*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (23 Viewers)

[skol asylum]

I live in Phoenix and have a 14 and 16 year old in high school in the fall.  We received an email from the school the other day with a survey asking what we would prefer, online schooling, normal schooling, or a combination.  I replied normal schooling as I think kids need to get back in school.  The risk is so low for them it doesn't make sense to not get back to normal.

It's not about them. They will be the spreaders that bring it from centralized school hubs out to their families. Super spreader petri dishes.

 

[skol asylum]

did people really NEED to go out and protest?   Watching the news the last 10 days, how in the world are you going to convince people who HAVE followed the rules and stayed inside except foe groceries, that you need to follow the rules when thousands and thousands across the country are not..  it is very frustrating, and many of the 'lockdown' politicians  are sending such mixed messages, that nobody cares anymore..  

Agreed. The groups of protesters drove me crazy seeing them. I get the importance of the message but at least try not to be on top of each other. 

 

[Parrothead]

Agreed. The groups of protesters drove me crazy seeing them. I get the importance of the message but at least try not to be on top of each other. 

I hope they did not undo the last 90 days of most of us following the rules..

 

[Grahamburn]

Yes. I'm not judging people that don't have that option. I'm directing my ire at the selfish idiots who can't stay home and NEED to go out and party at the beach, bars, etc.

Just saw you edited your post. We both work in healthcare, supply chain for her, finance for me. We have had cuts and other cost savings measures. Luckily we have not been too affected yet other than she is corporate so was required to take 2 weeks off unpaid. She was able to use her PTO balance to cover it though. Could be more cuts to come, who knows. We opened up to elective surgeries in May but Covid is now spiking again which could shut other things down.

Thanks.  I've just noticed opinions on how to handle this virus often vary based on income stream and personal situations. 

 

[shader]

Thanks.  I've just noticed opinions on how to handle this virus often vary based on income stream and personal situations. 

Unfortunately, the largest differentiator seems to be, not income, but the political party one supports

 

[jobarules]

I'm pretty sure a fire can't be put out over the internet.

Neither can learning for a child

 

[skol asylum]

Unfortunately, the largest differentiator seems to be, not income, but the political party one supports

This

 

[skol asylum]

Neither can learning for a child

X

 

[jobarules]

My real question is what happens in the regular flu season and people don't know if they have that or COVID.  Does everyone get tested for both? 

Sure, why not?

 

[jobarules]

We have 6 people in our house - my two oldest both are working outside the home (grocery and retail) - my wife and I WFH - so, I'm not exactly isolating my family but we are also following all the rules/suggestions and we basically make no unnecessary trips out.  I'll continue to do that until there's a vaccine or they say the death rate is a lot lower than they thought or herd immunity.

We visited my sons/out friends on Friday, my son's cousins backyard for the pool on Saturday, and then my dad's home and pool on Saturday. First time we've been to any of their homes since this whole things started. No masks or social distancing. My dad was thrilled to see us and his grandchildren finally. He even barbecued for us. My son practiced with his baseball team yesterday. No precautions taken. Not a single person involved in any of these events was nervous about getting sick. Bottom line, if your nervous, no judgments here, take the precautions you feel necessary and i will do the same. I hate all the judgmental crap going on in this world and this thread. 

 

[jobarules]

I don't think anyone is isolating completely. Many at risk individuals are smart and minimizing their exposure. People need to stop confusing caution with isolation. I am a type one Diabetic--my wife and I are working from home as long as we can (that will end at some point and I will have to make some tough decisions when it does) .We do grocery deliveries. We have ventured to a couple smaller stores to get pet supplies or my sports cards. We have done take out a few times. Our 15 year old has gone to meet friends, but it is always in an open air type setting and she brings a mask. This is caution not isolation. if you read the study done on Covid 19 and diabetics and you had diabetes, you would probably don a hazmat suit to go anywhere. It is a complete death sentence with only about 16% of the 1500 people they studied recovering. 

I think too many of the "open it all up" crowd believes this is some big conspiracy and we are all against them. I miss going to Av's games. I miss going to the movies. I want to sit down and have a good seafood dinner. I have played FF for 26 years and I am debating if I can go to the draft and be with the 11 other team owners--that sucks!!  I want this gone, but for that to happen we have to be on the same page. It is so eerie how we are paralleling the 1918 pandemic--did we not learn anything from our mistakes? 

You sure the diabetics study was for type 1 or type 2? My 40 year old brother has had type 1 since he was 10, is in great shape, and got covid. Had VERY mild symptoms, only losing taste and smell. The study you are referring to might mean type 2 who are generally older/ morbidly obese people. 

