinking that if you rag on him about anything he will somehow see the light and change his tune. I call him out all the time because he's a Seattle fan, and I don't like him making other Seatte fans look bad. I think the board would be a lot better if fans would take the time to police their own.
I am glad you are taking this responsibility. I hope after he goes through your 12 step program that we start seeing some positive progress. Good luck!

 
Raiders for a 5th.
Im going to bet this is 100% wrong.
Raiders fleeced the Seahawks
Perhaps. With the cap space being able to be rolled over into next year, the Seahawks have a lot of draftees that will need to be re-signed, so it goes beyond just getting two draft picks for him. Plus the Raiders gave him more guaranteed money and a bigger cap hit, so their side of the deal got a tad less sweet. Overall though, it looks like the Raiders got a great deal. If JS uses the money saved wisely, which there is an awful lot of precedent that he will, then it's win-win for both teams.

I do feel sorry though for all the people that bought Flynn jerseys.

 
But you side with him now. Less then a year ago he thought Flynn was worthy of a 7th overall QB selection in fantasy circles. Now he says he is not worth much now? After not even losing a spot because he sucks, just because someone was way better. 3rd round selection better. sounds like he put himself in a box, yet you defend it?
Side with him? WTF? I think you guys are all high. The only thing that is more dooshy than ITS is you guys thinking that if you rag on him about anything he will somehow see the light and change his tune. I call him out all the time because he's a Seattle fan, and I don't like him making other Seatte fans look bad. I think the board would be a lot better if fans would take the time to police their own.
I am glad you are taking this responsibility. I hope after he goes through your 12 step program that we start seeing some positive progress. Good luck!
Poor choice of words on my part. I think there's a greater chance of him changing his habits if he's getting called out by Seattle fans as opposed to other fans. If you disagree, no sweat.
 
But you side with him now. Less then a year ago he thought Flynn was worthy of a 7th overall QB selection in fantasy circles. Now he says he is not worth much now? After not even losing a spot because he sucks, just because someone was way better. 3rd round selection better. sounds like he put himself in a box, yet you defend it?
Side with him? WTF? I think you guys are all high. The only thing that is more dooshy than ITS is you guys thinking that if you rag on him about anything he will somehow see the light and change his tune. I call him out all the time because he's a Seattle fan, and I don't like him making other Seatte fans look bad. I think the board would be a lot better if fans would take the time to police their own.
I am glad you are taking this responsibility. I hope after he goes through your 12 step program that we start seeing some positive progress. Good luck!
Poor choice of words on my part. I think there's a greater chance of him changing his habits if he's getting called out by Seattle fans as opposed to other fans. If you disagree, no sweat.
I don't see any way he changes his habits...been going on for a long time. Just like a lot of us won't change. Im not going to change arguing my points when I feel strongly about them and will continue to do so supporting my opinions strongly (and that pisses plenty of people off...too bad)

 
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Nobody got fleeced here. Seahawks needed the cap space to resign their own while they are making a title run, and the Raiders got a hopefully starter quality QB that they needed going into a rebuilding year on the cheap. I'd say both sides got value from this trade.

 
Gentlemen, I think anyone who spends a fair amount of time reading these boards has developed his own opinion as to who to pay attention to and who to ignore. Rather than talking about posters, which does nothing to advance the thread topic, let's try to get things back on track. The rest of us would appreciate it. Thanks.

 
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If Aaron Rodgers would have been drafted by the Raiders instead of GB, where would he and they be?

Flynn was a leader at LSU, one of those intangibles guys, he wasn't highly regarded by all accounts coming into the draft, and maybe without his big game he would have been regarded the same as Chase Daniel after tutoring under a HOF QB and in a top grade offensive system.

Thing is an excellent team can make a good QB excellent and a bad team can make a good QB poor.

Flynn will be throwing to Moore, Ford and Streeter just like Palmer. Myers is gone. The Raiders do not have a workhorse at RB and they will once again, maybe this time with more success hang their hat on McFadden and he will most likely get injured again. Poor offensive line, shifting defensive talent following a year with mixed results, a young HC, etc. This team is actually making noises like Pryor will be given a chance. - It's not all about Flynn, it's about the fact that he's landed in one of these quicksand franchises. Someone mentioned Gannon, well Gannon had Gruden and theownership loved that success so much they fired him and scrapped the program.

