*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (4 Viewers)

[jplvr]

I'm willing to say that the risk of COVID-19 transmission strictly from a flushed toilet is virtually nil. That's to say nothing about other grossness, though. Try not to hang out in the toilet plume, if at all possible (someone needs to invent the time-delay flush, huh?). And try to avoid deep, top-of-the-Matterhorn "Ricola!" cleansing breaths while flushing until you can get clear.

If you ever watched Mythbusters back in the day ... their "flushed toilet droplets" episode was one of their most famous broadcasts.

Didn't they conclude that episode by pointing out how much fecal matter was everywhere and not just in the bathroom?  

 

[Dr_Zaius]

I consider public/workplace bathrooms to be a higher than average risk area in terms of potential respiratory droplets; they're small rooms with minimal airflow that lots of people visit.

ETA - I wasn't even factoring in the dreaded toilet flume.

I've been under the same assumption, particularly since the toilets where I work are insanely powerful - they actually hurt my ears a bit they are so loud, and they're automatic flush so there's no way around it.  I'm assuming the plume on these is quite large, probably substantially larger than a home toilet.  I've tried to time my limited office visits to minimize chances of needing to go #2 - it would be nice to know if I'm being overly paranoid here.

 

[parasaurolophus]

Look at the caption, though -- N95s reconditioned that way are meant for household use, not medical use (except I guess in a dire pinch).

Up until the week before Easter, I had been using the same N95 for all my out-of-the-house errands for about a month. I was leaving the mask on my dashboard and parking it in the sun in 80o+ F heat. While I'm confident that any virus on the mask was nuked ... the constant sun was heck on the mask's elastic loops. The last time I wore that mask, it was so loose that moved to and fro with every breath through my nose.

Maybe you could replace the elastic? 

Also I am not sure why the designation between medical and household matters. The 1% drop might be enough to discount it for the medical setting, but for me 1% off of an N95 is better than a cloth mask all day, every day.  

 

[Jobber]

You don't have a negative posting history and I know you don't have an agenda in your post.  I also had a good weekend.  But just like it would be bad form to walk into a thread on a natural disaster and say "hey guys I don't know about all of you but I had a great weekend and never thought about the tragedy", it's poor form here. But again, posting history matters.

Imagine me posting a pic smoking a spliff from my sunny deck during Katrina "High and dry up here boyz!"

 

[worrierking]

Derek Lowe's blog has been updated: https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/05/26/coronavirus-vaccine-update-may-26

He goes through the various vaccine candidates and describes what type of vaccine and what info has been released about each one.  Some sciency stuff.

Funny, he talks about how the info changes the various company's stock prices and cautions against betting on any of them.  I am rooting for the Pfizer vaccine, having bought their stock last summer, long before the pandemic!!

 

[Doug B]

Didn't they conclude that episode by pointing out how much fecal matter was everywhere and not just in the bathroom?  

  (Link to written summary)

 

[parasaurolophus]

(Don't take this the wrong way -- I'm only using your post as an example. A lot of people are doing this.)

If you want to cite info from a video or a podcast -- something that will take some real time to consume (more than a minute or two) -- please consider leaving a summarization of the main points along with a link. Or at least Google-able terms to find the video/podcast.

Chet linked a video yesterday and said something like "there's good information here". Maybe there is. Maybe there isn't. But don't assume that any great percentage of readers are going to be able or willing to devote however much time to sit through a video (same with podcasts). Lay out whatever the "good information" or "very interesting thing" is, and leave the link for those who seek to dig deeper.

With traditional text links, even if the linked page is wordy and long, CTRL+F can help the reader go straight to the important bits. So far as I'm aware, that's not possible yet with videos or podcasts. Having to sit through 20 minutes or so (which seems typical) just means whatever good information is there gets passed over that much more often.

Link

He touches on some of the points that have been debated in this thread. 

Such as(the irag) the purpose of the lockdowns. 

