Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
That you know of.
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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter Big League Chew
- Start date
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
As usual, great info from YLE. This time on nasal vaccines
Hype or hope? Nasal COVID-19 vaccines
Five billion dollars was just allocated to Operation Next Gen with one goal: speed the creation of next-generation COVID-19 vaccines and therapies, including nasal (mucosal) vaccines. I advocated for this at the White House, but it’s going to be a hard road.yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com
Makes me pessimistic on the nasal vaccine front.
I guess no pan-covid vaccine in 2023 either. Just some kind of updated booster in the fall.
Doug B
Footballguy
As usual, great info from YLE. This time on nasal vaccines
Hype or hope? Nasal COVID-19 vaccines
Five billion dollars was just allocated to Operation Next Gen with one goal: speed the creation of next-generation COVID-19 vaccines and therapies, including nasal (mucosal) vaccines. I advocated for this at the White House, but it’s going to be a hard road.
Of interest in the Comments section (to aid searching: posted by Nancy Beiman):
SaNoTize is a measured nitric oxide spray application that has been clinically proven to kill all viruses in the nose (link to manufacturer website - db). It was originally developed as a prophylactic against the flu. The tests showed that It kills ALL covid 19 virus in the nose within two minutes, and reduces viral load to a nearly undetectable amount in infected patients after two days. But don't take my word for it. Here is the result of the third stage trials in the LANCET. I use Enovid (its name in Israel - image of packaging [db]) and it appears to work. I have traveled, gone to crowded venues with poor ventilation, (although I still wear a mask) and eaten in restaurants, with no infection. There are no contraindications with any medication.. It is not a drug. Nevertheless The CDC and Health Canada have not authorized it. Israel, Germany, India and Singapore DID in 2021, and it's available in any drugstore in those countries. The additional tests by Health Canada and CDC should be expedited. It's even more inexcusable in Canada, since it was developed in Vancouver. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lansea/article/PIIS2772-3682(22)00046-4/fulltext
SaNoTize are developing a nasal flu vaccine. They should receive funding.
...
I had covid 19 in July 2022 and wish that i knew about Enovid at that time. It is a lot cheaper than getting sick and it probably costs pennies to make. Nitric oxide is the same substance given to premature babies, to kill viruses...it's not a novel substance; it's the spray bottle with the measured dose that makes it unique. There is no excuse not to approve it.
I went down a bit of a rabbit hole with nitric oxide, and read this on its Wikipedia page -- have never heard this before:
"Nasal breathing produces nitric oxide within the body, while oral breathing does not." (Link1)(Link2)
Anyway: So these virus-killing nasal sprays sound too good to be true. What do our resident medical folks think of this stuff? @Terminalxylem ? @gianmarco ? Any colleagues in NICU familiar with this stuff?
Could nitric oxide nasal sprays be decent pre-exposure prophylaxis that could be sold over-the-counter at chain drugstores? Take a hit before going out to a concert or bar-hopping? Or are there some obvious (to medical professionals) drawbacks to having nitric oxide sprays readily available to the public in this way?
Looks like I have some more reading to do.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Don’t know anything about them, but I’m reluctant to get too excited about any topical microbicide. Almost always, there are unintended consequences of their use. For one, they tend to kill other stuff besides the intended targets, namely your healthy microbiome. And there may be adverse effects involving sense of smell/taste (probably less likely). Plus delivering stuff to mucosal surface at appropriate concentrations is a challenge.As usual, great info from YLE. This time on nasal vaccines
Hype or hope? Nasal COVID-19 vaccines
Five billion dollars was just allocated to Operation Next Gen with one goal: speed the creation of next-generation COVID-19 vaccines and therapies, including nasal (mucosal) vaccines. I advocated for this at the White House, but it’s going to be a hard road.
Of interest in the Comments section (to aid searching: posted by Nancy Beiman):
SaNoTize is a measured nitric oxide spray application that has been clinically proven to kill all viruses in the nose (link to manufacturer website - db). It was originally developed as a prophylactic against the flu. The tests showed that It kills ALL covid 19 virus in the nose within two minutes, and reduces viral load to a nearly undetectable amount in infected patients after two days. But don't take my word for it. Here is the result of the third stage trials in the LANCET. I use Enovid (its name in Israel - image of packaging [db]) and it appears to work. I have traveled, gone to crowded venues with poor ventilation, (although I still wear a mask) and eaten in restaurants, with no infection. There are no contraindications with any medication.. It is not a drug. Nevertheless The CDC and Health Canada have not authorized it. Israel, Germany, India and Singapore DID in 2021, and it's available in any drugstore in those countries. The additional tests by Health Canada and CDC should be expedited. It's even more inexcusable in Canada, since it was developed in Vancouver. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lansea/article/PIIS2772-3682(22)00046-4/fulltextSaNoTize are developing a nasal flu vaccine. They should receive funding....I had covid 19 in July 2022 and wish that i knew about Enovid at that time. It is a lot cheaper than getting sick and it probably costs pennies to make. Nitric oxide is the same substance given to premature babies, to kill viruses...it's not a novel substance; it's the spray bottle with the measured dose that makes it unique. There is no excuse not to approve it.
