Obama speech seems to support reparations (1 Viewer)

[urbanhack]

By the way, where do we draw the line on any reparations?

Is there not a case to be made for many people groups that they are owed something for some historic treatment?

Asians, Hispanics, Irish, Jews... I mean, pretty much almost all people groups other than perhaps decendents of full blooded Englishmen that settled early in the original colonies.

Is there a sliding scale? This people group was enslaved... BIG pay day. This group was huddled into camps during a war... you get a big check but not as big as the enslaved group. This group over here was discriminated against socially... they get the smallest check.

What if you are half a particular group? Does that men you get half a check or a job or an education?

Do females get any reparations? I mean, after all, they get paid less than men. So, maybe the government gives them all a check to make up for earning less. Or do they all get promotions?

Are you drunk?

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

It's all a crock, right?

 

[timschochet]

I was really happy with Obama's "race" speech during the Reverend Wright controversy. Like many other people, I considered his speech thoughtful, nuanced, and that perhaps as a result might move this country beyond the typical racial arguments that we have been caught in for so long. I praised Obama for that speech, here and elsewhere.

Unfortunately, this more recent statement is a throwback to what will surely separate us rather than bring us together. In terms of the issue of African-American slavery, reparations is an overwhelmingly negative term. It is usually promoted by radical Blacks looking for confrontation. It's not something the majority of African-Americans spend their time thinking about; however, if you denounce it too strongly, they will suspect you of racism. A strong majority of white Americans are against the idea, and a loud minority are resentful about even discussing it. It's one of those issues that NO good can come from even discussing.

Everytime I become a little happier with things that Obama says or does, stuff like this comes up. There is a lot I like about the guy. It would be a wonderful thing to have an African American president. Why does he have to be so damn liberal?

 

[roadkill1292]

CHICAGO » Sen. Barack Obama, speaking to a gathering of minority journalists yesterday, stopped short of endorsing an official U.S. apology to American Indians but said the country should acknowledge its history of poor treatment of certain ethnic groups."There's no doubt that when it comes to our treatment of Native Americans as well as other persons of color in this country, we've got some very sad and difficult things to account for," Obama told hundreds of attendees of UNITY '08, a convention of four minority journalism associations.The Hawaii-born senator, who has told local reporters that he supports the federal recognition bill for native Hawaiians drafted by U.S. Sen. Daniel Akaka, noted other ethnic groups but did not mention native Hawaiians when answering a question about his thoughts on a formal U.S. apology to American Indians."I personally would want to see our tragic history, or the tragic elements of our history, acknowledged," the Democratic presidential hopeful said."I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds."Obama, who appeared tired in his first major appearance since returning Saturday from a 10-day trip abroad, met with a receptive audience at the Chicago convention. Some journalists had waited three hours for the 40-minute appearance.The group had expected Obama and Sen. John McCain to speak on Thursday night, but because of scheduling conflicts, only Obama could attend yesterday morning's talk.When Obama walked on stage at the McCormick Center, many journalists in the audience leapt to their feet and applauded enthusiastically after being told not to do so. During a two-minute break halfway through the event, which was broadcast live on CNN, journalists ran to the stage to snap photos of Obama.The Illinois senator talked about his trip overseas, reiterating his opinion that violence is down in Iraq but worsening in Afghanistan. And he expressed his approval of the Senate's passage of a major housing bill to help homeowners avert foreclosure.Obama, who acknowledged that he needed a nap, stood up to say farewell to the audience of journalists, many of whom gave him another standing ovation.

Can anyone explain all the hysteria over this?

Because he is saying things that one group of people thinks should have been said a long time ago and another group of people don't want to hear.

That's cool, and understandable, if he is popular with a group of minority journalists. But if they were there in a reportorial capacity, then they need to adhere to the standards of the profession and at least maintain the appearance of objectivity.

 

[Bonzai]

Sound bites, idiots, and message boards are an unfortunate combination.

 

[jonessed]

By the way, where do we draw the line on any reparations?

Is there not a case to be made for many people groups that they are owed something for some historic treatment?

Asians, Hispanics, Irish, Jews... I mean, pretty much almost all people groups other than perhaps decendents of full blooded Englishmen that settled early in the original colonies.

Is there a sliding scale? This people group was enslaved... BIG pay day. This group was huddled into camps during a war... you get a big check but not as big as the enslaved group. This group over here was discriminated against socially... they get the smallest check.

What if you are half a particular group? Does that men you get half a check or a job or an education?

Do females get any reparations? I mean, after all, they get paid less than men. So, maybe the government gives them all a check to make up for earning less. Or do they all get promotions?

Are you drunk?

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

I am sorry let me fixed that.Slavery was a boon for the African 'American' family in this country and it still reeps the benefits. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? They should be payin gus for this great reward we gave them by bringing their ancestors over here so they could now live in freedom.

The downfall of the African American family unit is fairly recent. It's not a result of slavery.

 

[Robbie Cooper]

this forum needs to get rid of the hacks

But then where would you go?

 

[urbanhack]

By the way, where do we draw the line on any reparations?

Is there not a case to be made for many people groups that they are owed something for some historic treatment?

Asians, Hispanics, Irish, Jews... I mean, pretty much almost all people groups other than perhaps decendents of full blooded Englishmen that settled early in the original colonies.

Is there a sliding scale? This people group was enslaved... BIG pay day. This group was huddled into camps during a war... you get a big check but not as big as the enslaved group. This group over here was discriminated against socially... they get the smallest check.

What if you are half a particular group? Does that men you get half a check or a job or an education?

Do females get any reparations? I mean, after all, they get paid less than men. So, maybe the government gives them all a check to make up for earning less. Or do they all get promotions?

Are you drunk?

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

I am sorry let me fixed that.Slavery was a boon for the African 'American' family in this country and it still reeps the benefits. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? They should be payin gus for this great reward we gave them by bringing their ancestors over here so they could now live in freedom.

The downfall of the African American family unit is fairly recent. It's not a result of slavery.

What do you mean when you say recent? Are you saying that the African American family unit was more stable back in the early to mid 1900s? Layout a time line for me.

 

[Weapon of Mass Instruction]

By the way, where do we draw the line on any reparations?

Is there not a case to be made for many people groups that they are owed something for some historic treatment?

Asians, Hispanics, Irish, Jews... I mean, pretty much almost all people groups other than perhaps decendents of full blooded Englishmen that settled early in the original colonies.