Well, what we have to remember is what we were originally attempting to do with these lockdowns when they first occurred back in March, and that was we had just come out of a situation as it unfolded in China where we saw the very rapid escalating of cases, the very serious health challenges in Wuhan, in the Hubei Province, and seeing this as in a sense a house on fire kind of event. It was at that same time we were seeing the situations emerge in Europe, in particular in the areas of northern Italy, the Milan area, and with this, we in this country, and particularly as we saw unfolding in New York responded with the idea that we are trying to flatten the curve. If we heard that term once, we heard it a hundred times in our discussions about what we were attempting to do

He talks about wear and tear on the testing machines because we are running them too hard and thinks we can get better outcomes with fewer tests. . 

Has anyone here thought about the fact that we're now running these machines 24/7, in ways they were never anticipated to run? Think about if you bought a new car, and you ran it at 100 miles an hour, 24 hours a day, for four weeks. Do you think that thing would be running the same way at the end of four weeks with no maintenance at 100 miles an hour for four weeks?

we are missing opportunities to address the situation with fewer tests, but much higher quality outcome, and that's where we need to go

I think in his mind the science appears settled on reinfection. 

We have no evidence of chronic infection at this point, I wouldn't rule it out, it could happen in an immune compromised individual, but it's going to be a very, very rare event, and number two, we don't have any evidence of people getting reinfected. This point that people had made before about "haha, you know, now that I've been negative for a week, and I've got it again, I must be reinfected," so this is good news. Hopefully this ends the debate over the idea of reinfection

He makes some comments about kids that I found very interesting. People can draw their own conclusions and listen if they wish. His first quote on this starts this way...

Anything that involves kids is a numerator. It's never a rate. It's not a numerator and denominator. We know that, and as a parent, as a grandparent, I'm the first one to tell you that. At the same time, we have to look at this from the standpoint of a numerator denominator in this regard.

 

[parasaurolophus]

I just don't flush.

What if you flush continuously? Can you create a constant draft? 

 

[Doug B]

Also I am not sure why the designation between medical and household matters. The 1% drop might be enough to discount it for the medical setting, but for me 1% off of an N95 is better than a cloth mask all day, every day.  

Succinctly: I don't believe that an N95 is necessary for source control.

For personal infection avoidance, I rely much more on personal space (maintaining six feet and usually better, passing by people quickly with my head turned away, etc.) than on having the right fit-tested mask. I'm comfortable in public -- in the spaces I frequent in my day-to-day life -- with a good cloth earloop mask and keeping away from people.

 

[Cjw_55106]

Its been a month since re-opening in Georgia.....no spike in cases.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/26/us/georgia-coronavirus/index.html

 

[shader]

Its been a month since re-opening in Georgia.....no spike in cases.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/26/us/georgia-coronavirus/index.html

The good news is that there hasn't been a spike.  The bad news is that the virus is still out there growing steadily.  

We were never going to get a major spike from slow reopenings.  I'd say that based on the numbers we are seeing from restaurants/theaters/airlines, that what is happening is about what is expected.

The one thing I think we can all agree on is that outdoor gatherings aren't having a major impact on the transmission rate, provided that people show caution.  

 

[shader]

I think this confirms that the virus is mainly contracted in ways that mask use, distancing, hand washing, and disinfecting surfaces largely prevents (I say largely because probably some transmission is happening to those taking reasonable precautions.) However, not everyone is taking these precautions, and we’re seeing more of these kinds of interactions. We’ll see even more as these kinds of stories lead to more people letting their guard down. And when weather turns favorable in Fall, the sense of security could really be damaging. 

Good news that transmission can be prevented though by those who choose to take appropriate measures. Problem is, if you’re living in a household, you’re only as good as your weakest link. As guard is down, we’ll see more of a ramp.

I’m not personally convinced we don’t see a spike in the next 4 weeks or so. Hope not. And if we don’t, it doesn’t mean we’re safe heading into colder seasons.

So I've been chatting with some friends about it.  TN just reported +358 today.  For the last 20 days we're averaging + 350.  For the last 10 days we're averaging +368.  So you could make the case that it's increasing, but man it's a slow increase, certainly not a spike.

