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QB Caleb Williams, CHI (1 Viewer)
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Hankmoody
Footballguy
Fantasy-wise he's far and away my #1. He's the first QB I have ever put into a top 10 spot for my 1QB league.
socrates
Footballguy
I agree that Williams is the #1 QB prospect, but first QB in your top 10? I personally have had several, including (off the top of my head) Trevor Lawrence, Kyler Murray, Andrew Luck and RG3
Not all one QB leagues are similar because of roster size but RG3 was my highest rated in-coming rookie QB for fantasy I have ever had and I've not seen one I'd use a first round pick pick on since the year he and Luck came out. That year was almost my first year to ever be in a rookie dynasty draft and I did not pick any of them but I did have them inside my top 12.
The highest I've ever drafted a rookie QB in the rookie/FA draft was Kyler at 2.3, in what was a weak draft. Kyler is in fact the only in-coming rookie QB I have ever used a top two round pick on, and took him 3X that year but again a lot of that had to do with that was a weak draft so I laid up for the more or less sure thing.
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Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
NFL Rookie Watch
@NFLRookieWatxh
Multiple NFL scouts and coaches reportedly believe Caleb Williams is “miles” ahead of any QB in this year’s NFL Draft.
Many scouts believe Williams is the “closest” a prospect has been to Patrick Mahomes since Mahomes was drafted.
Many coaches and evaluators believe Williams would “easily” be this year’s first overall pick.
Williams has one year left at USC before he is able to declare for the Draft
Chaka
Footballguy
The Shark move is to start tanking in June then you won't need to worry about perceptions in December.
Y'know, like cutting your best players before minicamp. Looking at you Arizona. Letting a solid QB go in favor of a solid QB with a busted foot is a power move Las Vegas.
By the time December rolls around everyone will expect those teams to suck.
"Suck for Caleb" doesn't ring as a great ad slogan like "Suck for Luck" (Balin' for Caleb? Wishin' for Williams?
) but I would be willing to endure a season of hardship if it means he ends up in Silver and Black next season.
Y'know, like cutting your best players before minicamp. Looking at you Arizona. Letting a solid QB go in favor of a solid QB with a busted foot is a power move Las Vegas.
By the time December rolls around everyone will expect those teams to suck.
"Suck for Caleb" doesn't ring as a great ad slogan like "Suck for Luck" (Balin' for Caleb? Wishin' for Williams?
) but I would be willing to endure a season of hardship if it means he ends up in Silver and Black next season.
Wigglytuff's Gruff
Footballguy
Collapse for Caleb
Colluding for Caleb.The Shark move is to start tanking in June then you won't need to worry about perceptions in December.
Y'know, like cutting your best players before minicamp. Looking at you Arizona. Letting a solid QB go in favor of a solid QB with a busted foot is a power move Las Vegas.
By the time December rolls around everyone will expect those teams to suck.
"Suck for Caleb" doesn't ring as a great ad slogan like "Suck for Luck" (Balin' for Caleb? Wishin' for Williams?
-jb-
Footballguy
My dynasty QBs suck and I have this years 1.01. Really can’t decide if I draft Bijan or Richardson, then hope I can Collapse for Caleb in order to get the 1.01 again next year. Not sure which option puts me in a “better” position to do so, but it’s definitely part of the decision process. Sigh.
Chaka
Footballguy
Absolutely!
The problem is the NFL is such a QB driven league that you have to take shots at landing a potential 10+ year All Pro/Face-of-the-Franchise. It's not impossible to compete without one of those guys but it sure makes the job a lot easier. So if you have the opportunity (or create the opportunity) you are obliged to go all-in on it. Your Colts took that shot this year. I know you disagree with that move but IMO it was 100% the correct decision. They weren't going anywhere with Minshew and they tried the rent-a-vet dance for five years. So they took the risk and good for them. If he had fallen to the Raiders I would have loved to grab him. I would have loved to trade up from 7 to 4 just to get him.
If you take the chance and the guy flops you are no worse off than you were when you were in the position to get that guy in the first place. I guess you could argue the rent-a-vet plan. Personally, I hate that strategy. Good on the Rams & Bucs for succeeding for one year on that plan. I would rather be truly competitive for a decade than to take a shot on a one year plan and hope for a ring followed by a long rebuild. But YMMV.
Using the Raiders as a current example how far will they get over the next few seasons with some combination of Garoppolo & Aiden O'Connell? What's the plan after that? But, if they manage to have built a decent core on defense and offense (and I think they may have) then plugging in a true franchise QB probably makes them highly competitive for a good long time. Certainly more so than they will with their current QB room.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
I was speaking from a fantasy perspective.
Chaka
Footballguy
From that perspective the Colts got the best option by an order of magnitude. Even if he ends up being a disaster from an NFL perspective, Richardson can move like very few others. He's 6'4" Vick/Lamar. He's going to be a fantasy darling.
