Pats penalty by Goodell (1 Viewer)

[Bankerguy]

Lets put this into a Fantasy Football perspective.You catch someone in your home FF league doing something to impact the scores of your fantasy games.Let's assume it's $100 league. Who would fine the player $10 and they forfeit their 1 first pick year?

I'd call him a cheater & ban him from the FFL

Exactly.

 

[az_prof]

Lets put this into a Fantasy Football perspective.You catch someone in your home FF league doing something to impact the scores of your fantasy games.Let's assume it's $100 league. Who would fine the player $10 and they forfeit their 1 first pick year?

If it were an on-going thing, not a one time thing- I would kick them out of the leauge. Consider for example an owner who colluded with another in key trades that helped him win a championship? No way ten bucks and a first round pick would be enough--he would be banished.

 

[Marc Levin]

But you don't really think the guy in the hoody is paying this out of his pocket do you?

Yeah - I do.And yeah - he is.He might make it back next year, but he's paying it now.

That is illogical. My wife is going to pay our DirecTv bill tomorrow, but rest assured it is MY MONEY. BB loses nothing here.

BBs money <> Kraft's moneyNot sure of your point. BB pays this fine.

 

[Phlash]

Slap on the wrist. Goodell loses credibility on this one. Too bad, looked like he was making some progress.

You wouldn't be calling it a slap on the wrist if it was your team.The Pats are getting screwed royally when this is all BBs fault. I want my 1st round pick back and I want BB suspended for 4 games instead. The fans and organization get screwed because BB cheats...

 

[HellToupee]

But you don't really think the guy in the hoody is paying this out of his pocket do you?

Yeah - I do.And yeah - he is.He might make it back next year, but he's paying it now.

more important than the $$$ from his pocket ,he is paying it with his tarnished rep

I agree, but he isn't losing this money.

I'm not quite sure right now if he is or not. Normally I'd say no way he is footing the bill but if Krafty Bob is truly embarrassed by BB he might make him pay.

 

[Pat Patriot]

Pats should be thankful, because if it was my decision it would have been much worse.

Shocking. Jon, please go back to playing poker.

Hey, who was the fraud again? Ouch.

What are you talking about?BTW. Hines Ward does realize that the Patriots are accused of stealing defensive signals right? Hines #####ing that the Pats knew the Steelers offensive plays seems a little out of place in this argument.

 

[Bankerguy]

Lets put this into a Fantasy Football perspective.You catch someone in your home FF league doing something to impact the scores of your fantasy games.Let's assume it's $100 league. Who would fine the player $10 and they forfeit their 1 first pick year?

If it were an on-going thing, not a one time thing- I would kick them out of the leauge. Consider for example an owner who colluded with another in key trades that helped him win a championship? No way ten bucks and a first round pick would be enough--he would be banished.

I am trying to show that if was league you ran (The NFL or your local FF league) must would have dealt with this much more seriously......no?

 

[Ron_Mexico]

Quick end to this saga, thankfully.

Look no further than Formula One racing

to see the heavy hammer come down,

as the spying mess between McLaren and

Ferrari ended with McLaren forfeiting a jawdropping

$100 MILLION DOLLAR FINE .

 

[HellToupee]

What is the word about the Patriots jamming of the radio frequencies ?

 

[Ghost Rider]

Slap on the wrist. Goodell loses credibility on this one. Too bad, looked like he was making some progress.

You wouldn't be calling it a slap on the wrist if it was your team.The Pats are getting screwed royally when this is all BBs fault. I want my 1st round pick back and I want BB suspended for 4 games instead. The fans and organization get screwed because BB cheats...

The organization is responsible for the actions of their employees, and since Belichick is their most visible non-player employee, there is no way you can say the Patriots are getting screwed. If anything, they are getting off easy.

 

[jonessed]

Slap on the wrist. Goodell loses credibility on this one. Too bad, looked like he was making some progress.

