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QB Marcus Mariota, WAS (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
Gruden loved Marcus but I don't think he's the guy to utilize Marcus' legs and let him be himself. Right now I think it wasn't a good team to sign with and that could mean his career is soon over. QBs have to do something in their moves like this if they want to play many many years.
The classiest Titan ever, one of the nicest good guys the NFL has ever had. As many have said (including Tannehlll) majorly responsible for turning the Titans from a doormat into a respectable team and changing the mindset/attitude around the complex.
One major problem is he was such a yes coach type guy and didn't adlib or think much on his own unless he called his own play. It'll be interesting to see him NOT in an offense where he has to throw to Davis and/or give Davis more time. It could be a big prob if Gruden wants him to do the same.
He has outstanding redzone efficiency and 4th Q efficiency stats, one or both are best ever type. The Titans and OC Smith, probably learned something from he and the prior coaches as they rocked in the 4th Q the second half of 2020.
His speed is unique. One of the fastest QBs and he doesn't look it.
Raiders OL will be everything to him. His stats suffer mightily when under pressure. Took the blame for Titans being on worst ever sacks allowed pace three times in his career. This is the same for every QB but 3 of 5 years does point more at him if you didn't watch the game.
He missed Delanie and getting a top TE will be big for him.
He's been with Carr at events and things so I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't friends already. I do see the rumors Carr is moved AND that Marcus is the backup or potential backup if it's a buy time for a rookie type setup. I don't know that Carr has a big list of teams interested though. The plan might be to start anew, but the Raiders may have to see Carr vs Mariota in camp.
There are many that think Marcus stinks like Matuski. There are many that think a fresh start will be everything for him. There doesn't seem to be a soul that thinks he could be good or average.
New England was the best possible spot and the Ravens were the second best. Helfrich I guess third. This is an odd choice but again Gruden did love Marcus years ago.
The classiest Titan ever, one of the nicest good guys the NFL has ever had. As many have said (including Tannehlll) majorly responsible for turning the Titans from a doormat into a respectable team and changing the mindset/attitude around the complex.
One major problem is he was such a yes coach type guy and didn't adlib or think much on his own unless he called his own play. It'll be interesting to see him NOT in an offense where he has to throw to Davis and/or give Davis more time. It could be a big prob if Gruden wants him to do the same.
He has outstanding redzone efficiency and 4th Q efficiency stats, one or both are best ever type. The Titans and OC Smith, probably learned something from he and the prior coaches as they rocked in the 4th Q the second half of 2020.
His speed is unique. One of the fastest QBs and he doesn't look it.
Raiders OL will be everything to him. His stats suffer mightily when under pressure. Took the blame for Titans being on worst ever sacks allowed pace three times in his career. This is the same for every QB but 3 of 5 years does point more at him if you didn't watch the game.
He missed Delanie and getting a top TE will be big for him.
He's been with Carr at events and things so I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't friends already. I do see the rumors Carr is moved AND that Marcus is the backup or potential backup if it's a buy time for a rookie type setup. I don't know that Carr has a big list of teams interested though. The plan might be to start anew, but the Raiders may have to see Carr vs Mariota in camp.
There are many that think Marcus stinks like Matuski. There are many that think a fresh start will be everything for him. There doesn't seem to be a soul that thinks he could be good or average.
New England was the best possible spot and the Ravens were the second best. Helfrich I guess third. This is an odd choice but again Gruden did love Marcus years ago.
JoeSteeler
Footballguy
Any word on how much $?
BoltBacker
Footballguy
I agree with pretty much everything you said in this post, but I think Carr will have interest around the league once Brady signs someplace. Personally, I think Brady is just leveraging the TB interest(which I believe is real) to get NE to pay him more but more importantly to build up the players around him because he knew going into last season that the skill positions were at a low there in NE. In the end I expect Brady back in NE either way. Of course even if this wasn't all smoke it wouldn't be surprising at all to me if NE turned its sights on Carr given his completion percentage and the safe type of passing offense they like to run.
Once that happens I can't think of someone much different from Winston than Carr. You have zero worries about the off-field stuff that seems to haunt Winston going all the way back to college. You don't have that worry with Rivers either, but if you are publicly ditching Winston because he loses too many games with TO's it's pretty tough to make the case to replace him with Rivers. Carr just seems like the goldylocks QB that is a team first guy, with no off field issues, and won't put Arians in an early grave by making mystifying TO's to actually lose games for the team.
