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Matt Jones Released (1 Viewer)

Seems to be a lot of Walker love for a place that's so down on Malcolm Kelly... and Torry Holt.
Hey Cookiemonster. Another comment that doesn't serve a lot of purpose is the "seems like there's a lot of love..." which springs up quite often in threads related to sleepers or breakout players or free agent signees, etc...Let's keep some perspective here. This is, according to Big-Boards.com, one of the largest Invision boards of any kind in the world. It's clearly one of the, if not THE, largest football-related forum. As such, you can safely assume that there will be "a lot of love" for any player, position, opinion, argument, team, coach, manger AND "a lot of hate."So while I think it's perfectly rational to express doubt about Mike Walker's credentials, I think it's another thing entirely to mix X with Y.Your post means to imply that the pervading viewpoint on this forum is that Mike Walker has sleeper potential while Malcolm Kelly and Torry Holt, do not. That's simply inaccurate. There are people I'm sure that love all three. There are people I'm sure that disregard all three. And there are a TON who prefer one or two of the trio and could care less about the others. Let's not mix metaphors or make sweeping generalizations; it only serves to come off as though you're disrespecting the aggregate viewpoints of the forum in totality, which I know you're certainly not doing.
 
I wonder if anyone will take a chance on Jones or if his career is over. Maybe OAK will sign him. They need WR help badly, they have a track record of taking on troubled players and he won't be expensive at all to sign so he is low risk.

 
Releasing Jones would seem to indicate that the Jags are more comfortable with Walker's injury status.
... or that an announcement of a Torry Holt signing is imminent.
I wouldn't read EITHER of the two into the release. This to me, looks like Gene Smith washing his hands of yet another one of Shack Harris' guys. Jones could have been a distraction in camp, nobody knows how long he'll be suspended, and they just decided to cut their losses.Yeah, they'll probably sign a veteran nobody and take a WR high but they better also be looking for undrafted free agents at the end of the draft as well.
yep. This is more about dumping a guy who is troubled than indicative of their WRs. I have no doubt whatsoever that Jones will be picked up by someone. Heck, maybe even a team in their own division.
 
Seems to be a lot of Walker love for a place that's so down on Malcolm Kelly... and Torry Holt.
Hey Cookiemonster. Another comment that doesn't serve a lot of purpose is the "seems like there's a lot of love..." which springs up quite often in threads related to sleepers or breakout players or free agent signees, etc...Let's keep some perspective here. This is, according to Big-Boards.com, one of the largest Invision boards of any kind in the world. It's clearly one of the, if not THE, largest football-related forum. As such, you can safely assume that there will be "a lot of love" for any player, position, opinion, argument, team, coach, manger AND "a lot of hate."So while I think it's perfectly rational to express doubt about Mike Walker's credentials, I think it's another thing entirely to mix X with Y.Your post means to imply that the pervading viewpoint on this forum is that Mike Walker has sleeper potential while Malcolm Kelly and Torry Holt, do not. That's simply inaccurate. There are people I'm sure that love all three. There are people I'm sure that disregard all three. And there are a TON who prefer one or two of the trio and could care less about the others. Let's not mix metaphors or make sweeping generalizations; it only serves to come off as though you're disrespecting the aggregate viewpoints of the forum in totality, which I know you're certainly not doing.
I disagree Jason, maybe not with regards to Holt but with regards to Kelly, it seems like he definitely has a point.Any time Walker is brought up most of the responses are of the positive nature. Any time Kelly is brought up most of the responses are of the negative nature in spite of their similarities. Asking who had more value between the two right now I have little doubt that most would place Walker significantly higher.Obviously there are SOME people that love all three, but if we're breaking it down into that then what's the point in having these discussions at all? I'm sure there are SOME people that would prefer any player to any player for a variety of reasons, especially when talking about guys this far down. Regardless of there being SOME that love each of them, it seems like there is a significant discrepancy in the actual number, just as there is in the actual number that prefer Peyton Manning to Matt Cassell, although there are SOME that would prefer each of them.
 
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Guys, the argument I keep reading against Walker is this supposed knee problem. Some talk like it's still injured. Others talk like the ACL has been repeatedly injured. I really think there is a lot of misinformation here that guys on this board just continue to regurgitate without knowing what they are talking about.

The fact is (and feel free to research it yourself, I just did) his knee is fine. He injured it (ACL) his Jr year of college, but they let him play on it his Sr year, probably too soon, and he experienced swelling in the knee from time to time. He had 98 receptions anyway. Jacksonville drafted him in the 3rd round but he continued to experience swelling in the knee in preseason, they had a glut of WRs at the time, and stashed him on IR. He needed a minor procedure done to remedy this, sort of a followup on the original procedure. Not a new injury.

So, 2008 was like a rookie year after missing all of 2007. He was still learning. But by week 4 he was becoming an important part of the offense. He had 11 catches in weeks 4 and 5 and was doing great, but in that Pittsburgh game (6-107) he got hit and it resulted in a sprained MCL, and then it got infected. It was NOT more ACL problems. Due to the infection he missed several weeks, but returned in week 11 and had 2 catches. THE KNEE WAS FINE BY THEN. He also played in week 12 but had no catches.

Then his personal life took some hits. On the Friday following that week 12 game he learned his best friend was stabbed to death, and the team gave permission for him to leave. He was inactive for the week 13 game. Then, on the day of his friend's funeral, Walker's father died due to a staph infection and so he also missed week 14. Just a horrible few weeks for the poor guy. NONE OF IT WAS KNEE-RELATED. THE KNEE WAS FINE.

By this time, other players were in the offense and Walker (still basically a rookie) had missed a lot of time. He did play in weeks 15-17 and had a couple of catches, but by then he had missed so much time, and his mind had to be a mess, that he wasn't a big part of the offense any longer.

