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*NBA THREAD* Abe will be missed (6 Viewers)

'8ebok24 said:
OH MY DURANT!!!!!!!!!!!Best dunk of his career, never seen a play like that from Kevin.If he starts being aggressive at the rim like that, look out Lebron, he's coming for your spot.
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What do you mean? I dunk on fools all the time, you should see me in my local rec league. If I get a good clear path to the hoop and an extra step to gather myself I can throw down all day.ETA: Oh, you're talking about Kevin Durant, not me Kevin. Never mind.
 
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'Bobcat10 said:
'cvnpoka said:
'Bobcat10 said:
The Wolves are gonna shop the heck out of that pick around the league....but I don't think the Cavs are going to be able to wow them. Actually, the Wolves probably don't have to do much shopping at all, their phones gotta be ringing. The best shot the Cavs have is to get a 3rd team involved in some fashion. Cavs have assets and the willingness to take on an unreasonable contract.
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if the cavs want it they could get it for varejao+4th. thats way overpaying and i doubt cavs are that aggressive. maybe varejao alone, but i still think thats a bad deal for the cavs.

the only other potential asset the cavs have is jj hickson but minnesota (and utah) have no interest in another 4.

minnesota is gonna evaluate dwill as a true 4 and take kanter at 2. utah will look at their stockpile of 4s with millsap, al jeff, kirilenko and esp the young favors and take brandan knight.

dwill droppin to 4 for the cavs #believeland
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Why would Varejao alone for #2 be too much to give up for the Cavs when two posts above you said:"not any player currently on their team is capable of being a significant factor on a contender."

Now I know I'm nitpicking with your words...but I don't see why in the world the Cavs wouldn't ship out Andy for DWilliams if they could.

People are already saying having 1 and 4 speeds up the process by about 2 years and that's assuming DWill is gone at #2.
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haha, nice catch. i indeed misspoke, varejao is a legit player on a contender.anyway, if dwill and kanter are destined to go at 2 and 3, but the cavs could get dwill for av, then i grudgingly do it i think. but, the reason i dont do it right now in real life is bc there is a chance dwill or kanter fall to 4 and the cavs get all 3. also, varejao may (not saying its likely) fetch better value at the trade deadline.

 
'8ebok24 said:
OH MY DURANT!!!!!!!!!!!Best dunk of his career, never seen a play like that from Kevin.If he starts being aggressive at the rim like that, look out Lebron, he's coming for your spot.
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And of course after the best dunk of his career, the refs call a phantom technical on him :lmao: amazing dunk though. Dallas was beating OKC up badly in the 1st but now this is a game. Tied at 54 with 1:54 left in the 2nd.
 
Tony Parker says that age has finally caught up with the Spurs."At the start of the season I said this was our last chance," he said."Tim and Gino (Manu Ginobili) are getting old. It's going to be tough to regenerate ourselves."We will always have a good team but we can no longer say that we're playing for a championship."
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Wow. I agree but for a player to come out and say it, Wow.
 
'8ebok24 said:
Tony Parker says that age has finally caught up with the Spurs."At the start of the season I said this was our last chance," he said."Tim and Gino (Manu Ginobili) are getting old. It's going to be tough to regenerate ourselves."We will always have a good team but we can no longer say that we're playing for a championship."
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Wow. I agree but for a player to come out and say it, Wow.
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The first time a french man has ever backed down prematurely?
 
I think the Thunder could win it all... Collision and Ibaka are doing great which is essential while Durant is doing his thing. 3 big men that could play defense, two young studs, perimeter players, and amazing coach. Wow

 
'Grady Wilson said:
Props to the OKC bench tonight. They have played great.
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This is going to be a great series. Dallas will earn it if they can win a game in OKC. Loud City is going to be louder than ever. Westbrook sits entire 4th quarter and they win? Hello confidence pants. Just hope it doesn't have negative effect on Westbrook. OKC bench redeems themselves.Also Harden and Ibaka will be all stars within a a few years. This team is set up for a dynasty if they can stay together.
 
