smbkrypt24
Footballguy
I’m in close to 10 and don’t like kickers
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
****OFFICIAL DYNASTY TRADES**** (23 Viewers)
- Thread starter Gottabesweet
- Start date
Boston
Footballguy
Only two Dynasty leagues…no kickers and no defenses…complete unanimity that they are not missed.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
New theory.
Lower number of leagues don't care about kickers.
Higher number of leagues=actively want to get rid of kickers
Dez
Footballguy
I am in over 100 leagues I love kickers and gain an advantage over the rest of the league in most cases because people don't want to spend that kind of pick on them. That is more for redraft but I traded for Tucker a few years ago in a dynasty league. I had 56 shares of Justin Tucker last year. Should been 1 more I would won an extra $10,000 if I had Tucker instead of McPherson week 17 last year. That 0 hurt.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
eighsse2
Footballguy
I guess it just seems odd to me to not include kickers and defenses. Feels more like a "team" despite the players having no actual relation to each other. Football teams have kickers, who score points. So why not have them. However, a counterargument would be to take that further and ask rhetorically, what about offensive linemen? Sometimes them might catch a pass on a trick/freak play. Why leave them out? Then obviously I would agree there is a limit, and then the question is, why must kickers be within the limit if there is a limit?
Two more points.
(1) The inclusion of kickers (and I guess defenses) probably made a lot more sense back in the old "scoring only" fantasy football leagues, in which a fantasy player would score points only when he scores actual points in the NFL game. With all the yardage points and PPR, it seems a less perfect and natural system, and then field goals are not as important to keep around.
(2) Someone, somewhere, has probably done this, but I always thought it would be cool to make a fantasy league with defenses (whether it be IDP, or team defense, or maybe team passing defense and team rushing defense separately) that actually affect the offensive players on the opposing fantasy team. There are five billion ways that could be implemented, mostly probably horrible. But if you could somehow fine-tune it to be sensible, I just think it would be cool to have to think, ooh, I'm going up against a tough rush defense this week, definitely putting a WR at flex, and things like that. [NOTE: Of course this would be something non-arithmetic. If you just say "a defensive sack takes 1 point away from your opponent's QB", it's just the same as a defense scoring 1 point for getting a sack. But if you say "if your defense gets 5+ sacks, then your opposing QB is limited to 3 passing TD MAX, and things of that nature, that would be really interesting, to me anyway. Of course, complicating things tends to complicate things. But sometimes it turns out fun.
Two more points.
(1) The inclusion of kickers (and I guess defenses) probably made a lot more sense back in the old "scoring only" fantasy football leagues, in which a fantasy player would score points only when he scores actual points in the NFL game. With all the yardage points and PPR, it seems a less perfect and natural system, and then field goals are not as important to keep around.
(2) Someone, somewhere, has probably done this, but I always thought it would be cool to make a fantasy league with defenses (whether it be IDP, or team defense, or maybe team passing defense and team rushing defense separately) that actually affect the offensive players on the opposing fantasy team. There are five billion ways that could be implemented, mostly probably horrible. But if you could somehow fine-tune it to be sensible, I just think it would be cool to have to think, ooh, I'm going up against a tough rush defense this week, definitely putting a WR at flex, and things like that. [NOTE: Of course this would be something non-arithmetic. If you just say "a defensive sack takes 1 point away from your opponent's QB", it's just the same as a defense scoring 1 point for getting a sack. But if you say "if your defense gets 5+ sacks, then your opposing QB is limited to 3 passing TD MAX, and things of that nature, that would be really interesting, to me anyway. Of course, complicating things tends to complicate things. But sometimes it turns out fun.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
The IDP redraft league I commission has kickers.
We voted to keep them last year when going 0 kicker was proposed.
I don’t mind K in redraft. It’s a tumultuous position to deal with in dynasty. Unless you have 99 copies of Justin Tucker like @Dez of course.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Why kickers and not coaches? Give points for wins or point differential.
QBs should get extra points if the team wins. Maybe ALL players should get extra points if the team wins.
QBs should get extra points if the team wins. Maybe ALL players should get extra points if the team wins.
eighsse2
Footballguy
What makes it tumultuous in dynasty? When you're making your drops in the offseason ... If you like your kicker, keep him. Don't like your kicker? Drop 'em. When your last pick comes up, draft the highest kicker on your list. When his bye comes around, drop him for another one, or if he's doing really well, pick up a second kicker for that week only.The IDP redraft league I commission has kickers.
We voted to keep them last year when going 0 kicker was proposed.
I don’t mind K in redraft. It’s a tumultuous position to deal with in dynasty. Unless you have 99 copies of Justin Tucker like @Dez of course.
