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PIT-TEN To Be Postponed (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Joe Bryant
- Start date
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Was listening to a radio interview from someone from the NFL while making deliveries yesterday. Apparently all players & team personnel wear "contact tracing bracelets", so they are constantly doing tracing.
Contrary to your assertions, they tested the OLB coach *because* their contact tracing indicated that he'd been in contact with one of the people who'd tested positive. Your criticism here is off-base. They actually weren't sloppy at all, nor were they lax with contact tracing. It was exactly the opposite.
This is coming from a guy who's been critical of the NFL's handling of COVID, so it's not like I'm biased in my defense of the league here. They are monitoring everyone 24/7, and have contact tracing data for every minute of the day.
skinsrule05
Footballguy
Yep, makes me glad I’m not a commish. Major headache I don’t want to have to deal with.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
As a commish it's not really a headache. Either the game gets played this week or it don't. If it isn't played, teams in my league will have ample opportunity to make lineup changes. If the game is moved to MNF or TuNF, then it's not dissimilar to the decisions managers need to make for prime time games with a hurt player. Here's a late game, you don't have 100% certainty your player will play. Set your lineup at your own risk.
This creates none headache for me whatsoever - I simply post commissioner messages to get out ahead of the situation. I apprise the league of the situation, and let 11 grown men make decisions for themselves. I will do the best I can to keep everyone informed as news breaks, and I indicate how it will be handled for our league in particular.
as a long-time project manager I've found that they best way to handle a situation is to set expectations in advance, and to get out ahead of potential problems using information & setting expectations. Provided that's done, I don't see any hassle with this.
Inconvenient, yes. But it's not a hassle.
I do like the idea of contingency players - e.g. "Here's a thread on the message board. Post your contingency players here. If the PIT/TEN game doesn't get played, I will use commish tools to change your lineup to that contingency". That seems like a fair way to handle it.
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I talked to my guy at Yahoo and he said the PIT TEN bye week designation was just a pre-emptive thing until the league makes a decision.
RC94
Footballguy
IMO this situation is similar enough to if Juju were banged up and a game time decision for Monday. In the leagues I commish, I would not allow anyone to retroactively substitute a player in that scenario and I wouldn't in this case either. Everyone has to make difficult WDIS decisions, especially when it comes to incomplete information and unsure whether a player will play. That isn't reason enough to allow retroactive starters.
Stoneworker
Footballguy
The nightmare for NFL teams would be if, for example, MIN/TEN had a Thursday game scheduled in Week 5.
At a minimum the NFL would then have to move the Thursday game to allow for adequate turnaround time. There would also be all types of domino effects if multiple teams were involved instead of just two as is the case this week.
Not sure what you mean by "apparently". It's been known for about 2 months now that everyone wears the contact tracing bracelets, including media.
The Titans OLB tested Friday, results came back positive on Saturday. I don't know if you are listening to Fox radio or something but that's false information for a few reasons. The most notable being other players and staff tested positive after the OLB coach and secondly everyone is tested, the OLB did not test on Friday because of contact tracing but because everyone got tested that day.
And with a known positive case on staff, with players known to have been around the coach, I will continue to assert this should have called for game day POC quick test. These do run risk of a false positive, but that beats the alternative.
I believe this is not similar to a player being banged up and a game time decision. It's a situation where the league is postponing a game so these teams will have their bye week moved so it is like purposely playing a bye week player.
What is the advantage gained by allowing a "backup" player to be designated before that player's game starts as a fall back in case the NFL postpones the game late? The team is not hand picking a player they know had a good game. They are actually at a disadvantage in not being able to play the guy they want to start (if the game is postponed). So it's actually a disadvantage having players in that game. If the game is played as usual in week 4 then nothing lost and the rightful starter plays. How is that a bad thing under these circumstances? It also allows the league to stay as competitive as possible as the other teams still have to face a full lineup. Balanced competition is always a good thing. I don't see any negative to this approach.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I just posted the suggestion to my league for the contingency plan & so far I have received 100% support.
I agree that it is not at all similar to an injured player that you start at your own risk. This is more like an "act of god" clause where you have healthy players who would be no-brainer starts, then the rug gets pulled out from under you. How would it possibly be fair to stick players with zeroes for that?
I'm giving the teams a deadline of 5:00 PT on Thursday to post contingency substitutions if they have players from TNF they want to use as contingencies, and 9:50 AM PT Sunday to post their contingencies if no TNF players. I expect 100% buy-in from my league on this - we have 7 starting defensive players, so we have quite a bit more exposure as an IDP league if a game gets cancelled.
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JoeSteeler
Footballguy
BroncoFreak_2K3
sucker for Orange
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I meant "apparently" in the literal sense that I just learned of the practice. By definition, it is apparent that this is the case.