I went down a bit of a rabbit hole with nitric oxide, and read this on its Wikipedia page -- have never heard this before:
"Nasal breathing produces nitric oxide within the body, while oral breathing does not." (Link1)(Link2)
Anyway: So these virus-killing nasal sprays sound too good to be true. What do our resident medical folks think of this stuff? @Terminalxylem ? @gianmarco ? Any colleagues in NICU familiar with this stuff?
Could nitric oxide nasal sprays be decent pre-exposure prophylaxis that could be sold over-the-counter at chain drugstores? Take a hit before going out to a concert or bar-hopping? Or are there some obvious (to medical professionals) drawbacks to having nitric oxide sprays readily available to the public in this way?
Looks like I have some more reading to do.
Interesting concept though. I‘ll wait for a large-scale clinical trial before believing they work.
The Commish
Footballguy
Podcast "Reveal" has a really good three part series recapping all the **** we went through from 2020 til now. I had forgotten about some of the absurd that we had to endure 
Part 1
Part 2
Part 3
The absurdities in Part 3 are particularly concerning given how likely it is something like this happens again.
Part 1
Part 2
Part 3
The absurdities in Part 3 are particularly concerning given how likely it is something like this happens again.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
The better question is, who thought a healthcare worker would believe endoscopies were performed sans masks?you guys really thought he meant during the procedure too?
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Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Yeah, I didn’t wear them pre-pandemic, except when there were specific concerns for airborne/droplet spread infections. While employee masking is still policy at my hospital, I plan on wearing them indefinitely.
It‘s probably reasonable, both to protect yourself and immunocompromised patients.
Doug B
Footballguy
Bah. It probably takes a good six weeks for these figures to lock in now, with so many states reporting weekly and even bi-weekly.
Today, on Thur 5/4/2023, using 7-day averages:
- The U.S. has been below 300 COVID deaths/day, sustained, since March 7, 2023 (unchanged from last week)
- The U.S. has been below 200 COVID deaths/day, sustained, since April 12, 2023
- The U.S. has been below 150 COVID deaths/day, sustained, since April 24, 2023
I'd guess -- based on the movements and adjustments we have been seeing -- that the true current 7-day average of COVID deaths is still in the neighborhood of 160-180.
Doug B
Footballguy
Conceptually, it reminded me of gargling/rinsing with alcohol-based mouthwashes like Scope. Or doing the same with a weakened hydrogen peroxide solution (I've done this from time to time).
Doug B
Footballguy
There's an ongoing Phase 3 trial right now for the nitric oxide nasal spray that's supposed to finish this summer.
There have been other COVID/nitric oxide studies, as well -- though a great majority of them are for inhaled nitric oxide gas as a COVID treatment (as opposed to a preventative).
fatness
Footballguy
In the last 6 weeks I've been in a hospital, 2 diagnostic labs, and a doctor's office (twice). What I've seen here is the same as what you describe as far as those interacting with patients. Among patients and other staff it was more like 60/40 mask/unmasked. Seems like a new normal is settling in.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
The WHO states that Covid-19 is no longer a global health emergency.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
The WHO has been about three steps behind surface-level reality for this whole thing. Weren't they one of the very last holdouts against the idea that covid was airborne?
Doug B
Footballguy
This is true -- but thankfully, the WHO wasn't really driving the pandemic-response bus in the U.S.
The reading on this topic interests me, and I hadn't really dove into it before. Checking these articles out today:
Aerosol experts provide an account of the rejection of aerosol science by the WHO
In a recent viewpoint article published in the journal Clinical Infectious Diseases, researchers underscored the need for prompt adoption of scientific evidence, using the delayed acceptance of the airborne mode of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) transmission as an...
www.news-medical.net
COVID-19 and Airborne Transmission: Science Rejected, Lives Lost. Can Society Do Better?
