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***OFFICIAL*** Washington Commanders Thread (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter dgreen
- Start date
MattFancy
Footballguy
I'm sure Grant is telling him how great he played and that it's all the WRs faultCousins on 106.7 The Fan right now totally defending the fade.
Grant and Danny were singing his praises BIG time. They were also complaining that we weren't throwing it more on first down. Seriously.
MattFancy
Footballguy
How anyone listens to them is beyond me. Grant will never say a bad thing about Cousins. It's always everyone else's fault if he doesn't play well. So pathetic that this passes for sports talk here. (Not that 980 is any better)
Sadly, I think Grant and Danny are better than most of the folks on sports radio in DC. But when it comes to Cousins, they just lose all objectivity. Cousins was loyal to them so they are loyal to him, you know? I won't even turn the channel to 980, Basically, I've just stopped listening to Sports Radio around here for the most part. I'd rather just BS with you guys on here...
Sebowski
Footballguy
nittanylion
Footballguy
Ryan Kerrigan is always a hero.
Samaje Perine will be my hero if, in "Fat Rob"'s absence, he takes the starting RB gig and never looks back. The only thing I crave more than dominance in the trenches, is a more dynamic starting RB, and not a miscast role-player. How I wish, wish, wish Thompson was more durable.
Critical win my any measure. Mandatory win, in the sense that the Rams are still firmly in the 25-32 range of NFL Teams. Simply not acceptable to come out of that game with an L. Not a pretty win, not at all. Even when they were running the ball, and running it well, it didn't feel like there was any 'flow' to the offense. Had to have this one to have even one remaining shred of optimism about 2017. Especially since we're headed into what's analagous to a 'perfect storm' scenario for the current iteration of the Redskins: 1) an upper-tier opponent, 2) home game, 3) night-time, prime-time...sure would like to get that monkey off our collective backs.
If we were a better team, playing better football, this schedule actually plays in our favor: quality Teams prefer prime-time home games vs superior opponents (SNF, Raiders), getting an extra day to prepare and playing in prime-time is about the best scenario you could ask having to travel (MNF, @ Chiefs), then a week off, followed by a home game v the hapless 49'ers (1pm west coast team traveling east), followed by a prime-time MNF rematch @ (one of the shortest road trips in football) the team you embarrassed yourselves dropping the home opener to.
A better team, playing better football, would be looking at a plausible 5-1 storyline, going into a late start Sunday home tilt vs the hated Cowboys. It couldn't be set up any better...
...for a better team, playing better football...
Samaje Perine will be my hero if, in "Fat Rob"'s absence, he takes the starting RB gig and never looks back. The only thing I crave more than dominance in the trenches, is a more dynamic starting RB, and not a miscast role-player. How I wish, wish, wish Thompson was more durable.
Critical win my any measure. Mandatory win, in the sense that the Rams are still firmly in the 25-32 range of NFL Teams. Simply not acceptable to come out of that game with an L. Not a pretty win, not at all. Even when they were running the ball, and running it well, it didn't feel like there was any 'flow' to the offense. Had to have this one to have even one remaining shred of optimism about 2017. Especially since we're headed into what's analagous to a 'perfect storm' scenario for the current iteration of the Redskins: 1) an upper-tier opponent, 2) home game, 3) night-time, prime-time...sure would like to get that monkey off our collective backs.
If we were a better team, playing better football, this schedule actually plays in our favor: quality Teams prefer prime-time home games vs superior opponents (SNF, Raiders), getting an extra day to prepare and playing in prime-time is about the best scenario you could ask having to travel (MNF, @ Chiefs), then a week off, followed by a home game v the hapless 49'ers (1pm west coast team traveling east), followed by a prime-time MNF rematch @ (one of the shortest road trips in football) the team you embarrassed yourselves dropping the home opener to.
A better team, playing better football, would be looking at a plausible 5-1 storyline, going into a late start Sunday home tilt vs the hated Cowboys. It couldn't be set up any better...