Is there a sliding scale? This people group was enslaved... BIG pay day. This group was huddled into camps during a war... you get a big check but not as big as the enslaved group. This group over here was discriminated against socially... they get the smallest check.

What if you are half a particular group? Does that men you get half a check or a job or an education?

Do females get any reparations? I mean, after all, they get paid less than men. So, maybe the government gives them all a check to make up for earning less. Or do they all get promotions?

Are you drunk?

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery Welfare/government money destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

Fixed that for ya. Slavery didn't start in Africa/with Africans. Just about every race from one time or another has been enslaved. If you could trace back far enough, you probably have ancestors that were enslaved.

I'm with you. In the guise of "helping" people, we've just repressed them more.

 

[Mr. Chumley]

By the way, where do we draw the line on any reparations?

Is there not a case to be made for many people groups that they are owed something for some historic treatment?

Asians, Hispanics, Irish, Jews... I mean, pretty much almost all people groups other than perhaps decendents of full blooded Englishmen that settled early in the original colonies.

Is there a sliding scale? This people group was enslaved... BIG pay day. This group was huddled into camps during a war... you get a big check but not as big as the enslaved group. This group over here was discriminated against socially... they get the smallest check.

What if you are half a particular group? Does that men you get half a check or a job or an education?

Do females get any reparations? I mean, after all, they get paid less than men. So, maybe the government gives them all a check to make up for earning less. Or do they all get promotions?

Are you drunk?

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

I think this type of attitude has more to do with it than slavery.

He has a $25 million contract, he's bought a $100,000 car, dropped $146,000 on jewelry ... and yet finds himself a tad on the broke side when it comes to those essential, but oh so pesky, child support payments.

You see, Henry, 28, has nine children ... from nine different women ... in at least four southern states.

(To say he's been a busy man would be quite the understatement.)

He's been ordered to establish a $250,000 trust to cover a new $3000/month child support payment due to his, let's just say, not-so-conservative spending habits.

DeKalb Superior Court Judge Clarence Seeliger this week ordered Henry to provide $3,000 a month for the Lithonia boy he fathered out of wedlock three years ago with Jameshia Beacham, now 29.

Henry isn't the most thrifty guy, according to court records, so the judge wants to ensure payment by establishing an unusual $250,000 trust that Henry must fund by next spring.

Seeliger wrote that the football player displayed "bad judgment in his spending habits," dropping $100,000 for a car and $146,000 for jewelry. Meanwhile, Henry fell behind on support payments for his child with Beacham that were mandated by a previous order. Threatened with jail, he borrowed $9,800 from his former team, the Tennessee Titans, to pay the bill, according to court records.

Funny, how Henry signed a contract with the Broncos in the off-season that guarantees him $12 million and yet had nothing but lint in his pocket for child support.

Funny? No.

Try sad. Really, really, sad.

LINK

 

[Darth Cheney]

CHICAGO » Sen. Barack Obama, speaking to a gathering of minority journalists yesterday, stopped short of endorsing an official U.S. apology to American Indians but said the country should acknowledge its history of poor treatment of certain ethnic groups."There's no doubt that when it comes to our treatment of Native Americans as well as other persons of color in this country, we've got some very sad and difficult things to account for," Obama told hundreds of attendees of UNITY '08, a convention of four minority journalism associations.The Hawaii-born senator, who has told local reporters that he supports the federal recognition bill for native Hawaiians drafted by U.S. Sen. Daniel Akaka, noted other ethnic groups but did not mention native Hawaiians when answering a question about his thoughts on a formal U.S. apology to American Indians."I personally would want to see our tragic history, or the tragic elements of our history, acknowledged," the Democratic presidential hopeful said."I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds."Obama, who appeared tired in his first major appearance since returning Saturday from a 10-day trip abroad, met with a receptive audience at the Chicago convention. Some journalists had waited three hours for the 40-minute appearance.The group had expected Obama and Sen. John McCain to speak on Thursday night, but because of scheduling conflicts, only Obama could attend yesterday morning's talk.When Obama walked on stage at the McCormick Center, many journalists in the audience leapt to their feet and applauded enthusiastically after being told not to do so. During a two-minute break halfway through the event, which was broadcast live on CNN, journalists ran to the stage to snap photos of Obama.The Illinois senator talked about his trip overseas, reiterating his opinion that violence is down in Iraq but worsening in Afghanistan. And he expressed his approval of the Senate's passage of a major housing bill to help homeowners avert foreclosure.Obama, who acknowledged that he needed a nap, stood up to say farewell to the audience of journalists, many of whom gave him another standing ovation.

Can anyone explain all the hysteria over this?

Because he is saying things that one group of people thinks should have been said a long time ago and another group of people don't want to hear.

That's cool, and understandable, if he is popular with a group of minority journalists. But if they were there in a reportorial capacity, then they need to adhere to the standards of the profession and at least maintain the appearance of objectivity.

Come on though......is there any objectivity in the profession? I don't understand why people continue to think this.

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

CHICAGO » Sen. Barack Obama, speaking to a gathering of minority journalists yesterday, stopped short of endorsing an official U.S. apology to American Indians but said the country should acknowledge its history of poor treatment of certain ethnic groups.

"There's no doubt that when it comes to our treatment of Native Americans as well as other persons of color in this country, we've got some very sad and difficult things to account for," Obama told hundreds of attendees of UNITY '08, a convention of four minority journalism associations.

The Hawaii-born senator, who has told local reporters that he supports the federal recognition bill for native Hawaiians drafted by U.S. Sen. Daniel Akaka, noted other ethnic groups but did not mention native Hawaiians when answering a question about his thoughts on a formal U.S. apology to American Indians.

"I personally would want to see our tragic history, or the tragic elements of our history, acknowledged," the Democratic presidential hopeful said.

"I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds."

Obama, who appeared tired in his first major appearance since returning Saturday from a 10-day trip abroad, met with a receptive audience at the Chicago convention. Some journalists had waited three hours for the 40-minute appearance.

The group had expected Obama and Sen. John McCain to speak on Thursday night, but because of scheduling conflicts, only Obama could attend yesterday morning's talk.

When Obama walked on stage at the McCormick Center, many journalists in the audience leapt to their feet and applauded enthusiastically after being told not to do so. During a two-minute break halfway through the event, which was broadcast live on CNN, journalists ran to the stage to snap photos of Obama.

