Obama To Announce Uncostitutional Amnesty (1 Viewer)

[HellToupee]

Tom has to learn how to do a proper link

Are you struggling with clicking that one?

"who's that man?"

 

[joffer]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

guy mowing your lawn mightt want a raise

 

[timschochet]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.

So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

 

[George Jefferson Airplane]

How long after the new Congress takes office are they trying to impeach?

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Nice piece looking at the Reagan/Bush executive order amnesty and how it's the same/different from Obama's proposed executive order amnesty.

 

[cstu]

Nice piece looking at the Reagan/Bush executive order amnesty and how it's the same/different from Obama's proposed executive order amnesty.

This struck many — including Reagan — as unfair. The year after IRCA passed, President Reagan took executive action to keep some of those spouses and kids from getting deported. Reagan said that children who had two parents who were legalizing, or were being raised by a single parent who was legalizing, could get something called "extended voluntary departure" — basically a grant of protection from deportation with a work permit, similar to what the Deferred Action For Childhood Arrivals program (DACA, protecting "DREAMers") uses today. And in particular cases, spouses of IRCA beneficiaries could apply, too. Reagan called it the Family Fairness program.

Reagan, that damn liberal.

 

[jamny]

Nice piece looking at the Reagan/Bush executive order amnesty and how it's the same/different from Obama's proposed executive order amnesty.

Still not the same though. Reagan and Bush made changes to something that passed Congress. Obama intends to take up something that only passed in the Senate.

 

[TobiasFunke]

Nice piece looking at the Reagan/Bush executive order amnesty and how it's the same/different from Obama's proposed executive order amnesty.

Still not the same though. Reagan and Bush made changes to something that passed Congress. Obama intends to take up something that only passed in the Senate.

Most would argue that the former is far worse. When Congress is silent the President has far more latitude to act than if legislation is already in place.

 

[tommyboy]

Listening to an immigration lawyer on the radio and she made the point that the reality is that the courts are so backed up on illegal immigration that very little deportation is being done anyhow. We are never going to deport most of these people; they're here to stay. So why not acknowledge the fact?

Because amnesty without secure borders ensures this will happen again and again.

well personally that's fine with me .But in point of fact the proposed bill that passed the Senate did secure the borders. But the House refused to vote on it because they won't tolerate ANY recognition that the illegals already here aren't going back home.

so you obviously don't care about the Poor in America that need higher wages and better paying jobs then.

How can any liberal Democrat, or any Democrat for that matter honestly be in favor of wide open borders and helping the poorest Americans at the same time? These are two competing and opposing forces.

 

[tommyboy]

How long after the new Congress takes office are they trying to impeach?

Obama won't be impeached, he's the gift that keeps on giving for Republicans

 

[cstu]

How does Amnesty work? Every 20 years we just "accept" all the illegals who are here and just start over?

How does that ever solve the problem of ILLEGAL immigration?

Until there's a viable system for stopping illegals from crossing border, yes, that's what will happen.

Bush had a chance to do something but his Secure Border Initiative, unsurprisingly, failed miserably.

 

[jamny]

Nice piece looking at the Reagan/Bush executive order amnesty and how it's the same/different from Obama's proposed executive order amnesty.

Still not the same though. Reagan and Bush made changes to something that passed Congress. Obama intends to take up something that only passed in the Senate.

Most would argue that the former is far worse. When Congress is silent the President has far more latitude to act than if legislation is already in place.

Won't argue that but they are different. The former is more like when Obama made changes to Obamacare. Now he's taking it a step further.

 

[cstu]

How long after the new Congress takes office are they trying to impeach?

Obama won't be impeached, he's the gift that keeps on giving for Republicans

What good is controlling Congress if there's a Democrat as President who gets to veto everything and nominate Supreme Court justices?

 

[cstu]

Listening to an immigration lawyer on the radio and she made the point that the reality is that the courts are so backed up on illegal immigration that very little deportation is being done anyhow. We are never going to deport most of these people; they're here to stay. So why not acknowledge the fact?

Because amnesty without secure borders ensures this will happen again and again.

well personally that's fine with me .But in point of fact the proposed bill that passed the Senate did secure the borders. But the House refused to vote on it because they won't tolerate ANY recognition that the illegals already here aren't going back home.

so you obviously don't care about the Poor in America that need higher wages and better paying jobs then.

How can any liberal Democrat, or any Democrat for that matter honestly be in favor of wide open borders and helping the poorest Americans at the same time? These are two competing and opposing forces.

I'm not in favor of wide open borders but once people are here and assimilating then it does more harm than good to attempt to kick them out.

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.

So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

 

[cstu]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.

So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

Crossing the border isn't committing a 'real' crime like theft and murder.