...for a better team, playing better football...
fatness
Footballguy
Sebowski
Footballguy
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc-sports-bog/wp/2017/09/18/kirk-cousins-was-scared-to-death-hed-tip-off-receivers-routes-to-sean-mcvay/?utm_term=.d418a27e4de5
Grant Paulsen asked Cousins about his conversation with Redskins Coach Jay Gruden on the sidelines after his incompletion on a fade to Josh Docston — and an incompletion to Chris Thompson on the next play — forced the Redskins to settle for a field goal in the second quarter.
“The coaching point there is, if you take a three-step drop, you buy a little bit of time, allow Josh to close the cushion on the defensive back, and then now really make it a true jump ball where Josh is already in the end zone waiting for the ball before it’s even left my hand,” Cousins said. “What I did was I really took a one-step drop, and while Josh was still closing the cushion on the [defensive back], the ball was already up in the air. He would have to be running to it as opposed to waiting for it and jumping up for it. So Jay’s point was really, the play was there, we got a great matchup, we really have a mismatch there for a fade, and we’ve got to give him an opportunity. When you throw the ball the way you did, you kind of doom the play from the start. Josh doesn’t even have an opportunity to go show what he can do. The coaching point there was set your feet, take three steps, buy some time and put it up. That’s where we’ve got to go back and talk about how we want to throw fades, and the details there, because each guy we throw a fade to wants it a little differently, and each DB technique that we go against changes it, and then what yard line we’re on changes it. That’s where we’ve got to establish some rules down there to be able to play with.”
---
How about, just don't throw the fade, guys.
Grant Paulsen asked Cousins about his conversation with Redskins Coach Jay Gruden on the sidelines after his incompletion on a fade to Josh Docston — and an incompletion to Chris Thompson on the next play — forced the Redskins to settle for a field goal in the second quarter.
“The coaching point there is, if you take a three-step drop, you buy a little bit of time, allow Josh to close the cushion on the defensive back, and then now really make it a true jump ball where Josh is already in the end zone waiting for the ball before it’s even left my hand,” Cousins said. “What I did was I really took a one-step drop, and while Josh was still closing the cushion on the [defensive back], the ball was already up in the air. He would have to be running to it as opposed to waiting for it and jumping up for it. So Jay’s point was really, the play was there, we got a great matchup, we really have a mismatch there for a fade, and we’ve got to give him an opportunity. When you throw the ball the way you did, you kind of doom the play from the start. Josh doesn’t even have an opportunity to go show what he can do. The coaching point there was set your feet, take three steps, buy some time and put it up. That’s where we’ve got to go back and talk about how we want to throw fades, and the details there, because each guy we throw a fade to wants it a little differently, and each DB technique that we go against changes it, and then what yard line we’re on changes it. That’s where we’ve got to establish some rules down there to be able to play with.”
---
How about, just don't throw the fade, guys.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I finally got around to watching this a couple days ago. I highly recommend it, especially if you were a fan back then. Was fun to relive it and learn more- I was 14 at the time so I didn't follow closely enough back then to pick up on the details. For example I didn't know Gibbs told the players that they couldn't break the picket line on their own; they had to either end the strike as a team or stay on strike as a team. It was also nice to remember a time when the Skins were one the NFL's "good guys." at least more so than they are now, and had a way of unifying the whole DMV that's probably gone for good.
You've probably heard, but the ultimate message is that the guys from that 3-0 team deserve rings. Seems like a no-brainer PR coup for Snyder, will be interesting to see how he botches it.
Watching Thursday night's surprisingly entertaining game is making me increasingly question the Kirk Cousins "leverage" narrative.
1. If you look at young QBs like Jared Goff and Trevor Siemian, you see what you can theoretically do with a great young QB without breaking the bank on a veteran. Admittedly, not every QB is going to develop like Goff, but just last year, all the news rags were shrieking: "McVay will enter into a bidding war with Kyle Shanahan to sign Kirk Cousins in 2018!!!" This narrative was pushed by media because McVay worked with Cousins and Shanahan worked with Cousins. The simple media logic was this: the teams didn't have QBs, the coaches knew Cousins, the teams have cap space, therefore they will pay Cousins 26+ Million per year. But now you can see how incomplete this narrative is. McVay -- to his good credit -- is simply developing Goff. And right now, Goff is looking better than Cousins. One of the reasons is that Goff has better weapons (right now) -- in Gruley, Woods, Watkins, even Cooper Kupp for gosh sakes.
