lod01
Footballguy
So do I. It's who the Bucs should have waited for.The Midday 180 @Midday180 19m19 minutes ago
“I think Jared Goff is a better QB prospect than James Winston.”- @GregCosell
So do I. It's who the Bucs should have waited for.The Midday 180 @Midday180 19m19 minutes ago
“I think Jared Goff is a better QB prospect than James Winston.”- @GregCosell
Wrong to look at it like that,From the linked article.
When teams have dealt the top pick, they have lost draft value 4 out of the 5 times.
Seems extremely likely at this point. (The Goff part, at least). Tennessee will not be interested, and I don't see anyone trading up to #1 to take Goff. Cutting Manziel makes a QB at #2 almost guaranteed, and it would probably be foolish to choose any of the other options over Goff. (But, it is Cleveland, and they're all about foolish).Might Jared Goff end up in Cleveland? JG to JG (Jared Goff to Josh Gordon)?
Yes.Might Jared Goff end up in Cleveland? JG to JG (Jared Goff to Josh Gordon)?
The above NFL.com story came from this PFT interview where Florio interviews Jared and to be perfectly honest, this is an odd interview. I was trying to get a feel for Goff but this is an awkward interview where... well check it out for yourself.
Ya, Goff sure does need to work on his interview skills, he was awkwardThe above NFL.com story came from this PFT interview where Florio interviews Jared and to be perfectly honest, this is an odd interview. I was trying to get a feel for Goff but this is an awkward interview where... well check it out for yourself.
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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/02/03/jared-goff-says-hell-do-everything-at-combine/
Jared Goff says he’ll do everything at combinePosted by Josh Alper on February 3, 2016, 3:58 PM EST
Jared Goff - QB - Golden Bears
Rotoworld's Josh Norris believes QB Jared Goff's offense at Cal should be questioned like Marcus Mariota's was last year.
We all remember the Marcus Mariota conversation last year: that he ran a simplistic offense that did not translate to the NFL. Those comments usually derived from people who did not give Mariota, or Oregon's offense, enough credit. Norris believes Goff's offense is far simpler than Mariota's, and Sonny Dykes has previously discussed using around seven passing concepts or plays. This should be a talking point, as it was last year, but thus far no one has brought it up.
Source: Rotoworld
Feb 4 - 12:09 PM
"No one has brought it up"? It's mentioned by everyone who talks about Goff's NFL prospects. I challenge anyone to find a draft profile which doesn't refer to Goff's production possibly being inflated by the offense.Rotoworld:
Jared Goff - QB - Golden Bears
Rotoworld's Josh Norris believes QB Jared Goff's offense at Cal should be questioned like Marcus Mariota's was last year.
We all remember the Marcus Mariota conversation last year: that he ran a simplistic offense that did not translate to the NFL. Those comments usually derived from people who did not give Mariota, or Oregon's offense, enough credit. Norris believes Goff's offense is far simpler than Mariota's, and Sonny Dykes has previously discussed using around seven passing concepts or plays. This should be a talking point, as it was last year, but thus far no one has brought it up.
Source: Rotoworld
Feb 4 - 12:09 PM
I wouldn't call him a gunslinger, no, but that's one of the things the offense masks a bit. Since there are four or five wide outs on almost every play, the receivers don't see a lot of double coverage. There are a lot of balls, especially fades to Lawler, that are thrown up into one-on-one situations where the receiver has to make a play, but not a lot where there's only one place to put the ball. I'd say he's more of a deliberate thrower.Is Goff a risk taker/gunslinger type of gun?
It doesn't sound like he is but I'm not sure. Why I ask is that I saw a mock draft with him going #2 to Cleveland then in the second round they took Doctson. If this happens and they get Gordon back this Cleveland offense could turn around very quick.
A lot of people have the frame and the tools, he certainly does at 6'4 215 (maybe could add 5-10 pounds) and a good arm...Bracie Smathers said:He very well could bust but could you elaborate?fantasycurse42 said:Bust!
OK, you're correct on one point; he didn't take snaps under center. The rest, I don't know what you're looking at. Among other things, Goff had 4 fumbles this year, tied for 89th most in the NCAA.A lot of people have the frame and the tools, he certainly does at 6'4 215 (maybe could add 5-10 pounds) and a good arm...Bracie Smathers said:He very well could bust but could you elaborate?fantasycurse42 said:Bust!