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'Leeroy Jenkins said:
'oukurt said:
'Scruff Mcgruff said:
Great win for the Thunder and all Wilbon and those bumbling fools can talk about is Russell Westbrook. I hate ESPN sometimes.
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Props to Scott Brooks. Teaching Westbrook a lesson. Stones to sit him all 4th qtr. No player is bigger than the team. Message sent by Brooks.
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I missed the game. Why did he sit him out? Literally the whole 4th?
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Westbrook turned the ball over at the end of 3rd qtr. Brooks got on Westbrook for not passing and Russ went off on Brooks for a couple of minutes on the bench. Russ just kept barking at him from the bench. Mo Cheeks went over to chill Russ out and that had little effect. Never seen Russ so mad. Brooks wasn't taking any #### though and just left him on the bench. I think he earned a lot of respect from the rest of the team. Brooks let everyone know that this was his team and he is the boss. Brooks is a big time coach imo.
 
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'oukurt said:
Westbrook turned the ball over at the end of 3rd qtr. Brooks got on Westbrook for not passing and Russ went off on Brooks for a couple of minutes on the bench. Russ just kept barking at him from the bench. Mo Cheeks went over to chill Russ out and that had little effect. Never seen Russ so mad. Brooks wasn't taking any #### though and just left him on the bench. I think he earned a lot of respect from the rest of the team. Brooks let everyone know that this was his team and he is the boss. Brooks is a big time coach imo.
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Yeah, and the announcers didn't even mention this aspect. Kept acting like it was only due to the bench's good play that Westbrook was on the bench. Mark Jackson is a terrible color guy. Huge respect to Brooks for pulling that move, especially considering the criticism he would've gotten if OKC had lost. Cajones.
 
'encaitar said:
'oukurt said:
Westbrook turned the ball over at the end of 3rd qtr. Brooks got on Westbrook for not passing and Russ went off on Brooks for a couple of minutes on the bench. Russ just kept barking at him from the bench. Mo Cheeks went over to chill Russ out and that had little effect. Never seen Russ so mad. Brooks wasn't taking any #### though and just left him on the bench. I think he earned a lot of respect from the rest of the team. Brooks let everyone know that this was his team and he is the boss. Brooks is a big time coach imo.
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Yeah, and the announcers didn't even mention this aspect. Kept acting like it was only due to the bench's good play that Westbrook was on the bench. Mark Jackson is a terrible color guy. Huge respect to Brooks for pulling that move, especially considering the criticism he would've gotten if OKC had lost. Cajones.
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Storms knocked out the game here so I am going to have to watch the replay in a couple of hours. I can't wait to hear what the announcers say. I can't believe Mark Jackson couldn't figure out what was going on. From what I am hearing on the radio Mo Cheeks did a hell of a job squashing what could have erupted into an ugly scene because from what I am hearing Westbrook was firing some verbal salvos Brooks way. Brooks a very cool customer for the composure he showed by ignoring Westbrook.
 
'drummer said:
I can't stand Mark Jackson anymore. He's horrid. :mute:.

Gotta find an audio stream somewhere.
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Anymore?Dr. Jack and whoever the play by play guy on ESPN radio are horrible. They'll ramble on about some topic while actual plays are going on. You're lucky if they let you know if someone scores every three possessions or so. Then Dr. Jack will start screaming for no reason.

BBall announcing is not exactly in a golden age right now.

 
'cvnpoka said:
'Gr00vus said:
'Bobcat10 said:
I'm not sure about the amnesty rule rumors either...but if that doesn't happen Baron isn't going anywhere for a year and a half.
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So Davis would ride the pine? That seems less than ideal from a team chemistry perspective.
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no, sessions will ride the pine. the cavs like davis as a "true point" and a "floor general" and they want him to mentor kyrie.
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Yes, I figured Sessions either gets benched or dealt. You still have to deal with Davis, and I don't think you really want him mentoring Irving, unless the topic is how many twinkies you can consume in an offseason and still get paid. I don't see Davis being the model citizen if he loses minutes either.
 
Collison was great tonight. He even gave Dirk some problems when he covered him. Harden was money too.

The ebb and flow of an NBA playoff series between relatively evenly matched teams is a thing of beauty to watch. Good adjustments by Brooks tonight, now its Carlisle's move. One thing the Thunder still aren't quite getting right is taking advantage of how often short guys are trying to cover Durant. I know it's not his number one option but he needs to take those guys into the low post before he gets the ball instead of catching at the perimeter and trying to drive on them.

Perkins still sucks, which makes me happy. He should get less minutes going forward.

