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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (6 Viewers)

Dybala is an exceptional talent,  who was the centerpiece at Palermo, along with Franco Vazquez(you gits should look him up, I think he's one of the most underrated players in Europe).  When Juve started off slow, there was intense pressure on Allegri to rush him into lineup, but he resisted. Now reaping the benefits. Speaking of Palermo, their owner Zamperini is certifiable, even for an Italian....they've had 6 coaching changes already this year.

 
Deuce looked great last night,  and more active than I can remember him for a loooong time. Also looked like he really missed Martens, who left a huge hole in that team, imo.

But yeah,  this preseason CCL is stoopit.

 
Just a theory:  I wonder if a bigger issue in CCL timing isn't so much the preseason knockout rounds, but the fact that by the time the knockout rounds occur, MLS teams are two seasons removed from the team that initially qualified.

Two seasons in a capped league with as much parity and turnover as MLS has, by now the teams are almost incomparable to who got them in.  For example nobody is picking DC and RSL as top MLS teams this season.

To be fair, Liga MX uses playoffs to determine champions and CCL too so there's some parity involved there as well, but they're still only one season removed from qualifying. (ETA- I refuse to consider MX's split seasons as separate.  Apertura/Clausera= one season for this purpose)

 
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:oldunsure:   Hopefully he knows that the Mexico bashing is good-natured rivalry fun?

Also, watching last night reminded me of what bugs me about MLS.  It isn't just the mediocre play -- it's the lack of team character.  Outside the Galaxy (MLS-approved home for aging superstars), Toronto (MLS-approved home for current US Nat team stars), and the Pac Northwest teams I feel like almost every team I see is interchangeable with all the others.  11 guys trying really hard, but basically faceless milquetoast worker drones.  It's boring.

Speaking of b-o-r... has Bornstein always had a sledgehammer for a left foot?  He was arguably Q's best player last night IMO and had 3 or 4 absolute belts on goal.

 
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wdcrob said:
:oldunsure:   Hopefully he knows that the Mexico bashing is good-natured rivalry fun?

Also, watching last night reminded me of what bugs me about MLS.  It isn't just the mediocre play -- it's the lack of team character.  Outside the Galaxy (MLS-approved home for aging superstars), Toronto (MLS-approved home for current US Nat team stars), and the Pac Northwest teams I feel like almost every team I see is interchangeable with all the others.  11 guys trying really hard, but basically faceless milquetoast worker drones.  It's boring.

Speaking of b-o-r... has Bornstein always had a sledgehammer for a left foot?  He was arguably Q's best player last night IMO and had 3 or 4 absolute belts on goal.
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screw that guy :rant:

Random story, Bornstein and my sister dated through out high school and up until he became a dad was still constantly texting her and trying to get her to move down to Mex. Her dumb ### could care less about what her brother wants and never did, girls are stupid.

 
wdcrob said:
:oldunsure:   Hopefully he knows that the Mexico bashing is good-natured rivalry fun?

Also, watching last night reminded me of what bugs me about MLS.  It isn't just the mediocre play -- it's the lack of team character.  Outside the Galaxy (MLS-approved home for aging superstars), Toronto (MLS-approved home for current US Nat team stars), and the Pac Northwest teams I feel like almost every team I see is interchangeable with all the others.  11 guys trying really hard, but basically faceless milquetoast worker drones.  It's boring.
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How is that different than just about any other league?  I couldn't tell you the roster of Los Palmas or Espanyol or Parma or Darmstadt if my life depended on it.  And I watch A LOT of soccer.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
How is that different than just about any other league?  I couldn't tell you the roster of Los Palmas or Espanyol or Parma or Darmstadt if my life depended on it.  And I watch A LOT of soccer.
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It may be a good point.

I feel like MLS is a league full of Stoke Citys and Norwich.  There are too many teams with no Payets, Mehrez, Puncheons -- I mean player who stand out.  I don't mean that same talent level as those guys I named, just relative to the others on the field.  It's seems there's more of a sameness to them -- relatively low skill, high work rate, with no one who makes you sit up and think "now there's a guy who's capable of getting something done".

Unfair?

 
wdcrob said:
It may be a good point.

I feel like MLS is a league full of Stoke Citys and Norwich.  There are too many teams with no Payets, Mehrez, Puncheons -- I mean player who stand out.  I don't mean that same talent level as those guys I named, just relative to the others on the field.  It's seems there's more of a sameness to them -- relatively low skill, high work rate, with no one who makes you sit up and think "now there's a guy who's capable of getting something done".