He has no internal clock, he fumbles frequently, his accuracy is an issue, and he has basically never taken a collegiate snap under center. I watched him in about 5 games this season and felt uninspired - I think he'll bust, just my opinion.
We watching the same player?He has no internal clock
his accuracy is an issue
No problem having an opinion where you think he will bust and you are right about him not taking any snaps under center but with accuracy his only issues with accuracy were on passing plays covering over 30 yards in the air because he doesn't have a big gun type of arm.A lot of people have the frame and the tools, he certainly does at 6'4 215 (maybe could add 5-10 pounds) and a good arm...Bracie Smathers said:He very well could bust but could you elaborate?fantasycurse42 said:Bust!
He has no internal clock, he fumbles frequently, his accuracy is an issue, and he has basically never taken a collegiate snap under center. I watched him in about 5 games this season and felt uninspired - I think he'll bust, just my opinion.
That was a take from last July and at the end of the article it mentioned Goff had improved his body and to re-evaluate his game going forward from the time this story was written last July where he was bigger and he showed an improvement in his overall game....Goff, who is surprisingly getting the most hype, epitomizes the Brian Hoyer case for weak armed quarterbacks. He has a weak arm, he knows it, and he throws scared because of it. He’s a fairly accurate quarterback and has nice traits, but he refuses to test tight windows because his arm cannot get there on its own. Like was mentioned before, there are ways to transcend this, but requires a natural instinct that Goff just does not seem to possess. Thus, his play involves a lot of “gimme” throws and check downs. He purposely leaves throws on the field because he feels he cannot make them. This, of course, is a double-edged sword, because it is important for a QB to know his strengths and weaknesses to limit mistakes, but this limits the offense as well. Goff’s play to this point makes me think he is a spot starter/backup type rather than a franchise quarterback. There is a slight caveat, as Goff was playing very, very light last season due to a surgery and he very well could have more juice in his arm next season with weight gain. However, that is a hypothetical future, and I was told from a very young age to live in the now.
Why Jared Goff Is the Next Franchise Quarterback By Ian Wharton, Featured Columnist Jan 3, 2016...After watching every snap of Cal’s offense in the 2015 season
...He’s gained around 30 pounds in the 18 or so months since he had surgery for a separated shoulder injury in late 2013.
Goff is still tall and appears skinny like Teddy Bridgewater did, coming out of Louisville in 2014. But his work in the weight room is apparent and shows his dedication to improvement. As his body continues to mature, expect more bulk to be added to his frame.
...One thing we certainly know is the Cal coaching staff fully trusted Goff by the time he was a junior, according to Sean Wagner-McGough of CBS Sports:
"I trust him with my job," Cal offensive coordinator Tony Franklin said. "When you're letting a guy do that, then you're putting it all in his hands."
For the first time in his career, Goff can change anything and everything he wants at the line of scrimmage. From routes to the protection scheme, he can call whatever he wants.
Goff had control of everything from read-option plays to improvising on routes with receivers. He even had some protection schemes. His mental advancement from a spread system isn’t the same as your typical spread-system quarterback that just reads the pre-snap look and makes the call with little information. He’s already much more than that.
A captain for two consecutive seasons, Goff has a pedigree and background that should satisfy NFL teams.
...On-field progression
Goff’s off-field improvement from his sophomore to junior seasons was noticeable, and so was his on-field play. While he flashed the ability to make jaw-dropping throws,
...We’ll look at his ability to extend plays later, but let’s focus on the nuance of Goff’s passing ability.
The first thing to mention is Goff’s exquisite footwork.
...Goff not only sees three receivers on this play, but he is physically ready to release the ball. While manipulating defenders with the eyes is an effective method, actually sweeping his body with his eyes is extremely advanced to even see at the NFL level.
Also notable in this clip is the timing and zip of the pass. Goff delivers the pass to the outside shoulder of his tight end, where the closing safety cannot reach. This placement helps convert the first down and protects his receiver from being walloped by the tackler.
We see this type of pocket movement often from Goff. He is incredibly comfortable amongst chaos in his surrounding areas. He feels pressure better than most young quarterbacks, moving up and around the pocket while keeping his eyes up
...Goff works through to his third read while the defensive tackle quickly bears down on him. His efficient feet make everything possible, and his ability to hang in despite pressure is frustrating for a defense. He’s able to win by cutting to death a thousand times, or going for the jugular in one play.