2. On the other side of the ball, San Francisco clearly still needs a QB. They have a third rounder they haven't tried yet -- Bethard -- and we'll probably see what he has later this year. Hoyer is ok, but clearly just a plug in guy for now. Watching Garcon ball out, you can see how much more developed he is right now vs. Pryor. Maybe Pryor will develop into that player, but I'm talking right now -- and you can see some of the reason for Cousins' drop off -- he's just not the QB to make others look better; he is a QB who looks better BECAUSE of others. But when I think about San Francisco next year -- and if I was GM -- why honestly would I want to sign a 30 year old Cousins to a 26 + Million / year contract when my team is a few years away and when Cousins is not showing himself to be a guy to elevate those around him? 49ers are 0-3 now and probably headed for a top 3 pick in the next draft. Wouldn't Shanahan be better off a.) trying Bethard half way through the year to see what he has and b.) drafting QB so he can grow with the young team. The media is kind of obsessed with "Kyle knows Kirk" but logically why would Shanahan even go this way? Yes, there is a chance you draft the next Ryan Leaf as opposed to the next Carson Wentz, BUT with Kirk you KNOW what you have and that's the next Trent Dilfer. Is this the way Kyle thinks? I dunno...
I've been going along the assumption that Redskins screwed up this QB situation and that Cousins has all this tremendous leverage...I'm starting to wonder a bit now...
1. If you look at young QBs like Jared Goff and Trevor Siemian, you see what you can theoretically do with a great young QB without breaking the bank on a veteran. Admittedly, not every QB is going to develop like Goff, but just last year, all the news rags were shrieking: "McVay will enter into a bidding war with Kyle Shanahan to sign Kirk Cousins in 2018!!!" This narrative was pushed by media because McVay worked with Cousins and Shanahan worked with Cousins. The simple media logic was this: the teams didn't have QBs, the coaches knew Cousins, the teams have cap space, therefore they will pay Cousins 26+ Million per year. But now you can see how incomplete this narrative is. McVay -- to his good credit -- is simply developing Goff. And right now, Goff is looking better than Cousins. One of the reasons is that Goff has better weapons (right now) -- in Gruley, Woods, Watkins, even Cooper Kupp for gosh sakes.
2. On the other side of the ball, San Francisco clearly still needs a QB. They have a third rounder they haven't tried yet -- Bethard -- and we'll probably see what he has later this year. Hoyer is ok, but clearly just a plug in guy for now. Watching Garcon ball out, you can see how much more developed he is right now vs. Pryor. Maybe Pryor will develop into that player, but I'm talking right now -- and you can see some of the reason for Cousins' drop off -- he's just not the QB to make others look better; he is a QB who looks better BECAUSE of others. But when I think about San Francisco next year -- and if I was GM -- why honestly would I want to sign a 30 year old Cousins to a 26 + Million / year contract when my team is a few years away and when Cousins is not showing himself to be a guy to elevate those around him? 49ers are 0-3 now and probably headed for a top 3 pick in the next draft. Wouldn't Shanahan be better off a.) trying Bethard half way through the year to see what he has and b.) drafting QB so he can grow with the young team. The media is kind of obsessed with "Kyle knows Kirk" but logically why would Shanahan even go this way? Yes, there is a chance you draft the next Ryan Leaf as opposed to the next Carson Wentz, BUT with Kirk you KNOW what you have and that's the next Trent Dilfer. Is this the way Kyle thinks? I dunno...
I've been going along the assumption that Redskins screwed up this QB situation and that Cousins has all this tremendous leverage...I'm starting to wonder a bit now...
fatness
Footballguy
I didn't quote the rest of your post but I agree with most of it. I believe the "Cousins has all this leverage" line of thought was started purely by his agent, and that agent has been hugely successful in getting DC area fans (and lots of fans nationally) to buy into it and accept it as true. But I don't believe it has ever been true. The only QB's with "leverage" are ones that can carry a team, and that is something Cousins has never been and, IMO, will never be.