The Illinois senator talked about his trip overseas, reiterating his opinion that violence is down in Iraq but worsening in Afghanistan. And he expressed his approval of the Senate's passage of a major housing bill to help homeowners avert foreclosure.

Obama, who acknowledged that he needed a nap, stood up to say farewell to the audience of journalists, many of whom gave him another standing ovation.

Can anyone explain all the hysteria over this?

Honestly? It is Obama's own fault. Anyone other than the people who have converted to the Obama religion are still trying to figure out who this guy is. He has little in way of a track record to really tell us about what he truly believes. And he tends to say everything to all people.

(For all Obamaniacs that is your cue to make some smug comment about me being insane or high or whatever else you choose)

Yes, honestly. Anyone?

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Can anyone explain all the hysteria over this?

New here?

 

[Homer J Simpson]

Sound bites, idiots, and message boards are an unfortunate combination.

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

CHICAGO » Sen. Barack Obama, speaking to a gathering of minority journalists yesterday, stopped short of endorsing an official U.S. apology to American Indians but said the country should acknowledge its history of poor treatment of certain ethnic groups."There's no doubt that when it comes to our treatment of Native Americans as well as other persons of color in this country, we've got some very sad and difficult things to account for," Obama told hundreds of attendees of UNITY '08, a convention of four minority journalism associations.The Hawaii-born senator, who has told local reporters that he supports the federal recognition bill for native Hawaiians drafted by U.S. Sen. Daniel Akaka, noted other ethnic groups but did not mention native Hawaiians when answering a question about his thoughts on a formal U.S. apology to American Indians."I personally would want to see our tragic history, or the tragic elements of our history, acknowledged," the Democratic presidential hopeful said."I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds."Obama, who appeared tired in his first major appearance since returning Saturday from a 10-day trip abroad, met with a receptive audience at the Chicago convention. Some journalists had waited three hours for the 40-minute appearance.The group had expected Obama and Sen. John McCain to speak on Thursday night, but because of scheduling conflicts, only Obama could attend yesterday morning's talk.When Obama walked on stage at the McCormick Center, many journalists in the audience leapt to their feet and applauded enthusiastically after being told not to do so. During a two-minute break halfway through the event, which was broadcast live on CNN, journalists ran to the stage to snap photos of Obama.The Illinois senator talked about his trip overseas, reiterating his opinion that violence is down in Iraq but worsening in Afghanistan. And he expressed his approval of the Senate's passage of a major housing bill to help homeowners avert foreclosure.Obama, who acknowledged that he needed a nap, stood up to say farewell to the audience of journalists, many of whom gave him another standing ovation.

Can anyone explain all the hysteria over this?

Because he is saying things that one group of people thinks should have been said a long time ago and another group of people don't want to hear.

That's cool, and understandable, if he is popular with a group of minority journalists. But if they were there in a reportorial capacity, then they need to adhere to the standards of the profession and at least maintain the appearance of objectivity.

So this is all about the standing ovations he got?

 

[Darth Cheney]

CHICAGO » Sen. Barack Obama, speaking to a gathering of minority journalists yesterday, stopped short of endorsing an official U.S. apology to American Indians but said the country should acknowledge its history of poor treatment of certain ethnic groups."There's no doubt that when it comes to our treatment of Native Americans as well as other persons of color in this country, we've got some very sad and difficult things to account for," Obama told hundreds of attendees of UNITY '08, a convention of four minority journalism associations.The Hawaii-born senator, who has told local reporters that he supports the federal recognition bill for native Hawaiians drafted by U.S. Sen. Daniel Akaka, noted other ethnic groups but did not mention native Hawaiians when answering a question about his thoughts on a formal U.S. apology to American Indians."I personally would want to see our tragic history, or the tragic elements of our history, acknowledged," the Democratic presidential hopeful said."I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds."Obama, who appeared tired in his first major appearance since returning Saturday from a 10-day trip abroad, met with a receptive audience at the Chicago convention. Some journalists had waited three hours for the 40-minute appearance.The group had expected Obama and Sen. John McCain to speak on Thursday night, but because of scheduling conflicts, only Obama could attend yesterday morning's talk.When Obama walked on stage at the McCormick Center, many journalists in the audience leapt to their feet and applauded enthusiastically after being told not to do so. During a two-minute break halfway through the event, which was broadcast live on CNN, journalists ran to the stage to snap photos of Obama.The Illinois senator talked about his trip overseas, reiterating his opinion that violence is down in Iraq but worsening in Afghanistan. And he expressed his approval of the Senate's passage of a major housing bill to help homeowners avert foreclosure.Obama, who acknowledged that he needed a nap, stood up to say farewell to the audience of journalists, many of whom gave him another standing ovation.

Can anyone explain all the hysteria over this?

Because he is saying things that one group of people thinks should have been said a long time ago and another group of people don't want to hear.

That's cool, and understandable, if he is popular with a group of minority journalists. But if they were there in a reportorial capacity, then they need to adhere to the standards of the profession and at least maintain the appearance of objectivity.

So this is all about the standing ovations he got?

I thought that that was the point of your question...the hysteria shown by the press.

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

CHICAGO » Sen. Barack Obama, speaking to a gathering of minority journalists yesterday, stopped short of endorsing an official U.S. apology to American Indians but said the country should acknowledge its history of poor treatment of certain ethnic groups."There's no doubt that when it comes to our treatment of Native Americans as well as other persons of color in this country, we've got some very sad and difficult things to account for," Obama told hundreds of attendees of UNITY '08, a convention of four minority journalism associations.The Hawaii-born senator, who has told local reporters that he supports the federal recognition bill for native Hawaiians drafted by U.S. Sen. Daniel Akaka, noted other ethnic groups but did not mention native Hawaiians when answering a question about his thoughts on a formal U.S. apology to American Indians."I personally would want to see our tragic history, or the tragic elements of our history, acknowledged," the Democratic presidential hopeful said."I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds."Obama, who appeared tired in his first major appearance since returning Saturday from a 10-day trip abroad, met with a receptive audience at the Chicago convention. Some journalists had waited three hours for the 40-minute appearance.The group had expected Obama and Sen. John McCain to speak on Thursday night, but because of scheduling conflicts, only Obama could attend yesterday morning's talk.When Obama walked on stage at the McCormick Center, many journalists in the audience leapt to their feet and applauded enthusiastically after being told not to do so. During a two-minute break halfway through the event, which was broadcast live on CNN, journalists ran to the stage to snap photos of Obama.The Illinois senator talked about his trip overseas, reiterating his opinion that violence is down in Iraq but worsening in Afghanistan. And he expressed his approval of the Senate's passage of a major housing bill to help homeowners avert foreclosure.Obama, who acknowledged that he needed a nap, stood up to say farewell to the audience of journalists, many of whom gave him another standing ovation.