In April 2020, 36 experts alerted the WHO about the importance of airborne transmission of SARS-CoV-2. WHO dismissed this advice until it was published in an in
academic.oup.com
What were the historical reasons for the resistance to recognizing airborne transmission during the COVID-19 pandemic? (Wiley Online Library via Indoor Air, 8/21/2022) <-- Ivan's friend Zeynep contributed to this one
I want to read this one, too, but it's behind Nature's strong paywall ($40 to purchase the article, $199 for a one-year subscription to the journal). Maybe @Commish 's wife can read it?
Why the WHO took two years to say COVID is airborne
Early in the pandemic, the World Health Organization stated that SARS-CoV-2 was not transmitted through the air. That mistake and the prolonged process of correcting it sowed confusion and raises questions about what will happen in the next pandemic.
www.nature.com
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Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
YLE's writeup on the WHO's ending of the Public Health Emergency of International Concern
yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com
A monumental moment: End of international emergency
Today the World Health Organization declared the end of the Public Health Emergency of International Concern (PHEIC). This is a huge moment in our story arc of the fight against COVID-19. Here is what it does and does not mean. What this means The WHO
yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
With the WHO milestone and good data on wastewater, deaths, hospitalizations, maybe this is almost over over and is ready to be actually endemic and seasonal.
But then I talk to a colleague today in Chicago whose kid had a total outbreak in her class and brought it home to infect all 4 family members this week. And my one kid has a 102 fever and sore throat the last 2 days (but negative so far).
But then I talk to a colleague today in Chicago whose kid had a total outbreak in her class and brought it home to infect all 4 family members this week. And my one kid has a 102 fever and sore throat the last 2 days (but negative so far).
The Commish
Footballguy
It's important to understand, in this country, we are still experiencing death numbers that are significantly worse than what we'd consider a "bad" flu season. However, the problem is getting more and more regional and the pockets are getting smaller and smaller even though the intensity is up in those pockets. It's really tough to gauge whether this is "endemic" or not by national numbers. We really need to zoom in and look at more local numbers IMO. It won't be the same for all of us unfortunately. As a virus, it's still very real and dangerous for us here in Florida. People may not be acting like it or behaving accordingly, but it's still very prominent down here.
OMG kids got sick? That never happens
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
Disease experts warn White House of potential for omicron-like wave of illness
@Doug B This is more info on what I mentioned a week or two ago. A little more data/discussion included in this piece.
@Doug B This is more info on what I mentioned a week or two ago. A little more data/discussion included in this piece.
Doug B
Footballguy
Saw this when you posted it. The following is not aimed at you, but at the advisers quoted in the article:
I see the predictions, but I am just not "there" yet. I don't feel we're on this constant knife-edge where we're one mutation away from biological Armaggedon. Pandemics end -- they always end. And they don't keep coming back in waves over and over in the immediate aftermath.
I'm a little uncertain what's being called for here. A return to 2020 protocols? Just "keeping an eye" on things and preparing to respond better the next time? I don't know.
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
End of PHE: A shift in data
This week the Public Health Emergency (PHE) for COVID-19 is ending in the U.S. This means many things, but one major shift will be the data—the dashboards and updates we’ve grown accustomed to. Why the change? The public health system in the U.S. is complicated. But, essentially it’s...
yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com
Doug B
Footballguy
I wish Johns Hopkins (or some other agency) could have found a way to keep up the hospitalizations and ICU data. That all sunset in mid-March. While it was a trailing indicator of COVID-wave occurrence & severity, it was a nice cross-check alongside other metrics.
At the moment, all you can really count on is COVID death numbers (which still need about a month to lock in) and the Biobot sewage data.
At the moment, all you can really count on is COVID death numbers (which still need about a month to lock in) and the Biobot sewage data.
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
Could a new COVID vaccine offer lifelong protection?
"We need a better vaccine, one that provides years of robust protection with fewer booster shots against a variety of SARS-CoV-2 strains."
www.futurity.org
Doug B
Footballguy
Most technologies improve over time. I am hoping that the COVID vaccines given in, say, 5-10 years are significantly better (in important ways) than the earliest "Model T" COVID vaccines.Could a new COVID vaccine offer lifelong protection?
"We need a better vaccine, one that provides years of robust protection with fewer booster shots against a variety of SARS-CoV-2 strains."
Wheres the money in that?Could a new COVID vaccine offer lifelong protection?
"We need a better vaccine, one that provides years of robust protection with fewer booster shots against a variety of SARS-CoV-2 strains."
