***Official 2012 Hot Stove Thread (1 Viewer)

[gump]

Big Al deal to FL is 'dead'.

Pursuing Wilson and looking to move #2.

 

[Eephus]

Rollins supposedly resigning with Philadelphia. It made too much sense not to happen.

 

[dparker713]

This whole Pujols situation confuses me. Marlins offered him 10 yrs, $200mil. He wouldnt even be the highest paid player in baseball. As a matter of fact there would be several players with a highers annual salary thank Pujols. Doesnt the best player in baseball deserve to also be the highest paid?

Pujols is probably older than he claims to be, so if he got offered a 10 year deal maybe he plays regularly and at a decent production level for 7 of them. If their offer was 10 years, $225 million, that works out to roughly $30 million a year for 7 years and $5 million a year for 3 years when he may not even be playing anymore. I realize that they don't consider that when evaluating contracts and average annual salary is how they rank contracts, but there's no doubt in my mind they are never going to get 10 years of above average production out of Pujols and the more years they tack on is really just window dressing.

No, he's not. Why would he have claimed to be younger? So he could play HS baseball and a year of Juco? So he could delay his ascention to the majors? Its not like he crushed the low minors in his first season. If you look at his financial incentives, he should have actually claimed to be older than he is, not younger. For all the speculation, for all the years, nothing has been found to indicate his is any other age than whats listed on his baseball card. And the team thats had the most motivation to discover his true age was willing to offer a 9 year extension during an exclusive negotiating window. Sorry, but all indications are Pujols is actually 31.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Phillies are talking to the A's about acquiring Gio.

The Red Sox are reportedly making a strong push to trade for Andrew Bailey. Beane seems to think closers are incredibly overvalued and replaced very easily so I'll be shocked if he's still on the roster come spring.

 

[dparker713]

Pujols is probably older than he claims to be...

I've seen this said a couple times, but I assumed they've been jokes. They're jokes, right? Or are there serious rumors to him being older?

no way is he not older

misread, sorry.Agree with you.

at this point I'd be surprised if his real name is even Albert

There was never a financial benefit to him reporting himself to be younger than his is. He was subject to the Rule IV draft. He was not an international signing.

 

[Eephus]

Phillies are talking to the A's about acquiring Gio. The Red Sox are reportedly making a strong push to trade for Andrew Bailey. Beane seems to think closers are incredibly overvalued and replaced very easily so I'll be shocked if he's still on the roster come spring.

Odd philosophy for a team where two of the three most expensive players on the roster are relief pitchers

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Phillies are talking to the A's about acquiring Gio. The Red Sox are reportedly making a strong push to trade for Andrew Bailey. Beane seems to think closers are incredibly overvalued and replaced very easily so I'll be shocked if he's still on the roster come spring.

Odd philosophy for a team where two of the three most expensive players on the roster are relief pitchers

He goes where the value is. If you're worth a damn on that team odds are you're home grown (or were acquired as a minor leaguer and brought up). In the last offseason he felt Fuentes/Balfour were bargains. 4 of the 5 highest dollar guys last year were not pitchers. It's just quite a few players have fled the team since the season ended. It seems he thinks relievers were undervalued last year but closers are overvalued. He hasn't had any issues finding quality closers since taking over as GM. He'll either move one of the bullpen guys into the role or he'll sign someone folks are paying attention to. I disagree with plenty of things Beane does but I'm also of the mindset closers are horribly overrated. I think it's by far the easiest position to replace.

 

[Samuel L Bronkowitz]

KRod accepts Brewers arbitration offer

 

[Eephus]

KRod accepts Brewers arbitration offer

This is a head scratcher unless there's some other move planned by the Brewers or Boras. The compensation picks aren't worth the risks of getting stuck with the world's most expensive set-up man.

 

[Daywalker]

This whole Pujols situation confuses me. Marlins offered him 10 yrs, $200mil. He wouldnt even be the highest paid player in baseball. As a matter of fact there would be several players with a highers annual salary thank Pujols. Doesnt the best player in baseball deserve to also be the highest paid?

