Megatron's (Calvin Johnson) value is falling everywhere...why? Is it because Stafford is returning at QB and he seems to target Calvin a lot less than the current QB? I have seen him ranked as low as #20!!! And never as high as #8. Until a week or two ago, everybody thought he was a top 7-8 WR.
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Megatron's value falling (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter gardener
- Start date
two_dollars
Footballguy
People are realizing he isn't going to hit his projected ceiling?
Keith1
Footballguy
don't think Stafford will be back for awhile. I read the other day that he couldn't tie his sneakers. And this was a week and a half after the injury. So, I don't think we'll see Stafford until Halloween.But I agree about Calvin's value dropping. He hasn't posted huge numbers, but the targets are there. He had a TD in week 2, and we all know he had one in week 1 as well. Burleson is out, which will leading to more double coverage. I've tried to move Calvin for an RB, and he is not bringing back what I would like. Haven't pulled the trigger on any deals yet, but I do have an offer of Santana Moss and Addai on the table for him, and I am strongly considering it.
CaptainHook
Footballguy
hes not the focal point fo the offense that i thought hed be
greedygoat
Footballguy
I'm holding. He's not the focal point, but he doesn't need to be. Teams are going to start paying Best more attention and that will only open things up for Megatron.
gary mexico
Footballguy
Im liking hill, not so excited when stafford comes back 
Had agreement in principle giving Megatron/Hass/Ricky Dub for Ray Rice at noon today. Before the guy got home, his RB2 (Moreno) blew the hamstring and he changed his mind.
Dammit Moreno you jerk.........
(I know, ptts. Just sharing trade value story for those interested in current value. 12 team PPR start 2QB).
Dammit Moreno you jerk.........
(I know, ptts. Just sharing trade value story for those interested in current value. 12 team PPR start 2QB).
VaTerp
Footballguy
I think the correct answer is he was overvalued in the weeks leading up to drafts.
I had Calvin around WR8 or 9 all off season as did a lot of people. He and Stafford looked good in pre-season and a lot of people bumped him up as high as WR2. I didnt see it then and I don't see it now.
Love the talent. Don't love everything else. He could still get his and the upside is still there but I didnt think this was the year it would come together for him and nothing I've seen in the 1st two weeks has changed that.
I had Calvin around WR8 or 9 all off season as did a lot of people. He and Stafford looked good in pre-season and a lot of people bumped him up as high as WR2. I didnt see it then and I don't see it now.
Love the talent. Don't love everything else. He could still get his and the upside is still there but I didnt think this was the year it would come together for him and nothing I've seen in the 1st two weeks has changed that.
Iwannabeacowboybaby!
Footballguy
He's falling because he hasn't been involved in the offense that much. In week 1 he didn't have a catch in the first half. Then in the second game he had 1 catch for 7 yards in the first half. Calvin came real close to a horrible game if not for a pass prevent TD late in the game. The Lions get a lot of points on offense and he isn't involved, that's surprising.
The one thing that could happen is that defenses will/should try and now scheme for J. Best. It will be the first time in his career that he isn't the No. 1 guy to stop on the offense. If defenses don't scheme to stop best, he'll tear them up like he has been doing.
The one thing that could happen is that defenses will/should try and now scheme for J. Best. It will be the first time in his career that he isn't the No. 1 guy to stop on the offense. If defenses don't scheme to stop best, he'll tear them up like he has been doing.
hutchins929
Footballguy
I still like him and I like Stafford too. Best will only make them better, IMO.
puckalicious
Footballguy
Maybe because Hill sucks and it's becoming obvious Stafford will be out a bit longer than expected.
That's because he's the focal point of the defense. They're still rolling a safety over the top on him almost every play I've seen (where you could identify the safety from the camera angle). Couple more weeks of Best domination and TE's gashing teams down the seams and he just might get some single coverage. Been awhile. I'm trying to buy low in the leagues I don't own him in.