Maybe the best fit for Carr would be Indy. They have already traded away the pick they may have used to acquire a QB in the draft.
It wouldn't really shock me at all to see Gruden fall in love with a guy like Jordan Love. Or really even one of the many polarizing QB prospects in this draft like Eason, Fromm, Hurts, and Gordon. All those guys are the typical QB coach bait, "If only I could have some time to develop him I'm sure I could turn him into....." that I can absolutely see Gruden falling into. If that happens then the Mariota signing makes a lot of sense if they have already had some interest and are happy getting Carr off their salary cap. None of those college guys would be ready to start very soon(if ever imo) so Mariota would have a legit chance to start for awhile to sink or swim. I just don't think Mariota has the disposition to put up with Gruden on the sidelines to be successful which is a shame.
Everything I read or watch from Gruden is that he's well aware of Marcus being shell shocked and the Titans not letting him use his athleticism and....it seems like he's in the perfect spot.
I am waiting for camp.
I think if Marcus is getting all the staff's attention, that might tell you all you need to with Carr.
I don't see how Gruden can reassure Marcus behind a good OL and break Titans tendencies and get him to run away from pressure/scramble without sufficient practice time to do so. Marcus has always thrown great on the run, even in his HS highlights. All the stay in the pocket people could certainly have harmed his development.
Can he relax and be him? Or is he just gonna be scared of the next hit?
I doubt this is a camp battle we have trouble reading. I bet we can tell who the starter will be by summer's end
I am waiting for camp.
I think if Marcus is getting all the staff's attention, that might tell you all you need to with Carr.
I don't see how Gruden can reassure Marcus behind a good OL and break Titans tendencies and get him to run away from pressure/scramble without sufficient practice time to do so. Marcus has always thrown great on the run, even in his HS highlights. All the stay in the pocket people could certainly have harmed his development.
Can he relax and be him? Or is he just gonna be scared of the next hit?
I doubt this is a camp battle we have trouble reading. I bet we can tell who the starter will be by summer's end
Quoting myself since things changed with no preseason and camp probably won't be enough time to change and adjust this year
Marcus needed to be allowed to be himself to relax and able to use those feet. The Covid19 stuff appears to have been bad timing for a guy like Mariota to work through some things
Jon Gruden on Mariota: "He's a dazzling playmaker with his feet and that's the key to his game." (Faust shared this above)
That is what he needed a coach to say.
The Titans rarely let him use his feet and knew this too, so I'm still stuck with this feeling like "OK you see it Gruden, will ya let him do it?"
(Everything is overblown this time of summer but )Raiders talk is how it should be for Marcus too. Carr is a pocket QB so it's easier to go with him than Mariota who has to move around.
Marcus really could be getting the understanding he's needed his whole career.
It's early, so early, but so far this is just what Marcus needed.
*****************************
Re camp battle- The reporter hypocrisy we all know happens is there. Many write that there isn't a camp battle but yet the text of the article is how it's a camp battle. I don't blame the reporters, this is usually because the team's statement is that there isn't but what's in front of their eyes is a different story.
Dazzling is a great word to describe Marcus on the run, he sure is. He doesn't need to be hurried through this process though. He has to have as much time as it will take for him to relax and I doubt it's just one month of training camp. Gruden might need to have him sub in for Carr when he struggles, close out a game that's out of hand, and then maybe he's comfortable.
I think how Gruden handles Marcus will be his whole career right here n now. I think it's that important. I don't want him to win a QB competition and/or start week 1. I just want him showing what he can do, people being impressed, and a coach/OC completely supporting him.
If Marcus is allowed to use his feet often, it should be like Baltimore's switch from Flacco to Lamar. (It's not the best comparison, forgive me, I got little to work with in today's NFL) What I mean is the O should be different. The Ravens did this n that with Flacco under center but with Lamar, they called these plays and those plays to utilize his mobility. The other question here is can the Raiders teammates support Marcus? Is their time for their linemen to switch up/adjust to a mobile QB? The RBs to know they've always gotta be ready to be moving around and yet still pickup a blitzer or catch a dump pass? Just like I don't want them to rush Marcus, I don't want them to rush his teammates to get used to him.