You wouldn't be calling it a slap on the wrist if it was your team.The Pats are getting screwed royally when this is all BBs fault. I want my 1st round pick back and I want BB suspended for 4 games instead. The fans and organization get screwed because BB cheats...

I'm not a big fan of cheaters. It would be a slap to the wrist of any team conspiring to cheat, including any team I root for.

 

[Marc Levin]

But you don't really think the guy in the hoody is paying this out of his pocket do you?

Yeah - I do.And yeah - he is.He might make it back next year, but he's paying it now.

more important than the $$$ from his pocket ,he is paying it with his tarnished rep

I agree, but he isn't losing this money.

I'm not quite sure right now if he is or not. Normally I'd say no way he is footing the bill but if Krafty Bob is truly embarrassed by BB he might make him pay.

I read somewher ethat the reason there are separate fines is that Kraft is prohibited from paying this fine on behalf of BB - and I am sure goodell will have methods in place to make sure BB actually pays it.

 

[az_prof]

But you don't really think the guy in the hoody is paying this out of his pocket do you?

Yeah - I do.And yeah - he is.He might make it back next year, but he's paying it now.

more important than the $$$ from his pocket ,he is paying it with his tarnished rep

I agree, but he isn't losing this money.

I'm not quite sure right now if he is or not. Normally I'd say no way he is footing the bill but if Krafty Bob is truly embarrassed by BB he might make him pay.

Depends on whether Kraft Bob knew about it, and I am betting he did.

 

[jonessed]

Quick end to this saga, thankfully.Look no further than Formula One racingto see the heavy hammer come down,as the spying mess between McLaren andFerrari ended with McLaren forfeiting a jawdropping$100 MILLION DOLLAR FINE .

At least there is one sport that still has a backbone.

 

[Kiddnets]

Commish dropped the ball IMO - way too light. Tough on the players = weak on the coaches. How is what Pacman or Vick did more damaging to the NFL than what that jackass BB did? He tarnished the integrity of the game - worse than Pete Rose IMO. Not even a one game suspension? what a joke!!!!

 

[jonessed]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If this is a serious penalty ask yourself: how many of you would be willing to trade a late first round pick for a Super Bowl?

There are supposedly ten teams out there doing this with varying frequency. Apparently all ten of them have won multiple Superbowls recently.

Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

 

[Ghost Rider]

Commish dropped the ball IMO - way too light. Tough on the players = weak on the coaches. How is what Pacman or Vick did more damaging to the NFL than what that jackass BB did? He tarnished the integrity of the game - worse than Pete Rose IMO. Not even a one game suspension? what a joke!!!!

An assistant coach gets 5 games for using HGH, while a head coach gets no suspension for cheating? Talk about making no sense at all.

 

[bostonfred]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If I was the commish, no fines...they don't matter.Dock their salary cap.BB suspended for the rest of this season.Two 1st round picks.The NFL can NOT afford to have the integrity of their games brought into question...this isn't the NBA. Too much at stake.

The fines don't matter? Tell that to Mike Tice, who was hawking tickets to make a few extra bucks. Take a half million from him and see how he feels. And that's the point. Despite the fact that this is a hall of fame coach we're talking about in this instance, the bigger concern in stopping this practice long term is preventing the one year, stopgap guys who make less than a million to begin with from doing it. Wait until they're on the hot seat, and they're under pressure to win now, and the guys who have the most motivation to cheat will be the ones with the least to lose. Unless you show them that the standard penalty is a half million dollars. In which case, they'll be crapping their pants. Which is a necessary protection for the teams that hire them. There needs to be a penalty for both the coach and the team if you want to prevent this.

Lol. If we were talking about Red McCombs then, yes it matters. But you don't really think the guy in the hoody is paying this out of his pocket do you?

