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*NBA THREAD* Abe will be missed (5 Viewers)

The Nuggets have traded Nate Robinson to the Celtics for Jameer Nelson. Not sure why this trade happened. Doesn't help either team.

 
Hawks continue the winning in Philly. Coach Bud going full on Pop resting 3 starters plus Antic. @Bos tomorrow night and then a back to back in Toronto and Chicago.

 
This is Hassan Whiteside's first mention in this thread since Dec 19, 2011
He's been double-digit points in his last 4 games and gone 26 of 34. He's also averaging 10 rebounds and 3 blocks during that span, in just over 20 minutes per game. A flash-in-the-pan or maybe Chris Andersen has showed him something about efficiency and playing without the ball.

 
This is Hassan Whiteside's first mention in this thread since Dec 19, 2011
He's been double-digit points in his last 4 games and gone 26 of 34. He's also averaging 10 rebounds and 3 blocks during that span, in just over 20 minutes per game. A flash-in-the-pan or maybe Chris Andersen has showed him something about efficiency and playing without the ball.
He's always had a lot of talent. The Kings drafted him and gave him a lot of rope but he was way too much of a knucklehead to make it in the league at the time. Glad he seems to have gotten his act together.

 
The Warriors have 16 points in the first 3:00 of the 3rd Q. They are unreal.

ETA: 23 in less than 5 now.

 
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are there a lot of ties between atl and san antonio i thought i heard that anyone who can fill me in that would be appreciated take that to the bank

 
This is Hassan Whiteside's first mention in this thread since Dec 19, 2011
He's been double-digit points in his last 4 games and gone 26 of 34. He's also averaging 10 rebounds and 3 blocks during that span, in just over 20 minutes per game. A flash-in-the-pan or maybe Chris Andersen has showed him something about efficiency and playing without the ball.
You mean Hassan Wilt-side, right?

 
Kev4029 said:
The Nuggets have traded Nate Robinson to the Celtics for Jameer Nelson. Not sure why this trade happened. Doesn't help either team.
Nelson has a player option next year. Robinson is a free agent. Celtics are going to buy out Robinson so they get cap relief next year and some cash savings this year.

Denver gets a better player that maybe they think can help them :shrug:

 
Kev4029 said:
The Nuggets have traded Nate Robinson to the Celtics for Jameer Nelson. Not sure why this trade happened. Doesn't help either team.
Nelson has a player option next year. Robinson is a free agent. Celtics are going to buy out Robinson so they get cap relief next year and some cash savings this year.

Denver gets a better player that maybe they think can help them :shrug:
I'd take Nate over Jameer any day.

 
This is Hassan Whiteside's first mention in this thread since Dec 19, 2011
He's been double-digit points in his last 4 games and gone 26 of 34. He's also averaging 10 rebounds and 3 blocks during that span, in just over 20 minutes per game. A flash-in-the-pan or maybe Chris Andersen has showed him something about efficiency and playing without the ball.
He's always had a lot of talent. The Kings drafted him and gave him a lot of rope but he was way too much of a knucklehead to make it in the league at the time. Glad he seems to have gotten his act together.
In the first half, 11 points on 5-5, with 4 rebounds and 3 blocks in just 11 minutes. There's not too much for Heat fans to get excited about until 2016.

 
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Kev4029 said:
The Nuggets have traded Nate Robinson to the Celtics for Jameer Nelson. Not sure why this trade happened. Doesn't help either team.
Nelson has a player option next year. Robinson is a free agent.Celtics are going to buy out Robinson so they get cap relief next year and some cash savings this year.

Denver gets a better player that maybe they think can help them :shrug:
I don't think Nelson is the better player anymore, but that is really besides the point. They took on additional salary this year (doesn't matter because they are well over the cap and under the tax) and next year (ultimately, even if they dump some salary before the trade deadline, they'll probably be capped out next year as well), while apparently trying to improve their team. Improving from the 10th worst team to the 12th worst team does nothing other than give them a worse pick in the draft this year, and if they some how could make the playoffs, it lowers both their pick and possibly the OKC pick they just acquired.

