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Hey aaron,I agree with you in that Bailey is still the best corner in the NFL by most people's accounts, so being overrated is a tough label to accept. And $6 million per year is more than fair for a starting CB, let alone the best in the bunch.While CB is NOT the 2nd highest paid position (that would be the O-line), it's the fourth and the franchise tender is $6.8 million (which is the average of the highest 5 CBs in the league), while the transition tender is $5.7 million (the top 10 contracts). Cheers
I just don't think because a guy wants what he's worth that makes him any less valuable. As far as McAllister and Alexander, McAllister was a first rounder and I don't remember where Alexander went, but he sat behind Watters and definately wasn't ROY. Crumpler only made it to the pro bowl because Shockey was hurt, and if Boldin is top 10 in receiving again this year he'll probably want more money next. I don't think if fair to say he's not anymore of a team guy then any other NFL player that wants more money. I don't agree with it, but unfortuanaltly players aren't in it for the fun of it anymore. Its all about who can pay them the most.
They might because Portis' cap number is alot more friendly. They really handcuffed themselves by franchising Bailey, cap wise anyway.
I'll preface this by saying that I don't think there's a cover corner in the league right now who truly distinguishes himself from his peers by so much that I'd consider him franchise worthy. With that said, I'm not sure Bailey is the best CB in the league. Admittedly, I'm probably biased from seeing so much of him, so I can remember every time he's been beat, but he's had plenty of bad games. Amani Toomer beat him like a rented mule in the first Giants game. Steve Smith burned him on a fly pattern to essentially win the Panthers game (OK, I thought Smith pushed off, but still).Despite it being Champ's contract year, I thought he was the 2nd best CB on the Redskins last year. Smoot picked up his game (and I was very hard on Fred in his first two years) while Bailey regressed. And Bailey has NEVER been a good tackler. Bobby Taylor is no match for Bailey as a cover corner, but when you factor in his run support, I'm not sure I wouldn't rather have him and help him with coverage schemes.I realize that Clinton's contract demands are the wild card here. But I just think he's one of the 5 most special players in the league right now. Denver's scheme is great, but Portis' talent just POPS everytime I see him. He's a guy who passes the looks test and the stats test. Considering Gibbs only has 3-4 years to get this done, I'd rather go into cap jail to let him do it his way. A talented running back behind a big offensive line with a steady, mistake-free QB sounds awfully enticing to me.But hey, it's the off-season. The Skins always win the off-season.EDIT: Last year, at least, Chris McAllister was the best cover CB in the NFL.
No, but they have an excellant scheme and it doesn't matter who they plug in it still works. If the Wash line is so great how come they couldn't run behind it? Is it a pass blocking O-line?
I thought so too. I didn't even pay attention to the Portis for Bailey rumor thread because I thought it was absurd. But ESPN is reporting this one with plenty of independent confirmation of the Denver Post story. Something is definitely up.
Only difference between this one and the others (i.e., Seattle) is that it's getting major run from legit sources. Lenny P says it has real legs and quotes NFL execs on the matter. He's not saying it will happen because deals like this are always tricky to pull off, but there's no question that this deal is actively being negotiated; big difference between that and yet another "rumor".Cheers
Warning "hijack alert"Hey Herd, you sure Oakland is going to take Fitzgerald? As an Oakland fan, I am still holding out hope that they will take whichever QB doesn't go to SD, assuming they decide Brees isnt the guy.
My mistake. I knew CB was up near the top, but I guess I went a little too high.But, out of 11 different position groupings, CB was the eighth-best paid in '93 and now it's the fourth best paid. AND, if you consider the fact that Sam Madison made $7M last year, then one could make the argument that Bailey is easily worth almost whatever price he asks for.WRs have jumped up from 5th highest paid in 1993 to 2nd highest now.Here are the salary rankings by position:1. Quarterback2. Wide receiver3. Offensive line4. Cornerback5. Defensive end6. Linebacker7. Defensive tackle8. Running back9. Safety10. Tight end11. Punters and kickersRB sure seems pretty far down the list for a guy like Portis to bring back the #1 CB and a high 2nd rounder in a very deep draft.
