Patriots being investigated after Colts game (4 Viewers)

[ROCKET]

Peter King said on M & M that the NFL won't likely rule on this til after the SB. I'll revisit this when there is any actual credible information regarding evidence coming out from the NFL. If all they have is 11 balls short 2 psi and no smoking gun or evidence as to how they got that way then there are going to be a lot of disappointed Pats haters. Until they release details and evidence there is no point on speculation. I'm going to decompress from this until something factual leaks out, until then it's all hot air from blow hards.

 

[MattFancy]

Peter King said on M & M that the NFL won't likely rule on this til after the SB. I'll revisit this when there is any actual credible information regarding evidence coming out from the NFL. If all they have is 11 balls short 2 psi and no smoking gun or evidence as to how they got that way then there are going to be a lot of disappointed Pats haters. Until they release details and evidence there is no point on speculation. I'm going to decompress from this until something factual leaks out, until then it's all hot air from blow hards.

You just took the air out of this thread

 

[12punch]

Trolls Be trollin'

They Suspend Bb Next Year And You Might Want To Play Some overs

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

Seems really odd that the NFL would let this linger past the SB per Peter King. I get what King is saying about not wanting something to come out after the fact that would force them to revisit the situation like in the Rice case but I have as hard time thinking they don't address it today or tomorrow.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

I'm not sure I'd go that far, Koya. The 'constant refrain over the years' stems from Spygate, it's not like there have been a litany of infractions against the team since then. This would be incident #2, unless I've had my head under a rock and missed something else.

Wasn't there a kerfuffle about them manipulating the Coach to quarterback communications channels back in the day. Something about the stadium system conveniently going out when the opposing offense had the ball and it happening frequently enough that the refs started cutting all communication for both teams, or am I misremembering.

 

[KarmaPolice]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

Don't you think he'll get deported too? I suspect what you think matters less and less to people.

Amazes me how Patriots fans think their team cheating is like no big deal

Simple people are amazed by all sorts of things (look, a rainbow!)

If you think stealing signals (legal) with a camcorder on the sidelines (not legal), or slightly under-inflated footballs makes a massive difference in the outcome of games (claims even their 'cheated upon' opponents adamantly refuse to make), you are, what I like to call, wrong.

It's sure that your beloved Pats are in the habit of doing illegal things because they don't get any benefit out of it. Cheating just because it's fun!

Just remember that your HC came to your team in a haze of NCAA allegations and many believe their SB win was fueled by Adderall.

 

[rjv]

Why are the patriots always involved in controversies like this? Seems a little fishy to me.

Because people are consistently jealous of their success and grasp at any little detail to try and discredit them. It pretty much boils down to "They hate us cause they ain't us"

This

It's an absolute joke that:

1. People think the Pats needed to deflate balls to beat a team they already beat by 22 points earlier this year.

2. That the ref's are so stupid, they couldn't tell the difference between the balls all game long.

Bottom line is it didn't happen, nothing will come of this because, as stated, jealous people need to make excuses.

I understand the silliness of the situation and joelousy of the matter BUT a rule is a rule. Bottom line the Pats broke a rule once again and I think the penalty is going to be severe. Possible BB being suspended all of next year possibly. It's Goodell's job to keep the integrity of the shield here and this hurts the NFL brand. The other owners are probably blowing up Goodells phone as we speak about this, and after the Rice situation and how Goodell screwed that up and almost lost his job, I believe the league will it just over look this and have the pats pay severely.

Payton from the Saints claimed he had no clue about the bounty scandal and he was gone for a season, no way BB didn't know about this.

So sure, say it's a " us against the world" mentality but rules are in place so teams can be on a even playing field and he Pats once again Broke a rule.

I'm bumping what I stated the other day. Guys, THEY CHEATED!!! Stop with the debate about PSI measurements, everyone hates the Pats, etc.... They cheated end of debate. If some of you think it's silly because the ball pressure is insignificant then why did they deflate the balls? Because they wanted a unfair edge to win. The Pats would of won this game nonetheless but why cheat? It's sickening how BB thumbs his nose to the NFL and now it's going to bite him in the ###. BB is a repeat offender, and there is no way he didn't know about this. The guy is arrogant and knowing what we know at this point Brady knew it to. Those 2 are attached at the hip, and if anyone thinks he didn't know, your kidding yourself. Nothing happens in that stadium without BB knowing about it. Now it's being reported that the Ravens tipped off the Colts about NE playing around with the air pressure in the footballs.

They should be punished just on stupidity alone. The intent was to cheat bottom line, and that's why they will be punished.

 

[SeniorVBDStudent]

Are klecko, leinhart and other nfl sources reporting in liars?

 

[Anarchy99]

John Madden has apparently provides his opinion that this is all on Brady, as he does not see where a coach would get into the ins and outs of how a QB wants his footballs prepared. He firmly believes that BB had no idea what was going on.

If so, are there are provisions in the rules about player conduct and trying to get a competitive advantage? Would that be viewed any differently than guys getting caught with PEDs?

 

[Dr. Octopus]

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2015/01/22/win-lose-patriots-have-sacrificed-their-legacy/XIYx6wws1NpEn1h82kMtwO/story.html

Shaughnessy is a hack. People in Boston have been trying to figure out for years who hates the Patriots more, him or Borges.

Yeah everyone knows Fitzy truly represents the people of the New England states.

 

[JohnnyU]

There's cheating and there's cheating. It's not like the Pats are all roided up. They blew Indy out. It's not like they got a slight edge to beat a superior team. I'm not condoning the behaviour, but it's also not like they paid off the refs. They deserve to be consequenced for violating the rules, but the reactions are also way overblown imo. Wouldn't surprise me if some of the haters are holding onto Hernandez for $1 in a dynasty.

what if they were doing the exact same thing the previous week, where they won by 4? A game where a single incompletion could have derailed a scoring drive?

The optics around that would obviously be a lot worse, but it's also not what's on the table currently being debated. Like I said, I'm not condoning it, but they blew Indy out and saying they cheated their way to the Superbowl is hyperbole at its finest.

Why don't u understand that beating Indy by a thousand pts doesnt excuse cheating. It's all about intent. Their arrogance and paranoid belief they need to cheat is the issue, not whether it actually makes a difference in the game.

It doesn't excuse it. It's a "punishment fits the crime" thing. On the one hand, people are calling for them to be banned from the SB or suspended for an entire year, yet on the other, you have demonstrable proof that it didn't give them an edge. Those don't square.

It's not whether the punishment fits the crime, but the fact that a repeat felon got caught again and the punishment should fit the multiple felon. BB is making a mockery out of the NFL, the rules, the refs, etc, and he needs to be put in his place by Goodell.