The Nuggets should be selling right now, firing their coach, or both. Its clear that the personnel doesn't fit what Shaw wants to do, even if the majority of this roster was successful a couple years ago and they are still in their prime. If they want to keep Shaw, they need to trade away anything that won't help them build from the ground up (Chandler, Afflalo, Foye, Hickson) or doesn't fit what Shaw wants to do defensively (Faried and maybe Lawson). They should be looking at trades to get younger, cheaper and to acquire as many picks and prospects as possible. Instead, it seems they are trying to limp to 45 wins and hope the Suns, Thunder and Pelicans all slip. Dumb.

 
are there a lot of ties between atl and san antonio i thought i heard that anyone who can fill me in that would be appreciated take that to the bank
I don't know if this is schtick, but Atl's head coach was an assistant in SA for 17 years before his current gig.

 
Here are some Abe-ish trades:

Denver trades Lawson and Foye to Houston for 2 1st round picks (Houston this year and NO's first rounder), Jason Terry, Clint Capela, Terrence Jones/Donuts and cap filler (the Greek dude, Brewer, or both Canaan and Shved).

Foye is an upgrade over Terry and can defend SGs a bit. Lawson is a huge upgrade at PG offensively over Beverly but the Rockets could still use Beverly if they need defense. Having a legit PG who is both comfortable off ball and with the ball could send Houston over the top.

Denver trades Afflalo to LAC Gee to Chicago, LAC trades Bullock and a 2019 first rounder to Denver and Crawford to Chicago, Chicago sends Snell and filler (Mohammad, Barstow, Moore) to Denver.

The Clippers get a SG/SF that can actually play alongside Redick and Paul, the Bulls get somebody that can actually score for their second unit (Crawford) and a wing defender that can play a bit (Gee). The Clippers could also dump a couple contracts on the Nuggets to help them dip below the tax.

Denver trades Chandler to Detroit for KCP, Joel Anthony (or Anthony Tolliver).

Chandler fits what Detroit is trying to do, he can hit open threes and defend. KCP has been a disappointment to this point of his career, but he has shown flashes of being a good player.

Denver sends Gallinari to Charlotte for Henderson (or Marvin Williams) and Vonleh.

This would depend on Gallinari playing well in the next month, but it would give Charlotte a SF who can shoot and play the 4.

 
Not that I'd be opposed to Lawson, and would eagerly ship out the picks you mentioned to make that happen. But Terry, Donuts, and "the greek dude" are all playing at least 20mpg. Brewer has been a welcome addition too to keep Ariza's minutes from being so high. The rotation seems to be working out reasonably well at the moment.

 
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Here are some Abe-ish trades:

Denver trades Lawson and Foye to Houston for 2 1st round picks (Houston this year and NO's first rounder), Jason Terry, Clint Capela, Terrence Jones/Donuts and cap filler (the Greek dude, Brewer, or both Canaan and Shved).

Foye is an upgrade over Terry and can defend SGs a bit. Lawson is a huge upgrade at PG offensively over Beverly but the Rockets could still use Beverly if they need defense. Having a legit PG who is both comfortable off ball and with the ball could send Houston over the top.

Denver trades Afflalo to LAC Gee to Chicago, LAC trades Bullock and a 2019 first rounder to Denver and Crawford to Chicago, Chicago sends Snell and filler (Mohammad, Barstow, Moore) to Denver.

The Clippers get a SG/SF that can actually play alongside Redick and Paul, the Bulls get somebody that can actually score for their second unit (Crawford) and a wing defender that can play a bit (Gee). The Clippers could also dump a couple contracts on the Nuggets to help them dip below the tax.

Denver trades Chandler to Detroit for KCP, Joel Anthony (or Anthony Tolliver).

Chandler fits what Detroit is trying to do, he can hit open threes and defend. KCP has been a disappointment to this point of his career, but he has shown flashes of being a good player.

Denver sends Gallinari to Charlotte for Henderson (or Marvin Williams) and Vonleh.

This would depend on Gallinari playing well in the next month, but it would give Charlotte a SF who can shoot and play the 4.
Denver sends Chandler to Toronto for Landry Fields and 2 2nd rounds picks.