 
'Gr00vus said:
'cvnpoka said:
'Gr00vus said:
'Bobcat10 said:
I'm not sure about the amnesty rule rumors either...but if that doesn't happen Baron isn't going anywhere for a year and a half.
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So Davis would ride the pine? That seems less than ideal from a team chemistry perspective.
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no, sessions will ride the pine. the cavs like davis as a "true point" and a "floor general" and they want him to mentor kyrie.
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Yes, I figured Sessions either gets benched or dealt. You still have to deal with Davis, and I don't think you really want him mentoring Irving, unless the topic is how many twinkies you can consume in an offseason and still get paid. I don't see Davis being the model citizen if he loses minutes either.
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Baron has been nothing but professional since he got to Cleveland, and the team played MUCH better when he was on the floor. For all the criticism he takes, he does understand how to initiate offense and pick his spots.
 
'cvnpoka said:
'Bobcat10 said:
'cvnpoka said:
'Bobcat10 said:
The Wolves are gonna shop the heck out of that pick around the league....but I don't think the Cavs are going to be able to wow them. Actually, the Wolves probably don't have to do much shopping at all, their phones gotta be ringing. The best shot the Cavs have is to get a 3rd team involved in some fashion. Cavs have assets and the willingness to take on an unreasonable contract.
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if the cavs want it they could get it for varejao+4th. thats way overpaying and i doubt cavs are that aggressive. maybe varejao alone, but i still think thats a bad deal for the cavs.

the only other potential asset the cavs have is jj hickson but minnesota (and utah) have no interest in another 4.

minnesota is gonna evaluate dwill as a true 4 and take kanter at 2. utah will look at their stockpile of 4s with millsap, al jeff, kirilenko and esp the young favors and take brandan knight.

dwill droppin to 4 for the cavs #believeland
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Why would Varejao alone for #2 be too much to give up for the Cavs when two posts above you said:"not any player currently on their team is capable of being a significant factor on a contender."

Now I know I'm nitpicking with your words...but I don't see why in the world the Cavs wouldn't ship out Andy for DWilliams if they could.

People are already saying having 1 and 4 speeds up the process by about 2 years and that's assuming DWill is gone at #2.
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haha, nice catch. i indeed misspoke, varejao is a legit player on a contender.anyway, if dwill and kanter are destined to go at 2 and 3, but the cavs could get dwill for av, then i grudgingly do it i think. but, the reason i dont do it right now in real life is bc there is a chance dwill or kanter fall to 4 and the cavs get all 3. also, varejao may (not saying its likely) fetch better value at the trade deadline.
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you say the Cavs need talent everywhere yet are willing to trade one of the few truly talented players they have? I like Williams but I'd rather stay at 4 than lose Andy.
 
'wadegarrett said:
'Abraham said:
Does anyone know anything about the Euros in this draft? It looks like there are 3 or 4 that could go top10 -all with various skil sets.
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Don't know much. Sure there will be plenty of info to come out in the next month.
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Came across this article that included some info on the Euros...

Cav’s Top 8 Possible Draft Duos

In the wake of Tuesday night’s Draft Lottery, the clear winner has to be the Cleveland Cavaliers. The team and their fans may have lucked into only having to endure one really torturous season of hoops. While this isn’t the best year talent wise for the Cavs to have seemingly cashed in on their post-LeBron karma in the Draft Lottery, with two picks in the top 4 it’s hard to complain.

Now the attention turns to what the franchise will actually do with their newfound wealth of picks. In theory, the Cavs should be able to obtain two franchise cornerstones, laying the foundation for the team’s rebuilding efforts. But which two players should they take? What two prospects go together like peanut butter and jelly in order to satisfy the fans’ appetite for Ws?

A conversation like this has to be framed by some parameters:

This whole discussion is based on the idea that the Cavs won’t trade one of the picks. They need an influx of young talent and projecting them to trade one of the picks falls into the category of rosterbation at this point; it’s just too hard and unlikely to project.

These rankings also operating under the assumption that Kyrie Irving and Derrick Williams are the two consensus top players, meaning neither one of them will fall to #4. Since it’s too tough to call who the third player taken before the #4 pick will be at this point, all other players are fair game.

I’m also assuming Dan Gilbert doesn’t go Caps Lock/Comic Sans crazy and off the wall with the picks. (Though, that would be awesome. “I WOULD PERSONALLY LIKE TO INTRODUCE YOUR NEWEST CAVS SUPERSTARS: JIMMER FERDETTE AND JOSH SELBY! 2012 TITLE HERE WE COME! I PERSONALLY GUARENTEE WE WILL HAVE MORE PLAYERS WITH FIRST NAMES STARTING WITH J THAN THE HEAT WILL NEXT SEASON!”)

