What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Official Donald Trump for President thread (1 Viewer)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Sabertooth said:
You need to bring a gun to a gun fight Tim.  Sorry if your sensibilities are hurt.  

What the Dems need to truly do is tap into the talk radio mentality.  Dumb your message down.  Nobody gives a #### about transgender when they lose their job.  The dems need to harp on one or two things (jobs and debt).  Focus like a laser on those and burn Trump and the right every single chance they get.  Make #### up.  Lie.  Fight.  Fight like the country depends on it.  They need to be louder than Limbaugh and Hannity.  They need to be crazier than Breitbart and lie more.  Scorched Earth.  Truly scorched Earth.  Trump needs to go down as a traitor, bigot, small handed failure.  Nothing short will do.  
Click to expand...
They could put together a left-wing talk radio outfit and call it Air America...

 
Yeah, I completely disagree with Sabertooth on this.  We need to improve our politics, not drag it down to the lowest possible level at every opportunity.  We will win in the long run and the country will be better for it.

 
Statorama said:
To this day it still baffles me that mainstream news (ABC/CBS/NBC/CNN) hasn't caught on that you need to sprinkle in some center-right stuff every once in a while.  They are fighting like a bucket of crabs over the same audience while FoxNews has the rest of the audience all to themselves. 

It's like having four doughnut shops in a row that only sell doughnuts and then one store next to them is a coffee shop.  If the doughnut places add coffee and beverages to their product offerings....the coffee shop loses business.
Click to expand...
They don't need to be right, left, or center. They need to be unbiased and report the news. Fox "wins" because they slant one way which appeals to a segment of society that still watches the "news". As that segment dies off it will be interesting to see what happens at/to Fox.

 
Sabertooth said:
You need to bring a gun to a gun fight Tim.  Sorry if your sensibilities are hurt.  

What the Dems need to truly do is tap into the talk radio mentality.  Dumb your message down.  Nobody gives a #### about transgender when they lose their job.  The dems need to harp on one or two things (jobs and debt).  Focus like a laser on those and burn Trump and the right every single chance they get.  Make #### up.  Lie.  Fight.  Fight like the country depends on it.  They need to be louder than Limbaugh and Hannity.  They need to be crazier than Breitbart and lie more.  Scorched Earth.  Truly scorched Earth.  Trump needs to go down as a traitor, bigot, small handed failure.  Nothing short will do.  
Click to expand...
Yes....YES...YES.  Let the hate flow through you.  

More race riots, more namecalling, more planted thugs at rallies, more fake news and political correctness run amok.   That will save the DEMS.   

 
More race riots, more namecalling, more planted thugs at rallies, more fake news and political correctness run amok. That will save the DEMS.
Click to expand...
Keeping thinking that your racist dog whistles ("race riots" and "thugs") are what propelled Trump into office. Make that the centerpiece of your platform going forward. That will save the REPS.

 
timschochet said:
According to the article Flynn didn't do it knowingly. But why should that make a difference right? 
Click to expand...
This was discussed further up if you look for it, but you can see from his comment excusing it as battlefield exigency that he did it knowingly. Clapper let him off the hook, then Obama stupidly hired him as DNI, then unsurprisingly had to fire him. Yes this stuff matters. Mattis is the one who had him investigated btw.

- ETA - This is really a prime example of how the Obama administration did not take classified information rules & cyber security seriously.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Skoo said:
I think there is a healthy balance that can be found for the Dems somewhere between spineless wussies and right-wing radio bat%^&^ crazy.
Click to expand...
Exactly.  There's way too much party acquiescence to the nutballs on either side of the aisle.  Keep the message simple.  Make America Great Again.  How freaking crazy simple is that?  As crazy simple as Hope and Change.

This is the "aint got time for that" generation.  People don't have the time to digest in-depth material.  I get it.  I roll my eyes if I see that there's a middle step of stirring my microwave meal (who am I, freaking Emeril over here?).  This generation wants their information in digestible chunks like blurbs that scroll across the bottom of the screen.

If you put out Economy / Jobs / Personal Freedoms as your High Level Platform, you're going to beat the Abortion / Transgender / Making-Climate-Change-related-companies-rich platform every single time.  James Carville is kind of an idiot but even he knew to pull Bill Clinton aside and say "it's the economy, stupid"

GRANTED, Hillary was a terrible messenger, and she was dealing with the biggest wild card opponent of all time.  Perfect storm kind of stuff.

 
boots11234 said:
I'm already getting tired of winning!  The guys not even in office yet and the Dow is closing in on 20K!!  Make it stop Mr president elect, make it stop!!!
Click to expand...
The ironic thing is that Obama will think it's because of him and his policies.  "Look at how high the Dow was when I left office...I'm awesome"

 
I think some of what you argue makes sense, Sabertooth. I agree the Democrats do need to refine their message and focus on one or two issues: given what Trump looks to be doing, climate change might be one of them. 