ETA: And if McGee gets healthy:

Chandler/McGee for Fields/Hans Bro/Hayes/2 2nds.

Saves Denver $19M next season and they get a few picks.

 
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Chandler/McGee for Fields/Hans Bro/Hayes/2 2nds.

Saves Denver $19M next season and they get a few picks.
I would do that if I were the Nuggets. The Raptors would probably want to include a little more salary to stay below the tax. Maybe substitute Nogueira for the picks. That would keep them something like $30k below the tax. Between that move and whatever happens to Afflalo (whether he's traded or not, he isn't a Nugget next season), they'll have a fair amount of cap space. Using that money on a free agent this offseason wouldn't be wise, but they could parlay that cap space into a pick from somebody like LAC (Hawes/Crawford/Barnes), NY (Calderon), Brooklyn (JJ/Williams/Jack) or GS (Lee/Iggy) that might be looking to dump some salary to make a move in free agency.

 
Not that I'd be opposed to Lawson, and would eagerly ship out the picks you mentioned to make that happen. But Terry, Donuts, and "the greek dude" are all playing at least 20mpg. Brewer has been a welcome addition too to keep Ariza's minutes from being so high. The rotation seems to be working out reasonably well at the moment.
Foye and Lawson would average probably 50 mpg between the two of them. Terry, Jones (rather than Donuts), Papanikolaou, Shved and Capela would probably average about the same amount of total minutes if the team was healthy. Beverly would probably lose a few minutes in the deal, but I think the added talent would more than offset that. They could probably bring in a third team to send Houston a cheap decent SF for a 2nd rounder from Denver.

 
When Blatt gets fired here in the next month or so, who do the hire? I would assume they would go after a veteran player friendly NBA coach. Jeff Van Gundy? George Karl?

 
Chandler/McGee for Fields/Hans Bro/Hayes/2 2nds.

Saves Denver $19M next season and they get a few picks.
I would do that if I were the Nuggets. The Raptors would probably want to include a little more salary to stay below the tax. Maybe substitute Nogueira for the picks. That would keep them something like $30k below the tax. Between that move and whatever happens to Afflalo (whether he's traded or not, he isn't a Nugget next season), they'll have a fair amount of cap space. Using that money on a free agent this offseason wouldn't be wise, but they could parlay that cap space into a pick from somebody like LAC (Hawes/Crawford/Barnes), NY (Calderon), Brooklyn (JJ/Williams/Jack) or GS (Lee/Iggy) that might be looking to dump some salary to make a move in free agency.
I hope they don't sign anyone and are spectacularly terrible next year :thumbup:

 
are there a lot of ties between atl and san antonio i thought i heard that anyone who can fill me in that would be appreciated take that to the bank
I don't know if this is schtick, but Atl's head coach was an assistant in SA for 17 years before his current gig.
no it is not i know that but i was wondering if the x and o guys could say is atl was running sets similar to what san antonio uses i am a big believer that to much of the nba teams use isolation stuff and try to rely on single guys athletic ability and that the spurs use a team game opposite to that and with the big hawk turnaround i was wondering if they were playing a lot of the san antonio style of team ball i do not get to see them play that it is take that to the bank thanks brohan

 
are there a lot of ties between atl and san antonio i thought i heard that anyone who can fill me in that would be appreciated take that to the bank
I don't know if this is schtick, but Atl's head coach was an assistant in SA for 17 years before his current gig.
no it is not i know that but i was wondering if the x and o guys could say is atl was running sets similar to what san antonio uses i am a big believer that to much of the nba teams use isolation stuff and try to rely on single guys athletic ability and that the spurs use a team game opposite to that and with the big hawk turnaround i was wondering if they were playing a lot of the san antonio style of team ball i do not get to see them play that it is take that to the bank thanks brohan
Think last I checked they were 3rd in the league in assists and 1st in the league in 3-pt shot assists. It's very similar. Lots of movement and passing and lots of 3-pt shooting. It's entertaining as hell to watch. I loathe watching a team take 5-7 seconds dribbling and then dumping it in the post for a player to make a post move. It's horrible to watch and not that effective. There's not a superstar/ego on the Hawks so there's nobody getting pissed that they aren't getting shots. Horford is just happy to be playing for a winner and I'm sure all the other guys are too to some degree