That is one thing I would add: I'm probably the only one in my league who almost NEVER has multiple kickers or defenses. 1 and 1, that's all. A lot of guys carry 2 and 2 almost all the time. Which I can understand, especially with defenses. But no, I'd rather stash a prospect.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Well, my IDP dynasty with K is a 16 team league, so it actually is challenging having a kicker all season including BYEs.
I was able to scrape up Maher & York, the rookie the Browns drafted (who wasn’t awesome) plus Pineiro, and Zane Gonzales who got hurt in preseason. I kicked in Pineiro as part of a deal where I got Kwity Paye, so that was useful.
They’re tumultuous because they seem to lose their jobs, get hurt, or just suck for extended periods. All for dumb luck weekly points - will their team score a bunch of TDs that week? Yay, I get 5 PATs. Does their coach go for it on 4th down? Great - I won’t get any long kicks.
It’s just an annoying position to deal with, so the idea of dealing with them in dynasty, and in a league with 32 rostered kickers, kinda sucks.
eighsse2
Footballguy
Yeah, I can see that being an issue in a 16-team league for sure.
BeTheMatch
Footballguy
If you want to use Ks and Ds, save everyone the trouble and just bet on monkeys playing blackjack.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Man. I want to say Saquan + Swift, but as a Swift shareholder already I’m loathe to invest in more shares.
The most value seems to be on that side though. Thomas might be a blank. Bijan is very very valuable.
It’s an interesting deal for sure. I’m not sure who wins.
Just traded 1.6 this year and Zach Ertz for a 2024 1st which I am convinced will be a top 2/3 pick. I don't need Ertz since I have Andrews and McBride as a back up.
I like to gamble on teams sucking. That's how I got 1.6 in the first place from a team that was convinced he was not only a playoff team but a title contender.
I like to gamble on teams sucking. That's how I got 1.6 in the first place from a team that was convinced he was not only a playoff team but a title contender.
If no contracts involved, I like team B. Big if, but if Swift manages to stay on the field, huge potential there. Plus the unknown of where Bijan ends up.
Hard for me to give Thomas much value at this point, but if he even gets to solid #2 production, then it's pretty even IMO
A good time until the dirty chimps start hitting 19
JohnnyU
Footballguy
I like that kind of gambling…….but the 1.6 was almost a playoff team.
16 team league , so not really. Should have mentioned that
Lehigh98
Footballguy
No kickers, no defense, best ball and super flexy... QB, RB, WR, TE(P), 5 Flex, SF... this is the way.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Whoa whoa whoa, settle down there fella, let’s not get too crazy now.
IDP Super Flex league. Keep 15 (or $250).
Starting Requirements: Q/R/R/W/W/T/SF/K/P/DL/DL/LB/LB/DB/DB/IDP FLEX
Team A gets:
Team B gets:
NOTES:
Starting Requirements: Q/R/R/W/W/T/SF/K/P/DL/DL/LB/LB/DB/DB/IDP FLEX
Team A gets:
- CMC ($62 to keep)
- Bradley Chubb ($5/2024) - Big Play scoring so OLB have more value than most IDP scoring gives them credit for
- Karlaftis ($7 to keep)
- 5th round pick (added value because you need a top 5 round pick to participate in the Restricted Free Agent Auction - probably equivalent to a late 1st or early 2nd rookie pick)
Team B gets:
- Trevor Lawrence ($10/2023)
NOTES:
- Team B likely wouldn't have been able to keep CMC at that price
- Team A still has Murray and Goff at QB
- Team B still has Taylor and Dillon at RB
- Team B now has TL and Dak at QB and can now keep Nick Bosa (DL2) & Quinnen Williams (DL4) because of cleared salary
- Team A won the title in 2022
- Team B finished 2nd in 2022
Jonesin For Some Football
Footballguy
I so badly want to do this in all of my leagues but can't get it through.
eighsse2
Footballguy
12-team PPR QRRWWFKD
Gave: Mixon + 2.10
Got: 1.08
Most people on here were saying no way they would give the 1.08 for Mixon, but maybe with the bump in RB value considering the RRWWF lineup it was more doable. I mean, what are the 2023 expectations of a RB you're getting at 1.08? Nowhere near Mixon's, unless he's suspended or whatever. He's a gamble for sure, but a RB who might have 2 more great years in him? That's always worth a good bit, even with some risk.
Gave: Mixon + 2.10
Got: 1.08
Most people on here were saying no way they would give the 1.08 for Mixon, but maybe with the bump in RB value considering the RRWWF lineup it was more doable. I mean, what are the 2023 expectations of a RB you're getting at 1.08? Nowhere near Mixon's, unless he's suspended or whatever. He's a gamble for sure, but a RB who might have 2 more great years in him? That's always worth a good bit, even with some risk.