So, PLEASE forget about the knee, people!! But DO REMEMBER this was the guy who was a year ahead of Brandon Marshall at UCF, by most accounts was BETTER than Marshall, had 98 catches on a bum knee his Sr year (now healed), was drafted a round earlier than Marshall, the Jags have continuously raved about his talent, they have cut Porter and Williams and Jones and didn't chase any of the high profile free agents, and in my opinion it's because they are ready to feature Walker in 2009.

Now, you do what you want with that info. It's really easy to just dismiss him by saying "bum knee, injury prone" but you'd be wrong. Sometimes these myths about players take on a life of their own after being repeated often enough, even if wrong. Learn the facts about players rather than regurgitating the same ol same ol and you'll be better for it.

 
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Doesn't matter who the #1 is on that team. The QB sucks. A WR graveyard like Atlanta used to be.
roddy white went for 1200yds and 6 tds with harrington, leftwich, and redmancalvin johnson went for 1300 and 16 tds last year with culpepper, kitna, orlovsky
 
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Doesn't matter who the #1 is on that team. The QB sucks. A WR graveyard like Atlanta used to be.
:goodposting:
I'm not trying to single out T. Bell here, but this is a pitch perfect example of the kind of thing we need to see less of.FavreCo posts a negative, declarative absolute and adds no context or analysis. And then T. Bell comes in with a :moneybag: icon to further muddy up the thread.

Tatum, I know you're capable of much more. Rather than post an icon for something that, frankly, wasn't a :rolleyes: as it was written and instead come in with your own analysis of why you TOO think David Garrard is the problem in Jacksonville?
Jason, I like you and appreciate your contribution to this board, but I'm having trouble understanding the crusade you're on right now. Should we eliminate the "good posting" smiley altogether as it's use never amounts to "unpacking" any idea in the Shark Pool? I don't get it, and I don't get how what I and others have posted in this thread is any worse than this, which I found in the first few pages of the Eagles Offseason thread:
Report from Schefter that Brian Dawkins is going to make a visit to Denver. I really am starting to get the feeling he is not going to be an Eagle in '09.
:wall: That better not be true :wall:
:thumbup: Truth be told, I have no problem with your post, and it's far more palatable and less intrusive than, for example, the morons' posts that are full of "analysis" as they argue incessantly, for pages on end, over minutiae, often in blatant hijacks. Again, I don't get it.

 
I've been telling people for over a year who J'ville's WR1 would be in 2009. Mike Walker.
LOL
i think these are the kinds of posts Joe talks about being tired of, and part of the reason I seldom bother to try to help anyone around here anymore. Closed mindedness sucks.
Indeed they are, and I think the longer I'm in this hobby the more I realize how dangerous it is to emphatically declare anything. We're paid to do that as staff but at the end of the day I've learned countless times that the situation you completely discount can, in fact, be the eventual outcome. While I admit that Mike Walker, to me, seems a long shot to emerge; I would never discount it out of hand. And I would like to think B.S.S. wouldn't either.
Jason,Do you really believe this? That it's your job?

I, for one, see too much of the 'emphatic declarations', particularly from staff.

I don't see that as the same, at all, as a strong opinion that's communicated well.

There's a handful of staffers that I'd say communicate their positions well, while being open to contrarian views.

If it's so dangerous, why not choose the more collegial, reasoned option?

Seems like that's exactly what you're trying to avoid here in the SP with this recent campaign to make it better.

I see a direct contradiction in what you say you're paid for vs what you say you're striving for in the SP makeover.

Just my :goodposting:

 
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Doesn't matter who the #1 is on that team. The QB sucks. A WR graveyard like Atlanta used to be.
11th in fantasy points in 2008, making him a startable fantasy QB.In 2007, in 12 games had a 64% completion rate, 18-3 TD-INT ratio, and a 7.7 YPA.Please define "sucks"
 
Jason, I like you and appreciate your contribution to this board, but I'm having trouble understanding the crusade you're on right now. Should we eliminate the "good posting" smiley altogether as it's use never amounts to "unpacking" any idea in the Shark Pool? I don't get it, and I don't get how what I and others have posted in this thread is any worse than this, which I found in the first few pages of the Eagles Offseason thread:
To be clear. Nothing wrong with :thumbup: Sometimes all I have to say is that I agree with what the other guy said. That's ok. I'm not saying we can't have goodpostings. I guess what I'm saying is given a choice, we'd rather have discussion more than just a "me too". But I fully understand that "me too" is sometimes all I got. That's ok.J
 
Yes please, let's eliminate the :thumbup: icon as well as the :blackdot: and for the love of God make :popcorn: go away forever.

It really doesn't matter why Mike Walker has missed so many games, the fact that he has makes it hard for me to believe that the Jags think they can count on him as a starter going into next year. They pretty much have to do something in FA even though they already missed on Coles, Housh and TO. I also think they'll double-dip at WR in the draft. It has to drive JDR nuts that in the entire time he has been there the only decent WR they've had has been Jimmy Smith.

 
I'm sure I'm not to first to suggest that he might land in Dallas. (jerry Jones history + has arkansas connections) His value would go through the roof. (matt jones owner)

 
Yes please, let's eliminate the :thumbup: icon as well as the :blackdot: and for the love of God make :popcorn: go away forever.

It really doesn't matter why Mike Walker has missed so many games, the fact that he has makes it hard for me to believe that the Jags think they can count on him as a starter going into next year. They pretty much have to do something in FA even though they already missed on Coles, Housh and TO. I also think they'll double-dip at WR in the draft. It has to drive JDR nuts that in the entire time he has been there the only decent WR they've had has been Jimmy Smith.
Not that they haven't tried. Reggie Williams was the 9th player taken overall in '04, and Matt Jones was the 21st taken in '05. They traded for Williamson (1.07 in 2005, though to be fair they only gave up a 6th round pick for him and probably didn't expect much), and they gave a big contract last year to get Porter and his awesome 11 catches.So, high draft picks haven't worked. High priced free agents haven't worked. They've been patient with Walker, I think, because they see a future in him. You know, Jimmy Smith missed his entire 1st year due to injury too. Fact.

