*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (13 Viewers)

[The Commish]

Posted in the Florida Politics thread...spikes are beginning to happen here in Florida.  Out by the lake in the Belle Glade / Pahokee area the ONE hospital they have is pretty much at capacity.  I only know this because my MIL works as an ER nurse and said it's unimaginable to see what is going on there right now.  That IS south Florida and I am in central Florida but it will be interesting to see if this is even acknowledged by our state officials.

 

[sho nuff]

At the dentist.

Went yesterday.

Call when you get there to check in.  They walk out with a dry erase board with the patient's name on it to call them in.  Check temp and survey questions about possible exposure when you come into lobby.  Asked me to wash my hands when back into the exam area.  Then had to swish a peroxide solution she stated was to cut down on possible contaminants in my mouth.  Hygienist in mask and face shield.  Dentist in the same.  Asked me to wash my hands again before I left.  Hygienist opened all doors on the way in and out so I did not have to touch anything.

Was all done very well.

 

[parasaurolophus]

All over the news here in Central Florida

I don't know why people outside our area would care.  Everyone pretty much understands that "Florida Man" is real.  Is this a shock to anyone?

Why did everybody care about the beaches? That was national news all over the place. 

 

[sho nuff]

Tennessee Numbers jumped up a bit yesterday (I think I had read that some business reported 57 people tested positive just from there).  But that big jump is worrisome.  Hopefully just a blip and they go back to the 100s and 200s of new cases rather than the just over 600 yesterday.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Why did everybody care about the beaches? That was national news all over the place. 

During spring break?  The people on those beaches were getting on planes and heading all over the country.

 

[The Commish]

Why did everybody care about the beaches? That was national news all over the place. 

Don't know

In terms of beaches, the only thing I cared about (and have said multiple times) was stopping spring break and that wasn't because of the beaches specifically, it was because of the crowds and how crowded all the restaurants/bars were after they moved off the beaches to all those areas in the evenings.  Then those people get on planes and go home.  That was the largest concern in my view.  It seems rather obvious, but perhaps not, that when people show concern for "the beaches" they mean more than just the physical beach itself and are also considering the things I mention here.  

I got into an argument with Tm in one of these threads over his outrage that DeSantis wasn't shutting down the beaches.  I didn't/don't see the point.  The measures that local municipalities took seemed to be more than sufficient.  They shut down all the parks and parking lots that were on the beaches and made them "exercise only" areas.  We weren't allowed to congregate in large groups.  There was even a time where you weren't allowed to set up chairs etc.  All that without shutting them down.  I had no problem with any of that.

 

[jamny]

Tennessee Numbers jumped up a bit yesterday (I think I had read that some business reported 57 people tested positive just from there).  But that big jump is worrisome.  Hopefully just a blip and they go back to the 100s and 200s of new cases rather than the just over 600 yesterday.

It was also the most amount of tests they've done in a single day at over 12,000

 

[the moops]

I have an appointment scheduled for Thursday. BYO Mask, stay in the car until a room is available and they call you.

I wonder if I should bring my own mask for the nitrous too. Damn. Where am I going to find one of those?

You got a balloon handy?

I say just bring your own length of flexible tubing and hook up to the tank

 

[sho nuff]

It was also the most amount of tests they've done in a single day at over 12,000

And the day before, how many?  Because the cases were down.  Im not saying more testing isn't going to show more...but I don't believe that large jump was just because of more testing that day.

And as I said earlier...my concern is more in the next 2-3 weeks what we see about numbers around Nashville that didn't start "opening" until last week.  The other counties have not had the cases like Nashville so a rise with them going back to being more open is nice...but seeing what happens in the hot spot for the virus in the state (plus where I live) is more my concern.  Im sure also the concern of the city before the entertainment areas get to open up.

Thus far...my wife's office has yet to set a date for their employees returning to the office (that is both here and world wide I believe).

 

[jamny]

And the day before, how many?  Because the cases were down.  Im not saying more testing isn't going to show more...but I don't believe that large jump was just because of more testing that day.