Of course not. For the purposes of this case, I'll agree with you that the fines don't matter. So the unprecedentedly high penalty of a first round pick is the only thing that it's really going to cost the Patriots. At the end of the day, I'm pretty sure that the grown ups will agree that's pretty harsh, and I'm pretty sure that you're one of the grown ups. You can say "is that all" all you want right now, but come draft day, people will be talking about how this player and that player look soooo awesome, and the Pats are going to miss out on them, and it'll all seem different then. But the commissioner has to set a precedent that is fair and correct across the board. He's done this. Playoff teams get screwed harder - they lose a first. Their head coach, who is assumably well paid and not on the hot seat - gets screwed less, but his team is going to suck. Most playoff caliber coaches would absolutely hate the idea of risking a first round pick to gain an advantage. That's exactly the deterrent effect the NFL wants. The non-playoff teams get screwed a little less - they lose an early second, and an early third, but at least they keep that early first. But their head coach, who probably doesn't make as much and, if he was thinking about cheating, is probably doing so because he IS on the hot seat, gets REEMED. That's exactly the deterrent effect the NFL wants. This punishment is correct for the Red McCombs and the Robert Krafts. That's why I think, at the end of the day, both sides of the debate will agree that this was a fair punishment, even though the people smelling blood in the water wanted to see the Pats get punished to the point that they simply couldn't win anymore.

 

[mad sweeney]

The draft pick is a stiff penalty and fair. No suspension is ridiculous. As someone already mentioned. Wade Wilson gets 5 games for taking a drug to treat ED so he can make love to his wife. Yet this gets no suspension? Please explain it to me........and sloooooooooowly, cause it makes no sense.

HGH makes your diabetes WORSE, according to most doctors. That "excuse" was a joke.

Fine I am NOT a doctor nor did I stay in a Holiday Inn last night. However, help me with the following then:A COACH takes HGH how does that help his team?BB is caught cheating and giving his team a significant edge.One offense gets 5 games, and the other no games. WTF.Not everyone that thinks it's a cop out is a hater. That's one of the problems with this board, if you're for something you'r a homer or player owner. If you're against something you're a hater, division rival, or owner of a different player. It's not that simple. I don't hate the Pats, nor Brady or Belicheat. I love the NFL and I believe, unlike many, that the info from the cameraman was instantly processed and useful and provided an unfair advantage in many of their games. The tech is there to do that. Less than a million bucks and a draft pick of which you have two (and only kept 2 of your draft class this year) is not really a deterrent for the rewards of a SB win, much less 3. What did that Glazer's say about the $8mil they paid the Raiders for Gruden after their SB win. Worth Every Penny. I am not a hater, I am not a Pats fan, the punishment was weak.I already wanted the Chargers to crush them this weekend (Chargers beat themselves, no need to even accuse the Pats for last year), but now I want them to really crush the Pats. But more than that, I want the Bolts to do it with the class that has been wrongly attributed to the Pats over the last few years. With their on field display last year, their own banned substance scandals, VideoGate, and clearly some other shenanigans (particularly RF shananigans which weren't addressed) the Pats are no longer the righteous Golden Team. So Stay Classy San Diego, beat the Pats and DON"T BE #######S ABOUT IT!!!!Please know, I am not a Pats hater.However, as an NFL fan first and foremost I am disgusted by this ruling.

One is a coach who bought a banned substance, yea he used it on himself but still, he had it. I'm sure the rules are standard for being in possesion of a banned substance beit a player or coach. He got 5 games and 100k fine.The other used a video camera. It's not that he was stealing signs which every team, player, coach, and analyst has agreed happens all the time, it's just the way he did it. He/the team got a 750k fine and will probable lose a 1st round pick, which is huge. Granted, they have another but that should not factor into the decision, teams trade away and for picks all of the time but they are only GIVEN one 1st round pick from the league therefore they should only take one 1st round pick away.

That's why we test the players. Who cares what Wilson puts in his body?A coach who takes medication (even if a banned substance) > a coach caught cheating. Very hard to swallow.