I think a "spike" could happen at anytime, but it's important to remember that we just won't see spikes like we saw the first time.  We don't live the same way, we don't congregate the same way...so it's impossible for it to spread that quickly.

In TN perhaps what we have is a more insidious growth where we just can't get rid of it.  That's good, in that lots of people aren't dying, but it's bad because people are getting used to it being around and being a part of life, and as you said, they let their guard down.

Then all it takes are a few little lifestyle changes (packed churches, packed restaurants) and that R0 value jumps up.  Then what?  That's the question. 

 

[moleculo]

one other thing I wanted to mention about CDC's estimates on CFR: based on the reported numbers, we need about 10x more symptomatic cases than reported for these numbers to be anywhere near 0.4%.  This has nothing to do with asymptomatic folks, this is about people who display symptoms but have not been tested.  

I just looked at new cases and new fatalities for the past 10 days.  The ratio of new deaths to new cases ranges between  2.55% and 7.65%...both numbers consistent with historical trends as well as other countries.  Obviously, this slice in time does not account for the sudden spike in March or overrun hospitals, and this is an an era of much more prevalent testing.  

I don't understand how the CDC can rationalize there being 10x more symptomatic than reported cases right now. 

 

[Statorama]

More evidence that the lockdowns were a massive waste of time, money, and lives

The nation’s economy is on track to drop by more than 30% in the second quarter. Unemployment is well into the double digits. Half of small businesses might close in the next six months. All for naught, it would appear, giving the growing pile of evidence that the economic lockdowns didn’t work.

The latest evidence comes from a report out of JP Morgan Chase & Co. this week. It finds that there’s been no increase in cases or deaths as other nations and U.S. states start reopening. This flies directly in the face of all the public health expert predictions of a major spike once people started moving about.

Oxford epidemiologist on lockdowns : We might have done better by doing nothing at all

A University of Oxford professor who produced a competing model to the apocalyptic Imperial College model said there's a chance that doing nothing would've been a more effective COVID-19 response than the various lockdowns implemented around the world.

During an interview on UnHerd, Sunetra Gupta, professor of theoretical epidemiology at Oxford, said the virus is on its way out in the United Kingdom, and the true infection fatality rate is likely extremely low.

"I think the epidemic has largely come and is on its way out in this country so I think it would definitely be less than 1 in 1,000 (0.1%) and probably closer to 1 in 10,000 (0.01%)," Gupta said.

Gupta is opposed to the lockdowns, pointing out that the coronavirus outbreak has followed similar patterns in different countries with different lockdown policies.

"In almost every context we've seen the epidemic grow, turn around and die away — almost like clockwork," Gupta told UnHerd. "Different countries have had different lockdown policies, and yet what we've observed is almost a uniform pattern of behavior which is highly consistent with the SIR model. To me that suggests that much of the driving force here was due to the build-up of immunity. I think that's a more parsimonious explanation than one which requires in every country for lockdown (or various degrees of lockdown, including no lockdown) to have had the same effect."

 

[Statorama]

All the catastrophic predictions about reopening Georgia, Florida, and Texas were spectacularly wrong

Las Vegas Strip tentatively set to reopen June 4

Study: A majority of the population (up to 60%) may have 'some degree' of preexisting immunity to COVID-19

$21 Million Brooklyn field hospital closes without treating a single patient

Coronavirus 'does not spread easily' except for close contact with infected patients

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have issued updated coronavirus guidelines that now downplay the chances of contracting the virus from surfaces, potentially offering relief to millions of Americans who have been concerned they might catch the disease from purchased groceries or delivered packages. 

Covid is dying out - UK COVID-19 vaccine trial may fail due to low transmission in population

The team has recruited 10,000 people to test the vaccine, some of whom will be given the vaccine and others a placebo. But as it is unethical to purposely infect people in the trial with COVID-19, participants will be asked to go about their normal routine in the expectation that some will be exposed to it naturally. However, that is unlikely to happen if the virus is not spreading, meaning that no conclusions can be drawn one way or the other about the vaccine’s efficacy.