Can anyone explain all the hysteria over this?

Because he is saying things that one group of people thinks should have been said a long time ago and another group of people don't want to hear.

That's cool, and understandable, if he is popular with a group of minority journalists. But if they were there in a reportorial capacity, then they need to adhere to the standards of the profession and at least maintain the appearance of objectivity.

So this is all about the standing ovations he got?

I thought that that was the point of your question...the hysteria shown by the press.

No - all the hysteria in this thread over this article. I noticed the thread title has changed, so maybe people didn't read the whole thing.

 

[RBM]

I think this type of attitude has more to do with it than slavery.

He has a $25 million contract, he's bought a $100,000 car, dropped $146,000 on jewelry ... and yet finds himself a tad on the broke side when it comes to those essential, but oh so pesky, child support payments.

You see, Henry, 28, has nine children ... from nine different women ... in at least four southern states.

(To say he's been a busy man would be quite the understatement.)

He's been ordered to establish a $250,000 trust to cover a new $3000/month child support payment due to his, let's just say, not-so-conservative spending habits.

DeKalb Superior Court Judge Clarence Seeliger this week ordered Henry to provide $3,000 a month for the Lithonia boy he fathered out of wedlock three years ago with Jameshia Beacham, now 29.

Henry isn't the most thrifty guy, according to court records, so the judge wants to ensure payment by establishing an unusual $250,000 trust that Henry must fund by next spring.

Seeliger wrote that the football player displayed "bad judgment in his spending habits," dropping $100,000 for a car and $146,000 for jewelry. Meanwhile, Henry fell behind on support payments for his child with Beacham that were mandated by a previous order. Threatened with jail, he borrowed $9,800 from his former team, the Tennessee Titans, to pay the bill, according to court records.

Funny, how Henry signed a contract with the Broncos in the off-season that guarantees him $12 million and yet had nothing but lint in his pocket for child support.

Funny? No.

Try sad. Really, really, sad.

LINK

Too much of this going on, thats the problem.

 

[roadkill1292]

CHICAGO » Sen. Barack Obama, speaking to a gathering of minority journalists yesterday, stopped short of endorsing an official U.S. apology to American Indians but said the country should acknowledge its history of poor treatment of certain ethnic groups."There's no doubt that when it comes to our treatment of Native Americans as well as other persons of color in this country, we've got some very sad and difficult things to account for," Obama told hundreds of attendees of UNITY '08, a convention of four minority journalism associations.The Hawaii-born senator, who has told local reporters that he supports the federal recognition bill for native Hawaiians drafted by U.S. Sen. Daniel Akaka, noted other ethnic groups but did not mention native Hawaiians when answering a question about his thoughts on a formal U.S. apology to American Indians."I personally would want to see our tragic history, or the tragic elements of our history, acknowledged," the Democratic presidential hopeful said."I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds."Obama, who appeared tired in his first major appearance since returning Saturday from a 10-day trip abroad, met with a receptive audience at the Chicago convention. Some journalists had waited three hours for the 40-minute appearance.The group had expected Obama and Sen. John McCain to speak on Thursday night, but because of scheduling conflicts, only Obama could attend yesterday morning's talk.When Obama walked on stage at the McCormick Center, many journalists in the audience leapt to their feet and applauded enthusiastically after being told not to do so. During a two-minute break halfway through the event, which was broadcast live on CNN, journalists ran to the stage to snap photos of Obama.The Illinois senator talked about his trip overseas, reiterating his opinion that violence is down in Iraq but worsening in Afghanistan. And he expressed his approval of the Senate's passage of a major housing bill to help homeowners avert foreclosure.Obama, who acknowledged that he needed a nap, stood up to say farewell to the audience of journalists, many of whom gave him another standing ovation.

Can anyone explain all the hysteria over this?

Because he is saying things that one group of people thinks should have been said a long time ago and another group of people don't want to hear.

That's cool, and understandable, if he is popular with a group of minority journalists. But if they were there in a reportorial capacity, then they need to adhere to the standards of the profession and at least maintain the appearance of objectivity.

Come on though......is there any objectivity in the profession? I don't understand why people continue to think this.

There certainly is. Of course, reporters have biases as do entire publications. And it's understandable when those biases bleed through in the reporting. But applauding a candidate is completely inappropriate and unprofessional in the same way that sports writers should not be cheering from the press box which, in my experience, doesn't happen.

 

[jonessed]

By the way, where do we draw the line on any reparations?

Is there not a case to be made for many people groups that they are owed something for some historic treatment?

Asians, Hispanics, Irish, Jews... I mean, pretty much almost all people groups other than perhaps decendents of full blooded Englishmen that settled early in the original colonies.

Is there a sliding scale? This people group was enslaved... BIG pay day. This group was huddled into camps during a war... you get a big check but not as big as the enslaved group. This group over here was discriminated against socially... they get the smallest check.

What if you are half a particular group? Does that men you get half a check or a job or an education?

Do females get any reparations? I mean, after all, they get paid less than men. So, maybe the government gives them all a check to make up for earning less. Or do they all get promotions?

Are you drunk?

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

I am sorry let me fixed that.Slavery was a boon for the African 'American' family in this country and it still reeps the benefits. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? They should be payin gus for this great reward we gave them by bringing their ancestors over here so they could now live in freedom.

The downfall of the African American family unit is fairly recent. It's not a result of slavery.

What do you mean when you say recent? Are you saying that the African American family unit was more stable back in the early to mid 1900s? Layout a time line for me.

The American family unit as a whole has been falling apart since the 60s, but African-American families have been falling much faster. By falling I mean more people not getting married, more divorces, and a lot more children born out of wedlock. It's not a result of slavery. I would argue that it's a result of a welfare and tax system that encourages couples not to get married, but there are probably other theories.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

The American family unit as a whole has been falling apart since the 60s, but African-American families have been falling much faster. By falling I mean more people not getting married, more divorces, and a lot more children born out of wedlock. It's not a result of slavery. I would argue that it's a result of a welfare and tax system that encourages couples not to get married, but there are probably other theories.

Low income people tend not to pay a lot of income taxes whether they are married or not.