 

[The Commish]

I hope they did not undo the last 90 days of most of us following the rules..

They didn't alone...there are plenty of states opening up going directly against the "guidelines" set forth....what we see today is result of those actions...in another week we'll see what the protestors add to the equation.  What we see today is bad enough.

 

[The Commish]

Thanks.  I've just noticed opinions on how to handle this virus often vary based on income stream and personal situations. 

Really?  My observation has been pretty different.  We can take examples from this very thread.

 

[shader]

I hope they did not undo the last 90 days of most of us following the rules..

So far so good in Minnesota.

 

[nirad3]

Have a job interview tomorrow.  Had a brief phone screen Monday followed by a more in-depth, multi-party phone call yesterday.  They are obviously super-interested in me since they're bringing me in, and their office isn't even "open".  Going to tour the office and then sit outside with who would be my supervisor.  It's going to be hot, ugh.  Contemplating wearing a mask, but kind of defeats the purpose of the "face to face".  

 

[Courtjester]

You sure the diabetics study was for type 1 or type 2? My 40 year old brother has had type 1 since he was 10, is in great shape, and got covid. Had VERY mild symptoms, only losing taste and smell. The study you are referring to might mean type 2 who are generally older/ morbidly obese people. 

It was actually both. So glad to hear about your bro, that is the kind of stories we need to hear more of (at least I do)   

 

[Parrothead]

They didn't alone...there are plenty of states opening up going directly against the "guidelines" set forth....what we see today is result of those actions...in another week we'll see what the protestors add to the equation.  What we see today is bad enough.

not at all- but they sure didn't help..   two wrongs and all..  

 

[jobarules]

It was actually both. So glad to hear about your bro, that is the kind of stories we need to hear more of (at least I do)   

My brother is a health nut. Takes tons of supplements. He said years ago his Vitamin D levels were super low so he started taking high doses of vitamin d. Then the whole thing about vitamin d levels possibly having a link to covid deaths and he said who knows, that may have saved his life. 

 

[The Commish]

not at all- but they sure didn't help..   two wrongs and all..  

agreed...plenty of moron to go around for sure.

 

[Don't Noonan]

It's not about them. They will be the spreaders that bring it from centralized school hubs out to their families. Super spreader petri dishes.

It is absolutely about them.  My kids did not do well with the online stuff this spring.  It is in their best interest to physically go to school.  

 

[nirad3]

It is absolutely about them.  My kids did not do well with the online stuff this spring.  It is in their best interest to physically go to school.  

Same here, 9 year old (just finishing 3rd) and 7 year old (just finishing 1st).

The 9 year old (girl) is super social and just learns better in a group environment.

The 7 year old (boy) is "on the autistic spectrum" (like wayyyyy on the low end), and needs speech and "social interaction" classes which can't be done remotely.

Our district sent the questionnaire, and I would suspect we have a mix of online and in-class come fall.

 

[-fish-]

Really?  My observation has been pretty different.  We can take examples from this very thread.

Biggest difference I can tell is whether it's directly affected you.  I know people that have died or become seriously ill.   The "justaflu"  let 'er rip people don't seem to have direct connections with the people that have been the most seriously impacted.   Economic hardships and not getting haircuts just isn't worth risking lives to me. 

 

[Biff84]

My real question is what happens in the regular flu season and people don't know if they have that or COVID.  Does everyone get tested for both?   

This was pretty standard practice especially before the test was readily available. They ruled out flu before considering COVID. When flu season comes, they will run both tests on everyone. One sample can be used for both, so no reason not to.

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

This was pretty standard practice especially before the test was readily available. They ruled out flu before considering COVID. When flu season comes, they will run both tests on everyone. One sample can be used for both, so no reason not to.

Random question, I've seen people complaining about the invasiveness of the swab test for COVID.  Is it the same as what's typically done for the flu, or is it worse somehow?  I got swabbed for flu back in January and it was unpleasant, but not nearly as bad as I've heard some people make it out to be.  

 

[The Commish]

Biggest difference I can tell is whether it's directly affected you.  I know people that have died or become seriously ill.   The "justaflu"  let 'er rip people don't seem to have direct connections with the people that have been the most seriously impacted.   Economic hardships and not getting haircuts just isn't worth risking lives to me. 

This is one....