 
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I'm sure I'm not to first to suggest that he might land in Dallas. (jerry Jones history + has arkansas connections) His value would go through the roof. (matt jones owner)
One can only hope and hope that he can run more than 7 yard slants over the middle. Hopefully someone gets him and uses what he can do good as opposed to knocking him for what he can't do good. It's like having Randy Moss and not playing him because he doesn't like to go over the middle. Just think what would have happened if D. Green would have done that to Randy his rookie year.
 
I drank the Jones kool aid for three years but gave up on him last year. He looks alot like Koren Robinson to me. Someone will probably give him another chance and sign him, but he will have to earn his place and stay clean. Guys who have an addiction have a hard time doing that. The drinking doesn't concern me too much, but the cocaine does.Walker will get a chance but the Jags also will take a WR number one almost certainly.
Honestly the cocaine just shows that he is a motivated individual and prolly is tired as ####. I'd be more concerned if he didnt follow up the "incident" with a top 30 WR campaign including a few games suspended/injured. Remember coke is an analgesic and has been used for pain relief/surgery for years.Not much different )except for stigma and legality) than the NFL trail mix of painkillers most nfl players take at night.lest we forget hes 6'6 and was timed by NFL scouts at times between 4.37 and 4.39 with an laser-time of 4.41. Last year he did well even though Jax's QB/system was HORRIBLE for receivers. Run first Run second and pass to anyone of like 5 receivers. I for one would love to take him and hope that this week in jail for drinking while on probation wakes him up and he works even harder to clean up his image.Hell even if he just played as well as he did last year, I'd take him as a gm as long as hi didnt commit a violent felony. 6'6 and 4.37-4.41 speed? YES PLEASE. I mean he's taller than randy Moss, and almost as fast. Plus he's played QB so he "knows where the qb wants him to be". Leonard Little is getting voted to Pro Bowls. This guy will be back, I hope it's with one of my teams.
 
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Doesn't matter who the #1 is on that team. The QB sucks. A WR graveyard like Atlanta used to be.
:)Garrard is a better QB than Vick, but the offense is way too conservative.
the Falcons never had a d like Jax. So they never "ground out games" for 3-4 quarters, and were usually trying to catch up and score late. The Jags lately make a living in winning 17-13 games where they run 70percent of the time.That's not good for overall FF stats, as so many fewer yards and possessions/tds.
 
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I'm sure I'm not to first to suggest that he might land in Dallas. (jerry Jones history + has arkansas connections) His value would go through the roof. (matt jones owner)
I saw another news site mention Dallas, and it made me wonder... are they trying to turn over a new leaf in Big D, avioding these problem guys in the future (at least for a while)? Pacman, TO, etc. Maybe they'd avoid a distraction guy like Jones now, whereas a year ago they might be all over a situation like this.Also, JJ expressed the desire to get Roy Williams, Austin, Hurd, etc. more opportunity as his reasoning for cutting TO. Whether that's truthful or not you decide, but if so Jones wouldn't really fit with that plan.Whoever does take Matt Jones will also have to wait for whatever his "time out" is going to be this time (maybe a half-season), and also the knowledge that they are signing a guy who is probably one strike away from a year's vacation the next time. This wasn't just a guy having a beer. This was a guy dumb enough to be caught cutting cocaine last year in a car for any cop to come by and see.
 
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Doesn't matter who the #1 is on that team. The QB sucks. A WR graveyard like Atlanta used to be.
:confused:
I'm not trying to single out T. Bell here, but this is a pitch perfect example of the kind of thing we need to see less of.FavreCo posts a negative, declarative absolute and adds no context or analysis. And then T. Bell comes in with a :goodposting: icon to further muddy up the thread.

Tatum, I know you're capable of much more. Rather than post an icon for something that, frankly, wasn't a :goodposting: as it was written and instead come in with your own analysis of why you TOO think David Garrard is the problem in Jacksonville?
I agree. sometimes just don't have the energy.
 
Seems to be a lot of Walker love for a place that's so down on Malcolm Kelly... and Torry Holt.
Hey Cookiemonster. Another comment that doesn't serve a lot of purpose is the "seems like there's a lot of love..." which springs up quite often in threads related to sleepers or breakout players or free agent signees, etc...Let's keep some perspective here. This is, according to Big-Boards.com, one of the largest Invision boards of any kind in the world. It's clearly one of the, if not THE, largest football-related forum. As such, you can safely assume that there will be "a lot of love" for any player, position, opinion, argument, team, coach, manger AND "a lot of hate."So while I think it's perfectly rational to express doubt about Mike Walker's credentials, I think it's another thing entirely to mix X with Y.Your post means to imply that the pervading viewpoint on this forum is that Mike Walker has sleeper potential while Malcolm Kelly and Torry Holt, do not. That's simply inaccurate. There are people I'm sure that love all three. There are people I'm sure that disregard all three. And there are a TON who prefer one or two of the trio and could care less about the others. Let's not mix metaphors or make sweeping generalizations; it only serves to come off as though you're disrespecting the aggregate viewpoints of the forum in totality, which I know you're certainly not doing.
This would be lessened with a :koolaid: smiley.
 
Excellent post, Couch Potato. I like seeing posts that break it down with this kind of detail and it informs people on a board about Walker's situation. I knew about the status of his knee, the MCL, and the resulting infection but I didn't know about his father dying and the friend passing.