This is an area that separates quarterback prospects from being the next Marcus Mariota, Jameis Winston (two very good prospects) as opposed to Geno Smith, Jake Locker or Blaine Gabbert. The confidence, poise and natural feel for the pocket is incredibly valuable. An elite quarterback, let alone a franchise quarterback, is able to deliver a catchable pass in the face of pressure or consistently extend plays to buy time.
Goff certainly does so from the pocket consistently.
,,,Accuracy to all levels
...take a look at Goff’s accuracy chart below. I didn’t include throwaways or shovel passes in the formula. Most notable is that he delivered a catchable pass on a whopping 77% of his passes, and 49 of them were dropped.
...I have the data available for his peers as well. Goff was easily the most accurate passer between Paxton Lynch, Connor Cook and Carson Wentz. That data is here.
One accuracy number doesn’t encompass everything, but it helps show where a player is performing well. Goff is not only efficient on short and intermediate passes, but he is deadly on deep-ball throws. His ability to drop the ball into a bucket is actually his biggest strength.
...Every bit of time the quarterback can buy for his offensive line to block, for his wide receivers to get open or for himself to execute his roll is invaluable. Goff’s willingness to take a hit is also important, as he’s somewhat likely to go to a bad team that cannot adequately protect him in his first few seasons. His toughness and ability to stay healthy is another positive trait.
...The hardest throw to make is the hash mark to far sideline throw. It requires timing, arm strength and velocity. Goff sometimes lacks the velocity on these throws when he is out of rhythm, but we have enough examples throughout 2015 that suggest he can make this throw consistently in the NFL. Remember, the NFL’s hash marks aren’t nearly as wide, so the ball travels less distance than in college.
On deep outs and comebacks, Goff can be a reliable passer. These passes are risky in nature. If the cornerback plays it correctly, the throw can be an easy interception. But Goff has hit this throw in college, and should continue to be successful as he adds bulk in to NFL.
Although the next throw is on the short side of the field, it still highlights excellent accuracy from Goff. He gets the ball out quickly and with plenty of zip. Only his receiver can catch this ball on the back-shoulder fade.
The defender is helpless.
You're cherry picking, how about the last 3 years, the number is 24.OK, you're correct on one point; he didn't take snaps under center. The rest, I don't know what you're looking at. Among other things, Goff had 4 fumbles this year, tied for 89th most in the NCAA.A lot of people have the frame and the tools, he certainly does at 6'4 215 (maybe could add 5-10 pounds) and a good arm...Bracie Smathers said:He very well could bust but could you elaborate?fantasycurse42 said:Bust!
He has no internal clock, he fumbles frequently, his accuracy is an issue, and he has basically never taken a collegiate snap under center. I watched him in about 5 games this season and felt uninspired - I think he'll bust, just my opinion.
You think that the fumble numbers from an 18-year-old true freshman getting pummeled behind a terrible line on a 1-11 team are more relevant than the numbers from this year? OK, you go with that.You're cherry picking, how about the last 3 years, the number is 24.OK, you're correct on one point; he didn't take snaps under center. The rest, I don't know what you're looking at. Among other things, Goff had 4 fumbles this year, tied for 89th most in the NCAA.A lot of people have the frame and the tools, he certainly does at 6'4 215 (maybe could add 5-10 pounds) and a good arm...Bracie Smathers said:He very well could bust but could you elaborate?fantasycurse42 said:Bust!
He has no internal clock, he fumbles frequently, his accuracy is an issue, and he has basically never taken a collegiate snap under center. I watched him in about 5 games this season and felt uninspired - I think he'll bust, just my opinion.
Pro Football Focus analyst Kevin Connaghan noted that Cal QB Jared Goff is "likely to go too early [in the draft] to be afforded [the] luxury [of learning on the bench during his first NFL season]."
Wrote Connaghan, "Goff is arguably the best QB prospect in this class, and should hear his name called early come draft time. An excellent downfield passer. Goff had the highest grade among Power-5 quarterbacks, and graded well when pressured." The 6-foot-4, 205-pounder is far from a slam dunk, though, and Connaghan advises that throwing him into the fire early could be problematic. "His decision making needs to improve," the analyst said, "and like most QBs coming out of college, he could benefit from some development time before starting."
