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PONDER vs SUH AND FAIRLEY (1 Viewer)
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hutchins929
Footballguy
I am actually grinning from ear to ear as a Lions fan right now! This is gonna be fun to watch!
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Has that sentence been typed in the past 50 years?
sihaokills
Footballguy
Wow this will be fun
RobertBobson
Footballguy
As a bears fans, pick 12 and 13 were an emotional roller coaster. the thrill of victory, watching the Vikings officially squander their window by taking ponder, and the agony of defeat, as I cringe in horror at the thought of what the Lions are going to do to the porous interior of the bears line. I'm also a Nebraska fan, and Suh is basically my favorite husker since Frazier, so its already heart breaking to have him in Detroit. But now, having him matched with Fairley. I joked with a friend a few months ago " God, it would be sick if he Fairley fell to the lions at 6. But no chance he falls that far".
Joke's on me.
At least I can take solace in the fact that the vikings are set back for the next decade.
Joke's on me.
At least I can take solace in the fact that the vikings are set back for the next decade.
shader
Footballguy
Cmon man cut the Lions some slack. Let the kid brother come out and play with the big boys for awhile.
Let's maybe wait till Fairley has played a snap before anointing anyone best anything. An interesting pick, and worthy of the buzz, to be sure.
hutchins929
Footballguy
I think that offensive coordinators are shaking in their boots right now. Just the thought of that Line... WOW! They won't be able to stop all of them or run on them. I predict a Lot of screens against the Lions next year.
TheFanatic
Footballguy
Every QB in the NFC North winced noticeably when the Lions picked Fairley. I love the pick. Fairley has some maturity and work ethic issues, but I think that Suh and Vanden Bosch beat some drive into the kid. That D-Line is going to be sick. For the first time in years I might actually care about both teams in the early Thanksgiving day game!?!
pollardsvision
Footballguy
Yeah, I think that's one of the most intriguing aspects of the pick. Much of the risk that Fairley might've been on other teams might be negated as a Lion.Asking this kid to be the savior of a terrible defensive line with no leadership sounds like a big risk.
I can't imagine a better situation to get the most out of Fairley than with the Lions (that sounds so strange). This should be fun.
hutchins929
Footballguy
Hipple Long Ware & Peete
Footballguy
(tears of joy)
Football Critic
Footballguy
A lot of people sayin it sounds strange to say the Lions will be good.
They went 6 n 10 without their stud QB or any Stud RB, and no secondary for most the season Dont be so surprised at what a great Dline can do for you, and now add a guy with a butt load of talent, gees. I know he hasnt played a down, but at this point we are only going of talent and upside.
The offense is already a young and talented group, expect a strong showing in FA of people who see what direction the Lions are in. Dare I say it, NNamdi and a solid vet LB? If that happened, I'd say it without hesitation "Lions would have the best D in the NFL"...I expect a playoff run for the Lie-downs this year.
They went 6 n 10 without their stud QB or any Stud RB, and no secondary for most the season Dont be so surprised at what a great Dline can do for you, and now add a guy with a butt load of talent, gees. I know he hasnt played a down, but at this point we are only going of talent and upside.
The offense is already a young and talented group, expect a strong showing in FA of people who see what direction the Lions are in. Dare I say it, NNamdi and a solid vet LB? If that happened, I'd say it without hesitation "Lions would have the best D in the NFL"...I expect a playoff run for the Lie-downs this year.
az_prof
Footballguy
Actually, it is typed almost every year. And almost every year it is disappointed. As a Viking's fan, let's just say that I can count on one hand how many times I remember the Lions beating us. And every year people project them to "break out" because there has to be a bad team break out and people always want it to be the Lions. Maybe this year they finally get lucky, but I wouldn't count on it.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
It takes a little more than two good interior linemen to make a good defense. The Vikes have had a pretty good pair themselves the last few years, and while their run defense has been pretty good their pass defense has been their achille's heel resulting in a very average total defense. And the Lions' secondary is much, much worse than the poor Vikings' secondary has been.
Not to say it wasn't the right pick for the Lions to make though.
Not to say it wasn't the right pick for the Lions to make though.