And as I said earlier...my concern is more in the next 2-3 weeks what we see about numbers around Nashville that didn't start "opening" until last week.  The other counties have not had the cases like Nashville so a rise with them going back to being more open is nice...but seeing what happens in the hot spot for the virus in the state (plus where I live) is more my concern.  Im sure also the concern of the city before the entertainment areas get to open up.

Thus far...my wife's office has yet to set a date for their employees returning to the office (that is both here and world wide I believe).

The day before was 5079 tests

 

[the moops]

I have an appointment scheduled for Thursday. BYO Mask, stay in the car until a room is available and they call you.

I wonder if I should bring my own mask for the nitrous too. Damn. Where am I going to find one of those?

You got a balloon handy?

I say just bring your own length of flexible tubing and hook up to the tank

Also - I actually do not recommend this. One time, back in the day, a friend had a tank in his house. I remember passing around a garden hose that was hooked up directly. Was great fun until I saw two friends, one after the other, take a deep inhale and fall face first onto the ground. As they came too a minute later, both had bloodied their lips. I decided at that moment to walk my self home in the early morning sunshine

 

[sho nuff]

The day before was 5079 tests

On a sunday...yes.  Numbers jumped from in the 100-200 range Sunday I believe to 623 yesterday.  

Id love it if there were just an outlier and a blip...I hope so.

 

[Don Hutson]

It wasn't a rhetorical question. It was an argument to negate your implication that we should disconsider the evidence from warm countries vis a vis spread of the Covid-19 in hot climates because of aircondition (which anyway doesn't seem that strong considering airconditioning is used in hot areas in the US as well).

It was a rhetorical question because you already knew the answer to the question.  That is the definition of a rhetorical question.  I will give you an example of how to communicate more respectfully.  You also asked Wilked an unnecessarily rude rhetorical question:

"Did you live in a trailer with seven or more immigrants workers from India or Pakistan?"

Instead, you could have said this:

"Foreign visitors are in air conditioning almost all of the time in Saudi Arabia but much of the local migrant workforce is not.  They live in very cramped quarters oftentimes without air conditioning.  The Coronavirus spread among these migrant workers has been huge and air conditioning can't explain the spread."

 

[culdeus]

Not sure if anyone cares, but here was experience at Dentist.

• Day before appointment took a series of CV related questions over the phone, asked me to take home temperature.
  
• Upon arrival they had someone take forehead temperature in car, then let me in.
  
• Hygienist was wearing surgical mask over N95 mask, gloves and goggles.
  
• They take hygenist/DDS temp 3x a day (didn't see this, but was posted on their list of things they do)
  
• Cleaning has limited tools, nothing that requires suction of water.  Polishing and similar done on the slowest setting.
  
• Ask you to as much as possible to not engage in small talk (TOTALLY FINE WITH THIS)
  
• Ask you to wear mask into/out of rooms and facility
  

:Shrug:

Cracked a tooth need a crown

 

[shader]

Posted in the Florida Politics thread...spikes are beginning to happen here in Florida.  Out by the lake in the Belle Glade / Pahokee area the ONE hospital they have is pretty much at capacity.  I only know this because my MIL works as an ER nurse and said it's unimaginable to see what is going on there right now.  That IS south Florida and I am in central Florida but it will be interesting to see if this is even acknowledged by our state officials.

I read an article this morning about how the lady that created the Florida covid database was just fired.  Surely they cannot be actually hiding a large number of cases, can they?  That is scary...

 

[shader]

Tennessee Numbers jumped up a bit yesterday (I think I had read that some business reported 57 people tested positive just from there).  But that big jump is worrisome.  Hopefully just a blip and they go back to the 100s and 200s of new cases rather than the just over 600 yesterday.

Definitely noticed that.  But to be fair, Sunday was a +100. So if you average the two together, we're at something like an average of 360 over the last two days, which is in the normal range.  

But, will definitely be watching today's numbers.