Dr. Awesome
Footballguy
Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
Give it some time. It's easy to forget that he has played on arguably one of the worst teams in NFL history since coming into the league.Check his first 3 years years AJ's first 3 years.Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
Andre
Calvin
CowboysFromHell
Footballguy
I had Megatron last year, and he was a big disappointment. Everything you guys are saying - wasn't involved in the offense, double-covered, bad team with nobody to throw to him. Didn't want to touch him this year, and so far it looks like the right decision. But, Best could be the game-changer needed... I have Best, not Johnson, but after reading this, I'm thinking of taking a stab at buying low on Johnson. there comes a point in time where you just have to accept that some guys with unlimited ceilings just don't get to the heights you think they will. CJ has the talent of a #1 but has never performed better then a high end WR2. One season out of the last three was anything better then average. Other elite WRs overachieved young ... he perpetually underachieves.Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
this is the hope you have to have with him.Give it some time. It's easy to forget that he has played on arguably one of the worst teams in NFL history since coming into the league.Check his first 3 years years AJ's first 3 years.Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
Andre
Calvin
Dr. Awesome
Footballguy
Imo he has a smidge of Chris Chambers to him. By that I mean his hands aren't as great as some of the other so called elites. :cuesomeonementioningowens:there comes a point in time where you just have to accept that some guys with unlimited ceilings just don't get to the heights you think they will. CJ has the talent of a #1 but has never performed better then a high end WR2. One season out of the last three was anything better then average. Other elite WRs overachieved young ... he perpetually underachieves.Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
⚡DEADHEAD⚡
Footballguy
Yes, he will get his. Stafford will be back and Best opens things up.
Calvin will be fine. If he's given that TD in week 1, we're not having this discussion.
Calvin will be fine. If he's given that TD in week 1, we're not having this discussion.
Last edited by a moderator:
⚡DEADHEAD⚡
Footballguy
He was hurt most of the season.I had Megatron last year, and he was a big disappointment. Everything you guys are saying - wasn't involved in the offense, double-covered, bad team with nobody to throw to him. Didn't want to touch him this year, and so far it looks like the right decision. But, Best could be the game-changer needed... I have Best, not Johnson, but after reading this, I'm thinking of taking a stab at buying low on Johnson.
Vicktimized
Footballguy
2008 = high end #2?there comes a point in time where you just have to accept that some guys with unlimited ceilings just don't get to the heights you think they will. CJ has the talent of a #1 but has never performed better then a high end WR2. One season out of the last three was anything better then average. Other elite WRs overachieved young ... he perpetually underachieves.Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
FantasyTrader
Footballguy
People are stoopid.
FantasyTrader
Footballguy
THIS. I don't get how people can't understand that what Best is doing is a GOOD thing for Calvin. It's about time he's not the focal point. The Lions NOT blindly targeting him 15 times a game for 6-80-0 is what needed to happen. As an owner, I'm absolutely loving what Best/Pettigrew are doing. What comes around, goes around and those that hold will be awful glad they did week 8 and beyond...maybe sooner.
Iwannabeacowboybaby!