Source: Pro Football Focus
Feb 7 - 4:13 PM
Jared Goff - QB - Golden Bears
Rotoworld's Josh Norris lists California QB Jared Goff as the No. 25 overall prospect in the 2016 NFL Draft.
"Produced some of the best touch, bucket throws weve seen in the last few years," Norris wrote. "There are a number of throws that clearly show he is willing to work to his second option, so 'progressions' might not be a leap. Converted from a number of unclean pockets. Seemingly mastered Cals system, albeit a very simple one. It is a simpler offense than Mariotas at Oregon, but no one is making that statement." This is, of course, a far lower ranking than most analysts give Goff. Norris' credo is that if he gives a quarterback a surefire first-round grade, they ought to sit atop the class.
Source: Rotoworld
Feb 9 - 3:09 PM
Jared Goff - QB - Golden Bears
NFL Media draft analyst Lance Zierlein ranks California QB Jared Goff as the No. 8 overall prospect in the class.
"While Goff is a little leaner in the lower body than teams might like, he has good size, an NFL arm, advanced pocket mobility and the field demeanor of a franchise quarterback," reads his scouting report. "His accuracy and decision making will suffer from occasional lapses, but he displays the tools to become a good starting quarterback with time." Zierlein compares Goff and his "pillowy soft touch" to Matt Ryan: "Goff and Ryan have similar body types and arms. Like Ryan was in 2008, Goff is pro-ready as he heads into the league. The most glaring difference between the two is that Ryan worked in a pro-style offense, where Goff works exclusively from shotgun and pistol." Goff's father, Jerry, played major league baseball as a catcher for six seasons.
Source: NFL.com
Feb 15 - 3:03 PM
ESPN's Louis Riddick tweeted he likes Cal's Jared Goff the more he watches the QB.
How much does Riddick like Goff? That is up to interpretation. "Every single one of these '16 QB's needs the perfect fit of environment, coaching, scheme, teammates, management of expectations, etc," Riddick added. This statement applies ot a number of prospects, but put it in the perspective of this year's quarterback group versus last years. We thought Marcus Mariota and Jameis Winston could succeed in any situation (obviously better situations would help), but we cannot say the same for this year's group.
Source: Louis Riddick on Twitter
Feb 15 - 10:24 AM
Galco with a contrarian point of view.
http://optimumscouting.com/uncategorized/quantifying-quarterbacks-jared-goff-isnt-here-to-save-a-franchise.html
QUANTIFYING QUARTERBACKS: JARED GOFF ISN’T HERE TO SAVE A FRANCHISE
Posted by Eric Galko on Dec 12, 2015 09:00
Do not die on hills. Jared Goff is one of the most disgusting instances of analysts propping up an undeserving player...
I watched Goff against Stanford and was concerned about his ball placement on some of his underneath and intermediate throws. It seemed like his receivers often had to adjust to the ball, and weren't in a great position for YAC. To give a few examples, I think this play at 2:20 could've been a touchdown, this throw at 3:32 made things hard on his WR, and his first throw of the game led his WR back towards the flat when Goff should've set him up to turn inside and break downfield. That matches one of Galko's criticisms.Galco with a contrarian point of view.
http://optimumscouting.com/uncategorized/quantifying-quarterbacks-jared-goff-isnt-here-to-save-a-franchise.html
QUANTIFYING QUARTERBACKS: JARED GOFF ISN’T HERE TO SAVE A FRANCHISE
Posted by Eric Galko on Dec 12, 2015 09:00
Do not die on hills. Jared Goff is one of the most disgusting instances of analysts propping up an undeserving player...
Hey Cal Bear,Note that that article is from December 12; I linked to it some time ago. It was before the 6-TD game against Air Force.
I think Galko is at least someone who has watched some film, and his opinions are based on real analysis. I don't entirely agree but he has an interesting contrarian view.
3
I thought the same thing.Reminds me of Drew Brees.
One glaring physical difference.Reminds me of Drew Brees.
Jared Goff - QB - Golden Bears
NFL Media's Mike Mayock believes Cal QB Jared Goff is "by far the most polished" prospect at his position in the 2016 NFL Draft.