How do you know that all of it went into his body? If it's in he's body that means bought some. He coaches a professional sports team and has a banned substance. Is it a huge leap to think that some of it made it to the players? or that he got it from the players?

Then players would caught for using it if tested......this is NOT rocket science.

The NFL doesn't test for HGH, which is what Wilson acquired.

 

[jonessed]

Commish dropped the ball IMO - way too light. Tough on the players = weak on the coaches. How is what Pacman or Vick did more damaging to the NFL than what that jackass BB did? He tarnished the integrity of the game - worse than Pete Rose IMO. Not even a one game suspension? what a joke!!!!

An assistant coach gets 5 games for using HGH, while a head coach gets no suspension for cheating? Talk about making no sense at all.

The buck stops with the Patriots when it comes to Goodell. I suppose that's nice for Patriot fans to find out but it sucks for the rest of the league.

 

[cobalt_27]

Commish dropped the ball IMO - way too light. Tough on the players = weak on the coaches. How is what Pacman or Vick did more damaging to the NFL than what that jackass BB did? He tarnished the integrity of the game - worse than Pete Rose IMO. Not even a one game suspension? what a joke!!!!

But, if you talk to Patriots fans, this crime wasn't a big deal. So, why should they get penalized harshly for it? I'd be pissed off if I were a Pats fan who felt unfairly singled-out when there are, like, at least 10 other teams doing this.

 

[bostonfred]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If this is a serious penalty ask yourself: how many of you would be willing to trade a late first round pick for a Super Bowl?

There are supposedly ten teams out there doing this with varying frequency. Apparently all ten of them have won multiple Superbowls recently.

Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

Here you gohttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...p;#entry7332273

 

[LDotson]

The sad thing is when the Pats players/coaches hit the field for the rest of the season they will be called 'cheaters' by the opposing fans.

It won't be like the regular 'boosss' at games.

It will either motivate the Pats or dismatle the team.

People don't realize the effects of the negative publicity (of this magnitude) that this story is causing. It's big everywhere - even from non-football fans.

It can also motivate the teams that play the Pats. They know they have the advantaged because the Pats will be watched very closely by the league.

Yes, the Pats have to live with their actions the rest of the year and maybe many more. They dug the grave and they either have to dig their selves out of it it or lay in it.

 

[tombonneau]

Wow. Shocked that people think $750k and a 1st round pick is a light. A first round pick is extremely valuable. That is by far the most a team has been penalized. Denver cheated the cap to win two super bowls and lots a pair of 3rds.

I'm just glad it's over and BB wasn't suspended.

Interested to hear another Pats fan say they'd rather have BB suspended than lose a pick.

I couldn't be more the opposite. I just wanted this thing over with no suspension so they can move on with 2007. I'd hate for anything further to jeopardize the Pats 2007 chances at a SB.

With BB not suspended, the team is still on course.

Plus, they now have their Us vs. The World mentality on. Not good for the league, having a focused and out to prove themselves Patriots.

Glad this is over.

Btw, Goodell is a real man leaking it to the media.

 

[jonessed]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If this is a serious penalty ask yourself: how many of you would be willing to trade a late first round pick for a Super Bowl?

There are supposedly ten teams out there doing this with varying frequency. Apparently all ten of them have won multiple Superbowls recently.

Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

Here you gohttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...p;#entry7332273

I'll help you out.Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

 

[cobalt_27]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If this is a serious penalty ask yourself: how many of you would be willing to trade a late first round pick for a Super Bowl?

There are supposedly ten teams out there doing this with varying frequency. Apparently all ten of them have won multiple Superbowls recently.

Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

Here you gohttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...p;#entry7332273

I'll help you out.Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

 

[fred_1_15301]

Wow. Shocked that people think $750k and a 1st round pick is a light. A first round pick is extremely valuable. That is by far the most a team has been penalized. Denver cheated the cap to win two super bowls and lots a pair of 3rds.