Pujols is probably older than he claims to be, so if he got offered a 10 year deal maybe he plays regularly and at a decent production level for 7 of them. If their offer was 10 years, $225 million, that works out to roughly $30 million a year for 7 years and $5 million a year for 3 years when he may not even be playing anymore. I realize that they don't consider that when evaluating contracts and average annual salary is how they rank contracts, but there's no doubt in my mind they are never going to get 10 years of above average production out of Pujols and the more years they tack on is really just window dressing.

No, he's not. Why would he have claimed to be younger? So he could play HS baseball and a year of Juco? So he could delay his ascention to the majors? Its not like he crushed the low minors in his first season. If you look at his financial incentives, he should have actually claimed to be older than he is, not younger. For all the speculation, for all the years, nothing has been found to indicate his is any other age than whats listed on his baseball card. And the team thats had the most motivation to discover his true age was willing to offer a 9 year extension during an exclusive negotiating window. Sorry, but all indications are Pujols is actually 31.

Most baseball exec's think he's 1-2 years older then he says. And it makes all the sense in the world to claim you are younger. Don't think that needs explaining.

 

[Eephus]

This whole Pujols situation confuses me. Marlins offered him 10 yrs, $200mil. He wouldnt even be the highest paid player in baseball. As a matter of fact there would be several players with a highers annual salary thank Pujols. Doesnt the best player in baseball deserve to also be the highest paid?

Pujols is probably older than he claims to be, so if he got offered a 10 year deal maybe he plays regularly and at a decent production level for 7 of them. If their offer was 10 years, $225 million, that works out to roughly $30 million a year for 7 years and $5 million a year for 3 years when he may not even be playing anymore. I realize that they don't consider that when evaluating contracts and average annual salary is how they rank contracts, but there's no doubt in my mind they are never going to get 10 years of above average production out of Pujols and the more years they tack on is really just window dressing.

No, he's not. Why would he have claimed to be younger? So he could play HS baseball and a year of Juco? So he could delay his ascention to the majors? Its not like he crushed the low minors in his first season. If you look at his financial incentives, he should have actually claimed to be older than he is, not younger. For all the speculation, for all the years, nothing has been found to indicate his is any other age than whats listed on his baseball card. And the team thats had the most motivation to discover his true age was willing to offer a 9 year extension during an exclusive negotiating window. Sorry, but all indications are Pujols is actually 31.

Most baseball exec's think he's 1-2 years older then he says. And it makes all the sense in the world to claim you are younger. Don't think that needs explaining.

Link?

 

[David Yudkin]

Link?

LinkLink

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Link

Link

Link

 

[Eephus]

Link?

LinkLink

Link

Link

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Link

Link

Link

I didn't click all the links but I didn't see any quotes attributed to baseball executives, even unnamed ones. The closest I found was the the Jonah Keri story about a bunch of Sloan School nerds writing guesses about Pujols age down on a piece of paper. You'd think an organization considering a $200M commitment would investigate this to the fullest extent possible. It's not like they don't have resources in the DR.

 

[Don Quixote]

@TBrownYahoo Tim Brown Source: Pujols will sign with Angels for 10 years for between $250 and $260 million. Full no-trade. Pujols decided Thursday morning.

 

[shadyridr]

@TBrownYahoo Tim Brown Source: Pujols will sign with Angels for 10 years for between $250 and $260 million. Full no-trade. Pujols decided Thursday morning.

cant blame him. Thats a lot of cash and the Angels have a great fan base. Still shocking though

 

[Bogart]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

 

[shadyridr]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

at least he can DH in the AL

 

[Brady Marino]

Albert must have taken lessons from LeBron on how to look as much of a whore as possible before leaving a fan base that has supported you for years.

Go make your money, Albert. I hope you ####### choke on a $100 bill that you try to smoke.

 

[dparker713]

This whole Pujols situation confuses me. Marlins offered him 10 yrs, $200mil. He wouldnt even be the highest paid player in baseball. As a matter of fact there would be several players with a highers annual salary thank Pujols. Doesnt the best player in baseball deserve to also be the highest paid?

Pujols is probably older than he claims to be, so if he got offered a 10 year deal maybe he plays regularly and at a decent production level for 7 of them. If their offer was 10 years, $225 million, that works out to roughly $30 million a year for 7 years and $5 million a year for 3 years when he may not even be playing anymore. I realize that they don't consider that when evaluating contracts and average annual salary is how they rank contracts, but there's no doubt in my mind they are never going to get 10 years of above average production out of Pujols and the more years they tack on is really just window dressing.

