No more moral high ground (1 Viewer)

[Sheriff66]

Pats article

I love this article, it's so true...

 

[Jason Wood]

I keep hearing this and yet, it makes no sense to me. When did the Patriots claim the moral high ground?

They brought in Corey Dillon, Rodney Harrison and Bryan Cox who all served as key cogs in championship runs.

 

[David Yudkin]

My question is, when were football players supposed to go to finishing school? Isn't the object to win? I guess all Patriot players needed to go to Ivy League schools and wear navy blazers, corduroy pants, pressed white shirts, and bow ties.

Why should 31 other teams get to field ne'er-do-wells, hooligans, and miscreants but the Pats have to roster only guys that are Eagle Scouts that got merit badges for helping eldery women across the street?

 

[massraider]

I keep hearing this and yet, it makes no sense to me. When did the Patriots claim the moral high ground?They brought in Corey Dillon, Rodney Harrison and Bryan Cox who all served as key cogs in championship runs.

They didn't claim it, some of their fans did for them. Talk radio hosts did. TV sports guys did.Eh, all I really want to say about this. This has already been dicussed, and can go nowhere interesting.

 

[QUEZILLA]

Beli sold his soul when Mangini went to the Jets.

 

[Jason Wood]

Beli sold his soul when Mangini went to the Jets.

Riiiiiiiight...his soul was intact as he drove his marriage to divorce through obsessing over his job, but signing Randy Moss signals the end of his morality. GB NFL Fandom

 

[Bri]

Beli sold his soul when Mangini went to the Jets.

Riiiiiiiight...his soul was intact as he drove his marriage to divorce through obsessing over his job, but signing Randy Moss signals the end of his morality. GB NFL Fandom

 

[QUEZILLA]

Beli sold his soul when Mangini went to the Jets.

Should have put

 

[ConstruxBoy]

I keep hearing this and yet, it makes no sense to me. When did the Patriots claim the moral high ground?They brought in Corey Dillon, Rodney Harrison and Bryan Cox who all served as key cogs in championship runs.

They didn't claim it, some of their fans did for them. Talk radio hosts did. TV sports guys did.Eh, all I really want to say about this. This has already been dicussed, and can go nowhere interesting.

See: King, Peter - Multiple columns

 

[djcolts]

The column wasn't much to ride home about. NFL Media types run stories into the ground, and Moss and the Pats look to be the story of the 2007 pre-season (at the very least) - so many positive and not-as-positive stuff about Moss and the Patriots will be written and it will all blend together eventually.

 

[softball]

Beli sold his soul when Mangini went to the Jets.

Riiiiiiiight...his soul was intact as he drove his marriage to divorce through obsessing over his job, but signing Randy Moss signals the end of his morality. GB NFL Fandom

He was NOT obsessing over his job Jason...

 

[Jason Wood]

Beli sold his soul when Mangini went to the Jets.

Riiiiiiiight...his soul was intact as he drove his marriage to divorce through obsessing over his job, but signing Randy Moss signals the end of his morality. GB NFL Fandom

He was NOT obsessing over his job Jason...

 

[Sheriff66]

This is the part I like the most...

"I'm not mad that they did this," the former Patriots player said. "I'm mad that for all these years, when everyone wrote that their values were different, they ate it up. They're no different than anyone else, and they never were. We had a run, and the rest is just propaganda."I bought into all that stuff about the 'Patriot Way,' and then when I went to [a new team], I was blown away by how loudly guys outside of the organization shot it down. They'd say, 'You guys don't do s--- different -- you've just got Tom Brady.' I argued with them at first, but looking back, there was no lower percentage of jackasses there than on any other team. Some of the guys they drafted, even in early rounds, were selfish and unreliable and horrible to have around."

 

[massraider]

Beli sold his soul when Mangini went to the Jets.

Riiiiiiiight...his soul was intact as he drove his marriage to divorce through obsessing over his job, but signing Randy Moss signals the end of his morality. GB NFL Fandom

He was NOT obsessing over his job Jason...

Not unless "obsessing over his job" is slang for "another woman".

 

[nightmare]

Maine native here,

Got absolutely no clue about "moral high ground" in regards to the Pats.

We've signed our share of "trouble makers" and they've never

raised much (any?)of a stink while in NE.

Another non story in a slow NFL news cycle.

 

[David Yudkin]

Beli sold his soul when Mangini went to the Jets.