But I don't agree with scorched earth. Donald Trump is no Republican, and some of the things he's going to propose will be stuff that Democrats will like (infrastructure spending for example). When that happens Democrats should cooperate. 

 
No need for the Dems to go scorched earth.  Trump will scorch the earth plenty on his own.  All they have to do is appear as the party of reason and common sense - a big challenge, I know.

 
timschochet said:
I think some of what you argue makes sense, Sabertooth. I agree the Democrats do need to refine their message and focus on one or two issues: given what Trump looks to be doing, climate change might be one of them. 

But I don't agree with scorched earth. Donald Trump is no Republican, and some of the things he's going to propose will be stuff that Democrats will like (infrastructure spending for example). When that happens Democrats should cooperate. 
Click to expand...
Yeah...Dems really like privatized toll roads. 

 
I would be hesitant to draw any conclusions on tone and message regarding this election as these were two uniquely bad choices.  Libertarians and greens should be doing a lot of self-reflection right now....

 
Statorama said:
Making-Climate-Change-related-companies rich
Click to expand...
Putting aside your awful definition, we really don't know if climate change is a losing political issue. Hillary never campaigned on it. Trump never referred to it. There were no questions about it during the GOP debates, and only one question, without followups, during the 3 Clinton/Trump debates. There were no ads about it. I and many others complained about all of this at the time. 

And now Trump's administration is dominated by people determined to roll back all environmental restrictions based on climate change. Suddenly this issue, which Trump never campaigned on or even mentioned, is becoming early one the leading item of his presidency. 

 
Boston said:
Means to an ends means by any means necessary...sorry but your Pollyanna way of thinking is not how it is being practiced in today's world...

The community organizer is given eleven rules for guidance with respect to ethics.

(1) The first rule is “One’s concern with the ethics of means and ends varies inversely with ones personal interest in the issue.”  That is to say, the more you care about the issue the less you should care about the methods you use to fight for it.

(2) “judgment of the ethics of means and ends is dependant on the political position of those making the judgment.”

(3) “in war the end justifies almost any means.”

(4) “judgment must be mad in the context of the times…” “ethical standards must be elastic to stretch in the times.”

(5) “concern with ethics increases with the number of means available…”

(6) “the less important the end…the more one can afford to engage in ethical evaluation of means

(7) “success or failure is a mighty determinate of ethics.”

(8) the “morality of means depends on whether the means is being deployed at the time of imminent defeat or imminent victory.”

(9) “any effective means is automatically judged by the opposition as unethical.”

(10) “do what you can with what you have and clothe it with moral arguments.”

(11) Whatever your mission “goals must be phrased in terms like Liberty, Equality, Fraternity, or Of the Common Welfare or Pursuit of Happiness or Bread and Peace”.
Click to expand...
Slicing and dicing out of context quotes to prove your point! Except you didn't do the heavy lifting and ignored fair use. Here's the link you forgot to post.

And I love how the front page has a completely fake quote . You might need to find some new source material

A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.”― Alexis de Tocquevilleca. 1840
Click to expand...

 
timschochet said:
But I don't agree with scorched earth. Donald Trump is no Republican, and some of the things he's going to propose will be stuff that Democrats will like (infrastructure spending for example). When that happens Democrats should cooperate. 
Click to expand...
While I can't speak for the actual deals themselves, Trump has a long history of getting two sides to sign on the line to get a deal done.  I think we're going to at least get back to some semblance of working together.  Look at the guys in charge of turning the GOP gears.  Ryan and McConnell?  You don't think those guys are ready to compromise?

Obama had a my way or the highway mentality and GOP got all butt hurt crybaby that Obama was mean to them.  Adolescent foolishness on both sides.

I think back to that time where Obama and Boehner had ironed out a deal as the continuing resolution was getting closer.  Obama was getting about 80% of what he wanted, but Boehner was getting 20% of what he wanted.  Boehner went to floor, went through a contentious fight to garner enough support for the deal only to have Obama turn around and say...yeah, I'm going to need more (for those who can't remember, it's the famous "moving the goalposts" incident - the original deal called for 800 billion in tax revenues, but Obama came in at the last minute and wanted 400 billion more).  If Obama hadn't come in and changed the deal...I think those guys could have worked well with each other.

 
The American electorate is like a smokin' hot chick with daddy issues; the worse you treat them, the more they want you.