 

[rjv]

There's cheating and there's cheating. It's not like the Pats are all roided up. They blew Indy out. It's not like they got a slight edge to beat a superior team. I'm not condoning the behaviour, but it's also not like they paid off the refs. They deserve to be consequenced for violating the rules, but the reactions are also way overblown imo. Wouldn't surprise me if some of the haters are holding onto Hernandez for $1 in a dynasty.

what if they were doing the exact same thing the previous week, where they won by 4? A game where a single incompletion could have derailed a scoring drive?

The optics around that would obviously be a lot worse, but it's also not what's on the table currently being debated. Like I said, I'm not condoning it, but they blew Indy out and saying they cheated their way to the Superbowl is hyperbole at its finest.

Why don't u understand that beating Indy by a thousand pts doesnt excuse cheating. It's all about intent. Their arrogance and paranoid belief they need to cheat is the issue, not whether it actually makes a difference in the game.

It doesn't excuse it. It's a "punishment fits the crime" thing. On the one hand, people are calling for them to be banned from the SB or suspended for an entire year, yet on the other, you have demonstrable proof that it didn't give them an edge. Those don't square.

It's not whether the punishment fits the crime, but the fact that a repeat felon got caught again and the punishment should fit the multiple felon. BB is making a mockery out of the NFL, the rules, the refs, etc, and he needs to be put in his place by Goodell.

+1 brother couldn't agree more. THEY CHEATED no matter how you paint the picture.

 

[ChuckLiddell]

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2015/01/22/win-lose-patriots-have-sacrificed-their-legacy/XIYx6wws1NpEn1h82kMtwO/story.html

Shaughnessy is a hack. People in Boston have been trying to figure out for years who hates the Patriots more, him or Borges.

Hack or no hack, what he says here rings true to me...

"The fanboy narrative is that “everybody does it.’’ You’re not trying if you’re not cheating. Folks are just jealous of the Patriots’ success.

Swell. But if you are a Patriots fan, you cannot be satisfied with this explanation. If you walk into your local 7-Eleven and see the back page of the New York Post screaming, “CHEATERS,’’ you cannot make it all go away by claiming jealousy.

Granted, it didn’t matter in Sunday’s game. But what about all the other games? If the Patriots are cheating, are they not cheating systematically?

Like Spygate, it’s not a one-game anecdote.

Did deflating footballs ever give the Patriots an illegal advantage in any of their close games? Did it help them win the division 11 times in 12 years? We know they don’t like to play on the road. In the playoffs. Ever. This great Patriot dynasty has not won a road playoff game in seven years.

Forget about the Colts game. Did a deflated ball make the playing field uneven in any games this year? Did it result in a home-field advantage that they would not have otherwise owned? How does the legion of Patriot toadies defend this?"

 

[JohnnyU]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

 

[David Dodds]

John Madden has apparently provides his opinion that this is all on Brady, as he does not see where a coach would get into the ins and outs of how a QB wants his footballs prepared. He firmly believes that BB had no idea what was going on.

If so, are there are provisions in the rules about player conduct and trying to get a competitive advantage? Would that be viewed any differently than guys getting caught with PEDs?

I think this has to start with the QB wanting the balls a certain way for certain weather conditions. But to think Brady would do anything without the coach knowing seems a bit naive to me. And of course Brady and Belichick would never be the ones to actually carry this out. That will be some lower employee that can take the fall.

 

[JBPH]

Looking ahead, can't help but think the Colts better make sure that everything from the psi of their game balls to the length of the cheerleaders skirts are exactly regulation and by the book when the Pats come to town next year. That could get ugly.

 

[KarmaPolice]

There's cheating and there's cheating. It's not like the Pats are all roided up. They blew Indy out. It's not like they got a slight edge to beat a superior team. I'm not condoning the behaviour, but it's also not like they paid off the refs. They deserve to be consequenced for violating the rules, but the reactions are also way overblown imo. Wouldn't surprise me if some of the haters are holding onto Hernandez for $1 in a dynasty.

what if they were doing the exact same thing the previous week, where they won by 4? A game where a single incompletion could have derailed a scoring drive?

The optics around that would obviously be a lot worse, but it's also not what's on the table currently being debated. Like I said, I'm not condoning it, but they blew Indy out and saying they cheated their way to the Superbowl is hyperbole at its finest.

Why don't u understand that beating Indy by a thousand pts doesnt excuse cheating. It's all about intent. Their arrogance and paranoid belief they need to cheat is the issue, not whether it actually makes a difference in the game.

It doesn't excuse it. It's a "punishment fits the crime" thing. On the one hand, people are calling for them to be banned from the SB or suspended for an entire year, yet on the other, you have demonstrable proof that it didn't give them an edge. Those don't square.

It's not whether the punishment fits the crime, but the fact that a repeat felon got caught again and the punishment should fit the multiple felon. BB is making a mockery out of the NFL, the rules, the refs, etc, and he needs to be put in his place by Goodell.

A mockery out of the NFL? Come on guys.

 

[devouredbychaos]

The 'natural pressure change' argument is easy to explore. The formula is simple:

P1/T1 = P2/T2.

Lets take the very outer temperature limits of plausibility, say it was 75d F when they filled them, and 33dF when they tested (you have to change F to Kelvin to work this formula).

12.5PSI / 297K = X / 274K

Solve for X = 11.5 PSI

So even if the temp dropped farther than we know it dropped, at most you would lose 1 pound per square inch of pressure.

In order to lose 2PSI, the temperature the balls were filled at would have had to have been 127d F.

Apparently not that easy as we are now 1400+ posts in and people are still calculating this wrong. The equation is P1/T1 = P2/T2 rearrange the equation to solve for T2 so we get T2 = P2/P1*T1. All units of measure MUST be measured in absolute . For pressure you need to add the atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) to the pressure inside the ball. The temps need to be in absolute also so either in Kelvin (C + 273) or Rankine (F + 459).

So your example to find a 2 psi drop works out to:

P1 = 12.5 + 14.7 = 27.2

P2 = 10.5 + 14.7 = 25.2

T1 = 75 + 459 = 534

T2 = (25.2/27.2) * 534 = 494 degrees rankine subtract 459 to convert back to F = 35

So the change in temperature is 75 - 35 = 40 degrees for a 2 psi drop in pressure in the ball.

Its not just posters getting this wrong its actual people in the media putting out this foolishness. Felger and Mazz on 98.5 were talking about an 87 degree temperature swing required to get the 2 psi change in the ball.

atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) can change depending on the weather, no? Foxboro went from cold and dry to wet and foggy that day..