Riiiiiiiight...his soul was intact as he drove his marriage to divorce through obsessing over his job, but signing Randy Moss signals the end of his morality. GB NFL Fandom

He was NOT obsessing over his job Jason...

Belichick named ‘Other Man’ in nasty N.J. divorce

 

[Workhorse]

This is the part I like the most...

"I'm not mad that they did this," the former Patriots player said. "I'm mad that for all these years, when everyone wrote that their values were different, they ate it up. They're no different than anyone else, and they never were. We had a run, and the rest is just propaganda."I bought into all that stuff about the 'Patriot Way,' and then when I went to [a new team], I was blown away by how loudly guys outside of the organization shot it down. They'd say, 'You guys don't do s--- different -- you've just got Tom Brady.' I argued with them at first, but looking back, there was no lower percentage of jackasses there than on any other team. Some of the guys they drafted, even in early rounds, were selfish and unreliable and horrible to have around."

I particularly like how the former Patriots player chose to remain anonymous. That shows a lot of courage.

 

[massraider]

This is the part I like the most...

"I'm not mad that they did this," the former Patriots player said. "I'm mad that for all these years, when everyone wrote that their values were different, they ate it up. They're no different than anyone else, and they never were. We had a run, and the rest is just propaganda."I bought into all that stuff about the 'Patriot Way,' and then when I went to [a new team], I was blown away by how loudly guys outside of the organization shot it down. They'd say, 'You guys don't do s--- different -- you've just got Tom Brady.' I argued with them at first, but looking back, there was no lower percentage of jackasses there than on any other team. Some of the guys they drafted, even in early rounds, were selfish and unreliable and horrible to have around."

I particularly like how the former Patriots player chose to remain anonymous. That shows a lot of courage.

Gutless weasel. Typical Patriot.

 

[Sheriff66]

This is the part I like the most...

"I'm not mad that they did this," the former Patriots player said. "I'm mad that for all these years, when everyone wrote that their values were different, they ate it up. They're no different than anyone else, and they never were. We had a run, and the rest is just propaganda."I bought into all that stuff about the 'Patriot Way,' and then when I went to [a new team], I was blown away by how loudly guys outside of the organization shot it down. They'd say, 'You guys don't do s--- different -- you've just got Tom Brady.' I argued with them at first, but looking back, there was no lower percentage of jackasses there than on any other team. Some of the guys they drafted, even in early rounds, were selfish and unreliable and horrible to have around."

I particularly like how the former Patriots player chose to remain anonymous. That shows a lot of courage.

Gutless weasel. Typical Patriot.

 

[Colin Dowling]

I think the Patriots play excellent football, make good personel decisions, and generally are well prepared to execute a winning game plan.

But at no time have I ever thought they had the moral high-ground. They are a football team of lots of different people with lots of different personalities.

 

[Iron_Far]

Couldn't BB have done better than this Shenocca chick?

http://sportsbybrooks.com/bill-belichick-c...-year-12186.php

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Couldn't BB have done better than this Shenocca chick?

http://sportsbybrooks.com/bill-belichick-c...-year-12186.php

Is she on the left or the right?

 

[ConstruxBoy]

This is the part I like the most...

"I'm not mad that they did this," the former Patriots player said. "I'm mad that for all these years, when everyone wrote that their values were different, they ate it up. They're no different than anyone else, and they never were. We had a run, and the rest is just propaganda."I bought into all that stuff about the 'Patriot Way,' and then when I went to [a new team], I was blown away by how loudly guys outside of the organization shot it down. They'd say, 'You guys don't do s--- different -- you've just got Tom Brady.' I argued with them at first, but looking back, there was no lower percentage of jackasses there than on any other team. Some of the guys they drafted, even in early rounds, were selfish and unreliable and horrible to have around."

I particularly like how the former Patriots player chose to remain anonymous. That shows a lot of courage.

Gutless weasel. Typical Patriot.

 

[PatsFanCT]

This is the part I like the most...

"I'm not mad that they did this," the former Patriots player said. "I'm mad that for all these years, when everyone wrote that their values were different, they ate it up. They're no different than anyone else, and they never were. We had a run, and the rest is just propaganda."I bought into all that stuff about the 'Patriot Way,' and then when I went to [a new team], I was blown away by how loudly guys outside of the organization shot it down. They'd say, 'You guys don't do s--- different -- you've just got Tom Brady.' I argued with them at first, but looking back, there was no lower percentage of jackasses there than on any other team. Some of the guys they drafted, even in early rounds, were selfish and unreliable and horrible to have around."