No, he's not. Why would he have claimed to be younger? So he could play HS baseball and a year of Juco? So he could delay his ascention to the majors? Its not like he crushed the low minors in his first season. If you look at his financial incentives, he should have actually claimed to be older than he is, not younger. For all the speculation, for all the years, nothing has been found to indicate his is any other age than whats listed on his baseball card. And the team thats had the most motivation to discover his true age was willing to offer a 9 year extension during an exclusive negotiating window. Sorry, but all indications are Pujols is actually 31.

Most baseball exec's think he's 1-2 years older then he says. And it makes all the sense in the world to claim you are younger. Don't think that needs explaining.

It makes sense now, not when you're a kid subject to the Rule IV draft.

 

[TobiasFunke]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

at least he can DH in the AL

At over $25 million per.If I were a Rangers fan I'd be popping champagne. It sounds like Kendrys Morales must be a mess otherwise the deal makes no sense, and your main rival just paid $25 million a year for a guy who gives them nothing more than an extra 40 OBP points over a healthy Morales even in 2012. And it's gonna go downhill from there.

 

[shadyridr]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

at least he can DH in the AL

At over $25 million per.If I were a Rangers fan I'd be popping champagne. It sounds like Kendrys Morales must be a mess otherwise the deal makes no sense, and your main rival just paid $25 million a year for a guy who gives them nothing more than an extra 40 OBP points over a healthy Morales even in 2012. And it's gonna go downhill from there.

LMAO at a fan base popping champagne at a division rival getting the best player in baseball.

 

[Mr. Know-It-All]

I am a huge Cardinal fan, but good for Albert. He was underpaid for years, management didn't act in good faith, but he was a professional about it and led us to a WS title. He'll always be a Cardinal legend regardless of what uniform he wears. Big loss for the community as well. Hope he has plans in the works to enrich the Anaheim area the way he enriched the St Louis area.

I wish we would have known this in time to make a play for Buerhle....now what? Huge hole in the offense - and staying the same in pitching...along with a new manager. At least help Matheny out a little.

 

[TobiasFunke]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

at least he can DH in the AL

At over $25 million per.If I were a Rangers fan I'd be popping champagne. It sounds like Kendrys Morales must be a mess otherwise the deal makes no sense, and your main rival just paid $25 million a year for a guy who gives them nothing more than an extra 40 OBP points over a healthy Morales even in 2012. And it's gonna go downhill from there.

LMAO at a fan base popping champagne at a division rival getting the best player in baseball.

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

 

[Brady Marino]

I am a huge Cardinal fan, but good for Albert. He was underpaid for years, management didn't act in good faith, but he was a professional about it and led us to a WS title. He'll always be a Cardinal legend regardless of what uniform he wears. Big loss for the community as well. Hope he has plans in the works to enrich the Anaheim area the way he enriched the St Louis area.I wish we would have known this in time to make a play for Buerhle....now what? Huge hole in the offense - and staying the same in pitching...along with a new manager. At least help Matheny out a little.

I really wish they would at least entertain the idea of going after Fielder, but from what I've read, they're not interested.Yu Darvish would make me giddy like a school girl.

 

[Eephus]

Albert must have taken lessons from LeBron on how to look as much of a whore as possible before leaving a fan base that has supported you for years.Go make your money, Albert. I hope you ####### choke on a $100 bill that you try to smoke.

What channel was his Decision show on this morning?

 

[RnR]

Yu Darvish would make me giddy like a school girl.

Not happening. Carp/Waino/Garcia/Lohse/Westy is your starting 5 coming into the spring. Only chance is finding a willing party to take Lohse, but his 2012 salary is too large to find any serious takers.

 

[Eephus]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

at least he can DH in the AL

At over $25 million per.If I were a Rangers fan I'd be popping champagne. It sounds like Kendrys Morales must be a mess otherwise the deal makes no sense, and your main rival just paid $25 million a year for a guy who gives them nothing more than an extra 40 OBP points over a healthy Morales even in 2012. And it's gonna go downhill from there.

LMAO at a fan base popping champagne at a division rival getting the best player in baseball.