I think there enough examples of players who came off ACL tears in college to produce at a high level in the NFL: Jamal Lewis, Willis McGahee, and Frank Gore are three I can name off the top of my head.

 
we'll see what happens to Matt from here. I don't think he has a choice, he can't party anymore or he'll lose his freedom. A lot of teams in the league won't even consider him because of it

 
I'm sure I'm not to first to suggest that he might land in Dallas. (jerry Jones history + has arkansas connections) His value would go through the roof. (matt jones owner)
I saw another news site mention Dallas, and it made me wonder... are they trying to turn over a new leaf in Big D, avioding these problem guys in the future (at least for a while)? Pacman, TO, etc. Maybe they'd avoid a distraction guy like Jones now, whereas a year ago they might be all over a situation like this.Also, JJ expressed the desire to get Roy Williams, Austin, Hurd, etc. more opportunity as his reasoning for cutting TO. Whether that's truthful or not you decide, but if so Jones wouldn't really fit with that plan.Whoever does take Matt Jones will also have to wait for whatever his "time out" is going to be this time (maybe a half-season), and also the knowledge that they are signing a guy who is probably one strike away from a year's vacation the next time. This wasn't just a guy having a beer. This was a guy dumb enough to be caught cutting cocaine last year in a car for any cop to come by and see.
JJ has always been amoral enough to evaluate when talent is present and then to curtail it most of the time. The guys they got rid of TO (ego attitude problems but not off the field stuff) for lockerroom. Matt Jones was able to deal with and start under Del Rio. I'd say that's not a BIG issue. Even Pac Man (whose "rap sheet is 10 x longer and more violent than jones) was signed and then put under 24 hour guard with a bodyguard/secuirty team. He was dumb enough to get drunk and fight them. I don't think Jones is that dumb, and if Jones set up the same-style of arrangement could see him doing well. REAL TIME (the 7 days will seem like weeks) does funny things to a guy who is priveliged/talented enough not to wanna go back/flunk out of the NFL.Freakish talent and size have a way about making an owner like Jerry look the other way/think he could change him. Plus I bet Jerry would love the idea of cleanig him up just for the Razorback reputation/pride thing.
 
Guys, the argument I keep reading against Walker is this supposed knee problem. Some talk like it's still injured. Others talk like the ACL has been repeatedly injured. I really think there is a lot of misinformation here that guys on this board just continue to regurgitate without knowing what they are talking about.

The fact is (and feel free to research it yourself, I just did) his knee is fine. He injured it (ACL) his Jr year of college, but they let him play on it his Sr year, probably too soon, and he experienced swelling in the knee from time to time. He had 98 receptions anyway. Jacksonville drafted him in the 3rd round but he continued to experience swelling in the knee in preseason, they had a glut of WRs at the time, and stashed him on IR. He needed a minor procedure done to remedy this, sort of a followup on the original procedure. Not a new injury.

So, 2008 was like a rookie year after missing all of 2007. He was still learning. But by week 4 he was becoming an important part of the offense. He had 11 catches in weeks 4 and 5 and was doing great, but in that Pittsburgh game (6-107) he got hit and it resulted in a sprained MCL, and then it got infected. It was NOT more ACL problems. Due to the infection he missed several weeks, but returned in week 11 and had 2 catches. THE KNEE WAS FINE BY THEN. He also played in week 12 but had no catches.

Then his personal life took some hits. On the Friday following that week 12 game he learned his best friend was stabbed to death, and the team gave permission for him to leave. He was inactive for the week 13 game. Then, on the day of his friend's funeral, Walker's father died due to a staph infection and so he also missed week 14. Just a horrible few weeks for the poor guy. NONE OF IT WAS KNEE-RELATED. THE KNEE WAS FINE.

By this time, other players were in the offense and Walker (still basically a rookie) had missed a lot of time. He did play in weeks 15-17 and had a couple of catches, but by then he had missed so much time, and his mind had to be a mess, that he wasn't a big part of the offense any longer.

So, PLEASE forget about the knee, people!! But DO REMEMBER this was the guy who was a year ahead of Brandon Marshall at UCF, by most accounts was BETTER than Marshall, had 98 catches on a bum knee his Sr year (now healed), was drafted a round earlier than Marshall, the Jags have continuously raved about his talent, they have cut Porter and Williams and Jones and didn't chase any of the high profile free agents, and in my opinion it's because they are ready to feature Walker in 2009.

Now, you do what you want with that info. It's really easy to just dismiss him by saying "bum knee, injury prone" but you'd be wrong. Sometimes these myths about players take on a life of their own after being repeated often enough, even if wrong. Learn the facts about players rather than regurgitating the same ol same ol and you'll be better for it.
With all due respect, I don't believe the knee is "fine". In these days of typically nice outcomes with ACL surgery, it's not common for players to have the kinds of problems Walker has had with his knee. He's definitely had two full years ('06 & '07) of knee problems (mostly off-&-on swelling) not counting the MCL sprain & infection last year. Even tho I agreed with you about Walker's potential in a previous post in this thread, I'm far from believing he's a sure thing. My main point of contention is I watched him closely in preseason '08 & he simply wasn't the same player who created the buzz in college & early on in his pro career ('07 training camp).

You can take something positive from the two decent games Walker had last year (5-46 & 6-107), but he played 7 other games & had 5 catches. I know he had some personal problems, but I'm very confident that knee wasn't 100%. It may not ever be. The MCL injury could very well have resulted from some instability in the knee. Who knows. I'm not a doctor, but this type of thing can turn into a chronic knee condition pretty easily (considering his line of work).

Again, I do like his potential, but I think it's a huge mistake to discount his past knee problems. And like I said, I don't believe he's the same player I saw as a junior in college. We'll see. This year will be make-or-break for Walker. More knee problems means he's got a pretty dim future, but if his knee holds up, he could be a big surpise.

 
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Guys, the argument I keep reading against Walker is this supposed knee problem. Some talk like it's still injured. Others talk like the ACL has been repeatedly injured. I really think there is a lot of misinformation here that guys on this board just continue to regurgitate without knowing what they are talking about.