Of course, they may trade Ramsey for a late 1st. And at least one of their RBs would probably become expendable for a mid-rounder. I could see Betts fetching a 3rd rounder.
consider that Stephen Davis ran very well behind Samuels, Jansen, et al.the problem with the OL (and I can't believe this needs to be continually pointed out to "sharks") was with the scheme run by the OBC (and his yes-man-lacky-buffoon-no-business-coaching-in-the-NFL-OL coach, Kim Helton). it wasn't injuries or lack of talent. it was Ransey "running" for his life because of a scheme that cannot work on the professional level. period.but don't listen to me. just wait to see how Gibbs & Bugel do with the exact same personnel.
ortis or not, the Skins will be making a major upgrade at RB, and will be a very sought after commodity in fantasy land. After all this, I can't imagine it will be retread like Staley or Garner.there will be RBs available in the 3rd and 4th round of the draft this year that have more value than Ladell Betts, and I'm a Betts fan. He's 2 years into the league at this point and I think his value has probably dropped off more than just a single round since he got drafted.
:Hijack response:1. I've been saying Fitz to the Raiders since he declared, and I see no reason to change that prediction now. I think he's the kind of guy that Al would love to have and sharing the field with Rice for a season would be invaluable experience. However, the bigger reason I think Al is taking Fitz is....2. When was the last time the Raiders drafted, groomed, and started a young QB who was their own investment? I can't think of the answer off the top of my head, which leads me to believe the Raiders haven't groomed a QB of their own in some time. HERD
I don't know. Czabe likes Champ way more than I do (although I agree that the Skins overpaid on LaVar, at least considering his performance to date).Andy will be drinking the Kool Aid, though. He didn't even have any doubts about the Brunell signing (which I think makes a TON more sense if they land an elite RB).Hey, Scooby, what will Czaban say about this one?
I'm skeptical as well however, this is the coach that replaced Terrel Davis with Orlandis Gary and people said it wasn't comparable. Then when Gary went down he plugged in Mike Anderson and everyone said he was insane. I think Shanahan is overrated in many areas but I think he's got a very good grasp of who will work in his running system.
Perhaps, but neither Gary nor Anderson put up Portis' numbers. And while Griffin looked good in spot duty, it's real hard to see him maintaining that productivity for a whole season (let alone a career). So to suggest that the Broncos have guys on their roster who they can obviously just plug in and be as good as Portis is kind of silly.Anderson's best year:2000 den | 14 | 297 1500 5.1 15 | 23 169 7.3 0 Gary's best year:1999 den | 12 | 276 1159 4.2 7 | 21 159 7.6 0Portis:2002 den | 16 | 273 1508 5.5 15 | 33 364 11.0 2 || 2003 den | 13 | 290 1591 5.5 14 | 38 314 8.3 0
Yep, since he might get hurt, which is something that NEVER happens to Portis...(Just making a joke, no need to reply.
)HERDGiven Shanny's history of being able to get great RB's out of later draft picks, I wouldn't be surprised to see that second rounder they get from the skins (or a later pick of their own) turn into one of the 3rd tier RB's.This is a pretty deep draft at RB, and if the Broncos snag someone in the 2nd -4th rounds, it will make for some interesting decisions on dynasty draft day.
Actually, that's partly what I'm getting at. Many folks are arguing that one reason Portis is expendable is because he's fragile. And then they have Denver replacing him with Q. That doesn't seem to make a lot of sense.Yep, since he might get hurt, which is something that NEVER happens to Portis...(Just making a joke, no need to reply.