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

At least Vernon Wells comes off the books in 2015

 

[Pipes]

Albert must have taken lessons from LeBron on how to look as much of a whore as possible before leaving a fan base that has supported you for years.Go make your money, Albert. I hope you ####### choke on a $100 bill that you try to smoke.

What channel was his Decision show on this morning?

How many championships did Lebron win before he bolted for the cash?

 

[Don Quixote]

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

Pujols is not himself worth 10 games, but the Rangers will be subtracting CJ Wilson too. I think that comes close to netting out, and if the Angels sign CJ Wilson too (as it sounds like it is still between them and the Marlins), I think it becomes hard not to call the Angels the favorites in that division.

 

[RnR]

Albert must have taken lessons from LeBron on how to look as much of a whore as possible before leaving a fan base that has supported you for years.Go make your money, Albert. I hope you ####### choke on a $100 bill that you try to smoke.

What channel was his Decision show on this morning?

How many championships did Lebron win before he bolted for the cash?

Take it easy on him guys, he's grieving.

 

[Brady Marino]

Albert must have taken lessons from LeBron on how to look as much of a whore as possible before leaving a fan base that has supported you for years.Go make your money, Albert. I hope you ####### choke on a $100 bill that you try to smoke.

What channel was his Decision show on this morning?

If he did that, I'd probably kick an infant in anger.

 

[Mr. Know-It-All]

I am a huge Cardinal fan, but good for Albert. He was underpaid for years, management didn't act in good faith, but he was a professional about it and led us to a WS title. He'll always be a Cardinal legend regardless of what uniform he wears. Big loss for the community as well. Hope he has plans in the works to enrich the Anaheim area the way he enriched the St Louis area.I wish we would have known this in time to make a play for Buerhle....now what? Huge hole in the offense - and staying the same in pitching...along with a new manager. At least help Matheny out a little.

I really wish they would at least entertain the idea of going after Fielder, but from what I've read, they're not interested.Yu Darvish would make me giddy like a school girl.

Some clowns on the Cards message board are chirping about using the money to go after Hanley Ramirez. Not a good fit for St Louis. Talented? Yes. Too much of a prima donna to play in St Louis. We need to get a SS, a complementary OF to work into the 3 man rotation (once Craig is healthy), a lefty middle reliever, and a #3 or #4 starter. Should be able to do all of that now. Unfortunately a lot of the free agents have already been picked through.

 

[TobiasFunke]

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

Pujols is not himself worth 10 games, but the Rangers will be subtracting CJ Wilson too. I think that comes close to netting out, and if the Angels sign CJ Wilson too (as it sounds like it is still between them and the Marlins), I think it becomes hard not to call the Angels the favorites in that division.

That's true. I hadn't factored in the loss of Wilson .. even that I think doesn't make the Angels the favorites, but if he goes to Anaheim then yeah, maybe. For 2012. Beyond that, it's ugly. And like I said, it's clearly bad news on Morales. Either that or it's a weird fit to say the least.I hope this doesn't mean the Marlins are now the favorites to land Wilson, though.

 

[Brady Marino]

I am a huge Cardinal fan, but good for Albert. He was underpaid for years, management didn't act in good faith, but he was a professional about it and led us to a WS title. He'll always be a Cardinal legend regardless of what uniform he wears. Big loss for the community as well. Hope he has plans in the works to enrich the Anaheim area the way he enriched the St Louis area.I wish we would have known this in time to make a play for Buerhle....now what? Huge hole in the offense - and staying the same in pitching...along with a new manager. At least help Matheny out a little.

I really wish they would at least entertain the idea of going after Fielder, but from what I've read, they're not interested.Yu Darvish would make me giddy like a school girl.

Some clowns on the Cards message board are chirping about using the money to go after Hanley Ramirez. Not a good fit for St Louis. Talented? Yes. Too much of a prima donna to play in St Louis. We need to get a SS, a complementary OF to work into the 3 man rotation (once Craig is healthy), a lefty middle reliever, and a #3 or #4 starter. Should be able to do all of that now. Unfortunately a lot of the free agents have already been picked through.

Hanley is a clown who only loves Hanley.Not much left for FA shortstops. When Edgar Renteria is the crown jewel left...time to explore a trade.

 

[Brady Marino]

Albert must have taken lessons from LeBron on how to look as much of a whore as possible before leaving a fan base that has supported you for years.Go make your money, Albert. I hope you ####### choke on a $100 bill that you try to smoke.