So without further ado, the top 8 potential dynamic draft duos for the Cavs…

8. Irving - Tristan Thompson

If the Cavs are intent on pairing Irving with a big with college experience (which admittedly would be a weird thing to be intent about), Tristan Thompson makes the most sense. Thompson has a good combo of length and athleticism and displayed double-double and shot blocking potential against many top opponents in his one year at Texas. Having Irving getting him the ball in open spots would likely help his questionable jump shot come along. Then again, it’d be hard to sell Cavs fans on using the #4 pick on a guy who only put up 3 points, 6 rebounds, and 0 assists in his final college game (losing to Arizona in the NCAA Tourney), especially when more skilled foreigners are on the board.

7. Irving - Jonas Valanciunas

Over the past year Valanciunas has become the top European prospect in the eyes of some scouts with his combination of length, size and upside that makes an ideal center. Irving dumping it down to Jonas for the next decade could certainly be a good situation. However, the Lithuanian is not a perfect fit considering the Cavs already have Anderson Varejo entrenched at center. Valanciunas simply doesn’t have the same level of versatility to play both the 4 and the 5 that someone like Enes Kanter possesses (we’ll get to him shortly). This pairing would probably be best be viewed as a fallback option rather than the plan heading into the draft.

6. Irving - Kemba Walker

This option is also known as “The David Kahn Special.” All joking aside, this drafting of two PGs makes much more sense then the Rubio-Flynn debacle. Walker has shown a great ability to play off-ball making it possible for him to slide into a SG role. For much of UConn’s title run he spent more time coming off screens then running point and that seems to have worked out. Having Irving distributing the ball as the point guard, Walker could focus solely on scoring. There might not be a better situation to help Kemba reach his offensive potential.

As for the duo’s defensive, the two could switch roles allowing the smaller Walker to take PGs and not be incredibly overmatched trying to guard SGs. It’s not a perfect fit, and more than a little gamble, but it this scenario could lock up Cleveland’s two guard positions for years to come. Walker also measured 6'1 in shoes at the combine giving his stock a boost.

5. Irving - Jan Vesley

In an Eastern Conference that is increasingly becoming defined by defense (see: Bulls, Celtics, Heat), the Cavs might decide they need another stopper. In that case, getting Vesley to pair with Irving would make a lot of sense. The weaknesses of Vesley’s offensive game could no doubt be lessened by pairing him with a PG like Irving who can get him the ball in his spots. More importantly, opposing offenses wouldn’t be keen on having to go up against the size and toughness of Vesley at SF and Varejao (back from injury) at C. Granted, Vesely has a ways to go but shows potential as a defender with his great length. Those two could help the Cavs forge a hard-nosed identity going forward.

4. Irving - Kawhi Leonard

Leonard would give the Cavs a truly balanced player to run alongside Irving for the foreseeable future. Kawhi is one of those guys who does everything well, but doesn’t have a clear skill you can point to and say that is what makes him special. That means he could develop into a Gerald Wallace type, but he also could end more in the Tony Allen mold.

In many ways, this is the safest option available, which again says more about how the Cavs seem to have ended up with high picks in the wrong year than anything else. There’s a decent chance neither player becomes a star (let alone both of them), but they’re the most likely combo to at least be solid contributors for years to come.

3. Williams - Enes Kanter

If the Cavs aren’t desperate for a PG and think Baron Davis can handle the spot for the time being, a pairing of Williams and Kanter could really solidify their front line. Slotting these two into the lineup alongside Varejao would give the Cavs some much needed size, scoring, and rebounding. Williams’ outside game would help draw bigger defenders away from Kanter’s area in the paint, giving both space to operate their offensive games.

By not picking up a PG, the Cavs would put off the search for their next floor general until next year, when they might grab a prospect like Marquis Teague, Myck Kabongo or Maalik Wayns(because let’s be honest, we all expect the Cavs to be picking in the lottery again next year). It might also open up a world of trade opportunities if the Cavs are willing to part with J.J. Hickson.

2. Irving - Kanter

At first glance, this draft duo appears to be the best the Cavs could hope for from the 2011 Draft. Many talent evaluators consider Irving and Kanter to be the most well-rounded and polished PG and PF/C respectively. In theory, their skill sets should mesh together seamlessly with Irving dropping dimes to Kanter in the post, and the big guy returning the favor with some kick-outs for 3s.