I'm just glad it's over and BB wasn't suspended.

Interested to hear another Pats fan say they'd rather have BB suspended than lose a pick.

I couldn't be more the opposite. I just wanted this thing over with no suspension so they can move on with 2007. I'd hate for anything further to jeopardize the Pats 2007 chances at a SB.

With BB not suspended, the team is still on course.

Plus, they now have their Us vs. The World mentality on. Not good for the league, having a focused and out to prove themselves Patriots.

Glad this is over.

Btw, Goodell is a real man leaking it to the media.

They cheat and they're going to use this card? Whatever floats their boat I guess.....

 

[Pat Patriot]

Pats should be thankful, because if it was my decision it would have been much worse.

Shocking. Jon, please go back to playing poker.

They got a slap on the wrist IMO. But they still have to live with the "taint" that is all over them...GL with that.

1st round pick is a slap on the wrist? You have 22 starters on your team. Its a starter. Pretty significant.

For them yes. If they took Atlanta's 1st that would be a big deal. The shame of this is that the Pats didn't really need to do this. If I were a Pats fan I'd be sick to my stomach thinking about the black eye that this creates. BB is clearly absent of any ethical or moral compass.

That is exactly how everyone that I have talked to feels.

 

[bostonfred]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If this is a serious penalty ask yourself: how many of you would be willing to trade a late first round pick for a Super Bowl?

There are supposedly ten teams out there doing this with varying frequency. Apparently all ten of them have won multiple Superbowls recently.

Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

Here you gohttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...p;#entry7332273

I'll help you out.Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

It's a ten minute video, there's more than two minutes of discussion, and yet the clock shows you responded in two minutes. So I'm pretty sure you didn't watch it. I guess you only watch what you want to watch, just like you only see what you want to see. That's OK. I didn't expect a serious conversation with you anyways. It's nicer when there are mostly grown ups in the thread, but I didn't figure it would last.

 

[Gambino]

But you don't really think the guy in the hoody is paying this out of his pocket do you?

Yeah - I do.And yeah - he is.He might make it back next year, but he's paying it now.

more important than the $$$ from his pocket ,he is paying it with his tarnished rep

I agree, but he isn't losing this money.

I'm not quite sure right now if he is or not. Normally I'd say no way he is footing the bill but if Krafty Bob is truly embarrassed by BB he might make him pay.

I read somewher ethat the reason there are separate fines is that Kraft is prohibited from paying this fine on behalf of BB - and I am sure goodell will have methods in place to make sure BB actually pays it.

Wow, very good point. Now there is no way that BB will walk in with a Bob Kraft endorsed check. Glad that is taken care of.

 

[Kiddnets]

Commish dropped the ball IMO - way too light. Tough on the players = weak on the coaches. How is what Pacman or Vick did more damaging to the NFL than what that jackass BB did? He tarnished the integrity of the game - worse than Pete Rose IMO. Not even a one game suspension? what a joke!!!!

But, if you talk to Patriots fans, this crime wasn't a big deal. So, why should they get penalized harshly for it? I'd be pissed off if I were a Pats fan who felt unfairly singled-out when there are, like, at least 10 other teams doing this.

If other teams are caught they should be suspended as well - PAts are the only ones stupid enough to get caught and the Commish turned yellow! Wonder if it was the Browns that got caught what would happen? Thin the got pressure that if he hammered them it would tarnish the SB victories - sorry commish - its already tarnsihed!!!

 

[Marc Levin]

Commish dropped the ball IMO - way too light. Tough on the players = weak on the coaches. How is what Pacman or Vick did more damaging to the NFL than what that jackass BB did? He tarnished the integrity of the game - worse than Pete Rose IMO. Not even a one game suspension? what a joke!!!!

But, if you talk to Patriots fans, this crime wasn't a big deal. So, why should they get penalized harshly for it? I'd be pissed off if I were a Pats fan who felt unfairly singled-out when there are, like, at least 10 other teams doing this.