If Marcus is to be Marcus, it won't be "eh just put him in." It will be a big change for the O
One more thing- Marcus should be more appealing to fans. We gotta admit that we love a good highlight and it's more fun to watch a guy adlib on the run than just sit N throw. The barometer will be how the offense moves down the field and scores points, not how they look.
Edit- I hate that comparison, maybe Kyler Murray? Just note the switch please
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One reporter has exposed himself as a hater and I can't stand that side of journalism. I guess Marcus will have to win him over or we have to ignore him or...idk I just can't stand that type of reporting. Faust's above should be how it is- did some good, did some bad; not just point out mistakes. Marcus taking off up the sideline for a TD gets critiqued for he should have waited for his blockers....cmon. I'm telling ya, look for this hater.
Anyway, what I've read is Gruden's getting creative. Let me start with Carr has been very good. He needed to practice well and fend off any comers and he had a great week.
Gruden is instilling mobile QB plays. The Raiders have Lynn Bowden Jr, a player that was a college QB two years ago and a RB last year. He's lined up at RB, WR, and QB. Mariota lined up at WR several times.
Mariota lined up at WR last year (2 times? 3?) and Henry got a shotgun snap. Many Titans players would point at someone moving amidst the D. Not that Gruden is stealing a play from the Titans, but I bet it's the same - he wants to see how the D reacts and if they can get a key defender out of the middle.
I think this is Plan B for the Raiders. No one writes that there were a ton of these snaps, it's always after Carr does well- I don't at all think this is a shift in the offense Carr can't handle so his FF owners should worry. I just think it's Plan B and maybe every now and then Gruden shows it to see what happens.
At QB, Mariota has been awful then great then awful then great. There are a lot of quotes on him having to learn things so quickly and it's a bit much to ask of him but also quotes of his legs and movement which is still a real good thing. Gruden recognizes Marcus does a few techniques wrong when he's unsure of himself and that's a big deal as that makes it fixable.
I don't in anyway get that Marcus is pressing Carr to start week 1.
Reading a lot of Raiders stuff this week, I figured I should share- I know a lot of sites are calling for Hunter Renfrow to be next to nothing this year after his replacements have been added, but he's still doing a lot of good. You probably need to reconsider NOT drafting him and pencil him in somewhere or maybe just adjust your rookie projections. He's still relevant
Anyway, what I've read is Gruden's getting creative. Let me start with Carr has been very good. He needed to practice well and fend off any comers and he had a great week.
Gruden is instilling mobile QB plays. The Raiders have Lynn Bowden Jr, a player that was a college QB two years ago and a RB last year. He's lined up at RB, WR, and QB. Mariota lined up at WR several times.
Mariota lined up at WR last year (2 times? 3?) and Henry got a shotgun snap. Many Titans players would point at someone moving amidst the D. Not that Gruden is stealing a play from the Titans, but I bet it's the same - he wants to see how the D reacts and if they can get a key defender out of the middle.
I think this is Plan B for the Raiders. No one writes that there were a ton of these snaps, it's always after Carr does well- I don't at all think this is a shift in the offense Carr can't handle so his FF owners should worry. I just think it's Plan B and maybe every now and then Gruden shows it to see what happens.
At QB, Mariota has been awful then great then awful then great. There are a lot of quotes on him having to learn things so quickly and it's a bit much to ask of him but also quotes of his legs and movement which is still a real good thing. Gruden recognizes Marcus does a few techniques wrong when he's unsure of himself and that's a big deal as that makes it fixable.
I don't in anyway get that Marcus is pressing Carr to start week 1.
Reading a lot of Raiders stuff this week, I figured I should share- I know a lot of sites are calling for Hunter Renfrow to be next to nothing this year after his replacements have been added, but he's still doing a lot of good. You probably need to reconsider NOT drafting him and pencil him in somewhere or maybe just adjust your rookie projections. He's still relevant
That running....been saying it for years. Rarely saw it in TEN which almost made you forget how fast he is.
The Zay Jones pass was behind him but Zay getting his hands on it about kept it perfect setup for the Chargers DB.
That deep ball to Waller...again, why didn't the Titans. He had the prettiest deep ball in high school and college...that dropped right in there beautifully.
The Chargers DBs were very impressive. So many times he was rolling and no one was open.