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
Catch up quick: COVID-19
We survived the end of the public health emergency.
yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com
Judge Smails
Footballguy
My daughter’s wedding was in NYC on Mother’s Day. My Mom and the the step mom of my son in law both got bad cases of COVID. My Mom has been isolating ever since and is just starting to sound human.
Doug B
Footballguy
Catch up quick: COVID-19
We survived the end of the public health emergency.
Some takeaways and responses (items quoted are Dr. Jetelina's words):
She is getting some pushback in the Comments because people are thinking that the wastewater levels are supposed to eventually end up near zero "when COVID is all over", and that she is underselling the danger of all those 'cases!'. But that's now how it works -- COVID is now an endemic illness like influenza, rhinoviruses, enteroviruses, legacy coronaviruses, etc. If we checked wastewater for those older, familiar pathogens, we'd see natural rises and falls but never to the point of virtually disappearing. So it is and will continue to be with COVID -- it's out there among people in our environments in May 2023, yes. But mere preponderance of cases doesn't broadly affect society so much anymore. And that will be all the more true going forward.
However: Some context is given in the Comments section:
Kathy
I am very surprised at the 46% of respondents stating that they have worn a mask in the past 7 days. I have not seen anyone anywhere wearing masks. I recently traveled overseas and saw at most maybe two people wearing masks at a very, very busy airport terminal, maybe 1 person on the plane had a mask on. No one wears them in stores, church etc. For reference I live in Pennsylvania.
Melissa Gold
I was a little surprised also, but then I looked at the source of the survey, which is YouGov. I am a YouGov member and receive occasional surveys, and I think the company's typical respondents are people who are socially engaged, politically savvy and who follow current events. I would guess that 46% is accurate among YouGov surveys, but the population surveyed is not necessarily in line with the general population in the US.
I think Melissa Gold is right on here.
Yeah, it's a preprint ... so this definitely isn't the last word on the matter. Still, this particular study is interesting to me because it's collecting self-reports of long COVID yet still coming with somewhat low percentages (I'd expect self-reporting to tend to exaggerate reported symptoms). More data will have to be collected to arrive at firmer conclusions, and that's going to take a good bit of time -- especially considering that we're only 16 months past the high point of Omicron (I feel like long COVID data from before Omicron, and especially from 2020, don't tell us a lot about May 2023 long COVID prevalence).
Doug B
Footballguy
The CDC has a COVID Data Tracker page which does keep track of COVID hospitalizations like Johns Hopkins used to. I don't see a way to tease out COVID ICU admissions, unfortunately. But it's something.
COVID Data Tracker
CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.
covid.cdc.gov
Admissions were over 15,000 the week ending April 1, 2023. The week ending May 20, 2023? Down to 8,200.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Anecdotally, I know 5 people with COVID right now.
Doug B
Footballguy
I would like to comment, but don't want to be glib ... so I'll ask: Do you know whether those five people are generally OK?
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Bad cases (body aches, exhaustion, and bad coughs), but not required to go to the hospital. But worse than how I or anyone in my house had it back in October.
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
Paxlovid gets full FDA approval:
www.fda.gov
FDA Approves First Oral Antiviral for Treatment of COVID-19 in Adults
The FDA approved Paxlovid for the treatment of mild-to-moderate COVID-19 in adults who are at high risk for progression to severe COVID-19.
Today, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved the oral antiviral Paxlovid (nirmatrelvir tablets and ritonavir tablets, co-packaged for oral use) for the treatment of mild-to-moderate COVID-19 in adults who are at high risk for progression to severe COVID-19, including hospitalization or death. Paxlovid is the fourth drug—and first oral antiviral pill—approved by the FDA to treat COVID-19 in adults.
Paxlovid manufactured and packaged under the emergency use authorization (EUA) and distributed by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services will continue to be available to ensure continued access for adults, as well as treatment of eligible children ages 12-18 who are not covered by today’s approval. Paxlovid is not approved or authorized for use as a pre-exposure or post-exposure prophylaxis for prevention of COVID-19.
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
The Brain and Long Covid
2 new studies shed light on persistent neuro-inflammation from even mild infections
erictopol.substack.com
The Commish
Footballguy
If they are doing their jobs correctly, they will undergo major overhauls forever.
