Also, it appears there may not be a shortage of ICU beds in South Florida:
https://www.local10.com/news/local/2020/04/06/coronavirus-how-full-are-the-hospital-beds-in-south-florida/
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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (13 Viewers)
- Thread starter Big League Chew
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https://www.local10.com/news/local/2020/04/06/coronavirus-how-full-are-the-hospital-beds-in-south-florida/
Capella
Footballguy
Is there a thread discussing the landlord/tenant situations? It’s fascinating to me how this plays out. Lot of tenants on twitter have organized to not pay and have essentially told their landlords to F off.
RnR
Footballguy
Sometimes we can take some good from this type of article:
This should appease the "Where's Fauci? Has Trump fired him?" crowd that seems to emerge every time the good Doc isn't at a taskforce presser
Doug B
Footballguy
In Louisiana, evictions right now are not being enforced by executive order of the governor. Law enforcement is, in fact, standing down.
...
One thing I really didn't know but that I've learned from this thread:
I had thought landlords paying a mortgage was, if not rare, fairly uncommon. Didn't think it would typically be problematic for a landlord to float residential tenants for a month or two.
shader
Footballguy
I posted a week ago that there would be a sharp drop-off in cases in the USA and that many people would take this as a great sign. That will be the moment of greatest importance.
Due to the delay in testing in the USA, the country spent a week or two getting through a backlog of cases. So the exponential growth was completely fake. Most everyone on this site knew that the virus wasn't doubling every 2-3 days, but the general public probably didn't.
Now that we are through the backlog and we are at a point where we have relatively solid numbers, we will see a drop in new cases from the cleared backlog, and a drop in cases from social distancing measures. So the dropoff in new cases could be dramatic.
But it's important to realize that the USA still has 300k active cases and is NOWHERE NEAR stopping the spread. I'm really worried that the "it's all good now" attitude you mentioned will happen.
Exactly. Think big picture. A large building with 100 apartments. If everyone stops paying all at once, is the landlord gonna show up with a wrecking ball?
whoknew
Footballguy
I think a lot of it is so unknown. A few things:
1) I'm a RE lawyer. My clients are generally trying to do workouts with their tenants to set up some kind of payment plan, extension of the lease, etc.
2) As for reporting to credit agencies, if you've a fed backed mortgage (FANNIE/FREDDIE) and you do a workout with your tenant, you can't report them to the credit agencies if they are paying consistently with that workout.
3) Obviously that changes if they don't pay in the future or you have a tenant that doesn't make up the rent once evictions are back on.
4) Because of expanded unemployment benefits, its a lot easier to be a residential than commercial landlord right now. I would think most residents should be able to pay rent with the amount of unemployment they can get now. Commercial tenants though - they are in bad shape.
whoknew
Footballguy
I just put this in the post above - but evictions are generally stopped but that doesn't mean you can just top paying rent overall.
And I really think that with the size of unemployment benefits - you would think most residents could at least do a workout with their landlord.
![[scooter]](/data/avatars/m/22/22287.jpg?1659477690){kind=avatar}
[scooter]
Footballguy
They only tested 1 tiger from what I've read.
I'm not sure why this is a bad thing. Seems to me that it's worthwhile to know if this virus can jump to different species. Also, the whole point of testing is to track down and quarantine anyone who may have been in contact with the infected individual, so in that regard it's just as important to trace the tiger's contacts as it is to trace a human's contacts.
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
If a company in california can be sellingbat home tests(illegally) i dont see why a zoo with that kind of funding cant test it on its own. I highly doubt the state would sue a zoo and tell them to stop.I was going to answer but @Doug B sums it up nicely below. Unless you are in an emergency ward full of COVID patience's I think it's fine to reuse for as long as you need to but I'm nobody, not even a guy playing a doctor on TV so please don't take my advice. I'm sure there are articles out there regarding the subject.
So we tested tigers & lions at the Bronx zoo this weekend and determined they have it. Serious question, is it a different test for animals than humans? My gut tells me even if it is, you are still using the same materials you would need for a human test thus taking that away from a human in lieu of an animal? Help me out smart people.
It is also of importance to understand from a public health perspective if cats can spread it. Feral cat colonies can be expansive.
msommer
Footballguy
I think I would be around 2 as well (for this specific case) since the incubation median time appears to be shorter than a couple of weeks (reminder: median 5 days, 97.5% in 11 days, 99% in 14 days). Whether my panic meter would be trending upwards would have a lot to do with the frequency of such cases and the precautions taken to avoid repetition.
Number of new cases in Italy is on a clear downtrend, so that's great news! Looks like deaths is also trending down, albeit with a spike today (obviously these things aren't linear).
shader
Footballguy
Death is a trailing indicator. But yes this is really good news.