I agree with Sabertooth........the message needs to be dumbed down and simplified.  All you need to do is look at the debates to know that being prepared and truly knowing all the issues has no bearing anymore.  Listen to the interviews and understand what Johnny Lunchbox and Mary Homemaker want.  You don't need specifics, you can insult and scorch earth.  Just tell them about jobs and how you will improve their lives.  But don't be specific, you don't have to.  You can wing it.  Don't commit to anything, leave yourself open.  Speak generally.  Tell them what the truth is.

It really is that simple.

 
timschochet said:
Putting aside your awful definition, we really don't know if climate change is a losing political issue. Hillary never campaigned on it. Trump never referred to it. There were no questions about it during the GOP debates, and only one question, without followups, during the 3 Clinton/Trump debates. There were no ads about it. I and many others complained about all of this at the time. 

And now Trump's administration is dominated by people determined to roll back all environmental restrictions based on climate change. Suddenly this issue, which Trump never campaigned on or even mentioned, is becoming early one the leading item of his presidency. 
Click to expand...
While it gets positive messaging in the media, it seems like a dog to me.  The new generation of voters want to see immediate personal results.  I don't have a job - this guy says he's going to get me a job.  I don't have a lot of money - this guy says the economy is going to roar back.  My kids are going to crappy public schools - this guys saying if we don't do something soon there's going to be less glaciers in 200 years.

What the climate change hoaxers have going for them is that younger voters like "being part of something" bigger than themselves.  If they can get that crowd into it there's trillions to be made in climate change R&D (which is the practical goal of the climate change hoaxers).

 
Chemical X said:
Listen to the interviews and understand what Johnny Lunchbox and Mary Homemaker want.  You don't need specifics, you can insult and scorch earth.  Just tell them about jobs and how you will improve their lives.  But don't be specific, you don't have to.  You can wing it.  Don't commit to anything, leave yourself open.  Speak generally.  Tell them what the truth is.

It really is that simple.
Click to expand...
Obama was the master of this.  I still don't know why Clinton didn't run with that blueprint.

 
This whole idea that Putin decided our president is totally off the rails insane. It’s one thing that the left-wing media continues to promote it, its another that people in high places give it legitimacy. It seems like all rational thought has evaporated.

 
fatguyinalittlecoat said:
I'd be more sympathetic to your position if Trump had seemed like a reasonable, good candidate before the election and all of a sudden he turned into Trump after the voters picked him.  Then we could say that the electors are protecting the voters by acting on info they didn't have.  But pretty much all this stuff was obvious before he got elected, and he still won the election.  This is what Trump voters cast their votes for.
Click to expand...
The electoral college wasn't created solely to protect the voters from what they don't know.  It was created, for better or worse, in the belief that elites would be better equipped to vote in the best interests of the country than the "common" voters.  Even when those common voters had to be white men who owned land. 

I'm with you in thinking the electoral college is stupid, but it's weird to see people so intent on defending it as an institution based on the intent of the Founders when the Founders had no concept that something like a faithless elector could exist.  Electors were never intended to be bound in the first place. 

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
The electoral college wasn't created solely to protect the voters from what they don't know.  It was created, for better or worse, in the belief that elites would be better equipped to vote in the best interests of the country than the "common" voters.  Even when those common voters had to be white men who owned land. 

I'm with you in thinking the electoral college is stupid, but it's weird to see people so intent on defending it as an institution based on the intent of the Founders when the Founders had no concept that something like a faithless elector could exist.  Electors were never intended to be bound in the first place. 
Click to expand...
did the founders ever invision women and blacks voting or there being 50 states?  states are represented in the house and senate.  no reason to continue to have our election be 51 or so popular elections. 

 
Chemical X said:
did the founders ever invision women and blacks voting or there being 50 states?  states are represented in the house and senate.  no reason to continue to have our election be 51 or so popular elections. 
Click to expand...
You seem to be arguing about a point I didn't make, but I will indulge you.  The Founders did not envision these things.  But the people who subsequently amended the Constitution to allow them obviously did envision them.  As you know, the Constitution has not been so amended as to eliminate the Electoral College.  I believe it should be, but that is largely irrelevant.  I just find it curious when people who defend the electoral college worry about the precedent that would be set if faithless electors chose not to cast their votes for Trump.  Because nothing in the Constitution suggests that electors would be bound by a state's vote in the first place.  Faithless elector laws are creations of state law.  And they are, arguably, unconstitutional under the Supremacy Clause. 