I'm not saying he will, I'm just saying Shanahan has been questioned before at this position and has always come out smelling like Roses.Anyway, to do the projection thing and give Gary and Anderson 16 games on their 12 and 14 game season their numbers are VERY impressive. Sure Portis' projects out close to 2000 yards if he starts all 16 games in his two season but 1500 and 1700 yards are nothing to sneeze at.2000 den | 14 | 297 1500 5.1 15 | 23 169 7.3 0 16 game projection: 1714 yardsGary's best year:1999 den | 12 | 276 1159 4.2 7 | 21 159 7.6 016 game projection: 1545 yards
Hmmm . . .Clinton Portis vs. Duce Staley . . . Close one . . .
o you upgrade or downgrade Portis?You'd have to downgrade him at least a little. When healthy, he was a monster in Denver who did everything including getting goal lines. He also had a fantastic OL. Whether or not the Redskins line will improve or not, is unknown. A lot is unknown because Gibbs is back and we, as fantasy owners, aren't familiar with his style. Portis will always be talented and always be a good back but he is really going into an unknown situation from a great situation. Downgrade for the time being.....
I don't see how anyone could possibly upgrade him here. For the time being I would say a 10-15% downgrade (which is still studly) but it will bear watching and could be easily be a wash depending on what Gibbs does.Bottom line
Thats been at least a decade hasn't it? HERD
Betts was a reach when the Redskins drafted him. Many thought he would be around in the mid 3rd round (sorry, no links, just off memory).Betts looks a little limited right now. Gibbs has said he would be a good 3rd down back. I interpreted that to mean they are definately NOT looking at him as the feature back. Also consider: All Redskin rbs last year were knock on poor pass blocking, although you could possibly attribute that to Spurrier. Betts also was slow picking up Spurrier's offense, being inactive a lot in his rookier year so an undrafted rookie, Kenny Watson, could get some playing time. Finally, Betts also does not play special teams (he may play some as the 2nd return man on kickoffs).Bottom line: if Betts does not excel at being a 3rd down back, his career could be quite short.
The unpopular answer: big time downgrade.The reasoning:1. In Denver, Portis' role is known and clear cut. He sees the ball early and often, goal line, and passing downs. Great situation. Any change in Washington rates to be a reduction, not an increase.2. If you look at Gibbs history, he gets other rbs into the action a lot. Riggins has Joe Washington go in on 3rd downs. Gerald Riggs had Ernest Byner play 3rd downs. Kelvin Bryant got a lot of action for a couple of years. Unless Portis excels in every aspect of the game and Gibbs does not see a need to get another rb some action (say for experience), then Portis will be on the sidelines on some occaisions.3. With Gibbs, Bugel, Brunell, Portis, this is a very different Redskin team than last year. More than likely, it will take time for them the gel. Is that 3 games or half a season? Who knows, but that gelling/developing chemistry time rates to cut into the numbers.Bottom line
I'm sure I'm in the minority, but I might actually upgrade him. Yes, Denver is one of the best RB-friendly systems we've ever seen, but here's what I didn't like about the way Portis was used. It seemed like Shanahan had one running play....one. I'm sure they have more, but I can't remember seeing them. I don't even know what they call it. It's almost a dive play between the guard and tackle. I noticed it more and more last year as the season went on, they never called anything different. No sweeps, no draws, no counters, nothing else. Obviously he's made a living off that play and it works, but it boggled my mind how they never deviated from it. It doesn't seem to give the back much chance to make people miss behind the line. Either the hole is there or it's not. Of course, with Denver's line, it was quite often there.They also didn't use Portis much as a receiver, although I wouldn't expect that to increase with Gibbs.Gibbs is certainly a wild card, but with his dedication to the run in years past, and the thought of Portis running counter-gap and counter-trey, I'm not so sure it's a downgrade. Of course I could be 100% wrong here.I don't see how anyone could possibly upgrade him here. For the time being I would say a 10-15% downgrade (which is still studly) but it will bear watching and could be easily be a wash depending on what Gibbs does.Bottom line
Gibbs is selling his vision and finding people to who will buy into it. Gibbs probably told Brunell that they were going to make a big upgrade at rb.Mark Brunell must be pinching himself. 1) He goes from being the #3 QB in JAX to the probable #1 in WAS.2) He gets a new $43 million contract with an $8.6 million signing bonus.3) He's going to play for one of the best coaches ever.4) He's going to be handing off to Clinton Portis.Life is good.