 

[culdeus]

If I had one wish in all this I wish the media would stop reporting Sunday and Monday case and death counts.  It promotes a huge amount of misinformation.  Not Georgia level misinformation, but it does allow data doctors the chance to make a false narrative.  

Gathering the cumulative count on Tuesday and reporting EOD Tuesday seems the best way forward.  

 

[shader]

And the day before, how many?  Because the cases were down.  Im not saying more testing isn't going to show more...but I don't believe that large jump was just because of more testing that day.

And as I said earlier...my concern is more in the next 2-3 weeks what we see about numbers around Nashville that didn't start "opening" until last week.  The other counties have not had the cases like Nashville so a rise with them going back to being more open is nice...but seeing what happens in the hot spot for the virus in the state (plus where I live) is more my concern.  Im sure also the concern of the city before the entertainment areas get to open up.

Thus far...my wife's office has yet to set a date for their employees returning to the office (that is both here and world wide I believe).

17k tests from Sunday/Monday.  Average of 8500.  Right in line with averages of the last few weeks.  There's no dramatic increase in testing that happened yesterday.  It was most likely just a bunch of reports that didn't get sent over on Sunday and were included Monday.

I'm with you on concern for TN.  The first few days of opening reminded me of a turtle popping it's head out of a shell.  People were just barely getting out, masks everywhere, nothing happening.

By the first weekend, traffic was significantly higher.  I think as the days have gone on, each day sees an increase in the resumption of "normal" activities.  Nothing close to February obviously, but a general increasing of activity levels, which will likely lead to a slow increase in cases counts over the next month. 

Where TN has advantages though, is that we do an incredible job of testing and there aren't a ton of active cases right now.  

 

[shader]

If I had one wish in all this I wish the media would stop reporting Sunday and Monday case and death counts.  It promotes a huge amount of misinformation.  Not Georgia level misinformation, but it does allow data doctors the chance to make a false narrative.  

Gathering the cumulative count on Tuesday and reporting EOD Tuesday seems the best way forward.  

On the flipside, Tuesday can often be slightly higher than normal as well.  Looks like we may be seeing that with Maryland's numbers today, +1,784.

 

[culdeus]

It's really time to re-investigate the whole "Asymptomatic spread" thing.  

So much could be explained if that was found to be non-sense. It's still not clear how and why we latched on to this so quickly, and with what evidence. 

 

[The Commish]

I read an article this morning about how the lady that created the Florida covid database was just fired.  Surely they cannot be actually hiding a large number of cases, can they?  That is scary...

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242773056.html

 

[msommer]

It was a rhetorical question because you already knew the answer to the question.  That is the definition of a rhetorical question.  I will give you an example of how to communicate more respectfully.  You also asked Wilked an unnecessarily rude rhetorical question:

"Did you live in a trailer with seven or more immigrants workers from India or Pakistan?"

Instead, you could have said this:

"Foreign visitors are in air conditioning almost all of the time in Saudi Arabia but much of the local migrant workforce is not.  They live in very cramped quarters oftentimes without air conditioning.  The Coronavirus spread among these migrant workers has been huge and air conditioning can't explain the spread."

I expected you to answer it, so while it may have been a socratean question, it was not rhetorical

 

[msommer]

experience at Dentist.

Extremely disappointed with this post  

Expecting much, moch more from a visit to @Dentist

 

[msommer]

It's really time to re-investigate the whole "Asymptomatic spread" thing.  

So much could be explained if that was found to be non-sense. It's still not clear how and why we latched on to this so quickly, and with what evidence. 

Initially it was used to "prove" that the Chinese numbers were bogus, IIRC, then that herd immunity was just around the corner.

That said there is something weird with asymptomatic cases that appear prevalent in prisons but not really elsewhere.

We'll likely get more data as testing goes from triaged to free for all (this is happening now AFAIK at least in Germany and Denmark) - hopefully that is one of the datapoints they note

 

[[scooter]]

If I had one wish in all this I wish the media would stop reporting Sunday and Monday case and death counts.  It promotes a huge amount of misinformation.  Not Georgia level misinformation, but it does allow data doctors the chance to make a false narrative.  