The fact is (and feel free to research it yourself, I just did) his knee is fine. He injured it (ACL) his Jr year of college, but they let him play on it his Sr year, probably too soon, and he experienced swelling in the knee from time to time. He had 98 receptions anyway. Jacksonville drafted him in the 3rd round but he continued to experience swelling in the knee in preseason, they had a glut of WRs at the time, and stashed him on IR. He needed a minor procedure done to remedy this, sort of a followup on the original procedure. Not a new injury.

So, 2008 was like a rookie year after missing all of 2007. He was still learning. But by week 4 he was becoming an important part of the offense. He had 11 catches in weeks 4 and 5 and was doing great, but in that Pittsburgh game (6-107) he got hit and it resulted in a sprained MCL, and then it got infected. It was NOT more ACL problems. Due to the infection he missed several weeks, but returned in week 11 and had 2 catches. THE KNEE WAS FINE BY THEN. He also played in week 12 but had no catches.

Then his personal life took some hits. On the Friday following that week 12 game he learned his best friend was stabbed to death, and the team gave permission for him to leave. He was inactive for the week 13 game. Then, on the day of his friend's funeral, Walker's father died due to a staph infection and so he also missed week 14. Just a horrible few weeks for the poor guy. NONE OF IT WAS KNEE-RELATED. THE KNEE WAS FINE.

By this time, other players were in the offense and Walker (still basically a rookie) had missed a lot of time. He did play in weeks 15-17 and had a couple of catches, but by then he had missed so much time, and his mind had to be a mess, that he wasn't a big part of the offense any longer.

So, PLEASE forget about the knee, people!! But DO REMEMBER this was the guy who was a year ahead of Brandon Marshall at UCF, by most accounts was BETTER than Marshall, had 98 catches on a bum knee his Sr year (now healed), was drafted a round earlier than Marshall, the Jags have continuously raved about his talent, they have cut Porter and Williams and Jones and didn't chase any of the high profile free agents, and in my opinion it's because they are ready to feature Walker in 2009.

Now, you do what you want with that info. It's really easy to just dismiss him by saying "bum knee, injury prone" but you'd be wrong. Sometimes these myths about players take on a life of their own after being repeated often enough, even if wrong. Learn the facts about players rather than regurgitating the same ol same ol and you'll be better for it.
With all due respect, I don't believe the knee is "fine". In these days of typically nice outcomes with ACL surgery, it's not common for players to have the kinds of problems Walker has had with his knee. He's definitely had two full years ('06 & '07) of knee problems (mostly off-&-on swelling) not counting the MCL sprain & infection last year. Even tho I agreed with you about Walker's potential in a previous post in this thread, I'm far from believing he's a sure thing. My main point of contention is I watched him closely in preseason '08 & he simply wasn't the same player who created the buzz in college & early on in his pro career ('07 training camp).

You can take something positive from the two decent games Walker had last year (5-46 & 6-107), but he played 7 other games & had 5 catches. I know he had some personal problems, but I'm very confident that knee wasn't 100%. It may not ever be. The MCL injury could very well have resulted from some instability in the knee. Who knows. I'm not a doctor, but this type of thing can turn into a chronic knee condition pretty easily (considering his line of work).

Again, I do like his potential, but I think it's a huge mistake to discount his past knee problems. And like I said, I don't believe he's the same player I saw as a junior in college. We'll see. This year will be make-or-break for Walker. More knee problems means he's got a pretty dim future, but if his knee holds up, he could be a big surpise.
:thumbup:
 
Guys, the argument I keep reading against Walker is this supposed knee problem. Some talk like it's still injured. Others talk like the ACL has been repeatedly injured. I really think there is a lot of misinformation here that guys on this board just continue to regurgitate without knowing what they are talking about.

The fact is (and feel free to research it yourself, I just did) his knee is fine. He injured it (ACL) his Jr year of college, but they let him play on it his Sr year, probably too soon, and he experienced swelling in the knee from time to time. He had 98 receptions anyway. Jacksonville drafted him in the 3rd round but he continued to experience swelling in the knee in preseason, they had a glut of WRs at the time, and stashed him on IR. He needed a minor procedure done to remedy this, sort of a followup on the original procedure. Not a new injury.

So, 2008 was like a rookie year after missing all of 2007. He was still learning. But by week 4 he was becoming an important part of the offense. He had 11 catches in weeks 4 and 5 and was doing great, but in that Pittsburgh game (6-107) he got hit and it resulted in a sprained MCL, and then it got infected. It was NOT more ACL problems. Due to the infection he missed several weeks, but returned in week 11 and had 2 catches. THE KNEE WAS FINE BY THEN. He also played in week 12 but had no catches.

Then his personal life took some hits. On the Friday following that week 12 game he learned his best friend was stabbed to death, and the team gave permission for him to leave. He was inactive for the week 13 game. Then, on the day of his friend's funeral, Walker's father died due to a staph infection and so he also missed week 14. Just a horrible few weeks for the poor guy. NONE OF IT WAS KNEE-RELATED. THE KNEE WAS FINE.

By this time, other players were in the offense and Walker (still basically a rookie) had missed a lot of time. He did play in weeks 15-17 and had a couple of catches, but by then he had missed so much time, and his mind had to be a mess, that he wasn't a big part of the offense any longer.

So, PLEASE forget about the knee, people!! But DO REMEMBER this was the guy who was a year ahead of Brandon Marshall at UCF, by most accounts was BETTER than Marshall, had 98 catches on a bum knee his Sr year (now healed), was drafted a round earlier than Marshall, the Jags have continuously raved about his talent, they have cut Porter and Williams and Jones and didn't chase any of the high profile free agents, and in my opinion it's because they are ready to feature Walker in 2009.

Now, you do what you want with that info. It's really easy to just dismiss him by saying "bum knee, injury prone" but you'd be wrong. Sometimes these myths about players take on a life of their own after being repeated often enough, even if wrong. Learn the facts about players rather than regurgitating the same ol same ol and you'll be better for it.
Walker’s woes finally over

Aims to be WR Jags need

By Vic Ketchman, jaguars.com senior editor

Tuesday, March 17, 2009

Mike Walker’s path to a starting job is clear and maybe, finally, fate will be his friend.