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

Xwrong.

it IS cheating.the colts balls were not off by any weight whatsoever...so how is it that just the Patriots balls , ALL 12 of them, were off by 2+ lbs,while the Colts balls were not off one bit?

answer: Bellichick and Brady cheated. where there's smoke there's fire.you backing the wrong people here.the NFL is goingto come down hard on BB,he'll get suspended for the SB, huge fine , loss of draft picks, and suspension for 4+ games next season.it's THAT serious.not a preseason game, not week 1, but the AFC Championship game..now the circus turns to the SB..he won't make the trip to Az..they'll let him get the team prepped till sunday,and annouce it then,that he's suspended.

THEY CHEATED.

what's so hard to understand here?

and if you think Brady didn't know about it,you're nuts.he was in on the gig.check his laugh at that radio show the other day,when asked about it.his obnoxious arrogant laughter tells it all.would love to have a body language expert sit in on that conversation..I'm sure there were telltale signs ..

also,if you think Bobby Kraft wasn't in on the gig, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell ya..

other owners are probably clamoring that the NFL come down hard on this guy, BB, who already was caught cheating,and now is again.

and those of you who don't think he should be suspended, they banned Sean Payton for a full year for Bountygate..and his DC was out for 2 years..thats for putting money on injuries made to opposing players.actually altering the game and its parts - deflating balls - is even WORSE...

the mdeia is going to make this SB a circus, it could affect sponsors, etc..the integrity of the game has been compromised,yet,again,by Bill Bellichick and Tommy Brady.

they're both FRAUDS, and this will only further cement the idea that BB doesn't sniff the HOF and that Brady gets an asterisk..

ladies and gentlemen, meet the new Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire..

Lol. Such a salty troll. So if they cheated like you claim, where's the proof?? Haters gonna hate!

 

[KarmaPolice]

Looking ahead, can't help but think the Colts better make sure that everything from the psi of their game balls to the length of the cheerleaders skirts are exactly regulation and by the book when the Pats come to town next year. That could get ugly.

Better stop pumping in that extra crowd noise too.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

This is still cheating by the way. The clear intent of the rule is ensure that balls are inflated to a consistent pressure and the same for both teams. Deliberately breaking the intent of the rule is cheating by any sane standard. We shouldn't need a specific clause in the rules saying that you can't inflate the balls with helium, for example.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

John Madden has apparently provides his opinion that this is all on Brady, as he does not see where a coach would get into the ins and outs of how a QB wants his footballs prepared. He firmly believes that BB had no idea what was going on.

If so, are there are provisions in the rules about player conduct and trying to get a competitive advantage? Would that be viewed any differently than guys getting caught with PEDs?

Agree. Madden stepping up here. Look at the Brad Johnson and Bradshaw comments/excerpts, this is a QB thing. There are so many permutations to this, the refs, equipment managers, the QB is the only player who would want this done, stadium security, the NFL's front office, gambling.

The reactionary commentary is incredible right now, it's at a fever pitch. I also don't have any confidence in Goodell that he will handle things fairly, he cares about one thing foremost, bad publicity. The NFL doesn't control its own equipment (that's a scandal right there)? Other teams may be doing it and for how long? If it happens who did it and who knew? Does it affect anything at all? For some time now Goodell has been firing first and looking at the file after (video, we got a video?). He could wake up in the morning and suspend BB for the SB, or he could delay it until the middle of the 2015 season and do zip, and never look at the facts the whole time.

 

[devouredbychaos]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

 

[ChuckLiddell]

The 'natural pressure change' argument is easy to explore. The formula is simple:

P1/T1 = P2/T2.

Lets take the very outer temperature limits of plausibility, say it was 75d F when they filled them, and 33dF when they tested (you have to change F to Kelvin to work this formula).

12.5PSI / 297K = X / 274K

Solve for X = 11.5 PSI

So even if the temp dropped farther than we know it dropped, at most you would lose 1 pound per square inch of pressure.

In order to lose 2PSI, the temperature the balls were filled at would have had to have been 127d F.

Apparently not that easy as we are now 1400+ posts in and people are still calculating this wrong. The equation is P1/T1 = P2/T2 rearrange the equation to solve for T2 so we get T2 = P2/P1*T1. All units of measure MUST be measured in absolute . For pressure you need to add the atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) to the pressure inside the ball. The temps need to be in absolute also so either in Kelvin (C + 273) or Rankine (F + 459).

So your example to find a 2 psi drop works out to:

P1 = 12.5 + 14.7 = 27.2

P2 = 10.5 + 14.7 = 25.2

T1 = 75 + 459 = 534

T2 = (25.2/27.2) * 534 = 494 degrees rankine subtract 459 to convert back to F = 35

So the change in temperature is 75 - 35 = 40 degrees for a 2 psi drop in pressure in the ball.

Its not just posters getting this wrong its actual people in the media putting out this foolishness. Felger and Mazz on 98.5 were talking about an 87 degree temperature swing required to get the 2 psi change in the ball.

atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) can change depending on the weather, no? Foxboro went from cold and dry to wet and foggy that day..

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

Xwrong.

it IS cheating.the colts balls were not off by any weight whatsoever...so how is it that just the Patriots balls , ALL 12 of them, were off by 2+ lbs,while the Colts balls were not off one bit?

answer: Bellichick and Brady cheated. where there's smoke there's fire.you backing the wrong people here.the NFL is goingto come down hard on BB,he'll get suspended for the SB, huge fine , loss of draft picks, and suspension for 4+ games next season.it's THAT serious.not a preseason game, not week 1, but the AFC Championship game..now the circus turns to the SB..he won't make the trip to Az..they'll let him get the team prepped till sunday,and annouce it then,that he's suspended.

THEY CHEATED.

what's so hard to understand here?

and if you think Brady didn't know about it,you're nuts.he was in on the gig.check his laugh at that radio show the other day,when asked about it.his obnoxious arrogant laughter tells it all.would love to have a body language expert sit in on that conversation..I'm sure there were telltale signs ..

also,if you think Bobby Kraft wasn't in on the gig, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell ya..

other owners are probably clamoring that the NFL come down hard on this guy, BB, who already was caught cheating,and now is again.

and those of you who don't think he should be suspended, they banned Sean Payton for a full year for Bountygate..and his DC was out for 2 years..thats for putting money on injuries made to opposing players.actually altering the game and its parts - deflating balls - is even WORSE...

the mdeia is going to make this SB a circus, it could affect sponsors, etc..the integrity of the game has been compromised,yet,again,by Bill Bellichick and Tommy Brady.

they're both FRAUDS, and this will only further cement the idea that BB doesn't sniff the HOF and that Brady gets an asterisk..

ladies and gentlemen, meet the new Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire..

Lol. Such a salty troll. So if they cheated like you claim, where's the proof?? Haters gonna hate!

Shocking denial. Take the fanboy goggles off for one second and look at what we do know. Maybe the proof is not a photo of an ornery, middle-aged hoodied man with a pin in a football and a video camera pointed toward a practice field, but for sake of all that is rational, use your head here.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

The 'natural pressure change' argument is easy to explore. The formula is simple:

P1/T1 = P2/T2.