 

[urbanhack]

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

I am sorry let me fixed that.Slavery was a boon for the African 'American' family in this country and it still reeps the benefits. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? They should be payin gus for this great reward we gave them by bringing their ancestors over here so they could now live in freedom.

The downfall of the African American family unit is fairly recent. It's not a result of slavery.

What do you mean when you say recent? Are you saying that the African American family unit was more stable back in the early to mid 1900s? Layout a time line for me.

The American family unit as a whole has been falling apart since the 60s, but African-American families have been falling much faster. By falling I mean more people not getting married, more divorces, and a lot more children born out of wedlock. It's not a result of slavery. I would argue that it's a result of a welfare and tax system that encourages couples not to get married, but there are probably other theories.

First off, this is more class-based within the African American community more than anything. The black middle class is a strong and growing demographic. It's the lower class segment that seems to contain most of the problems. Why is that? You can strongly argue that the environments they grow up in are directly related to Jim Crow and segregation which ties to slavery. Housing projects and ghettos weren't just created out of thin air. They were built and created by our government and our society because we didn't want them living among us. We wanted to force black people to live only in certain areas and we built high-rise projects that did nothing but create a terrible environment in which to live. While much has changed in the past 40 to 50 years, you can't deny that the environments created by those past policies still exist.

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

I think this type of attitude has more to do with it than slavery.

He has a $25 million contract, he's bought a $100,000 car, dropped $146,000 on jewelry ... and yet finds himself a tad on the broke side when it comes to those essential, but oh so pesky, child support payments.

You see, Henry, 28, has nine children ... from nine different women ... in at least four southern states.

(To say he's been a busy man would be quite the understatement.)

He's been ordered to establish a $250,000 trust to cover a new $3000/month child support payment due to his, let's just say, not-so-conservative spending habits.

DeKalb Superior Court Judge Clarence Seeliger this week ordered Henry to provide $3,000 a month for the Lithonia boy he fathered out of wedlock three years ago with Jameshia Beacham, now 29.

Henry isn't the most thrifty guy, according to court records, so the judge wants to ensure payment by establishing an unusual $250,000 trust that Henry must fund by next spring.

Seeliger wrote that the football player displayed "bad judgment in his spending habits," dropping $100,000 for a car and $146,000 for jewelry. Meanwhile, Henry fell behind on support payments for his child with Beacham that were mandated by a previous order. Threatened with jail, he borrowed $9,800 from his former team, the Tennessee Titans, to pay the bill, according to court records.

Funny, how Henry signed a contract with the Broncos in the off-season that guarantees him $12 million and yet had nothing but lint in his pocket for child support.

Funny? No.

Try sad. Really, really, sad.

LINK

Too much of this going on, thats the problem.

Seems like that might be one of the exceptions, not the rule. What percentage of black fathers would fall into this category?

 

[StrikeS2k]

First off, this is more class-based within the African American community more than anything. The black middle class is a strong and growing demographic. It's the lower class segment that seems to contain most of the problems. Why is that? You can strongly argue that the environments they grow up in are directly related to Jim Crow and segregation which ties to slavery. Housing projects and ghettos weren't just created out of thin air. They were built and created by our government and our society because we didn't want them living among us. We wanted to force black people to live only in certain areas and we built high-rise projects that did nothing but create a terrible environment in which to live. While much has changed in the past 40 to 50 years, you can't deny that the environments created by those past policies still exist.

I don't think we built the projects because we "didn't want them living among us." I think we built them because they were poor and we supplied them with cheap/free housing. They're free to live wherever the heck they want. The last time I checked this was America and they were no longer slaves.

 

[StrikeS2k]

I think this type of attitude has more to do with it than slavery.

He has a $25 million contract, he's bought a $100,000 car, dropped $146,000 on jewelry ... and yet finds himself a tad on the broke side when it comes to those essential, but oh so pesky, child support payments.

You see, Henry, 28, has nine children ... from nine different women ... in at least four southern states.

(To say he's been a busy man would be quite the understatement.)

He's been ordered to establish a $250,000 trust to cover a new $3000/month child support payment due to his, let's just say, not-so-conservative spending habits.

DeKalb Superior Court Judge Clarence Seeliger this week ordered Henry to provide $3,000 a month for the Lithonia boy he fathered out of wedlock three years ago with Jameshia Beacham, now 29.

Henry isn't the most thrifty guy, according to court records, so the judge wants to ensure payment by establishing an unusual $250,000 trust that Henry must fund by next spring.

Seeliger wrote that the football player displayed "bad judgment in his spending habits," dropping $100,000 for a car and $146,000 for jewelry. Meanwhile, Henry fell behind on support payments for his child with Beacham that were mandated by a previous order. Threatened with jail, he borrowed $9,800 from his former team, the Tennessee Titans, to pay the bill, according to court records.

Funny, how Henry signed a contract with the Broncos in the off-season that guarantees him $12 million and yet had nothing but lint in his pocket for child support.

Funny? No.

Try sad. Really, really, sad.

LINK

Too much of this going on, thats the problem.

Seems like that might be one of the exceptions, not the rule. What percentage of black fathers would fall into this category?

Not many. Most don't even try to pay child support.

 

[T Bell]

By the way, where do we draw the line on any reparations?

Is there not a case to be made for many people groups that they are owed something for some historic treatment?

Asians, Hispanics, Irish, Jews... I mean, pretty much almost all people groups other than perhaps decendents of full blooded Englishmen that settled early in the original colonies.

Is there a sliding scale? This people group was enslaved... BIG pay day. This group was huddled into camps during a war... you get a big check but not as big as the enslaved group. This group over here was discriminated against socially... they get the smallest check.

What if you are half a particular group? Does that men you get half a check or a job or an education?

Do females get any reparations? I mean, after all, they get paid less than men. So, maybe the government gives them all a check to make up for earning less. Or do they all get promotions?

Are you drunk?

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

In the early 1960's, the African American family was not a contradiction in terms. There were a lot of stable family units, and illegitimacy, crime, unemployment and drug use, while worse than the national average, were nowhere near epidemic. What killed the black family in America was welfare - the "Great Society" programs are a line of demarcation in that regard. To talk about slavery destroying the black family is to talk about conditions as they were almost 150 years ago. You might want to update your notebook just a tad.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

First off, this is more class-based within the African American community more than anything. The black middle class is a strong and growing demographic. It's the lower class segment that seems to contain most of the problems. Why is that? You can strongly argue that the environments they grow up in are directly related to Jim Crow and segregation which ties to slavery. Housing projects and ghettos weren't just created out of thin air. They were built and created by our government and our society because we didn't want them living among us. We wanted to force black people to live only in certain areas and we built high-rise projects that did nothing but create a terrible environment in which to live. While much has changed in the past 40 to 50 years, you can't deny that the environments created by those past policies still exist.