Footballguy
Here's the problem I have with that. Stafford played just about the entire 1st half of the 1st game and Calvin didn't have a catch, really wasn't involved in the game plan.Now, that's a super small sample size to make such a large conclusion, to say Calvin Johnson isn't involved in the offense because he didn't catch a pass in the 1st half of the 1st game.However, Calvin was mostly a very early 2nd round pick to mid 2nd round pick. Against the Bears, I was surprised at that half (I watched that game) at how little he was looked at. It wasn't until the 2nd half when they were down that all of a sudden Hill started targeting C. JOHnson.If you go back to the FBG reports......it was like no problem, S. Hill was targeting C. Johnson during the Bears game, look for the Lions and Hill to target Johnson even more and become a big focal point of the offense.Errr, 1 catch for 7 yards in a game that featured all kinds of big plays. He caught a TD pass at the very end of the game against the EAgles that were up by 2 scores to salvage the day. People said the same things last year, mostly people who didn't have C. Johnson, "hey, he's a stud, he'll get his." I heard it all year and they're saying the same exact thing again. Listen, he won't just "get his." You have to earn it, it doesn't just magically happen. I've watched every snap of the Lions and he is not been the focus of this offense, not even close.He is immensely talented, I will agree to that forever. It is why after last year in having him in multiple leagues, I again have him in 3 leagues this year. However, I'm thinking of benching him in 2 of the 3 leagues this week....something I thought I'd never do before the season started. I have in a 2 start league H. Nicks, S. Moss and him. Tough call and I love rooting for Megatron but I may sit him there and the other I have H. Nicks, Tolbert , Bradshaw, and him and need to pick 2. I don't love his matchup in Minnesota at all. It just takes 1 70 yard TD pass to him to make his day worth a start but I just haven't seen that kind of potential yet this year in the regular season. In fact, a lot of the reason I liked Megatron this year was that he was looking dominant inside the redzone. The Lions were throwing all kinds of passes to him during training camp and preseason and he was catching everything. Now inside the redzone, it's become the J. Best show.
Last edited by a moderator:
CaptainHook
Footballguy
he had 1330 yards and 12 tds in his second season......that was the #3 wr in my league. do you even pay attention to football to get the opinions you have?there comes a point in time where you just have to accept that some guys with unlimited ceilings just don't get to the heights you think they will. CJ has the talent of a #1 but has never performed better then a high end WR2. One season out of the last three was anything better then average. Other elite WRs overachieved young ... he perpetually underachieves.Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
Team Smokin'
Footballguy
It's only week 2 and like the stock market it can be volatile from week to week.
If he has a couple solid games his stock rises again and he's top 5.
People are betting on what might happen based upon what they saw last week.
I will admit that for him being a top tier stud WR I am a tad concerned.
Yet, all the studs are prone to average stat weeks here and there.
I think the Lions show they are capable of big plays on the ground with Best, this opens up the pass. Teams game plan this cat and mouse game all the time. Just when you think they will go to someone, they don't. Just when you think they won't they do.
New England, Belichek, Brady & company used this strategy all the time to keep the defenses guessing and on their heels.
If he has a couple solid games his stock rises again and he's top 5.
People are betting on what might happen based upon what they saw last week.
I will admit that for him being a top tier stud WR I am a tad concerned.
Yet, all the studs are prone to average stat weeks here and there.
I think the Lions show they are capable of big plays on the ground with Best, this opens up the pass. Teams game plan this cat and mouse game all the time. Just when you think they will go to someone, they don't. Just when you think they won't they do.
New England, Belichek, Brady & company used this strategy all the time to keep the defenses guessing and on their heels.
Hipple Long Ware & Peete
Footballguy
quack.Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
jacobo_moses
Footballguy
Thought I'd share this. And keep in mind these stats are before Javid Best and Scheffler came to the team.
Lions receiver Calvin Johnson, who is 6-foot-5, has a touchdown catch in four of six career games vs the Vikings. He had eight catches for 84 yards in his last outing against the Vikings.
Lions receiver Calvin Johnson, who is 6-foot-5, has a touchdown catch in four of six career games vs the Vikings. He had eight catches for 84 yards in his last outing against the Vikings.
CowboysFromHell
Footballguy
Another factor, sure. But he played/started in 14 games, and I was dumb enough to drink the koolaid all year long.He was hurt most of the season.I had Megatron last year, and he was a big disappointment. Everything you guys are saying - wasn't involved in the offense, double-covered, bad team with nobody to throw to him. Didn't want to touch him this year, and so far it looks like the right decision. But, Best could be the game-changer needed... I have Best, not Johnson, but after reading this, I'm thinking of taking a stab at buying low on Johnson.