There was talk before free agency that Jackson and Garcon somehow were threats to Cousins's leadership role with the team. Sheehan and Cooley among others pushed that narrative. Now here the team is without two 1000-yard WR's, with Cousins's leadership role more secure, with Ryan Grant and Terrelle Pryor on the field, and with an offense that, through 2 games, has taken a large step backwards from last year. Now the talk is that Cousins has taken a step back due to losing two 1000-yard WR's. It's become a neverending saga of what Cousins needs to be a leader and to make the offense productive. He is just a guy, and average-to-good QB who needs plenty of help around him on the field and coaching staff.
It's reasonable to hope that, as Cousins warms up into the season (his usual pattern) and as Pryor learns the offense better that the offense will improve. But I think the prolific yardage totals from last year are gone, because Garcon and Jackson are gone and Reed keeps breaking down. Without a significant improvement in red zone scoring, the offense looks like it'll be scoring less than last year. Fades and FG's are going to happen way too often. We don't have prolific WR's who open things up for other players, our star TE is fading, and we have a coach and QB who lose confidence near the goal line. They play scared in the red zone. We don't have a QB to get us beyond that. I don't see the leverage; I never did.
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
dgreen
Footballguy
Yeah, but are you felling the typical total blowout from the beginning or the typical late game failure to break our hearts?
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
Even after oakland comes back and beats us.... seeing Doctson make that catch makes it all worth it!
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
oh dustin.
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
who else thought that was gonna be a fade?
dgreen
Footballguy
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
right on time!
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
D looks good. Perine didnt look great. Thompson is a beast and we need to get him the ball more. Good win, but this week was very strange(lots of upsets). Here's to hoping we look respectable next week. Chiefs look really good.
dgreen
Footballguy
fatness
Footballguy
Wow, that was a completely dominant football game. I'm officially impressed.
Game balls:
entire defense
offensive line
Gruden's playcalling
Chris Thompson
There's a lot of other players to credit, like Spencer Long, Preston Smith, Cousins, Nicholson, etc., but Thompson is the most improved player on the team and can turn any play into a first down or highlight. Man the defense was good.
Game balls:
entire defense
offensive line
Gruden's playcalling
Chris Thompson
There's a lot of other players to credit, like Spencer Long, Preston Smith, Cousins, Nicholson, etc., but Thompson is the most improved player on the team and can turn any play into a first down or highlight. Man the defense was good.
dgreen
Footballguy
Wow.
What a defensive performance tonight. When Swearenger jacked up Lynch I was ready to put on a helmet, though clearly I was too drunk to do so.
Chris Thompson... offensive MVP
Jay Gruden...props coach for sticking with the run and the play action game. Keep that up coach...well done.
Cousins...best game this year...but this is a result of gruden sticking with the run and making game manageable for him.
Doctsons catch...omg. AmaZed he didn't get injured though lol
Perrine...uh we need Kelly back and in meantime I wonder if Mack brown will be elevated to second string.
Defense was nasty tonight. I like manuski a attacking style.
ill totally take 2-1 at this point. Eliminate those mistakes and team has potential
What a defensive performance tonight. When Swearenger jacked up Lynch I was ready to put on a helmet, though clearly I was too drunk to do so.
Chris Thompson... offensive MVP
Jay Gruden...props coach for sticking with the run and the play action game. Keep that up coach...well done.
Cousins...best game this year...but this is a result of gruden sticking with the run and making game manageable for him.
Doctsons catch...omg. AmaZed he didn't get injured though lol
Perrine...uh we need Kelly back and in meantime I wonder if Mack brown will be elevated to second string.
Defense was nasty tonight. I like manuski a attacking style.
ill totally take 2-1 at this point. Eliminate those mistakes and team has potential
fatness
Footballguy
Without McVay, Garcon, and Jackson, I think Gruden has figured out quickly that he needs a different game plan to win. The last 2 games he has called plays that suited what his players on the field could do best, and the team has 2 wins to show for it. I think that's what he'll keep doing.
And I know it's hard to tell anything from facial expressions and body language, but he looks angrier, more aggressive, and more decisive on the sidelines. I think he's starting to like running the ball and having a defense.