Lets take the very outer temperature limits of plausibility, say it was 75d F when they filled them, and 33dF when they tested (you have to change F to Kelvin to work this formula).

12.5PSI / 297K = X / 274K

Solve for X = 11.5 PSI

So even if the temp dropped farther than we know it dropped, at most you would lose 1 pound per square inch of pressure.

In order to lose 2PSI, the temperature the balls were filled at would have had to have been 127d F.

Apparently not that easy as we are now 1400+ posts in and people are still calculating this wrong. The equation is P1/T1 = P2/T2 rearrange the equation to solve for T2 so we get T2 = P2/P1*T1. All units of measure MUST be measured in absolute . For pressure you need to add the atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) to the pressure inside the ball. The temps need to be in absolute also so either in Kelvin (C + 273) or Rankine (F + 459).

So your example to find a 2 psi drop works out to:

P1 = 12.5 + 14.7 = 27.2

P2 = 10.5 + 14.7 = 25.2

T1 = 75 + 459 = 534

T2 = (25.2/27.2) * 534 = 494 degrees rankine subtract 459 to convert back to F = 35

So the change in temperature is 75 - 35 = 40 degrees for a 2 psi drop in pressure in the ball.

Its not just posters getting this wrong its actual people in the media putting out this foolishness. Felger and Mazz on 98.5 were talking about an 87 degree temperature swing required to get the 2 psi change in the ball.

atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) can change depending on the weather, no? Foxboro went from cold and dry to wet and foggy that day..

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

Xwrong.

it IS cheating.the colts balls were not off by any weight whatsoever...so how is it that just the Patriots balls , ALL 12 of them, were off by 2+ lbs,while the Colts balls were not off one bit?

answer: Bellichick and Brady cheated. where there's smoke there's fire.you backing the wrong people here.the NFL is goingto come down hard on BB,he'll get suspended for the SB, huge fine , loss of draft picks, and suspension for 4+ games next season.it's THAT serious.not a preseason game, not week 1, but the AFC Championship game..now the circus turns to the SB..he won't make the trip to Az..they'll let him get the team prepped till sunday,and annouce it then,that he's suspended.

THEY CHEATED.

what's so hard to understand here?

and if you think Brady didn't know about it,you're nuts.he was in on the gig.check his laugh at that radio show the other day,when asked about it.his obnoxious arrogant laughter tells it all.would love to have a body language expert sit in on that conversation..I'm sure there were telltale signs ..

also,if you think Bobby Kraft wasn't in on the gig, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell ya..

other owners are probably clamoring that the NFL come down hard on this guy, BB, who already was caught cheating,and now is again.

and those of you who don't think he should be suspended, they banned Sean Payton for a full year for Bountygate..and his DC was out for 2 years..thats for putting money on injuries made to opposing players.actually altering the game and its parts - deflating balls - is even WORSE...

the mdeia is going to make this SB a circus, it could affect sponsors, etc..the integrity of the game has been compromised,yet,again,by Bill Bellichick and Tommy Brady.

they're both FRAUDS, and this will only further cement the idea that BB doesn't sniff the HOF and that Brady gets an asterisk..

ladies and gentlemen, meet the new Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire..

Lol. Such a salty troll. So if they cheated like you claim, where's the proof?? Haters gonna hate!

Tell the truth. You're Fitzy, right?

 

[JohnnyU]

The 'natural pressure change' argument is easy to explore. The formula is simple:

P1/T1 = P2/T2.

Lets take the very outer temperature limits of plausibility, say it was 75d F when they filled them, and 33dF when they tested (you have to change F to Kelvin to work this formula).

12.5PSI / 297K = X / 274K

Solve for X = 11.5 PSI

So even if the temp dropped farther than we know it dropped, at most you would lose 1 pound per square inch of pressure.

In order to lose 2PSI, the temperature the balls were filled at would have had to have been 127d F.

Apparently not that easy as we are now 1400+ posts in and people are still calculating this wrong. The equation is P1/T1 = P2/T2 rearrange the equation to solve for T2 so we get T2 = P2/P1*T1. All units of measure MUST be measured in absolute . For pressure you need to add the atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) to the pressure inside the ball. The temps need to be in absolute also so either in Kelvin (C + 273) or Rankine (F + 459).

So your example to find a 2 psi drop works out to:

P1 = 12.5 + 14.7 = 27.2

P2 = 10.5 + 14.7 = 25.2

T1 = 75 + 459 = 534

T2 = (25.2/27.2) * 534 = 494 degrees rankine subtract 459 to convert back to F = 35

So the change in temperature is 75 - 35 = 40 degrees for a 2 psi drop in pressure in the ball.

Its not just posters getting this wrong its actual people in the media putting out this foolishness. Felger and Mazz on 98.5 were talking about an 87 degree temperature swing required to get the 2 psi change in the ball.

atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) can change depending on the weather, no? Foxboro went from cold and dry to wet and foggy that day..

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

Xwrong.

it IS cheating.the colts balls were not off by any weight whatsoever...so how is it that just the Patriots balls , ALL 12 of them, were off by 2+ lbs,while the Colts balls were not off one bit?

answer: Bellichick and Brady cheated. where there's smoke there's fire.you backing the wrong people here.the NFL is goingto come down hard on BB,he'll get suspended for the SB, huge fine , loss of draft picks, and suspension for 4+ games next season.it's THAT serious.not a preseason game, not week 1, but the AFC Championship game..now the circus turns to the SB..he won't make the trip to Az..they'll let him get the team prepped till sunday,and annouce it then,that he's suspended.

THEY CHEATED.

what's so hard to understand here?

and if you think Brady didn't know about it,you're nuts.he was in on the gig.check his laugh at that radio show the other day,when asked about it.his obnoxious arrogant laughter tells it all.would love to have a body language expert sit in on that conversation..I'm sure there were telltale signs ..

also,if you think Bobby Kraft wasn't in on the gig, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell ya..

other owners are probably clamoring that the NFL come down hard on this guy, BB, who already was caught cheating,and now is again.

and those of you who don't think he should be suspended, they banned Sean Payton for a full year for Bountygate..and his DC was out for 2 years..thats for putting money on injuries made to opposing players.actually altering the game and its parts - deflating balls - is even WORSE...

the mdeia is going to make this SB a circus, it could affect sponsors, etc..the integrity of the game has been compromised,yet,again,by Bill Bellichick and Tommy Brady.

they're both FRAUDS, and this will only further cement the idea that BB doesn't sniff the HOF and that Brady gets an asterisk..

ladies and gentlemen, meet the new Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire..

Lol. Such a salty troll. So if they cheated like you claim, where's the proof?? Haters gonna hate!