Gathering the cumulative count on Tuesday and reporting EOD Tuesday seems the best way forward.  

It's not the media's responsibility to compensate for inefficient bureaucracy.

 

[msommer]

It's not the media's responsibility to compensate for inefficient bureaucracy.

Or sloppy thought processes

 

[parasaurolophus]

It's really time to re-investigate the whole "Asymptomatic spread" thing.  

So much could be explained if that was found to be non-sense. It's still not clear how and why we latched on to this so quickly, and with what evidence. 

I think the prisons that had like 99% asymptomatic cases are a pretty good argument in favor. 

Eta: obviously there is a difference between "a" and "pre" 

 

[culdeus]

I think the prisons that had like 99% asymptomatic cases are a pretty good argument in favor. 

That also seems shaky, what if one person can spread very widely, while being symptomatic? 

In another way: The fact that cases present as symptomatic, does not mean that spread is also.

 

[parasaurolophus]

That also seems shaky, what if one person can spread very widely, while being symptomatic? 

In another way: The fact that cases present as symptomatic, does not mean that spread is also.

I think there were also studies that showed high viral loads at times prior to symptoms showing. 

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

Just for some perspective on numbers...

As of yesterday for Louisiana:

-over 269K tests completed

-34709 total cases reported (only 12.87% positive of all tests completed... that's a decrease of 7-8% in the last 3-4 weeks)

-only ~8400 ACTIVE cases currently

 

[sho nuff]

Not sure if anyone cares, but here was experience at Dentist.

• Day before appointment took a series of CV related questions over the phone, asked me to take home temperature.
  
• Upon arrival they had someone take forehead temperature in car, then let me in.
  
• Hygienist was wearing surgical mask over N95 mask, gloves and goggles.
  
• They take hygenist/DDS temp 3x a day (didn't see this, but was posted on their list of things they do)
  
• Cleaning has limited tools, nothing that requires suction of water.  Polishing and similar done on the slowest setting.
  
• Ask you to as much as possible to not engage in small talk (TOTALLY FINE WITH THIS)
  
• Ask you to wear mask into/out of rooms and facility
  

:Shrug:

Cracked a tooth need a crown

Interesting...mine still used the suction and water rinse as well as the water tool for scraping.  They also engaged in a little small talk, but not much.

 

[Doug B]

Just for some perspective on numbers...

As of yesterday for Louisiana:

-over 269K tests completed

-34709 total cases reported (only 12.87% positive of all tests completed... that's a decrease of 7-8% in the last 3-4 weeks)

-only ~8400 ACTIVE cases currently

Would like to see active cases become a more commonly-reported metric. Total cases always rise -- so looking at totals alone can make it look like nothing's changing for the better.

 

[parasaurolophus]

Werent the nba players all asymptomatic as well? 

 

[Blick]

Would like to see active cases become a more commonly-reported metric. Total cases always rise -- so looking at totals alone can make it look like nothing's changing for the better.

While a bit of a lagging indicator, aren't hospitalizations the easiest, most reliable, and important metric?  Why aren't those numbers broadly reported?

 

[culdeus]

Would like to see active cases become a more commonly-reported metric. Total cases always rise -- so looking at totals alone can make it look like nothing's changing for the better.

Shouldn't you wish for active cases to be more uniformly counted?  Some states are taking an approach of (Days since positive test <28 AND /Dead = ACTIVE)  Then some places are taking this to be 60.  This is being abused in some data manipulation circles as evidence that France is doing a poor job of managing their cases, when they are simply using a more conservative burn off rate.  

 

[Grace Under Pressure]

While a bit of a lagging indicator, aren't hospitalizations the easiest, most reliable, and important metric?  Why aren't those numbers broadly reported?

Tend to agree. Hospitalizations and fatalities tend to be the "hardest" metrics.