What channel was his Decision show on this morning?

How many championships did Lebron win before he bolted for the cash?

Take it easy on him guys, he's grieving.

I'm currently peeing on my Pujols jersey in anger.

 

[Don Quixote]

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

Pujols is not himself worth 10 games, but the Rangers will be subtracting CJ Wilson too. I think that comes close to netting out, and if the Angels sign CJ Wilson too (as it sounds like it is still between them and the Marlins), I think it becomes hard not to call the Angels the favorites in that division.

That's true. I hadn't factored in the loss of Wilson .. even that I think doesn't make the Angels the favorites, but if he goes to Anaheim then yeah, maybe. For 2012. Beyond that, it's ugly. And like I said, it's clearly bad news on Morales. Either that or it's a weird fit to say the least.I hope this doesn't mean the Marlins are now the favorites to land Wilson, though.

I've seen a few tweets that Wilson is signing with the Angels. Nothing confirmed from anyone that I trust yet though.I agree that it's ugly beyond the next couple of years. My guess is the Angels saw an opportunity to win now and take over LA while the Dodgers are a mess.

 

[Premier]

Albert must have taken lessons from LeBron on how to look as much of a whore as possible before leaving a fan base that has supported you for years.Go make your money, Albert. I hope you ####### choke on a $100 bill that you try to smoke.

Wow. You're a ####. Guy brought you two titles.

 

[shadyridr]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

at least he can DH in the AL

At over $25 million per.If I were a Rangers fan I'd be popping champagne. It sounds like Kendrys Morales must be a mess otherwise the deal makes no sense, and your main rival just paid $25 million a year for a guy who gives them nothing more than an extra 40 OBP points over a healthy Morales even in 2012. And it's gonna go downhill from there.

LMAO at a fan base popping champagne at a division rival getting the best player in baseball.

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

Yeah its a bad deal but as a fan of a team its hard to worry about what happens years down the road. For the next 5 yrs Pujols makes the Angels a better team. Id be hard pressed to celebrate that fact if I was a Rangers fan.

 

[Don Quixote]

Heyman reporting that Angels signed CJ Wilson for 5 years, $75 million.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

Pujols is not himself worth 10 games, but the Rangers will be subtracting CJ Wilson too. I think that comes close to netting out, and if the Angels sign CJ Wilson too (as it sounds like it is still between them and the Marlins), I think it becomes hard not to call the Angels the favorites in that division.

That's true. I hadn't factored in the loss of Wilson .. even that I think doesn't make the Angels the favorites, but if he goes to Anaheim then yeah, maybe. For 2012. Beyond that, it's ugly. And like I said, it's clearly bad news on Morales. Either that or it's a weird fit to say the least.I hope this doesn't mean the Marlins are now the favorites to land Wilson, though.

Some hyperbole in your first post. It's not a horrible, horrible deal for a franchise that has won one World Series. And if you look, the Angels were right with the Rangers until the last two weeks last year. The Rangers swept a three game series to end the season when the Angels had nothing to play for as well. That division was a lot closer than it seemed.

 

[TobiasFunke]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

at least he can DH in the AL

At over $25 million per.If I were a Rangers fan I'd be popping champagne. It sounds like Kendrys Morales must be a mess otherwise the deal makes no sense, and your main rival just paid $25 million a year for a guy who gives them nothing more than an extra 40 OBP points over a healthy Morales even in 2012. And it's gonna go downhill from there.

LMAO at a fan base popping champagne at a division rival getting the best player in baseball.

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

Yeah its a bad deal but as a fan of a team its hard to worry about what happens years down the road. For the next 5 yrs Pujols makes the Angels a better team. Id be hard pressed to celebrate that fact if I was a Rangers fan.

I'd say two years. After that, I'm not sure it's a net win considering how much Pujols is already regressing and how much (clean) sluggers usually regress when they reach their mid-30s, when you consider that it means that they're likely losing Morales ... either because this news means he's got a career-type injury or because now they'll have to move him.Adding Wilson to the mix, though, now that may put them over the top.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

They have one of the five best starters in baseball in Weaver.