Hill expects that fewer than 50 people in the test population will catch the virus, but if less than 20 test positive the results may be useless “It is a race, yes. But it’s not a race against the other guys,” he said. “It’s a race against the virus disappearing – and against time. We said earlier in the year that there was an 80% chance of developing an effective vaccine by September. But at the moment, there’s a 50% chance that we get no result at all.

It's beyond time to end the Great Oppression.

 

[jplvr]

  (Link to written summary)

I have a little toilet story I doubt I've shared with the board.

I was working out at the Y pretty regularly right around Christmas one year when I just new I was going to explode. Made it to the bathroom and managed not to see any old balls, but when I turned the corner getting to the toilets, there stood a naked Santa Claus playing with his beard. I quickly tried to put the image out of my head, and entered the handicap stall where someone had left me another awful surprise. I leaned over to flush the toilet, and when the water got down near the bottom of the bowl, one droplet of water defied gravity and emerged above the rim to hit me on my upper lip. I couldn't bring myself to face naked Santa again, and I doubt I had time anyway, so I just let 'er rip and sat there feeling bacterial growth spreading across my face like a true contagion. When I finally finished up, Santa had fled the area, likely due to the sounds emanating from the handicap stall, and I scrubbed my face at the sink until it hurt.

I checked the toilet again on the flush, and another water droplet defied gravity and hung in the air for a brief moment before landing safely in the bowl this time.

 

[Statorama]

CDC Says Coronavirus Infection Fatality Rate Could be as Low as 0.26%  That's 10 times lower than initially assessed

Study: Corona Virus patients no longer infectious after 11 days

 

[flranger]

Personal Opinion:  There will be no substantial spike in cases until schools open up and children return to classrooms in mass.  Hanging out at the beach or going to a restaurant just doesn't provide the long term exposure that classrooms do.  And those kids largely don't get the symptoms as bad but bring it into their homes.

My girlfriend is an elementary school teacher.  I'm concerned about the fall as being when we see a spike.  If there is no substantial spike by this fall, we gotta just go live our lives.

 

[The Big Donkey]

I can't recall where I read it, but I came across an article that indicated a large outbreak in Brazil due to the huge bat population would be very bad with regards to mutations.   

This is scary in Brazil.

 

[[scooter]]

Covid is dying out - UK COVID-19 vaccine trial may fail due to low transmission in population

This is a misleading description on your part -- phrase "Covid is dying out" does not seem to exist anywhere in the article or headline. Very poor form but not unexpected.

 

[Rich Conway]

As of Monday morning, mortality rate in CT was 9.1%.  Obviously, much of this is the elderly, but even for the age range 40-49, mortality rate is currently ~1.4%.  Personally, I believe CT isn't testing nearly enough.

 

[shader]

As of Monday morning, mortality rate in CT was 9.1%.  Obviously, much of this is the elderly, but even for the age range 40-49, mortality rate is currently ~1.4%.  Personally, I believe CT isn't testing nearly enough.

Nationwide it’s 5.9%, so yeah that’s a bit higher than normal.

We’ve spent so much time talking another how the TRUE rate is probably 1% that I think people have a false sense of security.

If you feel bad, go get tested and get confirmed positive, the death rate is 6%.  That’s high and shows just how dangerous this is for those that develop a significant case.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Yale study:  COVID-19 concentrations in sewage perfectly predict cases one week later.

 

[moleculo]

More evidence that the lockdowns were a massive waste of time, money, and lives

To be fair, I'd like to see a similar analysis that shows the economic downturn was purely a result of the lockdown and not a function of people responding to a world wide pandemic. 

For reference, the (American) markets started crashing Feb 19 - almost a full month before anywhere in USA locked down.

 

[ChiefD]

All of the talk about the economy and how we didn’t need to shut down is just bunk.

We had (and still have) no idea what we are really dealing with. The only thing we had to work with as the first line of defense was time.  And the stay at homes bought us time in my opinion.