Percent of positive tests becomes more important once those two numbers are low and testing capacity is high, IMO. 

 

[culdeus]

Werent the nba players all asymptomatic as well? 

Again, this doesn't mean the spread was done in this manner.  

 

[sho nuff]

17k tests from Sunday/Monday.  Average of 8500.  Right in line with averages of the last few weeks.  There's no dramatic increase in testing that happened yesterday.  It was most likely just a bunch of reports that didn't get sent over on Sunday and were included Monday.

I'm with you on concern for TN.  The first few days of opening reminded me of a turtle popping it's head out of a shell.  People were just barely getting out, masks everywhere, nothing happening.

By the first weekend, traffic was significantly higher.  I think as the days have gone on, each day sees an increase in the resumption of "normal" activities.  Nothing close to February obviously, but a general increasing of activity levels, which will likely lead to a slow increase in cases counts over the next month. 

Where TN has advantages though, is that we do an incredible job of testing and there aren't a ton of active cases right now.  

From the places Ive seen...its a mixed bag.

Went fishing Saturday and stopped in at a gas station just off I-40 between Nashville and Cookeville.  This gas station has like breakfast biscuits and hashbrowns and stuff.  There was a group of 5-6 older guys sitting on little cafe tables inside...its as if the virus doesn't exist there.  Now...sure, they have few cases...but these would likely be high risk individuals....not a mask in sight in that place.

After fishing, stopped in to grab some takeout (now in Lebanon)...restaurant had all staff in masks (id say 50/50 of customers walked in or out wearing masks)...tables roped off for good distancing.  Picked up takeout at a mexican place for my family and the family of my wife's best friend who came over to sort of picnic out in the back yard.  Mexican place looked to have a few inside...all staff in masks.  (drove by the same place yesterday after my dentist appointment and it looked pretty busy for lunch.

From what I have experienced in several places...people in Davidson Co are more likely to be wearing masks and taking it more cautiously...obviously the places more distanced from large cities are acting almost as usual.  Im avoiding Wilson Co about as much as possible...Ive seen far fewer masks there and people less likely to distance...the exception has been Demos' in Lebanon.  

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

While a bit of a lagging indicator, aren't hospitalizations the easiest, most reliable, and important metric?  Why aren't those numbers broadly reported?

I have wondered also. Our state only reports it at the state level (at least publicly reports it, no doubt they have the data internally). And hospital licensed/available bed capacity is already publicly tracked. This goes back to my theory I presented a couple of months ago. IMO, THE metric should be: % of hospitalizations to available hospital space. And some sort of "sliding scale" system that lockdowns/whatever more aggressive containment measurements go into place once the magic threshold has been crossed.  Of course that number is going to be different for every area, so I guess it would make sense to do it by region/county. 

 

[parasaurolophus]

Again, this doesn't mean the spread was done in this manner.  

I find it unlikely that just a couple people at a prison could infect 500. But i also dont know how such a prison is scheduled for eating, recreation, library, etc. But i also have no idea about the follow up. So did like 25 people end up sick? 

I think it is pretty conclusive that presymptomatic people are spreaders. 

I am not so sure about people that never developed symptoms. 

 

[glock]

From the places Ive seen...its a mixed bag.

Went fishing Saturday and stopped in at a gas station just off I-40 between Nashville and Cookeville.  This gas station has like breakfast biscuits and hashbrowns and stuff.  There was a group of 5-6 older guys sitting on little cafe tables inside...its as if the virus doesn't exist there.  Now...sure, they have few cases...but these would likely be high risk individuals....not a mask in sight in that place.

After fishing, stopped in to grab some takeout (now in Lebanon)...restaurant had all staff in masks (id say 50/50 of customers walked in or out wearing masks)...tables roped off for good distancing.  Picked up takeout at a mexican place for my family and the family of my wife's best friend who came over to sort of picnic out in the back yard.  Mexican place looked to have a few inside...all staff in masks.  (drove by the same place yesterday after my dentist appointment and it looked pretty busy for lunch.