Statler & Waldorf
Footballguy
He wasn't 100% for all those games. He was limping around for weeks after the injury.
dickey moe
Fingerpicker
I've been saying for two years that he's the most overrated player in fantasy. He may have great size and talent, but as long as he's on the Lions he's going to continue to disappoint his owners.
shnikies
Footballguy
Yes, in a two team league. Duh.Vicktimized said:2008 = high end #2?basher said:there comes a point in time where you just have to accept that some guys with unlimited ceilings just don't get to the heights you think they will. CJ has the talent of a #1 but has never performed better then a high end WR2. One season out of the last three was anything better then average. Other elite WRs overachieved young ... he perpetually underachieves.Dr. Awesome said:Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
5th in yardage, tied for first in TDs, 20th in total catches, and he only caught 50% of his total targets. His TDs more then doubled what he did his first year and 3rd year. Double digit TDs clearly aren't sustainable. Go ahead and draft him as your WR1 and continually be pissed that he doesn't get over the top. He is like a slightly better Vincent Jackson.CaptainHook said:he had 1330 yards and 12 tds in his second season......that was the #3 wr in my league. do you even pay attention to football to get the opinions you have?basher said:there comes a point in time where you just have to accept that some guys with unlimited ceilings just don't get to the heights you think they will. CJ has the talent of a #1 but has never performed better then a high end WR2. One season out of the last three was anything better then average. Other elite WRs overachieved young ... he perpetually underachieves.Dr. Awesome said:Maybe because he's not as talented as we want to believe? I know, now folk will come in here and start blasting me. But I think he's underperformed thus far and won't be as good as was expected coming into the league.
⚡DEADHEAD⚡
Footballguy
First half of the first game of the season. Coach says "shut Calvin down." Now, the Lions have clearly demonstrated offense versatility. It's not as easy as saying "double Calvin." We may not see the benefits of this weekend as I'm not sure of Hill but I think the Stafford-Johnson connection will be a very good one if they can stay healthy.Iwannabeacowboybaby! said:
⚡DEADHEAD⚡
Footballguy
So the Lions will never again have a fantasy-worthy WR. Some might have said the same thing about RB until recently too.
HurryUpSundays
Footballguy
Where in there does he say 'the Lions will never again have a fantasy-worthy WR'?I think his point is spot on. Calvin is a talented freak, but fantasy wise he's been in, and obviously still is in, a less than perfect fit.My do not draft list: The Detroit Lions. Just cuz./traded for Jahvid minutes before Saints/Vikes kickoff
jacobo_moses
Footballguy
Doesn't anyone think that Best and Pettigrew have been able to flourish because of the constant focus on Megatron? I mean defenses are going to have to respect the run and the TE's now. This should only help Megatron down the road. I mean look at Andre Johnson, he has a top 5 QB throwing to him, and Walters and Jacoby to deflect attention. So its not really Megatrons fault you know. I think he will start to go off soon. Just be patient.
CaptainHook
Footballguy
calvin is one of very few players capable of being the #1 fantasy wr. unfortunately he also has the lowest floor of those 5 by far. (andre moss austin roddy calvin)
which just means when he is performing closer to his floor people will happily come by claiming that they knew it all along even though they were completely silent beforehand.
which just means when he is performing closer to his floor people will happily come by claiming that they knew it all along even though they were completely silent beforehand.
⚡DEADHEAD⚡
Footballguy
Franchise QB, solid TEs, emerging star RB, not-so-good defense, dome team. What's not to like. It may take a while for things to shake out but he'll be fine. What more do you want?Blanket "don't draft guys on X team" is just plain not smart.EDIT: Except for Browns players.
Last edited by a moderator:
do you really think teams worry about Walter/Jones in comparison to AJ? It isn't like those two are drawing double coverage. The numbers they get is more indicative of the coverage that AJ sees but teams would rather have Kevin Walter and/or Jacoby Jones be the guys to beat you then say Andre. Jahvid Best had a lot of success in the second game and cashed in his goal line attempts on game 1. Teams aren't going to forget about him but they also are not going to deviate coverage from Calvin for either Best or Pettigrew.