I found it fascinating how the sports world lit up for him last night and the Titans loving it on social media. He's such a good guy ya just root for him.
He was rusty and the offense wasn't smooth. I don't know if the O is on him or just difference between Carr and him or again, the Chargers D. He got them there every time. I don't know what more you can ask from a backup QB.
I saw the Belichick tweets and yeah if he wants to make Marcus a starter that should play out this off-season. All that, fired up the team with his play and a team (fans only) wondering if he could starr...that is what every NFL backup should do. We've gone so far away from that with poor backups- that should be normal and on all 32.
The Raiders need a big back or a tough back. Like the announcers said, their 3rd and 3 3rd and 4 offense is so difficult without it. Love Jacobs but a backup to him.
Carr's been excellent imo. Every time I watch I'm blown away. He's taken every next step in his development and is their assured starter no matter how Marcus plays.
Raiders need those rookies to shine in year two. It's still Waller and some has beens.
Tua versus Marcus would be awesome next week.
The Zay Jones pass was behind him but Zay getting his hands on it about kept it perfect setup for the Chargers DB.
That deep ball to Waller...again, why didn't the Titans. He had the prettiest deep ball in high school and college...that dropped right in there beautifully.
The Chargers DBs were very impressive. So many times he was rolling and no one was open.
I found it fascinating how the sports world lit up for him last night and the Titans loving it on social media. He's such a good guy ya just root for him.
He was rusty and the offense wasn't smooth. I don't know if the O is on him or just difference between Carr and him or again, the Chargers D. He got them there every time. I don't know what more you can ask from a backup QB.
I saw the Belichick tweets and yeah if he wants to make Marcus a starter that should play out this off-season. All that, fired up the team with his play and a team (fans only) wondering if he could starr...that is what every NFL backup should do. We've gone so far away from that with poor backups- that should be normal and on all 32.
The Raiders need a big back or a tough back. Like the announcers said, their 3rd and 3 3rd and 4 offense is so difficult without it. Love Jacobs but a backup to him.
Carr's been excellent imo. Every time I watch I'm blown away. He's taken every next step in his development and is their assured starter no matter how Marcus plays.
Raiders need those rookies to shine in year two. It's still Waller and some has beens.
Tua versus Marcus would be awesome next week.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Mariota did some good things last night but he also threw about 3 balls that shoulda been picked. I'm excited about the Dolphin D facing him next week.
Boston
Footballguy
Gotta believe he is on the Pats radar...and I don't hate it...the issue the Pats have (besides not having a QB which is kind of a big issue) is even if they love a rookie like Mac Jones there is no guarantee they can get him or any of the other top prospects at #15...so, realistically the Pats have to bring in two QBs this offseason and one has to be a veteran that is suitable to start in case the draft does not unfold the way they want (if they are in-fact eying a rookie QB)...to me the two that make the most sense are Mariota and Jimmy G and it is still not known if Jimmy G will be available...I think Mariota would be a huge upgrade over Cam and his salary cap # does not put much of a dent in what they can do this off-season...would love it if they brought him in and used their #1 on a QB but if they went with Mariota, used their #1 elsewhere and got someone like Trask later I'd be ok with that as well.
rockaction
Footballguy
They had so many opt-outs that they're still a viable club with their defense. The question is who do they have at wideout and QB? Mariota answers one of those questions, WR can be drafted and free agents procured. That's really what they were missing, was their nine or ten defensive players that opted-out, minus Brady, but especially devoid of receiving talent.
Boston
Footballguy
Agreed...the other thing is...if you don't want Mariota then what is your plan? I think bringing him in along with a legit rookie is your best bet (at least as far as how the landscape is now)...gives you two shots to fix the QB position (and there is zero doubt he is an upgrade over Cam so you can at least have a functioning offense) and it doesn't put much of a dent in all the cap space they have.
Boston
Footballguy
Interesting...not hearing any rumors locally about him of late...a few months ago he was a QB a lot of people were talking about being a fit for the Pats but that died down when the whole contract restructuring took place and haven't heard a whisper since...wouldn't bother me if the Pats brought him in a long with a rookie.
Boston
Footballguy
He confuses me...last year it felt like he was not in a rush to become a starter as he took a pay cut and got a no trade clause for a team where he had no chance of starting...I think he is very worthy of another opportunity so it will be interesting to watch what he does this offseason.