Defense may be their liability but they've been really good there too on this long run they've been on. As Lowe likes to mention on ESPN, we don't really have a rim-protector other than Horford and he's not fantastic at it. They try to make up for it by playing smart and big-time help D. Carroll is probably our best man defender but he can only really defend the 2/3. Teague is pretty decent and gets steals (as does Millsap) but neither are elite one-on-one defenders.

 
Another Abe-ing.....

Denver trades Arthur and Afflalo, OKC trades Perkins, Jones and Jackson.

For Denver, this gives them a big point guard who can defend through screens and can play alongside Lawson as well. This would also give them the opportunity to trade Lawson and acquire some big time assets, while taking a shot at what could be their point guard for the next half decade. Jones hasn't done much in his career, but he would get a chance to showcase his skills (or lack thereof) with the rebuilding Nuggets. For OKC they get the 4th banana they really want in the starting lineup. Afflalo will happily play behind Westbrook and Durant, hit plenty of jumpers, defend a bit, and can be a third creator when called on. Arthur is an excellent defender and can hit open jump shots. He isn't efficient, but he demands at least a little attention from the elbows and his defensive metrics are outstanding. Including Jones in the trade gets OKC under the tax, which in a different trade may cost them a 2nd round pick or two.

 
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As much as I've want to believe the Hawks are legitimate title contenders I can't bring myself to truly believe it - probably unless/until they win something significant in the playoffs (get to a conference finals and we'll talk). Having said that I'm curious what others think and how they would improve the Hawks. I'm not good playing feaux GM so I have no clue what I would do. My gut tells me 1. don't mess with a good thing. most of what they are doing is based on chemistry and team play so why screw around with something working so well. but also tells me 2. they aren't quite good enough to beat the Bulls/Raptors/Wiz in a series and then GS/Portland/Memphis in a series. The only piece on the team I don't like is Mack - never liked him and I think Coach Bud feels the same way as he's had a lot of DNP - Coaches Decision over the last 2 months.

So, what would you do - ride the season out and see what happens or try to make a trade to (in theory) improve your odds of winning this year?

 
As much as I've want to believe the Hawks are legitimate title contenders I can't bring myself to truly believe it - probably unless/until they win something significant in the playoffs (get to a conference finals and we'll talk). Having said that I'm curious what others think and how they would improve the Hawks. I'm not good playing feaux GM so I have no clue what I would do. My gut tells me 1. don't mess with a good thing. most of what they are doing is based on chemistry and team play so why screw around with something working so well. but also tells me 2. they aren't quite good enough to beat the Bulls/Raptors/Wiz in a series and then GS/Portland/Memphis in a series. The only piece on the team I don't like is Mack - never liked him and I think Coach Bud feels the same way as he's had a lot of DNP - Coaches Decision over the last 2 months.

So, what would you do - ride the season out and see what happens or try to make a trade to (in theory) improve your odds of winning this year?
Like all teams trying to win, they should remain engaged with other teams and look for ways to improve. However, I don't think they should feel like they "need" to do anything. In my opinion, this stretch of good play have legitimately made them the team to beat in the East.

 
As much as I've want to believe the Hawks are legitimate title contenders I can't bring myself to truly believe it - probably unless/until they win something significant in the playoffs (get to a conference finals and we'll talk). Having said that I'm curious what others think and how they would improve the Hawks. I'm not good playing feaux GM so I have no clue what I would do. My gut tells me 1. don't mess with a good thing. most of what they are doing is based on chemistry and team play so why screw around with something working so well. but also tells me 2. they aren't quite good enough to beat the Bulls/Raptors/Wiz in a series and then GS/Portland/Memphis in a series. The only piece on the team I don't like is Mack - never liked him and I think Coach Bud feels the same way as he's had a lot of DNP - Coaches Decision over the last 2 months.