Dr. Awesome
Footballguy
There were plenty of people claiming he was overvalued in the preseason. We can all disagree but let's no pretend he had no critics coming into the season. I am certainly not crazy enough to say he sucks or is only slightly above average - he's undoubtedly an elite talent - but he wasn't in my top 5 and I know I wasn't alone. I had:AustinMossAndreRoddyWayneIt was pretty vanilla but aside from Austin those guys have proven to be elite year in and year out (fantasy wise). People are/were too enthralled with Calvin's talent/potential/upside. He wasn't being drafted at his floor - he was being drafted closer to his ceiling despite his brief history indicating he would struggle with some kind of injury and/or be used improperly.Heck, he didn't start shooting up many boards until we got a taste of how he COULD be used during the preseason. Until that time many folk agreed he was a top 5 talent but not necessarily a top 5 fantasy option. He's talented enough to easily crash into the top 5 despite doing very little thus far. I could certainly be wrong. But if I didn't have him there before he's sure as heck not going to get moved up after his lackluster start.
jacobo_moses
Footballguy
The reason Calvn has always flirted wih a top 5 ranking and usually deserves to be in the top 10 is for a number of reasons. Plays big and fast, Check. Plays on a team with a subpar defense so team will be ususally throwin a lot, check. Has the skillset to put up some big games, check. He is good enough that he doesn't need a top QB to put up great numbers, check (SEE season 2 when he had like 2 or 3 different QB's throwing to him)
All I"m saying is the targets are there. He just needs to get into a rythym. Its only week 3, and a little premature to be calling him a bust or a flop when there is a lot of football to play. I'm sure if Tony Romo, or Matt Schaub was throwing to him, and he actually had some decent WR to deflect defensive attention we wouldn't be having this coversation.
All I"m saying is the targets are there. He just needs to get into a rythym. Its only week 3, and a little premature to be calling him a bust or a flop when there is a lot of football to play. I'm sure if Tony Romo, or Matt Schaub was throwing to him, and he actually had some decent WR to deflect defensive attention we wouldn't be having this coversation.
Good point, re: the refs screwing the pooch on the call in game 1. BUT, he was a huge bust last year, only putting up stats to save his season numbers after your team was buried after the dreck he put up in the first half of the season. I think the overrated/overhyped tag has been earned over a period of time.jon_mx said:
No doubt he was a huge bust last year. But Detroit 2010 >> Detroit 2009. Best makes their offense exciting, and we should see a better mix of deep throws in the coming weeks. Megatron will go for 80/1200/10. In 2010, Megatron will not win you leagues, but he will not lose them either. You would have been better off with Welker or Austin who went a round or two later, but you could have done worse too.
Keith1
Footballguy
The loss of Stafford doesn't seem to be considered here. Hill may target Calvin alot, but he is not nearly as good. Calvin will finish the year as a decent WR1, but not the top 20 stud people thought they were drafting. I drafted him at # 17, and thought pairing him with Andre would make for a great combo (Johnson & Johnson). I wish I had taken Austin. Or Roddy White. Can't imagine anyone else wouldn't feel that way as well.
wiscstlatlmia
Footballguy
this. see folks this guys has an opinion without bashing either side 
I am one of the biggest calvin fans around...but im starting to deal with the reality that this may not be the year he takes off to uber-stud status. im willing to wait though. isnt there some saying that says the best things in life comes to those who wait. My dynasty teams may have to wait another year but thats ok ...cause i love rooting for this guy
Last edited by a moderator:
jacobo_moses
Footballguy
I took Megatron because I have his jersey and he is one of my favorite players. I logically should've taken Roddy or Miles Austin too but oh well. I'm 2 and 0 in that league so I'm not too worried about it.