Maybe Flynn will show enough that a good team with a good offense will give him a shot on the cheap after it all gets blown up again.

 
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Per rotoworld.com
The Contra Costa Times believes it's "not a stretch" to think fourth-round pick Tyler Wilson could surpass Matt Flynn and Terrelle Pryor on the Raiders' quarterback depth chart this season.
Wilson reportedly looked like a "seasoned veteran" at rookie minicamp, throwing the football with placement and velocity. He'll look even better in preseason games because Wilson stands tall and firm in the pocket and isn't gunshy under pressure. "Throwing the ball, he’s done a nice job," said coach Dennis Allen. "I don’t have any question about his arm strength and his accuracy."
Deja vu. I will feel bad for Flynn if he gets usurped by another QB named Wilson.

Seriously though, barring injury, I believe Flynn wins this QB battle.
 
Per rotoworld.com

The Contra Costa Times believes it's "not a stretch" to think fourth-round pick Tyler Wilson could surpass Matt Flynn and Terrelle Pryor on the Raiders' quarterback depth chart this season. Wilson reportedly looked like a "seasoned veteran" at rookie minicamp, throwing the football with placement and velocity. He'll look even better in preseason games because Wilson stands tall and firm in the pocket and isn't gunshy under pressure. "Throwing the ball, he’s done a nice job," said coach Dennis Allen. "I don’t have any question about his arm strength and his accuracy."
Deja vu. I will feel bad for Flynn if he gets usurped by another QB named Wilson. Seriously though, barring injury, I believe Flynn wins this QB battle.
I don't think Flynn is QB after the bye. I think this is Wilson's team moving forward.
 
They didn't pay Flynn an extra million bucks and guarantee his 2013 salary to have him languish on the bench. 6.5 million reasons why It's his job to lose. If anyone should be sweating bullets over Wilson, it should be Pryor. And maybe Wilson is the starting QB by the bye week. But it would be only because if Flynn got injured. Tap the brakes a bit on the Wilson express train. This is Flynn's team.

 
If what I hear is accurate, there is lots of talk and excitement about Wilson working his way up to being the #2 QB behind Flynn for 2013. This is a big deal for Oakland. Wilson is reportedly way further along the development road than the last few QB's drafted by Oakland. There is a lot of optimism for Wilson, but IMO, it is for his future, not 2013. I think Flynn starts and plays well in 2013 while Wilson learns. Despite a whole lot of negative vibes for Oakland up in this thread for 2013, I think Flynn (and the Raiders) play much better than expected. Especially Flynn. If Reece and McFadden stay healthy (yes, I know), I see Flynn looking a lot like Dilfer did with Baltimore when they won the super bowl. No, I'm not saying Oakland will win the Super Bowl this year, but I think Flynn and the Raiders will be a lot better than they are being projected.

 
Raiderfan32904 said:
And maybe Wilson is the starting QB by the bye week. But it would be only because if Flynn got injured. Tap the brakes a bit on the Wilson express train. This is Flynn's team.
Trivia question: Which year is this post from?

 
Raiderfan32904 said:
They didn't pay Flynn an extra million bucks and guarantee his 2013 salary to have him languish on the bench. 6.5 million reasons why It's his job to lose. If anyone should be sweating bullets over Wilson, it should be Pryor. And maybe Wilson is the starting QB by the bye week. But it would be only because if Flynn got injured. Tap the brakes a bit on the Wilson express train. This is Flynn's team.
Way too much unjustified certainty in this post. The Raiders are in exactly the right position to start Wilson in 2013 should he impress them enough to warrant it. Flynn's contract doesn't at all preclude that.

 
POSTED MAY 13, 2013
Tyler Wilson a realistic option as Raiders starter?OAKLAND RAIDERS

BY CHRIS BURKE

Tyler Wilson threw for 7,765 yards and 52 touchdowns during his college career, exactly 24 yards and five touchdowns more than E.J. Manuel at Florida State. Obviously, NFL prospect analysis goes well beyond stats — Manuel also rushed for 827 yards to Wilson’s -44, and Florida State won five more games than Arkansas from 2009-12.

Still, there was a 96-pick gap between when Manuel came off the board at No. 16 overall in this year’s draft and when the Raiders nabbed Wilson at 112. Considering that Wilson could wind up with just as much of a shot to start in Week 1 as Manuel (or the four other QBs taken in the top 115), Oakland might reap a pretty nice return on its investment.