Seriously Pats fans, you really need to find better responses than "Haters gonna hate", and "salty troll". If the latest infractions are true, just accept it that your team cheats and their legacy is garbage in the eyes of everyone except those from the northeast. Stings like hell doesn't it?

 

[ChuckLiddell]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

LOL that you are the same guy asking for concrete proof before rushing to judgement when it comes to your team, but believes in some sort of un-proovable conspiracy about a coaching staff, front office, and players all trying to keep their jobs purposely losing games so that their replacements will have a shiny new toy?

 

[JohnnyU]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

love the deflection.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

This happened.

 

[devouredbychaos]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

LOL that you are the same guy asking for concrete proof before rushing to judgement when it comes to your team, but believes in some sort of un-proovable conspiracy about a coaching staff, front office, and players all trying to keep their jobs purposely losing games so that their replacements will have a shiny new toy?

If they wanted to win, they would've traded for a legitimate QB. They would've kept Manning. It's pretty well known that they lost on purpose. Maybe you've been living under a rock for the past 5 years though.

 

[devouredbychaos]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

love the deflection.

Love the fact you're crying cheating when there's no concrete proof. Still salty over the past 4 loses to the Patriots I see

 

[rjv]

There's cheating and there's cheating. It's not like the Pats are all roided up. They blew Indy out. It's not like they got a slight edge to beat a superior team. I'm not condoning the behaviour, but it's also not like they paid off the refs. They deserve to be consequenced for violating the rules, but the reactions are also way overblown imo. Wouldn't surprise me if some of the haters are holding onto Hernandez for $1 in a dynasty.

what if they were doing the exact same thing the previous week, where they won by 4? A game where a single incompletion could have derailed a scoring drive?

The optics around that would obviously be a lot worse, but it's also not what's on the table currently being debated. Like I said, I'm not condoning it, but they blew Indy out and saying they cheated their way to the Superbowl is hyperbole at its finest.

Why don't u understand that beating Indy by a thousand pts doesnt excuse cheating. It's all about intent. Their arrogance and paranoid belief they need to cheat is the issue, not whether it actually makes a difference in the game.

It doesn't excuse it. It's a "punishment fits the crime" thing. On the one hand, people are calling for them to be banned from the SB or suspended for an entire year, yet on the other, you have demonstrable proof that it didn't give them an edge. Those don't square.

It's not whether the punishment fits the crime, but the fact that a repeat felon got caught again and the punishment should fit the multiple felon. BB is making a mockery out of the NFL, the rules, the refs, etc, and he needs to be put in his place by Goodell.

A mockery out of the NFL? Come on guys.

?? You serious? It's exactly what BB is doing and has done.

 

[rjv]

The 'natural pressure change' argument is easy to explore. The formula is simple:

P1/T1 = P2/T2.

Lets take the very outer temperature limits of plausibility, say it was 75d F when they filled them, and 33dF when they tested (you have to change F to Kelvin to work this formula).

12.5PSI / 297K = X / 274K

Solve for X = 11.5 PSI

So even if the temp dropped farther than we know it dropped, at most you would lose 1 pound per square inch of pressure.

In order to lose 2PSI, the temperature the balls were filled at would have had to have been 127d F.

Apparently not that easy as we are now 1400+ posts in and people are still calculating this wrong. The equation is P1/T1 = P2/T2 rearrange the equation to solve for T2 so we get T2 = P2/P1*T1. All units of measure MUST be measured in absolute . For pressure you need to add the atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) to the pressure inside the ball. The temps need to be in absolute also so either in Kelvin (C + 273) or Rankine (F + 459).

So your example to find a 2 psi drop works out to:

P1 = 12.5 + 14.7 = 27.2

P2 = 10.5 + 14.7 = 25.2

T1 = 75 + 459 = 534

T2 = (25.2/27.2) * 534 = 494 degrees rankine subtract 459 to convert back to F = 35

So the change in temperature is 75 - 35 = 40 degrees for a 2 psi drop in pressure in the ball.

Its not just posters getting this wrong its actual people in the media putting out this foolishness. Felger and Mazz on 98.5 were talking about an 87 degree temperature swing required to get the 2 psi change in the ball.

atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) can change depending on the weather, no? Foxboro went from cold and dry to wet and foggy that day..

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

Xwrong.

it IS cheating.the colts balls were not off by any weight whatsoever...so how is it that just the Patriots balls , ALL 12 of them, were off by 2+ lbs,while the Colts balls were not off one bit?

answer: Bellichick and Brady cheated. where there's smoke there's fire.you backing the wrong people here.the NFL is goingto come down hard on BB,he'll get suspended for the SB, huge fine , loss of draft picks, and suspension for 4+ games next season.it's THAT serious.not a preseason game, not week 1, but the AFC Championship game..now the circus turns to the SB..he won't make the trip to Az..they'll let him get the team prepped till sunday,and annouce it then,that he's suspended.

THEY CHEATED.

what's so hard to understand here?

and if you think Brady didn't know about it,you're nuts.he was in on the gig.check his laugh at that radio show the other day,when asked about it.his obnoxious arrogant laughter tells it all.would love to have a body language expert sit in on that conversation..I'm sure there were telltale signs ..

also,if you think Bobby Kraft wasn't in on the gig, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell ya..

other owners are probably clamoring that the NFL come down hard on this guy, BB, who already was caught cheating,and now is again.

and those of you who don't think he should be suspended, they banned Sean Payton for a full year for Bountygate..and his DC was out for 2 years..thats for putting money on injuries made to opposing players.actually altering the game and its parts - deflating balls - is even WORSE...

the mdeia is going to make this SB a circus, it could affect sponsors, etc..the integrity of the game has been compromised,yet,again,by Bill Bellichick and Tommy Brady.

they're both FRAUDS, and this will only further cement the idea that BB doesn't sniff the HOF and that Brady gets an asterisk..

ladies and gentlemen, meet the new Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire..

Lol. Such a salty troll. So if they cheated like you claim, where's the proof?? Haters gonna hate!

Seriously Pats fans, you really need to find better responses than "Haters gonna hate", and "salty troll". If the latest infractions are true, just accept it that your team cheats and their legacy is garbage in the eyes of everyone except those from the northeast. Stings like hell doesn't it?

Love it agree 100%. Almost hope BB gets the full year suspension so these guys realise that cheating will not be tolerated.

 

[12punch]

The 'natural pressure change' argument is easy to explore. The formula is simple:

P1/T1 = P2/T2.

Lets take the very outer temperature limits of plausibility, say it was 75d F when they filled them, and 33dF when they tested (you have to change F to Kelvin to work this formula).

12.5PSI / 297K = X / 274K

Solve for X = 11.5 PSI

So even if the temp dropped farther than we know it dropped, at most you would lose 1 pound per square inch of pressure.