They have a solid #2 starter in Wilson who is also lefthanded

They have Haren who can be elite

They have a great manager

They have the best hitter in baseball over the last ten years, and one of the best for probably the next 4-6 years

They have a strong fan base

They have guys like Morales

They can always bring back Chone Figgins to ignite the magic

I don't think they are worse for signing Pujols. This franchise plays in the #2 market where the dominant team is signing average middle infielder after middle infielder. I think they'll get their money back for signing Pujols, I don't think many franchises were in a position to say that.

 

[shadyridr]

That pretty much sucks right now for Ranger fans, but that is a lot of money long term. Could get ugly down the road.

at least he can DH in the AL

At over $25 million per.If I were a Rangers fan I'd be popping champagne. It sounds like Kendrys Morales must be a mess otherwise the deal makes no sense, and your main rival just paid $25 million a year for a guy who gives them nothing more than an extra 40 OBP points over a healthy Morales even in 2012. And it's gonna go downhill from there.

LMAO at a fan base popping champagne at a division rival getting the best player in baseball.

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

Yeah its a bad deal but as a fan of a team its hard to worry about what happens years down the road. For the next 5 yrs Pujols makes the Angels a better team. Id be hard pressed to celebrate that fact if I was a Rangers fan.

I'd say two years. After that, I'm not sure it's a net win considering how much Pujols is already regressing and how much (clean) sluggers usually regress when they reach their mid-30s, when you consider that it means that they're likely losing Morales ... either because this news means he's got a career-type injury or because now they'll have to move him.Adding Wilson to the mix, though, now that may put them over the top.

Angels havent had Morales for 1.5 yrs now. I think we should all assume that he wasnt going to contribute to them in the next year. Way too much of a risk to assume he would ever be as good as he was a few years ago. Hes a non-factor IMO. Less of a factor than Trumbo.

 

[kneeshooter]

Jon_Heyman Jon Heyman

#angels new tv deal is the key, insiders say. may get $150M per. had been getting only $50M.

An extra $100 mill a year will make these new contracts a lot easier to swallow, I'd say

 

[shadyridr]

They have one of the five best starters in baseball in Weaver.They have a solid #2 starter in Wilson who is also lefthandedThey have Haren who can be eliteThey have a great managerThey have the best hitter in baseball over the last ten years, and one of the best for probably the next 4-6 yearsThey have a strong fan baseThey have guys like Morales They can always bring back Chone Figgins to ignite the magic I don't think they are worse for signing Pujols. This franchise plays in the #2 market where the dominant team is signing average middle infielder after middle infielder. I think they'll get their money back for signing Pujols, I don't think many franchises were in a position to say that.

Exactly. I wouldnt say its a great deal but anytime you sign the best player in baseball its hard to imagine it being a horrible horrible deal. The idea is to sign the best players isnt it? The best players should get the best contracts shouldnt they?

 

[TobiasFunke]

It's a horrible, horrible deal. The Rangers are better at the major league level than the Angels even with this deal (they finished 10 games ahead of the Angels in 2010, 32 year old Pujols isn't worth anywhere near 10 games, and Trout won't make up for the rest of the team's aging), and they're deeper and probably better at the minor league level. The Angels' only advantage over the Rangers was payroll flexibility in the coming years, and they just pooped it away over the next decade on one guy who is already regressing and who plays a position where the Angels already thought they were set (probably meaning they aren't set, i.e. Morales is done, or that they now have the same problem that the Marlins have at SS). I don't see how this isn't a win for the Rangers.

Pujols is not himself worth 10 games, but the Rangers will be subtracting CJ Wilson too. I think that comes close to netting out, and if the Angels sign CJ Wilson too (as it sounds like it is still between them and the Marlins), I think it becomes hard not to call the Angels the favorites in that division.

That's true. I hadn't factored in the loss of Wilson .. even that I think doesn't make the Angels the favorites, but if he goes to Anaheim then yeah, maybe. For 2012. Beyond that, it's ugly. And like I said, it's clearly bad news on Morales. Either that or it's a weird fit to say the least.I hope this doesn't mean the Marlins are now the favorites to land Wilson, though.

Some hyperbole in your first post. It's not a horrible, horrible deal for a franchise that has won one World Series. And if you look, the Angels were right with the Rangers until the last two weeks last year. The Rangers swept a three game series to end the season when the Angels had nothing to play for as well. That division was a lot closer than it seemed.