Walker’s first two years in professional football were his personal version of hard times. His woes began soon after the Jaguars made him a third-round pick in the 2007 draft. Walker tore cartilage in spring drills and it caused him to spend his rookie season on the injured reserve list and to undergo a form of microfracture surgery in October of that year.

He was back to health and making a move on playing time early last season when he sustained an injury to his “good” knee in the final moments of the Jaguars’ loss to the Steelers. It was considered to be a mild sprain, but then the knee and just about everything else in Walker’s life worsened.

A few days after enjoying his best game as a pro, Walker was found to have contracted a staph infection in the knee, which hospitalized him for four days and caused him to miss the next four games.

Yet, circumstances would worsen.

Just two weeks after making his first career start, Walker learned his best friend was stabbed to death in an Orlando nightclub. A little more than a week later, on the day of his best friend’s funeral, Walker’s father died following a two-year battle with colon cancer.

“The injuries were frustration. The deaths were depression. My dad and my best friend were so close to me. My dad was the first person I called when I got in an argument with a family member. My best friend lived with me. We played midget football together, high school, everything. I was in a state of depression. It’s hard sitting in a meeting because you’re thinking of stuff. It’s hard to focus,” Walker said as he reflected on the saddest season of his life.

He ended up catching 16 passes for 217 yards and gave reason to believe he can fulfill the promise he’s flashed in practice, but the 2008 season is one Walker would like to forget but never will. All he can do is hope for better days ahead.

“I can’t be more ready than I am right now. It’s all up to me now. I have no excuses. It’s all in my hands. I’ve always been taught to take advantage of an advantage,” Walker said.

The advantage of which Walker is speaking is the opening at wide receiver that has been caused by a mass exodus at the position so far this offseason. Jerry Porter was unceremoniously cut, Reggie Williams was allowed to leave in free agency and Matt Jones was released on Monday, just two days after he was released from an Arkansas jail.

If the season was to begin today, Walker and Dennis Northcutt would likely be the Jaguars’ starting wide receivers.

“There is not one injury I have and there is not one issue. I can play freely,” Walker said.

Can he be the receiver the Jaguars desperately need? Can he still be the star pass-catcher Walker has been on occasion on the practice field? More importantly, will he be each of those two guys?

“I don’t wanna say any numbers but I see a coming-out show. I see me and David (Garrard) being a great combination. I see big things for us. The path is paved for me. It’s time to work. I’m going to be here until training camp starts,” Walker said prior to a workout at Jacksonville Municipal Stadium on Tuesday.

Consensus of opinion is the Jaguars need to sign a veteran receiver of some renown. Walker agrees and would welcome such an addition.

“It would help me out, it would help the receiving corps out and it would help the Jaguars out. A guy like a Marvin Harrison or a Torry Holt, who’s been to the Pro Bowl and the big game, can teach me how to prepare myself in training camp and in the film room. Holt’s a great player. I’m still learning the game. I wouldn’t mind modeling myself after someone like Holt,” Walker said.

He was in the weight room on Monday when the news began to circulate that Jones had been cut, and there were reports of an anxious feeling inside the players’ area following the news about Jones. Make no mistake, the message of the dawn of a new day has been sent.

“What’s going on is cleanup. Any kind of negativity; they’re trying to clean up everything. They’re trying to make sure that whoever is on board is on board. We’re just jumping on board with those guys and we have their back 100 percent,” Walker said.
 
Guys, the argument I keep reading against Walker is this supposed knee problem. Some talk like it's still injured. Others talk like the ACL has been repeatedly injured. I really think there is a lot of misinformation here that guys on this board just continue to regurgitate without knowing what they are talking about.

The fact is (and feel free to research it yourself, I just did) his knee is fine. He injured it (ACL) his Jr year of college, but they let him play on it his Sr year, probably too soon, and he experienced swelling in the knee from time to time. He had 98 receptions anyway. Jacksonville drafted him in the 3rd round but he continued to experience swelling in the knee in preseason, they had a glut of WRs at the time, and stashed him on IR. He needed a minor procedure done to remedy this, sort of a followup on the original procedure. Not a new injury.

So, 2008 was like a rookie year after missing all of 2007. He was still learning. But by week 4 he was becoming an important part of the offense. He had 11 catches in weeks 4 and 5 and was doing great, but in that Pittsburgh game (6-107) he got hit and it resulted in a sprained MCL, and then it got infected. It was NOT more ACL problems. Due to the infection he missed several weeks, but returned in week 11 and had 2 catches. THE KNEE WAS FINE BY THEN. He also played in week 12 but had no catches.

Then his personal life took some hits. On the Friday following that week 12 game he learned his best friend was stabbed to death, and the team gave permission for him to leave. He was inactive for the week 13 game. Then, on the day of his friend's funeral, Walker's father died due to a staph infection and so he also missed week 14. Just a horrible few weeks for the poor guy. NONE OF IT WAS KNEE-RELATED. THE KNEE WAS FINE.

By this time, other players were in the offense and Walker (still basically a rookie) had missed a lot of time. He did play in weeks 15-17 and had a couple of catches, but by then he had missed so much time, and his mind had to be a mess, that he wasn't a big part of the offense any longer.

So, PLEASE forget about the knee, people!! But DO REMEMBER this was the guy who was a year ahead of Brandon Marshall at UCF, by most accounts was BETTER than Marshall, had 98 catches on a bum knee his Sr year (now healed), was drafted a round earlier than Marshall, the Jags have continuously raved about his talent, they have cut Porter and Williams and Jones and didn't chase any of the high profile free agents, and in my opinion it's because they are ready to feature Walker in 2009.