 

[The Commish]

Random question, I've seen people complaining about the invasiveness of the swab test for COVID.  Is it the same as what's typically done for the flu, or is it worse somehow?  I got swabbed for flu back in January and it was unpleasant, but not nearly as bad as I've heard some people make it out to be.  

Here, flu swab is in the throat...not up the nose through the nasal cavity.  Though, there are some saliva tests that are tracking better than the nasal swab, so who knows which it will be by the fall.

 

[JShare87]

Who will teach those kids in that scenario?  The "regular teacher" will now be busy in the standard classroom.  If the answer is "more federal money to hire virtual teachers for this purpose" then I might be on board.  I suspect, however, the true answer ends up being "we'll figure it out" then nothing ever happens, especially with our polarized federal government.  That's where I continue to say the devil is in the details, and I can't get on board until those details are worked out and implemented.

Just as there will be parents not comfortable sending their kids back, there will be teachers not willing to risk coming back. In our district, around 10 percent of teachers are 65+. The teachers that do not feel safe coming to school can virtually teach the students of the parents that don’t feel safe sending them in. I feel like this scenario is much easier than anything I’ve heard being proposed.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I'm still on team #lockdown, but I do worry a lot about the effect of this on school-aged kids.  Mine are in college in now so this doesn't affect me, but I have a hard time believing that 10 year olds, for example, will not be set back by another year of no school.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I just got an email today from my kid’s high school that another school parent has died from Covid-19.  That’s the fourth dead parent we’ve gotten an email about.  I have a hard time seeing how school opens in the fall around here (Maryland suburbs of DC).

 

[jobarules]

I'm still on team #lockdown, but I do worry a lot about the effect of this on school-aged kids.  Mine are in college in now so this doesn't affect me, but I have a hard time believing that 10 year olds, for example, will not be set back by another year of no school.

Millions of kids already falling behind

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/05/us/coronavirus-education-lost-learning.html?campaign_id=9&emc=edit_nn_20200608&instance_id=19177&nl=the-morning&regi_id=46831018&segment_id=30343&te=1&user_id=92237aed4bb1370a592f4d6c8057c219

 

[jobarules]

People saying we should defund the police but then advocate kids should continue remote learning until a vaccine. Guess who suffers most from remote learning? Minority students who may not have access to remote learning tools. 

MAKES SENSE

 

[skol asylum]

It is absolutely about them.  My kids did not do well with the online stuff this spring.  It is in their best interest to physically go to school.  

I meant health wise. Kids in schools will be huge virus spreaders in their communities. 

By the way, my older kid goes to ASU Digital Prep. Just got an email that they are opening up their program to include K-8 this coming school year. Might be a better online option for you or other interested parents. Don't need to be AZ based to attend the 9-12 grades. Not sure with this new option.

 

[Biff84]

Random question, I've seen people complaining about the invasiveness of the swab test for COVID.  Is it the same as what's typically done for the flu, or is it worse somehow?  I got swabbed for flu back in January and it was unpleasant, but not nearly as bad as I've heard some people make it out to be.  

As @The Commish said the flu swab is typically in the throat. I’m not sure about the invasive nature of the COVID test. Pretty much everyone who has had it told me it was bad but then I read the description of the self test that’s done in the drive thru testing and it doesn’t sound nearly as deep. Could be when someone is administering the test it is more invasive and that’s why you hear the differing opinions.

 

[skol asylum]

Have a job interview tomorrow.  Had a brief phone screen Monday followed by a more in-depth, multi-party phone call yesterday.  They are obviously super-interested in me since they're bringing me in, and their office isn't even "open".  Going to tour the office and then sit outside with who would be my supervisor.  It's going to be hot, ugh.  Contemplating wearing a mask, but kind of defeats the purpose of the "face to face".  

Good luck!

 

[gobrowns33]

Just as there will be parents not comfortable sending their kids back, there will be teachers not willing to risk coming back. In our district, around 10 percent of teachers are 65+. The teachers that do not feel safe coming to school can virtually teach the students of the parents that don’t feel safe sending them in. I feel like this scenario is much easier than anything I’ve heard being proposed.

What of the families where both parents need to work to put food on the table? Scenario is "easy" when it fits your dynamic or situation. 

 

[joffer]

I just got an email today from my kid’s high school that another school parent has died from Covid-19.  That’s the fourth dead parent we’ve gotten an email about.  I have a hard time seeing how school opens in the fall around here (Maryland suburbs of DC).

very sorry to hear that.  I don’t envy you parents.  it’s a tough decision and a tough situation for school districts.