I wouldn't say typed.. but Jon Kitna said it pretty much every year he was on the team.. "10 wins", "10 wins", "10 wins"..
why are the vikings set back for the next decade?
Drafting Billy Sims and Barry Sanders were about the only other times the Lions were that interesting.
remote controller
Footballguy
As a Packer fan the Fairley pick didn't bother me at all. Since they still can't cover, the quick read from Rodgers to Jennings will give him and Suh a seat on the bench. I'm not knocking the pick as being a terrible waste, it was a gift from the Gods, but picking Prince would have gotten them one step closer to competing with the Packers.
hutchins929
Footballguy
Didn't Aaron Rodgers end up with a concussion when the champs played the Lions last year. It's a little hard to complete too many passes when your getting knocked out of the game.I agree that quick passes and screens are the only way people will have success against this defense right now. It depends though on what happens in FA. If they get themselves a LB and CB that don't try to arm tackle they'll be fine excellent.
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Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Not to be Debbie Downer here, but you Lions fans are assuming your LBs and CBs will look better with Suh and Fairley crushing the pocket. That's correct, in theory. But it's based on the assumption that Fairley will live up to expectations. Here are just a few D-lineman over just the previous ten drafts who were total busts, and were drafted at the same spot or higher than Fairley:
Tyson Jackson (1.03 - 2009)
Aaron Maybin (1.11 - 2009)
Glenn Dorsey (1.05 - 2008)
Vernon Gholston (1.06 - 2008)
Derrick Harvey (1.08 - 2008)
Gaines Adams (1.04 - 2007) ... RIP
Jamaal Anderson (1.08 - 2007)
Adam Carriker (1.13 - 2007)
Johnathan Sullivan (1.06 - 2003)
Jimmy Kennedy (1.12 - 2003)
Ryan Sims (1.06 - 2002)
Wendell Bryant (1.12 - 2002)
Gerard Warren (1.03 - 2001)
Jamal Reynolds (1.10 - 2001)
Damione Lewis (1.12 - 2001)
Courtney Brown (1.01 - 2000)
Statistically speaking, there is a far greater chance Fairley will be a bust rather than be a great player.
Tyson Jackson (1.03 - 2009)
Aaron Maybin (1.11 - 2009)
Glenn Dorsey (1.05 - 2008)
Vernon Gholston (1.06 - 2008)
Derrick Harvey (1.08 - 2008)
Gaines Adams (1.04 - 2007) ... RIP
Jamaal Anderson (1.08 - 2007)
Adam Carriker (1.13 - 2007)
Johnathan Sullivan (1.06 - 2003)
Jimmy Kennedy (1.12 - 2003)
Ryan Sims (1.06 - 2002)
Wendell Bryant (1.12 - 2002)
Gerard Warren (1.03 - 2001)
Jamal Reynolds (1.10 - 2001)
Damione Lewis (1.12 - 2001)
Courtney Brown (1.01 - 2000)
Statistically speaking, there is a far greater chance Fairley will be a bust rather than be a great player.
cobalt_27
Footballguy
Sure. We could do this for every position in the draft.Bottom line, as it looks right now that looks like a monster front, and I'm bullish on the Lions with what they've done to rebuild this team in just a few short years.
Football Critic
Footballguy
Plus Fairley was took at 13, that matches the lowest spot on your chart thingy. So I like his chances as Suh was took at 2 and is an ungawdly beast.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
The fact that he was took at 13 only bolsters my argument. The expectations for those other guys were actually higher. Regardless, the D-line position carries with it one of the highest bust rates for whatever reason.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
I'm pretty sure it was typed about 100 times after the draft where the Lions added Roy W and KJ to Charles Rogers from the year (or was it two years?) before.Just goes to show you how things can work out.1st round DTs bust a monumental amount of the time. The chances that the Lions end up with stud DTs in back to back years are way to low for people to be this excited about it. Of course, the potential is there, but Lions fans are treating this like it's a done deal when it's MUCH more likely to be the total opposite.
remote controller
Footballguy
Nice try! lol!