As for the rest, you said
Since they do contact tracing 100% of the time, it was neither a failure to do it, nor was it sloppy.
I was listening to local radio, but I have no idea what that could possibly have to do with it. I was simply correction your incorrect assertions.
ahartig
Footballguy
ahartig
Footballguy
spodog
Footballguy
"my guy at Yahoo"?
Based upon the way Yahoo handled the elimination of the Yahoo Groups functionality, I was under the impression they were down to only one employee total working on all of Yahoo. Good that you know him.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
BoltNlava
Footballguy
The only issue I'm trying to think through is whether this will be used as a precedent for future situations that are trickier. If and when we have a game postponed after the Thursday games are played or even after the Sunday 1:00 games have started I could imagine some owners then wanting to preemptively post "backups" for every starter for the rest of the year. Since we don't know when another outbreak will happen those owners will want to be covered incase their preferred backup plays their game before the postponement is announced. That could be fine so long as the whole league is onboard with it but I know it would rankle some owners.
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Wooderson
Fight The Power
Still gets messy. For example a team in my league has the Pitt kicker. Now he has no other kickers on his roster so he would have to pick up a kicker and drop someone and maybe not play that kicker at all. Also would then maybe want that player he dropped back.@Gally gets 100% of the credit for this one. It's a great idea.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
A good point. A lot of teams carry only one K.
As commish I can work with that as well. League member just needs to tell me which FA K they want subbed in & I'll make it happen, then swap their kicker back after week 4 with no transaction fee. Easy.
Appreciate the head's up - I've added that to the post.
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Chemical X
Footballguy
i commish in cbs and game is still listed sunday at 1p. i would consider the scoring week to be thursday-wednesday. but, this is why we expanded rosters. i am not doing contingent stuff. start players at your own risk and you have should have more than enough to field a squad. up to you if you want to gamble......
Hankmoody
Footballguy
We put in a 2nd waiver run on Saturday. Any owner can pick up players to replace a player with an IR-COVID designation in this special run. It uses stimulus FAAB and those guys are dropped when the original comes back.
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Stoneworker
Footballguy
All the myriad COVID scenarios is why our Yahoo league just gave everyone 5 extra bench spots and called it a day.
It's going to be an unfair year. It just is.
Commissioner interventions will just be an exercise in whack-a-mole...fixing one problem will invariably lead to more problems...and thus more interventions.
Why go through the brain damage?
It's going to be an unfair year. It just is.
Commissioner interventions will just be an exercise in whack-a-mole...fixing one problem will invariably lead to more problems...and thus more interventions.
Why go through the brain damage?
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Oh yeah - forgot I added 2 COVID IR spots. That works - just pick up a K, move their K to the COVID spot & drop the replacement K after the game. Solid.
Man this place has some smart folks.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Because some of our leagues have
1. $$$ involved
2. Care about having the most fair outcomes.
If someone's 1st round pick has a game unexpectedly turned into a BYE by the league at the last minute, that's injury enough. No need to add insult to that injury by not providing a contingency for a replacement player.
There are degrees of fairness. If it is possible to provide a solution to increase the amount of fairness, why wouldn't I? I see that as part of my job as commish. It won't take that much effort to make the swaps. If I can't be bothered to spend 30 mins on that, then I shouldn't be commish.
JoeSteeler
Footballguy
On yahoo, can the commish move players without the IR designation to IR?
BroncoFreak_2K3
sucker for Orange
Buck Bradcanon
Footballguy
Looking like Monday as of now per teh Twitters
Just be clear upfront. If a game gets postponed out of the blue after the Thursday game is played it just means you cannot use any Thursday players. It is a bit unfortunate but not a deal breaker. In addition, if the game is actually postponed then you don't need the backup provision because you just take those guys out of your lineup and put someone else in. The backup provision is only for cases like this week where everything is still up in the air. The game may be played it may not. Because of that ambiguity you use the backup provision.
FairWarning
Footballguy
I'm surprised more are not using the best ball format. We went with 4 extra roster spots for something like this, then used the BBF. There really isn't many good options that everyone will agree with. I know it'll hamper the Vegas capping contests, especially if you play the Thursday night game.
One other item I just thought of that needs to be clarified as well is that if a player is found COVID positive on game day and the game is still played you don't get the backup provision. It gets treated like any other pre-game injury. It sucks but it happens. The backup provision only goes into effect if the game is postponed to a different NFL week.@Gally gets 100% of the credit for this one. It's a great idea.
Also remember the whole point is to add flexibility in a situation that nobody knows what will happen. You want competitive teams that have full starting lineups. Any way you can do that in a situation that is non injury and funky the better for the entire league.