In order to lose 2PSI, the temperature the balls were filled at would have had to have been 127d F.

Apparently not that easy as we are now 1400+ posts in and people are still calculating this wrong. The equation is P1/T1 = P2/T2 rearrange the equation to solve for T2 so we get T2 = P2/P1*T1. All units of measure MUST be measured in absolute . For pressure you need to add the atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) to the pressure inside the ball. The temps need to be in absolute also so either in Kelvin (C + 273) or Rankine (F + 459).

So your example to find a 2 psi drop works out to:

P1 = 12.5 + 14.7 = 27.2

P2 = 10.5 + 14.7 = 25.2

T1 = 75 + 459 = 534

T2 = (25.2/27.2) * 534 = 494 degrees rankine subtract 459 to convert back to F = 35

So the change in temperature is 75 - 35 = 40 degrees for a 2 psi drop in pressure in the ball.

Its not just posters getting this wrong its actual people in the media putting out this foolishness. Felger and Mazz on 98.5 were talking about an 87 degree temperature swing required to get the 2 psi change in the ball.

atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) can change depending on the weather, no? Foxboro went from cold and dry to wet and foggy that day..

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

Xwrong.

it IS cheating.the colts balls were not off by any weight whatsoever...so how is it that just the Patriots balls , ALL 12 of them, were off by 2+ lbs,while the Colts balls were not off one bit?

answer: Bellichick and Brady cheated. where there's smoke there's fire.you backing the wrong people here.the NFL is goingto come down hard on BB,he'll get suspended for the SB, huge fine , loss of draft picks, and suspension for 4+ games next season.it's THAT serious.not a preseason game, not week 1, but the AFC Championship game..now the circus turns to the SB..he won't make the trip to Az..they'll let him get the team prepped till sunday,and annouce it then,that he's suspended.

THEY CHEATED.

what's so hard to understand here?

and if you think Brady didn't know about it,you're nuts.he was in on the gig.check his laugh at that radio show the other day,when asked about it.his obnoxious arrogant laughter tells it all.would love to have a body language expert sit in on that conversation..I'm sure there were telltale signs ..

also,if you think Bobby Kraft wasn't in on the gig, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell ya..

other owners are probably clamoring that the NFL come down hard on this guy, BB, who already was caught cheating,and now is again.

and those of you who don't think he should be suspended, they banned Sean Payton for a full year for Bountygate..and his DC was out for 2 years..thats for putting money on injuries made to opposing players.actually altering the game and its parts - deflating balls - is even WORSE...

the mdeia is going to make this SB a circus, it could affect sponsors, etc..the integrity of the game has been compromised,yet,again,by Bill Bellichick and Tommy Brady.

they're both FRAUDS, and this will only further cement the idea that BB doesn't sniff the HOF and that Brady gets an asterisk..

ladies and gentlemen, meet the new Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire..

Lol. Such a salty troll. So if they cheated like you claim, where's the proof?? Haters gonna hate!

Seriously Pats fans, you really need to find better responses than "Haters gonna hate", and "salty troll". If the latest infractions are true, just accept it that your team cheats and their legacy is garbage in the eyes of everyone except those from the northeast. Stings like hell doesn't it?

Nope

Salty troll

 

[Touchdown Syndrome]

(BTW, to you pats fans out there... don't you think this will create a 2007 'spygate' scenario, when they used that chip on their shoulder to destroy people? I wouldn't want to be a Seahawk next week)

Yeah, that was such an unforgettable championship season! Look out NFL! Those shoulder chips lead straight to Super Bowl victories!

 

[ChuckLiddell]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

LOL that you are the same guy asking for concrete proof before rushing to judgement when it comes to your team, but believes in some sort of un-proovable conspiracy about a coaching staff, front office, and players all trying to keep their jobs purposely losing games so that their replacements will have a shiny new toy?

If they wanted to win, they would've traded for a legitimate QB. They would've kept Manning. It's pretty well known that they lost on purpose. Maybe you've been living under a rock for the past 5 years though.

They added Kerry Collins if I recall, and he got concussed soon thereafter. Its not like its an easy task to add a QB mid-season, assimilate them to a playbook, and expect them to be effective. It is not "pretty well known". If anything, it is suspected by fans who know very little about the business. I have never heard this theory supported by anyone who is involved in the game in any way. That doesnt mean its not true - it just means that you are taking a huge leap to call it a fact.

Regardless, as noted you are simply deflecting. Calling for proof on something that has essentially been proven, but relying on a conspiracy theory with little support as a "fact". Its juvenile and hypocritical. And it is irrelevant to the nature of this thread.

 

[12punch]

quoting a poster from a pats board (weei is the local pats coverage station)

So on WEEI they said the head coaches at the senior bowl are angry and disgusted that this is such a big issue

Ima Bump What I Posted Yesterday, Guise!

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

This happened.

No it didn't. Be smart about it. So Jim Caldwell purposely lost games so that he could lose his job at the end of the season? So Curtis Painter and Kerry Collins were pulling the reins back and not unleashing their golden arms so that they can be replaced at the position and never heard from again.

The team also won 2 of their last 3 games which almost cost them the top spot.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I think Belichick will get banned for life from the Hall. Maybe over this. Maybe over the next thing that happens. But I think its coming.

If true, I believe he will get banned for 2015 and lose picks. He might even get banned from the Super Bowl. If true, the Patriots should also lose cap $$$ because of their arrogance and multiple infractions to cheat. Goodell has to come down hard on them for the sake of the integrity of the game. Brady may not be exempt from punishment as well.......again...if true.

Integrity of the game?? Lol. Your Colts tanked purposely to draft Luck..that's a hell of a lot worse.

LOL that you are the same guy asking for concrete proof before rushing to judgement when it comes to your team, but believes in some sort of un-proovable conspiracy about a coaching staff, front office, and players all trying to keep their jobs purposely losing games so that their replacements will have a shiny new toy?

If they wanted to win, they would've traded for a legitimate QB. They would've kept Manning. It's pretty well known that they lost on purpose. Maybe you've been living under a rock for the past 5 years though.

Because teams are always giving away legitimate quarterbacks that late in the offseason?

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

I suspect Belichick is going to deflect all questions by saying they are cooperating fully with the league and any questions related to the matter should be addressed to them. However, I'm sure the league has been communicating with the Pats quite a bit over the last few days and if they have giving any indication that punishment is going to include anything more than a fine (suspensions, lost of draft picks, etc.) than I think Belichick should just seize the narrative and lay out everything he knows about the situation and what the Pats did/did not do. Yeah, the NFL would be pissed but they also would be shocked and not know how to react. The media would be shocked as well since it would be so out of character for Belichick to be forthcoming with information. Obviously the key is if the league has giving any indication to the punishment they plan to hand down. As a Pats fan, I think if it is only a fine then it is fair to say this has been way overblown. However, any suspensions and/or loss of draft picks makes this an offense on par with Spygate. Might as well control the narrative instead of allowing unnamed sources to continue to leak information designed to put your team in a bad light.