 

[JShare87]

What of the families where both parents need to work to put food on the table? Scenario is "easy" when it fits your dynamic or situation. 

I don’t understand how this has any impact on what I suggested. If both parents need to work, send the kids to school. Maybe I’m misunderstanding what you’re trying to say. I was simply trying to offer a solution as to how the students will be taught virtually if the parents did not feel comfortable sending them back. Also, I’m not trying to make this fit my dynamic or situation. 

 

[Pipes]

People saying we should defund the police but then advocate kids should continue remote learning until a vaccine. Guess who suffers most from remote learning? Minority students who may not have access to remote learning tools. 

MAKES SENSE

Yeah this needs to be discussed.  There is still a chunk of the population that has poor to no internet at home.  These kids are already behind the 8 ball education wise under normal conditions.  That gap is only going to get worse if it’s online school come fall.

 

[gobrowns33]

I don’t understand how this has any impact on what I suggested. If both parents need to work, send the kids to school. Maybe I’m misunderstanding what you’re trying to say. I was simply trying to offer a solution as to how the students will be taught virtually if the parents did not feel comfortable sending them back. Also, I’m not trying to make this fit my dynamic or situation. 

I see your point, but think it would be a little more difficult to implement. I guess my point is, if my kids go to a school with one class per grade and the teacher decides to do virtual learning to all 25 of her students, how many kids have two working parents get screwed. IF they give every parent a choice and the school can support it... two big IFs, then that would be a solid solution. Are there enough teachers for some to do virtual and some in school though? It just seems like the start of this school year is gonna be a nightmare! 

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

As @The Commish said the flu swab is typically in the throat. I’m not sure about the invasive nature of the COVID test. Pretty much everyone who has had it told me it was bad but then I read the description of the self test that’s done in the drive thru testing and it doesn’t sound nearly as deep. Could be when someone is administering the test it is more invasive and that’s why you hear the differing opinions.

Yeah, I had a nasal swab for the flu.  Was just curious if it's the same thing for COVID or if it's somehow a deeper swab or whatever.  

 

[JShare87]

I see your point, but think it would be a little more difficult to implement. I guess my point is, if my kids go to a school with one class per grade and the teacher decides to do virtual learning to all 25 of her students, how many kids have two working parents get screwed. IF they give every parent a choice and the school can support it... two big IFs. Are there enough teachers for some to do virtual and some in school? It just seems like the start of this school year is gonna be a nightmare! 

A teacher isn’t going to be able to make that decision for all his/her kids. I’m on your side with this one. I’m saying, there are going to be parents that do not want to send their kids. There are going to be teachers that do not want to teach in person. Identify the students and teachers that want to do virtual learning across each district. You can assign virtual students to virtual teachers. The rest can go on with school like normal. This way, the parents are making the decision based on their situations. Not the district making a blanket decision for hundreds of different families and situations. 

 

[joffer]

TX hospitalizations up again.

 

[Cowboysfan8]

Have a job interview tomorrow.  Had a brief phone screen Monday followed by a more in-depth, multi-party phone call yesterday.  They are obviously super-interested in me since they're bringing me in, and their office isn't even "open".  Going to tour the office and then sit outside with who would be my supervisor.  It's going to be hot, ugh.  Contemplating wearing a mask, but kind of defeats the purpose of the "face to face".  

Good luck D

 

[gobrowns33]

A teacher isn’t going to be able to make that decision for all his/her kids. I’m on your side with this one. I’m saying, there are going to be parents that do not want to send their kids. There are going to be teachers that do not want to teach in person. Identify the students and teachers that want to do virtual learning across each district. You can assign virtual students to virtual teachers. The rest can go on with school like normal. This way, the parents are making the decision based on their situations. Not the district making a blanket decision for hundreds of different families and situations. 

Gotcha, makes sense...I would be all for that.

What I hope doesn't happen in my state is what some places want to do...half the days in school and half virtual...so with three kids, Monday and wednesday, 2 would be at school, one virtual.  On Tuesday and Thursday, one at school and two virtual....that sounds like a terrible idea (for those who don't have a parent who can stay home full-time or for teachers with young school age kids). 

 

[Terminalxylem]

It's more complicated than that when you take an expansive top-of-the-mountain view. Don't confuse 'your normal' with 'everyone's normal'.

In my experience, it is common (if not a majority) of middle and upper-class households to have an elderly relative living with them. YMMV.

It's a lot, especially in expensive areas like HI.