The problem with that is it completely changes the entire format of the league. It is a good solution to the possible issues but if this is only one or two weeks of uncertainty you are changing the entire structure of the league. I would think for most people that would be a hurdle to overcome.
FairWarning
Footballguy
Yes, that was a concern. We threw around a lot of ideas, from that to how long is an official season.
Yeah I agree that could work. I guess my thinking is that every game is technically up in the air because of covid. If this "backup" work around is being rolled out in your leagues I would mention to your owners that they can designate backups for all their starters if they want to be covered in case covid impacts a starters game.
barackdhouse
Footballguy
Wow that is a big plus then. I didn't realize they were tracing like that. If true, and I have no reason to doubt it, I feel much better about the chances of them containing these mini outbreaks.
Stoneworker
Footballguy
Please. Lots of leagues have $ involved and care about fair outcomes.Because some of our leagues have
1. $$$ involved
2. Care about having the most fair outcomes.
If someone's 1st round pick has a game unexpectedly turned into a BYE by the league at the last minute, that's injury enough. No need to add insult to that injury by not providing a contingency for a replacement player.
There are degrees of fairness. If it is possible to provide a solution to increase the amount of fairness, why wouldn't I? I see that as part of my job as commish. It won't take that much effort to make the swaps. If I can't be bothered to spend 30 mins on that, then I shouldn't be commish.
Adding bench spots gives teams a consistent amount of currency to take their own approach to adapting and adjusting whatever unpredictable situation comes along. As opposed to adapting and adjusting the league rules a different way potentially each week.
Your way is fine. It's just that at the end of the day it's doubtful it will move the fairness needle one bit.
Not a big deal.
barackdhouse
Footballguy
I brought it up in my league months ago and got crickets@Gally gets 100% of the credit for this one. It's a great idea.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
It won't move the "fairness needle" one bit?
Having a player with a zero for a last min cancellation is the same fairness as allowing a contingency plan for the teams in my league to replace that player, as if they knew in advance it would be cancelled?
You and I define fairness very differently.
Stoneworker
Footballguy
Relative to a league that adds additional bench spots and lets teams adapt and adjust on their own.
Clearly you're on a mission. It's a noble effort. Carry on.
barackdhouse
Footballguy
Agreed. I think some people haven't fully realized the likelihood of games getting postponed past the present week. I want to institute a substitute in case of postponement thread in my league but not sure I have it together to run that PR campaign right now before tomorrow's kickoff. 96 team league. 73 unique owners. ####show.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Yeah, that's a much more difficult proposition.
I am hoping to at least mitigate for the 11 other owners in my league (and myself, since I have JJSS), and trying to do so with the understanding that this may not be an isolated incident. it's a long season and a raging pandemic. This may not be the only game this happens to. Any solution has to come with an understanding that precedent is being set.
I think the option we're going to try can be applied at any time this comes up during the season, so I'm gonna go ahead with it.
barackdhouse
Footballguy
Yeah I actually feel halfway decent about the chances for this week to happen, but this is definitely a wake up call in case it doesn't. And could again.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
That is simply a lazy means of handling it, and moreover one that fails to address the problem at hand. Lots of leagues added additional bench spots as a contingency for players getting COVID. That does absolutely nothing for a game cancellation.
These are two entirely different situations, and one size most definitely does not fit all when it comes to the solution. Bench spots are fine if you have a player out, you know they'll be out, and that team can make a necessary roster adjustment.
Here we are discussing the potential for an entire game's cancellation where 2 teams could have every player out. Moreover it could come after a move of the game time, and then to the day of game with no notice. That's a unique problem and requires a little more creativity to resolve.
If your resolution for your league is "do nothing, tough luck, life is unfair", and your league is ok with it, then good for your league. For my league that's simply not good enough.
Wut
I'm saying what I'm doing for my league. I don't know what "mission" you think I'm on. It's a discussion about a game cancellation and I, and other commishes are spit-balling ideas for solutions. And I believe it would be unfair for teams in my league to lose a player or players (we are IDP and have 16 active roster spots) because of a late game cancellation.
Again: if we knew today that a Sunday or Monday game was going to be cancelled that's one thing. But we don't. All we know is that it's been postponed, maybe to MNF, and maybe to TuNF and maybe to another week altogether. The latter of which is the worst case scenario, and essentially punishes teams for having Steelers or Titans. Unprecedented situations sometimes call for a little extra effort.
You're welcome to disagree, but I have no idea how this constitutes my being on "a mission" to do anything but seek a fair outcome for the league for which I am responsible.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Better to have a plan and not need it than to need a plan and not have it.
~Ancient Project Management Proverb
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Anyone have any idea what the TV situation will be for a Monday or Tuesday game?
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
A cluster, I'm sure. First, I'm gonna have to set my DVR to record Golden Girls, and then....
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