And we still need time. Just my two cents.

 

[moleculo]

During an interview on UnHerd, Sunetra Gupta, professor of theoretical epidemiology at Oxford, said the virus is on its way out in the United Kingdom, and the true infection fatality rate is likely extremely low.

"I think the epidemic has largely come and is on its way out in this country so I think it would definitely be less than 1 in 1,000 (0.1%) and probably closer to 1 in 10,000 (0.01%)," Gupta said.

What is this lady talking about?  Yesterday, UK had 2000 new cases and 134 deaths...a CFR or 6.7%  shapewise, their curve is similar to ours: rapid rise to a peak and then a drawn out, gradual descent.  

1) how does she say its on its way out?  I don't see how we (and the UK) aren't dealing with this for the next year at least.

2) i wish someone could tell me how they justify sub 1% CFR.  I'm not doubting off hand but i want to know what the underlying assumptions are.  Call me a healthy skeptic.

ETA:

From the article,

"In almost every context we've seen the epidemic grow, turn around and die away — almost like clockwork," Gupta told UnHerd. "Different countries have had different lockdown policies, and yet what we've observed is almost a uniform pattern of behavior which is highly consistent with the SIR model. To me that suggests that much of the driving force here was due to the build-up of immunity."

Except almost every country has seen a different shape of virus growth and decay.  You cant look at this and tell me it's uniform.

 

[belljr]

Is this the thread where we complain about a virus we still don't know everything about and post random studies?

 

[ericttspikes]

What is this lady talking about?  Yesterday, UK had 2000 new cases and 134 deaths...a CFR or 6.7%  shapewise, their curve is similar to ours: rapid rise to a peak and then a drawn out, gradual descent.  

1) how does she say its on its way out?  I don't see how we (and the UK) aren't dealing with this for the next year at least.

2) i wish someone could tell me how they justify sub 1% CFR.  I'm not doubting off hand but i want to know what the underlying assumptions are.  Call me a healthy skeptic.

She explains it in the interview. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1778&v=DKh6kJ-RSMI&feature=emb_logo

 

[moleculo]

Is this the thread where we complain about a virus we still don't know everything about and post random studies?

No.  This is where we post articles with obvious political spin that cite studies favorable to political predispositions.

 

[moleculo]

She explains it in the interview. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1778&v=DKh6kJ-RSMI&feature=emb_logo

Can you summarize?  I make it a rule to not watch youtube for news.

 

[tri-man 47]

Covid worldometers: Steady with new cases at 92,000, led again by the U.S. (19,000), Brazil (15,700), and Russia (8,900).  Brazil again leads the list of reported daily deaths (over 1,000, versus a lower 774 in the U.S.).  Brazil's deaths per million continues to climb.  Several days ago it was about 80/million, and it's now 116/million ...still well below the U.S. (304/M) and the primary European countries (all above 500/M).  U.K, by the way, was 8th in reported deaths today with 134.  Odd spikes in Nicaragua where cases almost tripled (to 759) and deaths doubled (to 35).  

 

[prosopis]

I have a little toilet story I doubt I've shared with the board.

I was working out at the Y pretty regularly right around Christmas one year when I just new I was going to explode. Made it to the bathroom and managed not to see any old balls, but when I turned the corner getting to the toilets, there stood a naked Santa Claus playing with his beard. I quickly tried to put the image out of my head, and entered the handicap stall where someone had left me another awful surprise. I leaned over to flush the toilet, and when the water got down near the bottom of the bowl, one droplet of water defied gravity and emerged above the rim to hit me on my upper lip. I couldn't bring myself to face naked Santa again, and I doubt I had time anyway, so I just let 'er rip and sat there feeling bacterial growth spreading across my face like a true contagion. When I finally finished up, Santa had fled the area, likely due to the sounds emanating from the handicap stall, and I scrubbed my face at the sink until it hurt.

I checked the toilet again on the flush, and another water droplet defied gravity and hung in the air for a brief moment before landing safely in the bowl this time.