I don't think we built the projects because we "didn't want them living among us." I think we built them because they were poor and we supplied them with cheap/free housing. They're free to live wherever the heck they want. The last time I checked this was America and they were no longer slaves.

Do you also attribute the problems in the Black community to welfare and other entitlement programs?

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Why hasn't welfare caused the same problems for white people?

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

I think this type of attitude has more to do with it than slavery.

He has a $25 million contract, he's bought a $100,000 car, dropped $146,000 on jewelry ... and yet finds himself a tad on the broke side when it comes to those essential, but oh so pesky, child support payments.

You see, Henry, 28, has nine children ... from nine different women ... in at least four southern states.

(To say he's been a busy man would be quite the understatement.)

He's been ordered to establish a $250,000 trust to cover a new $3000/month child support payment due to his, let's just say, not-so-conservative spending habits.

DeKalb Superior Court Judge Clarence Seeliger this week ordered Henry to provide $3,000 a month for the Lithonia boy he fathered out of wedlock three years ago with Jameshia Beacham, now 29.

Henry isn't the most thrifty guy, according to court records, so the judge wants to ensure payment by establishing an unusual $250,000 trust that Henry must fund by next spring.

Seeliger wrote that the football player displayed "bad judgment in his spending habits," dropping $100,000 for a car and $146,000 for jewelry. Meanwhile, Henry fell behind on support payments for his child with Beacham that were mandated by a previous order. Threatened with jail, he borrowed $9,800 from his former team, the Tennessee Titans, to pay the bill, according to court records.

Funny, how Henry signed a contract with the Broncos in the off-season that guarantees him $12 million and yet had nothing but lint in his pocket for child support.

Funny? No.

Try sad. Really, really, sad.

LINK

Too much of this going on, thats the problem.

Seems like that might be one of the exceptions, not the rule. What percentage of black fathers would fall into this category?

Not many. Most don't even try to pay child support.

Yeah I think we've gone from "OMG Obama made some outrageous comments" to "Journalists shouldn't be clapping at the end of a speech!" to "a black football player didn't pay child support!"I think some are just trying too hard to to find something over which to be outraged.

 

[Darth Cheney]

Why hasn't welfare caused the same problems for white people?

It hasn't?

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Why hasn't welfare caused the same problems for white people?

It hasn't?

Good point. What about the Asians?

 

[Rayderr]

Why hasn't welfare caused the same problems for white people?

Ever been to a trailer park?

 

[urbanhack]

lol at welfare being the culprit of the downfall of black families. I'm thinking it's stories like this which have played a bigger part: http://www.alternet.org/rights/92374/how_s...chicago_police/

 

[Darth Cheney]

Why hasn't welfare caused the same problems for white people?

It hasn't?

Good point. What about the Asians?

Well...the Japanese and other Asians are inventive, and can turn a television into a watch. They don't need the welfare. Hispanics are gifted in family structure, and you can see a Hispanic person, and they can put 20, 30 people in one home. They take care of their own. Indians are gifted in spirituality...they get theirs from the Lord.

 

[StrikeS2k]

Do you also attribute the problems in the Black community to welfare and other entitlement programs?

Not specifically. I don't think they help. I think there are a lot of issues contributing to the problems in the black community, at least the problem parts of the black community:1) They're poor. Poor people start out at a disadvantage. 2) They have the highest absentee rate amongst fathers of any group in the country. 3) They don't value education. This is a byproduct of young, single mothers who often don't even finish high school because they get pregnant. Also, you've got uneducated black men who aren't there pushing education on their children.4) High incarceration rate for black men. This again contributes to their absenteeism.5) Bad role models. Whether it's athletes or Jesse/Al, these guys in general aren't doing the AA community a lot of good. They need more positive role models, especially ones that push education.There are probably more factors. It's a combination of all these things that is bringing that community down. And having guys like Jesse/Al constantly blaming whitey for their problems just gives them an out to say "see, we can't get out". Well they can. But it's gonna take work and, since they really don't listen to people not of AA descent it's gonna have to start within their own community.

 

[Darth Cheney]

I'm not going to sit here and say that blacks in America historically haven't had a rough go of it. They've been pretty much crapped on from the moment they landed until a couple of years ago. Only the Native Americans have had it worse...as I would view genocide as worse than enslavement. In addition, they really only gained their social mobility after the frontier closed...( I talk about this alot and I don't think that people realize the importance of the concept of free or cheap arable land to the success of our countries past) so their 1960s freedom came along at a pretty crappy time in our countries development. However, there has to be a point where the system cannot be blamed for individual failures....and instead individuals need to gaze at thier own situation, acknowledge the individual problems that plague them....and do something about it.

 

[fsword]

The downfall of the African American family unit is fairly recent. It's not a result of slavery.

Fixed.If someone wanted to help the American family unit, they could start with the repeal of no-fault divorce and a change of the tax codes and welfare laws.

 

[Jobber]

I think this type of attitude has more to do with it than slavery.

He has a $25 million contract, he's bought a $100,000 car, dropped $146,000 on jewelry ... and yet finds himself a tad on the broke side when it comes to those essential, but oh so pesky, child support payments.

You see, Henry, 28, has nine children ... from nine different women ... in at least four southern states.

(To say he's been a busy man would be quite the understatement.)

He's been ordered to establish a $250,000 trust to cover a new $3000/month child support payment due to his, let's just say, not-so-conservative spending habits.

DeKalb Superior Court Judge Clarence Seeliger this week ordered Henry to provide $3,000 a month for the Lithonia boy he fathered out of wedlock three years ago with Jameshia Beacham, now 29.

Henry isn't the most thrifty guy, according to court records, so the judge wants to ensure payment by establishing an unusual $250,000 trust that Henry must fund by next spring.

Seeliger wrote that the football player displayed "bad judgment in his spending habits," dropping $100,000 for a car and $146,000 for jewelry. Meanwhile, Henry fell behind on support payments for his child with Beacham that were mandated by a previous order. Threatened with jail, he borrowed $9,800 from his former team, the Tennessee Titans, to pay the bill, according to court records.