You commit a crime every day by speeding, are you not law abiding?

 

[Jim11]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.

So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

Spouting the Obama Admin. talking points, I see. Maybe all 7,000,000,000+ people on earth should move to the USA. More benefits!

edited to add a few zeros.

 

[cstu]

Spouting the Obama Admin. talking points, I see. Maybe all 7,000,000+ people on earth should move to the USA. More benefits!

Look at me, I can type words too!!

 

[tommyboy]

Listening to an immigration lawyer on the radio and she made the point that the reality is that the courts are so backed up on illegal immigration that very little deportation is being done anyhow. We are never going to deport most of these people; they're here to stay. So why not acknowledge the fact?

Because amnesty without secure borders ensures this will happen again and again.

well personally that's fine with me .But in point of fact the proposed bill that passed the Senate did secure the borders. But the House refused to vote on it because they won't tolerate ANY recognition that the illegals already here aren't going back home.

so you obviously don't care about the Poor in America that need higher wages and better paying jobs then.

How can any liberal Democrat, or any Democrat for that matter honestly be in favor of wide open borders and helping the poorest Americans at the same time? These are two competing and opposing forces.

I'm not in favor of wide open borders but once people are here and assimilating then it does more harm than good to attempt to kick them out.

here's a hint, we aren't attempting to kick them out

 

[timschochet]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

Spouting the Obama Admin. talking points, I see. Maybe all 7,000,000+ people on earth should move to the USA. More benefits!

How I wish those were his talking points or any major politician for that matter. But sadly they are my own.

 

[joffer]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.

So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

Spouting the Obama Admin. talking points, I see. Maybe all 7,000,000+ people on earth should move to the USA. More benefits!

lol

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Prediction: In 2021 Hillary Clinton signs a treaty with North Korea that involves UN inspections of North Korean nuclear facilities. At the signing she says, "Trust, but verify."

Republicans fill the Internet with explanations of how it's different than when Ronald Reagan said it.

 

[timschochet]

Listening to an immigration lawyer on the radio and she made the point that the reality is that the courts are so backed up on illegal immigration that very little deportation is being done anyhow. We are never going to deport most of these people; they're here to stay. So why not acknowledge the fact?

Because amnesty without secure borders ensures this will happen again and again.

well personally that's fine with me .But in point of fact the proposed bill that passed the Senate did secure the borders. But the House refused to vote on it because they won't tolerate ANY recognition that the illegals already here aren't going back home.

so you obviously don't care about the Poor in America that need higher wages and better paying jobs then.

How can any liberal Democrat, or any Democrat for that matter honestly be in favor of wide open borders and helping the poorest Americans at the same time? These are two competing and opposing forces.

i can't answer your question Tommyboy because I'm not a liberal Democrat. I don't believe in the minimum wage. The best long term way to help the poor is through free trade. I regard illegal immigrants as a form of free trade of labor. It's capitalism I am defending not socialism. Ultimately you can't set wages any more than you can set prices. There will always be a black market, impossible to stop, which represents the price of goods at their actual value, including labor. Illegal immigrants in this country are that black market.

 

[Yankee23Fan]

Wait....

When did we lose 90% of the population of the Earth? Holy h-e-double hockey sticks! That happened on Obama's watch? Do we have that many drones?

 

[urbanhack]

Listening to an immigration lawyer on the radio and she made the point that the reality is that the courts are so backed up on illegal immigration that very little deportation is being done anyhow. We are never going to deport most of these people; they're here to stay. So why not acknowledge the fact?

Because amnesty without secure borders ensures this will happen again and again.

well personally that's fine with me .But in point of fact the proposed bill that passed the Senate did secure the borders. But the House refused to vote on it because they won't tolerate ANY recognition that the illegals already here aren't going back home.

so you obviously don't care about the Poor in America that need higher wages and better paying jobs then.

How can any liberal Democrat, or any Democrat for that matter honestly be in favor of wide open borders and helping the poorest Americans at the same time? These are two competing and opposing forces.

I'm not in favor of wide open borders but once people are here and assimilating then it does more harm than good to attempt to kick them out.

here's a hint, we aren't attempting to kick them out

No...Obama has done a damn fine job of deporting them the last few years on his own.

 

[TobiasFunke]

Nice piece looking at the Reagan/Bush executive order amnesty and how it's the same/different from Obama's proposed executive order amnesty.

Still not the same though. Reagan and Bush made changes to something that passed Congress. Obama intends to take up something that only passed in the Senate.

Most would argue that the former is far worse. When Congress is silent the President has far more latitude to act than if legislation is already in place.

Won't argue that but they are different. The former is more like when Obama made changes to Obamacare. Now he's taking it a step further.