I still struggle with the "what next" question.
Italy is too: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy/as-covid-19-deaths-steady-italys-health-minister-eyes-next-phase-idUSKBN21N0GA
When do you start making plans to open up? When it's less than 1000 new cases a day? 500? 100? 0?
Tough questions.
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The Daily is required listening. Barbaro's interview with Fauci was interesting. Haven't heard anyone push Fauci as much as he did (was still respectful).
AAABatteries
Footballguy
This is the kind of stuff I would like to hear more from our leaders on. What is the plan to get things back to normal and how will that work. Not saying it should be any time soon but it would be comforting to know that they have a plan based on something and not just wishful thinking.
msommer
Footballguy
The Danish PM has promised a plan for opening up after Easter (not sure whether the plan is going to be published after Easter or it'll commence then, we'll soon see). She's already communicated that it is ging to be gradual, that it will take a long time and that it will be reevaluated the second cases start behaving different than the models predict/demand. I look forward to hearing more and will post more when I do.
proteus126
Footballguy
A little info for the group:
My brother is a doctor associated with a large hospital in the Piedmont NC area. He's a cardiologist, but has been keeping tabs, talking with the respiratory docs to see what's happening. That hospital hadn't lost any patients as of a couple days ago. There are quite a few in ICU at the moment obviously. They haven't had a massive volume of COVIDs come through, but sizeable. There have been about 100 cases in that county. His comments (in my words, and 2nd-hand via my mom):
He said that COVID is consistent with extremely high inflammation markers (I'm guessing this means from a standard diagnostic blood test that is routinely and rapidly done by hospitals). If a case of the flu produces a 500x rise in markers, COVID might produce 3000x. The phrase "off the charts" was used. Don't really need the COVID test to diagnose.
The current protocol at that hospital is to treat with the anti-malarial drug, and both Azithromycin and Rocephin (another antibiotic). Both antibiotics have some anti-inflammatory attributes, which is why they are being used (and also as a prophylactic). Fighting inflammation and preventing pneumonia is the focus.
They are paying close attention to what other hospitals are doing, and what results they are getting. Hope I didn't get any of his comments incorrect.
My brother is a doctor associated with a large hospital in the Piedmont NC area. He's a cardiologist, but has been keeping tabs, talking with the respiratory docs to see what's happening. That hospital hadn't lost any patients as of a couple days ago. There are quite a few in ICU at the moment obviously. They haven't had a massive volume of COVIDs come through, but sizeable. There have been about 100 cases in that county. His comments (in my words, and 2nd-hand via my mom):
He said that COVID is consistent with extremely high inflammation markers (I'm guessing this means from a standard diagnostic blood test that is routinely and rapidly done by hospitals). If a case of the flu produces a 500x rise in markers, COVID might produce 3000x. The phrase "off the charts" was used. Don't really need the COVID test to diagnose.
The current protocol at that hospital is to treat with the anti-malarial drug, and both Azithromycin and Rocephin (another antibiotic). Both antibiotics have some anti-inflammatory attributes, which is why they are being used (and also as a prophylactic). Fighting inflammation and preventing pneumonia is the focus.
They are paying close attention to what other hospitals are doing, and what results they are getting. Hope I didn't get any of his comments incorrect.
Grace Under Pressure
Footballguy
Gov. Cuomo is going to ask the President to lift the 14 day limit on Hydroxychloroquine and for the USS Comfort to take Covid patients.
Grace Under Pressure
Footballguy
Agreed. There needs to be parallel planning for slow and limited re-opening of certain parts of the economy. Emphasis on slow and limited.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Managed to keep my wife and daughter at home without being exposed to anyone else but me for the last 2 weeks. Then my wife came down with a rash and pain this weekend and her doctor had her come into the office versus doing a tele-appointment. 
She wore a mask and tried to be super careful, but I wasn’t thrilled.
Also not thrilled that it turns out that she has shingles.
She wore a mask and tried to be super careful, but I wasn’t thrilled.Also not thrilled that it turns out that she has shingles.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Meanwhile...
That drug? Hydroxychloroquine.
May you live in interesting times...
A radio station is Boston had Jonathon Kraft on this morning to talk about getting the masks from China. Hopefully somebody does an in depth article on this because it was really interesting. A lot of moving parts to pull this off. If anyone is interested, their show is on iTunes. Toucher and Rich, hour #2.