Caleb Williams can also move and that will give him immediate fantasy value, but for pure fantasy purposes, Richardson is the deal of the century.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Jameis Winston's numbers in his Heisman and National Championship season are almost identical to what Caleb Williams just did at USC. JW's walk year was not as impressive. We'll see if Caleb can follow up that great Heisman season with another. Seems like we always identify the shiny new toy a little early and then these guys go from having an enormous talent advantage around them in college to an enormous deficit in the NFL, and they aren't so shiny.
Chaka
Footballguy
I don't see that comp at all. Jameis was always reckless with the ball. He benefitted a lot from that as a freshman at FSU putting up low % balls to the gigantic Kelvin Benjamin. But in his Heisman year he had 10 INTs (18 the following year
sans Benjamin). He had a 3.2% INT rate at FSU on 851 passes, Williams has a 1.2% rate on 711 attempts, with 9 INTs total in two seasons.Jameis's production fluctuated wildly between his FR & SO years, Williams FR & SO seasons are virtually mirror images.
The end of season Heisman numbers may look a little similar if you squint, but how they got there is wildly different.
Chaka
Footballguy
Okay Joel, no pressure.
massraider
Footballguy
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Highlights.
Obviously tough to live up to this hype, which is Andrew Luck levels.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
I've watched his highlights and tuned in to a few games last year. Looking forward to seeing if he can repeat it this year with all the pressure/hype. If he looks that way again and the Bucs start slow I'll be rooting for the #1 overall like most any other fan of a bad team. All I'm saying is Jameis also had that kind of a season in his Heisman year, the Bucs tanked for him, and then endured 5 years of misery.- YouTube
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Highlights.
Obviously tough to live up to this hype, which is Andrew Luck levels.
People saying Caleb is a more refined Mahomes? Tap the breaks.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Also, there are several high end QB prospects coming out this year. There's a better than zero chance one of those guys ends up being the better QB of the class, or at minimum having a better career, simply due to being drafted later and subsequently going to a better franchise/organization. Similar to Roethlisberger/Rodgers.
massraider
Footballguy
Does a ton of stuff in those highlights that seem like bad ideas that he got away with. Like, most of these highlights are questionable throws, off balance, etc.
But if a guy just has that thing, whatever that thing is? Feel like this is what it looks like.
I am with you, remains to be seen. People want the next greatest thing EVER. He might just be a really good prospect.
I really like that you don't see panic in his game, because that seems like one of those innate things. Really good QBs today have panic in their game (coughCarrcough). Mahomes, his first playoff game, on the sideline he looked like he was at a golf tournament. So relaxed. Caleb looks like that, like he expects everything he does to turn out right, because it has so far I imagine.
Chaka
Footballguy
Jameis is still a poor comp but you are right to be eager to if Caleb can follow up his Heisman year.I've watched his highlights and tuned in to a few games last year. Looking forward to seeing if he can repeat it this year with all the pressure/hype. If he looks that way again and the Bucs start slow I'll be rooting for the #1 overall like most any other fan of a bad team. All I'm saying is Jameis also had that kind of a season in his Heisman year, the Bucs tanked for him, and then endured 5 years of misery.- YouTube
Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.
Highlights.
Obviously tough to live up to this hype, which is Andrew Luck levels.
People saying Caleb is a more refined Mahomes? Tap the breaks.
Comparing Caleb to NFL Mahomes is silly and beyond reason. But comparing him to Texas Tech Mahomes is fair. And Williams has been objectively better in college...so far.
That doesn't really say a lot about what kind of NFL player Williams will turn into, but he's a heck of a college QB.
massraider
Footballguy
Not like this. You know that.
In terms of next-year hype, Caleb is up there with Bijan, Pitts, Bowers, Harrison Jr.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Yep, for today he is. Bowers may be a tad overrated.
Brunell4MVP
Footballguy
I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right 
If I was an NFL GM I would literally lose every game this year 0-50 to be able to draft him.
If I was an NFL GM I would literally lose every game this year 0-50 to be able to draft him.
massraider
Footballguy
Cardinals gonna be looking at him and Harrison Jr back to back next year.
elguapo07
Footballguy
I’m all aboard the Williams train. Think he’s the prototype for the modern NFL QB with his ability to make and extend plays off script with his athletic ability. Just hope he doesn’t land in Zona.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
Chaka
Footballguy
Would not mind.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
~Raiders Fan
steelcityman
Footballguy
Would the Browns take him at #1 knowing the predator is under contract for a few more years? Or do they take the Ohio St kid at WR?
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
I think for any team that has an established QB (if you want to include Watson in that) it would be tempting to take the “haul” they could receive for that pick. After seeing what Carolina paid for Bryce I would assume Caleb would bring in an unprecedented amount of resources in a trade.
In the Browns case. they also don't have a 1st round pick.
In general, it makes sense to take the haul, and you are likely correct that Williams will get an even bigger one than Young did, as he (at the moment) has fewer question marks than Young did.