Unfair?
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I think so.  Let's be honest, Mahrez and Payet are huge anomalies in the Premiere League.  It's rare to have a super creative player outside the top 4 or 6 teams.  Most years, a West Ham or Leicester is like a Norwich (if anything Stoke this year is overstacked in favor of creative players with Shaqiri, Bojan, Affelay, and Arnautovic).  West Ham has usually been associated with a Mark Noble (or a Kevin Noble).

But I think there are exciting, creative players in MLS outside of Giovinco and Keane.  Fabian Castillo comes immediately to mind.  I think Columbus plays very attractive soccer as a team, as do the Red Bulls (who have lost some individual flair in losing Henry but now play a less static, more pleasing game in general).  If you value pure passing, Maidano is an excellent player to watch even if Philly surrounded him with junk.  He might really blossom with Houston.  There are also definitely teams like DCU, who stifle creativity and hope to over perform by being disciplined.  I'm hoping Acosta will change that a bit this year, because I really haven't enjoyed watching DCU in the past few years no matter whether they won or lost.

 
wdcrob said:
It may be a good point.

I feel like MLS is a league full of Stoke Citys and Norwich.  There are too many teams with no Payets, Mehrez, Puncheons -- I mean player who stand out.  I don't mean that same talent level as those guys I named, just relative to the others on the field.  It's seems there's more of a sameness to them -- relatively low skill, high work rate, with no one who makes you sit up and think "now there's a guy who's capable of getting something done".

Unfair?
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@wdcrobI think your comment might be simultaneously correct and probably also a bit unfair if that makes any sense?

I am unsure what people expect out of MLS at this point in its development.

As a fan I am happy the league appears to be growing as a steady pace while not being too foolish with the check books (at least not China level foolish).

The league is laying down significant infrastructure in stadiums, training facilities and academies.  SIGNIFICANT millions of dollars are being spent on the long game.

If someone wants MLS to be a top 5-8ish type league there are two distinct paths

a) remove the international player limit.  This will significantly lower the opportunities for Americans

b) over spend what your revenues say you can afford.

I personally don't like either of those choices.

So in summary, you are correct, MLS is not full of skilled players who stand out.  But I also think it is a touch unfair to actually expect that from a league that is showing it is growing at a slow and steady pace.

 
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I only saw the highlights of Juve-Bayern. Mandzukic looked on his game. Part of both goals and did some other nice work. Very inconsistent player. Seems to have that Adebayor/Andy Carroll unplayable when he's clicking thing going on. 

 
wdcrob said:
Maybe my problem is that every game I watched included DCU.
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no I don't think that is your problem, in fact you don't really have a problem. :)

DCU is probably a good representative of 70% of the teams in the league so if you are basing your observations on them and their opponents, that seems perfectly valid to me.

 
I love that I can sit 3 rows up center pitch to an Earthquakes game for $40.00 and see a guy like Giovinco come to town. I don't want to spend $150 to sit in a nose bleed seat over at Levi stadium to watch the crap they put on over there. In the bay area we have the A's and the Earthquakes as the only affordable game in town, the other teams have ridiculous ticket prices.

 
CGRdrJoe said:
I love that I can sit 3 rows up center pitch to an Earthquakes game for $40.00 and see a guy like Giovinco come to town. I don't want to spend $150 to sit in a nose bleed seat over at Levi stadium to watch the crap they put on over there. In the bay area we have the A's and the Earthquakes as the only affordable game in town, the other teams have ridiculous ticket prices.
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This is MLS's niche right now.

It is a very fun product to attend live.  The crowds are great, the players are honest and hard working and easy to cheer for and the prices really can't be beat, and most of the stadiums outside of a remaining few are nice to see a game in.

It is a much harder sell for people who don't care about live soccer though and just want to turn on the TV and watch the best (EPL, La Liga, Bundesliga) or watch a league from their countries origin (Liga MX).

MLS will likely never be able to clear that perception hurdle in the next two decades if not longer.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
That would do it.  No team created fewer chances last year.  The only team that was close was Montreal before they got Drogba.  DCU are a very hard team for the casual fan to love. 
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They are not that much different than many teams imo.

I think people in Chicago, Colorado, Philly and other cities would flop talent with DC if given the choice.

 
NewlyRetired said:
They are not that much different than many teams imo.