Funny, how Henry signed a contract with the Broncos in the off-season that guarantees him $12 million and yet had nothing but lint in his pocket for child support.

Funny? No.

Try sad. Really, really, sad.

LINK

Too much of this going on, thats the problem.

Seems like that might be one of the exceptions, not the rule. What percentage of black fathers would fall into this category?

Not many. Most don't even try to pay child support.

Yeah I think we've gone from "OMG Obama made some outrageous comments" to "Journalists shouldn't be clapping at the end of a speech!" to "a black football player didn't pay child support!"I think some are just trying too hard to to find something over which to be outraged.

And this is exactly the point of the thread. When Obama brings up reparations, it spurs talk and debates like this. Another ***** in Obama's armor. This one's self inflicted.

 

[RoarinSonoran]

It would be a wonderful thing to have an African American president.

Why? What about an Azerbaijani-Peruvian-American? Would that be wonderful as well? What about his race, or anyone else's, is so wonderful?Vote for him because you want free health care, not because of his race.

 

[fsword]

It would be a wonderful thing to have an African American president.

Why? What about an Azerbaijani-Peruvian-American? Would that be wonderful as well? What about his race, or anyone else's, is so wonderful?Vote for him because you want free health care, not because of his race.

Imagine the "First Llama" romping the WH grounds at the annual Easter Egg hunt.

 

[jonessed]

Why not just answer the questions?

Obama isn't talking about paying anyone. He's simply pointing out that our mistreatment of various minorities is one factor in some of the challenges we see those groups facing today. He's saying that paying people for past transgressions isn't the answer - but we have an obligation to ensure that those who still suffer from the results of slavery and displacement are put on an even playing field with regard to educational opportunities. What is wrong with that?

I have a hard time believing that people are still being hindered because their great grand dad was a slave.

Slavery destroyed the African 'American' family in this country and it still has not recovered. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? Do I think money will solve the problem, no way! Do I think that many African Americans see effects of slavery on their culture, absolutly.

I am sorry let me fixed that.Slavery was a boon for the African 'American' family in this country and it still reeps the benefits. Do you not understand the value of a solid family unit? They should be payin gus for this great reward we gave them by bringing their ancestors over here so they could now live in freedom.

The downfall of the African American family unit is fairly recent. It's not a result of slavery.

What do you mean when you say recent? Are you saying that the African American family unit was more stable back in the early to mid 1900s? Layout a time line for me.

The American family unit as a whole has been falling apart since the 60s, but African-American families have been falling much faster. By falling I mean more people not getting married, more divorces, and a lot more children born out of wedlock. It's not a result of slavery. I would argue that it's a result of a welfare and tax system that encourages couples not to get married, but there are probably other theories.

First off, this is more class-based within the African American community more than anything. The black middle class is a strong and growing demographic. It's the lower class segment that seems to contain most of the problems. Why is that? You can strongly argue that the environments they grow up in are directly related to Jim Crow and segregation which ties to slavery. Housing projects and ghettos weren't just created out of thin air. They were built and created by our government and our society because we didn't want them living among us. We wanted to force black people to live only in certain areas and we built high-rise projects that did nothing but create a terrible environment in which to live. While much has changed in the past 40 to 50 years, you can't deny that the environments created by those past policies still exist.

The denegration has happened over the past 40 years. This current generation has not held onto the family values of their parents and grandparents. I think it's difficult to argue that problems relating to slavery somehow skipped generations that, for all intents and purposes, had it much worse.Housing projects are a product of Section 8 housing laws, which is a welfare product. Our welfare system has failed. Much like our schools, we continue to throw money at a system that's completely broken.

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

I think this type of attitude has more to do with it than slavery.

He has a $25 million contract, he's bought a $100,000 car, dropped $146,000 on jewelry ... and yet finds himself a tad on the broke side when it comes to those essential, but oh so pesky, child support payments.

You see, Henry, 28, has nine children ... from nine different women ... in at least four southern states.

(To say he's been a busy man would be quite the understatement.)

He's been ordered to establish a $250,000 trust to cover a new $3000/month child support payment due to his, let's just say, not-so-conservative spending habits.

DeKalb Superior Court Judge Clarence Seeliger this week ordered Henry to provide $3,000 a month for the Lithonia boy he fathered out of wedlock three years ago with Jameshia Beacham, now 29.

Henry isn't the most thrifty guy, according to court records, so the judge wants to ensure payment by establishing an unusual $250,000 trust that Henry must fund by next spring.

Seeliger wrote that the football player displayed "bad judgment in his spending habits," dropping $100,000 for a car and $146,000 for jewelry. Meanwhile, Henry fell behind on support payments for his child with Beacham that were mandated by a previous order. Threatened with jail, he borrowed $9,800 from his former team, the Tennessee Titans, to pay the bill, according to court records.

Funny, how Henry signed a contract with the Broncos in the off-season that guarantees him $12 million and yet had nothing but lint in his pocket for child support.

Funny? No.

Try sad. Really, really, sad.

LINK

Too much of this going on, thats the problem.

Seems like that might be one of the exceptions, not the rule. What percentage of black fathers would fall into this category?

Not many. Most don't even try to pay child support.

Yeah I think we've gone from "OMG Obama made some outrageous comments" to "Journalists shouldn't be clapping at the end of a speech!" to "a black football player didn't pay child support!"I think some are just trying too hard to to find something over which to be outraged.

And this is exactly the point of the thread.

Thanks Jobber, that what I figured.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Do you also attribute the problems in the Black community to welfare and other entitlement programs?

Not specifically. I don't think they help. I think there are a lot of issues contributing to the problems in the black community, at least the problem parts of the black community:1) They're poor. Poor people start out at a disadvantage. 2) They have the highest absentee rate amongst fathers of any group in the country. 3) They don't value education. This is a byproduct of young, single mothers who often don't even finish high school because they get pregnant. Also, you've got uneducated black men who aren't there pushing education on their children.4) High incarceration rate for black men. This again contributes to their absenteeism.5) Bad role models. Whether it's athletes or Jesse/Al, these guys in general aren't doing the AA community a lot of good. They need more positive role models, especially ones that push education.There are probably more factors. It's a combination of all these things that is bringing that community down. And having guys like Jesse/Al constantly blaming whitey for their problems just gives them an out to say "see, we can't get out". Well they can. But it's gonna take work and, since they really don't listen to people not of AA descent it's gonna have to start within their own community.