I don't know, I kinda like this...

This is not to say that the New England roster isn't full of high-character guys. In terms of commitment to the team concept and love of the game, it doesn't get much better than Brady, Tedy Bruschi, Rodney Harrison, Richard Seymour, Matt Light, Troy Brown, Larry Izzo and a few other veterans. After several unhappy seasons in Cincinnati, halfback Corey Dillon was able to join the Patriots in 2004 and thrive without incident -- the theory being that these leaders were able to keep him in line."I've seen guys come in from other places and fall right in line, and the guys who didn't, they got rid of immediately," said Browns linebacker Willie McGinest, who, until his release following the 2005 season, was probably the strongest presence in the Patriots' locker room. "You can go all the way back to Terry Glenn, and then look at guys like Duane Starks and Tyrone Poole -- if you weren't with the program, you were gone. Meanwhile, people said Corey Dillon was troubled when they got him, and how many problems did he have there? The one thing he wanted in life was a ring, and he knew he had to do it their way to get it."This is why, in McGinest's view, the Moss deal was a smart gamble for the organization. "You've got leaders on the field," he said Tuesday from the office of his L.A.-based record company, 55 Entertainment, "and that's the main thing. With Randy, people in there will be able to say to him, 'Listen -- if you want to win, you have to do X, Y and Z.' How many guys has he been around in the past who could say that to him with any authority? These are the types of players he's been losing to all these years and watching win Super Bowls, so he has to listen.

 

[Sheriff66]

This is the part I like the most...

"I'm not mad that they did this," the former Patriots player said. "I'm mad that for all these years, when everyone wrote that their values were different, they ate it up. They're no different than anyone else, and they never were. We had a run, and the rest is just propaganda."I bought into all that stuff about the 'Patriot Way,' and then when I went to [a new team], I was blown away by how loudly guys outside of the organization shot it down. They'd say, 'You guys don't do s--- different -- you've just got Tom Brady.' I argued with them at first, but looking back, there was no lower percentage of jackasses there than on any other team. Some of the guys they drafted, even in early rounds, were selfish and unreliable and horrible to have around."

I don't know, I kinda like this...

This is not to say that the New England roster isn't full of high-character guys. In terms of commitment to the team concept and love of the game, it doesn't get much better than Brady, Tedy Bruschi, Rodney Harrison, Richard Seymour, Matt Light, Troy Brown, Larry Izzo and a few other veterans. After several unhappy seasons in Cincinnati, halfback Corey Dillon was able to join the Patriots in 2004 and thrive without incident -- the theory being that these leaders were able to keep him in line."I've seen guys come in from other places and fall right in line, and the guys who didn't, they got rid of immediately," said Browns linebacker Willie McGinest, who, until his release following the 2005 season, was probably the strongest presence in the Patriots' locker room. "You can go all the way back to Terry Glenn, and then look at guys like Duane Starks and Tyrone Poole -- if you weren't with the program, you were gone. Meanwhile, people said Corey Dillon was troubled when they got him, and how many problems did he have there? The one thing he wanted in life was a ring, and he knew he had to do it their way to get it."This is why, in McGinest's view, the Moss deal was a smart gamble for the organization. "You've got leaders on the field," he said Tuesday from the office of his L.A.-based record company, 55 Entertainment, "and that's the main thing. With Randy, people in there will be able to say to him, 'Listen -- if you want to win, you have to do X, Y and Z.' How many guys has he been around in the past who could say that to him with any authority? These are the types of players he's been losing to all these years and watching win Super Bowls, so he has to listen.

This is better than both....

Don't you think it's time we remove the 'Winning With Class' emblem from the Patriots' coat of arms and replace it with another motto? 'Winning With An ###' is more like it.

 

[PatsFanCT]

This is the part I like the most...

"I'm not mad that they did this," the former Patriots player said. "I'm mad that for all these years, when everyone wrote that their values were different, they ate it up. They're no different than anyone else, and they never were. We had a run, and the rest is just propaganda."I bought into all that stuff about the 'Patriot Way,' and then when I went to [a new team], I was blown away by how loudly guys outside of the organization shot it down. They'd say, 'You guys don't do s--- different -- you've just got Tom Brady.' I argued with them at first, but looking back, there was no lower percentage of jackasses there than on any other team. Some of the guys they drafted, even in early rounds, were selfish and unreliable and horrible to have around."