It will be a little interesting if Caleb Williams is the #1 QB prospect though. Drake Maye is extremely talented as well and has much more prototype size. A lot of anonymous GMs said in the lead up to this year's draft, that if Williams and Maye were in it, they'd have both gone before Young/Stroud.
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
I agree, I believe Caleb/Maye would have been 1/2 in last years draft. If they both build on last years performance it will make this upcoming draft very interesting.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
I get this from a fan's perspective, but I don't think a coach/GM can operate this way in good faith unless you never plan on looking your player's in the eye. When has tanking ever worked? You just can't build great culture with that kind of mentality.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
JohnnyU
Footballguy
It worked for the Colts and Luck for awhile. Karma is a biotch however.I get this from a fan's perspective, but I don't think a coach/GM can operate this way in good faith unless you never plan on looking your player's in the eye. When has tanking ever worked? You just can't build great culture with that kind of mentality.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Did they really tank though? Peyton got hurt. I don't think it was their intention before the season started. Maybe later on in the year?It worked for the Colts and Luck for awhile. Karma is a biotch however.I get this from a fan's perspective, but I don't think a coach/GM can operate this way in good faith unless you never plan on looking your player's in the eye. When has tanking ever worked? You just can't build great culture with that kind of mentality.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
Once your season is down the tubes I get resting some guys who are banged up who could probably play if it was worth something. Playing a young QB over a vet. But, actively "building" your roster to lose as many games as possible prior to the season never made sense to me. Looking at you, Arizona.
These kids go to bad teams, bad organizations with bad cultures, and their talent just gets wasted. We've seen it fail more often than we've seen it be successful. How many #1 overall QB's (drafted by their original team) have won a Super Bowl recently? The last was Peyton in 2007. Before him was Denver in 98-99, and they had to wait a LONG time for that. Then you have a few with Dallas/Aikman.
Point is, I don't think ensuring the #1 pick ensures winning. Seems to me building an organization with great culture around a great coach/scheme is the way to go.
Somewhat off topic, but something I'd like to get your opinion on. I always thought the Colts should have kept Manning and traded the Luck pick, given the haul Griffin went for, I would think Luck would have gotten quite a bit more than that. Like 3 1sts, multiple day 2 picks, and maybe a couple vet starters.It worked for the Colts and Luck for awhile. Karma is a biotch however.I get this from a fan's perspective, but I don't think a coach/GM can operate this way in good faith unless you never plan on looking your player's in the eye. When has tanking ever worked? You just can't build great culture with that kind of mentality.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
Or am I misremembering and did Manning want out? In my head they kinda pushed him out once they got the #1 pick. I know there were some questions about Manning post-injury, but I don't think anyone thought he was done.
Chaka
Footballguy
Worked for the Spurs, twice.I get this from a fan's perspective, but I don't think a coach/GM can operate this way in good faith unless you never plan on looking your player's in the eye. When has tanking ever worked? You just can't build great culture with that kind of mentality.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
The Colts, at least once. I don't know if 1997 was a true tank job but 2011 absolutely was.
There are probably a few more examples but those came to mind
Grahamburn
Footballguy
NBA isn’t really apples to apples when you’re only rostering 11 guys. Having the best player in the league is a much bigger advantage than it is in the NFL.Worked for the Spurs, twice.I get this from a fan's perspective, but I don't think a coach/GM can operate this way in good faith unless you never plan on looking your player's in the eye. When has tanking ever worked? You just can't build great culture with that kind of mentality.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
The Colts, at least once. I don't know if 1997 was a true tank job but 2011 absolutely was.
There are probably a few more examples but those came to mind
We’ve seen plenty of great NFL players win nothing without the help of a quality supporting cast.
Chaka
Footballguy
I think they had the tank mentality long before the season started. I am 100% certain the Colts understood the severity of Manning's neck injury long before his surgery in May. Signing 39 year old Kerry Collins doesn't strike me as a "Let's all rally and make a surprise playoff run!" move to me.
Chaka
Footballguy
Fair but they still worked very hard to get the best player in the league, twice.NBA isn’t really apples to apples when you’re only rostering 11 guys. Having the best player in the league is a much bigger advantage than it is in the NFL.Worked for the Spurs, twice.I get this from a fan's perspective, but I don't think a coach/GM can operate this way in good faith unless you never plan on looking your player's in the eye. When has tanking ever worked? You just can't build great culture with that kind of mentality.I've seen Caleb live in HS for all years. And watched extensively in college. He is better than the hype. Barring injury, he's gonna be incredible. My opinion, but I am right
The Colts, at least once. I don't know if 1997 was a true tank job but 2011 absolutely was.
There are probably a few more examples but those came to mind
We’ve seen plenty of great NFL players win nothing without the help of a quality supporting cast.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Honestly couldn’t remember the timeline and was too lazy to look it up. And even so, did it actually work for the Colts? He had one great year and one good year. Then retired. One AFC Championship game I think. That’s it.
My guess is if they had a chance to do it again they trade that pick and try to win another with Peyton. Instead, Denver got 2. Hindsight I guess.
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