Jonesin For Some Football
Footballguy
I'm trying my hardest to get the 1.01 for Bijan right now and have Barkley. Not sure I would make this move if I had Swift. Seems pretty fair but Barkley/Swift is probably the safer bet and more value as of now. This is a tough one as all fair trades probably should be.
NE_REVIVAL
Footballguy
FFPC std
Gave
Cooper Amari, Chubb, Moore DJ, Murray Kyler
Got
Diggs Stefon, Hurts Jalen
2.10, 3.11 & 24 3rd
Current roster:
Hurts
Kenneth Walker, Josh Jacobs, D'Andre Swift, Damien Harris, James Cook
Diggs, Metcalf, Waddle, Kirk, Isaiah Hodgins
Freiermuth, Engram, Likely
Missed playoffs last couple of years and I know I took a beating on value (maybe trades like this are reason why). Cutdown looming, needed to consolidate and shake things up a bit. Only piece I really hated letting go off was DJ. Meh, regerts already, but yolo.
Gave
Cooper Amari, Chubb, Moore DJ, Murray Kyler
Got
Diggs Stefon, Hurts Jalen
2.10, 3.11 & 24 3rd
Current roster:
Hurts
Kenneth Walker, Josh Jacobs, D'Andre Swift, Damien Harris, James Cook
Diggs, Metcalf, Waddle, Kirk, Isaiah Hodgins
Freiermuth, Engram, Likely
Missed playoffs last couple of years and I know I took a beating on value (maybe trades like this are reason why). Cutdown looming, needed to consolidate and shake things up a bit. Only piece I really hated letting go off was DJ. Meh, regerts already, but yolo.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hurts is the best player in this trade. You gave up Murray, 2 aging assets & DJ Moore.
I don’t love the picks you got back, but you jettisoned an injured Murray for Hurts. That’s a win in my book.
Not sure why the other team made this deal unless Hurts was their QB2?
NE_REVIVAL
Footballguy
Fwiw, I tried like heck to get his 23 1st but couldn't, aside from that pick the 2.10 this yr and 3rd next yr were the highest he had. He just bought the team, his other qb is Goff, but I think he improved overall at rb and wr. Calcs I looked at had him winning it pretty easy, but wanted to move on from Murray and get some flexibility with the short roster. I thought Id get flamed here for it, but maybe not. TX
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Not by me. Hurts >>> Murray
It wasn’t a bargain, but you were gonna have to get out of Chubb & Cooper soon anyway, and you should get some value out of those picks. Might even work them into future deals.
Jonesin For Some Football
Footballguy
I don't mind this trade too much. Would have liked to see you get back a better pick as most of those are dart throws. Have you only got like 2.02 back or a future 1st I think this would have been a really solid move as Hurts is a much better asset than Kyler especially as Murray will miss a decent part of next season.
Single QB I prefer what you gave up, seems a high price to pay to upgrade to Hurts IMO. However, you do have depth to spare and sometimes you have to overpay for those upgrades.
NE_REVIVAL
Footballguy
FFPC std, same lg and teams as above
Gave 3.3 got Waller
Never been a Waller guy, but seems cheap to me
Gave 3.3 got Waller
Never been a Waller guy, but seems cheap to me
No comments? Did it get lost in the shuffle or is it too bland to have an opinion? hahaha
Wigglytuff's Gruff
Footballguy
Just a niche league format mate. Hard to have an opinion on it when you're unsure on the real time value of the assets and how restrictive the contract amounts actually are.
Jonesin For Some Football
Footballguy
That seems like an easy accept. 3.3 is such a dart throw anyways and Waller could have a good year next year, depending on what they do at QB.
Jonesin For Some Football
Footballguy
I don't play SF in Dynasty (only redraft), I don't play any IDP, and not a real fan of salary cap leagues but have played in the past. With the "NOTES" you added, I would say Team B probably did well as they would have lost CMC anyways and T-Law is going to be gold at that price in SF leagues due to age and position. Could be a win-win but I'd take the T-Law side I think.
Understandable. It is a very complicated league with lots of moving parts. I tried to give as much pertinent info to clarify some of the complexities of the league so it has some reference to "normal" leagues.
The cap is $250 for 15 players so CMC is about 25% of the cap at that price. The average of the top 5 RB salaries is $45 (about 20% of the cap) while the average of the top 5 QB salaries is $76 (30%). So that gives some idea of the bargain of TL at $10 for another year before he is subject to escalation. That is really the crux of the deal.
jm192
Footballguy
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I'm not sure that would be "easy" anymore - but it's possible.