 

[KarmaPolice]

There's cheating and there's cheating. It's not like the Pats are all roided up. They blew Indy out. It's not like they got a slight edge to beat a superior team. I'm not condoning the behaviour, but it's also not like they paid off the refs. They deserve to be consequenced for violating the rules, but the reactions are also way overblown imo. Wouldn't surprise me if some of the haters are holding onto Hernandez for $1 in a dynasty.

what if they were doing the exact same thing the previous week, where they won by 4? A game where a single incompletion could have derailed a scoring drive?

The optics around that would obviously be a lot worse, but it's also not what's on the table currently being debated. Like I said, I'm not condoning it, but they blew Indy out and saying they cheated their way to the Superbowl is hyperbole at its finest.

Why don't u understand that beating Indy by a thousand pts doesnt excuse cheating. It's all about intent. Their arrogance and paranoid belief they need to cheat is the issue, not whether it actually makes a difference in the game.

It doesn't excuse it. It's a "punishment fits the crime" thing. On the one hand, people are calling for them to be banned from the SB or suspended for an entire year, yet on the other, you have demonstrable proof that it didn't give them an edge. Those don't square.

It's not whether the punishment fits the crime, but the fact that a repeat felon got caught again and the punishment should fit the multiple felon. BB is making a mockery out of the NFL, the rules, the refs, etc, and he needs to be put in his place by Goodell.

A mockery out of the NFL? Come on guys.

?? You serious? It's exactly what BB is doing and has done.

He pushes the rules and doesn't play the media game. Irritating, but overall not that big of a deal to a lot of people.

IMO things like PEDs, horribly handling domestic abuse cases, turning a blind eye to concussions for decades, seemingly becoming a tattle-tale league, having Katy Perry do a half time show for a sport that used to be geared for middle aged men, etc make more of a mockery of the NFL than what Billy Boy is doing.

 

[shader]

The 'natural pressure change' argument is easy to explore. The formula is simple:

P1/T1 = P2/T2.

Lets take the very outer temperature limits of plausibility, say it was 75d F when they filled them, and 33dF when they tested (you have to change F to Kelvin to work this formula).

12.5PSI / 297K = X / 274K

Solve for X = 11.5 PSI

So even if the temp dropped farther than we know it dropped, at most you would lose 1 pound per square inch of pressure.

In order to lose 2PSI, the temperature the balls were filled at would have had to have been 127d F.

Apparently not that easy as we are now 1400+ posts in and people are still calculating this wrong. The equation is P1/T1 = P2/T2 rearrange the equation to solve for T2 so we get T2 = P2/P1*T1. All units of measure MUST be measured in absolute . For pressure you need to add the atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) to the pressure inside the ball. The temps need to be in absolute also so either in Kelvin (C + 273) or Rankine (F + 459).

So your example to find a 2 psi drop works out to:

P1 = 12.5 + 14.7 = 27.2

P2 = 10.5 + 14.7 = 25.2

T1 = 75 + 459 = 534

T2 = (25.2/27.2) * 534 = 494 degrees rankine subtract 459 to convert back to F = 35

So the change in temperature is 75 - 35 = 40 degrees for a 2 psi drop in pressure in the ball.

Its not just posters getting this wrong its actual people in the media putting out this foolishness. Felger and Mazz on 98.5 were talking about an 87 degree temperature swing required to get the 2 psi change in the ball.

atmospheric pressure (14.7 psi) can change depending on the weather, no? Foxboro went from cold and dry to wet and foggy that day.

.

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

X

wrong.

it IS cheating.the colts balls were not off by any weight whatsoever...so how is it that just the Patriots balls , ALL 12 of them, were off by 2+ lbs,while the Colts balls were not off one bit?

answer: Bellichick and Brady cheated. where there's smoke there's fire.you backing the wrong people here.the NFL is goingto come down hard on BB,he'll get suspended for the SB, huge fine , loss of draft picks, and suspension for 4+ games next season.it's THAT serious.not a preseason game, not week 1, but the AFC Championship game..now the circus turns to the SB..he won't make the trip to Az..they'll let him get the team prepped till sunday,and annouce it then,that he's suspended.

THEY CHEATED.

what's so hard to understand here?

and if you think Brady didn't know about it,you're nuts.he was in on the gig.check his laugh at that radio show the other day,when asked about it.his obnoxious arrogant laughter tells it all.would love to have a body language expert sit in on that conversation..I'm sure there were telltale signs ..

also,if you think Bobby Kraft wasn't in on the gig, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell ya..

other owners are probably clamoring that the NFL come down hard on this guy, BB, who already was caught cheating,and now is again.

and those of you who don't think he should be suspended, they banned Sean Payton for a full year for Bountygate..and his DC was out for 2 years..thats for putting money on injuries made to opposing players.actually altering the game and its parts - deflating balls - is even WORSE...

the mdeia is going to make this SB a circus, it could affect sponsors, etc..the integrity of the game has been compromised,yet,again,by Bill Bellichick and Tommy Brady.

they're both FRAUDS, and this will only further cement the idea that BB doesn't sniff the HOF and that Brady gets an asterisk..

ladies and gentlemen, meet the new Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire..

Look, the facts will eventually come out. But lets not turn this into a major conspiracy that the entire organization was in on. The pats ownership wasn't sitting around telling their friends in the luxury boxes "Don't worry..we've got a secret weapon, deflated ball".

It's a small thing, and while the facts may end up coming down and proving that the Pats did something wrong here, the only advantage it gave them was that Brady got a slightly better feeling ball.

As further proof that it really isn't that big of a deal, the pats absolutely annihilated the Colts in the 2nd half with balls that weren't deflated.

If the Pats did end up cheating here, I hope that people can be halfway rational about it, but then in this day and age in the NFL, rational thinking isn't really what sells newspapers, gets clicks, or generates attention on message boards.

 

[Deranged Hermit]

When all is said and done, if Goodell doesn't drop the hammer, you are inviting more of this type of behavior.

My wife and I were watching the news last night and this topic came up. I told her my thoughts (dropping the hammer on them) and she said that was too harsh. I explained that it wasn't the first time they were caught cheating and if you go easy you invite more of this type of activity.