Lucky to be alive

 

[the moops]

Antibody tests for Covid-19 wrong half the time, CDC says

 

[ericttspikes]

Can you summarize?  I make it a rule to not watch youtube for news.

It's not news, it's an interesting, apolitical interview with an Oxford professor of epidemiology. Well worth watching IMO.

I can't really do it justice, but the jist is that she believes that the virus has been circulating longer in the UK. That more have been exposed. That antibody testing and current data is poor, but we still need to be patient and compile more data. Her observation is that despite the different degrees in which countries implement lockdowns or no lockdowns, the virus has progressed in a similar way. 

 

[moleculo]

It's not news, it's an interesting, apolitical interview with an Oxford professor of epidemiology. Well worth watching IMO.

I can't really do it justice, but the jist is that she believes that the virus has been circulating longer in the UK. That more have been exposed. That antibody testing and current data is poor, but we still need to be patient and compile more data. Her observation is that despite the different degrees in which countries implement lockdowns or no lockdowns, the virus has progressed in a similar way. 

Thanks.  I wasn't trying to be snarky about the video thing; its just that i find when people post videos as an explanation 9 times out of 10  its a political commentary that kills 20 minutes to get to the (unsourced) point.  

 

[shader]

Antibody tests for Covid-19 wrong half the time, CDC says

This is a tough concept.  I spend quite a long time trying to understand how 95% specificity means the test could be wrong half the time in a population where the virus is at 5-10%.  It’s definitely not a straight forward concept. 

 

[GroveDiesel]

It's not news, it's an interesting, apolitical interview with an Oxford professor of epidemiology. Well worth watching IMO.

I can't really do it justice, but the jist is that she believes that the virus has been circulating longer in the UK. That more have been exposed. That antibody testing and current data is poor, but we still need to be patient and compile more data. Her observation is that despite the different degrees in which countries implement lockdowns or no lockdowns, the virus has progressed in a similar way. 

That seems wrong on its face to me when looking at countries with quick significant lockdowns with good contact tracing and testing like South Korea and Taiwan versus countries that have done a poor job of testing/tracing and/or were slow to lockdown (or haven’t really locked down) like the US, Russia, and Sweden.

 

[joffer]

well that’s one way to go

 

[belljr]

well that’s one way to go

"It is more of a push back — the snitches, and the contact tracers out there" said Kevin Smith, Co-Owner of the Liberty Tree Tavern

A lot of babies out there....

 

[-fish-]

That seems wrong on its face to me when looking at countries with quick significant lockdowns with good contact tracing and testing like South Korea and Taiwan versus countries that have done a poor job of testing/tracing and/or were slow to lockdown (or haven’t really locked down) like the US, Russia, and Sweden.

This theory that "it was here longer than people thought" was just refuted again in regard to the first cases in Seattle.   If you can move the infection dates back a month, it's all great news.   Except no matter how hard these advocates try, they keep coming up short when it comes to actual evidence.

 

[tjnc09]

https://www.twitter.com/dailycaller/status/1265376663069691905

https://www.twitter.com/dailycaller/status/1265382872631980032

This is hilarious.  MSNBC reporter wearing a mask does a segment on people not wearing masks.  Points out bystander not wearing mask.  Bystander points out cameraman isn’t wearing mask and he also touches his face.

 

[the moops]

 Points out bystander not wearing mask.  Bystander points out cameraman isn’t wearing mask

That was funny

 

[jobarules]

https://www.twitter.com/dailycaller/status/1265376663069691905

https://www.twitter.com/dailycaller/status/1265382872631980032

This is hilarious.  MSNBC reporter wearing a mask does a segment on people not wearing masks.  Points out bystander not wearing mask.  Bystander points out cameraman isn’t wearing mask and he also touches his face.

Reminds me of that cnn reporter who constantly questioned the president about not wearing a mask and then was caught on camera ripping her own mask off the instant she thought the camera were off. 