I don't know, I kinda like this...

This is not to say that the New England roster isn't full of high-character guys. In terms of commitment to the team concept and love of the game, it doesn't get much better than Brady, Tedy Bruschi, Rodney Harrison, Richard Seymour, Matt Light, Troy Brown, Larry Izzo and a few other veterans. After several unhappy seasons in Cincinnati, halfback Corey Dillon was able to join the Patriots in 2004 and thrive without incident -- the theory being that these leaders were able to keep him in line."I've seen guys come in from other places and fall right in line, and the guys who didn't, they got rid of immediately," said Browns linebacker Willie McGinest, who, until his release following the 2005 season, was probably the strongest presence in the Patriots' locker room. "You can go all the way back to Terry Glenn, and then look at guys like Duane Starks and Tyrone Poole -- if you weren't with the program, you were gone. Meanwhile, people said Corey Dillon was troubled when they got him, and how many problems did he have there? The one thing he wanted in life was a ring, and he knew he had to do it their way to get it."This is why, in McGinest's view, the Moss deal was a smart gamble for the organization. "You've got leaders on the field," he said Tuesday from the office of his L.A.-based record company, 55 Entertainment, "and that's the main thing. With Randy, people in there will be able to say to him, 'Listen -- if you want to win, you have to do X, Y and Z.' How many guys has he been around in the past who could say that to him with any authority? These are the types of players he's been losing to all these years and watching win Super Bowls, so he has to listen.

This is better than both....

Don't you think it's time we remove the 'Winning With Class' emblem from the Patriots' coat of arms and replace it with another motto? 'Winning With An ###' is more like it.

Sure, but only if Moss does indeed prove to be an ###. Until then, that's a stupid label that’s way premature.

 

[massraider]

For real, I think Moss should be in the league at least 17 years before we can label him an ###.

 

[Jason Wood]

Ah...gotcha re: Belichick and infidelity. Regardless, my point holds steady. He didn't lose his morality the day he signed Randy Moss, it was gone a long time ago.

 

[Kit Fisto]

:(

 

[Gopher State]

I have a lot of respect for the Pats, a well run team. When I think of NE, I think of players like Troy Brown, playing both ways wr/db, Adam V., Teddy B., real team players, I agree they signed players a little questionable in the past, i.e. Dillon, etc., but in Dillon's case he was the star RB, at first, and was in the lime light. I do question, the signing of Randy Moss, being from MN he was great, but then became a head case, I wonder what happens the first game that Brady only throws the ball two times in Randys direction, do you think Randy might say something to the press? Or if Randy leaves the game early?, or if he acts like he's mooning another teams fan.

Randy Moss & T.O. are to NFL teams, like a cheap bottle of wine, when you open the bottle it looks good and makes you feel good as you drink it, and you just have to have it, but the next day it leaves you with a bad hangover.

Moss & T.O. have one thing in common, neither has a Superbowl ring. IMO the Pat's signed Moss, to try keep up with the younger, very talented Colts, adding a 30 old, problem child, doesn't make you the best team in the NFL, it makes you a little older, and draws press coverage where ever you go.

I hope the Pats do well in 07, I sure Randy will make it a colorful year for the NE press.

 

[BusMan]

Hey, I don't like the Patriots any more than the next guy, but so much of this is just sour grapes and jealously. Everyone always takes pot shots at the guys at the top. And even though they haven't won the Super Bowl the past two years (OMG!! 2!!!), they're still perceived to be at the top. Couple that with this offseason, and they're the targets right now.

Two other things:

1) This moral high ground thing is bogus; its just some kickback from their "introduced-as-a-team" thing that, given the time distance from the event, has probably rubbed people the wrong way. My guess is some folks look back on that as snobbery but in reality they were a team no one picked to win doing what they knew to do--sticking together.

2) I'm guessing Peyton, Tony, and the Colts are loving all this Pats talk. Now they'll get to be the Super Bowl champs coming into the '07 season under the radar. Or at least more under the radar than they should be.

