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Obama's Legacy Ruined? (1 Viewer)

My thoughts on Obama

  • I think he was good to great and this election doesn't change that

    Votes: 59 36.6%

  • I think he was good to great and now I am not as sure

    Votes: 5 3.1%

  • I think he was average and this election doesn't change that

    Votes: 37 23.0%

  • I think he was average and now I am not as sure

    Votes: 6 3.7%

  • I think he was below average and this election confirms that

    Votes: 52 32.3%

  • Other, explain

    Votes: 2 1.2%
  • Total voters
    161
fantasycurse42

fantasycurse42

Footballguy Jr.
Just had an interesting conversation this morning:

Does the outcome of this election change your opinion on Obama?

 
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I'm not sure how many opinions this immediately changed, but it certainly put a damper on his potential historical impact, which will affect people's opinions in the future.

 
FWIW, his legacy can be ruined without necessarily changing your opinion of him.  His legacy is what he leaves in his wake.  Whether your perceptions are favorable or unfavorable, many of his executive orders can be easily erased stifling his legacy.

 
I think he was average and it doesn't change my opinion. That being said, it could very well change how history views his legacy. 

 
bud29 said:
I'm not sure how many opinions this immediately changed, but it certainly put a damper on his potential historical impact, which will affect people's opinions in the future.
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You serious Clark?

Apparently you missed the part of last night where the country elected a guy to basically say #### you :shrug:

For anyone who said he did so great, why are so many people pissed?

 
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In fairness, I don't think people's opinions changed because of the outcome, the outcome was in large part because of their already held opinion.

Now if you asked if I think this hurts his legacy, I would answer that it absolutely does.

 
fantasycurse42 said:
You serious Clark?

Apparently you missed the part of last night where the country elected a guy to basically say #### you :shrug:

For anyone who said he did so great, why are so many people pissed?
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The people that are pissed are the people who feel entitled to more than they've been given recently.  F those people. 

 
fantasycurse42 said:
You serious Clark?

Apparently you missed the part of last night where the country elected a guy to basically say #### you :shrug:
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It would certainly be an indictment of Obama if the dems had put up a solid candidate and still lost to Trump - but instead, the DNC chose the bland, corrupt, widely loathed politician. They did him no favors. 

I get what you're saying, that Hillary was essentially an Obama 3rd term and she lost. But the messenger matters as much as the message. Do you think Obama himself would have lost to Trump last night? I don't.

 
FUBAR said:
The people that are pissed are the people who feel entitled to more than they've been given recently.  F those people. 
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This was sorta my opinion and the counter which I kinda agree with is I'm in a bubble and clearly not in touch with reality or what the people wanted.

 
Is there a list somewhere of all the executive orders and other things that Trump and Congress can easily reverse?

 
bud29 said:
It would certainly be an indictment of Obama if the dems had put up a solid candidate and still lost to Trump - but instead, the DNC chose the bland, corrupt, widely loathed politician. They did him no favors. 

I get what you're saying, that Hillary was essentially an Obama 3rd term and she lost. But the messenger matters as much as the message. Do you think Obama himself would have lost to Trump last night? I don't.
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At best I'd say this is a 50/50. You think that people that came out in huge numbers would've changed their vote for Obama?

They didn't vote for Trump, they voted against political robots and the establishment, so very possibly.

 
Obama will have a good legacy.  He will benefit from becoming President at a perfect time.  A time when the economy was over-reacting to a crisis of unknown proportions.  As soon as we figured our banking system was not doomed, the economy started to recover.  Obama's contribution was a stimulus package which provided temporary relief to the poor and working class.  It provided fuel to the economy, so kudos.  Getting Osama was good, although I am still puzzled why he spent 80 percent of his speech patting himself on the back.  Obamacare was a mixed bag.  Did not live up to the promises and probably did cause rates to increase, but more people are covered.  Got two younger staunch liberals on the Supreme Court, so if you are liberal that was a plus.  His second term was almost pointless, but he did no harm.  Race relations deteriorated and I felt he missed his opportunity and calling.  Middle East is still a hot mess, but no real war.  Not much to hate, not much to love.  The economy did get better, but it is hard to give him more than a minor assist.  He lead with a calmness and was a good speaker, but did not very little to reach out to the other side.  Failed to convince Biden to run and probably should have tried to help Bernie win in hindsight.  Reluctantly got behind Hillary, whose loss will be a undoing of his biggest accomplishment, Obamacare. 

 
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This poll will confirm why we're a narrow minded society IMO - The good/great voters will not change their stance even though America just said #### you Obama/Hillary. I'd bet beyond the small sample size here, the majority in that good to great wouldn't rethink it either.

I voted "I think he was average and am now not as sure." If you don't think the outcome last night is the American majority saying they're unhappy and you still won't even rethink your stance that he might not have been as great as you think he was, you could be in a bubble.

 
fantasycurse42 said:
This was sorta my opinion and the counter which I kinda agree with is I'm in a bubble and clearly not in touch with reality or what the people wanted.
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True.  My workforce, while fairly well diversified racially, sexually, and by any other normal demographic, is separated big time from others who aren't "like us". 