Now, you do what you want with that info. It's really easy to just dismiss him by saying "bum knee, injury prone" but you'd be wrong. Sometimes these myths about players take on a life of their own after being repeated often enough, even if wrong. Learn the facts about players rather than regurgitating the same ol same ol and you'll be better for it.
I find this awfully hypocritical at points you refer to a knee as a whole and others differentiate between the MCL and ACL in a self serving fashion.11 total catches is different than 11 catches in weeks 4 and 5.

Bottom line is in 2 years he's played 7 games and averages a shade more than 2 per game AND that his fans make posts this long excusing it in a results based hobby.

 
I wonder if anyone will take a chance on Jones or if his career is over. Maybe OAK will sign him. They need WR help badly, they have a track record of taking on troubled players and he won't be expensive at all to sign so he is low risk.
A real real lot of draft pundits claimed that Matt was an exceptional athlete that would take time to learn the WR position.These stats

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JoneMa00.htm

read exactly like that.

Arrests are, of course, nothing positive.

It sure seems to me like some team is going to be sending Jax thank you letters for developping him while he prospers with their team.

If the Jags cut him due to arrests OK. If not, then why did they bother drafting a project if they weren't going to reap the rewards?

How many WRs had better than 65 catches for 761 yards in 12 games? Just the elite?

 
To think this time last year we were talking about Walker still making a serious impact even with Porter, Jones, Williams, Northcutt and Williamson. Now it's down to Walker and Northcutt and whoever they may bring in as a FA or rookie. I thought the situation was really improving for him in dynasty leagues last year, but this year is shaping up even better regardless of Holt, Crabtree, Maclin, etc, etc coming in. He's been on and off dynasty rosters for the better part of 3 years now. I've had and lost him about 3-4 times now, but he's home now! There's no doubt Walker will have competition but if you have him on your roster now, you have to like your chances of turning nothing into something special this season.

 
I wonder if anyone will take a chance on Jones or if his career is over. Maybe OAK will sign him. They need WR help badly, they have a track record of taking on troubled players and he won't be expensive at all to sign so he is low risk.
I can almost guarantee that someone will sign him to a cheap contract. The best FA WR this year was an aging Housh. There was NO ONE else. Had Matt Jones been on the FA market he would easily have been the second most desirable FA WR. Yes, he has problems and there will be a suspension. But someone will take a chance on him. Whether he will take advantage of that chance I can't say. I am not optimistic. Aside from his drug/alcohol issues, he hasn't shown alot of drive and desire to be a top NFL player. Talent will get you far but not that far in the NFL--too many other talented guys.
 
To think this time last year we were talking about Walker still making a serious impact even with Porter, Jones, Williams, Northcutt and Williamson. Now it's down to Walker and Northcutt and whoever they may bring in as a FA or rookie. I thought the situation was really improving for him in dynasty leagues last year, but this year is shaping up even better regardless of Holt, Crabtree, Maclin, etc, etc coming in. He's been on and off dynasty rosters for the better part of 3 years now. I've had and lost him about 3-4 times now, but he's home now! There's no doubt Walker will have competition but if you have him on your roster now, you have to like your chances of turning nothing into something special this season.
Walker will have a chance to compete and is worth keeping an eye on. Beyond that we can't say much. A young WR who has had two bum knees is not someone that excites me, but I know he generated alot of excitement in his rookie camp two years ago. I would be very surprised if they don't draft a rookie in the second or first round.
 
CP

The "sorta followup" to the original procedure on his knee was that Walker (his rookie year) could not play without a knee brace. His knee couldn't handle it.

He had arthroscopic surgery on his knee to remedy the situation.

He has yet to play well without a brace for any extended period.

Last spring/summer, aside from knee problems, he also had a hand injury which I didn't see mentioned.

Jacksonville.com has more info on this

 
I wonder if anyone will take a chance on Jones or if his career is over. Maybe OAK will sign him. They need WR help badly, they have a track record of taking on troubled players and he won't be expensive at all to sign so he is low risk.
A real real lot of draft pundits claimed that Matt was an exceptional athlete that would take time to learn the WR position.These stats

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JoneMa00.htm

read exactly like that.

Arrests are, of course, nothing positive.

It sure seems to me like some team is going to be sending Jax thank you letters for developping him while he prospers with their team.

If the Jags cut him due to arrests OK. If not, then why did they bother drafting a project if they weren't going to reap the rewards?

How many WRs had better than 65 catches for 761 yards in 12 games? Just the elite?
The Jaguars are weeding out character problems within the organization. Matt Jones was cut because of the arrests.
 
CPThe "sorta followup" to the original procedure on his knee was that Walker (his rookie year) could not play without a knee brace. His knee couldn't handle it. He had arthroscopic surgery on his knee to remedy the situation. He has yet to play well without a brace for any extended period.Last spring/summer, aside from knee problems, he also had a hand injury which I didn't see mentioned. Jacksonville.com has more info on this
Did you read the article Mr. Brownstone posted above?
“There is not one injury I have and there is not one issue. I can play freely,” Walker said.
Straight from the horse's mouth. Today. I think that's where the focus of this discussion should head.
 
Yes please, let's eliminate the :confused: icon as well as the :football: and for the love of God make :thumbup: go away forever.

It really doesn't matter why Mike Walker has missed so many games, the fact that he has makes it hard for me to believe that the Jags think they can count on him as a starter going into next year. They pretty much have to do something in FA even though they already missed on Coles, Housh and TO. I also think they'll double-dip at WR in the draft. It has to drive JDR nuts that in the entire time he has been there the only decent WR they've had has been Jimmy Smith.
Its not from lack of trying - through the draft. Not sure just exactly how much input Del Rio has on the Jacksonville draft but they have spent a good number of high draft picks on guys like Matt Jones, Reggie Williams, Mike Walker, etc. and signed a few free agents like Jerry Proter and Troy Williamson over the last few seasons. None have really worked out. It hasn't really been an issue of talent necessarily, mostly just character issues and injuries.Personally I think they made a mistake letting Wilford walk - although in he made very little impact in Miami, in fact he hardly even dressed for game days.