Mayock went on to expand on that thought. "Quick release, natural feel in the pocket, good arm strength and accuracy and ability to read progressions better than anyone in this draft," the longtime evaluator concluded. Allow us to play devil's advocate in this situation. Goff definitely displays pocket movement, but sometimes it is unnecessary when leaving a clean pocket and many times it is out of the "back door"in Cal's empty looks. Cal's offense fits the Air Raid style, and Sonny Dykes has talked in the past about only coaching seven passing concepts/plays, so one can conclude that, yes, Goff mastered the offense, but does it prepare him for an expanded offense in the NFL?
Source: The MMQB
Feb 22 - 10:07 AM
Those are small hands, below the baseline. Not sure if any QB with 9' hands has been drafted with the #2 pick recently let alone a 6'4, 215 lb QB.From the Combine:
Goff's hand size came in at 9 in.
Wentz hand size came in at 10 in.
Same as Romo. Not an issue.
Cal QB Jared Goff scoffed at talk of his small hand size, saying, "No, I've never had a problem with that or expect it to be a problem at all."
At the NFL Scouting Combine, Goff's hands measured out to 9", shy of the 9 1/2" inches that's generally viewed as ideal for an NFL quarterback. Said the 6-foot-4, 215-pounder, "I just heard about that yesterday. I've been told I have pretty big hands my whole life. I heard I have small hands yesterday, apparently." The Browns are one team considering Goff with the second overall selection and HC Hue Jackson addressed the importance of size when he said, "I think guys that have big hands can grip the ball better in those environmental situations, and so we'll look for a guy that fits what we're looking for in a quarterback, and, is hand size important? Yes, it is."
Source: ESPN.com
Feb 25 - 8:05 PM
Cal QB Jared Goff was "head and shoulders above [the] rest of [the] QB competition during [the] Combine's first throwing session," according to CBS Sports draft analyst Rob Rang.
It had to be something of a relief for Goff to simply throw the football. Prior to Saturday's throwing drills, almost all the talk in Indianapolis surrounding the 6-foot-4, 215-pound gunslinger had to do with size. His hand measured out to just nine inches, leading to questions about his ability to grip the ball in inclement weather. Goff, himself, didn't put too much stock into that criticism. We've seen this kind of water-muddying before regarding top prospects. With four months between the close of the college season and the draft, there's a lot of time for idle chatter. He remains a probable top-5 pick come late April.
Source: Rob Rang on Twitter
Feb 27 - 1:58 PM
TFY Draft Insider's Tony Pauline noted that Cal QB Jared Goff posted a "big-time performance" at the NFL Scouting Combine on Saturday.
Wrote Pauline, "His timing and anticipation were on the money despite the fact Goff was throwing to receivers he was unfamiliar with. Goff showed great accuracy and pass placement, gently placing throws into receivers' hands." Pauline's not hallucinating here, as CBS Sports' Rob Rang called the 6-foot-4, 215-pounder's first throwing session "head and shoulders" better than the rest of the QB field on hand in Indianapolis.
Source: philadelphiaeagles.com
Former NFL scout John Middlekauff believes "Dallas would be nuts to pass on [Cal QB Jared] Goff at [pick No.] 4."
Middlekauff believes the Browns will draft North Dakota State QB Carson Wentz at No. 2, leaving the Cowboys to decide whether to scoop up Goff with the fourth pick. Wrote the former scout, "Sit him behind Romo, set the franchise up for years." On Saturday, though, Cowboys owner Jerry Jones indicated that he believes that Tony Romo will be the team's quarterback for the next four or five years. If that's the timetable they have in mind at quarterback, it might serve them better to look for a more immediate impact as they continue to build toward a title run. Middlekauff's basic logic is accurate. You just have to wonder whether sitting Goff for four seasons (or thereabouts) is realistic.
Source: John Middlekauff on Twitter
An NFL scout who spoke with the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel's Bob McGinn ventured the opinion that Cal QB Jared Goff "might be the most ready [quarterback in this draft class]."
"Thing I don't like is [Goff's] slender build. He did not have a lot of talent around him. Does he have a great arm? No, but it's good enough. I'd be nervous taking him above 10," the scout said. Nerves or no, the 6-foot-4, 215-pounder is probably going to be drafted in the top-10 come late April's draft unless there's a drastic change in perception. Another scout who spoke with McGinn also harped on Goff's size, calling him a "skinny kid" before adding, "Accuracy is off at times, but he is talented. He can really spin it. Really good feet."
Source: Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel
Feb 28 - 5:48 PM