Wilson took a very tiny step toward that possibility over the weekend, when he opened some eyes at the Raiders’ rookie camp.Still, there was a 96-pick gap between when Manuel came off the board at No. 16 overall in this year’s draft and when the Raiders nabbed Wilson at 112. Considering that Wilson could wind up with just as much of a shot to start in Week 1 as Manuel (or the four other QBs taken in the top 115), Oakland might reap a pretty nice return on its investment.

He was so impressive, in fact, that Steve Corkran of the Contra Costa Times wrote that ”Wilson is on track to push Matt Flynn for the starting job right away and certainly push (Terrelle) Pryor for the backup spot held by Matt Leinart last season.”

Wilson himself urged a little caution.

“Obviously, I have a lot to learn,” Wilson said in a post-practice interview on Raiders.com. “The playbook’s one of those things that you have to dive in and really attack, and I’ve got a lot of work to do there to get up to speed, because there’s been veteran guys that have been here and are ahead of me right now. So I’m playing catch-up from that point.

“I do think I can bring some things to the table, skill set-wise, but again, I’ve got to play catch-up. I’m going to use this as an opportunity and compete like heck, for sure.”

And why wouldn’t the Raiders leave that “opportunity” on the table for Wilson?

Flynn is the team’s projected starter, following an offseason trade with Seattle. But Oakland was uncertain enough about Flynn’s potential (one year after Russell Wilson beat him out for the Seahawks’ job) that the franchise reworked the QB’s contract so it owes him no guaranteed money beyond 2013. In other words, the Raiders already have a fail-safe in place to move on without Flynn next season.

Pryor, meanwhile, seems to be fighting an uphill battle of his own. The Raiders’ coaching staff continues to say that he’ll get a shot at the starting job come training camp — and he may very well be in the mix — but his salary (a combined $1.3 million base over the next two seasons) makes him even more expendable than Flynn, and he has yet to really make any headway in Oakland after being inherited by the team’s current staff.

The uncertain situations atop the Raiders’ QB depth chart are what led to the selection of Wilson in the first place. It’s possible the former Razorback could throw the whole situation into flux in the coming weeks.

“Well, I’ve liked the way Tyler’s commanded the huddle,” head coach Dennis Allen said Saturday. “I like the way he’s gone through his reads. Obviously, picking up a new system, I think there’s still a little bit of rust there but throwing the ball, I think he’s done a nice job. I don’t have any question about his arm strength and his accuracy.”

One bonus for Wilson: Both Flynn and Pryor have to learn a new system, too, with the Raiders bringing in Greg Olson to run the offense following the end of the 2012 season. The two incumbents had a head start, but it’s not as if Wilson is years behind there.

The experience gap is there in some regard, especially when Wilson is stacked up against the veteran Flynn, but it’s not as drastic as those facing, say, Manuel against Kevin Kolb in Buffalo or Geno Smith with Mark Sanchez in New York. Flynn and Pryor also have just three combined NFL starts (two for Flynn in Green Bay, one for Pryor last season).

“I’m comfortable out there; it’s fun, it’s football,” Wilson said over the weekend. “There’s a lot going through your head, and I’ve always tried not to show that — just be cool and … calm and let the guys know that even if I’m not right the first time, we’ll get it right eventually.”

Basing anything of substance on a rookie-camp performance is premature. While those minicamps give coaches a chance to evaluate their talent, the relatively relaxed atmosphere is a far cry even from what NFL newcomers will see at OTAs or in the preseason.

The Raiders will reconvene for a full-team workouts on May 20, with mandatory minicamp set for June 11-13 and the preseason opener on Aug. 9.

Those events will give everyone a much better feel for where Wilson stands in relation to Flynn and Pryor. For now, though, he’s off and running.

“I knew they’d throw a lot at ya, they want to see kind of how you handle the intensity,” Wilson said. “There’s a lot that goes into it, how you mesh with the other guys and how you are around the facility. That’s a big part of this weekend, just soaking up, digesting as much of that as possible.

“This has been a big step for me, for sure.”

Big enough, it seems, for Wilson to have solidified himself as a contender to run the Raiders’ offense in 2013.

 

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