I think people in Chicago, Colorado, Philly and other cities would flop talent with DC if given the choice.
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I think they'd swap results.  Maybe they'd swap talent (with no other changes in coaching, etc.) on the premise that just having Hamid would get them more wins.  Hard to know.  DCU was a better team than the FIRE! but I think its hard to say that they were as exciting or entertaining.  Every time I'd watch Chicago I'd see a team that could generate chances but that had atrocious team defense.  Kind of a less talented Toronto.

 
As someone who does not like governments paying for stadiums, I think this latest deal Minnesota has come up with seems like it could be a win win for both the team and the city. Here are the highlights.  

  • Under the proposal, the stadium itself would be built by team owners and given to the city.
  • The Met Council would commit up to $4.5 million to clean the site of any pollution -- and would receive annual rent payments worth a total of $29 million over the course of 50+ years.
  • That money would be paid by the city using proceeds from the team and stadium events.
  • Team owners would like construction to begin around June 1, but some councilors are concerned they don't have enough information to vote on the proposal responsibly.
 
Well this is just nuts IMO.  

I know Gerrard comes off the books at the end of this season for LA but damn, there had better be some fine print in here that is not being published because that is a foolish pay raise for just playing in 23 games.

=========================================

The LA Galaxy got a sweetheart deal on Nigel de Jong this year and is only paying him $500,000 in 2016. But I’m told that De Jong has a big incentive to perform well. According to his contract with the Galaxy, if De Jong plays in 23 games this season he’ll earn a guaranteed Designated Player contract of around $3 million a year for 2017 and ’18.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
I think so.  Let's be honest, Mahrez and Payet are huge anomalies in the Premiere League.  It's rare to have a super creative player outside the top 4 or 6 teams.  Most years, a West Ham or Leicester is like a Norwich (if anything Stoke this year is overstacked in favor of creative players with Shaqiri, Bojan, Affelay, and Arnautovic).  West Ham has usually been associated with a Mark Noble (or a Kevin Noble).

But I think there are exciting, creative players in MLS outside of Giovinco and Keane.  Fabian Castillo comes immediately to mind.  I think Columbus plays very attractive soccer as a team, as do the Red Bulls (who have lost some individual flair in losing Henry but now play a less static, more pleasing game in general).  If you value pure passing, Maidano is an excellent player to watch even if Philly surrounded him with junk.  He might really blossom with Houston.  There are also definitely teams like DCU, who stifle creativity and hope to over perform by being disciplined.  I'm hoping Acosta will change that a bit this year, because I really haven't enjoyed watching DCU in the past few years no matter whether they won or lost.
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:goodposting:

first- it's preseason, so let's not make any sweeping comments about style of play just yet... but I hear you.  IMO, MLS teams' style revolves around the key individuals on the team. LA had some great flair attacking with LDon and Keane- same is true of Dempsey+ Obafemi. Still trying to figure out Bradley, Jozy and Giovinco. Kaka is informing the attacking shape of Orlando, etc etc.

as RHE said, there are a ocuple of teams with less individual talent that do their best to knock the ball around like RBNY and COL (RSL used to be that way too), and have some nice moments- but nothing consistently enough to get all jazzed about, brand-wise.

 
221px-Manchester_City.svg.png


 
I do have to say almost every MLS initial rendering looks better than what they actually build but if they do pull off that Minnesota deal and build that stadium, that would be very cool.

That might be a good stadium for the US to play in some day as well depending on the demographics of the area.

 
Atleti not doing so great these days putting balls in the back of the net.  They'll need to do better if they want to make some hay.  I have to think they'll be trying to bring in a proven striker this summer before the window closes for winter 2016/17 and summer 2017.

 
The Z Machine said:
Atleti not doing so great these days putting balls in the back of the net.  They'll need to do better if they want to make some hay.  I have to think they'll be trying to bring in a proven striker this summer before the window closes for winter 2016/17 and summer 2017.
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Watched this one.  PSV was just letting Felipe Luis have the ball for his bad crosses all day.  Needed to play through the middle more.  OliverTorres looks good on the ball

 
Ted Lange as your Bartender said:
Rimando bails out RSL with a PK save right before halftime

0-0 with Tigres at the half
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This appears to shaping up very similar to the DC game.

RSL appears to be playing them relatively evenly, especially considering they are the away team but it would not shock me if Tigres breaks them down late for a couple like what happened to DC last night.

 
Barca has told Neymar they only want him to play in either the Copa or the Olympics.

With the Olympics in Brazil, I could see him maybe choosing that which would be a big loss to the Copa.

 
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