However, there is a major hurdle with this pairing, namely that they haven’t played much competitive basketball over the past year. Irving spent most of the college hoops season injured and Kanter spent the whole season ineligible. Since their agents will likely pressure them to play as little as possible against other prospects in the pre-draft stage, these two have to be drafted in large part on what the Cavs knew about them an entire year ago.

Still, it would seem this is the best guard-forward combo available, except…

1. Williams - Brandon Knight

If the Cavs are seeking an explosive impact, the combination of Williams and Knight might be just right. Unlike the pair at #2 on this list, Williams and Knight were both beasts on the court for the entire college hoops season.

While Knight may not be the “pure” PG that Irving is, he displayed consistent scoring ability while still getting his team involved (17.3 ppg, 4.2 apg). He also showed a knack for the moment, hitting big shot after big shot to propel Kentucky to wins. Teaming him up with Williams would provide the Cavs with two terrific scoring options that both are well adept at getting to the free throw line. The tandem would also be quite the 1-2 punch in the fast break game.

There are also some risks associated with this pairing. Knight lacks the polish of Irving and Williams is somewhat of a SF/PF tweener. But the unrelenting energy they’d bring to the franchise and to the downtrodden Cavs fans would be undeniable.

It may be a bit of a gamble, but together this dynamic duo could rule the vacated throne in Cleveland.
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It actually occurred to me that Williams/Knight would be the way to go for Cleveland. UNless they are sure that Irving is the next Williams/Paul (i.e. a superstar in waiting) then I'd be more inclined to take two solid and productive guys like WIlliams and Knight.

 
If Williams goes 1, would the Jazz be willing to deal Harris and the 3 or the 3 and the 13 to move up one spot to get Irving? Would Minnesota be interested in sliding down and getting Kanter?

 
'Abraham said:
If Williams goes 1, would the Jazz be willing to deal Harris and the 3 or the 3 and the 13 to move up one spot to get Irving? Would Minnesota be interested in sliding down and getting Kanter?
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Doesn't Minn need a PG? Passing on Irving b/c of the Rubio/Flynn debacle would be like the Lions passing on Calvin b/c of BMW and Rogers.
 
'tommyGunZ said:
'Abraham said:
If Williams goes 1, would the Jazz be willing to deal Harris and the 3 or the 3 and the 13 to move up one spot to get Irving? Would Minnesota be interested in sliding down and getting Kanter?
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Doesn't Minn need a PG? Passing on Irving b/c of the Rubio/Flynn debacle would be like the Lions passing on Calvin b/c of BMW and Rogers.
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I didn't know if they were wanting a PG or if Kahn might hold on to hope that Rubio/Flynn worked out. They actually would be big winners for Irving to drop in to their laps. Then again, I could see him taking Kanter anyway and Irving dropping to 3. :shrug:ETA - the Rockets really don't have the roster space to add two first rounders. I really hope they can find a way to move up a bit. Then again, I'm not sure there is anyone so attractive outside the top4 that moving up would be truly worthwhile.
 
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'Captain Quinoa said:
'cvnpoka said:
haha, nice catch. i indeed misspoke, varejao is a legit player on a contender.

anyway, if dwill and kanter are destined to go at 2 and 3, but the cavs could get dwill for av, then i grudgingly do it i think. but, the reason i dont do it right now in real life is bc there is a chance dwill or kanter fall to 4 and the cavs get all 3. also, varejao may (not saying its likely) fetch better value at the trade deadline.
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you say the Cavs need talent everywhere yet are willing to trade one of the few truly talented players they have? I like Williams but I'd rather stay at 4 than lose Andy.
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i would too. i said as much, tho in a convoluted way.
 
Isn't it kind of a given that if Minnesota stays at 2 they have to take Knight (assuming Irving is gone) or some other PG? Perhaps they can find another foreign guy with no desire to play for them?

 
'Instinctive said:
Isn't it kind of a given that if Minnesota stays at 2 they have to take Knight (assuming Irving is gone) or some other PG? Perhaps they can find another foreign guy with no desire to play for them?
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Jonas Valanciunas would seem to be the best choice for a player that won't come over.
 
Anybody here willing to give up their top 10/20 guys in the draft based strictly on skill/potential (not need of team drafting in that slot). Just curious, have no obvious ulterior motives. :whistle:

 
Top 10? Let's see...

1. Lebron

2. Howard

3. Durant

4. Griffin

5. Paul

6. Deron Williams

7. Al Horford

8. Al Horford

9. Al Horford

10. Al Horford

EDIT: I assumed you meant rookies, but this is funnier for me.

 
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