From what I have experienced in several places...people in Davidson Co are more likely to be wearing masks and taking it more cautiously...obviously the places more distanced from large cities are acting almost as usual.  Im avoiding Wilson Co about as much as possible...Ive seen far fewer masks there and people less likely to distance...the exception has been Demos' in Lebanon.  

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that these non-mask wearing/no distancing types are all about "I'm not wearing no mask/distancing 'cuz I'm not afraid."

They still don't get that wearing a mask is a courtesy to others in case that they themselves have the 'rona. Not enough PSAs out there on this?

 

[IvanKaramazov]

My university is no longer using the term "mask."  It's now a "face covering."  Sadly, I'm seeing the exact same euphemism at other schools too.

Can we please just stick with English, people?  It's called a mask.  It's always been called a mask.  Just use the short, concise, universally-understood word that already exists.

 

[lod001]

My university is no longer using the term "mask."  It's now a "face covering."  Sadly, I'm seeing the exact same euphemism at other schools too.

Can we please just stick with English, people?  It's called a mask.  It's always been called a mask.  Just use the short, concise, universally-understood word that already exists.

I'm sure someone got offended by the term mask. 

 

[parasaurolophus]

My university is no longer using the term "mask."  It's now a "face covering."  Sadly, I'm seeing the exact same euphemism at other schools too.

Can we please just stick with English, people?  It's called a mask.  It's always been called a mask.  Just use the short, concise, universally-understood word that already exists.

You cant say mask! People will buy all the masks then! Think of the doctors! 

 

[E-Z Glider]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that these non-mask wearing/no distancing types are all about "I'm not wearing no mask/distancing 'cuz I'm not afraid."

They still don't get that wearing a mask is a courtesy to others in case that they themselves have the 'rona. Not enough PSAs out there on this?

I actually see more "cuz its a hoax" or "cuz its a government conspiracy" types.

 

[Shaft41]

My university is no longer using the term "mask."  It's now a "face covering."  Sadly, I'm seeing the exact same euphemism at other schools too.

Can we please just stick with English, people?  It's called a mask.  It's always been called a mask.  Just use the short, concise, universally-understood word that already exists.

I, for one, love a good euphemism.  Of course, that sentence was hard to type, what with me wearing hand coverings.  

 

[Doug B]

While a bit of a lagging indicator, aren't hospitalizations the easiest, most reliable, and important metric?  Why aren't those numbers broadly reported?

Well, even hospitalizations ... that always accumulates, too. But most COVID-19 patients are discharged eventually.

If you mean current COVID hospitalizations and not cumulative COVID hospitalizations, I agree with you that it's a helpful metric.

 

[glock]

My university is no longer using the term "mask."  It's now a "face covering."  Sadly, I'm seeing the exact same euphemism at other schools too.

Can we please just stick with English, people?  It's called a mask.  It's always been called a mask.  Just use the short, concise, universally-understood word that already exists.

The neck gaiters and multipurpose head wrapper thingees ain't "masks."

 

[Doug B]

Shouldn't you wish for active cases to be more uniformly counted?  Some states are taking an approach of (Days since positive test <28 AND /Dead = ACTIVE)  Then some places are taking this to be 60.  This is being abused in some data manipulation circles as evidence that France is doing a poor job of managing their cases, when they are simply using a more conservative burn off rate.  

Well, sure. We get what we can get otherwise.

 

[[scooter]]

My university is no longer using the term "mask."  It's now a "face covering."  Sadly, I'm seeing the exact same euphemism at other schools too.

Can we please just stick with English, people?  It's called a mask.  It's always been called a mask.  Just use the short, concise, universally-understood word that already exists.

"Face covering" has been the CDC description since the directive was introduced on April 3rd.

It seems like it's their way of making a distinction between PPE (which should be prioritized for front-line workers) and non-medical-grade equipment.

edit: and also to underscore the fact that you can use a bandana, gaiter, baklava, or other non-mask item.