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
'Gosh the back shoulder throw Brees & Brady do works so well, why doesn't Blaine Gabbert just do that?'
Click to expand...
In a vacuum Blaine Gabbert might be able to complete a higher than average percentage of those throws, but he has a horrible offensive line.

Hillary had a step by step blueprint to follow and she ignored it.  To your comparison, it was like Blaine Gabbert said "Yeah, I know Brees and Brady think they're so cool with their back shoulder throws, but I think throwing into triple coverage is the way to go.  High five!"

Just keep telling people things are going to be ok.  All the bad stuff that happened yesterday will wash away tomorrow.  The useful idiots vote for that every dang time.

 
butcher boy said:
This whole idea that Putin decided our president is totally off the rails insane. It’s one thing that the left-wing media continues to promote it, its another that people in high places give it legitimacy. It seems like all rational thought has evaporated.
Click to expand...
It's insane that we have an admitted rapist as President-elect.  But it's happening.  

 
Sabertooth said:
Exactly, it shouldn't.  Ignorance of the law is never a defense.  Even in traffic court.  
Click to expand...
Most crimes require a mens rea, or a criminal state of mind.  The statute in question requires the disclosure of classified information to be knowing.  To be intentional.  Being negligent or even reckless does not suffice. 

Your quote about ignorance of the law has nothing to do with this.  If Flynn knew that he was divulging classified information to an unauthorized party, but didn't know that there was a criminal statute prohibiting that, then yes, his ignorance of the law, would not be a defense.  But his lack of knowledge as to the basic elements of the offense (i.e., either the classified status of the material or the unauthorized status of the recipients) would always be a defense.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
Sometimes the fancy talk matters.  Understanding why Flynn likely committed no crime is key to understanding that Hillary committed no crime. 
Click to expand...
They're not remotely the same in this report. Flynn doesn't apologize for anything but rather states he believed the battlefield situation called for his divulging the information. Whatever excuse Clapper made for him not knowing it was classified was bs. Mattis obviously wanted him punished and it sounds like he should have been.

- However the other security issue that Flynn got in trouble for - having a private internet connection - was similar to Hillary, but that's not what's discussed here.

 
Chemical X said:
The American electorate is like a smokin' hot chick with daddy issues; the worse you treat them, the more they want you.

I agree with Sabertooth........the message needs to be dumbed down and simplified.  All you need to do is look at the debates to know that being prepared and truly knowing all the issues has no bearing anymore.  Listen to the interviews and understand what Johnny Lunchbox and Mary Homemaker want.  You don't need specifics, you can insult and scorch earth.  Just tell them about jobs and how you will improve their lives.  But don't be specific, you don't have to.  You can wing it.  Don't commit to anything, leave yourself open.  Speak generally.  Tell them what the truth is.

It really is that simple.
Click to expand...
No, this is how we get crappy governance.  The better choice is to turn Johnny Lunchbox and Mary Homemaker into more sophisticated voters.  I realize this is not easy but that's how I want to do it.

 
Will Jordan ‏@williamjordann  2h2 hours ago

Um, wow... Net favorability of Putin: Democrats July 2014: -54 Dec 2016: -62 Republicans July 2014: -66 Dec 2016: -10 (YouGov/Economist)

 
fatguyinalittlecoat said:
No, this is how we get crappy governance.  The better choice is to turn Johnny Lunchbox and Mary Homemaker into more sophisticated voters.  I realize this is not easy but that's how I want to do it.
Click to expand...
watch family guy episode - it takes a village idiot and I married one

this teaches how to win an election........very accurately

 
Now Jim Brown, Ray Lewis and Kayne all say they "Love Trump" Maybe this thing will work...
Click to expand...
Sure. Three rich black guys who believe that police brutality is a myth and that things really aren't that bad for black people. That will go over real easy with the BLM types.

 
Joe Summer said:
Sure. Three rich black guys who believe that police brutality is a myth and that things really aren't that bad for black people. That will go over real easy with the BLM types.
Click to expand...
I hope this is sarcasm?  Jim Brown and Ray Lewis have a lot more credibility than some poser punk like Shaun King.   Jim Brown has dedicated decades to civil rights issues. 

 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

DA RAIDERS
Pick a fantasy team for the Tour de France. There will be prizes!
Replies
35
Views
3K
DA RAIDERS
DA RAIDERS
kutta
***Official 2025 Footballguy T-Shirt Exchange - OCT 12 SHIPPING DEADLINE (extended 2 weeks)***
2 3
Replies
141
Views
3K
kutta
kutta
scorchy
Any banking guys that can offer solutions to a vexing issue?
Replies
31
Views
490
Mrs. Rannous
Mrs. Rannous

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)
Back
Top