 
T J said:
In fairness, I don't think people's opinions changed because of the outcome, the outcome was in large part because of their already held opinion.

Now if you asked if I think this hurts his legacy, I would answer that it absolutely does.
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:goodposting:

 
fantasycurse42 said:
This poll will confirm why we're a narrow minded society IMO - The good/great voters will not change their stance even though America just said #### you Obama/Hillary. I'd bet beyond the small sample size here, the majority in that good to great wouldn't rethink it either.

I voted "I think he was average and am now not as sure." If you don't think the outcome last night is the American majority saying they're unhappy and you still won't even rethink your stance that he might not have been as great as you think he was, you could be in a bubble.
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Obama would've #####slapped the Drumpfster across three time zones, as would have anyone who hadn't spent 25 years building a 'no####inway' constituency like Hillary. And Obama was a terrible President - he cut one awful deal to get his legacy legislation and spent the rest of his time letting the world happen then telling America how awful to feel about it and what he would have done if he did stuff.

 
This is like saying that Clinton's legacy was ruined b/c Gore struck out playing softball.  It couldn't have been any easier for Hillary.  She's just an absolute dog#### candidate.  

 
fantasycurse42 said:
At best I'd say this is a 50/50. You think that people that came out in huge numbers would've changed their vote for Obama?
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No, the pro-Trump newcomers were Trump or bust. Obama would probably lose the states that saw major turnout increases this year. MI/WI/NH actually saw decreased turnout from 2012 though, and PA pretty much held steady. I don't think he lets those states get away, and from that point it's pretty easy to get to 270.

 
Wait..what? Obama had a legacy?? Puhlease.21 tril in debt more than all other presidents combined.worst piece of legislation in U.S. history , comically called 'affordable' care act.

Most racially divisive person to ever hold the WH. 

Constantly out-foxed on int'l stage..remember him asking 'Mr. President can I see you now?' to chinese president? 

Puppet for George Soros. Worst recovery since 1940s.slowest GDP in decades.

Rampant job losses and 'new' ones went to govt .

Worst president in US history and its not close. 

Who the hell is talking about a legacy?? 

Screw democrats they've ruined the country enough.

Lets not forget how many senate seats Obama lost in his years.he lost congress as well.and how many states have GOP gubners now?? Yeah ,um, Obama has NO legacy, people.none whatsoever.

 he DID abuse his power with executive orders..

Get over it. Obamacare RIP JAN 20 2017..

Boom.

Ding dong the witch is dead ,the witch is dead...

 
Barack Obama was one of the greatest (if not THE greatest) campaigner of our time.  He hired fantastic campaign organizers and speech writers.  He was simply great at getting elected.  

When he had you down he put his boot on your throat and didn't let you up.  One of the most competitive people I've ever seen.  But his competitive nature was also one of his greatest weaknesses.  He saw everything as a zero sum "if you win, I lose" or "if they win, we lose" type event.  He never learned the finesse side of politics, where you ask for 100% and then "settle" and accept 85%.  He had willing partners on the right (gang of eight, Boehner) to provide him with cover on all kinds of things if he'd have just played ball.  All they needed was a little ego stroke and some kind words from Obama making them seem like an important part of the process and he could have had a string of legislative victories.  When you're too far left to get cover from Susan Collins, you need to make some adjustments.  

Did Obama accomplish everything he set out to do?  He's the only one that will know.  Maybe he wanted Obamacare pushed through, and everything else was a bonus.  In that respect he'd look upon his Presidency as a rousing success.

He wasted an incredible opportunity.  He could have been so much more, a truly transformative figure in American politics.  Instead, he got a lot of Democrats fired.  The scorched Earth of Obamacare is littered with the political bones of those that supported it.  Obamacare also initiated a wave of victories for Republicans in local government. That wave doesn't look like it'll slow down in 2018 either. 

His legacy isn't going to be great.  There's a litany of bad stuff that happened with his administration during the Presidency that is going to have a big bright light shining on it in the coming years.

I thought he was great at getting elected and fantastic at rousing his base.  I thought he was horrible at all other aspects of the Presidency.  History will not be kind to Barack Obama, and the books outlining what a bad President he was will by far eclipse those that try to highlight anything that might even be considered average about his 2 terms.

With a few tweaks, he could have been a really great President.

 
wikkidpissah said:
Obama was a terrible President - he cut one awful deal to get his legacy legislation and spent the rest of his time letting the world happen then telling America how awful to feel about it and what he would have done if he did stuff.
Click to expand...


Statorama said:
I thought he was great at getting elected and fantastic at rousing his base.  I thought he was horrible at all other aspects of the Presidency.  History will not be kind to Barack Obama, and the books outlining what a bad President he was will by far eclipse those that try to highlight anything that might even be considered average about his 2 terms.
Click to expand...


:goodposting:

IMO his legacy would have been lousy no matter who won this election, and that would have been more evident the further removed we get from his presidency. Obamacare dwarfs everything else he did or didn't do, and thus dictates his legacy... and Obamacare is a disaster.