So, what would you do - ride the season out and see what happens or try to make a trade to (in theory) improve your odds of winning this year?
Like all teams trying to win, they should remain engaged with other teams and look for ways to improve. However, I don't think they should feel like they "need" to do anything. In my opinion, this stretch of good play have legitimately made them the team to beat in the East.
That's my take too - I was listening to one of the Bill Simmons basketball podcasts and they brought it up just briefly. I can't imagine them changing anything but I'm also a blind homer who doesn't follow the league enough to know what would be possible for them to do. I could suggest they trade Brand and Mack for something good but I like Abe and don't want to sound mocking.

 
As much as I've want to believe the Hawks are legitimate title contenders I can't bring myself to truly believe it - probably unless/until they win something significant in the playoffs (get to a conference finals and we'll talk). Having said that I'm curious what others think and how they would improve the Hawks. I'm not good playing feaux GM so I have no clue what I would do. My gut tells me 1. don't mess with a good thing. most of what they are doing is based on chemistry and team play so why screw around with something working so well. but also tells me 2. they aren't quite good enough to beat the Bulls/Raptors/Wiz in a series and then GS/Portland/Memphis in a series. The only piece on the team I don't like is Mack - never liked him and I think Coach Bud feels the same way as he's had a lot of DNP - Coaches Decision over the last 2 months.

So, what would you do - ride the season out and see what happens or try to make a trade to (in theory) improve your odds of winning this year?
Unless they can somehow score a top flight SF, they shouldn't mess with the big pieces. The could look for a replacement for Mack and Bazemore's minutes (and limit Thabo's as well). Maybe somebody that would come relatively cheap like Jared Dudley.

 
Did we talk about Mo Williams and his 52 points? That's gotta rank pretty highly as far as unlikely 50 point games.
Yep, maybe 3rd behind Willie Burton and Tony Delk.
No love for T Ross?
Didn't Tracy Murray put up half a bill one time as well? Or was that Don McLean? I always mix up the two.
Yep. Corey Brewer, Andre Miller and Cedric Ceballos would also be more :shock: compared to Mo Williams IMO.

 
Denver trades Chandler to Detroit for KCP, Joel Anthony (or Anthony Tolliver).

Chandler fits what Detroit is trying to do, he can hit open threes and defend. KCP has been a disappointment to this point of his career, but he has shown flashes of being a good player.
Chandler's a personal favorite of mine since he's from my area, and SF is by far the Pistons' biggest need since they're starting Kyle Singler :X . This deal would certainly make Detroit a better team tomorrow.

On the other hand, despite their recent run it's not like the Pistons are one player away. They have 4 players on the roster who matter - Drummond (21), Monroe (24), Jennings (25) and KCP (21). Everyone else is an expendable role player. And Monroe could be gone after the year. So they need to be looking long-term.

KCP is already a decent defender. His offense needs a lot of work but he's got time to get there. SVG seems to like him so I think he stays.

 
Did we talk about Mo Williams and his 52 points? That's gotta rank pretty highly as far as unlikely 50 point games.
Yep, maybe 3rd behind Willie Burton and Tony Delk.
No love for T Ross?
Didn't Tracy Murray put up half a bill one time as well? Or was that Don McLean? I always mix up the two.
It was Murray. Hung 50 on a terrible Warriors team a couple months after the Sprewell/Carlisemo choking incident.

ETA: I did have to look it up to make sure it wasn't MacLean. I was like, "Which 1990s UCLA chucker was it?"

 
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Did we talk about Mo Williams and his 52 points? That's gotta rank pretty highly as far as unlikely 50 point games.
Yep, maybe 3rd behind Willie Burton and Tony Delk.
No love for T Ross?
Didn't Tracy Murray put up half a bill one time as well? Or was that Don McLean? I always mix up the two.
Yep. Corey Brewer, Andre Miller and Cedric Ceballos would also be more :shock: compared to Mo Williams IMO.
Crazier 50-point game anomaly: Mo Williams putting up a 50-point game once, or Jamal Crawford scoring 50 in a game twice?

 

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