Mr. Pickles
Footballguy
But the nice man on the radio tells me “it’s always a landlord’s market.” And I do so wish to get 18-21% returns.
cosjobs
Footballguy
If this thing is jumping species, especially in the cat or dog family, it is critical to know and understand that.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Would be interesting to know what percentage of residential landlords carry a mortgage and what kind of net worth those folks hold. Probably a whole lot more middle class landlords with just a few properties who are carrying mortgages than you’d think.
cosjobs
Footballguy
I have one rent house that is a pretty big part of our retirement income. I told them a couple weeks ago to take off rent payment for this month and I can reduce it some for a couple more, but repairs, taxes and insurance take up a large part of my income from the property and I don't see how I can do much more that that. They have been great tenants, so I'll do what I can, but there are definitely limits.
CurlyNight
Footballguy
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Even if you were able to evict say 30 people. Are there a lot of people looking to move right now? They are likely just to sit empty.
hagmania
Footballguy
I'm going to do my best to restrain myself from going out to crowds for an additional month after "shelter-in-place" orders are lifted.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
It really is, because of the element of unknown. Wife's clinic didn't take a ton of precautions, and it would nice if both places of employment knew for sure.
I am more worried about her, since the regular stuff knocks her out a bit each year. She also called in to nurse.
On that note, it's also frustrating we got different responses. I was told 7 days after symptoms started I could go back if i felt better. 3 days after any sort of fever. She was told 72 hours after symptoms go away, and they were forwarding info to the infectious disease center and they might be contacting her.
shader
Footballguy
It's so unfortunate that a rational discussion of this drug isn't easy.Meanwhile...
That drug? Hydroxychloroquine.
May you live in interesting times...
There was a doctor on the Joe Rogan podcast, Peter Hotez, that was discussing this drug. He explained it really well. He said that there is no proof that it works, but that it does work in a test tube so there could be hope. Of course, it works against the flu in the test tube too, and that didn't pan out either.
I hope it works, but we need to let the experts do their job.
Thanks for the reply.
I'm not sure what % are getting or will get unemployment benefits, but a sizeable portion won't be getting any.
Some exceptions I know about are my daughter who quit her job in February, expecting to be able to easily find another job. Her friend who has a lease in NY, but is afraid to travel back there for her job. And many employees who are being asked to work only 2 or 3 days per week, with PTO covering the remaining hours. But many employees have limited PTO hours. And the gig economy workers.
Exactly. I'm seeing many more for rent signs in Miami and Miami Beach. Finally, prices should come down.
cosjobs
Footballguy
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
It is really dumb to put covid patients on that ship unless it will be only covid patients.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
It's such a weird system. Workers put money into bank. Landlord borrows money from bank to buy building. Workers pay landlord to live in the building so landlord can pay the money back to the bank. The craziest part is nobody ever actually has the money. It's all just adjustments on spreadsheets, numbers being shifted around all day long. When the landlord goes to borrow the money, the bank creates new money and with it new debt to pass out.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
I know a few people who are taking advantage of this and it’s really sad. They still are working as usual but are skipping paying their rent this month.
beer 30
Footballguy
Agree, so all the people in NYC that would normally be in the hospital just all dried up and they no longer need medical care? I just think this whole thing with the ship is reflective of the poor response to this whole pandemic we've put forth since the get go. How do you not have a solid plan in place when you inherit 1,000 extra hospital beds overnight in what is touted as the epicenter of the pandemic for the US?
Quit the political redtape bull#### and figure it out. People are dying that don't need to.
nirad3
Footballguy
I am working as usual, but my wife (works at Starbucks) is basically furloughed. And I am awaiting word of reduced hours. We paid our April rent but have already discussed with the owner of our place that reduced rent for May is highly probable. He mentioned it first, too. Thankfully.
I know some who are working and trying to negotiate a delay in mortgage payments. With the anticipation that they might be furloughed or laid off.
In the case of one coworker, she's anticipating in advance that her tenants won't be able to pay the rent next month, due to a 50% reduction in her tenants work hours. But the tenants just paid April in full, so my coworker can pay the mortgage this month. I'm not even sure mortgages on 2nd homes qualify.
It's almost class warfare. #RentStrike
Regarding people still working and looking to have their rent reduced, I'm surprised the government is giving out the stimulus payments to people who haven't had their wages affected (and their job outlook still looks good).
Honestly, it would be totally fair if they only gave the money to people who were laid off, had wages reduced, etc.
Honestly, it would be totally fair if they only gave the money to people who were laid off, had wages reduced, etc.
NotSmart
Footballguy
Ilov80s
Footballguy
hagmania
Footballguy
We have a very good relationship with our landlord. Based on the conversations in this thread, I proposed a 10% reduction in rent for the next two months to match my company's 10% salary reduction and she agreed nearly immediately.
Just another reason this thread has been so great.
Just another reason this thread has been so great.
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