Thanks for your response. I agree with a lot of your points, but most of your causes aren't really "root" causes -- each of them has in turn been caused by earlier events. What, for example, explains the high rate of absentee fatherhood? What explains the lack of appreciation for the benefits of education (and delaying pregnancy)? What explains the high incarceration rate?

 

[StrikeS2k]

Do you also attribute the problems in the Black community to welfare and other entitlement programs?

Not specifically. I don't think they help. I think there are a lot of issues contributing to the problems in the black community, at least the problem parts of the black community:1) They're poor. Poor people start out at a disadvantage. 2) They have the highest absentee rate amongst fathers of any group in the country. 3) They don't value education. This is a byproduct of young, single mothers who often don't even finish high school because they get pregnant. Also, you've got uneducated black men who aren't there pushing education on their children.4) High incarceration rate for black men. This again contributes to their absenteeism.5) Bad role models. Whether it's athletes or Jesse/Al, these guys in general aren't doing the AA community a lot of good. They need more positive role models, especially ones that push education.There are probably more factors. It's a combination of all these things that is bringing that community down. And having guys like Jesse/Al constantly blaming whitey for their problems just gives them an out to say "see, we can't get out". Well they can. But it's gonna take work and, since they really don't listen to people not of AA descent it's gonna have to start within their own community.

Thanks for your response. I agree with a lot of your points, but most of your causes aren't really "root" causes -- each of them has in turn been caused by earlier events. What, for example, explains the high rate of absentee fatherhood? What explains the lack of appreciation for the benefits of education (and delaying pregnancy)? What explains the high incarceration rate?

Well, the high incarceration rate is easy to explain. It's a result of a lot of AA men committing crimes. The others are tougher to explain. I'm just gonna quote another poster who I think said what needs to be said best:

I'm not going to sit here and say that blacks in America historically haven't had a rough go of it. They've been pretty much crapped on from the moment they landed until a couple of years ago. Only the Native Americans have had it worse...as I would view genocide as worse than enslavement. In addition, they really only gained their social mobility after the frontier closed...( I talk about this alot and I don't think that people realize the importance of the concept of free or cheap arable land to the success of our countries past) so their 1960s freedom came along at a pretty crappy time in our countries development. However, there has to be a point where the system cannot be blamed for individual failures....and instead individuals need to gaze at thier own situation, acknowledge the individual problems that plague them....and do something about it.

At some point you just have to say enough is enough. We aren't going to get AA's out of the gutter through entitlement programs. They need to take responsibility for their own lot in life as everyone does.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I agree with a lot of your points, but most of your causes aren't really "root" causes -- each of them has in turn been caused by earlier events. What, for example, explains the high rate of absentee fatherhood? What explains the lack of appreciation for the benefits of education (and delaying pregnancy)? What explains the high incarceration rate?

Well, the high incarceration rate is easy to explain. It's a result of a lot of AA men committing crimes. The others are tougher to explain.

Again, the fact that black men commit more crimes, if true, isn't really that satisfactory of an answer. Why do black men commit more crimes than men of other races?

 

[StrikeS2k]

I agree with a lot of your points, but most of your causes aren't really "root" causes -- each of them has in turn been caused by earlier events. What, for example, explains the high rate of absentee fatherhood? What explains the lack of appreciation for the benefits of education (and delaying pregnancy)? What explains the high incarceration rate?

Well, the high incarceration rate is easy to explain. It's a result of a lot of AA men committing crimes. The others are tougher to explain.

Again, the fact that black men commit more crimes, if true, isn't really that satisfactory of an answer. Why do black men commit more crimes than men of other races?

Look, it seems you have a point you're trying to make. Go ahead and make it. Me, I'm not really in to the whole "root cause" thing. The bottom line, to me, is that the problems in the AA community NOW stem mainly from the issues I mentioned above. If they want it to get better they need to address those issues, not why those issues exist.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I agree with a lot of your points, but most of your causes aren't really "root" causes -- each of them has in turn been caused by earlier events. What, for example, explains the high rate of absentee fatherhood? What explains the lack of appreciation for the benefits of education (and delaying pregnancy)? What explains the high incarceration rate?

Well, the high incarceration rate is easy to explain. It's a result of a lot of AA men committing crimes. The others are tougher to explain.

Again, the fact that black men commit more crimes, if true, isn't really that satisfactory of an answer. Why do black men commit more crimes than men of other races?

Look, it seems you have a point you're trying to make. Go ahead and make it. Me, I'm not really in to the whole "root cause" thing. The bottom line, to me, is that the problems in the AA community NOW stem mainly from the issues I mentioned above. If they want it to get better they need to address those issues, not why those issues exist.

My point is that your analysis is pretty superficial.

 

[StrikeS2k]

I agree with a lot of your points, but most of your causes aren't really "root" causes -- each of them has in turn been caused by earlier events. What, for example, explains the high rate of absentee fatherhood? What explains the lack of appreciation for the benefits of education (and delaying pregnancy)? What explains the high incarceration rate?

Well, the high incarceration rate is easy to explain. It's a result of a lot of AA men committing crimes. The others are tougher to explain.

Again, the fact that black men commit more crimes, if true, isn't really that satisfactory of an answer. Why do black men commit more crimes than men of other races?

Look, it seems you have a point you're trying to make. Go ahead and make it. Me, I'm not really in to the whole "root cause" thing. The bottom line, to me, is that the problems in the AA community NOW stem mainly from the issues I mentioned above. If they want it to get better they need to address those issues, not why those issues exist.

My point is that your analysis is pretty superficial.

Actually I think my point is spot on. But let's hear your reasons for the problems in the black community and what needs to be done to improve things there. TIA

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Actually I think my point is spot on. But let's hear your reasons for the problems in the black community and what needs to be done to improve things there. TIA

I don't have all the answers. But I'm fairly certain that the situation will not improve by saying "enough is enough ... They need to take responsibility for their own lot in life."

 

[RBM]

Actually I think my point is spot on. But let's hear your reasons for the problems in the black community and what needs to be done to improve things there. TIA

I don't have all the answers. But I'm fairly certain that the situation will not improve by saying "enough is enough ... They need to take responsibility for their own lot in life."

Are you kidding me?

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Actually I think my point is spot on. But let's hear your reasons for the problems in the black community and what needs to be done to improve things there. TIA

I don't have all the answers. But I'm fairly certain that the situation will not improve by saying "enough is enough ... They need to take responsibility for their own lot in life."

Are you kidding me?

No.