No, he's not taking it "a step further. He's doing the opposite- not taking it as far as Reagan and Bush- because he's not overriding Congressional action.

To give you an example from something I know well, the Keystone debate. Both branches have Constitutional authority to regulate borders. Because Congress didn't act w/r/t pipelines across the borders the President was free to do so. If Congress chooses to act, that action would limit the president going forward.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Wait....

When did we lose 90% of the population of the Earth? Holy h-e-double hockey sticks! That happened on Obama's watch? Do we have that many drones?

It's worse than that YF23... 99.9% down the drain.

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.

So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

Crossing the border isn't committing a 'real' crime like theft and murder.

You commit a crime every day by speeding, are you not law abiding?

is providing a fake social security # a 'real' crime?

 

[siffoin]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.

So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

Spouting the Obama Admin. talking points, I see. Maybe all 7,000,000+ people on earth should move to the USA. More benefits!

I'm open to learn more. Can you tell me from your point of view how this will have any specific impact on my life?

 

[Yankee23Fan]

Wait....

When did we lose 90% of the population of the Earth? Holy h-e-double hockey sticks! That happened on Obama's watch? Do we have that many drones?

It's worse than that YF23... 99.9% down the drain.

And we're worried about the IRS and Benghanzi and birth certificates? Gengis Khan didn't kill that many people. I thought all that drone stuff was a little overblown but now I'm freaking out. Is, like, the entire continent of Africa just empty right now?

 

[timschochet]

Wait....

When did we lose 90% of the population of the Earth? Holy h-e-double hockey sticks! That happened on Obama's watch? Do we have that many drones?

It's worse than that YF23... 99.9% down the drain.

And we're worried about the IRS and Benghanzi and birth certificates? Gengis Khan didn't kill that many people. I thought all that drone stuff was a little overblown but now I'm freaking out. Is, like, the entire continent of Africa just empty right now?

Ebola is in the rivers, so it soon will be.

 

[tommyboy]

Listening to an immigration lawyer on the radio and she made the point that the reality is that the courts are so backed up on illegal immigration that very little deportation is being done anyhow. We are never going to deport most of these people; they're here to stay. So why not acknowledge the fact?

Because amnesty without secure borders ensures this will happen again and again.

well personally that's fine with me .But in point of fact the proposed bill that passed the Senate did secure the borders. But the House refused to vote on it because they won't tolerate ANY recognition that the illegals already here aren't going back home.

so you obviously don't care about the Poor in America that need higher wages and better paying jobs then.

How can any liberal Democrat, or any Democrat for that matter honestly be in favor of wide open borders and helping the poorest Americans at the same time? These are two competing and opposing forces.

I'm not in favor of wide open borders but once people are here and assimilating then it does more harm than good to attempt to kick them out.

here's a hint, we aren't attempting to kick them out

No...Obama has done a damn fine job of deporting them the last few years on his own.

which is also false

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2014/jul/15/lou-dobbs/lou-dobbs-obama-administration-manipulated-deporta/

 

[HellToupee]

I'm glad that none of the Ds I personally know don't talk & act like most of the Ds here at FBG

 

[CBusAlex]

so you obviously don't care about the Poor in America that need higher wages and better paying jobs then.

How can any liberal Democrat, or any Democrat for that matter honestly be in favor of wide open borders and helping the poorest Americans at the same time? These are two competing and opposing forces.

More immigrants = more consumers for American goods = more jobs in America. HTH.

 

[CBusAlex]

here's a hint, we aren't attempting to kick them out

What exactly do you think "deportation" is?

 

[squistion]

I'm glad that none of the Ds I personally know don't talk & act like most of the Ds here at FBG

Yes, if the D's here only had the class and sophistication that you have demonstrated in this forum.

Easy there piss pot.

 

[tommyboy]

here's a hint, we aren't attempting to kick them out

What exactly do you think "deportation" is?

not what you think it is

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2014/jul/15/lou-dobbs/lou-dobbs-obama-administration-manipulated-deporta/

 

[FlapJacks]

There's definitely a real question here about where executive authority ends in the absence of a controlling statute. But it's just that -- a question.

And it's good politics for Obama to ask the question and watch conservatives/Republicans/Tea Partiers/loons (pick four) flip out.

Obama's going to stir up the hornets nest as many times as he can during the next two years, too. If you can't get good policy you might as well do good politics.

Not just good politics. It's pretty downright brilliant. Conservatives go crazy and Dems get a lock on the Latino vote forever.

if so, it would do as much for the Latino community as it has done for the Black community for the past 40 years

 

[tommyboy]

so you obviously don't care about the Poor in America that need higher wages and better paying jobs then.