The number and share of Americans living in multigenerational family households have continued to rise, despite improvements in the U.S. economy since the Great Recession. In 2016, a record 64 million people, or 20% of the U.S. population, lived with multiple generations under one roof, according to a new Pew Research Center analysis of census data.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I like how you tell me not to confuse my normal with everyone else's, then your next sentence, you tell me what your normal is.  Do you not agree that money is the #1 factor on whether or not a child lives with grandparents?

FBG's are generally middle to upper middle class.  I wonder how many are currently living with more than 2 generations?  My guess is it's a minority, not majority as you have suggested.

It's ~20% of the US population. Add that to the percentage of people under 65 with pre-existing conditions (I posted stats for obesity, diabetes, high blood pressure and heart disease several hundred pages ago) you should quickly realize we're talking about a big chunk of the population with increased risk from SARS-CoV-2.

 

[Terminalxylem]

My real question is what happens in the regular flu season and people don't know if they have that or COVID.  Does everyone get tested for both?  Do kids become COVID spreaders if they get sick? etc.  It's one thing to open up when symptoms equal COVID (with a general low percentage having symptoms), its another when symptoms can be almost anything and more people have symptoms.  

When flu resurfaces, I fully expect every patient with flu-like symptoms will be tested for both influenza and COVID. There already are swabs which test for multiple respiratory pathogens, and I see no reason they can't add SARS-CoV-2 to the mix. I also believe our healthcare systems are gonna be bursting at the seams come winter.

I know we don't have convincing evidence thus far, but I'll be shocked if kids don't play a role in COVID resurgence.

 

[Terminalxylem]

As @The Commish said the flu swab is typically in the throat. I’m not sure about the invasive nature of the COVID test. Pretty much everyone who has had it told me it was bad but then I read the description of the self test that’s done in the drive thru testing and it doesn’t sound nearly as deep. Could be when someone is administering the test it is more invasive and that’s why you hear the differing opinions.

They both can be taken from the nose or throat. Nose is way more sensitive for SARS-CoV-2, though saliva is better than either source, at least for the initial tests that were released.

Newer tests have higher sensitivity, though I haven't seen a direct comparison for nasopharyngeal vs. pharyngeal vs. sputum for the best tests.

 

[Terminalxylem]

So many things cause death, how many different causes for the 1,030,799? Where does covid rank on the list of causes?

COVID-19 is already a top 10 cause of death in the US, and will likely be top 3 by the time it's all said and done. #3 Accidents was 169K in 2017. 

Moreover, numbers 1 & 2 contain multiple distinct disease entities; #1 Heart disease includes acute coronary syndromes, heart failure, valve problems, etc. #2 Cancer encompasses every type of malignancy.

IMO, the only specific diagnosis that will be ahead of COVID-19 by year's end will be heart attacks, which killed 365K people.  

 

[TheWinz]

COVID-19 is already a top 10 cause of death in the US, and will likely be top 3 by the time it's all said and done. #3 Accidents was 169K in 2017. 

Moreover, numbers 1 & 2 contain multiple distinct disease entities; #1 Heart disease includes acute coronary syndromes, heart failure, valve problems, etc. #2 Cancer encompasses every type of malignancy.

IMO, the only specific diagnosis that will be ahead of COVID-19 by year's end will be heart attacks, which killed 365K people.  

Your stats are for the older generations, I assume?  I found these numbers from 2014, for people aged 1 thru 44:

10 leading causes of death
1) Unintentional injury - 47,937
2) Suicide - 18,782
3) Cancer - 17,633
4) Heart disease - 15,002
5) Homicide - 11,534
6) Liver disease - 3,337
7) Diabetes - 2,919
Stroke - 2,622
9) Influenza and pneumonia - 2,080
10) Birth defects - 1,961

According to the CDC, there have been 2,426 deaths in 2020 due to COVID for people under 45, as of just a few days ago.  But if you break it down further...

Under 1 year old - 5 COVID deaths = No way 5 deaths makes the top 10 list
Ages 1 thru 4 - 3 COVID deaths = No way 3 deaths makes the top 10 list
Ages 5 thru 14 - 13 COVID deaths = No way 13 deaths makes the top 10 list
Ages 15 thru 24 - 116 COVID deaths = Still nowhere near the top, but perhaps top 10 now
Ages 25 thru 34 - 640 COVID deaths = Again, not close to the top, but surely in the top 10
Ages 35 thru 44 - 1,649 COVID deaths = Not only top 10, but likely pushing top 5

So yeah, COVID will be a leading cause of death in 2020, but not necessarily for all age groups.  It preys on the elderly, not the younger generations.