Doug B
Footballguy
Kind of a watershed in online COVID tracking these past few weeks:
I didn't catch it initially, because I always look at the 7-day averages but as of May 17, 2023, Worldometers no longer adds new COVID cases to its U.S. Daily New Cases graph. Right now, the graph just looks like it's trailing off to zero. Those who have followed COVID case trends knew that U.S. case data has been unreliable for some time now -- but now it's essentially absent. At least in a one-stop-shop form ... might still be able to cherry-pick from among however many state and municipal health department websites.
The Worldometers COVID deaths counts seemed to still be chugging along, allowing maybe 4-6 weeks for the numbers to adjust and get "baked in". But today I noticed that no new deaths have been added since May 25. Could be a blip in the counting, to be made up over the next month or so. Or it could be similar to the case counts, where the death counts just peter out to nothing as fewer and fewer states continue to report consistently.
Well ... I guess I knew COVID counts wouldn't be a thing forever. Just kind of interesting to experience the familiar, oft-checked Worldometers graphs just drying up like a puddle on a sunny day.
I didn't catch it initially, because I always look at the 7-day averages but as of May 17, 2023, Worldometers no longer adds new COVID cases to its U.S. Daily New Cases graph. Right now, the graph just looks like it's trailing off to zero. Those who have followed COVID case trends knew that U.S. case data has been unreliable for some time now -- but now it's essentially absent. At least in a one-stop-shop form ... might still be able to cherry-pick from among however many state and municipal health department websites.
The Worldometers COVID deaths counts seemed to still be chugging along, allowing maybe 4-6 weeks for the numbers to adjust and get "baked in". But today I noticed that no new deaths have been added since May 25. Could be a blip in the counting, to be made up over the next month or so. Or it could be similar to the case counts, where the death counts just peter out to nothing as fewer and fewer states continue to report consistently.
Well ... I guess I knew COVID counts wouldn't be a thing forever. Just kind of interesting to experience the familiar, oft-checked Worldometers graphs just drying up like a puddle on a sunny day.
Doug B
Footballguy
Not a big shocker, but it's nice to see research trending this way (from US News & World Report, 6/1/2023):
CDC Study: Nearly All Americans Had Some Level of COVID-19 Immunity by Last Fall
Almost all Americans have some level of immunity against COVID-19 through vaccination, previous infection or both, suggests new research from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
The study, which was published Thursday, tested blood donations from people ages 16 years and older for antibodies against the coronavirus from July through September 2022.
It found that 96% of people had antibodies by last fall. About 23% were from infection alone and 26% were from vaccination alone. Nearly 48% had hybrid immunity – a number that’s only expected to grow as the coronavirus continues to circulate.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Hasn’t been a big deal here for a while. But last week, for the first time in several months, I heard about three people admitted to the hospital for symptomatic covid. They were old and/or immunosuppressed, and two of the three were not up to date on boosters. The vaccinated guy had a transplant, with reinfection in less than six months.
And my sole antivax friend, a twenty-something year-old with no medical problems, is out with covid for the third time.
Doug B
Footballguy
Curious: Your friend's in their twenties, essentially healthy, unvaccinated, and is on their third bout of COVID. How's the severity/level of infirmity been? Feeling it for real, or skating through it?
...
COVID is starting to pop up on my wife's work's radar (works with able-bodied elderly in a recreational setting) after several months of calm. I guess the fall 2022 boosters are no longer at least speed-bumping infections. Good news is despite the ages at her work, the recent cases have been taken in stride and haven't caused hospitalizations.
FatMax
Member
It rolled through my workplace in early April. About ten of us got it, out of 30 total people. Four (including myself) tested positive on home tests, one at test site, and the others never tested, but logic tells me that they probably had it too. Only one was more sick that any normal cold or flu. He was unvaxed and had never had it before. I guess there's still of few of those unicorns out there.
My two takeaways from this are A) covid is still severely undereported, and that will not change unless this thing morphs back into Delta-level severity. Of the ten coworkers that got it, only one got an "official" test and was counted. And B) That's not necessarily a bad thing. Most are not getting as sick as the used to. Seems like this is something we can live with now.
nirad3
Footballguy
Always anecdotal, but my latest observations from traveling have been pretty interesting this time around. From OC, Cali to ATL, ATL to Charlotte and now back in ATL, seeing a bit more mask usage than I'm accustomed to seeing on planes / in airports recently. Dunno why, maybe just coincidental based on this trip.
I know folks are still getting hospitalized and God forbid dying of this, but to be honest the only time I really think about COVID is when I see this thread bumped or if I'm traveling and see folks wearing masks.