Anyh Pats fan who complains is a whiny . . never mindPats fans lucked out big time that this became an issue and was punished this year and not last. They can afford a first this year - and if they MISS the playoffs, they still get two #1s, but don't pick again until the 4th.The fines don't touch fans at all. Pats fans should be happy as heck right now.

 

[jonessed]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If this is a serious penalty ask yourself: how many of you would be willing to trade a late first round pick for a Super Bowl?

There are supposedly ten teams out there doing this with varying frequency. Apparently all ten of them have won multiple Superbowls recently.

Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

Here you gohttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...p;#entry7332273

I'll help you out.Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

It's a ten minute video, there's more than two minutes of discussion, and yet the clock shows you responded in two minutes. So I'm pretty sure you didn't watch it. I guess you only watch what you want to watch, just like you only see what you want to see. That's OK. I didn't expect a serious conversation with you anyways. It's nicer when there are mostly grown ups in the thread, but I didn't figure it would last.

I'll give you a third chance because I'm niceName the teams and cite the evidence or this is

If you can't, you can't. It's cool. Just admit it.

It's not in the podcast. I listened to it when it was posted the first time. Maybe you should hear it again.

 

[raor]

Quick end to this saga, thankfully.

Look no further than Formula One racing

to see the heavy hammer come down,

as the spying mess between McLaren and

Ferrari ended with McLaren forfeiting a jawdropping

$100 MILLION DOLLAR FINE .

the money involved in F1 is quite a bit more than the NFL, and yes I know exactly what I'm talking about - that being said, a proportional fine ($20 mil) wouldn't have been out of reason IF the organization was complicit in the cheat. That is probably this biggest tragedy in this, no in-depth/league-wide investigation into the scope of this type of

cheating.

 

[Pat Patriot]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If I was the commish, no fines...they don't matter.Dock their salary cap.BB suspended for the rest of this season.Two 1st round picks.The NFL can NOT afford to have the integrity of their games brought into question...this isn't the NBA. Too much at stake.

Jon, how is the integrity of the game at risk by what Belichek was doing? Dont you agree that it was more a STUPID thing to do than anything else?

 

[Marc Levin]

But you don't really think the guy in the hoody is paying this out of his pocket do you?

Yeah - I do.And yeah - he is.He might make it back next year, but he's paying it now.

more important than the $$$ from his pocket ,he is paying it with his tarnished rep

I agree, but he isn't losing this money.

I'm not quite sure right now if he is or not. Normally I'd say no way he is footing the bill but if Krafty Bob is truly embarrassed by BB he might make him pay.

I read somewher ethat the reason there are separate fines is that Kraft is prohibited from paying this fine on behalf of BB - and I am sure goodell will have methods in place to make sure BB actually pays it.

Wow, very good point. Now there is no way that BB will walk in with a Bob Kraft endorsed check. Glad that is taken care of.

Funny one.

 

[LDotson]

If the Jets come with-in one win of making the playoffs and the Pats go to the Super Bowl. It will hurt this league a lot.

Can you imagine the media and fan out cry? And how bad this Super Bowl will be viewed?

 

[bostonfred]

Quick end to this saga, thankfully.

Look no further than Formula One racing

to see the heavy hammer come down,

as the spying mess between McLaren and

Ferrari ended with McLaren forfeiting a jawdropping

$100 MILLION DOLLAR FINE .

the money involved in F1 is quite a bit more than the NFL, and yes I know exactly what I'm talking about - that being said, a proportional fine ($20 mil) wouldn't have been out of reason IF the organization was complicit in the cheat. That is probably this biggest tragedy in this, no in-depth/league-wide investigation into the scope of this type of

cheating.

The owners also have a lot more control in the NFL than they do in F1. There's no way that the owners will want a commissioner throwing around $20 million fines, regardless of who did what. Curious, though, what makes you think there's no in-depth, league wide investigation going on?