"Rodgers decided to take off straight up the middle on a passing play and gained a good chunk of yards before two Detroit defenders – linebacker Landon Johnson and S Amari Spievey – hit him simultaneously. Rodgers was dazed and confused when he got up to return to the huddle." http://helmet2helmet.net/2010/12/12/aaron-rodgers-sustains-concussion/
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FantasyTrader
Footballguy
I would disagree with this. You have to build from the interior out. Denver is a prime example of how inept a defense can be with a Pro Bowl lock down corner when you can't rush the passer. It all begins with the interior and the ability to limit opponent's success in the running game. When you do that, you put your average (or below average) CB's in position to succeed. Or at least compete. Prince is the guy you add to take your "very good" defense over the top. The Lions aren't there yet.
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GridironMenace
Footballguy
Don't worry, the Bears are right behind. The Bears are old and aren't going to get all those breaks they got last year, moving forward.
smackdaddies
Footballguy
I like the pick. I think you have to have the D Line to match your defensive style. If your going to suck in the secondary, your front four better be able to play. I thought the Lions were a good team last year, will be better this year. Not sure they make the playoffs, but could. Vikes and Bears didn't impress me much with thier draft, and I think the Packer draft was ok. Of course getting 15 guys off the IR is better than any draft.
RobertBobson
Footballguy
Well, not specifically because of the draft, but their window is coming to a close, and I think Ponder is a terrible pick, and a best will be chad peddington. I could be wrong, but I think it's going to be a long time before the vikes contend again'cvnpoka said:
I agree completely that the bears were lucky last year, that they were essentially an average team that got a couple lucky breaks and finished 11-5. There are usually 2-4 teams in the playoffs every year that fit that profile, and only a few that sustain elite playoff contention year after year, like the Colts, Steelers, Patriots, Packers.I do think you're also right, that the bears defensively are old, and are going to need to retool in order to sustain contention. Right now, I would trade my entire roster for the lions, and feel better about the next 5 years. However, the bears have one thing that the Vikings do not, that will keep them no worse than average, and allow them to make periodic playoff runs (a the very least), and that's a franchise quarterback. I am still a cutler believer, unlike many bears fans, and i am very glad that we have a young QB entering his physical prime.
RobertBobson
Footballguy
Well, not specifically because of the draft, but their window is coming to a close, and I think Ponder is a terrible pick, and a best will be chad peddington. I could be wrong, but I think it's going to be a long time before the vikes contend again'cvnpoka said:
I agree completely that the bears were lucky last year, that they were essentially an average team that got a couple lucky breaks and finished 11-5. There are usually 2-4 teams in the playoffs every year that fit that profile, and only a few that sustain elite playoff contention year after year, like the Colts, Steelers, Patriots, Packers.I do think you're also right, that the bears defensively are old, and are going to need to retool in order to sustain contention. Right now, I would trade my entire roster for the lions, and feel better about the next 5 years. However, the bears have one thing that the Vikings do not, that will keep them no worse than average, and allow them to make periodic playoff runs (a the very least), and that's a franchise quarterback. I am still a cutler believer, unlike many bears fans, and i am very glad that we have a young QB entering his physical prime.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
Rumor has it that Chad Peddington is an excellent QB.
RobertBobson
Footballguy
Yeah, he's exactly where I'd what my QB's ceiling to be.Rumor has it that Chad Peddington is an excellent QB.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
'TheWick said:
Phlash
Footballguy
If he could have stayed healthy, he would've been a championship QB imo. Guy could pick apart defenses in a Manning-esque manner. Not having the strongest arm didn't hold him back from doing insane things.Yeah, he's exactly where I'd what my QB's ceiling to be.Rumor has it that Chad Peddington is an excellent QB.
Yeah...those Jaguar teams were just brutal!!!!
You Lions lovers are cracked!!! The Vikings and Bears are both teams that are filled with probowlers...the Lions? Not so many probowlers on that team.
Unless of course, you are talking about imaginary/bizarro world pro bowl players!!! In that case, the Lions are brimming with incredible talent and will be knocking on the NFC championship door!!!