He'll be 31 to start the season coming off two injury plagued years and right now Stidham is the starting QB for the Raiders.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I missed this.
So am I understanding this correctly that team TLaw only gets him through 2023?
I love the value of the IDP-ers, but CMC is only going to get another couple of years (maybe less - he has a lot of wear on those tires, and a nasty history of breaking down) though both Chubb & Karlaftis are nice gets - and the latter is super young.
Seems like a fair deal for SF, as I have TLaw as a top 10 (or better) QB asset moving forward, and for his age and situation, he's a top 4 dynasty SF QB - again, my opinion. Ton of value to give up for him though.
Feels like a premium price for TLaw, and the team that sold him is getting a pretty nice haul in return. My judgement of this trade is reserved for knowing specifically how the contracts work, and what the roster composition of each team is.
Knee-jerk reaction, gimme the CMC/Chubb/Karlaftis side, but it's close. And if I needed a QB and was otherwise stacked at RB/LB/DE, I make that deal for TLaw easily.
Playing in a performance scoring IDP myself, I know how expensive LB who get TFL/Sacks, and DE who get sacks + tackles can be. I just dealt Pittman for Kwity Paye, Mooney (pre-injury), a 5th & a 6th, and felt like I was stealing. The other team had 4 good DE though, with Paye being a bit nicked up last year. DE who also get tackles are somewhat rare, and can put up monster games in that format. I believe he had a 37 point game, and a few 25+ games. Karlaftis is one of those dudes, and at 21 he has room to grow. 33 tackles and 6 sacks makes him a pretty solid performance scoring asset and I expect him to be better. Chubb is obviously a monster in this format. 26 isn't old, but he's no spring chicken.
So the way contracts work is that you are allowed to sign a player to a contract up to 3 years if you draft them or acquire them in the Restricted Free Agent (RFA) Auction. TLaw having a $10/2023 means he is under contract through 2023 and is subject to escalation after that. The escalation is based on actual performance as every player not under contract that finishes in the top 15 of their position will escalate based on their finish. The top 5 escalate a percentage of their salary (35/30/20/10/10%) or to the average of the top 5 salaries of that position (QB is currently $76 and RB is currently $45). So for TLaw if he finishes in the top 5 of QB's in 2023 his salary would jump to $76 for the team to keep him. If he were to finish as QB6 (outside the top 5 QB's) then his escalation would be $10 so he would be $20 to keep for 2024.
I am assuming team A will leave CMC off his 15 freezes at $62 and allow him to go into the RFA auction where that team will have matching rights. This means if CMC is auctioned off and won with a big of $54 then Team A would have the option of keeping their RFA at that price. If he does that it also costs him an RFA pick (a pick in the first 5 rounds of the draft beginning in round 5 and working towards round 1).
Another wrinkle is that there are franchise tag's available (one per team). Team B currently has a franchise tag assigned through the 2024 season. Upon the completion of the 2024 season if that team still has TLaw he can assign the franchise tag to TLaw and give him up to a 3 yr contract at his current salary. So if T-Law finishes QB6 in 2023 and QB6 in 2024 his salary will go up $10 each year (the escalation for the QB6). So his salary going into 2025 would be $30. Team B could get then give him a 3 yr contract at $30 and then he would lock that salary in through 2027.
i know it's a lot but I figured @Hot Sauce Guy would like the detail.
If someone is paying that for a 33 year old TE coming off a late season multi-ligament knee tear you don't need to do lot convincing to me the pick will be high. I have Ertz in two FFPC TE premium leagues and at this point my plan is to cut him if I can't get anything for him and we have to trim rosters.
Bijan and Thomas by a considerably large amount.
Boston
Footballguy
100% Hurts...not even remotely close when you throw in the 1.10 and Otton is very intriguing in Dynasty.
200% Hurts on the second one...absolute steal for one of fantasy's biggest difference-makers.
Wigglytuff's Gruff
Footballguy
What an odd series of trades.
Essentially traded the 1.04 and a 24 1st for 1.06, 1.10 and some change.
Possibly could have got something close to the 1.10 for a 24 1st straight up and not moved back 2 spots to do so?
I'd be feeling pretty good if I was team A to be honest, assuming they still have a competent QB.
Essentially traded the 1.04 and a 24 1st for 1.06, 1.10 and some change.
Possibly could have got something close to the 1.10 for a 24 1st straight up and not moved back 2 spots to do so?
I'd be feeling pretty good if I was team A to be honest, assuming they still have a competent QB.
rockaction
Footballguy
Agreed. Whoever wound up with Hurts "won" the trade, I guess. It would seem if Team B stood pat after the first deal, they'd have come out ahead. But...they didn't.
Wigglytuff's Gruff
Footballguy
It's a 1 QB league.