 
Tanner9919 said:
Wait..what? Obama had a legacy?? Puhlease.21 tril in debt more than all other presidents combined.worst piece of legislation in U.S. history , comically called 'affordable' care act.

Most racially divisive person to ever hold the WH. 

Constantly out-foxed on int'l stage..remember him asking 'Mr. President can I see you now?' to chinese president? 

Puppet for George Soros. Worst recovery since 1940s.slowest GDP in decades.

Rampant job losses and 'new' ones went to govt .

Worst president in US history and its not close. 

Who the hell is talking about a legacy?? 

Screw democrats they've ruined the country enough.

Lets not forget how many senate seats Obama lost in his years.he lost congress as well.and how many states have GOP gubners now?? Yeah ,um, Obama has NO legacy, people.none whatsoever.

 he DID abuse his power with executive orders..

Get over it. Obamacare RIP JAN 20 2017..

Boom.

Ding dong the witch is dead ,the witch is dead...
Click to expand...
So hilarious that people like this will think they're in charge now. G'ahead, shill some more for people who wouldnt cross the street to piss on you.

 
His legacy was signed into law  March 23rd, 2010.  He did that willingly and with aforethought.  

For better or worse that's what he'll be known for - I don't think the election results change his legacy at all.  Trump is a political non sequitur.

 
I think Obama will be this generation's Jimmy Carter. His true impact will be made during his years after he is out of the White House, when he has the clout to work on projects that he wants without the constraints of being POTUS.

Both are leaving office relativity young (Obama 55 - Carter 57). Both have had pretty vanilla presidencies. Obamacare will most likely be remembered like Carter's Energy Crisis or Afghanistan, as their biggest SNAFU, but hopefully overshadowed by the good they did after being president.

 
wikkidpissah said:
So hilarious that people like this will think they're in charge now. G'ahead, shill some more for people who wouldnt cross the street to piss on you.
Click to expand...
There's going to be a lot of disappointed people who will learn very soon that there's no magic wand to be waved that solves problems

 
He will always be the first black president and a very popular one.  That's his legacy.  

There is little policy legacy though.  Obamacare is gone, his immigration policies were all executive orders, the economy has been pretty meh for eight years, and the ME is still a mess.  

That's the danger of pushing policy without making law.  It has no staying power.

 
Bogart said:
I think Obama will be this generation's Jimmy Carter. His true impact will be made during his years after he is out of the White House, when he has the clout to work on projects that he wants without the constraints of being POTUS.

Both are leaving office relativity young (Obama 55 - Carter 57). Both have had pretty vanilla presidencies. Obamacare will most likely be remembered like Carter's Energy Crisis or Afghanistan, as their biggest SNAFU, but hopefully overshadowed by the good they did after being president.
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I hope to agree with you, bogie - because Obama could be a HELLA ex-Prez & globally transformative figure - but i don't yet. Carter is a verrrry moral man - it made his presidency a disaster (big errors of commission v. Obama's countless omissions) as much as it made his recent career one of the greatest in the history of charitable endeavour. Obama loves his nods & "ya"'s but i see no passion for anything but looking cool, smart & good. He could single-handledly lead developing worlds to the light as an ambassador of freedom if he wanted to, though, especially set against the myopia of American govt.

 
fantasycurse42 said:
This poll will confirm why we're a narrow minded society IMO - The good/great voters will not change their stance even though America just said #### you Obama/Hillary. I'd bet beyond the small sample size here, the majority in that good to great wouldn't rethink it either.

I voted "I think he was average and am now not as sure." If you don't think the outcome last night is the American majority saying they're unhappy and you still won't even rethink your stance that he might not have been as great as you think he was, you could be in a bubble.
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The entire country voting less than 24 hours prior is not a good sample?

 
wikkidpissah said:
I hope to agree with you, bogie - because Obama could be a HELLA ex-Prez & globally transformative figure - but i don't yet. Carter is a verrrry moral man - it made his presidency a disaster (big errors of commission v. Obama's countless omissions) as much as it made his recent career one of the greatest in the history of charitable endeavour. Obama loves his nods & "ya"'s but i see no passion for anything but looking cool, smart & good. He could single-handledly lead developing worlds to the light as an ambassador of freedom if he wanted to, though, especially set against the myopia of American govt.
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I think there's hope here.  His work before politics points to someone that actually means it when he wants to promote change.

 
bud29 said:
I get what you're saying, that Hillary was essentially an Obama 3rd term and she lost. But the messenger matters as much as the message. Do you think Obama himself would have lost to Trump last night? I don't.
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Here's an interesting read showing that Trump's 2016 numbers were better than Obama's 2012 numbers.  Pure speculation, though, how things would have turned out if they squared off against each other.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/442059/dont-blame-clinton-trump-2016-wouldve-beaten-obama-2012

I'm waiting to see what Obama does in the next few weeks.  He ignored the rebuke of the 2014 mid-terms and continued his Executive Orders spree.  I hope he doesn't do that again, but won't be surprised if he goes nuts.

Also, once Trump is in office, the media is going to end its blackout of reporting on the national debt.  I think a lot of snowflakes are going to be stunned at the price tag for 8 years of Obama.

 
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