 

[[scooter]]

https://www.twitter.com/dailycaller/status/1265376663069691905

https://www.twitter.com/dailycaller/status/1265382872631980032

This is hilarious.  MSNBC reporter wearing a mask does a segment on people not wearing masks.  Points out bystander not wearing mask.  Bystander points out cameraman isn’t wearing mask and he also touches his face.

Reminds me of that cnn reporter who constantly questioned the president about not wearing a mask and then was caught on camera ripping her own mask off the instant she thought the camera were off. 

Her mask was off for 6 seconds and she was practicing social distancing the entire time. Does that somehow justify someone else's constant flaunting of CDC guidelines?

 

[jobarules]

Her mask was off for 6 seconds and she was practicing social distancing the entire time. Does that somehow justify someone else's constant flaunting of CDC guidelines?

She's a hypocrite 

 

[moleculo]

It's not news, it's an interesting, apolitical interview with an Oxford professor of epidemiology. Well worth watching IMO.

I can't really do it justice, but the jist is that she believes that the virus has been circulating longer in the UK. That more have been exposed. That antibody testing and current data is poor, but we still need to be patient and compile more data. Her observation is that despite the different degrees in which countries implement lockdowns or no lockdowns, the virus has progressed in a similar way. 

Ok, i watched it.  Worth it, good interview.  I do have some criticisms:

1) she doesn't show her work postulating the actual CFR is 0.1%  or 0.01%.  I don't know how she can come to that.  When pressed on NY and how its possible for a population of 8M can have 15k deaths, she proposes it may be due to NY having a high ratio of elderly or comorbidities.  I don't think i buy that.

2) she states that the reason some countries have done better than others is more related to inherent immunities (perhaps previous cases of non-COVID coronavirus?) Or differences in demographics.  I dont buy that either, given Sweden vs other Nordic countries.  Basically, she completely discounts the effectiveness of mitigation efforts.  I'm going to need further convincing on that.

In short, i think she is making the data fit her model.

 

[[scooter]]

Her mask was off for 6 seconds and she was practicing social distancing the entire time. Does that somehow justify someone else's constant flaunting of CDC guidelines?

She's a hypocrite 

No, that's not how hypocrisy works.

She would have been a hypocrite if she had told people to wear a mask....and then never wore a mask.

Or, she would have been a hypocrite if she had criticized a specific person for never wearing a mask....and then never wore a mask herself.

But, "wearing a mask, removing it for 6 seconds, then putting it back on" is not hypocrisy.

 

[the moops]

I also think people are not getting that you don't need to wear a mask 24/7 and in every situation. I wear a face covering when I have to go into work. I only wear it probably 10% of the time though. If I am sitting at my computer alone in my office, working on a CAD model - no mask. If I am welding up a protoptype - no mask (well maybe a different kind). If I am hauling some heavy ### piece of furniture with my coworker - I wear a mask.

Masks are a tool. You need to use it in the appropriate time and fashion for it to be effective. 

 

[moleculo]

I also think people are not getting that you don't need to wear a mask 24/7 and in every situation. I wear a face covering when I have to go into work. I only wear it probably 10% of the time though. If I am sitting at my computer alone in my office, working on a CAD model - no mask. If I am welding up a protoptype - no mask (well maybe a different kind). If I am hauling some heavy ### piece of furniture with my coworker - I wear a mask.

Masks are a tool. You need to use it in the appropriate time and fashion for it to be effective. 

Exact same, except swap welding for grinding.  I don't weld.

 

[jobarules]

I also think people are not getting that you don't need to wear a mask 24/7 and in every situation. I wear a face covering when I have to go into work. I only wear it probably 10% of the time though. If I am sitting at my computer alone in my office, working on a CAD model - no mask. If I am welding up a protoptype - no mask (well maybe a different kind). If I am hauling some heavy ### piece of furniture with my coworker - I wear a mask.

Masks are a tool. You need to use it in the appropriate time and fashion for it to be effective. 

Are you working again?

I agree. Masks should be worn when social distancing can't be done and especially indoors.