How can any liberal Democrat, or any Democrat for that matter honestly be in favor of wide open borders and helping the poorest Americans at the same time? These are two competing and opposing forces.

More immigrants = more consumers for American goods = more jobs in America. HTH.

= lower wages paid to make those goods = fat cat 1% make more profits while poor Americans remain poor and unemployed

 

[FlapJacks]

This whole argument about adding voters is really silly. It will be years (decades?) before any illegals are citizens eligible to vote.

Since when has that ever stopped anybody from voting?

 

[FlapJacks]

Listening to an immigration lawyer on the radio and she made the point that the reality is that the courts are so backed up on illegal immigration that very little deportation is being done anyhow. We are never going to deport most of these people; they're here to stay. So why not acknowledge the fact?

Ah, the old "It's too hard so let's just ignore the problem and it'll go away" argument. This is the logic of impotent, dying societies.

Actually no. The solution to this "problem" is to let them stay and benefit our society.

By letting them stay you are debasing the legal foundation upon which this nation was founded, thereby damaging society. Either we are a nation of laws or we are not. "Rules for thee and not for me" is not how healthy, well-run nations conduct business.

what foundation? I suggest sometime you ask a Native American what they think of our legal foundation and whether or not our ancestors came here "legally". What a joke.

The follow up would be to ask them how letting the Europeans stay worked out for them...

 

[timschochet]

There's definitely a real question here about where executive authority ends in the absence of a controlling statute. But it's just that -- a question.

And it's good politics for Obama to ask the question and watch conservatives/Republicans/Tea Partiers/loons (pick four) flip out.

Obama's going to stir up the hornets nest as many times as he can during the next two years, too. If you can't get good policy you might as well do good politics.

Not just good politics. It's pretty downright brilliant. Conservatives go crazy and Dems get a lock on the Latino vote forever.

if so, and it would do the same thing for the Latino community as it has done for the Black community for the past 50 years

Exactly. Although blacks vote for Dems 80-90%. The Dems will never repeat that with Latinos, but if they can get 60-70%, that will be enough for them. In particular, it will within 10 years, at the latest 20, put Texas squarely in the blue column. When that happens it's the ballgame: no more Republican Presidents.

 

[timschochet]

This whole argument about adding voters is really silly. It will be years (decades?) before any illegals are citizens eligible to vote.

Since when has that ever stopped anybody from voting?

Can you prove this massive voting fraud you keep claiming?

 

[HellToupee]

I'm glad that none of the Ds I personally know don't talk & act like most of the Ds here at FBG

Yes, if the D's here only had the class and sophistication that you have demonstrated in this forum.

Easy there piss pot.

Your twisted obsession with me continues

 

[jamny]

How are people justifying this after Obama himself has said many times that it is unconstitutional and that he wouldn't do it?

Now it's ok?

 

[HellToupee]

How are people justifying this after Obama himself has said many times that it is unconstitutional and that he wouldn't do it?

Now it's ok?

Ds=GoodRs=Bad

 

[squistion]

I'm glad that none of the Ds I personally know don't talk & act like most of the Ds here at FBG

Yes, if the D's here only had the class and sophistication that you have demonstrated in this forum.

Easy there piss pot.

Your twisted obsession with me continues

If you are going to be hypocritical, expect to be called out on it.

 

[HellToupee]

I'm glad that none of the Ds I personally know don't talk & act like most of the Ds here at FBG

Yes, if the D's here only had the class and sophistication that you have demonstrated in this forum.

Easy there piss pot.

Your twisted obsession with me continues

If you are going to be hypocritical, expect to be called out on it.

I stand by my statement. None of the Ds I know espouse the beliefs I see here

 

[TobiasFunke]

Gotta admit this whole "Obama is acting like a king" shtick is pure gold. Especially coming from the small handful of guys who got together last year and unilaterally decided to shut down the entire freaking government over a petty squabble despite the clear wishes of the vast majority of the population and their elected representatives.

 

[RCon]

I know nothing about this issue:

Can anyone tell me if this has any meaningful and direct impact on my life?

It will not. Illegal immigrants benefit you and every other American by their presence. They lower prices and pay taxes into the system without receiving nearly as many benefits in return as legal citizens. They often strengthen the dollar by sending their money back home.They are, for the most part, much harder workers than ordinary citizens, more law abiding, and in general better Americans because they risked their lives to come here and understand in every fiber of their beings what a great country this is- they appreciate more than many of those who are born here.

So giving a portion of them legal status will not affect your life except to help maintain the prosperity these people bring us. Only by forcibly deporting illegal immigrants would your life be affected in a negative manner.

The above is, of course, only an opinion, not fact. Many other knowledgeable people do not share this opinion.