 

[BostonSportsGuy]

from the article: Randy's just a fiery guy who couldn't handle the losing in Oakland; that's why he justifiably went in the tank and acted like a six-year-old. Put him in a winning situation -- and in a locker room where they know how to handle guys like that -- and he'll be instantly and completely transformed. Why else would he take a potential $6.75 million pay cut if he wasn't all about winning?

Says it all. He's never been an egomaniac like Terrell or wanted the spotlight, he's just an honest guy who speaks his mind. Anyone of you (non-Pats fans) would love to have someone of his talent on your team --- and if you say no, you are lying!

 

[ImTheScientist]

I keep hearing this and yet, it makes no sense to me. When did the Patriots claim the moral high ground?

They brought in Corey Dillon, Rodney Harrison and Bryan Cox who all served as key cogs in championship runs.

They didn't claim it, some of their fans did for them. Talk radio hosts did. TV sports guys did.Eh, all I really want to say about this. This has already been dicussed, and can go nowhere interesting.

 

[ImTheScientist]

from the article: Randy's just a fiery guy who couldn't handle the losing in Oakland; that's why he justifiably went in the tank and acted like a six-year-old. Put him in a winning situation -- and in a locker room where they know how to handle guys like that -- and he'll be instantly and completely transformed. Why else would he take a potential $6.75 million pay cut if he wasn't all about winning?

Says it all. He's never been an egomaniac like Terrell or wanted the spotlight, he's just an honest guy who speaks his mind. Anyone of you (non-Pats fans) would love to have someone of his talent on your team --- and if you say no, you are lying!

If Moss is all about winning why does he take plays off?

 

[JohnnyU]

This (NE recent acquisitions) is all about the Colts. Beating the Colts is more important than the "Patriot Way".

 

[BostonSportsGuy]

This is all about the Colts. Beating the Colts is more important than the "Patriot Way".

The Colts just were lucky last year --- let's see them do it more than once. Now that the Pats finally have a respectable core of WRs, midnight has come & gone for Peyton & Co.

 

[David Yudkin]

from the article: Randy's just a fiery guy who couldn't handle the losing in Oakland; that's why he justifiably went in the tank and acted like a six-year-old. Put him in a winning situation -- and in a locker room where they know how to handle guys like that -- and he'll be instantly and completely transformed. Why else would he take a potential $6.75 million pay cut if he wasn't all about winning?

Says it all. He's never been an egomaniac like Terrell or wanted the spotlight, he's just an honest guy who speaks his mind. Anyone of you (non-Pats fans) would love to have someone of his talent on your team --- and if you say no, you are lying!

If Moss is all about winning why does he take plays off?

People apparently think that Moss is the only WR in the league that takes plays off when he's not involved in the play. They were discussing this the other night on a couple of tv sports talk shows and they mentioned that this is not all that uncommon but because it's Moss he becomes the ultimate slacker.

 

[JohnnyU]

This is all about the Colts. Beating the Colts is more important than the "Patriot Way".

The Colts just were lucky last year --- let's see them do it more than once. Now that the Pats finally have a respectable core of WRs, midnight has come & gone for Peyton & Co.

I it when NE fans get defensive.

 

[PatsWillWin]

Anti-Patriots are hilarious.

People who think that the so-called "Patriot way" has anything to do with morals are either idiots or just exercising their urge to crap on Patriot fans by making stuff up.

This team has been bringing in jackasses since 2001. This is nothing new.

 

[Sheriff66]

I just like how it exposes the "Patroit Way" for the farce that it is...

 

[John Mamula]

they lost the moral high ground when they accepted the win in the tuck rule game.

they should have conceded after their drive ended with an obvious fumble.



similarly, the steelers have not had a moral high ground for some time after the crapmaculate reception.

 

[ImTheScientist]

from the article: Randy's just a fiery guy who couldn't handle the losing in Oakland; that's why he justifiably went in the tank and acted like a six-year-old. Put him in a winning situation -- and in a locker room where they know how to handle guys like that -- and he'll be instantly and completely transformed. Why else would he take a potential $6.75 million pay cut if he wasn't all about winning?

Says it all. He's never been an egomaniac like Terrell or wanted the spotlight, he's just an honest guy who speaks his mind. Anyone of you (non-Pats fans) would love to have someone of his talent on your team --- and if you say no, you are lying!

If Moss is all about winning why does he take plays off?