 

[cobalt_27]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If I was the commish, no fines...they don't matter.Dock their salary cap.BB suspended for the rest of this season.Two 1st round picks.The NFL can NOT afford to have the integrity of their games brought into question...this isn't the NBA. Too much at stake.

Jon, how is the integrity of the game at risk by what Belichek was doing? Dont you agree that it was more a STUPID thing to do than anything else?

In the same link Fred gave, Shefter was citing another player who said, "You have no idea how big of an advantage this gives a team."BB wouldn't do it if he didn't think it gave him an advantage. Cheating erodes the integrity of the game. That's what BB was doing.

 

[Gangster]

Am I now allowed to sue the Pats for the lost money on certain sportsbook tickets? Just wondering if I'd have a leg to stand on.

 

[Gambino]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If I was the commish, no fines...they don't matter.Dock their salary cap.BB suspended for the rest of this season.Two 1st round picks.The NFL can NOT afford to have the integrity of their games brought into question...this isn't the NBA. Too much at stake.

Jon, how is the integrity of the game at risk by what Belichek was doing? Dont you agree that it was more a STUPID thing to do than anything else?

I don't personally think the games were compromised. But my point is that the Multi-Billion dollar business that is the NFL cannot afford to have that cloud. Look at the NBA ref scandal for a case in point. And, yes it was stupid that he did this.

 

[HellToupee]

The sad thing is when the Pats players/coaches hit the field for the rest of the season they will be called 'cheaters' by the opposing fans.It won't be like the regular 'boosss' at games.It will either motivate the Pats or dismatle the team.People don't realize the effects of the negative publicity (of this magnitude) that this story is causing. It's big everywhere - even from non-football fans.It can also motivate the teams that play the Pats. They know they have the advantaged because the Pats will be watched very closely by the league.Yes, the Pats have to live with their actions the rest of the year and maybe many more. They dug the grave and they either have to dig their selves out of it it or lay in it.

I'm guessing from comments by players yesterday that they will be pissed about the position BB put them in & use it as a rallying cry

 

[HellToupee]

If the Jets come with-in one win of making the playoffs and the Pats go to the Super Bowl. It will hurt this league a lot.Can you imagine the media and fan out cry? And how bad this Super Bowl will be viewed?

that tape they were caught with had nothing to do with the results of last sunday

 

[cobalt_27]

Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

Here you gohttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...p;#entry7332273

I'll help you out.Name the teams and cite the evidence or this is

It's a ten minute video, there's more than two minutes of discussion, and yet the clock shows you responded in two minutes. So I'm pretty sure you didn't watch it. I guess you only watch what you want to watch, just like you only see what you want to see. That's OK. I didn't expect a serious conversation with you anyways. It's nicer when there are mostly grown ups in the thread, but I didn't figure it would last.

I'll give you a third chance because I'm niceName the teams and cite the evidence or this is

If you can't, you can't. It's cool. Just admit it.

It's not in the podcast. I listened to it when it was posted the first time. Maybe you should hear it again.

Fred can't. Must be the grown-up thing to evade the question by referencing the latter part of an interview that added nothing to his argument.The evidence is simply that the accumulation of others' accounts suggests that as many as 10 teams are involved. None of those teams were named, and no evidence was produced by Schefter. Nice Red Herring by Fred.

 

[Kiddnets]

Everything the Pats ever won is now tarnished - in the Court of public opinion - every court outside of Boston has found your team guilty. I would not be chest bumping but laying low in shame!

 

[Ghost Rider]

If the Jets come with-in one win of making the playoffs and the Pats go to the Super Bowl. It will hurt this league a lot.Can you imagine the media and fan out cry? And how bad this Super Bowl will be viewed?

that tape they were caught with had nothing to do with the results of last sunday

How do you know that? Did you miss the part yesterday about how the video can be viewed in real time by coaches, meaning they could have easily gotten the signals before the cameraman was nabbed.