Yeah, some hyperbole, but I do still think it's a pretty awful deal for the Angels. Maybe they have Yankee/Red Sox type spending power that they just haven't been exercising, so they can absorb a blow like this- I don't know enough to speak to that. And I think it's not quite as painful for an AL teams as it would have been for, say, the Marlins, because they can DH him in the last five years of the deal and at least get some value from him, although obviously nowhere near what they'll be paying him. I think were you and I differ is that I just don't see Albert being Albert for 4-6 more years. He's already regressing significantly on defense, he's had injury issues pop up each of the last two years (although each time he's bounced back pretty well). I think he's got two more years of being a .950-1.000 OPS guy who plays decent 1B. After that, who knows.

I also wonder (1) if he's older than 31, like others have said, and (2) wonder if the steroids era gave us all the wrong idea of what happens to sluggers in their mid-30s.

That said, it makes more sense in light of them also adding Wilson. They're clearly in #### the torpedoes, win now at all costs mode. I don't know much about their market but I guess that makes sense for them?

ETA: Dave Cameron sums it up better than I can

 

[TobiasFunke]

They have one of the five best starters in baseball in Weaver.

They have a solid #2 starter in Wilson who is also lefthanded

They have Haren who can be elite

They have a great manager

They have the best hitter in baseball over the last ten years, and one of the best for probably the next 4-6 years

They have a strong fan base

They have guys like Morales

They can always bring back Chone Figgins to ignite the magic

I don't think they are worse for signing Pujols. This franchise plays in the #2 market where the dominant team is signing average middle infielder after middle infielder. I think they'll get their money back for signing Pujols, I don't think many franchises were in a position to say that.

Exactly. I wouldnt say its a great deal but anytime you sign the best player in baseball its hard to imagine it being a horrible horrible deal. The idea is to sign the best players isnt it? The best players should get the best contracts shouldnt they?

Ask the 2001 Rangers if the idea is to sign the best players.I'm pretty sure the idea is to win enough games to make the playoffs as often as possible. Pujols probably means that you're only getting an extra 3-4 wins per year out of the 1B/DH spots considering the options the Angels already had on the roster, and you now have to wonder if they can afford to re-sign guys like Haren, Izturis, Aybar, Santana and Kendrick when they become free agents over the next couple years (I assume they'll fork over what they need to keep Weaver, who also becomes a FA in that time frame). I don't know if this helps them in the long term. That's a lot of talent to potentially lose over two years for two guys who will be entering their mid-30s after the 2013 season.

Like I said, if they're doing this because they have a Yankees/Red Sox budget, that's one thing. But if not, they're creating a lot more problems than they're solving.

 

[shake zula]

I also wonder (1) if he's older than 31, like others have said, and (2) wonder if the steroids era gave us all the wrong idea of what happens to sluggers in their mid-30s.

I think this is a great point and I mentioned either in this thread or the Marlins thread. I think only Hank Aaron had a season, after the age of 35, anywhere in the ballpark of Pujols-09 season. Coming of a down year and a significant injury I just don't know how it makes sense in light of what we've seen happen with AROD.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I also wonder (1) if he's older than 31, like others have said, and (2) wonder if the steroids era gave us all the wrong idea of what happens to sluggers in their mid-30s.

I think this is a great point and I mentioned either in this thread or the Marlins thread. I think only Hank Aaron had a season, after the age of 35, anywhere in the ballpark of Pujols-09 season. Coming of a down year and a significant injury I just don't know how it makes sense in light of what we've seen happen with AROD.

Shocking Pujols didn't sign in Miami, you know, because of all the great Latino culture. Maybe he's part Asian because he took a west coast job?

 

[shake zula]

I also wonder (1) if he's older than 31, like others have said, and (2) wonder if the steroids era gave us all the wrong idea of what happens to sluggers in their mid-30s.

I think this is a great point and I mentioned either in this thread or the Marlins thread. I think only Hank Aaron had a season, after the age of 35, anywhere in the ballpark of Pujols-09 season. Coming of a down year and a significant injury I just don't know how it makes sense in light of what we've seen happen with AROD.

Shocking Pujols didn't sign in Miami, you know, because of all the great Latino culture. Maybe he's part Asian because he took a west coast job?

Swing and a miss. At least be funny.