People apparently think that Moss is the only WR in the league that takes plays off when he's not involved in the play. They were discussing this the other night on a couple of tv sports talk shows and they mentioned that this is not all that uncommon but because it's Moss he becomes the ultimate slacker.

So are you saying that Moss takes as many plays off as other WR's (the average) when he is not in a play?

 

[Sheriff66]

they lost the moral high ground when they accepted the win in the tuck rule game.they should have conceded after their drive ended with an obvious fumble. similarly, the steelers have not had a moral high ground for some time after the crapmaculate reception.

No evidence that he didn't make the catch and they never claimed the moral high ground to begin with. You're right about one thing, Brady fumbled for everyone to see, from multiple angles no less.

 

[David Yudkin]

from the article: Randy's just a fiery guy who couldn't handle the losing in Oakland; that's why he justifiably went in the tank and acted like a six-year-old. Put him in a winning situation -- and in a locker room where they know how to handle guys like that -- and he'll be instantly and completely transformed. Why else would he take a potential $6.75 million pay cut if he wasn't all about winning?

Says it all. He's never been an egomaniac like Terrell or wanted the spotlight, he's just an honest guy who speaks his mind. Anyone of you (non-Pats fans) would love to have someone of his talent on your team --- and if you say no, you are lying!

If Moss is all about winning why does he take plays off?

People apparently think that Moss is the only WR in the league that takes plays off when he's not involved in the play. They were discussing this the other night on a couple of tv sports talk shows and they mentioned that this is not all that uncommon but because it's Moss he becomes the ultimate slacker.

So are you saying that Moss takes as many plays off as other WR's (the average) when he is not in a play?

I am not saying anything. I was only reporting what others were saying. IMO, Moss probably takes a few more in game breaks than others but I think overall it gets overblown.

 

[Sheriff66]

from the article: Randy's just a fiery guy who couldn't handle the losing in Oakland; that's why he justifiably went in the tank and acted like a six-year-old. Put him in a winning situation -- and in a locker room where they know how to handle guys like that -- and he'll be instantly and completely transformed. Why else would he take a potential $6.75 million pay cut if he wasn't all about winning?

Says it all. He's never been an egomaniac like Terrell or wanted the spotlight, he's just an honest guy who speaks his mind. Anyone of you (non-Pats fans) would love to have someone of his talent on your team --- and if you say no, you are lying!

If Moss is all about winning why does he take plays off?

People apparently think that Moss is the only WR in the league that takes plays off when he's not involved in the play. They were discussing this the other night on a couple of tv sports talk shows and they mentioned that this is not all that uncommon but because it's Moss he becomes the ultimate slacker.

So are you saying that Moss takes as many plays off as other WR's (the average) when he is not in a play?

He quit on the Vikes at the end and then quit on the Raiders, and he didn't take a 6.75 mil paycut, he never would have seen that money and probably been released outright. He's a HOF turd, not a HOF WR

 

[John Mamula]

they lost the moral high ground when they accepted the win in the tuck rule game.

they should have conceded after their drive ended with an obvious fumble.



similarly, the steelers have not had a moral high ground for some time after the crapmaculate reception.

No evidence that he didn't make the catch and they never claimed the moral high ground to begin with. You're right about one thing, Brady fumbled for everyone to see, from multiple angles no less.

i made myself a homemade ring for the championship the raiders should have one that year.championship!

 

[Sheriff66]

they lost the moral high ground when they accepted the win in the tuck rule game.

they should have conceded after their drive ended with an obvious fumble.



similarly, the steelers have not had a moral high ground for some time after the crapmaculate reception.

No evidence that he didn't make the catch and they never claimed the moral high ground to begin with. You're right about one thing, Brady fumbled for everyone to see, from multiple angles no less.

i made myself a homemade ring for the championship the raiders should have one that year.championship!

Touchdown!

 

[John Mamula]

they lost the moral high ground when they accepted the win in the tuck rule game.

they should have conceded after their drive ended with an obvious fumble.



similarly, the steelers have not had a moral high ground for some time after the crapmaculate reception.

No evidence that he didn't make the catch and they never claimed the moral high ground to begin with. You're right about one thing, Brady fumbled for everyone to see, from multiple angles no less.

i made myself a homemade ring for the championship the raiders should have one that year.championship!

Touchdown!

 

[Sheriff66]

Some :(

 

[Kit Fisto]

Seriously, do you guys ever take a break?

This is some serious , and going on in here.