 

[raor]

Quick end to this saga, thankfully.

Look no further than Formula One racing

to see the heavy hammer come down,

as the spying mess between McLaren and

Ferrari ended with McLaren forfeiting a jawdropping

$100 MILLION DOLLAR FINE .

the money involved in F1 is quite a bit more than the NFL, and yes I know exactly what I'm talking about - that being said, a proportional fine ($20 mil) wouldn't have been out of reason IF the organization was complicit in the cheat. That is probably this biggest tragedy in this, no in-depth/league-wide investigation into the scope of this type of

cheating.

The owners also have a lot more control in the NFL than they do in F1. There's no way that the owners will want a commissioner throwing around $20 million fines, regardless of who did what. Curious, though, what makes you think there's no in-depth, league wide investigation going on?

I would assume announcing such a thing would be worthwhile PR was - offset the hit from cheating scandal, reinforce Godell as enforcer, etc. Not like it needs to be kept secret, everyone already knew the league was concerned/watching - re: memo sent out at start of season.

 

[bostonfred]

Does anyone know the last time a team lost a first round pick as a punishment? Has it happened before?

That's my point. I don't think this is a light penalty, at all. Especially, given how you guys have been downplaying this infraction, saying it's not much of a big deal and that everyone does it. Sheesh. For such small potatoes, this all seems like a pretty stiff penalty to me.

But their 1st is essentially a 2nd.

Still...

If I was the commish, no fines...they don't matter.Dock their salary cap.BB suspended for the rest of this season.Two 1st round picks.The NFL can NOT afford to have the integrity of their games brought into question...this isn't the NBA. Too much at stake.

Jon, how is the integrity of the game at risk by what Belichek was doing? Dont you agree that it was more a STUPID thing to do than anything else?

In the same link Fred gave, Shefter was citing another player who said, "You have no idea how big of an advantage this gives a team."BB wouldn't do it if he didn't think it gave him an advantage. Cheating erodes the integrity of the game. That's what BB was doing.

This is why I think the penalty is fair. The thing I keep going back to is, even if both teams are stealing signs, the one that does it better has a significant enough advantage that the Dolphins, who allegedly put microphones on their defenders to steal the Patriots' audibles, were able to beat the heavily favored Patriots. Look at this from last year:vs. Miami Tom Brady 16/29 for 140, 2 TDs, 0 INTs@ Miami Tom Brady 12/25, 78 yards, 0 TDs, 0 INTsThose were his two worst starts last year. Or in 2004, when the 14-1, Superbowl bound Patriots were on a roll going into Miami, Brady suddenly and uncharacteristically threw 4 INTs. Of course, there's no more proof of this than there is that the Patriots were stealing signs in games outside of the Jets game last week. But it goes to show you how much of an impact this can have on a game. I seriously wonder how much Vegas knows about this, too.

 

[zoonation]

I think a 1st rounder is pretty harsh, but fair

Hhow Belichick avoided a suspension as well is beyond me. A player takes steroids (cheats) and gets 4 games. A coach does the coach's version of cheating and gets a fine?

Nice message.

 

[ChrisHenrysDD]

It's a ten minute video, there's more than two minutes of discussion, and yet the clock shows you responded in two minutes. So I'm pretty sure you didn't watch it. I guess you only watch what you want to watch, just like you only see what you want to see. That's OK. I didn't expect a serious conversation with you anyways. It's nicer when there are mostly grown ups in the thread, but I didn't figure it would last.

I think his point was that no other team has had a salaried camera man escorted off the field AT LEAST twice, and that no other team has been caught red handed, with their hand in the cookie jar, or whatever you want to call it. that's the evidence he is talking about. Not a bunch of he said, she said.And for the record, I think the black eye is going to be punishment enough. I know I don't look at those three rings the same way anymore.