 
Yes please, let's eliminate the :confused: icon as well as the :football: and for the love of God make :thumbup: go away forever.

It really doesn't matter why Mike Walker has missed so many games, the fact that he has makes it hard for me to believe that the Jags think they can count on him as a starter going into next year. They pretty much have to do something in FA even though they already missed on Coles, Housh and TO. I also think they'll double-dip at WR in the draft. It has to drive JDR nuts that in the entire time he has been there the only decent WR they've had has been Jimmy Smith.
Not that they haven't tried. Reggie Williams was the 9th player taken overall in '04, and Matt Jones was the 21st taken in '05. They traded for Williamson (1.07 in 2005, though to be fair they only gave up a 6th round pick for him and probably didn't expect much), and they gave a big contract last year to get Porter and his awesome 11 catches.So, high draft picks haven't worked. High priced free agents haven't worked. They've been patient with Walker, I think, because they see a future in him. You know, Jimmy Smith missed his entire 1st year due to injury too. Fact.
I guess I should have read down a little further before I made my last post.
 
I wonder if anyone will take a chance on Jones or if his career is over. Maybe OAK will sign him. They need WR help badly, they have a track record of taking on troubled players and he won't be expensive at all to sign so he is low risk.
In pro sports If you can still play, some team will take a chance.
 
CPThe "sorta followup" to the original procedure on his knee was that Walker (his rookie year) could not play without a knee brace. His knee couldn't handle it. He had arthroscopic surgery on his knee to remedy the situation. He has yet to play well without a brace for any extended period.Last spring/summer, aside from knee problems, he also had a hand injury which I didn't see mentioned. Jacksonville.com has more info on this
Did you read the article Mr. Brownstone posted above?
“There is not one injury I have and there is not one issue. I can play freely,” Walker said.
Straight from the horse's mouth. Today. I think that's where the focus of this discussion should head.
Yes. Although saying and doing are two different things, it's good to hear him say that today. Talent + Healthy Knee + Opportunity + Little Competition/Experience around him = very nice sleeper.
 
The Jaguars are weeding out character problems within the organization. Matt Jones was cut because of the arrests.
Jones. Sensabaugh 3 (traffic) arrests, who else?
They have to start somewhere :shrug:Jerry Porter, Drayton Florence, Khalif Barnes, Reggie Williams all have had their issues. All of them were either negative influences in the locker room or had off the field issues. Admittedly though, all of these guys weren't exactly stalwarts at their respective positions either.
 
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Did you read the article Mr. Brownstone posted above?

“There is not one injury I have and there is not one issue. I can play freely,” Walker said.
Straight from the horse's mouth. Today. I think that's where the focus of this discussion should head.
he has said that at least 3 times previously
 
Naturally with Jerry Jones running the show, I'd expect Dallas to be interested. JMO He'd be an immediate upgrade to their #2 WR position. If he has his head on straight like last year, he could be Dallas's #1.

 
Cowboys | May be interested in M. Jones

Fri, 20 Mar 2009 11:21:39 -0700

Bob Glauber, of Newsday, reports the Dallas Cowboys may show interest in unrestricted free-agent WR Matt Jones (Jaguars), according to league sources.

Jets | May be interested in M. Jones

Fri, 20 Mar 2009 11:10:24 -0700

Bob Glauber, of Newsday, reports the New York Jets may show interest in unrestricted free-agent WR Matt Jones (Jaguars), according to league sources.

 
Don't know when or where but between now and the 1st game some team is gonna need WR help and they'll take Jones. He can still recover his career somewhat be it's gonna be even harder now and take that much more work. Doubt he'll be a starter anywhere unless some team has a number of their WR's go down like Seattle did. He's just dug his hole deeper and may not find a ladder big enough to get out of it.

Doesn't look like the Jags have really been doing much about the receiving corps other than getting rid of guys. Yeah it's early but what's really left out there in F/A for them to bring in and be the guy? Even if they draft a rookie wr high I don't think he's gonna outperform Walker this year. It possible but I don't think probable. Walker hasn't done anything to justify him being the guy and we can talk about his knees all we want which won't mean much until we see him on the field. We know the Jags are gonna run,run,run and then run MJD some more. It's gonna have to be Garrard to elevate his game if any of the Jags receiver they have now are to benefit. I think he does and Walker will be the main recipient. Just my opinion with no data to back it up but Walker will end up their top receiver this year. Hunch or whatever you wanna call it, we all get them, I see 8 td's and 1,000 yds. Yeah I can hear the laughter but I got him at 16.02 in WSL4 and I'm expecting good returns for getting him there. I also drafted Matt Jones at 7.15 :goodposting: Still, by whatever reason, it looks like he's gonna get the chance to prove himself this year and I think he succeeds. Sigmund Bloom has WR Crabtree going to the Jags with their first pick in his mock. Even if they get him, and he could do well his rookie year there, I still think Walker ends up with the better numbers.If I'm wrong oh well, we'll see at season's end.

 
here http://www.nwanews.com/adg/Sports/255177/ a reporter that used to cover him at Arkansas and didn't care for him, says that he'd take a chance on Matt if he owned an NFL team. (Long article)
Mmmmmm... not unless your regular reading is "Family Circus". From the article:

Judge Gunn gave him a choice between a six-week drug rehab or a week in jail.
And he takes the week in jail. :popcorn: What does that say about his commitment to his sobriety?
 
here http://www.nwanews.com/adg/Sports/255177/ a reporter that used to cover him at Arkansas and didn't care for him, says that he'd take a chance on Matt if he owned an NFL team. (Long article)
Mmmmmm... not unless your regular reading is "Family Circus". From the article:

Judge Gunn gave him a choice between a six-week drug rehab or a week in jail.
And he takes the week in jail. :thumbdown: What does that say about his commitment to his sobriety?
read it again and get back to me
 

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