Lets get something straight. Do not look at a teams schedule and assume that a close game means you could have or should have won. You can look at every team in the league and point out a few games where they might have won had they played just a wee bit better. The Lions do not belong in some special category that extrapolates them out to 10 wins if Stafford would have played....the fact is that he didn't, he was injured because his shoulder is made of glass. Guess what? There will be injuries next year too. Every team has them. Have fun with your five draft picks next year!!! That is how a real championship team does itYou are going to havwe amazing depth. Five picks! LOL.
Seriously. Good luck to you. I am sure it must have been exhilerating to get those 6 wins last year after losing 20 something in a row, but lets be serious. I am a Packers fan, and that is a team with superlative depth. You are nowhere close. Nowhere. As far as the Vikings and Bears go, I am way more fearful to play either of those teams than I am to play your team, the Bears have tough players in all three facets of the game, the Vikings are similar. Is Ponder going to bust? Who knows? Just like we should not assume that Fairley is going to be anything special. If I were a betting man, I would say he is going to stink seeing that he was a one year wonder. Just to let you know, there are not many one year college wonders that amount to much in the NFL. Just telling you like it is. Sorry.
Unless of course, you are talking about imaginary/bizarro world pro bowl players!!! In that case, the Lions are brimming with incredible talent and will be knocking on the NFC championship door!!!
Lets get something straight. Do not look at a teams schedule and assume that a close game means you could have or should have won. You can look at every team in the league and point out a few games where they might have won had they played just a wee bit better. The Lions do not belong in some special category that extrapolates them out to 10 wins if Stafford would have played....the fact is that he didn't, he was injured because his shoulder is made of glass. Guess what? There will be injuries next year too. Every team has them. Have fun with your five draft picks next year!!! That is how a real championship team does itYou are going to havwe amazing depth. Five picks! LOL.
Seriously. Good luck to you. I am sure it must have been exhilerating to get those 6 wins last year after losing 20 something in a row, but lets be serious. I am a Packers fan, and that is a team with superlative depth. You are nowhere close. Nowhere. As far as the Vikings and Bears go, I am way more fearful to play either of those teams than I am to play your team, the Bears have tough players in all three facets of the game, the Vikings are similar. Is Ponder going to bust? Who knows? Just like we should not assume that Fairley is going to be anything special. If I were a betting man, I would say he is going to stink seeing that he was a one year wonder. Just to let you know, there are not many one year college wonders that amount to much in the NFL. Just telling you like it is. Sorry.
Chicago Hooligan
Footballguy
The Vikings are certainly loaded with Pro Bowl third-alternates.
hutchins929
Footballguy
They beat your Super Bowl Packers with a Back up QB, a banged up running back and a below average secondary. Even with all of that they Beat the Packers, Vikings, Bears* and finished ahead of the Vikes in the division. The Lions aren't gonna win the Super Bowl or anything this year, but they are definitely on the rise. If I had the choice, I'd rather have the Lions roster right now over the Vikings or the Bears. They still have time to make some key additions in FA also. I think the Lions will be a place that players will be attracted to playing, unlike in years past. They can see as well as a lot of other people that they (DET) are getting close and are on the right track. I wouldn't be surprised at all if they landed Nnamdi Asomugha. *they didn't technically beat the Bears but we all know they really did.'meatwad1 said:
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Yeah. But those free agents would also realize they have to live in Detroit in order to play there.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
And who was Green Bay's QB for most of that game?
hutchins929
Footballguy
This is true but does that stop people from playing in NE, NY, PIT, GB, MIN All of those places get cold. Ford Field might be in DET... But it's Ford Field, newer stadium with amazing facilities and it's a dome. So they wouldn't be playing in it (the cold).Yeah. But those free agents would also realize they have to live in Detroit in order to play there.
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Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
It's not the cold that's the problem. And Ford Field is like lipstick on a pig.This is true but does that stop people from playing in NE, NY, PIT, GB, MIN All of those places get cold. Ford Field might be in DET... But it's Ford Field, newer stadium with amazing facilities and it's a dome. So they wouldn't be playing in it.Yeah. But those free agents would also realize they have to live in Detroit in order to play there.
hutchins929
Footballguy
Aaron Rodgers was knocked out of the game yes... That is part of my point though. The Lions defense put his ### on the bench!
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Let's not get so dramatic. It was a routine tackle and Rodgers' own momentum caused him to bang his head on the turf.
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