I continued by using this analogy: If the Bears somehow cheated to get into the Super Bowl, doesn't matter how they did it, as a fan I wouldn't care less if they were fined. Hell, I'd probably chip in to pay it if need be. Now, if they lost a first round pick, I'd be very bothered. If my coaching staff and star QB were suspended for the SB, I'd be livid. If you did all three (fine, draft pick, suspension) I would hit the roof. THAT'S what needs to happen. You need to set a precedent right now that this crap won't be tolerated now or in the future.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

There's cheating and there's cheating. It's not like the Pats are all roided up. They blew Indy out. It's not like they got a slight edge to beat a superior team. I'm not condoning the behaviour, but it's also not like they paid off the refs. They deserve to be consequenced for violating the rules, but the reactions are also way overblown imo. Wouldn't surprise me if some of the haters are holding onto Hernandez for $1 in a dynasty.

what if they were doing the exact same thing the previous week, where they won by 4? A game where a single incompletion could have derailed a scoring drive?

The optics around that would obviously be a lot worse, but it's also not what's on the table currently being debated. Like I said, I'm not condoning it, but they blew Indy out and saying they cheated their way to the Superbowl is hyperbole at its finest.

Why don't u understand that beating Indy by a thousand pts doesnt excuse cheating. It's all about intent. Their arrogance and paranoid belief they need to cheat is the issue, not whether it actually makes a difference in the game.

It doesn't excuse it. It's a "punishment fits the crime" thing. On the one hand, people are calling for them to be banned from the SB or suspended for an entire year, yet on the other, you have demonstrable proof that it didn't give them an edge. Those don't square.

It's not whether the punishment fits the crime, but the fact that a repeat felon got caught again and the punishment should fit the multiple felon. BB is making a mockery out of the NFL, the rules, the refs, etc, and he needs to be put in his place by Goodell.

A mockery out of the NFL? Come on guys.

?? You serious? It's exactly what BB is doing and has done.

He pushes the rules and doesn't play the media game. Irritating, but overall not that big of a deal to a lot of people.

IMO things like PEDs, horribly handling domestic abuse cases, turning a blind eye to concussions for decades, seemingly becoming a tattle-tale league, having Katy Perry do a half time show for a sport that used to be geared for middle aged men, etc make more of a mockery of the NFL than what Billy Boy is doing.

 

[David Dodds]

The NFL won't allow this story to be fully addressed BEFORE the game. The second they do, then questions about suspending the team, the coach, etc all come fully into play. The Patriots will state their public line (We are working with the NFL) and the NFL will state they are talking to more people and will eventually state they should have the conclusion wrapped up post-Super Bowl.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Look, the facts will eventually come out. But lets not turn this into a major conspiracy that the entire organization was in on. The pats ownership wasn't sitting around telling their friends in the luxury boxes "Don't worry..we've got a secret weapon, deflated ball".

I agree with this. The last thing Robert Kraft would want is another black eye on his franchise and the NFL (which he owns 1/32 of) because of something that only gave the team a small, if any, advantage.

If Belichick is involved (assuming that it was even something the Pats did), I wouldn't be shocked if Kraft fires him. Sure he's one of the league's best coaches of all time, but with the good will the team has built up and a string fan base they could survive a few down years - and frankly maybe in a weak AFC East they do fine without Bill Boy.

 

[KarmaPolice]

When all is said and done, if Goodell doesn't drop the hammer, you are inviting more of this type of behavior.

My wife and I were watching the news last night and this topic came up. I told her my thoughts (dropping the hammer on them) and she said that was too harsh. I explained that it wasn't the first time they were caught cheating and if you go easy you invite more of this type of activity.

I continued by using this analogy: If the Bears somehow cheated to get into the Super Bowl, doesn't matter how they did it, as a fan I wouldn't care less if they were fined. Hell, I'd probably chip in to pay it if need be. Now, if they lost a first round pick, I'd be very bothered. If my coaching staff and star QB were suspended for the SB, I'd be livid. If you did all three (fine, draft pick, suspension) I would hit the roof. THAT'S what needs to happen. You need to set a precedent right now that this crap won't be tolerated now or in the future.

i get what you are saying, but i bet a lot of teams and fans would give up $1m and a 1st for a ring and sustained success.

 

[devouredbychaos]

All I can do is laugh at the haters who are filled with rage and jealousy. It's comical to me that you actually think someone was on the sideline during the game deflating balls with cameras surrounding them as well as fans. How ######ed can you be? Just admit it already, you're jealous of the Patriots and how well they've done over the years. You'll go to any length to try and discredit them because you can't stand the arrogant fan base and the amount of success they've had over the past 15 years. I also find it quite hilarious that you're trying to say it's cheating, with no actual concrete evidence whatsoever. You're basing all your allegations off what Mortenson said. The Patriots had 24 balls altogether, and 11 were underinflated. Why wouldn't all 24 be underinflated? If they were going to do it, why would only 11 be underinflated and not all 24.

Carry on with the accusations though, because you guys obviously know more than the NFL!

 

[Bigboy10182000]

Am I understanding it right that the balls were corrected in the 2nd half?

 

[bostonfred]

Also, if the Patriots (Brady) wanted a softer ball, the easiest way would be to inflate the balls with hot air at time of inspection.

They meet the minimum psi then quickly lose psi after cooling off outside. Not cheating.

This is still cheating by the way. The clear intent of the rule is ensure that balls are inflated to a consistent pressure and the same for both teams. Deliberately breaking the intent of the rule is cheating by any sane standard. We shouldn't need a specific clause in the rules saying that you can't inflate the balls with helium, for example.

From my cursory readbof the rules, that's not true. It's angle shooting, not cheating. If the rules state that you have to provide game balls at a certain psi, and have provisions for what to do if the pressure drops below that psi (replace the balls) then it appears the system worked as it is supposed to. It's like using for offensive linemen and vereen - you're acting within the rules and hoping to get away with something. But even if you believe it's cheating, which is certainly how the media is playing it, maybe a better example would be like throwing the ball deep every play and hoping to draw a pass interference. Or telling your d backs and o linemen to hold until they get called for it. When there's a prescribed penalty - a relatively small fine, or ten yards - breaking the rules is a perfectly sane thing to do.

And that's another key point - even if you believe in your heart of hearts that they broke the intent or letter of the rule, the penalty was so small that the nfl clearly stated is not a big deal. It's fine to say "if it wasn't a big deal then why did they do it", but the simple answer may be because it was worth the fine.

Because, in truth, a 25000 dollar fine is about the smallest penalty the nfl has for a team. That, or a first, second and third, lifetime ban and loss of cap money. Those are the two appropriate responses. You know, the one in the rules and the one in people's fevered imaginations.

 

[KarmaPolice]

The NFL won't allow this story to be fully addressed BEFORE the game. The second they do, then questions about suspending the team, the coach, etc all come fully into play. The Patriots will state their public line (We are working with the NFL) and the NFL will state they are talking to more people and will eventually state they should have the conclusion wrapped up post-Super Bowl.

no win for them. If they dont address this quickly, then it reeks of incompetence and them doing anything to protect their brand the week they are rolling out the big product.