I know folks are still getting hospitalized and God forbid dying of this, but to be honest the only time I really think about COVID is when I see this thread bumped or if I'm traveling and see folks wearing masks.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
He‘s been out of commission for a few days-week each time. Fully recovered thereafter.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
Bad/unreliable data feels like a hallmark of the covid experience sadly.
Doug B
Footballguy
Needs replication and corroboration, but this is a promising long-COVID-fighting development:
Covid-19: Metformin reduces the risk of developing long term symptoms by 40%, study finds (British Medical Journal, 6/8/2023)
A LOT of Americans fall into that category in red, and that middle-aged cohort tends to be somewhat overlooked in studies. At least from what I've been seeing.
Covid-19: Metformin reduces the risk of developing long term symptoms by 40%, study finds (British Medical Journal, 6/8/2023)
Metformin—a cheap, safe, and widely available diabetes drug—could reduce the incidence of long covid if given during the acute phase of covid-19, a new study indicates.
A two week course of metformin given within three days of testing positive for SARS-CoV-2 led to 40% fewer long covid diagnoses over the following 10 months compared with people who had taken placebo, according to a randomised controlled trial.
The authors of the study, published in Lancet Infectious Diseases, caution that the trial did not look at whether metformin would be effective as a treatment for those who already have long covid.
The 1126 people included in the trial had tested positive for SARS-CoV-2 in the previous three days but had no known previous covid infection. They were not admitted to hospital for covid-19 but were at higher risk of developing severe covid-19 as they were overweight or obese. The median age of participants was 45 years; 44% were male and 56% were female.
A LOT of Americans fall into that category in red, and that middle-aged cohort tends to be somewhat overlooked in studies. At least from what I've been seeing.
ignatiusjreilly
Footballguy
Finally got around to listening to this. Really good (and really depressing).Podcast "Reveal" has a really good three part series recapping all the **** we went through from 2020 til now. I had forgotten about some of the absurd that we had to endure
Part 1
Part 2
Part 3
The absurdities in Part 3 are particularly concerning given how likely it is something like this happens again.
Doug B
Footballguy
The accounts of cryptic COVID lineages -- and individuals who walk around asymptomatically with very-long-term infections -- is fascinating. In the first article below, they were able to actually backtrack a cryptic COVID lineage through wastewater to an individual manhole and narrowed it down to ~30 people in a nearby office building. Then the trail grew cold.
Brownie points to the media in both articles below for not sensationalizing cryptic lineages as "the next variant!!!"
Mysterious COVID strain found in central Ohio (WCMH, 6/6/2023)
Mysterious Covid-19 lineages in US sewers could offer clues to chronic infections (CNN, 6/9/2023)
@Terminalxylem , @gianmarco , @growlers and other medical FBGs: I know that people can (or used to be able to) have essentially permanent typhoid fever infections (e.g. "Typhoid" Mary Mallon). Is that known to be true for any of the various pre-COVID respiratory viruses? Are there people walking around with 12-month or even 10-year-old flu infections?
Brownie points to the media in both articles below for not sensationalizing cryptic lineages as "the next variant!!!"
Mysterious COVID strain found in central Ohio (WCMH, 6/6/2023)
COLUMBUS, Ohio (WCMH) — Viral researchers believe someone in central Ohio has been infected with COVID-19 for at least two years, and they want to find that person.
While the researchers believe there is no threat to public health, they hope this case holds much-needed answers to treating long COVID.
Mysterious Covid-19 lineages in US sewers could offer clues to chronic infections (CNN, 6/9/2023)
The US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has been following these developments closely but has not been directly involved in the work, said Amy Kirby, program lead for the CDC’s National Wastewater Surveillance System.
Right now, the cryptic lineages do not pose a public health threat, she said.
@Terminalxylem , @gianmarco , @growlers and other medical FBGs: I know that people can (or used to be able to) have essentially permanent typhoid fever infections (e.g. "Typhoid" Mary Mallon). Is that known to be true for any of the various pre-COVID respiratory viruses? Are there people walking around with 12-month or even 10-year-old flu infections?
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Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Pretty much every herpesviruses (herpes, mono, CMV, Chickenpox) remain latent for years after initial infection, only to rear their ugly heads when immunity wanes. HPV hangs around too, promoting cancer in those chronically infected.
It's less common for respiratory viruses, but still occurs in some measles cases, and probably adenovirus. There are surely other we don't know about, but flu ain't one of them.
It's also worth noting that ~50% of our DNA is thought to be virally derived. Just like the trillions of bacteria and fungi covering every surface in our bodies, we coexist with a bunch of tiny critters. Essentially, we're more "them" than human.
